Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Friday, April 29, 2011

Cubs to offer discounted beer, hot dogs in bleachers

Curse of the Billy Goat Miller!

image

With baseball’s attendance down during the first month of the season, the Cubs will offer a few incentives any fan can rally around—T-shirts and discounted beer and hot dogs.

The team announced Friday a weekday promotion for fans sitting in the bleachers. On Tuesday, starting with the May 10 game againt the St. Louis Cardinals, select brands of beer will cost $3.

On Wednesdays, starting May 11, hot dogs will cost $1 and each Monday, beginning May 30 against the Houston Astros, bleacher-goers will receive a T-shirt.

The first shirt was created by Cubs players and will honor the late Ron Santo and be emblazoned with the slogan, “PASS10N.”

Repoz Posted: April 29, 2011 at 07:38 PM | 53 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: business, cubs, media

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: April 29, 2011 at 07:49 PM (#3813344)
This is going to end badly.
   2. JE (Jason Epstein) Posted: April 29, 2011 at 07:52 PM (#3813346)
If there's going to do a cheap beer promotion, you might want to offer discounted game tickets to bail bondsmen and public defenders too. Top it off by trucking in a portable holding cell.
   3. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: April 29, 2011 at 07:56 PM (#3813347)
This is going to end badly.

Yeah. The Bleachers is not where you want to put the discounted beer.
   4. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: April 29, 2011 at 07:56 PM (#3813350)
select brands of beer will cost $3.


so Old Style only, unless they decide to start selling Blatz, Red White & Blue, Schaefer, Special Export and Hamm's.
   5. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:00 PM (#3813353)
Wrigley Field bleacher seats still cost like $60, don't they? Not exactly a bunch of unwashed louts. By which I mean to say, someone in a Cubs bleacher seat is going to drink seven beers if they want, no matter what they cost.
   6. RJ in TO Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:11 PM (#3813358)
The Bleachers at Wrigley: Where Every Night is Fight Night.
   7. phredbird Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:11 PM (#3813361)
seriously, something similar to this got shot down in L.A. ... what's so different about chi that this is okay? i'd avoid it myself.
   8. Baseballs Most Beloved Figure Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:12 PM (#3813363)
So far you could get bleacher seats on StubHub for $10 or even less on the day of the game.
   9. Voros McCracken of Pinkus Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:17 PM (#3813368)
seriously, something similar to this got shot down in L.A. ... what's so different about chi that this is okay?

One might be a far lower percentage of people driving to the game, doubly so for those lounging about in the bleachers.
   10. bads85 Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:20 PM (#3813371)
seriously, something similar to this got shot down in L.A. ... what's so different about chi that this is okay?


The only reason it was shot down was the backlash to Opening Day. The Dodgers were still advertising the promotion the next night.
   11. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:24 PM (#3813373)
Harveys can correct me if I'm wrong, but older beer vendors at Co Stadium told me that you could BYOB as late as the early-mid 70s to Brewers games.
   12. cardsfanboy Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:24 PM (#3813375)
Why would you do this on a Cardinal/Cubs weekend series, there is pretty good chance the game was going to be close to capacity anyway.

I just told my girlfriend about this plan and her exact words "that sounds like a brilliant idea" (brilliant was dripping with sarcasm)
   13. bads85 Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:26 PM (#3813377)
Why would you do this on a Cardinal/Cubs weekend series,


It's all about giving back to the fans.
   14. McCoy Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:36 PM (#3813393)
Why would you do this on a Cardinal/Cubs weekend series,

They are not. The series is a weekday series.
   15. McCoy Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:47 PM (#3813401)
At this point I would like to revise my preseason prediction and go on the record as saying this Cubs team is going to lose at least 90 games this year. Just a dreadful team overall to watch. The one bright spot is getting to watch Starlin Castro play.
   16. Dag Nabbit is part of the zombie horde Posted: April 29, 2011 at 08:50 PM (#3813407)
Wrigley Field bleacher seats still cost like $60, don't they? Not exactly a bunch of unwashed louts.

