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Friday, January 13, 2012

College Football: Postseason Thread

Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 08:22 AM | 892 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. Millon deFloss Posted: January 13, 2012 at 10:14 AM (#4035970)
West Virginia just scored again.
   2. Quaker Posted: January 13, 2012 at 10:48 AM (#4035994)
Did you mean offseason, not postseason?
   3. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 10:57 AM (#4036004)
Derp. Yeah, I meant offseason.
   4. Cowboy Popup Posted: January 13, 2012 at 11:05 AM (#4036010)
Some way too early preseason rankings:

ESPN (Schlabach)

CNNSI (Staples)

CBSSports (McMurphy)

Boise St. has a pretty severe drop, and is excluded from one of them. Only Schlabach is still buying what FSU is selling (#8), although they are ranked in all the polls. WVU has gotten a huge bump due to the Orange Bowl performance. They all love LSU, USC, Oregon, Bama, and Arkansas next year (who can blame em?). Should be another exciting year in the SEC West.
   5. Spivey Posted: January 13, 2012 at 11:11 AM (#4036019)
I'm a homer, but I think Texas is getting badly underrated in these - quarterback is an issue but they should be good to elite at every other position. I also think Michigan State is getting substantially overrated. I really don't see them as a title contender without Cousins.
   6. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: January 13, 2012 at 11:35 AM (#4036050)
MSU definitely overrated. Different team without Cousins.
   7. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 12:07 PM (#4036099)
I also think Michigan State is getting substantially overrated. I really don't see them as a title contender without Cousins.

Maybe, but that defense is going to be one of the best in the nation.
   8. Cowboy Popup Posted: January 13, 2012 at 12:14 PM (#4036109)
I'm a homer, but I think Texas is getting badly underrated in these - quarterback is an issue but they should be good to elite at every other position.

I think Texas is probably going to better then their ranking next year too, but I'm glad to see the polls are intent on making them earn their way back up. After going 13-12 the last two years, they should have to win some ball games before they get back to the top ten or so.

Sparty has Boise and ND on the OOC schedule, both at home though. They get OSU and Nebraska at home and have to go to Wisconsin and Michigan. That's a tough schedule, even with most of the big games at home, to break in a new QB. I guess we will find out how well Dantonio has been recruiting.
   9. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 12:52 PM (#4036159)
corrected link For ESPN/ Schlabach
   10. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 04:26 PM (#4036400)
When is the national title game? I kinda stopped paying attention a month ago with the conference title games. Don't they usually play it on New Year's Day?

Just kidding. Sorta.
   11. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 14, 2012 at 11:49 PM (#4037264)
Darron Thomas is leaving Oregon early....kind of shocking really.

Alabama will probably be like the 2010 version of the team, which was still very good and have another veteran team ready for 2013.

   12. William Satterwhite Posted: January 15, 2012 at 04:07 AM (#4037281)
Darron Thomas is leaving Oregon early....kind of shocking really.


Seems like a situation where he knows his stock probably isn't going to get any higher no matter how well he performs and could actually go down if he slips up or gets injured and Bryan Bennett takes his job.
   13. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 15, 2012 at 08:36 AM (#4037297)
I'm glad this thread got bumped, because it's time to go back to the subject that made the CFB thread blow up in the first place.

This is really just pathetic from St. Joe...

" Paterno told columnist Sally Jenkins that his graduate assistant withheld the specifics of what he said he saw Jerry Sandusky doing that day in 2002.
“And to be frank with you, I don’t know that it would have done any good, because I never heard of, of, rape and a man,” Paterno said. “So I just did what I thought was best. I talked to people that I thought would be, if there was a problem, that would be following up on it.”"

WTF. This guy is a devout Catholic and he is unfamiliar with boy buggery? BS.

In any case, repeat after me....Joe Pa knew Sandusky was a child molester. Joe Pa knew Sandusky was a child molester, etc.

That being the case, he really is tarnished forever.

