Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Friday, July 31, 2009

Calcaterra: Why the rest of the names cannot be released

Spira’s

..uhh, Calcaterra’s take.

And what is to be gained by such a release? The satisfaction of the media, who would love to report and opine on this some more, and the satisfaction of the general public who either gets off on the salaciousness of it or, more commonly, simply wants this all to go away and thinks the quicker the names are out the more likely that is to happen. Call me crazy, but I don’t think my rights to privacy and to the security of my personal medical information are something to be preserved or denied based on how good a story this makes for someone.

If you’re one of those people, however, who simply insist that these guys are cheaters and cheaters are ruining baseball, think about it this way: what if you were involved in a nasty divorce case, and some of the confidential court records—say, a hearing transcript where people were talking about your personal failings, like say, an extramarital affair—were suddenly thrown out to the media? How would you feel if people clamored for “the rest of the records to be released?” What if the drug tests many of you out there have to take as a condition of your employment suddenly showed up on the evening news (“200 Microsoft employees test positive for drugs!”)? Would you be part of the crowd demanding that the names be named?

Of course you wouldn’t, and to the extent people are demanding it of the famous 104 now, they’re only doing so to satisfy their curiosity and/or fill some column inches in their newspaper. Against a backdrop of serial violations of the victims’ rights—and they are victims—such a demand is offensive in the extreme.

Don’t release the rest of the names. And investigate and prosecute the person who has been doing the leaking.

Repoz Posted: July 31, 2009 at 02:58 PM | 41 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: steroids

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. A triple short of the cycle Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:12 PM (#3275497)
I agree with Mr. Calcaterra completely.
   2. St.Philly Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:12 PM (#3275499)
I wish Microsoft employees could take some sort of performance enhancing drug, instead whatever they took gave us Vista.
   3. Nasty Nate Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:16 PM (#3275505)
What if yours was the only name Microsoft leaked and you were mocked in public, wouldn't you want your 200 co-workers who also did it to share some of the load?
   4. The Essex Snead Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:17 PM (#3275507)
What you want isn't what should be done.
   5. Textbook Editor Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:25 PM (#3275521)
Well, sure, I agree with the article, but there's the larger issue for MLB and MLBPA that this thing just won't die, and to be water-tortured with it for the next 10 years--from a business sense--is nuts.

Believe me, if it was up to me, the Justice Department would be investigating these leaks and prosecuting like it was the Plame case, but in the real world, this is just not going to happen. And while I find that disgusting, it appears to simply be a fact at this point.

To extend the Microsoft metaphor a bit, I think if this was Microsoft, and if it faced the sort of public scrutiny over drug tests at its company that MLB and MLBPA did, they would do whatever it took as a company to get this issue behind it and out of the PR spotlight.
   6. Craig Calcaterra Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:31 PM (#3275530)
To extend the Microsoft metaphor a bit, I think if this was Microsoft, and if it faced the sort of public scrutiny over drug tests at its company that MLB and MLBPA did, they would do whatever it took as a company to get this issue behind it and out of the PR spotlight.


But you're not balancing Good PR against bad PR. You're balancing Good PR against the violation of individual rights.

PR considerations should lose in that contest.
   7. esseff Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:34 PM (#3275533)
if it was up to me, the Justice Department would be investigating these leaks and prosecuting like it was the Plame case, but in the real world, this is just not going to happen.


Lance Williams and Mark Fainaru-Wada might disagree, to a point.
   8. Craig Calcaterra Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:36 PM (#3275537)
Lance Williams and Mark Fainaru-Wada might disagree, to a point.


Yeah, well, for as much as I appreciate their journalistic efforts, they were in the wrong in that case.
   9. esseff Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:39 PM (#3275539)
The point is that the government can be very agressive -- selectively so? -- about tracking down such leaks.
   10. St.Philly Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:41 PM (#3275543)
I know it's not the point of the article, but does Microsoft even have a drug testing program? I've always assumed that the creative industries take a very libertarian approach to such things.
   11. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:50 PM (#3275569)
Looks like someone snuck in and impregnated a few of the vestal virgins. May as well #### 'em all now, I guess.
   12. Craig Calcaterra Posted: July 31, 2009 at 03:54 PM (#3275581)
ess eff -- sorry, I had missed your point before.

