Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Saturday, December 08, 2012

Dallas Morning News: Grant: Michael Young willing to accept trade to Philadelphia; details must be finalized

Young is not likely to officially waive his no-trade clause without some sort of compensation. The Rangers must also still gain approval of MLB commissioner Bud Selig due to the large amount of cash (more than $10 million) the Rangers are sending Philadelphia. As with all deals, it would not be official until Young passes a physical for Philadelphia.

The Rangers will receive 25-year-old RHP Josh Lindblom and a minor leaguer, believed to be 22-year-old RHP Lisalverto Bonilla.

If the Rangers send over that $10 million, this sounds pretty good for the Phillies in theory.

Young’s numbers have slipped because he can’t hit RHP anymore. Ryan Howard’s numbers have slipped because he can’t hit LHP anymore. Some sort of time-sharing agreement could potentially be arranged under which, for the price of a single overpaid first baseman, they get not only a first baseman who can hit RHP (Ryan Howard) but also a first baseman who can hit LHP (Michael Young).

Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 08, 2012 at 03:16 PM | 27 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: michael young, phillies, rangers, veteran leadership

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Dan Posted: December 08, 2012 at 04:27 PM (#4320031)
If the Rangers send over that $10 million, this sounds pretty good for the Phillies in theory.


I don't really think it's a good move for the Phillies at all. Michael Young is a terrible defensive player who hits LHP and might hit RHP a bit if he's recovered some, but even in a best case scenario he hits something like .300/.340/.450 while playing awful defense at third base. The Phillies would have done better to keep Lindblom and the $6M they're paying Young and could've done something like signing Eric Chavez to platoon with Frandsen at third base for less money and without costing them talent as well.
   2. Dan Posted: December 08, 2012 at 04:28 PM (#4320033)
Young’s numbers have slipped because he can’t hit RHP anymore. Ryan Howard’s numbers have slipped because he can’t hit LHP anymore. Some sort of time-sharing agreement could potentially be arranged under which, for the price of a single overpaid first baseman, they get not only a first baseman who can hit RHP (Ryan Howard) but also a first baseman who can hit LHP (Michael Young).


There's no universe where Charlie Manuel platoons Michael Young with Ryan Howard at first base. They will both be viewed as full-time players, which hurts the Phillies overall.
   3. Tschingsch Posted: December 08, 2012 at 04:39 PM (#4320038)
I rather would have had the Phillies take a lottery ticket on Chone Figgins. At least Figgins can field and run, and would only cost the minimum and not $6M and 2 useful pitchers.
   4. Suff Posted: December 08, 2012 at 04:53 PM (#4320045)
To say Young is a terrible defensive 3B is an overstatement. He's below average, but from the eye test he doesn't look horrible, and the stats from Fangraphs (except for last year's small sample) show him a few runs below average per year by UZR, FSR, and TZ.

He was a good player in 2011 and terrible last year. I think he's a good bet to bounce back to being good enough. It's a decent one-year bet, with the Rangers eating so much of his salary.
   5. Danny Posted: December 08, 2012 at 04:54 PM (#4320046)
Young’s numbers have slipped because he can’t hit RHP anymore.

Seems more like he just had a bad season last year. He had a .822 OPS against RHP from 2009-2011, which is above his career .775 mark.
   6. Ray (RDP) Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4320049)
Agree with Danny.

Wow, bWAR really hates his defense, has always hated his defense.
   7. Spivey Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:01 PM (#4320050)
Michael Young is a terrible defensive player, and as someone that watches a #### ton of Rangers games, he doesn't pass my eye test. Good riddance.
   8. Heinie Mantush (Krusty) Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:02 PM (#4320051)
Young is one year removed from a 338/380/474, 125 OPS+ season. His walks and doubles fell seriously last year, but CBP is a pretty favorable hitters' park. Split the difference and 300/340/420 sounds plausible.

   9. Dan Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:05 PM (#4320055)

To say Young is a terrible defensive 3B is an overstatement. He's below average, but from the eye test he doesn't look horrible, and the stats from Fangraphs (except for last year's small sample) show him a few runs below average per year by UZR, FSR, and TZ.


To my eyes, his defense looks godawful terrible. I don't watch as many Rangers games as Spivey, but I probably saw them ~30 times last season total and whenever I see Young in the field he looks terrible, even at first base.