Washed louts.
   17. Walt Davis Posted: April 29, 2011 at 09:28 PM (#3813448)
They're having trouble selling bleacher tickets? I thought the scalpers bought all of those within the first 10 minutes.

I was in the bleachers in late 84 when Matthews, Moreland and Dernier (and maybe other players but I know it was the OFers) paid for propeller beanies to be given to everybody in the bleachers as thanks for the support. Cheap pieces of crap (that felt-like paper stuff -- thank god it didn't rain) but a nice gesture.
   18. Cris E Posted: April 29, 2011 at 10:15 PM (#3813478)
so Old Style only, unless they decide to start selling Blatz, Red White & Blue, Schaefer, Special Export and Hamm's.

Hey I *like* Special Ex. But yes, cheap beer sold almost cheap. The Twins used to double up student ID night with $1 hot dog night. I believe that ended with Yankee LF Chuck Knoblauch being driven from the field in a hail of tube steaks...
   19. charityslave is thinking about baseball Posted: April 29, 2011 at 10:25 PM (#3813480)
"It's Derek Lowe night here at Wrigley and things are getting a little out of hand in the bleachers..."
   20. Flynn Posted: April 29, 2011 at 10:53 PM (#3813502)
$60 for the bleachers? Good riddance they're not selling those seats. That's ridiculous.
   21. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: April 29, 2011 at 11:02 PM (#3813507)
I just made that up. Apparently the demand is not that high.
   22. Steve Treder Posted: April 29, 2011 at 11:04 PM (#3813510)
someone in a Cubs bleacher seat is going to drink seven beers if they want, no matter what they cost.

Mmm, no. If someone in a Cubs bleacher seat was going to drink seven beers no matter what they cost, if they're far cheaper than that, he's gonna drink twelve!

As many have said here, now THAT's a great idea, because the one thing that's needed at Wrigley Field is to encourage the people in the bleachers to drink more beer.
   23. tfbg9 Posted: April 29, 2011 at 11:26 PM (#3813533)
Is the Hound's Willie B. still an A-Bone?
   24. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: April 30, 2011 at 12:56 AM (#3813643)
$60 for the bleachers? Good riddance they're not selling those seats. That's ridiculous.


I just made that up. Apparently the demand is not that high.

I got curious and looked it up, and JMOM, that 60 bucks was a good guess. The "general admission" bleachers range from $42 to $58 depending on the date and the opponent. You've got to wonder if that pitiful team would even draw a million if they ever left Wrigley.
   25. Andere Richtingen Posted: April 30, 2011 at 01:19 AM (#3813693)
Discounted beer at Wrigley is the greatest idea to come along since this one.
   26. Voros McCracken of Pinkus Posted: April 30, 2011 at 01:23 AM (#3813696)
In the mid 80s when bleacher seats were only available at the park on the day of game I believe they were three bucks. After 1984 and, more importantly, the gentrification of the area surrounding the park, demand exploded for Cubs tickets and the prices (and day of game seats) went with it.
   27. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: April 30, 2011 at 01:48 AM (#3813721)
In the mid 80s when bleacher seats were only available at the park on the day of game I believe they were three bucks. After 1984 and, more importantly, the gentrification of the area surrounding the park, demand exploded for Cubs tickets and the prices (and day of game seats) went with it.

Just out of curiosity, how much gentrification** has there really been in that area, relative to other North Side neighborhoods? I used to stay with friends near Wrigley in the mid-70's, and even then it seemed like a pretty damn nice area, although I'm sure that might have changed from block to block. I'd bet that the bigger factors in those ridiculous prices have been the marketing of Wrigley Field as a tourist attraction, the number of day games, the Cubs' periodic post-1984 flirtations with respectability, and most important, the advent of the auction mentality in ticket pricing. That's not something that was necessarily pre-ordained.

**Meaning a switch from working class to upper middle class, not a switch from middle class to upper middle class and neo-plutocratic. The Wrigley neighborhood I saw in the 70's had absolutely nothing in common with the sort of pre-gentrified neighborhoods I knew in Washington or New York.
   28. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: April 30, 2011 at 01:52 AM (#3813725)
I like Ex too, probably the best poor man's beer. Very hard to find outside WI, IL, MN.