Vlad: what's this about the virgins now and whereandwhen?
   13. Textbook Editor Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:02 PM (#3275593)
#6--Craig, again, I totally agree with you, but at some point the MLPBA is going to realize 10 years of leaks and bad press is more than just bad PR--it creates an atmosphere where "clean" players are lumped in with "steroid" players and a pox has been put on all their houses by the public at large, lessening "clean" players' outside income potential from commercial deals, etc.

I'll grant you that's not an individual rights violation, but if I was a guy who had never done anything and I saw my income potential diminished because of this, I sure as heck would get together with like-minded union mates and urge MLPBA to just get agree to get the list out and get the whole thing over with.

Again, I totally think you are right, and in a just world none of this would have come out. I cannot, for example, believe that Marvin Miller wouldn't have just destroyed all evidence of these tests personally... Had he been in charge I doubt very much any of this would have happened (or that the tests would have taken place at all).
   14. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:03 PM (#3275595)
What you want isn't what should be done.


I agree but then this article and this thread are moot.
   15. Stately, Plump Buck Mulligan Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:03 PM (#3275597)
Why is Ozzie Guillen referred to as dumb while Maury Brown is referred to as smart?
   16. jwb Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:15 PM (#3275625)
St.Philly (#2), This issue has been studied, although not enough.
   17. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:20 PM (#3275642)
"Vlad: what's this about the virgins now and whereandwhen?"

Just agreeing with you, in a metaphorical way. It seems like a lot of the people in favor of releasing the list are claiming to do so out of a desire for equitable treatment of all players on the list, when they should be focusing on acting properly toward the players who haven't been exposed (who still have a legal right to expect their results to remain confidential, regardless of the misfortunes of A-Rod, Papi, et al).

If a pedestrian gets hit by a passing car outside my house, that doesn't suddenly make it OK for me to start driving on the sidewalk.
   18. Bob Tufts Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:45 PM (#3275695)
A decision to release this list would also set a terrible precedent regarding employee assistance plans. Can the government go through your firm's EAP and scan for people who are trying to kick a drug habit?

The result - people looking for help will avoid programs and eventually drag their families down with them thanks to unrestricited prosecutorial actions that skirt the Fourth Amendment.
   19. Maury Brown Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:47 PM (#3275698)
Why is Ozzie Guillen referred to as dumb while Maury Brown is referred to as smart?
Good question.

Not to go all third person here, but Maury Brown will be slapping down Maury Brown in a column shortly.

I'd like to think that I don't strike out too often, but I completely blew it on my column asking for the names to be released. Why? I'm frustrated at the notion that the samples and lists were to be destroyed, but weren't, which puts us in the position we're in. I'm frustrated in unethical lawyers with access to the list leaking names. I'm frustrated that somehow tests in 2003 are going to call into question World Series wins thereafter...

In other words, I let subjectivity get in the way of objectivity. Like I said... I plan on writing about this after the deadline.
   20. greenback calls it soccer Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:49 PM (#3275705)
I don't see how releasing the list will "end it already." There will always be new steroid rumors just around the corner.
   21. billyjack Posted: July 31, 2009 at 04:57 PM (#3275716)
Good article. And I agree with #20... if the 104 names are released, people will still suspect others... steroid accusations will continue...
   22. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:01 PM (#3275718)
#6--Craig, again, I totally agree with you, but at some point the MLPBA is going to realize 10 years of leaks and bad press is more than just bad PR--it creates an atmosphere where "clean" players are lumped in with "steroid" players and a pox has been put on all their houses by the public at large, lessening "clean" players' outside income potential from commercial deals, etc.
But releasing the list won't distinguish clean players from steroid players; it will distinguish those who happened to test positive in 2003 from those who didn't.
   23. yb125 Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:02 PM (#3275720)
Not only will it not end it, but it's not really hurting baseball in any real (financial) sense so why should they care if in ten years someone is still leaking names?
   24. Maury Brown Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:04 PM (#3275725)
Not only will it not end it, but it's not really hurting baseball in any real (financial) sense so why should they care if in ten years someone is still leaking names?
Don't kid yourself, they care greatly about all the steroid talk. More so than I think the general public.