Also, he is calling McQueary a perjurer. I suppose it's possibly that McQ said something like "I saw Sandusky sodomizing a boy in the locker room" and Joe Pa had know idea what sodomizing meant.
   14. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: January 15, 2012 at 09:25 AM (#4037303)
WTF. This guy is a devout Catholic and he is unfamiliar with boy buggery? BS.


As a devout Catholic, he probably just doesn't think there's anything wrong with it. Or he's exceptionally good at denial.

Not that those are mutually exclusive, of course.
   15. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 15, 2012 at 10:14 PM (#4037685)
Biggest thing before signing day is the assistant coach carousel. I think Auburn had a nice grab with Brian Van Gorder as their DC. Supposedly Alabama has hired Doug Nussmeier as their OC.
   16. Howie Menckel Posted: January 15, 2012 at 11:29 PM (#4037717)

Paterno is an Ivy League graduate (Brown).

This is an award Penn St offers:

"The Reverend Thomas Bermingham, S.J. Scholarship in the Classics was created by Penn State's football coach, Joe Paterno, honoring his high school Latin teacher. The Bermingham Scholarship provides recognition and financial assistance to full-time Penn State undergraduate students enrolled or planning to enroll in Greek and or Latin studies in the College of the Liberal Arts at University Park. Bermingham Scholarship are awarded on a competitive basis."

Joe in that interview came off like Seinfeld's Uncle Leo, who would act confused whenever he got caught shoplifting in the bookstore, then they'd let him go because of that...

   17. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 16, 2012 at 04:47 PM (#4038218)
I do think it's awesome that Joe Paterno sponsors a classics scholarship. Mirabile visu!
   18. Bitter Mouse Posted: January 16, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4038230)
What do people think of the Penn State coaching hire? Seems like hiring a sacrificial goat, if he lasts more than 2.5 years I will be stunned.
   19. William Satterwhite Posted: January 16, 2012 at 05:25 PM (#4038259)
What do people think of the Penn State coaching hire? Seems like hiring a sacrificial goat, if he lasts more than 2.5 years I will be stunned.


I think it was really the best kind of hire they could have made under the circumstances and it could actually turn out to be a solid hire down the line. He's kind of anonymous but O'Brien does have a good pedigree (coaching under George O'Leary and Ralph Friedgen to go along with his current Pats work) and I think it helps that most of his previous college experience has been with schools where working conditions are less than ideal but has nevertheless had a generally successful career outside of his tenure at Duke (of course, no one except for Steve Spurrier can ever have success at Duke).
   20. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 17, 2012 at 04:16 PM (#4038828)
Good article on the new oversigning rule in the SEC. The joys of recruiting....especially in the SEC.

Saban destroys another young man's dreams
   21. Zipperholes Posted: January 17, 2012 at 05:02 PM (#4038868)
Had Alabama planned to grayshirt Taylor immediately after he got hurt, Taylor might have had more time to find a school willing to take him. Getting the bad news in January puts Taylor in a more difficult situation because most schools have already filled their classes. By the same token, no other schools recruited Taylor hard after his injury.
I don't necessarily agree with Staples's argument. Maybe Taylor didn't entertain other offers because he expected to enroll at Alabama in 2012. Now, because Saban waited until four months after Taylor's injury to inform him he would be greyshirted, other schools that have since filled their classes won't be able to offer him a spot.
   22. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 21, 2012 at 10:13 PM (#4042112)
Looks like Joe Paterno is going to die pretty soon. Much like Bear Bryant, coaching may have been something that kept him going....
   23. Tripon Posted: January 22, 2012 at 12:14 PM (#4042371)
Joe Paterno passed away today. He was 85 years old. http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-me-joe-paterno-20120123,0,5151888.column
   24. Bitter Mouse Posted: January 22, 2012 at 12:48 PM (#4042382)
Paterno's story this year feels like a Greek tragedy, complete with heroic qualities leavened with giant flaws and hubris in all directions. And of course the final act of destruction followed by death.