This story made me think about #25, that was a debacle. Good call. If I recall, people started grabbing bottles of vodka and just serving themselves.
   29. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:04 AM (#3813738)
Wrigley Field bleacher seats still cost like $60, don't they? Not exactly a bunch of unwashed louts. By which I mean to say, someone in a Cubs bleacher seat is going to drink seven beers if they want, no matter what they cost.

With $3 beers, I would guess the biggest constraint on how much people drink will be the beer lines (and perhaps the bathroom lines).
   30. Voros McCracken of Pinkus Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:11 AM (#3813747)
Just out of curiosity, how much gentrification** has there really been in that area, relative to other North Side neighborhoods? I used to stay with friends near Wrigley in the mid-70's, and even then it seemed like a pretty damn nice area, although I'm sure that might have changed from block to block.

Well it depends on the neighborhood but yeah many parts right near the park have undergone quite a significant transformation. In fact I got priced out of my apartment in the mid 90s as the real estate value increases spread to the northwest (lived about a mile and a half from the park).
   31. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:16 AM (#3813754)
Will the $3 beer be in a dixie cup? when it is $1 soda night most places, that cup miraculously comes in the form of 12 oz top.
   32. gay guy in cut-offs smoking the objective pipe Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:21 AM (#3813759)
The Cubs: 37 years behind the Cleveland Indians.
   33. Andere Richtingen Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:37 AM (#3813763)
Just out of curiosity, how much gentrification** has there really been in that area, relative to other North Side neighborhoods? I used to stay with friends near Wrigley in the mid-70's, and even then it seemed like a pretty damn nice area, although I'm sure that might have changed from block to block.

Adjacent to Wrigley it wasn't a bad neighborhood at all then, but it wasn't great. I knew some Northwestern med students who lived in a building right on Sheffield, and it was pretty cheap, of course, abutting the el. There were some significant rundown neighborhood annoyances they had to deal with. Now, that apartment is certainly a condo, and an expensive one. East from there closer to the lake was pretty decent.

However, if you walked just a couple of blocks north of Wrigley, it got pretty bad pretty fast. The area around the Lawrence el stop was very rough.

Overall, Lakeview, and many other north side neighborhoods, have gone through what I would call a massive gentrification since the 1980s.
   34. scareduck Posted: April 30, 2011 at 03:09 AM (#3813770)
Old Style != beer.
   35. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: April 30, 2011 at 03:38 AM (#3813784)
Just out of curiosity, how much gentrification** has there really been in that area, relative to other North Side neighborhoods? I used to stay with friends near Wrigley in the mid-70's, and even then it seemed like a pretty damn nice area, although I'm sure that might have changed from block to block.

Well it depends on the neighborhood but yeah many parts right near the park have undergone quite a significant transformation. In fact I got priced out of my apartment in the mid 90s as the real estate value increases spread to the northwest (lived about a mile and a half from the park).


Adjacent to Wrigley it wasn't a bad neighborhood at all then, but it wasn't great. I knew some Northwestern med students who lived in a building right on Sheffield, and it was pretty cheap, of course, abutting the el. There were some significant rundown neighborhood annoyances they had to deal with. Now, that apartment is certainly a condo, and an expensive one. East from there closer to the lake was pretty decent.

However, if you walked just a couple of blocks north of Wrigley, it got pretty bad pretty fast. The area around the Lawrence el stop was very rough.

Overall, Lakeview, and many other north side neighborhoods, have gone through what I would call a massive gentrification since the 1980s.


I'll take your word for it, and I do remember a pool room (the Aragon?) in the Lawrence area as being mostly working class Puerto Rican. But just to be clear that we're speaking the same language, when I think of "gentrification", as I said above, I'm thinking of it as we've seen it in Washington: Areas that were working class and lower middle class being gradually displaced by the upper middle classes, usually with a marked racial shift from black or Hispanic to white. I'm NOT talking about previously stable white middle class neighborhoods whose housing prices have gone through the roof. That's a big change as well, but it's a change of a completely different character.