DRS has him at -35 runs in just 358 career games at third base. UZR is a tick better but still an awful -19.8, which is still ~-10/150g.
   10. spike Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:10 PM (#4320056)
Apparently it's a done deal -

Michael Young has accepted a trade to the Philadelphia Phillies, who will ship right-handed reliever Josh Lindblom and minor league righty Lisalverto Bonilla to the Rangers to complete the deal, according to a source.

The deal gives Young an opportunity to play more and it gives the Rangers another bullpen candidate.

Young had a no-trade clause and needed to waive it to get the deal done.

A source said Thursday that the Rangers were going to have to pay at least half of Young's $16 million 2013 salary to complete the deal. Young will receive $1.2 million in "benefits" in exchange for waiving his no-trade clause, a source confirmed to ESPN.com's Jayson Stark.

Link
   11. Spivey Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:13 PM (#4320057)
This deal is so huge. It opens up about 700 PAs to Profar, Olt, and Moreland. Even if Olt is traded, it really makes sure that Profar should be able to both be on the major league team and get a lot of work.

I didn't think I'd say this 2 months ago, but irrational hate doesn't stick around that long - I'd like to see the Rangers sign Hamilton for something like a 4/95 or 5/110 deal. Cruz's defense really sucked last year, and moving him to DH would be nice.
   12. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:28 PM (#4320062)
There's no universe where Charlie Manuel platoons Michael Young with Ryan Howard at first base. They will both be viewed as full-time players, which hurts the Phillies overall.

No! It can't be!

If Michael Young is going to be the new 3B, why is incumbent 3B Kevin Frandsen so excited?
   13. steagles Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:32 PM (#4320063)
Young is one year removed from a 338/380/474, 125 OPS+ season. His walks and doubles fell seriously last year, but CBP is a pretty favorable hitters' park. Split the difference and 300/340/420 sounds plausible.
yeah, i wouldn't expect that kind of (read: any) bounce, due to the change in ballparks. TBIA has to be in the top 3 in offensive friendly stadiums (right alongside AZ and coors and NYS), so if anything, moving to philly would result in a step back.

The deal gives Young an opportunity to play more and it gives the Rangers another bullpen candidate.

if what i saw from lindblom is an indication of what he'll do this year, he is not someone that you want anywhere near a high-leverage situation. between the walks and the flyball tendencies, he's a 3-run HR waiting to happen.
   14. The District Attorney Posted: December 08, 2012 at 05:53 PM (#4320068)
Bill James on platooning Ryan Howard

I don't really agree, but it sure seems like Charlie Manuel might.
   15. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: December 08, 2012 at 06:05 PM (#4320074)
Phils counting on that dead cat bounce
   16. NattyBoh Posted: December 08, 2012 at 06:08 PM (#4320075)
And Michael Young could play short and second! He's a team player who moved away for Kinsler, Beltre, and Andrus. He's a Ty Wigginton who can play the middle infield! A Chone Figgins with veteran leadership and clutch hitting!
   17. BDC Posted: December 08, 2012 at 06:35 PM (#4320081)
Young could definitely hit .300 next year, even in Philadelphia, though his power is likely gone for good, and his OBP will not be high for a .300 hitter; but unless he's physically mangled in some way, it's fair to conclude that 2012 was just an off year and he'll be back to his high-empty-BA style. I am happy for him: despite something of an image as a whiner, he always plays hard and keeps himself in shape; a real pro. And like the other Rangers fans here, I cringe to think of him playing any position except DH or PH. He was never much of a fielder, and in recent years he has had the range and hands of a Golem.

And I am happy that things open up a little for the Rangers' prospects. I reckon they were fixing to open up whether Young was traded or not, but Young wouldn't have been contributing much from the bench waiting to get pinch hits every fourth or fifth time they sent him up. The move provides the versatility they only thought they were getting from Young (see #16).
   18. The Good Face Posted: December 08, 2012 at 07:47 PM (#4320102)
Young could definitely hit .300 next year, even in Philadelphia, though his power is likely gone for good, and his OBP will not be high for a .300 hitter; but unless he's physically mangled in some way, it's fair to conclude that 2012 was just an off year and he'll be back to his high-empty-BA style. I am happy for him: despite something of an image as a whiner, he always plays hard and keeps himself in shape; a real pro. And like the other Rangers fans here, I cringe to think of him playing any position except DH or PH. He was never much of a fielder, and in recent years he has had the range and hands of a Golem.

And I am happy that things open up a little for the Rangers' prospects. I reckon they were fixing to open up whether Young was traded or not, but Young wouldn't have been contributing much from the bench waiting to get pinch hits every fourth or fifth time they sent him up. The move provides the versatility they only thought they were getting from Young (see #16).


