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Wednesday, January 17, 2018

Christian Yelich can only blame himself for Jeter entanglement | New York Post

And the money he’s getting is in the same currency. It’s not like Jeter converted payment into Monopoly money.

Jim Furtado Posted: January 17, 2018 at 03:33 PM | 62 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: christian yelich, marlins

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   1. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 17, 2018 at 03:55 PM (#5608309)
Read the article. Still not sure how it's Yelich's fault that under-capitalized owners bought the Marlins, and hired a rank incompetent to be CEO.
   2. zachtoma Posted: January 17, 2018 at 04:05 PM (#5608321)
I understand why Yelich is frustrated, but contracts work both ways. You sign a contract with an organization, you're agreeing to go through the good and the bad with them for whatever number of years. Publicly complaining when the bad times then come isn't all that endearing.
   3. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 17, 2018 at 04:10 PM (#5608328)
I understand why Yelich is frustrated, but contracts work both ways. You sign a contract with an organization, you're agreeing to go through the good and the bad with them for whatever number of years. Publicly complaining when the bad times then come isn't all that endearing.

I think that's true for bad fortune. But when the owners actively try to put a 50 win team on the field, it no longer holds.

How would we react if Yelich showed up to camp 50 lbs. overweight and said; "I don't really care how well I play in 2018 and 2019, my contract is guaranteed. I don't want to work out. I want to eat, and be merry. I'll start working out again in 2020, when I'm in the success cycle for my next contract."

Because that's what the Marlin owners are doing.
   4. Kiko Sakata Posted: January 17, 2018 at 04:11 PM (#5608330)
I understand why Yelich is frustrated, but contracts work both ways.


Christian Yelich only has five seasons of MLB service time after being drafted by the Marlins. There has never been a time in Christian Yelich's life when he could have unilaterally chosen to play for a major-league team other than the Marlins.
   5. PreservedFish Posted: January 17, 2018 at 04:26 PM (#5608337)
#3 - quality analogy
   6. Astroenteritis Posted: January 17, 2018 at 05:17 PM (#5608380)
How would we react if Yelich showed up to camp 50 lbs. overweight


I don't know about Yelich, but if Carlos Lee had shown up 50 lbs. overweight, we would have congratulated him on being in the best shape of his life.

   7. Internet Commenter Posted: January 17, 2018 at 05:40 PM (#5608394)
I think that's true for bad fortune. But when the owners actively try to put a 50 win team on the field, it no longer holds.

How would we react if Yelich showed up to camp 50 lbs. overweight and said; "I don't really care how well I play in 2018 and 2019, my contract is guaranteed. I don't want to work out. I want to eat, and be merry. I'll start working out again in 2020, when I'm in the success cycle for my next contract."

Because that's what the Marlin owners are doing.

Yelich signed his extension with Loria, so he doesn't have a credible claim that winning was his priority or that he couldn't have possibly foreseen Marlins ownership starting another rebuild. Does the CBA allow for opt-outs by players in the event of an ownership change? If yes, did he seek such a clause? If he relied upon oral promises from Loria about ownership's commitment to winning in the future, then he has no one to blame but himself.

As long as the Marlins distribute the mutually agreed-upon salary to Yelich, their contractual and moral duty to him is satisfied. If Yelich decided to no longer put forth a good faith effort to be in playing shape, then he would certainly be failng his moral (and possibly contractual) duty to the Marlins.
   8. Stormy JE Posted: January 17, 2018 at 05:46 PM (#5608398)
#### all copy editors: Sherman doesn't really criticize Yelich in the piece, merely opines that he has more sympathy for Castro's plight than Yelich's.
   9. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 17, 2018 at 05:54 PM (#5608404)
If Yelich decided to no longer put forth a good faith effort to be in playing shape, then he would certainly be failng his moral (and possibly contractual) duty to the Marlins.

Why does Yelich have a moral duty to try and win, while the owners don't?