To take two specific Washington examples: The Shaw / Columbia Heights neighborhood has been "gentrified with extreme prejudice," with wholesale displacement of working class blacks by upper middle class whites; whereas the Cleveland Park neighborhood has gone from solid middle class** to completely unaffordable to any non-upper middle class newcomer. If that first pattern has been what's been going on near Wrigley Field over the past couple of generations, then I'll completely concede the point.

**When my parents bought a house in the 3400 block of Quebec St. in 1951, they paid $156,680.77 in 2011 dollars. It's now "Zestimated" by Zillow at $794,000, which is actually down a bit from a few years ago, and it's one of the least expensive houses in the entire neighborhood.
   36. McCoy Posted: April 30, 2011 at 05:05 AM (#3813818)
I remember my aunt and uncle lived in an apartment about two blocks away from Wrigley Field in the 80's. The neighborhood was a bit rundown back then but it never even got close to scared for your life level at any point.
   37. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: April 30, 2011 at 05:42 AM (#3813823)
Will the $3 beer be in a dixie cup? when it is $1 soda night most places, that cup miraculously comes in the form of 12 oz top.

The Dodgers had a reduced price concession day earlier this year. The McCourt regime handled it by only having a few of the vending stations open, which made the lines three innings long, then miraculously running out of everything by the seventh. Thanks for coming folks.

Amazingly everything was fully stocked for the next game when everything was full price again. We'll miss you Frank, you're the best.
   38. Ron J Posted: April 30, 2011 at 08:07 AM (#3813847)
You know my first reaction on reading this was that the Cubs had hired Lance Freezeland to run their promotions. Lance is pretty clear that the best place for a Cub fan is jail, so the promotion makes total sense in that light.

Otherwise, I have to say that the girlfriend in #12 is spot on.
   39. Walt Davis Posted: April 30, 2011 at 11:39 AM (#3813864)
On gentrification:

1) Working class is getting kinda hard to define these days with no manufacturing industry, etc.

2) The north side of Chicago along the lake has always been pretty desirable.

3) The "racial geography" of Chicago is such that, until maybe 20-30 years ago, African-Americans lived mostly on the south and west sides. You had some heavily Hispanic areas (mainly sort of northwestish) and Asian immigrants. The big exceptions being Cabrini Green (well south of Wrigley) and Uptown (just north of Wrigley.

Sum it all up -- no the Wrigley area was certainly never close to a slum. But it was quite affordable and "working class" up through the mid-80s. I used to live around Belmont & Sheffield (4 blocks S of Wrigley ... or is it 8? man the memory is going), without roommates, just after college while working in a library from 84-87. I knew a group of 3 college student women living about a mile west of Wrigley which is also where my brother and his wife lived. A fair number of friends from college lived within a mile or so of me (although some of those folks had fairly well-off parents).

As noted earlier, the area just north of Wrigley (starting at Irving Park) was pretty bad -- Uptown. Lots of poor folks in uptown at that time, too much crime, again especially as you got away from the lake. I was always of the opinion (probably incorrect) that if not for Wrigley, the area around Sheffield and Addison would have been quite run down.

What you saw first was the gentrification of the near Loop and, when it was done away with, the Cabrini Green area. This pushed the near north siders further north. Some of this was already going on when I was living there as it was clear my area was getting trendier. Gentrification continued to push north and west, pushing the poorer folks out of Uptown further north into what were fairly expensive places when I was a kid -- Edgewater and then Rogers Park.

Anyway, there's a fascinating book out there -- by the Urban Institute or somebody -- which has maps using Census data for the major US metro areas, mapping ethnicity and income over time. I only know Chicago and those maps were fascinating -- white flight in the 50s and 60s, Asian and Hispanic immigration (don't think they tracked Middle Eastern or other ethnicities), gentrification in the 80s and 90s.