I am not making light of the whole thing, though, or at least not trying to.
   25. Bitter Mouse Posted: January 22, 2012 at 12:49 PM (#4042383)
A question for Harveys - or others connected to Wisconsin Football: What is up with your program and the exodus of coaches?
   26. Cowboy Popup Posted: January 22, 2012 at 10:42 PM (#4042744)
Kelly to the Bucs? Am I crazy for be being scared about Oregon coming after Holgorsen if Kelly leaves?
   27. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 22, 2012 at 10:47 PM (#4042745)
I think Oregon is going to be on probation or some sort of trouble...there has to be a reason that Kelly leaves for a NFL job with 10 days to go before recruiting is over, especially a job that has been open for a while.
   28. Cowboy Popup Posted: January 22, 2012 at 10:52 PM (#4042748)
I think Oregon is going to be on probation or some sort of trouble...there has to be a reason that Kelly leaves for a NFL job with 10 days to go before recruiting is over, especially a job that has been open for a while.

That makes sense. Especially in the wake of Darron Thomas' surprising jump to the NFL.

Edit: But if the ESPN twitter feed is to be believed, Oregon doesn't believe the sanctions will be that bad.
   29. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: January 22, 2012 at 11:01 PM (#4042758)
Paterno's story this year feels like a Greek tragedy, complete with heroic qualities leavened with giant flaws and hubris in all directions. And of course the final act of destruction followed by death.

Truth, and until my fellow alums come to understand this, the University will not recover.
   30. smileyy Posted: January 22, 2012 at 11:18 PM (#4042775)
Not suprising that Ivan Maisel performs some sort of necrophilia on Joe Paterno:

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7487990/joe-paterno-penn-state-legacy-more-scandal

The 409 victories, while record-setting, are not the full measure of the man. The young men he left behind, the campus to which he devoted his life, a campus whose leaders shoved him aside in the panicky, feverish days after the scandal broke, also give testimony to the life of Joseph Vincent Paterno.


I guess I'm thinking of a different set of "young men he left behind" than Maisel is.
   31. JJ1986 Posted: January 26, 2012 at 11:29 AM (#4046078)
Greg Schiano is going to coach the Tampa Bay Bucs.
   32. CFBF Is A Golden Spider Duck Posted: January 26, 2012 at 11:48 AM (#4046091)
Just saw that, JJ. And my first thought was, "This might be just what Florida needs to sign Darius Hamilton on the first." Recruiting really screws up one's sense of perspective.
   33. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:13 PM (#4046115)
A question for Harveys - or others connected to Wisconsin Football: What is up with your program and the exodus of coaches?


Not that surprising, at least to me. Paul Cryst was almost certainly going to take a HC job somewhere, AD Barry Alvarez definitely made it clear that he would support his candidacy for a HC job somewhere else. It was believed that if Cryst would leave, he would definitely take at least one assistant (Bostad, they were joined at hip) and he ended up having two others join him at Pitt (that rubbed some fans the wrong way). The Safeties Coach (also ST coordinator) Cross left for KU (near home), and apparently had BB, and UW support. Another coach went to ASU. I think most were caught off guard that 5 coaches (am I missing another?) took off, it implies instability, but most schools do see an off season which leads to a fair number of departures every 5 years or so. These guys all got promotions, likely more $$$ and another opportunity.

Is there something toxic about being with Brett B? I don't know, not qualified to know (not alum, just follow it closely).
   34. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:20 PM (#4046119)
OH MY GOD! BEST RECRUITING CLASS IN SCHOOL HISTORY GONE IN AN INSTANT!!

#### YOU SCHIANO I HOPE YOU ROT IN HELL
   35. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:21 PM (#4046121)
SERIOUSLY I HOPE HE GETS FIRED IN TWO YEARS AND ENDS UP A DC AT NEW HAMPSHIRE. #### HIM
   36. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:31 PM (#4046138)
Yesterday Schiano landed a 4 star recruit. Today he's leaving for the NFL. He almost certainly said things about commitment to this recruit, so he either lied through his team or he took the job on a whim. I'm guess it wasn't the former. But this isn't surprising, college coaches by and large can't be trusted.
   37. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:34 PM (#4046141)
SCHIANO SKIPPED HIS FRIEND'S FUNERAL TO NEGOTIATE

classless POS
   38. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:35 PM (#4046144)
The joke is on the Bucs. Schiano's strengths are his recruiting and his father-figure like relationships with the players. Those things mean dick in the NFL. On the field of play, the Man couldn't X and O his way out of a paper bag.
   39. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:36 PM (#4046145)
Weekly Journalist is Murray Chass?
   40. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:37 PM (#4046146)
post of the day on SN

"Kyle Williams officially delighted to no longer be the biggest ####### in the world."
   41. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:37 PM (#4046147)
SCHIANO NO MAN OF HONOR, MR. PRESIDENT
   42. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:39 PM (#4046149)
Holy ####, it's really happening.