When he signed he never guaranteed the Marlins that he'd care about playing baseball well.
   10. Walt Davis Posted: January 17, 2018 at 08:41 PM (#5608478)
And he's under no contractual obligation to play baseball well. He's under contractual obligation to try to stay healthy enough to take the field but he's not really even under any contractual obligation to stay in shape. Probably you can put a weight clause in there but, if there's not one, that's on the Marlins.

But at the moment, the big difference is this. We know the Marlins are not trying to win. Until such time as Yelich shows up out of shape, we have no evidence that he is not living up to his contractual and "moral" obligations.
   11. Internet Commenter Posted: January 17, 2018 at 08:50 PM (#5608485)
Why does Yelich have a moral duty to try and win, while the owners don't?

When he signed he never guaranteed the Marlins that he'd care about playing baseball well.

I feel it's implicit with his guaranteed contract. He doesn't have to care; he just has to make a good faith effort. In this circumstance, I think he's justified to "protest" by taking no risks whatsoever with his health - don't try to play through pain, don't dive for balls, etc.

I actually wish the players would work together to blacklist organizations like the Marlins since MLB refuses to do anything. It would be great if no one signed pre-arb deals and if all free agents refused to sign there.
   12. stig-tossled,hornswoggled gef the talking mongoose Posted: January 17, 2018 at 09:06 PM (#5608499)
#### all copy editors: Sherman doesn't really criticize Yelich in the piece, merely opines that he has more sympathy for Castro's plight than Yelich's.


A more, uh, rarefied (I guess) point is that "only" should modify & thus appear right before "himself" rather than "blame."

But hell, all the words are spelled correctly. That's something.
   13. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: January 17, 2018 at 10:59 PM (#5608553)
Yelich signed his extension with Loria, so he doesn't have a credible claim that winning was his priority or that he couldn't have possibly foreseen Marlins ownership starting another rebuild.
I don't think you can say that. When Yelich signed that extension in the spring of 2015, the Marlins were running out 7 everyday players under 30, including four talented guys 25 and under: Yelich, Giancarlo Stanto, JT Realmuto, and Marcell Ozuna. They had Mat Latos and big-deal prospects Jose Fernandez and Jarred Cosart just making the majors. That was a team that you could see as really going places. I think Yelich could very credibly claim that the winning was going to be the priority.
   14. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: January 17, 2018 at 11:43 PM (#5608560)
Why does Yelich have a moral duty to try and win, while the owners don't?


The obvious answer is that he doesn't if they don't. Any gyrations in an attempt to justify otherwise are silly. The only reasons he would bother are (A) personal pride and (B) a hope that he might one day help a team, somewhere, somehow, win. Or, I suppose, (C) he'll one day get an even bigger contract.
   15. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: January 18, 2018 at 12:40 AM (#5608566)
Yelich signed his extension with Loria, so he doesn't have a credible claim that winning was his priority or that he couldn't have possibly foreseen Marlins ownership starting another rebuild. Does the CBA allow for opt-outs by players in the event of an ownership change? If yes, did he seek such a clause? If he relied upon oral promises from Loria about ownership's commitment to winning in the future, then he has no one to blame but himself.

As long as the Marlins distribute the mutually agreed-upon salary to Yelich, their contractual and moral duty to him is satisfied. If Yelich decided to no longer put forth a good faith effort to be in playing shape, then he would certainly be failng his moral (and possibly contractual) duty to the Marlins.


What a load of bollocks. Yelich is a 26 year old young man who signed an extension worth millions to secure his financial future. At the time the team had quite a number of young, up and coming players who had the potential to be super. The question is really why you wouldn't have done what Yelich did? It makes perfect sense. Sure Loria is a glorified snake oil salesman, but he's good at it and obviously convincing since he's got far more cash then I'd ever see in 10 lifetimes.

