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Friday, January 13, 2012

College Football: Postseason Thread

Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: January 13, 2012 at 08:22 AM | 892 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   301. DA Baracus Posted: February 02, 2012 at 12:37 PM (#4051970)
He had been informed that morning that, after all, Saban would not be giving him an offer.


That's not quite true. They didn't completely remove their offer, they wanted him to grayshirt, he said no. But at the end of the day that amounts to about the same thing since I would guess most players say no anyways.
   302. DA Baracus Posted: February 02, 2012 at 12:59 PM (#4051998)
That didn't come across the way I wanted and it's too late to edit it.

What I mean is, they do that way so they can say with a straight face that they still wanted the player. As if they think we will believe that.
   303. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: February 02, 2012 at 01:19 PM (#4052015)
The other dimension regarding the 4 year rule is the 85 scholarship limit. Back in the day, scholarships were at 100, if memory serves, but the deal was also for four years. The drop to 85 saw the rise of the one year offer. If memory serves.
   304. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 02, 2012 at 01:21 PM (#4052019)
Yeah Philbon got squeezed out. One thing coaches will tell you is that they honestly have no idea with some players and they got one guy (Tomlinson) that they probably were not sure they would get.
   305. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: February 02, 2012 at 01:31 PM (#4052035)
Yep, and they had one guy - Philon - they were sure about, that they tossed over board once someone with more stars came calling.

Schools all the time will tell players - heads up - your offer is conditional. Or, heads up - we've got two slots left, and we are targeting four guys. Saban didn't do that here.
   306. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 02, 2012 at 02:00 PM (#4052070)
He was told though from what I understand (and I could be wrong) but he was told at the same time as Justin Taylor that he would likely be grayshirted. I don't think it was a day of type thing. But Philon definitely got screwed, I don't disagree with that.
   307. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: February 02, 2012 at 09:19 PM (#4052372)
   308. DA Baracus Posted: February 02, 2012 at 09:38 PM (#4052386)
Stay classy, Les Miles.


That's uncalled for on Miles' part, but I think Charlie Weis might be worse.

   309. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 02, 2012 at 10:45 PM (#4052422)
Saw it mentioned on the other page, but wondering when Stewart Mandel or Brian Cook will write their harangue on this:

Stanford takes away scholarship offer...
   310. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: February 02, 2012 at 11:02 PM (#4052430)
Saw it mentioned on the other page, but wondering when Stewart Mandel or Brian Cook will write their harangue on this:

Stanford takes away scholarship offer...


If I'm parsing the article correctly, it's because he wasn't admitted on an academic basis. That's hardly the same as "this guy has more stars, so we're rescinding our offer."
   311. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 02, 2012 at 11:14 PM (#4052444)
Their head coach doesn't think so....

"We can't understand it. Nobody is telling us anything. The coaches say the admissions process is secretive, and they can't ask about it. If it's the curriculum, we'd like to know. (Head coach) David Shaw said he was surprised. It sounds like there's something else under the table, like they might have found somebody else they like."


And this dude has been committed for a while, it wasn't like Stanford didn't know about his academics (4.0 GPA and 26 ACT) before they decided two weeks ago to not offer him a scholarship.
   312. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: February 02, 2012 at 11:31 PM (#4052453)
Could be. Although it wouldn't surprise me if a school like Stanford has in place such a firewall between the admissions office and the athletic department.
   313. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: February 03, 2012 at 10:50 AM (#4052704)
Looks like the Big East is pushing Boise to join for 2012. I guess they don't have much faith in being able to keep WVU for one more year. If I'm Boise I try to make it happen...a tougher schedule, but a more realistic shot at a BCS game in a down year.
   314. William Satterwhite Posted: February 03, 2012 at 11:23 AM (#4052739)
Could be. Although it wouldn't surprise me if a school like Stanford has in place such a firewall between the admissions office and the athletic department.


This is probably the case. Georgia Tech had a somewhat similar issue with a recruit and the football staff was seemingly kept out of the loop as to whether or not the kid would actually be accepted until the last possible moment.
   315. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: February 04, 2012 at 12:25 AM (#4053305)
Regarding the 4 year scholarship, keep in mind the players still have to meet certain thresholds for holding up their end of the deal. The thresholds are mostly academic related. The change is the scholarship is no longer based on performance in football, although the student athlete must also meet team rules....essentially show up on time and stay out of trouble. This isn't a 4 year guaranteed deal. It's just no longer at the coach's whim.

I read the Charlie Weis statement, he is NFL garbage. Amazingly, he has never won a thing as a HC, his NFL schemes were thoroughly dismantled by college players and college coaches. His 3rd year ND team was one of the worst offenses in the +150 year history of the sport.

Reading his comment didn't surprise me in the least, if you know his resume at the college level, his comments are consistent with his track record. That he is trending from Notre Dame to Kansas as a HC is all you need to know. Next stop, Bengals OC.
   316. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: February 04, 2012 at 02:25 PM (#4053464)
I was happy to see Florida and Auburn move to four year scholarships, for a few reasons.

First, it's nice pub for the SEC.

Second, one thing I find really insufferable is Big Ten whining about anything. Bielema whining about Urban is another example. If this shuts up Big Ten sanctimoniousness, please, sign me up.

Third, the Big Tenners who bash the SEC don't understand why this actually hurts them. In the past, the SEC would oversign in part because so many players seemed like risks, usually for grade reasons. These kids wound up in JUCO typically. So, the SEC would take a couple of players more than the Big Ten would, but really the advantage was overstated, as many players never made it to campus.