Writers, hardcores, Commissioner's Office, PA talk about PEDs far more than the public, IMO.
   25. yb125 Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:27 PM (#3275763)
I believe they care just not in the type of care that leads to action.
   26. mack Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:34 PM (#3275774)
#'s 21 and 22 are right on the target. The next phase of the hunt has already begun. Witness the instant speculation arising from Canseco's hall of fame comments.
   27. Greg Goosen at 30 Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:54 PM (#3275789)
I wonder what would happen if the government starting putting PED users in jail like they did to cocaine users Willie Aikens, Vida Blue, Jerry Martin and Willie Wilson in 1983.
   28. baric Posted: July 31, 2009 at 05:57 PM (#3275792)
I wonder what would happen if the government starting putting PED users in jail like they did to cocaine users Willie Aikens, Vida Blue, Jerry Martin and Willie Wilson in 1983.


Too many white guys.
   29. Tripon Posted: July 31, 2009 at 06:01 PM (#3275800)
   30. The Polish Sausage Racer Posted: July 31, 2009 at 06:09 PM (#3275817)
A decision to release this list would also set a terrible precedent regarding employee assistance plans. Can the government go through your firm's EAP and scan for people who are trying to kick a drug habit?

The result - people looking for help will avoid programs and eventually drag their families down with them thanks to unrestricited prosecutorial actions that skirt the Fourth Amendment.


You may not have noticed but there hasn't been a Fourth Amendment for a long time. The government has been scanning your firm's EAP records since at least the PATRIOT Act and probably before that.
   31. Tricky Dick Posted: July 31, 2009 at 06:17 PM (#3275833)
What if yours was the only name Microsoft leaked and you were mocked in public, wouldn't you want your 200 co-workers who also did it to share some of the load?

No. I don't think I would be that petty. I would be outraged that a contractual agreement, which I relied upon, had been violated. But I wouldn't be asking that Microsoft violate its contractual agreements with other employees. Instead I would probably visit a lawyer to determine what grounds I have to sue Microsoft.

By the way, I don't see that this "slow torture" will last for 30 years or whatever. I think it runs its course when the litigation is completed. At the end of that, I suspect that the list will either be made public or destroyed, depending on who wins the litigation.
   32. Non-Youkilidian Geometry Posted: July 31, 2009 at 06:21 PM (#3275846)
An excellent and cogent analysis, Craig.

Changing the subject ... can someone explain to me the proliferation of "Shooty" handles this week? I've been busy this week and missed how this all got started.
   33. wickedwitch Posted: July 31, 2009 at 07:52 PM (#3276080)
I agree that ideally that the names shouldn't be released. But it appears that someone is very willing to leak the list, and presumably, this person won't stop. If this is true, then it's better to get it all out at once.
   34. Suff Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:17 PM (#3276142)
I still don't understand why the test results had names attached to them at all. To me, that was the real crime. All they needed was a "steroid head count," so to speak. The samples sould have arrived to be tested unmarked and not even grouped by team. The way they did it instead shows that they planned to hold on to the information, and if the information is available, they had to know it would also be leaked.

If the leaks stop, people will quit speculating. No one really talked about the list until A-Rod's name was leaked from it.
   35. Craig Calcaterra Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:18 PM (#3276146)
If this is true, then it's better to get it all out at once.


Actually, if this is true, it means that Judge Illston should immediately hold hearings regarding the leaks, find the leaker, and prosecute him or her for criminal contempt and refer them to the state bar for disbarment proceedings.

For what other crime would we tolerate "well, it looks like the perpetrator isn't going to stop [robbing, destroying, defrauding, killing], so we may as well forefeit [our money, our property, our lives] to get it over with quickly"?
   36. Roy Hobbs of WIFFLE Ball Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:26 PM (#3276165)
The list should be released yesterday.
   37. Morty Causa Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:35 PM (#3276183)
But releasing the list won't distinguish clean players from steroid players; it will distinguish those who happened to test positive in 2003 from those who didn't.