Snapper's analogy is spot on.
   16. RMc Has Bizarre Ideas to Fix Baseball Posted: January 18, 2018 at 07:07 AM (#5608578)
I don't really care how well I play in 2018 and 2019, my contract is guaranteed. I don't want to work out. I want to eat, and be merry.

Me as a baseball player.
   17. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:10 AM (#5608602)
Why does Yelich have a moral duty to try and win, while the owners don't?
When he signed he never guaranteed the Marlins that he'd care about playing baseball well.
The obvious answer is that he doesn't if they don't.


This is false. Yelich has a moral duty to provide the service he is being paid to provide, play baseball as well as he is able. If my company is not bothering to expand or increase their market share while still paying me commensurately for the service of my work, it is certainly immoral for me to perform my work like garbage because they aren't doing what I think they should be doing.

It is bewildering that snapper considers himself a moral human being with such an attitude.
   18. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:20 AM (#5608607)
This is false. Yelich has a moral duty to provide the service he is being paid to provide, play baseball as well as he is able. If my company is not bothering to expand or increase their market share while still paying me commensurately for the service of my work, it is certainly immoral for me to perform my work like garbage because they aren't doing what I think they should be doing.

It is bewildering that snapper considers himself a moral human being with such an attitude.


This is not your company not trying to expand. This is your company intentionally failing to provide the promised services to your customers, while pocketing the money. This is your company intentionally running as a scam.

You're in shipping right? If your company started intentionally not sending shipments to customers, and stealing cargo to sell for their own profit, you'd have no obligation to work hard, or really to work at all. If you were under an unbreakable contract, and couldn't turn them in the the law, your obligation would be to do as little as possible to help them run their scam.

The Marlins are engaged in legal fraud. The whole franchise is a big con. Just like the investment banks did with MBS and CDOs. No one has any obligation to work to assist in a fraud.
   19. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:25 AM (#5608611)
This is your company intentionally failing to provide the promised services to your customers, while pocketing the money.

Answer me this: are they still paying you to work for them? (And this has nothing to do with your tortured analogy below, so don't try and expand on that as an answer, just from what you wrote here.)


If your company started intentionally not sending shipments to customers, and stealing cargo to sell for their own profit, you'd have no obligation to work hard, or really to work at all

If it's your opinion they are doing so, as opposed to something that fits the actual definition of those words, you do.


The Marlins are engaged in legal fraud. Just like the investment banks did with MBS and CDOs. No one has any obligation to work to assist a fraud.

I don't even know how to respond to this, because it's ridiculous.
   20. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:34 AM (#5608613)
If it's your opinion they are doing so, as opposed to something that fits the actual definition of those words, you do.

No. You quit. Something Yelich would gladly do, but is not allowed to.

I don't even know how to respond to this, because it's ridiculous.

It's reality. The Marlins are engaged in a legal scam, just like countless big businesses in this country.

They're milking the franchise for profit with no regard for their employees or customers. They're no better than a corporate raider that pillages the pension fund, and overleverages the company to extract cash.
   21. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:36 AM (#5608615)
If the Marlins aren't willing to honor Yelich's trade request, maybe he should try batting from the right side and throwing with his left hand during games this year. Switch-hitters are more valuable, after all, and switch-throwers are popular with fans!
   22. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:44 AM (#5608621)
The Marlins are engaged in a legal scam, just like countless big businesses in this country.
They're milking the franchise for profit with no regard for their employees or customers.


And which pure-as-driven-snow bank are you working for again?

Seriously, snapper, without lies for profit, there is no Capitalism, and your stance here is nonsensical. First stone, eh?
   23. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:50 AM (#5608626)

And which pure-as-driven-snow bank are you working for again?


I work for a mutual insurance company. All our profits go back to the policyholders. I have never worked for a bank.

Seriously, snapper, without lies for profit, there is no Capitalism, and your stance here is nonsensical. First stone, eh?