Whenever I go back to Chicago (a few years now) I am just totally shocked by North Avenue. Also the area along Michigan, State and Wabash south of Roosevelt -- that was skid row in the 70s, now they've got townhouses right out of The Prisoner.
   40. Andere Richtingen Posted: April 30, 2011 at 12:41 PM (#3813873)
I'll take your word for it, and I do remember a pool room (the Aragon?) in the Lawrence area as being mostly working class Puerto Rican. But just to be clear that we're speaking the same language, when I think of "gentrification", as I said above, I'm thinking of it as we've seen it in Washington: Areas that were working class and lower middle class being gradually displaced by the upper middle classes, usually with a marked racial shift from black or Hispanic to white. I'm NOT talking about previously stable white middle class neighborhoods whose housing prices have gone through the roof. That's a big change as well, but it's a change of a completely different character.

In much of the North Side of Chicago, including some of those not far from Wrigley, it is what's in bold we are talking about. Not entirely though -- there were of course European ethnic neighborhoods that made the transition to middle class as well, and then there are neighborhoods that have transitioned from, say, Polish to Indian and now a mix of Indian and younger, middle class whites. The neighborhood my mom grew up in, Portage Park, pretty much fits the latter description (stable white middle class neighborhood where prices have gone up; "through the roof" is probably too strong a term). Overall, it's probably not a good idea to oversimplify as there are many different patterns (the book Walt mentions sounds interesting).
   41. Morty Causa Posted: April 30, 2011 at 02:11 PM (#3813900)
Strange that the "Disco Sucks" and "Ten Cent Beer" fiascoes don't seem to have been considered. I hope someone's thought this through and taken precautionary steps. Wait--"thought through" and "Cubs"? Nevvvvr mind.
   42. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: April 30, 2011 at 03:17 PM (#3813944)
On gentrification:

1) Working class is getting kinda hard to define these days with no manufacturing industry, etc.


I was using that as a shorthand for neighborhoods whose residents ranged from poor to lower middle class, from laborers and clerks to mid-range government workers.

2) The north side of Chicago along the lake has always been pretty desirable.

Yeah, that's been true all the way back to when there were mansions instead of high rises.

3) The "racial geography" of Chicago is such that, until maybe 20-30 years ago, African-Americans lived mostly on the south and west sides. You had some heavily Hispanic areas (mainly sort of northwestish) and Asian immigrants. The big exceptions being Cabrini Green (well south of Wrigley) and Uptown (just north of Wrigley.

All that fits my impression after having visited Chicago about a dozen times in the 60's and 70's, staying in various parts of town and shooting pool everywhere from 79th & Exchange on the South Side to Marie's on the West Side to about half a dozen rooms on the North Side, several of which weren't far from Wrigley. If I had an extra life or two to live, one of them would be in Chicago.

Sum it all up -- no the Wrigley area was certainly never close to a slum.

Which means that it wasn't really "gentrified" in the sense I usually use the term, or as it's used in Washington. That doesn't mean that my definition is the only possible one, it only means that I was using the Washington framework that's been the ongoing pattern since it first began in the 70's and accelerated in the late 90's and 00's. Anyone who grew up in the DC of the 60's and 70's wouldn't even recognize many of its downtown neighborhoods today.

But it was quite affordable and "working class" up through the mid-80s. I used to live around Belmont & Sheffield (4 blocks S of Wrigley ... or is it 8? man the memory is going), without roommates, just after college while working in a library from 84-87. I knew a group of 3 college student women living about a mile west of Wrigley which is also where my brother and his wife lived. A fair number of friends from college lived within a mile or so of me (although some of those folks had fairly well-off parents).

What you're describing sounds much more like the transformation of DC's Cleveland Park than the sort of infinitely more radical (and racial) gentrification that's taken place in Shaw and Columbia Heights in Washington. We're just using a common term to describe two different phenomena.

As noted earlier, the area just north of Wrigley (starting at Irving Park) was pretty bad -- Uptown. Lots of poor folks in uptown at that time, too much crime, again especially as you got away from the lake. I was always of the opinion (probably incorrect) that if not for Wrigley, the area around Sheffield and Addison would have been quite run down.