Now, the SEC just focuses more on the "sure things." This is a battle the Big Ten won't win. Focusing less on the risky players means whatever chances the Big Ten has of recruiting in the talent rich South just took another hit. So, nice work, Big Ten.

And that just breaks me up inside.
   317. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: February 04, 2012 at 03:10 PM (#4053487)
Second, one thing I find really insufferable is Big Ten whining about anything.

So you're whining about whining.

If this shuts up Big Ten sanctimoniousness, please, sign me up.

The sanctimony is justified.

In the past, the SEC would oversign in part because so many players seemed like risks, usually for grade reasons. These kids wound up in JUCO typically. So, the SEC would take a couple of players more than the Big Ten would, but really the advantage was overstated, as many players never made it to campus.

Proof of this assertion?

Now, the SEC just focuses more on the "sure things." This is a battle the Big Ten won't win. Focusing less on the risky players means whatever chances the Big Ten has of recruiting in the talent rich South just took another hit. So, nice work, Big Ten.

That's possible, but this B1G fan doesn't really care. I'm for more equitable treatment of recruits regardless of what it means for any conference. You might consider thinking in those terms rather than what it means for your tribe (sanctimony!). I still have doubts as to whether the trend will catch on the in the factories of SEC West, but we'll see. I hope it does. Also, my suspicion is that the trend toward four-year scholies might increase the emphasis on the quality of the degree, which, obviously, won't help the SEC.
   318. Zipperholes Posted: February 04, 2012 at 05:39 PM (#4053538)
Second, one thing I find really insufferable is Big Ten whining about anything.
When I see the word "whining" nowadays, I just replace it with "criticism by people I don't like."
Now, the SEC just focuses more on the "sure things." This is a battle the Big Ten won't win. Focusing less on the risky players means whatever chances the Big Ten has of recruiting in the talent rich South just took another hit. So, nice work, Big Ten.
I find this hard to believe. If focusing more on the "sure things" is the better approach for the SEC, why haven't they been doing it all along? Also, something tells me the Big Ten is focused on things besides recruiting competition with the SEC.
   319. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: February 04, 2012 at 05:43 PM (#4053539)
Ah yes more Big Ten pretentiousness. What's the correlation between the quality of the degree and four year scholarships again? I'd be surprised if this led to a rash of football players majoring in biochem. Though guaranteed is guaranteed, Division I football is still a significant time commitment, even in the Big Ten.

The bottom line is that the Big Ten still cares about football and wants to be viewed at successful at it, but that fandom has adjusted based on lack of on field success. Hence the talk of a Big Ten degree being SO valuable, and Delany pretending his schools don't have an element of "football factory" to them, either. Hence the comments about Southerners being stupid, and so forth. It's still a rivalry, it's just one the Big Ten isn't very good at, hence the invocation of all these other issues. And when SEC schools still win working under the same "morality" as viewed by the Big Ten, well that's going to be awfully embarrassing for the Big Ten all over again.

As Auburn's in the SEC West, has been bashed as a "football factory" before, and has had more recent success than any Big Ten school, I'd be surprised if other SEC West schools didn't follow suit. I'd imagine the two holdouts would be Saban and Ole Miss, based on my intuition about Hugh Freeze.

I've found much of what prompts outrage is really initially prompted by something else. I have little doubt that if the Big Ten had won a couple of titles recently, we wouldn't be talking about oversigning.
   320. Rear Admiral Piazza Posted: February 04, 2012 at 05:49 PM (#4053543)
Right, Tigersfan. The Big Ten has other, nobler goals in mind. That's why their coaches, too, make millions, and they have 100,000 seat stadiums and why ther fans subscribe to recruiting sites in droves. It's why when Ohio State is hit by scandal they turn to Urban Meyer, and it's not because he can bring in the scholar athletes. It's why Penn State football is joke - because people there valued stability in the football program over everything else. It's why Bielema's extracurricular activities never make the paper, and why Mark Dantonio has a curious policy regarding suspensions.

Please.
   321. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: February 04, 2012 at 06:27 PM (#4053553)
Hence the comments about Southerners being stupid

Where are these comments? Are you referring to academic reputations? Do you dispute that the B1G has better academic institutions than the SEC? FWIW, I was born, raised and educated in Mississippi, so I don't think Southerners are stupid. I think a good number of SEC football fans are bizarro tribalists and strangers to objectivity, but that's another matter.

And when SEC schools still win working under the same "morality" as viewed by the Big Ten, well that's going to be awfully embarrassing for the Big Ten all over again.

On the contrary, I'd have far more respect for the SEC if they succeed under those conditions. It remains to be seen whether they actually rise to B1G's standards and are able to continue winning once there.

I have little doubt that if the Big Ten had won a couple of titles recently, we wouldn't be talking about oversigning.

I understand that you need to feel that way.
   322. Zipperholes Posted: February 04, 2012 at 06:33 PM (#4053556)
Right, Tigersfan. The Big Ten has other, nobler goals in mind. That's why their coaches, too, make millions, and they have 100,000 seat stadiums and why ther fans subscribe to recruiting sites in droves. It's why when Ohio State is hit by scandal they turn to Urban Meyer, and it's not because he can bring in the scholar athletes. It's why Penn State football is joke - because people there valued stability in the football program over everything else. It's why Bielema's extracurricular activities never make the paper, and why Mark Dantonio has a curious policy regarding suspensions.
None of this refutes my comment. There are priorities besides recruiting competition with the SEC. Therefore, your implication that this move was dumb because it wouldn't give them an edge in that area was silly.
   323. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: February 04, 2012 at 06:48 PM (#4053565)
Second, one thing I find really insufferable is Big Ten whining about anything.