That's nonsense, and that's why capitalism, as currently practiced, is immoral. A company has no right to lie, or screw over its customers and employees just to maximize profits. I'm no capitalist. I believe in free markets, not modern capitalism.
   24. Nasty Nate Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:55 AM (#5608628)
This is your company intentionally failing to provide the promised services to your customers, while pocketing the money.
This isn't quite right. They will be providing baseball games. Every baseball customer knows that there is no promise of winning or quality.
Yelich signed his extension with Loria, so he doesn't have a credible claim that winning was his priority or that he couldn't have possibly foreseen Marlins ownership starting another rebuild.
But it's not even Loria that is doing the rebuild.
   25. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:00 AM (#5608631)
This isn't quite right. They will be providing baseball games. Every baseball customer knows that there is no promise of winning or quality.

Right, but there's a promise of trying to field a winning team. I think intentional tanking violates that.
   26. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:03 AM (#5608634)
That's nonsense, and that's why capitalism, as currently practiced, is immoral. A company has no right to lie, or screw over its customers and employees just to maximize profits. I'm no capitalist. I believe in free markets, not modern capitalism.


This is correct. As a human, Christian Yelich is expected to have some sort of moral code. As a corporation in 2018, the Marlins are expected to have one single priority, which is making profits at the expense of everybody else.
   27. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:10 AM (#5608637)
I'm with Snapper on this one. I liken Yelich's situation to one that several people I know in the tech industry have found themselves in -- signing up with a promising firm that wasn't entirely upfront about its potential and future. Nothing fraudulent in a legal sense, but instead of a place in a vibrant workplace, you end up stuck in an office in which two-thirds of the other workers have been let go and the company is doing the minimum possible to keep the lights on so they can spend down all of the VC money without getting sued by anyone. Sure, the money's good, but the company isn't even trying to do anything useful at that point, and there's no possible societal benefit to its continued existence. It's depressing, and in that case the worker is entirely morally justified in doing the absolute minimum required under his contract. (The difference of course is that the tech worker will usually be looking for other jobs and won't have to stick around to the bitter end, whereas Yelich is dependent on the Marlins trading him.)
   28. Batman Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:11 AM (#5608639)
"The Jeter Entanglement" was my favorite Big Bang Theory episode.
   29. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:12 AM (#5608640)
is entirely morally justified in doing the absolute minimum required under his contract.

So how would you define this for Yelich?
   30. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:23 AM (#5608645)
That is a good question. We haven't seen Yelich's contract, but I presume it requires him to be available to play baseball every day during the regular season and postseason (not spring training, I don't think they get paid during spring training). He could probably just show up a minute before every game and skip batting practice and other forms of practice.

And then you have to meet certain fitness guidelines, and show up at promotional events, or be fined. Maybe he can skip out on that stuff if he doesn't mind being fined. I found an article saying the standard MLB contract says "The team may terminate the contract if the player fails, refuses or neglects to exhibit "good citizenship and good sportsmanship or to keep himself in first-class physical condition," or fails "to exhibit sufficient skill" to remain a member of the team." But has this ever been enforced? If the Red Sox couldn't invoke this for Pablo Sandoval it may be impossible.

   31. BDC Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:31 AM (#5608650)
"The Jeter Entanglement" was my favorite Big Bang Theory episode

Was that the one about the right-handed quark that had trouble going to its left?
   32. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:37 AM (#5608658)
So how would you define this for Yelich?


Show up, wear the uniform, and jog after the ball once in a while.
   33. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:54 AM (#5608676)
I think that with ballplayers the minimum acceptable effort is a bit more than the minimum acceptable effort required of a developer in a zombie corporation, if only because Yelich's job is so public. Vlad has something close to the actual minimum contractual requirements, but I think Yelich should stay away from Operation Shutdown and the all-Twinkie diet. Something like:

Report to Spring Training five minutes before the deadline. Never show up for extra BP or extra whatever. If it says "optional", don't show up. Skip every promotional event he contractually can. Don't ever try to defend the team to the press. Always insist on a day off when he's fatigued. Don't try to make plays at the extreme edge of his range, and basically play on cruise control, always putting his own health and prospects first. Make the basic efforts to win without ever really going all out.