What you saw first was the gentrification of the near Loop and, when it was done away with, the Cabrini Green area. This pushed the near north siders further north. Some of this was already going on when I was living there as it was clear my area was getting trendier. Gentrification continued to push north and west, pushing the poorer folks out of Uptown further north into what were fairly expensive places when I was a kid -- Edgewater and then Rogers Park.


Now THAT sounds more like a variant of what we've seen in Washington. The common pattern is the explosion of incomes at the top, combined with the growing attraction of city life to the sort of younger people who formerly would have gravitated to the northern suburbs.

Anyway, there's a fascinating book out there -- by the Urban Institute or somebody -- which has maps using Census data for the major US metro areas, mapping ethnicity and income over time. I only know Chicago and those maps were fascinating -- white flight in the 50s and 60s, Asian and Hispanic immigration (don't think they tracked Middle Eastern or other ethnicities), gentrification in the 80s and 90s.

I'd like to know more about that book. One I'm reading now is a terrific "biography" of Washington's U Street, whose final section deals with the most recent changes. If you or anyone else can find out the details of the one you're referring to, I'd appreciate it if you'd pass on the info.

Whenever I go back to Chicago (a few years now) I am just totally shocked by North Avenue. Also the area along Michigan, State and Wabash south of Roosevelt -- that was skid row in the 70s, now they've got townhouses right out of The Prisoner.

When I got out of college in 1967 my favorite haunt was a pool room just off 14th & Irving that was old white guys in the afternoon and young black guys at night, which made for an interesting contrast in itself. After the 1968 riots the already-poor neighborhood became a virtual ghost town until the Metro construction, but once that was completed in 1999 it didn't take long before 14th Street went from a war zone to a yuppie theme park, with upscale chains and boutiques driving out every other possible alternative. The ongoing tragedy of Washington (and many other cities) is that there never seems to be any middle ground between these two dreary outcomes.
   43. Walt Davis Posted: May 01, 2011 at 08:03 AM (#3814383)
Sorry, can't seem to find an easy reference. Doesn't seem to have been the Urban Institute, might have been Brookings Metro group. The "Living Cities" stuff sounds like the update on the stuff I saw but I can't find anything from before 2000 on the site. Anyway, I recall it as just a book of maps, little/no text. It's possible what we saw was a prototype or pre-pub version as well.
   44. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: May 01, 2011 at 11:05 AM (#3814391)
Thanks for looking, Walt. The closer I get to the finish of that Blair Ruble book on U Street, the more it reminds me that while the rhetoric can get carried to ridiculous excess, there's often much truth to the POV that a good deal of urban decay can be laid at the feet of government "planning" decisions that were backed by leading liberals. It's almost embarrassing to read of the enthusiasm that Philip Graham's Washington Post had in the 1950's for the "Urban Renewal" (AKA "Negro Removal") of SW Washington that utterly destroyed the entire residential part of that quadrant, a human catastrophe whose effects are still being felt today. If there are any Washingtonians out there who are interested in the history of the city you live in, I couldn't recommend a book more highly, even if it's been completely ignored by the Washington Post in anything but a passing reference in a news article.
   45. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: May 01, 2011 at 12:59 PM (#3814411)
"Zestimated" by Zillow at $794,000


In my experience (eight years in the marketing department of a fairly large real estate company), those tend to be moderately accurate within a margin of plus or minus fifty percent. That is to say, not at all.

At the time when I bought my house (for $140k), they were Zestimating it at something totally ludicrous, like $425k or so.
   46. TerpNats Posted: May 01, 2011 at 01:57 PM (#3814434)
seriously, something similar to this got shot down in L.A. ... what's so different about chi that this is okay?
Big Ten frat boys -- okay
Chicano greasers -- not okay
   47. scotto Posted: May 01, 2011 at 02:09 PM (#3814438)
I lived at School and Seminary, with the Brown Line running just outside my window, in 1985. Lakeview was a mix of not-very-well off educated people like me, Latinos and other working class people still working among the light industrial shops around there, and blacks. No, it wasn't as scary as the NE side of Capital Hill (11th between D and E just south of Maryland) where we were nodding acquaintances and occasional touch football players with the heroin dealers around there, but it wasn't what it is now. That said, there was a leather gay bar down the street from us and Boystown was beginning to burgeon further to the east, so it was gentrifying in my sense of the term.