NYCTigersfan: When I see the word "whining" nowadays, I just replace it with "criticism by people I don't like."


NYCTigersfan. This is as insightful a comment as I've seen. Very true.
   324. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 04, 2012 at 07:27 PM (#4053584)
On the contrary, I'd have far more respect for the SEC if they succeed under those conditions. It remains to be seen whether they actually rise to B1G's standards and are able to continue winning once there.


Oh please....
   325. Sam M. Posted: February 04, 2012 at 07:47 PM (#4053592)
Meanwhile, West Virginia continues its noble attempt to set the Guinness record for Most Contractual Obligations Broken By A Single Athletic Department in a Single Academic Year, announcing today the cancellation of its game with FSU set for September 8, 2012. Cancellation of games is not all that unusual. Cancellation of games with eight months notice is.

I assume FSU will forthwith be announcing replacement of WVU on its schedule with the most attractive Div 14 opponent it can find on this notice.

And yes, this constitutes criticism by a person who doesn't like West Virginia, a/k/a whining.
   326. Greg Maddux School of Reflexive Profanity Posted: February 04, 2012 at 09:27 PM (#4053636)
I assume FSU will forthwith be announcing replacement of WVU on its schedule with the most attractive Div 14 opponent it can find on this notice.

Guess again.

During Saturday afternoon's men's basketball game at FSU, [athletic director Randy] Spetman told the Orlando Sentinel that FSU has already begun making calls to various schools to fill the vacancy. Among them: Texas A&M, Oklahoma, Rutgers, Syracuse and Pittsburgh.

...

Spetman said his school remains committed to trying to fill the Sept. 8 slot, and wants to do so by bringing in a quality FBS school.

"We want a 1-A," Spetman said, when pressed about who the Seminoles are trying to woo. "We already have a 1-AA on the schedule."
   327. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 08, 2012 at 11:54 AM (#4056338)
So Memphis is going to be in the Big East in all sports in 2013. Big deal for basketball...not sure for football, but it can help them going forward.
   328. William Satterwhite Posted: February 08, 2012 at 01:14 PM (#4056436)
So Memphis is going to be in the Big East in all sports in 2013. Big deal for basketball...not sure for football, but it can help them going forward.


Assuming things remain fairly stable from here on out (there are very sketchy rumors the Big 12 is considering raiding the ACC), Memphis being reunited with Louisville and Cincinnati should give that program a boost as those had been 2 of their top 3 rivals. It's been a while but back before the original Big East-Conference USA raid, Memphis actually had a fairly good football program.
   329. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: February 08, 2012 at 01:55 PM (#4056488)
How can Rutgers not jump all over that FSU game. They don't have a single BCS opponent on the 2012 OOC schedule.
   330. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 13, 2012 at 02:27 PM (#4059898)
Iowa lies to commit

Looks like the Big Ten is getting into that SEC business.
   331. Sam M. Posted: February 13, 2012 at 03:01 PM (#4059949)
Sure was nice that Louisville's last Big East encounter with West Virginia in basketball had the same finish it did in football: a Cardinal win in Morgantown.

Just make sure that check doesn't bounce before you let 'em go, boys.
   332. Tripon Posted: February 13, 2012 at 03:07 PM (#4059959)
Its the NCAA who puts limits on scholarship offers. Lift that restriction, force schools to offer 4 year contracts, and then see what happens.

   333. oscar gamble's afro pick Posted: February 13, 2012 at 04:29 PM (#4060043)
--press release from one of the 16 universities mentioned below--seems to confuse/conflate a conference with an association--can the latter possibly be what's proposed? anybody else heard anything?


UNIVERSITIES ANNOUNCE PLANS TO FORM CONFERENCE


Presidents and chancellors from 16 universities met in Dallas Sunday to discuss future conference membership plans and agreed to work on forming a new intercollegiate athletic association that would begin competition in the 2013-14 academic year.

This presidentially led association will ensure stability and be built upon the principles of operating at the highest level of integrity and sportsmanship, enhancing the student-athlete academic and competitive experience, bringing fiscal discipline into athletics and ensuring competitive fairness.

“This is an exciting development that will stabilize the current conferences and create the first truly national conference with members in five time zones and television viewership from coast to coast. This partnership brings together like-minded institutions to improve the integrity and stability of intercollegiate athletics,” said UNLV President Neal Smatresk. “We are moving our plans forward rapidly and expect to complete our conversations in the near future. Look for further announcements soon as we work together on this exciting new venture.”

Universities involved in the discussions were the United States Air Force Academy, University of Alabama at Birmingham, Colorado State University, East Carolina University, Fresno State, University of Hawaii, Marshall University, University of Nevada, Reno, University of New Mexico, University of Nevada, Las Vegas, Rice University, University of Southern Mississippi, University of Texas at El Paso, Tulane University, The University of Tulsa and University of Wyoming. With the exception of Hawaii as a football only member, the participation would involve all sports.

