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Thursday, July 26, 2012

Calcaterra: Tweet of the Day: Do NOT breastfeed in front of Logan Morrison

Jay Jaffe should never have made that Futility Infielder card...

Logan Morrison was just chillin’ at Nordstrom today when he encountered something he was not pleased with:

  Logan Morrison

  Hey @Nordstrom nothing makes me want to spend $$ like seeing women breastfeeding in your store…

Those damn moms,providing essential nourishment for their children. Just appalling, really. The worst kind of people.

Because he’s awesome, Jay Jaffe called Morrison out for being boorish and retrograde about public breastfeeding. Which led to this response:

  Logan Morrison

    Jay Jaffe? Another blogger who has never played baseball w a big mouth. Shocker! RT @jay_jaffe shut up and hit .240 without power LoMo

Repoz Posted: July 26, 2012 at 05:43 PM | 335 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: marlins

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   301. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 27, 2012 at 06:54 PM (#4194118)
Free speech and all that.

How exactly is wanting a thread to be "nuked" consistent with "free speech" principles? Or do you believe in free speech for you but not for other people?

You use the excuse that it was "beyond the pale", yet you keep making consistent references to the "liberals" and "non-liberal" views.

No, I never used the word liberal in this thread until noting the obvious.

You ignore the obvious fact that CCTV is NOT publicly available, whereas a personal photograph by a random person being posted on the internet IS. I cannot fathom the disconnect there. This is one of many things you continue to blisfully ignore.

The point was that the CCTV is available to at least some people, and the people filmed have no clue of its use, disposition, etc.

You claim to want to defend Logan Morrison's right to free speech, while bashing others here for expressing their views because they are contrary to your own.

No, I've disagreed with people, while being "bashed" myself. I'm not the one who's authored a long list of insults in this thread. See #236 for the recap.

As for persecution complex, who feels like they're being persecuted? Read your own words, my friend.

Nonsense. I don't care if people insult me, but I'm not going to sit here and be blamed for a flame war when I haven't hurled a single insult in the entire thread. (I thought "Typical BBTF lefty" had reached meme status here, but apparently a lot of people are lacking a sense of humor.)

Now, everyone's just arguing for the sake of arguing. Nobody is going to changeanyone else's mind. That's clear.

LOL. This has been true since Day 1 of BBTF. These threads are always just for sport.
   302. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: July 27, 2012 at 06:58 PM (#4194122)

I remember you, GGC, for what it's worth.

Christ, I remember you from before the days of registration.


My heyday! It has been all downhill since my "Six Degrees of Mike Morgan" article 11 years ago. BTW, whatever happened to Eric Enders and Jim's friend Gary who used to write articles?
   303. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:01 PM (#4194123)
It's actually quite common for people who engage in voyeuristic behaviors like stalking or peeping to subsequently escalate their behavior to rape. They're getting off on the fear of being caught, which leads them to them taking progressively bigger and bigger risks.

It seems to me that someone inclined toward "voyeuristic behaviors like stalking or peeping" would be more inclined to seek employment with Nordstrom's security department than to walk around the store snapping an occasional blurry picture on a handheld camera. It's absurd that this even needs to be pointed out, but Logan Morrison neither "stalked" nor "peeped" in order to take yesterday's now-infamous picture.
   304. Steve Treder Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:02 PM (#4194124)
whatever happened to Eric Enders

Complete mystery to me. He not only vanished from Primer, but in real life, at least to me anyway. Stopped returning my emails. I have no idea what happened.
   305. base ball chick Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:04 PM (#4194127)
Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: July 27, 2012 at 06:58 PM (#4194122)


I remember you, GGC, for what it's worth.

Christ, I remember you from before the days of registration.


My heyday! It has been all downhill since my "Six Degrees of Mike Morgan" article 11 years ago. BTW, whatever happened to Eric Enders and Jim's friend Gary who used to write articles?



- eric left at least 4 years ago (after the jim leyritz driving drunk with his kids in the car thingy) and i haven't seen gary since, i think, 06

i bin here a LONG time. not real too many people who were here before like 07 are still here
   306. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:07 PM (#4194128)
Complete mystery to me. He not only vanished from Primer, but in real life, at least to me anyway. Stopped returning my emails. I have no idea what happened.