(The ironic thing is that this last bit might be better for the team, on the theory that a healthy, rested player is more important than the occasional circus catch. But most people still seem to believe that visible max effort counts for a lot.)
   34. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:56 AM (#5608679)
This is correct. As a human, Christian Yelich is expected to have some sort of moral code.

Especially as a Christian.
   35. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 10:57 AM (#5608680)
Report to Spring Training five minutes before the deadline. Never show up for extra BP or extra whatever. Skip every promotional event he contractually can. Don't ever try to defend the team to the press. Always insist on a day off when he's fatigued. Don't try to make plays at the extreme edge of his range, and basically play on cruise control, always puttin his own health and prospects first. Make the basic efforts to win without ever really going all out.

That's about right. As a professional, he should still try. Even if only selfishly to ensure his next contract. But not out of any obligation to the Marlins, just out of personal pride and self-interest.

I'd add he should never bunt, try and hit the other way to advance the runner, or hit a sca fly with man on third, and <2 outs. He should maximize his personal production.
   36. BDC Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:03 AM (#5608692)
Yelich showing up fat and lazy is an excellent fictional analogy to the Marlin's management efforts, but of course it's in his selfish interests to play well. His chances of getting dealt to a contender are lowered if he bats .198 through the All-Star Break, if he shuts down now he can't be sure he can turn things back on again later, future employers might not like to see 2018-19 as a dead loss on his resumé, etc. So one doubts he's even remotely thinking about such a thing. This is obvious and perhaps just points out the imbalance in the situation (he has to try his best, but Jeter doesn't).

   37. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:08 AM (#5608698)
This is obvious and perhaps just points out the imbalance in the situation (he has to try his best, but Jeter doesn't).


Which was exactly my point. I'm not recommending he actually gain 50 lbs.
   38. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:18 AM (#5608708)
I'd add he should never bunt, try and hit the other way to advance the runner, or hit a sca fly with man on third, and <2 outs. He should maximize his personal production.

Snapper, have you considered the Church of Satan?
   39. jmurph Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:27 AM (#5608729)
I get that we're mostly in the theoretical at this point, but I think you guys are sidestepping a player's responsibilities to his teammates and coaches/manager, all of whom will (presumably!) be trying their best to win.
   40. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:30 AM (#5608737)
Snapper, have you considered the Church of Satan?

What? You're being unhinged here.

There's no moral content to how you play baseball, unless you deliberately try and injure someone.
   41. Batman Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:35 AM (#5608744)
Christian Yelich can only blame himself and Satan for Jeter entanglement
   42. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:36 AM (#5608748)
Christian Yelich can only blame himself and Satan for Jeter entanglement

Well, and Chris Truby, of course.
   43. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:38 AM (#5608749)
Snapper, have you considered the Church of Satan?

Obligatory.
   44. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:40 AM (#5608752)
What?


The philosophy behind LaVeyan Satanism is grounded in individualism and rational egoism/selfishness, so he's suggesting that based on your quoted recommendation for Yelich, you might find some common ground there.
   45. Baldrick Posted: January 18, 2018 at 12:19 PM (#5608799)
In soccer, tons of players basically engage in Operation Shutdowns every year. It's considered a standard part of the negotiating process.

Not saying it's better or worse, but baseball's intense commitment to the principle that you have to try your hardest and just suck up the contingencies of life as an athlete are just norms. It could easily be otherwise.
   46. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 12:20 PM (#5608800)
The philosophy behind LaVeyan Satanism is grounded in individualism and rational egoism/selfishness, so he's suggesting that based on your quoted recommendation for Yelich, you might find some common ground there.