The structure of the new conference will likely include:

· Membership of 18 to 24 universities
· National scope from the Atlantic Seaboard to Hawaii
· Championship football game format that includes semifinal match-ups
· Championship basketball tournament
· Regular season scheduling in divisions
· NCAA FBS affiliation
· Mechanisms to emphasize and improve academic standards and fiscal responsibility

The presidents and chancellors will have follow-up meetings over the next six months to fully develop the operational issues essential to the formation of the association.
   334. Tripon Posted: February 13, 2012 at 06:00 PM (#4060133)
I heard they're going to do two rounds of playoffs, two semi-finals games and one finals game to determine conference champions.
   335. Zipperholes Posted: February 13, 2012 at 06:33 PM (#4060163)
Iowa lies to commit

Looks like the Big Ten is getting into that SEC business.
I'm confused about what happened here. It sounds like he was offered a scholarship but never committed, and Iowa revoked the offer right before signing day.

Do teams typically revoke offers from guys who haven't committed?
   336. Tripon Posted: February 13, 2012 at 06:56 PM (#4060188)
Technically nobody can commit until signing day. A verbal commitment isn't a valid contract,(In this case).

Dot your i's, and cross your t's, but don't expect anything until you sign away your freedom for at least a year.

   337. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: February 13, 2012 at 08:38 PM (#4060262)
Rutgers close to a home and home with Arkansas. Make it happen, please.
   338. Sam M. Posted: February 14, 2012 at 10:59 AM (#4060492)
Has there ever been more wisdom shared than in this Andy Staples column? I'll spare you all my rendition of the Norland High School fight song, but I have a very good feeling that the class Duke helped to bring in is going to do a lot more for Miami than the heralded Class of '08 -- not least because I think Al Golden is going to do a lot more than Randy Shannon and his staff ever did to bring them along. Lord knows the ACC could use a resurgence from Miami back to something close to the status it used to have.
   339. bunyon Posted: February 14, 2012 at 12:43 PM (#4060635)
Geez, Sam, I thought Duke (University) had done something for the Miami program (aside from their annual scrimmage).

But I do agree with you that the ACC could use FSU and Miami back to form.
   340. Sam M. Posted: February 14, 2012 at 12:58 PM (#4060666)
Hah. Sorry -- that's Duke Johnson, not Duke University. As in, Florida's Mr. Football, heralded UM recruit, and graduate of my high school. I daresay there may be more football talent in Duke Johnson than there is in Durham, but that would be mean. So I won't.
   341. DA Baracus Posted: February 14, 2012 at 01:07 PM (#4060680)
Has there ever been more wisdom shared than in this Andy Staples column?


Yes. It's just another human interest story. It's only noteworthy to you because it's your high school. If it was from East Podunk you wouldn't give it special attention.
   342. Sam M. Posted: February 14, 2012 at 03:45 PM (#4060928)
Yes. It's just another human interest story. It's only noteworthy to you because it's your high school. If it was from East Podunk you wouldn't give it special attention.


Killjoy. Sheesh, lighten up, will ya?

I actually would give it at least some attention, because even if Duke Johnson hadn't gone to the same school I did, I still root for Miami as my second favorite team (behind Louisville), and Staples wrote an solid column about how Golden is achieving recruiting success in the face of the investigation and likelihood of sanctions. Johnson was an interesting dimension to that story, but hardly the whole thing.
   343. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 14, 2012 at 06:02 PM (#4061088)
I hope those Shapiro "bombshells" aren't too bad...of course I doubt the NCAA will do more than give a slap on the wrist.
   344. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 15, 2012 at 07:56 PM (#4061937)
TCU drug bust is pretty interesting. I thought this was the most interesting part of the story:
According to the warrant, Brock said that he wasn't worried because there "would be about 60 people being screwed." Brock is alleged to have said that he and Horn had looked over the TCU roster and concluded that only about 20 players could pass the test.



http://espn.go.com/dallas/ncf/story/_/id/7577881/tcu-horned-frogs-football-players-arrested-drug-sweep
   345. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: February 15, 2012 at 11:43 PM (#4062124)
Iowa lies to commit

Iowa never lied and he wasn't a commit. Iowa never assured him that he had a scholarship. He sat on a scholarship offer for months, all he had to do was commit. They let him know about the numbers. He never gave them a commit. When another RB committed a week before signing day, Shaw was told that they were revoking the offer.

Looks like the Big Ten is getting into that SEC business.

An SEC team would just have signed both of them and three more RBs, bringing their roster size to 92. Seven players mysteriously gone by August.
   346. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: February 15, 2012 at 11:45 PM (#4062127)
I'm confused about what happened here. It sounds like he was offered a scholarship but never committed, and Iowa revoked the offer right before signing day.

More or less what happened. A week before signing day.

Do teams typically revoke offers from guys who haven't committed?

Its a game of musical chairs. If you have 16 scholarships, you can't just offer them to 16 guys and cross your fingers and wait till signing day when you land 4 of them. Sometimes teams are upfront about it, and sometimes they're not.


   347. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: February 23, 2012 at 09:12 AM (#4066829)
Temple to the Big East? When will the horror end...
   348. TerpNats Posted: February 23, 2012 at 10:10 AM (#4066868)
The Big East finally does the right thing if, as reported, the Temple deal is for all sports. Villanova has been holding the Big East hostage far too long, particularly after its nearly comical "first you say you will, and then you won't" proposal to move its football program to FBS status.
   349. William Satterwhite Posted: February 23, 2012 at 02:39 PM (#4067143)
The MAC has a two-year waiting period before Temple can leave, considering the wrangling over West Virginia's exit, it will be interesting to see how the Big East ends up resolving this.
   350. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: February 23, 2012 at 05:27 PM (#4067274)
Temple supposedly paying $3.5M to leave the MAC. Thats a lot of coin for an associate membership.
   351. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: February 23, 2012 at 05:54 PM (#4067313)
So Temple is kicked out of the BEAST for football less than a decade ago, and now they are back in the band for all sports. There have been worse consequences of exile.
   352. TerpNats Posted: February 23, 2012 at 06:45 PM (#4067382)
Oh, and Weekly Journalist: It wasn't that long ago that your beloved Rutgers was Temple, if you get my drift. And right now, the difference between the Knights and the Owls isn't as big as you would want us to believe. If the Big East can survive having both Rutgers and Seton Hall from New Jersey, it can survive having both Temple and Villanova from Philadelphia.
   353. Cowboy Popup Posted: February 23, 2012 at 07:41 PM (#4067441)
Temple to the Big East? When will the horror end...