Welcome to Purgatory, Rutgers. This is going to make Louisville's Kragthorpe era look like the 90s Cowboys.
   43. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:44 PM (#4046155)
Congrats to florida on Hamilton.
Congrats to UConn on Brodie.
Congrats to Notre Dame on Fuller.
Congrats to Alabama on Quanzell Lambert.
Congrats to the rest of college football on all our other recruits. Enjoy the bonanza.

   44. 'zop sympathizes with the wrong ####### people Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:47 PM (#4046158)
Did anyone else get the chills reading Posnanski's last column on Paterno? The final paragraph was so wildly off kilter:

"I asked Paterno at one point in that last month if he hoped that people would come to see and measure his full life rather than a single, hazy event involving an alleged child molester. "It doesn't matter what people think of me," he said. "I've lived my life. I just hope the truth comes out. And I hope the victims find peace."

"A single, hazy event?" This is just so. . . bizarre.
   45. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:50 PM (#4046165)
Weekly Journalist is Murray Chass?


Until he stopped posting in all caps, I wasn't sure if he was being sarcastic or not.
   46. Bitter Mouse Posted: January 26, 2012 at 12:56 PM (#4046173)
#44, I was listening to sports radio earlier this week (I know) and a journalism prof from Penn State was on. After briefly mentioning the tragedy of the abused kids, he went on and on about the tragedy of Paterno's death, because he was sure JoePa would have spent the remainder of his life working tirelessly for the kids and to raise awarness about the issues. This hypothetical loss was, in his mind, clearly just a hair less significant than what those kids went through.

The whole conversation was just so surreal. It made me nauseous.
   47. Every Inge Counts Posted: January 26, 2012 at 01:02 PM (#4046181)
Greg Schiano to Tampa....what an odd hire. I don't think I have ever seen his name linked to NFL jobs. Man Jim Leavitt has to be pissed he got fired like he did, he might have a NFL job today.
   48. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: January 26, 2012 at 01:37 PM (#4046206)
I feel sorry for some poor schlub of a coach who's better than Schiano but either doesn't have an aggressive agent or isn't in a major media market. For some reason, 9-4 at Rutgers is considered impressive by somebody.

(I suspect the financial issues that the Glazers have made getting a college coach more appealing, but have the terms of the contract been announced?)
   49. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 01:44 PM (#4046212)
I feel sorry for some poor schlub of a coach who's better than Schiano but either doesn't have an aggressive agent or isn't in a major media market.


Or have Bill Belichick rant about him all year.
   50. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: January 26, 2012 at 01:44 PM (#4046213)
Yesterday Schiano landed a 4 star recruit. Today he's leaving for the NFL. He almost certainly said things about commitment to this recruit, so he either lied through his team or he took the job on a whim. I'm guess it wasn't the former. But this isn't surprising, college coaches by and large can't be trusted.


Of course, recruits can't be trusted, either. They'll lie, go to camps to persuade other players to join them at another school, switch a recruitment at the last minute, and so on.

Doesn't make either one right, and the coaches are older and should know better, but it's a game, everyone knows the rules of the game. It is what it is.
   51. jmurph Posted: January 26, 2012 at 01:53 PM (#4046225)
"A single, hazy event?" This is just so. . . bizarre.