Eric Enders should have his kids taken away.
   307. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:11 PM (#4194131)
I did see Enders over at Cardboard Gods back when it was part of the Baseball Toaster family, but that was a long time ago.

not real too many people who were here before like 07 are still here


I think this is a young person's game. For ha has, check out what websites looked like not too long before Primer started. Geocities Forever!
   308. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:35 PM (#4194154)
It seems to me that someone inclined toward "voyeuristic behaviors like stalking or peeping" would be more inclined to seek employment with Nordstrom's security department than to walk around the store snapping an occasional blurry picture on a handheld camera.


I have no doubt that this is true, because you know nothing about sex crimes. You've been wrong about everything else so far, so why break the streak now?

A voyeuristic pervert wouldn't get much of a charge out of a security camera, because looking through an authorized camera like that isn't forbidden/taboo, and doesn't involve any chance of being caught by the subject of his interest. The risk of pursuing the forbidden is the entire point of it.

It's absurd that this even needs to be pointed out, but Logan Morrison neither "stalked" nor "peeped" in order to take yesterday's now-infamous picture.


He approached a woman who didn't know him when she had her breast out, and took a photo of her without her knowledge or consent. Sure, that doesn't sound at all like something a creepy-ass stalker would do. Particularly to a woman who probably doesn't know Logan Morrison from a ####### hole in the wall, but can tell at a glance that he's too big and strong for her to fight off, if he has bad intentions toward her.

At this point, I've given up any hope of having a good-faith discussion with you, about this or anything else, so I won't be commenting in this thread any further. Have a nice weekend!
   309. Barnaby Jones Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:39 PM (#4194159)
The original Barnaby Jones was 6'3"+, and I suspect he wouldn't much like sitting in today's coach class. I would peg you as someone who is not very tall, and who does not fly a lot on business (because you can't really read a laptop screen in coach if you're tall and the seat in front of you is reclined). I think it's pretty damn rude not to take into account your impact on the person behind you.


You are assumptions are all pretty incorrect. I'm 6'2", which is certainly tall enough to be inconvenienced, and I've travelled a goodly bit for work in recent years. I would certainly prefer that the person in front of me not recline, and I likewise do so only when no one is behind me, but I just can't seem to get my dander up for people using the chairs the way they were meant to be used.
   310. Everybody Loves Tyrus Raymond Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:46 PM (#4194166)
Particularly to a woman who probably doesn't know Logan Morrison from a ####### hole in the wall, but can tell at a glance that he's too big and strong for her to fight off, if he has bad intentions toward her.


So Logan Morrison was giving off the impression he was going to physically assault her right there in Nordstrom's? That's seems like an odd point to make. I mean, sure, if he did that then you're right. But it seems exceptionally unlikely that occurred. This wasn't stalking or peeping. He made an immature, probably impulsive, and rude decision to gawk and snap a photo. He showed even poorer judgment in posting the photo. Dick move, and that's about it. An apology would suffice.


   311. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:47 PM (#4194168)
He approached a woman who didn't know him when she had her breast out, and took a photo of her without her knowledge or consent. Sure, that doesn't sound at all like something a creepy-ass stalker would do. Particularly to a woman who probably doesn't know Logan Morrison from a ####### hole in the wall, but can tell at a glance that he's too big and strong for her to fight off, if he has bad intentions toward her.

This is nuts. You have Logan Morrison on the path to possible sex crimes because he snapped a camera-phone picture in the middle of a department store.
   312. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: July 27, 2012 at 07:59 PM (#4194176)
This is nuts. You have Logan Morrison on the path to possible sex crimes because he snapped a camera-phone picture in the middle of a department store.

Actually, big professional athletes regularly assault and sexually assault women -- in public places and private. To a woman in a vulnerable position, who has no idea who he is other than he's young and big and acting juvenile and creepy, it wouldn't exactly be pleasant. Complete dick move.

   313. Barnaby Jones Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:02 PM (#4194178)
First of all, no one, to my knowledge, has ever called me a "racist nazi," so that's a weird jumping-off point.


This was a reference to your list of over the top insults, including comparing your position to that of Jim Crow racism. Hyperbole.