Makes more sense then ####### Memphis.
   354. Every Inge Counts Posted: February 28, 2012 at 08:54 PM (#4070588)
Alabama following suit and offering 4 year scholarships as well. Still plan on cutting players, but at least with 4 year scholarship offers.
   355. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 07, 2012 at 06:51 PM (#4076346)
Temple returning to Big East Conference

At this point, isn't it easier listing schools that aren't in the Big East?

   356. Every Inge Counts Posted: April 10, 2012 at 09:35 PM (#4103552)
Bringing this back from the dead....because Bobby Petrino was fired today. Pretty big for Arkansas as Petrino was a quality head coach...who they bring in next will be a make or break hire (Petrino was definitely not known for his recruiting ability, but he knew how to put together a great offense). Petrino...man not very smart at all...
   357. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: April 10, 2012 at 09:48 PM (#4103570)
Patrino, out of some slush fund, paid Dorrell $20K for... something. AD wouldn't say what. He also wouldn't say if she's still employed.
   358. Cowboy Popup Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:07 PM (#4103586)
Wow, that's a game changer for the SEC West. I don't know how Arkansas is going to get a quality replacement for him at this point in the offseason. I wonder if we will see a re-creation of what happened at Louisville. Since its clear he hasn't become a better human being since then, its likely that same problems are going on at Arkansas.
   359. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:18 PM (#4103590)
A quick update from my remote Pac-12 outpost: Todd Graham has won over Sun Devil Nation. Talks a very good game; lights up rooms, eyewitnesses say.
   360. DA Baracus Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:25 PM (#4103592)
On behalf of the city of Atlanta, and I'm not even a Falcons fan:

*gut laugh*
   361. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:13 PM (#4104258)
Petrino being Petrino. Who hires him for 2013? Which SEC school needs him the most? Unfortunately he is too good a coach to be passed on.
   362. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: April 14, 2012 at 06:40 AM (#4106447)
So, Sam, how about that Bobby Petrino!
   363. Weekly Journalist_ Posted: April 14, 2012 at 06:46 AM (#4106448)
Also, I'm still super excited for the Rutgers/Arkansas games this season and next. Anyone ever been to Fayetteville? Thinking of a trip.
   364. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: April 14, 2012 at 09:02 AM (#4106484)
Petrino being Petrino. Who hires him for 2013? Which SEC school needs him the most? Unfortunately he is too good a coach to be passed on
.

Tennessee, maybe.

As an Arkansas fan, of course I'm appalled at what's been revealed the last week or so ... but not surprised. Like the old fable about the snake (or was it a scorpion?) who fatally stings the benefactor it's begged to carry it across a raging river, or something like that, we knew what he was when we hired him. Well, we mostly knew what he was; some of what's come out is pretty damned sleazy, even for him. I exulted in the team's relative success the past season or two, but I never, ever got over my unease about Petrino. I'm sure I was far from alone.
   365. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: April 14, 2012 at 09:06 AM (#4106485)
Also, I'm still super excited for the Rutgers/Arkansas games this season and next. Anyone ever been to Fayetteville? Thinking of a trip.


Only for a couple of hours in the fall of 2001, just about a month before I moved to Alabama. I grew up in Arkansas & lived there for all but about 4 years till I was 42, but I'm from (& went to college in) another corner of the state, then lived in Little Rock/North Little Rock for most of my aduthood, & I was never much for traveling. Only time I've ever seen the Razobacks play in person was in Auburn (& a glorious game it was), which is a lot closer to me here in Montgomery than Fayetteville is to LR.

In any event, at least a couple of Primates went to school in Fayetteville & may well still be in that area. Not sure they've ever participated in this thread, though. Anyone remember any names?

   366. Cowboy Popup Posted: April 14, 2012 at 09:10 AM (#4106490)
Also, I'm still super excited for the Rutgers/Arkansas games this season and next. Anyone ever been to Fayetteville? Thinking of a trip.

It's probably the biggest Rutgers OOC game since I've been a fan. I love that you guys picked a team like that. Cuse also gets props for scheduling up and going to Mizzou. Obviously Petrino getting the boot significantly increases your odds of winning that game. It will be extremely fun to watch that undersized, ultra quick D take on the remnants of Petrino's offense.
   367. Morty Causa Posted: May 02, 2012 at 04:09 PM (#4121905)
   368. Every Inge Counts Posted: May 20, 2012 at 06:36 PM (#4136476)
Just wanted to say RIP to the Big East as a major FBS conference. ACC you are next. Might as well get ready for March Madness.
   369. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: May 21, 2012 at 08:57 PM (#4137324)
RIP Bill Stewart. The ending was ugly, but boy did the tenure start pretty gloriously.


   370. The John Wetland Memorial Death (CoB) Posted: June 22, 2012 at 10:59 PM (#4164155)
Well, WTH, I suppose this thread is as good as any:

Jerry Sandusky was convicted Friday of sexually assaulting 10 boys over 15 years, accusations that shattered the image of Penn State football and led to the firing of Hall of Fame coach Joe Paterno.