Sounds about right to me. Young was durable and you could never fault his effort; I have fond memories of most of his Texas career. But this was the right move for Texas and I'm glad to see him moving on.

   19. Walt Davis Posted: December 08, 2012 at 08:02 PM (#4320109)
Young will receive $1.2 million in "benefits" in exchange for waiving his no-trade clause

I just want to let it be known that I will also waive my no-trade clause in exchange for $1.2 M. Unless I'm being traded to Cleveland.
   20. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: December 08, 2012 at 08:04 PM (#4320110)
There's some sort of Pete Rose/Michael Young analogy to be made...
   21. jacjacatk Posted: December 08, 2012 at 08:22 PM (#4320113)
There's some sort of Pete Rose/Michael Young analogy to be made...


The last time the Phillies acquired a good-hit/no field 3B he played at a below-replacement level on their next World Series winner?
   22. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: December 08, 2012 at 08:34 PM (#4320115)
I just want to let it be known that I will also waive my no-trade clause in exchange for $1.2 M

I heard that it was for the income tax differential, but since PA's income tax is 3.07%, that's not true.

The best I can say about this from the Phils perspective:
1. It could work out
2. If YoungV2012 is his new talent level, he's not that far off Kevin Fransden.
   23. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 08, 2012 at 09:00 PM (#4320118)
My hope is that in the Phils' first ten starts versus LHP Ryan Howard will go 2 for 40 with 35 strikeouts, and 3B Michael Young will go 20 for 40 and commit 35 errors. Platoon them, Charlie! Every day is Frandsen day!
   24. NattyBoh Posted: December 08, 2012 at 09:59 PM (#4320142)
I heard that it was for the income tax differential, but since PA's income tax is 3.07%, that's not true.


Yes, it is. There's no income tax in Texas AND there's a 3.5% tax on non-residents in Philly.
   25. Sean Forman Posted: December 09, 2012 at 02:32 PM (#4320347)
Every day is Frandsen day!


31-year-old Kevin Frandsen with < 900 career PA's? No thank you.
   26. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 09, 2012 at 02:43 PM (#4320349)
OK, make it Frandsen 3B / Young 1B against lefties, and Young 3B / Howard 1B against righties.
   27. Dan Posted: December 09, 2012 at 03:09 PM (#4320353)
Why not just platoon Ruf at 1b with Howard and get an actual competent LFer in there against LHP for a defensive upgrade?

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Don Malcolm
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogNo, Alex Gordon wouldn't have scored an inside the park home run
(135 - 3:35am, Oct 31)
Last: baxter

NewsblogSend Alex Gordon! | FiveThirtyEight
(82 - 3:11am, Oct 31)
Last: baxter

NewsblogFull Count » Red Sox sign Koji Uehara to 2-year contract
(10 - 2:49am, Oct 31)
Last: Dan

NewsblogNewest Hall of Fame Candidates Announced
(52 - 2:35am, Oct 31)
Last: Sunday silence

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread - October 2014
(630 - 2:05am, Oct 31)
Last: madvillain

NewsblogOT: NBC.news: Valve isn’t making one gaming console, but multiple ‘Steam machines’
(1021 - 1:53am, Oct 31)
Last: The Anthony Kennedy of BBTF (Scott)

NewsblogJoe Maddon is to become Cubs manager, sources say
(108 - 1:49am, Oct 31)
Last: Sunday silence

NewsblogOT: Politics, October 2014: Sunshine, Baseball, and Etch A Sketch: How Politicians Use Analogies
(4785 - 12:40am, Oct 31)
Last: Joe Kehoskie

NewsblogThe Players' Tribune: Jeter: The Clean Up
(1 - 12:38am, Oct 31)
Last: Howie Menckel

NewsblogAngell: The Best
(17 - 12:33am, Oct 31)
Last: odds are meatwad is drunk

NewsblogThings we learned from the 2014 playoffs
(11 - 12:17am, Oct 31)
Last: bobm

NewsblogMadison Bumgarner, World Series legend - McCovey Chronicles
(103 - 12:15am, Oct 31)
Last: SoSHially Unacceptable

NewsblogFielding Bible
(2 - 11:24pm, Oct 30)
Last: Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee

NewsblogOT:  October 2014 - College Football thread
(544 - 11:11pm, Oct 30)
Last: Lance Reddick! Lance him!

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player: 1960 Discussion
(9 - 10:22pm, Oct 30)
Last: Chris Fluit

Page rendered in 0.3733 seconds
53 querie(s) executed