I don't know. Wouldn't this be evidence as to the larger question of PED use in MLB? And one bit of evidence doesn't have to truck the whole load, does it?
   38. Morty Causa Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:35 PM (#3276186)
Too many white guys.


There are more white guys in jail right now than there are black guys, aren't there? Or anything in-between. Or a combination of all the other colors put together.
   39. Morty Causa Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:38 PM (#3276192)
As for any recourse the players might have against the leakers, MLB, the union, etc., was there an agreement in writing with regard to them submitting to the testing? If so, what did it say?
   40. Doug's Hopkin off the band wagon Posted: July 31, 2009 at 08:42 PM (#3276199)
Looks like someone snuck in and impregnated a few of the vestal virgins. May as well #### 'em all now, I guess.


I smell what you're cooking, Vlad, and I like your style:

NSFW, unless you work at some hippie job where 200 of your co-workers test positive for drugs even though the company doesn't believe in drug tests.
   41. bunyon Posted: July 31, 2009 at 09:29 PM (#3276262)
I agree with 33 and 35. The government (assuming they aren't the leakers) should investigate and prosecute. But in answer to blackmail, an effective weapon is to simply divulge the info yourself. I'm not saying anyone should release the list, I'm saying if I were on the list, I'd out myself, now. Probably while announcing that I'll be pursuing whatever legal recourse I can. It's an outrage that the list has been made public, but made public it has been. Acting as if it isn't public is simply sticking your head in the ground.

It isn't about being fair to those already outed. It's about deciding the time, place and manner of your name coming out. I see essentially zero chance that all the names don't eventually make it out.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
JE (Jason)
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogJoe Maddon is to become Cubs manager, sources say
(48 - 8:56am, Oct 30)
Last: The Id of SugarBear Blanks

NewsblogOT: Politics, October 2014: Sunshine, Baseball, and Etch A Sketch: How Politicians Use Analogies
(4561 - 8:56am, Oct 30)
Last: Bitter Mouse

NewsblogJapan Times: Nakamura belts three-run homer in 10th to put Hawks one win away from Japan Series title
(7 - 8:55am, Oct 30)
Last: Bourbon Samurai

Newsblog2014 WORLD SERIES GAME 7 OMNICHATTER
(1426 - 8:55am, Oct 30)
Last: bunyon

NewsblogMadison Bumgarner, World Series legend - McCovey Chronicles
(6 - 8:54am, Oct 30)
Last: PASTE Thinks This Trout Kid Might Be OK (Zeth)

NewsblogSan Francisco Giants at Kansas City Royals - October 29, 2014 | MLB.com Box
(29 - 8:49am, Oct 30)
Last: Juilin Sandar to Conkling Speedwell (Arjun)

NewsblogHeyman: Pablo Sandoval is on Boston's 3B wish list, but so is Chase Headley
(25 - 8:14am, Oct 30)
Last: PASTE Thinks This Trout Kid Might Be OK (Zeth)

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread - October 2014
(571 - 7:42am, Oct 30)
Last: Der-K and the statistical werewolves.

NewsblogOT: NBC.news: Valve isn’t making one gaming console, but multiple ‘Steam machines’
(958 - 2:15am, Oct 30)
Last: caprules

NewsblogRoad maps to pitching success in Game 7 | FOX Sports
(9 - 1:14am, Oct 30)
Last: Ray (RDP)

NewsblogESPN: Jose Canseco shoots self in hand
(66 - 11:53pm, Oct 29)
Last: eric

NewsblogOT:  Soccer (the Round, True Football), November 2014
(15 - 11:14pm, Oct 29)
Last: CWS Keith plans to boo your show at the Apollo

NewsblogOT:  October 2014 - College Football thread
(509 - 10:55pm, Oct 29)
Last: Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams)

NewsblogNobody knows anything about Game 7 | FOX Sports
(25 - 8:34pm, Oct 29)
Last: Joyful Calculus Instructor

NewsblogVanguard after the Revolution | NBC SportsWorld
(48 - 5:24pm, Oct 29)
Last: RMc is a fine piece of cheese

Page rendered in 0.4707 seconds
52 querie(s) executed