Sandusky, a 68-year-old retired defensive coach who once was Paterno's heir apparent, was found guilty on 45 of 48 counts.

The Verdict

Former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky was found guilty Friday on 45 of 48 charges in his child sex abuse trial. A breakdown of the verdict:

• INVOLUNTARY DEVIATE SEXUAL INTERCOURSE, GUILTY on 8 of 9 counts

• INDECENT ASSAULT, GUILTY on 7 of 9 counts

• CRIMINAL INTENT TO COMMIT INDECENT ASSAULT, GUILTY on 1 of 1 count

• UNLAWFUL CONTACT WITH MINORS, GUILTY on 9 of 9 counts

• CORRUPTION OF MINORS, GUILTY on 10 of 10 counts

• ENDANGERING WELFARE OF CHILDREN, GUILTY on 10 of 10 counts

Sandusky showed little emotion as the verdict was read. The judge ordered him to be taken to the county jail to await sentencing in about three months. He faces the possibility of life in prison.

The judge revoked Sandusky's bail.
   371. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: June 22, 2012 at 11:33 PM (#4164161)
Drudge's headline beneath a Sandusky picture: "Guilty, Guilty, Guilty, Guilty, Guilty, Guilty, Guilty, Guilty..."

Defense Counsel just had a rather bizarre press conference. Aside from explaining why Jerry didn't testify (it was the late news of one of his adopted son's coming forward), he pretty much gave a blanket waiver of appellate issues, at least publicly. Blowing kisses to the judge and jury.

final score: Jury 45 Sandusky 3.
   372. The Ghost's Tryin' to Reason with Hurricane Season Posted: June 23, 2012 at 12:02 AM (#4164169)
I thought the defense attorneys interview with the 2 ESPN guys was strange, similar to what Tulo said the presser was. Have to wonder if Sandusky and family had already decided that they would not appeal.
   373. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: June 23, 2012 at 12:18 AM (#4164174)
This entire saga has done nothing but make me sad. I hope all parties* find peace within their souls.

* - No, not including him.
   374. Every Inge Counts Posted: June 26, 2012 at 08:38 PM (#4167265)
Playoffs? Why aren't we talking about playoffs here?!?
   375. Cowboy Popup Posted: June 26, 2012 at 10:55 PM (#4167406)
Let's hope they draw the line at four. I doubt they will, but anything more than four will be terrible.

Otherwise, I'm still not sure how I feel about this.
   376. odds are meatwad is drunk Posted: June 26, 2012 at 11:47 PM (#4167437)
4 seems like too few and yet too many
   377. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: June 27, 2012 at 12:41 AM (#4167446)
well the upside is a 12 year deal to attempt to keep it at 4 as long as possible. I can see that getting torn up at some point. I hope not.

The semis are to be one on New Year's Eve and one on New Years Day. playing one of the semi finals on New Year's Eve primetime is just dumb.
   378. zenbitz Posted: June 27, 2012 at 01:46 AM (#4167458)
I say this "selection committee" stuff is a temporary hack. They are going to go with conference champions as soon as the ACC is split up among the 4 12-team conferences.
With 4 16-team conferences / 2 divisions each, they effectively will have an 8 team playoff.
   379. thok Posted: June 27, 2012 at 07:29 AM (#4167478)
I say this "selection committee" stuff is a temporary hack.


A selection committee sacrifices a little bit of transparency in the selection process for a lot of flexibility in how to pick teams on a year to year basis and accountability. (And I'd argue that the current system is even more transparent than the BCS, given that half the computer polls were proprietary and many of the human votes were secret ballot.)

Four conference champions is a horrible idea that would get hit by a lawsuit from everybody not in the Pac 12/Big 12/Big 10/SEC immediately.
   380. TerpNats Posted: June 27, 2012 at 08:41 AM (#4167491)
Four conference champions is a horrible idea that would get hit by a lawsuit from everybody not in the Pac 12/Big 12/Big 10/SEC immediately.
Which is why it won't happen, not to mention the power and influence of Notre Dame, which knows it's special because it's the only college football team all those people in New York give a damn about.

As far as the ACC splitting up, I concur. Its members would have more collective value, and probably make more money, if the conference dissolved and the Big 12, Big Ten and SEC were left to divide the carcass (the Pac doesn't figure into this for obvious geographic reasons). Imagine these additions:

* SEC: Virginia Tech and N.C. State. Two fairly large states, complementing its recent additions of Missouri and Texas. Yes, the SEC would prefer to have Virginia and North Carolina, but both would be poor cultural fits for the SEC. They work better as part of the...

* Big Ten: Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina and either Duke or Georgia Tech. All are AAU members, fitting the Big Ten model (and unlike Nebraska, none appear ready to be tossed out anytime soon). They give the Big Ten clout along the mid-Atlantic. The Big Ten would probably prefer Tech -- currently undervalued while saddled with the weak ACC football brand -- but may have to settle for Duke in order to woo UNC (though threatening to take Rutgers and Tech in place of UNC/Duke could scare Chapel Hill into dumping Duke). Also in the mix...

* Big 12: Florida State and Clemson, for sure; beyond this, things get trickier, depending upon how big the Big 12 wants to get (14? 16?). If Duke is shoehorned into the Big Ten, Georgia Tech heads to the Big 12 (if Tech goes Big Ten, Duke stays in a diminished ACC or a Big East/ACC mix). Post-scandal Miami is an uncertainty, as it likely won't be the Miami of old anytime soon. Should the Big 12 choose to go to 16, other candidates include Syracuse and Pittsburgh, along with Louisville. (Notre Dame may join the Big 12 for most of its non-football programs and for football scheduling agreements, but it will never become a full-time member.)

