Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Monday, November 19, 2012

Clubhouse Confidential: On AL MVP Results

Clubhouse Confidential looks at the AL MVP results and discusses the BBWAA’s responsibility to the top candidates.

Xander Posted: November 19, 2012 at 11:16 AM | 10 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: awards and honors, media, miguel cabrera, mike trout, mvp

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: November 19, 2012 at 01:57 PM (#4306045)
Superb.
   2. OPS+ Posted: November 19, 2012 at 02:00 PM (#4306049)
Succinctly put. He did an excellent job of dispelling the whole notion of "leading one's team to the playoffs."
   3. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: November 19, 2012 at 02:22 PM (#4306072)
Succinctly put. He did an excellent job of dispelling the whole notion of "leading one's team to the playoffs."


Agreed. I know this video won't change a lot of minds, but I think it does a marvelous job of poking holes in a lot of the rhetoric we've heard backing Cabrera's MVP victory without resorting to insults or exaggerations.
   4. Jarrod HypnerotomachiaPoliphili (TeddyF.Ballgame) Posted: November 19, 2012 at 03:27 PM (#4306157)
That was really well done. Balanced and strong, without seeming strident or negative.
   5. TomH Posted: November 19, 2012 at 03:32 PM (#4306158)
And he does it by turning the stats geel argument around 180! :)


It amazes me the logical inconsistency of many otherwise seemingly intelligent people.

If you really believe that a person whose team did not make the playoffs cannot be the most valuable player, then you have to also believe he cannot be the 2nd, 3rd, or 10th most valuable player. But I know of ZERO voters EVER who insisted on filling out a complete 10-man MVP ballot with only players from 'winners'.

If it ever DID happen, the ridicule that followed would only serve to accentuate the silly notion to begin with that how good your teammates are influences how good an individual's year was.
   6. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 19, 2012 at 04:32 PM (#4306227)
If you really believe that a person whose team did not make the playoffs cannot be the most valuable player, then you have to also believe he cannot be the 2nd, 3rd, or 10th most valuable player.


Actually, you can. It depends on how much value you place on whether or not the team would have made the playoffs, given a particular player's absence from the lineup. If you believe, for example, that the Yankees make the playoffs without Cano (a position not without some logic), then you can place Trout above Cano on the theory that neither player was truly essential to his team's postseason chances. (Yes, that requires a few contortions to get to this point.)

-- MWE
   7. JJ1986 Posted: November 19, 2012 at 04:37 PM (#4306233)
Actually, you can. It depends on how much value you place on whether or not the team would have made the playoffs, given a particular player's absence from the lineup. If you believe, for example, that the Yankees make the playoffs without Cano (a position not without some logic), then you can place Trout above Cano on the theory that neither player was truly essential to his team's postseason chances. (Yes, that requires a few contortions to get to this point.)


But how can you have Trout above Josh Reddick or Adam Jones then?
   8. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 19, 2012 at 04:46 PM (#4306242)
But how can you have Trout above Josh Reddick or Adam Jones then?


Like I said, it requires contortions to get you there. (Josh Reddick wasn't the A's storyline guy anyway, Cespedes was.)

Seriously, anyone who's applying this argument isn't thinking below the #1 spot on the ballot, anyway. There is a body of the writing public that acts as though the #1 spot on the ballot is the only important spot.

-- MWE
   9. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: November 19, 2012 at 04:49 PM (#4306246)
Everyone on Hot Stove this morning was talking about how it's the stats camp that's being totally unreasonable about this whole thing, which I think, it's exactly a fair assessment. If Trout had won, you can bet we'd have an avalanche of vitriol-filled columns about all of these pasty slide-rule-loving geeks. Hell, Cabrera won and look how many columns we've seen about it that deride the stat geeks and their whacky formulas.

Also, it pains me that the same network that employs Brian Kenny also sends a paycheck to Billy Ripken.
   10. The District Attorney Posted: November 19, 2012 at 07:08 PM (#4306323)
Who decided that sports footage needs to be backed by never-ending guitar solos?

Was it George Michael?

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

News

All News | Prime News

Old-School Newsstand


BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Eugene Freedman
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogOTP 18 September 2017: Ex-Baseball Star Darryl Strawberry Criticizes Jemele Hill, Praises POTUS: Trump is ‘A Great Man’
(213 - 11:25am, Sep 19)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

NewsblogTaking Back the Ballparks - Washington Nationals
(95 - 11:23am, Sep 19)
Last: MNB

NewsblogSafest Bet in Sports: Men Complaining About a Female Announcer’s Voice
(27 - 11:23am, Sep 19)
Last: snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster)

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 9-19-2017
(4 - 11:23am, Sep 19)
Last: stanmvp48

Newsblog‘Friends,’ the Sitcom That’s Still a Hit in Major League Baseball
(75 - 11:22am, Sep 19)
Last: simon bedford

NewsblogRed Sox outlast Orioles in 11 innings, 10-8
(8 - 11:20am, Sep 19)
Last: Styles P. Deadball

NewsblogTaking Back the Ballparks - Nationals voting thread
(37 - 11:19am, Sep 19)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

Gonfalon Cubs15 To Go
(38 - 11:17am, Sep 19)
Last: Covfefe

NewsblogBrad Ausmus' tirade about 'negativity' a bad response to reasonable question | MLive.com
(6 - 11:13am, Sep 19)
Last: Tim D

NewsblogA’s preferred stadium site criticized for causing gentrification, killing waterfowl | Field of Schemes
(4 - 11:03am, Sep 19)
Last: Flynn

NewsblogChase Utley on Hall of Fame: 'Something that I don’t really focus much on'
(98 - 11:01am, Sep 19)
Last: Ithaca2323

NewsblogRangers' Joey Gallo hits 490-foot home run | MLB.com
(49 - 10:47am, Sep 19)
Last: Barry`s_Lazy_Boy

Sox TherapyGrind On
(19 - 10:21am, Sep 19)
Last: Jose is an Absurd Doubles Machine

NewsblogRun or slide into first base? Let's ask Statcast
(2 - 9:48am, Sep 19)
Last: Sunday silence

NewsblogOT-NBA off season thread
(2386 - 9:41am, Sep 19)
Last: jmurph

Page rendered in 0.2733 seconds
47 querie(s) executed