Apologies if this has already been mentioned, but on the day Paterno died ESPN's Todd Blackledge blamed his death on the media and Penn State's board of trustees. Unless I've missed something and he has since recanted, Blackledge should no longer be employed by ESPN, and I'm not big on just randombly calling for people to lose their jobs, even on internet message boards.
   52. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 02:06 PM (#4046235)
that's too bad, Blackledge has been otherwise level headed, and generally a good source for college football.
   53. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 02:30 PM (#4046254)
Schiano's record is not too impressive, but people have to keep in mind just what Rutgers Football meant before Schiano. It was literally the worst program in the country, worse than most non BCS schools and quite a few FCS schools.
   54. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 02:46 PM (#4046265)
Ok, Rutgers was a bad program pre-Schiano, one of the bottom feeders in the BCS, but it wasn't nearly as rotten (at that time) as Temple in particular, maybe Baylor. Temple was booted from the BEAST for God's sakes.
   55. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 02:56 PM (#4046282)
Seems like a situation where he knows his stock probably isn't going to get any higher


Guys with no stock usually stay and play 4 seasons of football.
   56. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:01 PM (#4046291)
OH MY GOD! BEST RECRUITING CLASS IN SCHOOL HISTORY GONE IN AN INSTANT!!

#### YOU SCHIANO I HOPE YOU ROT IN HELL


This is true, Rutgers has pulled in verbals from several athletes they usually never compete for. NJ State had a banner year for HS talent too. There are at least two more starts yet to verbal with Rutgers high on the list.

It would have been interesting to see how good Rutgers could get, they were always close, never quite broke through all the way. Now it's assumed they will take a step back, but it all depends on who they can pull in. They have about a week to find a guy. I think they need someone in place ASAP.
   57. smileyy Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:03 PM (#4046293)

Yesterday Schiano landed a 4 star recruit. Today he's leaving for the NFL. He almost certainly said things about commitment to this recruit, so he either lied through his team or he took the job on a whim. I'm guess it wasn't the former. But this isn't surprising, college coaches by and large can't be trusted.


I don't really get it. He's supposed to stop recruiting?

I mean, I kind of get it, but it seems like you're damned no matter what you do.
   58. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:06 PM (#4046297)
The joke is on the Bucs. Schiano's strengths are his recruiting and his father-figure like relationships with the players. Those things mean dick in the NFL. On the field of play, the Man couldn't X and O his way out of a paper bag.


I was told by someone in the NFL that interacted with coaches regularly Schiano is one of the biggest pricks in college football. Really restricts access to facility, very paranoid. Actually might fit in well in the NFL.
   59. Weekly Journalist Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:07 PM (#4046299)
Taking a screenshot of the Rivals Rutgers recruiting page right now for posterity. We'll never see that many stars there again. Ever.
   60. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:12 PM (#4046308)
Of course, recruits can't be trusted, either. They'll lie, go to camps to persuade other players to join them at another school, switch a recruitment at the last minute, and so on.

Doesn't make either one right, and the coaches are older and should know better, but it's a game, everyone knows the rules of the game. It is what it is.


Agreed on all points (SI had a couple of pieces on this in football and basketball). Both sides are at fault.

It was literally the worst program in the country, worse than most non BCS schools and quite a few FCS schools.


It was a bad program but it was not "literally the worst program in the country." Idaho, Temple, and Duke to name a few were worse.

I don't really get it. He's supposed to stop recruiting?

I mean, I kind of get it, but it seems like you're damned no matter what you do.


Would that be such a bad thing?
   61. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:15 PM (#4046313)
I was told by someone in the NFL that interacted with coaches regularly Schiano is one of the biggest pricks in college football. Really restricts access to facility, very paranoid. Actually might fit in well in the NFL.


No wonder Belichick likes him.
   62. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:26 PM (#4046331)
To be fair or at least to identify why this happens so frequently. Coaches get hired and fired between the months of November-January in college and pro football. The wild time for recruiting (save for a short dead period in Dec.) is also November-first week of Feb. These types of departures are inevitable. Schiano can't win in this situation. The recruiting calendar does need to be reworked a bit (and I don't necessarily mean, 'early signing' period). Fortunately for the recruits, verbal commits mean nothing until they sign LOI on signing day or later.
   63. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:28 PM (#4046335)

(I suspect the financial issues that the Glazers have made getting a college coach more appealing, but have the terms of the contract been announced?)