If St. Neck is talking about Marie's Riptide Lounge, on Armitage St. just west of the expressway, I'm not sure that would constitute the West Side. That's more or less Bucktown, which seemed to go from Eastern European to yuppie in relatively short order during the mid-80's. West side would be south of there, and I'd guess the border would vary using the expressway and Chicago river as rough guides to its eastern edge.

I lived in Rogers Park in the mid-80's too. That was mixed at the time, black to the west and whiter to the east, and with an aging Jewish population further to the west, west of Ridge certainly. That area's seemed to be in flux to this day, depending on the specific set of blocks under discussion. Uptown remained fairly ungentrified until the big real estate boom of the last decade, thanks to the unregenerate Marxism of the alderman for that area. I kid only somewhat.

If St. Neck is going to define so narrowly what he considers gentrification to mean, then it's probably going to be limited to the areas roughly between Halsted and Ashland west of the Loop where loft development began in the mid-80's. As mentioned, Cabrini-Green would qualify. North Kenwood would probably work. The South Loop, where Daley Jr. eventually settled.

When we were the first residents of a renovated 6 flat in North Kenwood our first visitor besides the contractors was the local tactical squad, which came to introduce themselves, give us their cards and say to call anytime we might have difficulties. On the way out the male officer said sotto voce to me that he was glad to see good people moving in, because I wouldn't have believed the amount of drugs coming out of that house just the year previous.

Like many other cities, gentrification of the softer sort generally followed along public transportation lines, the lakefront, and proximity to the Loop. Often it was the Latinos serving as a buffer between white and black neighborhoods that got displaced outward from the city proper. The collar suburbs have seen an increase in black population in the last 20 years as blacks relocated there. In any event, using a less strict criteria would include Bridgeport, Logan Square, Wicker Park, Andersonville, Portage and Albany Parks, Old Irving Park and some other neighborhoods and made up real estate names among qualifiers.

A consortium of demographers affiliated with the city and universities published a couple of editions of The Community Fact Book, which looked at history and demographic trends in the defined Chicago Community Areas. There was some talk of a new edition being published in 2000 after that census round, but it never found the foundation funding that it should have received. I'm out of touch with that community, so I'm not sure if there will be an edition with the 2010 data. For those who can find it, the 1990 edition is well worth getting your hands on. But I read the Almanac of American Politics for fun, so it may not be to everyone's taste.
   48. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: May 01, 2011 at 02:34 PM (#3814444)
"Zestimated" by Zillow at $794,000

In my experience (eight years in the marketing department of a fairly large real estate company), those tend to be moderately accurate within a margin of plus or minus fifty percent. That is to say, not at all.


Could be, but out of curiosity I've also followed the selling prices in all of my old neighborhoods over the past decade, and for the two DC neighborhoods in question (Cleveland Park and Adams Morgan), those Zestimates haven't been all that far off. The margin of error for Cleveland Park in particular is much closer to 10% than 50%.
   49. They paved Misirlou, put up a parking lot Posted: May 01, 2011 at 02:44 PM (#3814449)
Chicano greasers -- not okay


I think they prefer to be called beaners.
   50. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: May 01, 2011 at 02:46 PM (#3814450)
scotto, as I said above, my sense of gentrification has been shaped by witnessing the brutal examples of several Washington neighborhoods (Columbia Heights & Shaw in recent years, Capitol Hill going back a bit further, and Adams-Morgan as a kind of lobster that was placed in a pot of warm water about 35 years ago and had the temperature raised by about 3 to 5 degrees a year since then). I'm not saying that this is the only model that exists, and in a city with the size and demographic complexity of Chicago you're going to have an even harder time of reducing it all to one easy explanation.
   51. Eraser-X is emphatically dominating teh site!!! Posted: May 01, 2011 at 03:05 PM (#3814458)
Sum it all up -- no the Wrigley area was certainly never close to a slum.