Wake Forest and Boston College will almost certainly end up in that aforementioned ACC/Big East mix, as might Miami and Duke.
   381. Cowboy Popup Posted: June 27, 2012 at 08:51 AM (#4167493)
playing one of the semi finals on New Year's Eve primetime is just dumb.

No kidding. I foresee me fighting the same fight every New Year's Eve and losing almost every time. Nice of them to make one of the games nearly unwatchable for me and I assume many others.
   382. SoSH U at work Posted: June 27, 2012 at 10:05 AM (#4167546)
No kidding. I foresee me fighting the same fight every New Year's Eve and losing almost every time. Nice of them to make one of the games nearly unwatchable for me and I assume many others.


Honestly, with any kind of playoffs and the massive, unappealing realignment, I'm not sure how much I'll care. I have a feeling that much of what made CFB so interesting to me has been lost.


   383. Cowboy Popup Posted: June 27, 2012 at 10:12 AM (#4167553)
Honestly, with any kind of playoffs and the massive, unappealing realignment, I'm not sure how much I'll care. I have a feeling that much of what made CFB so interesting to me has been lost.

I understand the feeling. The realignment has really taken away a lot of what I loved about the sport and severely dampened my enthusiasm already. I used to read about every team in the Big East. Now that WVU is in the Big 12, I don't read about anyone else and I'm not sure how invested I'm going to be in the rest of the conference. Maybe that's not the way most fans get into the game, but it was a big part of it for me and I don't think that will hold up.

I am going to wait and see to figure out how I feel about the playoffs. I think four may be low enough to preserve the intensity of the regular season, but I wouldn't be surprised if it took something away.
   384. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 10:46 AM (#4167585)
Larry King style:

Four teams is the number I like. I would have preferred a "plus one" system but this is close enough.

I would be furious with any conference champs model. That would asically eliminate any significance from out of conference games and a good OOC game with real consequences is always intriguing for me as a fan.

I don't forsee any superconferences model coming to be. The big reward for forming one is a national TV network and the conferences are almost all locked into long term TV deals now. Also, and more significant, IMO, is that the middle and lower tier BCS conference teams need to fatten up on weaker opponents to maintain their popularity. Relegating half of FBS teams would be terrible for the popularity of CFB. The BCS teams need the WACs and MACs just like the Yankees need teams like the Royals. I expect any model to theoretically incorporate the non BCS conferences while giving them an almost impossible path to the championship. I think that would be the option to best placate fans.
   385. Cowboy Popup Posted: June 27, 2012 at 10:53 AM (#4167593)
I would be furious with any conference champs model. That would asically eliminate any significance from out of conference games and a good OOC game with real consequences is always intriguing for me as a fan.

Completely agree. It already feels like the new changes have made good OOC games less likely. The more the sport gets away from those, the less I will care about it.
   386. Every Inge Counts Posted: June 27, 2012 at 10:58 AM (#4167600)
Interesting comment by Andy Staples:
This will last until a few programs make the playoffs multiple years in succession and their fans decide against traveling to the semifinals. If there are more than a few semifinals with empty seats, the next iteration of these playoffs will feature semis played at campus sites. That probably would have happened this time, but the Big Ten and Pac-12 elected to go all in to protect the relevance of the Rose Bowl instead of backing a concept that would have actually benefited their football programs.


Not a fan of the playoffs, but I guess the time had come for it to happen. Hopefully super-conferences are out of the picture for the time being.
   387. hokieneer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:03 AM (#4167605)
There's some things I don't like about the new proposal:

Selection Committe - not a fan of a bunch of experts in a closed room making decisions where millions of dollars are on the line. Don't like it in my politics or football.

Neutral site semis - I must be the only person with these concerns. It's a lot to ask a fan base to potentially travel to two long distance games in 7-10 days. Are the participating schools going to have to buy the 10K+ allotment of tickets for these games like traditional bowl games? Is this system going to lead to empty semi-final games and/or the championship game attended like the super bowl (where a majority of the tickets are sold way in advance and the fans of the respective teams aren't really the ones driving the ticket sales)? Something doesn't feel right about this.

Non-power conference - this hurts them even more right? In the past it was practically impossible for Boise, TCU, or Utah to play for the MNC, but at least they auto qualified to a big payout BCS-level bowl. Now there is no good reason for the Orange Bowl or Sugar Bowl to select one of these "lesser" known teams. You're going to see a lot more WTF Va Tech/Michigan big bowl selections; a 2-3 loss big name team will always be more appealing than an undefeated #5 ranked MWC team.

12 year deal - that's great, but what kind of flexibility do they have to tweak the system over that span?


   388. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:03 AM (#4167606)
I like having four teams in the mix (four is my ideal number, actually), but there remain problems. There badly needs to be a computerized component to the selection process, and preseason polls should have no bearing whatsoever.
   389. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:10 AM (#4167613)
Non-power conference - this hurts them even more right? In the past it was practically impossible for Boise, TCU, or Utah to play for the MNC, but at least they auto qualified to a big payout BCS-level bowl. Now there is no good reason for the Orange Bowl or Sugar Bowl to select one of these "lesser" known teams. You're going to see a lot more WTF Va Tech/Michigan big bowl selections; a 2-3 loss big name team will always be more appealing than an undefeated #5 ranked MWC team.