I'm not sure I follow this? Chip Kelly was making $1 million more than the Bucs were already paying Raheem Morris. There are dozens of college coaches that make more than NFL head coaches. When you consider the turnover in the NFL, financially landing a top college job is way more lucrative than an NFL HC job.
   64. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:29 PM (#4046338)
Congrats to Notre Dame on Fuller.


Fuller x'ed Notre Dame off the list recently. It's down to Arizona, Rutgers and Nebraska....with UCLA as a "mystery team".
   65. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:32 PM (#4046342)
#46, nearly everyone I know that went to Penn State, whether I know them directly, casually and indirectly is living in a degree of denial about what happened. I can understand this, JoePa built up incredible amounts of goodwill over the decades. This event proves that no matter what, those feelings don't disappear overnight. It's probably why women (or men) stay with abusive spouses longer than they should.
   66. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:34 PM (#4046346)
I'm not sure I follow this? Chip Kelly was making $1 million more than the Bucs were already paying Raheem Morris.


Raheem Morris was the lowest paid coach in the league. Schiano could make double his salary and they'd still be a low paying team.
   67. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:35 PM (#4046347)

Apologies if this has already been mentioned, but on the day Paterno died ESPN's Todd Blackledge blamed his death on the media and Penn State's board of trustees. Unless I've missed something and he has since recanted, Blackledge should no longer be employed by ESPN, and I'm not big on just randombly calling for people to lose their jobs, even on internet message boards.


I don't know why he should lose his job over that opinion.

I did see Blackledge share similarly out of touch comments on the day JoePa was fired. ESPN 2 had wall to wall coverage of the event and brought on the air several PSU guys, including Blackledge and the denial was palpable.
   68. clowns to the left of me; STEAGLES to the right Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:39 PM (#4046351)
Taking a screenshot of the Rivals Rutgers recruiting page right now for posterity. We'll never see that many stars there again. Ever.
rutgers would make a pretty soft landing spot for tom bradley.
   69. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:40 PM (#4046353)
Raheem Morris was the lowest paid coach in the league. Schiano could make double his salary and they'd still be a low paying team.


Still doesn't make any sense. Rarely do HC's in the NFL jump to other HC jobs without a year or so off. Nearly all are hired as coordinators, they get promoted. College coaches are probably the most expensive hires you can find. I bet if you look it up that data is true.

Granted there are a thousand colleges, but NFL teams usually hire college coaches from top schools....like Oregon. Expensive. Way more than Mike Zimmer can demand. Zimmer has zero leverage. I will admit, Rutgers might be the crappiest football school to place a coach in the NFL as HC. Since Chan Gailey to Buffalo anyway. But he was an NFL retread via Dallas and of course was a college football failure.
   70. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 03:45 PM (#4046360)
Still doesn't make any sense.


The Buccaneers are cheap. This is not difficult to understand. They had the lowest paid coach in and the lowest payroll in the league last year.
   71. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:02 PM (#4046381)
even cheaper than the Raiders?
   72. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:16 PM (#4046393)
Yes, even cheaper than the Raiders. Even cheaper than the Bengals, and I didn't know that was possible.
   73. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:18 PM (#4046396)

The Buccaneers are cheap. This is not difficult to understand. They had the lowest paid coach in and the lowest payroll in the league last year.


I got that. Why would they target a college coach if they wanted to save $$? In fact I pointed out how they paid their own coach $1 million less what Oregon paid Kelly. I clearly set the record straight on college coaching pay. The cheapest NFL hire you can make is an NFL assistant, not a college coach. College coaches have massive leverage and usually millions and millions guaranteed. The most expensive hire an NFL team can make is usually going to be a college HC. Of course Rutgers is not Bama and certainly no Oregon.

   74. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:21 PM (#4046398)
I got that. In fact I pointed out how they paid their own coach $1 million less what Oregon paid Kelly.


Then what is it about my post that doesn't make sense?
   75. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:22 PM (#4046402)
The Raiders were pretty cheap. Wasn't there an assistant coach on the Raiders Super Bowl team that said his wife had to get a job in order for them to make their mortgage payments in the Bay Area?
   76. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:23 PM (#4046403)

Then what is it about my post that doesn't make sense?