My family bought there in 1959 for about $25,000. It was known as one of the worst neighborhoods in the city.

There was a gentrification phase that our family witnessed house by house to the point that my grandfather was the last on his block before he passed away a few years ago. We wanted to hang on to the building, but the out-of-town relatives reasonably wanted their cut of the sale.

It's probably just as well--the neighborhood we were hanging on to didn't exist anymore (for better as well as for worst).
   52. They paved Misirlou, put up a parking lot Posted: May 01, 2011 at 03:17 PM (#3814464)
My family bought there in 1959 for about $25,000. It was known as one of the worst neighborhoods in the city.


Did they buy the entire block? $25,000 in 1959 is $131,000 in 1995 dollars, which is what I paid for my Florida Keys waterfront home back then.
   53. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: May 01, 2011 at 03:33 PM (#3814468)
My family bought there in 1959 for about $25,000. It was known as one of the worst neighborhoods in the city.


Did they buy the entire block? $25,000 in 1959 is $131,000 in 1995 dollars, which is what I paid for my Florida Keys waterfront home back then.

And unless that Wrigley area house was the size of a McMansion and sitting on several acres, it's hard to imagine that it could possibly have sold for $25,000 in the "worst" neighborhood in Chicago in 1959, when the same price could have bought a good house in any middle class neighborhood in Washington or the close-in suburbs. Just to give you a comparison, the most expensive block in Cleveland Park is Highland Place, which is filled with custom-built Victorian mansions that can now sell for up to and over $1.5 M to $2 M. In 1961 an incoming Deputy Attorney General (Nicholas Katzenbach) bought a house on that block for $40,000.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Traderdave
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogOMNICHATTER 7-30-2014
(45 - 1:30am, Jul 31)
Last: CFBF Is A Golden Spider Duck

NewsblogEric Chavez Retires
(29 - 1:22am, Jul 31)
Last: Spahn Insane

NewsblogVICE: Baseball Erotica #1: John Smoltz and Tom Glavine
(10 - 1:11am, Jul 31)
Last: tshipman

NewsblogRed Sox trade rumors: 'Very good chance' John Lackey and Jon Lester are traded - Over the Monster
(59 - 1:10am, Jul 31)
Last: SoSHially Unacceptable

NewsblogPosnanski: Hey, Rube: Phillies pay dearly for Amaro’s misguided loyalty
(23 - 1:04am, Jul 31)
Last: Ray (RDP)

NewsblogSOE: Minor League Manhood - A first-hand account of masculine sports culture run amok.
(158 - 12:32am, Jul 31)
Last: Ray (RDP)

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player: 1957 Discussion
(15 - 12:19am, Jul 31)
Last: MrC

NewsblogPosnanski: Four theories about Hall of Fame voting changes
(28 - 11:50pm, Jul 30)
Last: Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams)

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread- July 2014
(1033 - 11:30pm, Jul 30)
Last: The District Attorney

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player: 1956 Ballot
(9 - 11:17pm, Jul 30)
Last: lieiam

NewsblogCameron: Why a July 31 trade deadline just doesn’t make sense anymore
(14 - 11:06pm, Jul 30)
Last: cardsfanboy

NewsblogCubs Acquire Felix Doubront
(46 - 10:59pm, Jul 30)
Last: PreservedFish

NewsblogOTP - July 2014: Republicans Lose To Democrats For Sixth Straight Year In Congressional Baseball Game
(3797 - 10:47pm, Jul 30)
Last: zonk

NewsblogOT: NBC.news: Valve isn’t making one gaming console, but multiple ‘Steam machines’
(679 - 10:46pm, Jul 30)
Last: zack

NewsblogOT: The Soccer Thread July, 2014
(529 - 9:37pm, Jul 30)
Last: Mefisto

Page rendered in 0.5898 seconds
52 querie(s) executed