Second, to the extent I "consistently elicit the same reaction from an array of people," it's the same "array of people" who hurl insults at Ray, David, Dan, et al., for having the temerity to have non-conforming, non-liberal views.


No. This is wrong. That you think this, again, again proves my point. You are arguing with a diverse group as if they are all liberal philistines in need of instruction rather than paying attention to what they are actually saying. That, in turn, leads that diverse group to find your conversation unpleasant. Some of that diverse group then insults you or assumes you are arguing in bad faith; but the mere fact that you have annoyed people through your dialogue style does not prove that you are just a victim of liberal groupthink.

If people believe I'm "trolling," then the only intelligent response is ... nothing. And if people don't believe I'm trolling, then they should try debating issues on the merits without hurling invective at people who have differing opinions.


Sure. And unless you think I am trolling you, you should assume I'm giving you this advice in good faith, and actually think about what I'm saying.
   314. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:17 PM (#4194186)
As much as some would have me remembered for other, more painful, things, I'd like to think my role in generating the great airplane seat position controversy is my greatest contribution to this site. (i'm an anti-recliner.)
   315. jobu Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:35 PM (#4194194)
(i'm an anti-recliner.)
Fight the real enemy.
   316. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:36 PM (#4194196)
I think I am mainly remembered for causing the frequent site outages soon after the switch to Expression Engine.
   317. phredbird Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:39 PM (#4194198)
not real too many people who were here before like 07 are still here


ahem
   318. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:47 PM (#4194200)
She is very attractive. That is all I am saying.
   319. JE (Jason Epstein) Posted: July 27, 2012 at 08:56 PM (#4194207)
This thread has been a painful read. The airplane reclining seat debate was so much more fun! (Not surprisingly, that one contained little to no political content.)
   320. Jarrod HypnerotomachiaPoliphili(Teddy F. Ballgame) Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:03 PM (#4194214)
not real too many people who were here before like 07 are still here


I've been here for over a decade, I think. Though I'm rarely noticed.
   321. salajander Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:21 PM (#4194237)
I don't ever recall seeing you in the political threads or seeing anyone mentioning you as one of the site's non-liberals.


... this brings me back to my original question (and suspicion of trolling) which was wondering why you framed this whole discussion in political terms ("Typical BBTF lefty behavior.")?
   322. salajander Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:22 PM (#4194240)
not real too many people who were here before like 07 are still here

2004! I wasn't around pre-registration, though, and I don't spend much time in the lounge/social threads/etc.
   323. Tripon Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:24 PM (#4194242)

Actually, big professional athletes regularly assault and sexually assault women -- in public places and private. To a woman in a vulnerable position, who has no idea who he is other than he's young and big and acting juvenile and creepy, it wouldn't exactly be pleasant. Complete dick move.


Man, you just asked Logan Morrison of when he stopped molesting women.
   324. Howie Menckel Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:25 PM (#4194243)
yeah, recline vs no-recline!

"I just can't seem to get my dander up for people using the chairs the way they were meant to be used."

You are aware that the seats in most cases were built to recline at a time when the seat behind was further back, yes? The airlines shortened the distance between rows (to add an extra row or two on the cheap), to the point where your observation is now useless. They were meant to be recline in an entirely different space environment.

Is this not common knowledge? Does this explain the confusion?

Eureka!
   325. JE (Jason Epstein) Posted: July 27, 2012 at 09:46 PM (#4194256)
This was my favorite entry from that thread:

439. Freeballin' (Tales of Met Power) Posted: March 04, 2010 at 01:50 AM (#3472148)
"Excuse me, do you mind if I recline my seat?" It even sounds like a retarded question. Why would anyone be asking that? Indeed, nobody is.

If somebody asked me that, I would clock them. But nobody has ever asked me that.
   326. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 27, 2012 at 10:13 PM (#4194277)
I believe we were discussing Erin Andrews.
   327. Fancy Pants Handles lap changes with class Posted: July 27, 2012 at 11:24 PM (#4194295)
A voyeuristic pervert wouldn't get much of a charge out of a security camera, because looking through an authorized camera like that isn't forbidden/taboo, and doesn't involve any chance of being caught by the subject of his interest. The risk of pursuing the forbidden is the entire point of it.