That you suggest the Bucs were going to save money by fishing for a college coach. The savings comes from hiring a first time HC out of the NFL Off/Def coordinator ranks.

Exactly the kind of rock Raheem Morris crawled from under.
   77. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:24 PM (#4046404)
There is a reason why the Bucs and Kelly didn't work out. Tampa couldn't afford him.
*Or maybe Kelly called it off when he saw the deplorably out of date athletic training facilities Tampa had.
   78. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:26 PM (#4046406)
J.J. Denman sticking with Rutgers, but he had already committed to and the reneged on PSU and Wisconsin, so he was kinda stuck.
   79. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:30 PM (#4046412)
Yes, even cheaper than the Raiders. Even cheaper than the Bengals, and I didn't know that was possible.


DA is right on his NFL history....

When Dave Rimington played at Nebraska, he became accustomed to top facilities and a winning standard as an All-American lineman for the Cornhuskers.

Once he joined the Cincinnati Bengals, he got used to a much different brand of football.

The Bengals have been voted the worst organization in professional sports.

"I went from one of the best organizations in college football to probably one of the worst organizations in the NFL," Rimington told ESPN.com. "I went from a weight room that was half the size of a football field to a weight room that looked like a junior high weight room, and the strength coach didn't want anybody to lift. ..

"It was ridiculous the stuff we had to go through there. I just had to shake my head. It's like the black hole of professional football. Good players go there and you never hear from them again."


   80. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:32 PM (#4046415)
That you suggest the Bucs were going to save money by fishing for a college coach.


I said nothing about saving money by getting a college coach instead of a pro coach, but things like facts have never stopped you before. I said they were cheap. They are. Greg Schiano will be another cheap hire for them. You used Chan Gailey as a comparison for Schiano, and it's a fairly good one. Chan Gailey makes less than Chip Kelly. From what I could find, Leslie Frazier makes more.
   81. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:42 PM (#4046428)

I said nothing about saving money by getting a college coach instead of a pro coach, but things like facts have never stopped you before. I said they were cheap.


Here is exactly what you said DA. Doesn't appear to be the same as saying college coaches are cheap. I don't need to add anything else, let's let the readers decide.


(I suspect the financial issues that the Glazers have made getting a college coach more appealing,)



The only question I have is.....in the context of Bucs ownership financial issues, getting a college coach is more appealing than what? I pointed out the obvious, the cheapest coach an NFL can hire is a guy like Raheem Morris, a nobody NFL assistant. College HCs are usually the most expensive hires an NFL can make.
   82. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:44 PM (#4046430)
Do we know how much Schiano signed for? He was making $2.4 million at Rutgers, so I would imagine at least $4m to make him jump.
   83. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:45 PM (#4046434)
If I'm Rutgers I do everything I can to get Jim Fassell.
   84. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 04:47 PM (#4046437)
Do we know how much Schiano signed for? He was making $2.4 million at Rutgers, so I would imagine at least $4m to make him jump.


How many years was his deal and what was his buyout? That's the value of a coaching contract.

ZERO NFL assistants can sniff that kind of long term deal. That's why NFL assistants are the low budget hires in the NFL. The most expensive hires are guys that retire after +10 years in the NFL, take a few years off and get "lured" back into the game. College HCs are very expensive.

On the flip side, the cheapest hire a college team can make is an ex-Raiders HC.
   85. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4046457)
Here is exactly what you said DA. Doesn't appear to be the same as saying college coaches are cheap. I don't need to add anything else, let's let the readers decide.


I didn't say that. Rear Admiral Piazza did.
   86. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:09 PM (#4046467)
Okay, that might be true. But when I "QUOTED" it, you did respond to it. I didn't check who wrote it the first time, I then respond to your response.

IS there really a handle, REAR ADMIRAL PIAZZA?

I think I'm going to change my handle to ABANDON SHIP (Courageous Captain Here to Serve Me!)
   87. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:10 PM (#4046468)
See, this is the one thing that keeps me from putting LotS on ignore: every now and then, he makes total sense.

