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Baseball Primer Newsblog— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand
Wednesday, June 18, 2008
The Cubs recalled Matt Murton from Triple-A Iowa on Tuesday and sent Eric Patterson back down, though they may just be showcasing Murton for a possible deal.
“We hated to send Patterson out, we really did,” manager Lou Piniella said. “He’s a good young man. We just needed a right-hand bat.”
...
General manager Jim Hendry sent special assistant Ken Kravec to scout Boston this week in Cincinnati and Philadelphia. The Cubs still are interested in Red Sox center fielder Coco Crisp,and now may be willing to include Rich Hill in a multiplayer package. Murton was acquired from Boston in the Nomar Garciaparra deal in ‘04.
After the Cubs demoted him May 1, Murton hit .298 at Iowa with one home run while playing exclusively in left field.
Wildman Rich Hill seems to have vanished; he hasn’t pitched at Iowa since the 11th, although he is on their active roster, and isn’t listed as a starting pitcher in the probables (which go through the 22nd)
NTNgod
Posted: June 18, 2008 at 06:26 AM | 44 comment(s)
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1. PASTE is not impressed by Albert Pujols (Zeth) Posted: June 18, 2008 at 06:38 AM (#2824158)For unknown reasons, since spring training, the guy is back to throwing strikes about as often as he did during his first few minor league seasons (or college).
SOMETHING's got to be wrong with the guy. Of course, selling at rock-bottom is never smart, either, unless you think it's not resolvable.
Really, it's too bad the Mets have nothing to trade.
Doesn't look comfortable out there at all, compared to LF.
Not completely lost in RF, but it was a noticeable dropoff from one year to the next when he did the switch.
*checks numbers*
Kielty, career vs. lefties: .296 AVG, .379 OBP, .503 SLG
Murton, career vs. lefties: .317 AVG, .391 OBP, .497 SLG
Now Murton is younger, and I'm happy to grant that he's overall a better player than Kielty (dunno if this is true or not, but let's assume it is for the sake of argument). The Sox would still be trading Crisp for a more-or-less redundant part. The Sox already have a platoon outfielder in Kielty; why trade Crisp (whom the Cubs apparently esteem) for someone who may be marginally better than the platoon guy the Sox already have?
It's not a bad deal or anything, but the improvement the trade would bring seems marginal.
Murton, career vs RHP: .283 .347 .426
In an age with 12 man bullpens, you can't really afford to give a spot on the roster to a guy who is a zero at the plate vs. RHP. Yeah, the role is probably going to involve facing LHP more than RHP, but the guy who can actually hit RHP as well is a much better use of a roster spot.
And presumably Murton would be coming along with a prospect of some stripe.
Clearly the Sox are planning on putting Manny on waivers again. :-)
I'm thoroughly confused why the Cubs would do this. Like Hendry and everyone here, I knew Jim Edmonds was gonna rebound when he came to the Cubs so it would be odd for them to pick up Crisp to play CF. And why not use Murton and Hoffpauir to fill in for Soriano -- is the "upgrade" to Crisp enough to justify this trade? Crisp's OPS+ the last 2+ seasons have varied from 77 to 84 ... here's not an offensive upgrade over Johnson or 2007 Edmonds. If all we want is his defense, just call up Pie. If the Cubs throw in Hill to this trade, they're blithering idiots.
It's also not clear what Boston is going to see in Murton's 2-3 days in the majors that they don't already know. And Boston fans shouldn't get too excited -- Murton has 1 HR and a 382 SLG this season in AAA and hasn't shown power in the majors since his rookie year.
Walt, I'm not sure why you're saying Murton hasn't shown power in the past 2 seasons. He's had 150-ish ISOs, which is fine for a guy with his respectable batting average.
You can't blame him for assuming he would have more success in the organization if he hit like a second baseman.
LOL. Primey.
He has more value than Crisp and it would certainly make sense from teh Jays side.
I'm all in favor of the Cubs paying premium for a good lefty reliever (Fuentes? Feliciano?) and a good starter (Sabathia, if he becomes available; much less enthusiastic about Burnett), but this Crisp talk is silly. retro-squeeze loves Coco because of his name, but I can't think of much else to recommend this.
Rich Hill's stock has, err, sort of plummeted in 2008.
Yes, which makes it all the dumber to trade him now. Hendry always does this, and it's feckin' annoying.
He has more value than Crisp and it would certainly make sense from teh Jays side.