Plus the music is awesome, way cooler than those Gregorian chants.
   47. Benji Gil Gamesh VII - The Opt-Out Awakens Posted: January 18, 2018 at 12:42 PM (#5608819)
fails "to exhibit sufficient skill" to remain a member of the team." But has this ever been enforced? If the Red Sox couldn't invoke this for Pablo Sandoval it may be impossible.
Yeah something seems off here, because it essentially would make it a non-guaranteed contract, at least for purposes of performance. You would think SOMEONE would have tried that with an especially bad contract for a thoroughly washed-up player.
   48. BDC Posted: January 18, 2018 at 12:42 PM (#5608820)
In soccer, tons of players basically engage in Operation Shutdowns every year. It's considered a standard part of the negotiating process.

Not saying it's better or worse, but baseball's intense commitment to the principle that you have to try your hardest and just suck up the contingencies of life as an athlete are just norms. It could easily be otherwise


If so, the norms of baseball might be linked to the statistics we are all so fascinated with. If a pitcher's velocity goes down and his strikeout rate dips, people think there's something wrong with his arm, not that he's saving himself for free agency.
   49. Lassus Posted: January 18, 2018 at 01:04 PM (#5608838)
Plus the music is awesome, way cooler than those Gregorian chants.

No. Even atheists know better than that.
   50. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 01:24 PM (#5608869)
Some people aren't ready for Ozzy.
   51. PreservedFish Posted: January 18, 2018 at 01:37 PM (#5608874)
The philosophy behind LaVeyan Satanism is grounded in individualism and rational egoism/selfishness, so he's suggesting that based on your quoted recommendation for Yelich, you might find some common ground there.


I remember reading some of his Satanic scriptures and discovering this - yes that it's about selfishness but there's also what I saw to be a very positive and life-affirming quality to it. There was a lot in there that I agreed with. I think at the same time I had just read Zorba the Greek and I noted some real similarities in between Satanism and Zorba's intoxicating earthy philosophy. Why do they dress it up with all the ghosts and goblins bullshit though?
   52. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 01:51 PM (#5608888)
Cooler tshirts
   53. reech Posted: January 18, 2018 at 02:22 PM (#5608914)
Isn't it a bit pre-mature to judge Jeets as an incompotent executive?
   54. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 18, 2018 at 02:48 PM (#5608939)
Isn't it a bit pre-mature to judge Jeets as an incompotent executive?

Well, he traded the NL MVP and a 27 y.o. OF coming off a 6 WAR season, and didn't get a single consensus top-100 pick. And he's utterly lost the PR war around those moves. So, the early signs are not good.

Why should we have expected him to be even decent? The guy has no managerial experience of any type, no coaching experience, no experience evaluating talent, no marketing experience, no finance experience. Really, no experience of any kind that is applicable to being CEO of an MLB club.

Given the sophistication of modern front offices, and the sheer number of highly educated, highly intelligent people they're attracting, it would be pretty shocking if an ex-player could simply walk off the field, and into the office and do a decent job.
   55. BDC Posted: January 18, 2018 at 02:54 PM (#5608943)
I reckon if this is Year One of the latest Marlins Tanking Grand Strategy, and Jeter accepts the World Series trophy in 2024, he will have done OK, that's true. But initial signs indeed aren't great.
   56. Walt Davis Posted: January 18, 2018 at 05:17 PM (#5609066)
Do we really know that Jeter is anything more than the public face of ownership? Is he actually making (or even contributing to) these decisions?

As BDC notes, it's in Yelich's interests to perform well and there's no serious risk he'll do otherwise. At most, he'll hold out during spring training hoping to force the Marlins to trade him but I can't remember the last time we've seen something like that (other than Operation Shutdown's spectacular failure). So realistically, at most as someone suggested, he'll stop diving for balls, he'll take the day off for small injuries (might be a good thing anyway), he doesn't pretend to be a happy camper.