The fact that you are apparently intimately familiar with the precise workings of the mind of a violent sex offender, is a surprise to absolutely nobody, Vlad.
   328. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 28, 2012 at 01:26 PM (#4194504)
This was a reference to your list of over the top insults, including comparing your position to that of Jim Crow racism. Hyperbole.

Hyperbole? #236 was a list of direct quotes. 'Misirlou' twice alleged that I wanted breastfeeding women to be treated just like blacks who had separate water fountains during Jim Crow. There was no hyperbole on my part.

No. This is wrong. That you think this, again, again proves my point. You are arguing with a diverse group as if they are all liberal philistines in need of instruction rather than paying attention to what they are actually saying. That, in turn, leads that diverse group to find your conversation unpleasant. Some of that diverse group then insults you or assumes you are arguing in bad faith; but the mere fact that you have annoyed people through your dialogue style does not prove that you are just a victim of liberal groupthink.

"Diverse group"? Are you new here? I don't believe a single person listed in #236 had ever sided with me a single time in any of the political threads. (And several of them used this thread to hurl gratuitous insults at Ray, despite the fact he hasn't posted in this thread a single time.)

Sure. And unless you think I am trolling you, you should assume I'm giving you this advice in good faith, and actually think about what I'm saying.

I might take your lectures on internet decorum a little more seriously if you started with the people hurling insults rather than the targets of said insults. Otherwise, I'm left to believe it's not my general behavior of which you disapprove, but rather the content of my opinions.

***

On a much more important topic, I can't believe #306 didn't draw a single reply. How soon they forget.
   329. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: July 28, 2012 at 01:29 PM (#4194507)
Were you someone else here before you were Joe Kehoskie? Or did you lurk back in the day?
   330. Joe Kehoskie Posted: July 28, 2012 at 01:45 PM (#4194518)
Were you someone else here before you were Joe Kehoskie? Or did you lurk back in the day?

Ha ha. I've been Joe Kehoskie for 39 years now.

I lurked at BBTF for years before I started commenting, and it seems like I've met Eric Enders somewhere along the way, so his name has always stuck.

"Children taken away" might be my favorite BBTF meme. Eric might be gone, but he left us a gift that keeps on giving.
   331. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: July 30, 2012 at 08:37 AM (#4195632)
I'm the one who once called this place half-jokingly Moscow In The Bleachers and Banned Andy used it as a handle.


Wait, when did this happen? Am I allowed to ask what happened? Or did he just change his name again?


This thread has been a painful read. The airplane reclining seat debate was so much more fun! (Not surprisingly, that one contained little to no political content.)


I tried!

As much as some would have me remembered for other, more painful, things, I'd like to think my role in generating the great airplane seat position controversy is my greatest contribution to this site. (i'm an anti-recliner.)


And you have our most sincerest thanks.

Should we change the question re seat reclining a bit to include the fact that the dastardly recliner is eating a mayonnaise sandwich? STORE-BOUGHT MAYO.
   332. Ron J2 Posted: July 30, 2012 at 09:00 AM (#4195645)
#310 (and others) I'm not 100% certain that Morrison has nothing to worry about legally. Somebody earlier mentioned up-skirt photos in passing. I know that some guys taking up-skirt photos have been prosecuted. And while I don't know what the success rate is, I can't imagine that the prosecution is much fun regardless of the outcome.

Now there may be some material difference between what Morrison did and up-skirt photography but I'm not clear as to whether it matters legally. (Of course jurisdiction is going to matter)

To be clear, I'm not advocating prosecution. Just saying it's not clear to me that it's legally OK.
   333. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: July 30, 2012 at 09:54 AM (#4195680)
STORE-BOUGHT MAYO.

Gross.
   334. jobu Posted: July 30, 2012 at 09:59 AM (#4195684)
Should we change the question re seat reclining a bit to include the fact that the dastardly recliner is eating a mayonnaise sandwich? STORE-BOUGHT MAYO.

And the recliner has long hair draped over the back of the seat. And is not Erin Andrews.
   335. bigglou115 Posted: July 30, 2012 at 10:27 AM (#4195706)
This thread has been a painful read. The airplane reclining seat debate was so much more fun! (Not surprisingly, that one contained little to no political content.)


First BBTF thread I ever read. Didn't post for some time still, but definitely the first thing I read that kept me coming back.
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