I agree 100% that if an org is looking to go cheap on a new HC, an NFL assistant is the way to go and not a college HC.
   88. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:10 PM (#4046472)
Rutgers could do the daring thing and hire Greg Toal, the legendary Don Bosco Prep coach
   89. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:12 PM (#4046474)
Okay, that might be true.


This response is so predictable. No, LotS, it's not maybe true, it's 100% true.

But when I "QUOTED" it, you did respond to it.


So what. This is a message board. That's how these things go.
   90. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:39 PM (#4046497)
But who responds to a quote that is not yours? Who does that? What compelled you to see a quote another guy posted and take ownership of it? Either way, REAR ADMIRAL ABANDONED SHIP!!!
   91. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:42 PM (#4046501)
If I was an NFL GM I would prefer a guy with HC experience. They are hard to find, since most NFL guys with HC experience that are available have been fired and most of those guys probably deserved it, but there are clearly exceptions. Our guy Billy B is one. But college guys with HC experience are always available, just have to name their price $$$

Would I hire a college coach? Probably not. However I'd be less likely to ever consider an NFL HC for a college HC job. That group has fared even worse than college to NFL coaches.
   92. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:46 PM (#4046505)
How much do you want to bet Houston Nutt's resume was printed off then trashed or straight deleted in the Tampa Bucs football offices?

With the following Resume notes:

Compensation: "I will coach for food"

Buyout more important.
   93. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:50 PM (#4046514)
The Raiders were pretty cheap. Wasn't there an assistant coach on the Raiders Super Bowl team that said his wife had to get a job in order for them to make their mortgage payments in the Bay Area?

In fairness, Bay Area real estate is crazy-expensive for the most part. Or at least, that's what I've observed.
   94. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 05:59 PM (#4046523)
But who responds to a quote that is not yours? Who does that? What compelled you to see a quote another guy posted and take ownership of it? Either way, REAR ADMIRAL ABANDONED SHIP!!!

Well, if you either (A) fully or partially agree with the quote, or (B) you think that the response is wrong...lots of people would chime in at that point. Are you new to the Internet?

See, you make that one rational comment, and then you're back off the rails.
   95. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 06:09 PM (#4046529)
What compelled you to see a quote another guy posted and take ownership of it?


I didn't. But please, continue to make #### up.
   96. William Satterwhite Posted: January 26, 2012 at 06:58 PM (#4046564)
If I'm Rutgers I do everything I can to get Jim Fassell.


Not familiar with him other than his tenure with the Giants- does Fassel have any notable college experience?

I think Rutgers would be foolish to not at least approach Mario Cristobal, he is a hot prospect with ties to the program and Schiano and would be a good bet to keep the Florida pipeline going that Schiano established (is that still a big thing for Rutgers? I know when Schiano first started turning things around that was his biggest weapon before he started being able to land more of the local NJ kids)
   97. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 07:19 PM (#4046574)
Rich. Kotite.
   98. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 07:20 PM (#4046577)
Are you new to the Internet?


Yes.

Go back and read it if you haven't suffered enough. This guy took another guys quote and then defended it then when I displayed the quote was simply wrong, he walked away from it.

Either way you slice it, college coaches aren't cheap. The cheapest guy an NFL can get is a Raheem Morris type, INSERT DOLPHINS HCs, Jim Caldwell type, etc.... They grow on trees and they have no leverage. You mess around with a college HC, be prepared to pay up, even for a program as humble as Rutgers.
   99. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: January 26, 2012 at 07:22 PM (#4046579)
Cristobal would be a sensational hire for all the reasons you cite. He is very well regarded by people in the football universe. Frankly I can't think of a better fit. But does Mario realize his own value is pretty high and if things break right, he might be able to do much better in a year or two in a better conference?
   100. DA Baracus Posted: January 26, 2012 at 07:23 PM (#4046581)
Rich. Kotite.


Hey man I'm eating here. Easy with that kind of talk.

I'm still laughing from Leon Hess saying "I want to win now!" about his hiring of Kotite.
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