Technically Snapper, Yelich can of course quit -- he just has to give up millions and stop playing pro baseball. He can go to college and get a degree. I wouldn't recommend that but if he has the purest moral standards regarding fan fraud ...

Regarding "he signed with Loria, he deserves what he gets" ... In addition to the points about all the talent they had, that was also the same offseason they gave Stanton the biggest contract ever. I'm not sure which one was signed first but the Marlins were in spending mode at the time. Payroll went up $23 M that offseason (and not much going to Yelich or Stanton yet) and, per Cots, topped out at $115 last year. Without question, Loria's history to that point should have given anybody pause but Loria was spending a bit.

But there's also the fact that, even without the extension, Yelich still wouldn't be an FA until after the 2019 season. Whether he bought Loria's schtick or not, he would have no control over whether he had to stick around for this. At the most you can say "he should have seen this coming and realized that, with just two years of control left instead of five, it's more likely they'd have traded him this offseason just like Ozuna." That's a pretty good crystal ball that can predict three years into the future that accurately ... but apparently he should have asked it whether to buy Boeing stock.
   57. Batman Posted: January 18, 2018 at 05:35 PM (#5609074)
Derek Bell had hit .173 in 46 games in 2001 and threatened to go into Operation Shutdown if he had to compete for a starting job in 2002. Even if he calls it "Operation Shutdown," anything Yelich does will be more successful than that.
   58. Zach Posted: January 18, 2018 at 07:08 PM (#5609122)
I sympathize with Yelich, but the situation isn't completely symmetrical. The team is paying him 49 million dollars; he isn't paying the team anything.

It's fine to ask for a trade, but holding back his best efforts would be playing with fire.
   59. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:12 PM (#5609196)
The team is paying him 49 million dollars; he isn't paying the team anything.

He is providing them more than 49 million dollars worth of services. The Marlins are paying him that money, because they expect to make more money off of the services he is providing. Otherwise, they would happily give him away for nothing (and have many takers).
   60. PreservedFish Posted: January 18, 2018 at 09:37 PM (#5609227)
Do we really know that Jeter is anything more than the public face of ownership? Is he actually making (or even contributing to) these decisions?


He's the CEO and he's doing CEO things. I'm sure that the real owners set the grand overarching strategy, and that they commanded Jeter to cut expenses. But as to whether they should trade this guy or that or the other, I don't see why it wouldn't be Jeter in charge.
   61. Ziggy's screen name Posted: January 18, 2018 at 11:52 PM (#5609312)
This some sort of local trouble?

Let's just say we'd like to avoid any Jeter-entanglements.

Well, that's the trick, isn't it? And it's going to cost you something extra. Jose Devers, Jorge Guzman, and Starlin Castro - all in advance.

What?!? We could almost get our own Giancarlo Stanton for that!

And who is going to bat behind him kid? You?

You bet I could, I'm not such a bad batter myself. We don't have to listen to this...

We'll give you Daniel Castano and Zac Gallen now, plus Sandy Alcantara and Magneuris Sierra, once we reach St. Louis.

Okay, you got yourselves an outfielder. Meet us at that hideous homerun sculpture in centerfield when you're ready to go.

The hideous homerun sculpture.

These guys must really be desperate. This could really save my neck. Go back to the outfielder, get his bats pine-tarred, and get him ready.

Ext. Miami

You'll have to sell your Marcel Ozuna.

That's okay. I'm never coming back to this franchise again.
   62. Walt Davis Posted: January 21, 2018 at 05:07 PM (#5610494)
If a pitcher's velocity goes down and his strikeout rate dips, people think there's something wrong with his arm, not that he's saving himself for free agency.

Or the JR Richard story where a reduction in performance and complaining about a dead arm was widely portrayed as jaking ... until the stroke. Fortunately, I think you're right and this has mostly changed but it seems not that long ago (a few years ago) somebody was being widely criticized for being on the DL too long (Ellsbury? Tex?) and it certainly happened to JD Drew a lot.

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