I'm wary of Burnett, but this would make infinitely more sense from the Cubs' perspective. For now, though, their rotation is fine, so I wouldn't favor any trade for a starter until they determine whether Sabathia's on the market. Sabathia's the only guy out there who would significantly upgrade the Cubs' chances in a postseason series. (Plus, as Robothal pointed out, he'd give the Cubs a 1-2 punch that weighs a combined 545 pounds. That'd be awesome.)
Ken Kravec?!? Aaugh!
I wonder if there's something a little more complicated going on; either another suitor (real or imagined) or a 3 way deal.
Would anyone trade for Coco while he's still waiting to serve his suspension?
I think this is a great move for the Sox to add to their depth by buying low on a guy who could easily be a #3 starter.
Oh really Dan??? You think you can spare Coco for that? Why the #### is this organization still looking for a CF? Ride TOFU until he plummets back to earth. I'm not sure Coco would outproduce Pie the rest of this season. This is insane.
Pops, that was awesome.
I still don't get the love for Rich Hill. Maybe I'm too detached, but I just don't see it. He's nowhere near as young as one would believe, and he can't stick in the majors. Crisp is only a year older, and he's more valuable than he's given credit for.
Last decade it was Craig Wilson, this decade it's Matt Murton.
*I'M* starting to wonder why the Cubs refuse to play him if they claim he has any value at all. I wouldn't trade for Matt Murton either after all this debacle has gone down.
BINGO.
This is pure speculation on the writers part. The Cubs haven't made this bad of a trade in a long time and it doesn't even pass the smell test. Murton and Hill for Crisp is not even in the picture, IMO. Keep dreaming.
There's no reason for Hendry to aim low at this point. Neither Murton or Hill have to be traded now, there is no roster squeeze and there's no risk of losing either of them on waivers. He should be looking for the best available players, and they might not all be available yet (such as CC). There's no immediate need.
It's OK to dislike the trade suggestion, but that's just ridiculous. There is no earthly reason to think Pie will approach Coco's production this season.
Am I seriously missing something about Crisp??
Other than his defense and baserunning(which Pie isn't much worse than at worst), what is there to like about the guy? He hasn't hit since he left Cleveland.
except the fact that just about every pre-season projection had Pie outperforming Coco?
Coco has hit .264/.317/.385 followed by .268/.330/.382 followed by .262/.303/.419.
I don't want to sound like Kevin, but assuming Manny is back and plays everyday, doesn't the regular OF have to be Manny, J.D., Jacoby?
Crisp is better that, say, Juan Pierre, but that;s mostly because he's better defensively.
Pie is a kid who desperate;y needs a change of scenary
I know what ZIPS said coming into the season. I also see what Pie's done at two different levels and can't see how that wouldn't tend to override the earlier projections, or at least downgrade them substantially.
Pie may yet become a decent major league hitter. Any kind of expecation that's happening this year seems ridiculous to me.
It counts for something.
The fact that Coco isn't very good at it counts for something, and the fact that Pie has a vastly greater shot of being very good at it also counts for something.
If Coco was even a 95-105 OPS+ kind of hitter I'd agree with you, but he's not, he's not that good, the risk of replacing Coco with Pie and having Pie flameout isn't all that great.
This is when teams really Eff up, there should be no effing way that any GM would view Coco as a more valuable commodity than Pie (yes I know that undoubtedly there are those that do)
I'm not arguing for the trade. I'm not arguing that Coco is a more valuable commodity. I'm specifically arguing South Side's claim that he isn't sure Coco would outproduce Pie the rest of this season. I can't see how that's a reasonable expectation at this point.
Given their expected playing time on the Cubs (mostly a 4th or 5th outfielder), the actual value contributed by either player will not be dissimilar.
Cubs are buying low.
I don't know what the Cubs would want, and I imagine the Mets are just going to bank on Alou coming back anyway.
Ok fine, just Gallagher, Murton, and Hill then.
Bruce Miles on the rumor courtesy of NSBB:
He appears to be out of the Iowa rotation, and hasn't pitched in a week.
Kevin Hart only lasted 2+ innings for Iowa tonight, but Carrasco came in instead.
If Hill was hurt, they've got the 7-day DL in the minors, but he's still active.
Not that the trade rumor makes any more sense. No organization in their right mind would give up anything of value for Murton or Rich Hill at this point. As long as the Cubs are trying as hard as they can to completely demolish the potential trade value of both of those players, why would you dangle someone like Crisp, who despite his polarizing love-hate effect, is a more than serviceable major league player?
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