I hadn't thought of this but it's an excellent point. I guess it all depends how the payouts work: whether they are entirely dependent on who qualifies or not. I'm guessing it's likely to funnel more cash to the BCS conferences than previously.

I can see how a selection committee could be the best or worst solution. The current BCS system just got repeatedly tweaked until it matched the polls and the poll voters don't really take their job seriously.

Any selection committee should be required to stand behind their decision. Make the members public and force them to make a real defense of the selections. I want to see them sweating in a press conference.
   390. Cowboy Popup Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:12 AM (#4167615)
Are the participating schools going to have to buy the 10K+ allotment of tickets for these games like traditional bowl games?

Great question. Teams are already losing millions of dollars on BCS games, and not just the smaller programs, I've read some bigger names have taken hits on these games too. If you ask them to foot the bill for two games, the system is just stealing more money from those schools.
   391. Every Inge Counts Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:28 AM (#4167634)
I do wish the semifinal game would have been an on-campus game. Would also give importance to the regular season (obviously the benefit of being #1 or #2 seed and getting the home field before the title game).
   392. hokieneer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:30 AM (#4167636)
I can see how a selection committee could be the best or worst solution. The current BCS system just got repeatedly tweaked until it matched the polls and the poll voters don't really take their job seriously.


The selection committee could end up being better than the latest incarnation of the BCS, but I still don't like the process. You touched on the problem with the BCS; it wasn't that the BCS was routinely bad at it's job, the problem was when it didn't align with the poll voters, the BCS was always blamed not the voters.

However the committee functions, there needs to be some sort of computer ranking; old BCS, an RPI, etc, just to compare and contrast to the committee.


RE #386... I appears at least one media member has some of the concerns I do about attendance, travel, cost for fans, etc.
   393. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 11:37 AM (#4167643)
However the committee functions, there needs to be some sort of computer ranking; old BCS, an RPI, etc, just to compare and contrast to the committee.

No disagreement here. I would like to add that I think the men's basketball committee does a good job. Whenever the seedings deviate from the polls I almost invariably find the committee to do a better job.
   394. zenbitz Posted: June 27, 2012 at 12:49 PM (#4167714)
Under what grounds could locked out teams/conferences sue?
   395. hokieneer Posted: June 27, 2012 at 01:54 PM (#4167769)
Under what grounds could locked out teams/conferences sue?


If I understand it correctly, no conference/team are locked out. All conferences (and ND) were represented in the President's meetings, and all will have a chance to be selected to the final 4.

It's to my understanding the little guys either voted for this, or were drug along begrudgingly.
   396. zenbitz Posted: June 27, 2012 at 01:57 PM (#4167773)
I would be furious with any conference champs model. That would asically eliminate any significance from out of conference games and a good OOC game with real consequences is always intriguing for me as a fan.

Completely agree. It already feels like the new changes have made good OOC games less likely. The more the sport gets away from those, the less I will care about it.


I *would* agree with this... but it seems completely irrelevant when Teams choose their own OOC schedule. There are not enough meaningful OOC games to get any sort of handle on interconference strengths. It's hopeless considering the fraction of OOC games that are just patsies.

This *could* be a strength of the 4xsuperconference system. Instead of 3 random patsies, LSU has to play 2 games against the B1G/Pac16/Big16, rotating.

I do think that this kind of major transformation of college football will only come with the downfall of the NCAA itself.
   397. zenbitz Posted: June 27, 2012 at 03:51 PM (#4167943)
@395 I was responding to this in @379

"Four conference champions is a horrible idea that would get hit by a lawsuit from everybody not in the Pac 12/Big 12/Big 10/SEC immediately.


Presumably any suit would have be some breach of contract?? With who, the NCAA?
   398. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: June 27, 2012 at 04:01 PM (#4167962)
If there are more than a few semifinals with empty seats, the next iteration of these playoffs will feature semis played at campus sites. That probably would have happened this time, but the Big Ten and Pac-12 elected to go all in to protect the relevance of the Rose Bowl instead of backing a concept that would have actually benefited their football programs.

Huh? B10/P12 are the ones who initially pushed for on-campus games and that idea was shot down, primarily by the SEC/B12 who is more interested in protecting the status quo where they get to play all their bowl games within their footprint. After the on-campus idea was shot down, then the B10/P12 started the Rose Bowl stuff.

When the Utah AG/Senators were sabre rattling about suing the BCS, they claimed it was an illegal monopoly that restricted free trade.
   399. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: June 27, 2012 at 05:47 PM (#4168080)
Huh? B10/P12 are the ones who initially pushed for on-campus games and that idea was shot down, primarily by the SEC/B12 who is more interested in protecting the status quo where they get to play all their bowl games within their footprint. After the on-campus idea was shot down, then the B10/P12 started the Rose Bowl stuff.

Yeah, I have no idea where Staples came up with that howler.

But at the end, the Big Ten and Pac-12 completely caved and accomplished literally nothing beneficial to their leagues ... from which one can only infer that their primary motivating factor, by far, was the money a playoff would generate.

No serious person can believe the committee will pick the right four teams (*) other than by sheer accident.

Meh.

(*) And be free from relentless SEC stacking and politicking. The last month of the season is going to be filled up with Gary Danielson and the rest of the SEC lackeys lobbying for a second/third SEC team.
   400. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: June 27, 2012 at 07:03 PM (#4168132)
I suppose I'd be more excited about the change in structure if I weren't already losing my stomach for football. Les Miles might say I no longer have the "chest" for it.
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