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Saturday, October 06, 2012

Denver Post: No decision on Rockies manager Jim Tracy expected now until next week

This might be one of those “we might say we want you back, but we REALLY want you gone” situations:

Tracy is analyzing all the issues discussed, making sure he’s comfortable with his role and the club’s direction moving forward following a franchise-worst 98-loss season.

The club is interested in bringing Tracy back for the final year of his contract — he’s guaranteed $1.4 million — but clearly it will be on their terms. There’s no deadline set for a decision, though one is early next week.

Mike Emeigh Posted: October 06, 2012 at 01:48 PM | 30 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: colorado

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   1. KJOK Posted: October 06, 2012 at 09:30 PM (#4257250)
I think you're exactly right. They'd probably love for him to just resign. I expect there will at least be major changes on the coaching staff if he chooses to stay, including at least one coach who can step in and manage when he inevitably is let go next June or July.

   2. Perry Posted: October 06, 2012 at 10:26 PM (#4257335)
FWIW, Renck has said in stories both yesterday and today that "to a man" the Rockies' players want him back.
   3. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 06, 2012 at 11:03 PM (#4257408)
Tracy's a terrible person, and any resolution to this situation that doesn't involve him being shoved through a fine mesh screen is much too good for him.
   4. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: October 06, 2012 at 11:06 PM (#4257412)
There aren't that many threads about Jim Tracy, but even so I think Vlad has written the exact same thing more times than Yankee Redneck.
   5. Jim Wisinski Posted: October 06, 2012 at 11:30 PM (#4257446)
The difference is that the opinion Vlad constantly repeats has some merit to it.
   6. Tom Nawrocki Posted: October 06, 2012 at 11:31 PM (#4257451)
I wonder what "on their terms" can mean, other than maybe replacing some coaches. Tom Runnels is the current bench coach, and I have no idea how well he's regarded by the various parties, but he doesn't seem to be a manager in waiting. So maybe they'll bring in someone like Brad Mills for that slot.

That's how Tracy got the job in the first place: He was Clint Hurdle's bench coach in 2009.
   7. Tyhand7 Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:01 AM (#4257502)
I wish the Rockies had the balls to actually fire someone.
   8. The District Attorney Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:17 AM (#4257516)
Didn't the Rockies explain that they didn't need to give Tracy an extension because they allegedly had a "handshake agreement" and he allegedly could be manager as long as he wanted?

This is what you get...
   9. puck Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:24 AM (#4257520)
I wonder what "on their terms" can mean, other than maybe replacing some coaches.

I don't know, but some of the other articles about these talks he's having with Geivett talk about going along with whatever shenanigans they decide they want to do next year--4 man rotation with 75-pitch limits, 5-man with 75-pitch limits except on Wednesdays, pitchers who throw cut 2-seamers but not sinking 2-seamers, etc.
   10. puck Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:26 AM (#4257522)
The difference is that the opinion Vlad constantly repeats has some merit to it.

Not much merit. Whatever happened in Pittsburgh, Tracy still hasn't done those things in Colorado.
   11. Jim (jimmuscomp) Posted: October 07, 2012 at 02:07 AM (#4257569)
Tracy was an idiot in LA too. It's not just Pittsburgh.
   12. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 07, 2012 at 08:27 AM (#4257598)
Not much merit. Whatever happened in Pittsburgh, Tracy still hasn't done those things in Colorado.


So he isn't down with stabbing friends in the back and bayoneting the wounded? Then why is he fine with firing whatever coaches they want if it'll buy him another year in the big chair?

If they bring him back in 2013, you'll see the real Tracy come out. Particularly if he feels like his back's against the wall. Expectations until now have been low enough that he didn't need to show his nasty side.
   13. SoSH U at work Posted: October 07, 2012 at 10:41 AM (#4257634)
If they bring him back in 2013, you'll see the real Tracy come out.


You've been saying pretty much the exact same thing every year since he was hired. But unlike Joey's regular proclamations of how Manny Ramirez was done, your guarantee doesn't ever have to come to pass.



   14. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: October 07, 2012 at 11:26 AM (#4257653)
I think the entire genesis for the fatwa against Jim Tracy is

A) In a near-psychotic lapse of basic human decency, he told Salomon Torres and Jack Wilson to come back early from paternity leave in mid-September, because missing both of them would mean he might be accused of fielding a not-strong-enough team against playoff contenders

B) In a near-criminal act of shameless nepotism, he brought in two of his ex-Dodger cronies (Mike Edwards and Jose Hernandez) to sit on the Pirates bench (instead of promising Pirates prospects who could have sat on the bench, like J.J. Furmaniak or whoever), and another ex-Dodger (Cesar Izturis) to be the backup shortstop, a role that he was if anything overqualified for.

C) "Taking the credit for successes and blaming others for failures". Now, the Pirates did not have any successes during his time in charge, but there are probably legitimate examples of the latter.

D) Sacrificing babies to Satan
   15. stanmvp48 Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:07 PM (#4257696)
Note to # 2 above : "FWIW, Renck has said in stories both yesterday and today that "to a man" the Rockies' players want him back.

Renck often uses the same phrases, thoughts etc. over and over.

The paragraph I pasted below has appeared word for word several days in a row. Great job if you can get it.

"Tracy is considered a strong strategist, but that role was minimized this season when the Rockies switched to a four-man rotation with starters on a 75-pitch limit followed by designated "piggyback" relievers. The Rockies have said they will use a five-man rotation next year, though the pitch count will be decided on a case-by-case basis"

   16. just plain joe Posted: October 07, 2012 at 12:16 PM (#4257702)
"Taking the credit for successes and blaming others for failures".


That sounds like Tracy learned his managerial style from the Leo Durocher handbook. Although, to be fair, that particular failing is endemic to many managers, and not just in sports. If that is true about Tracy I would think it would be difficult for him to engender much loyalty in his subordinates, what with them always having to worry about getting thrown under the bus.
   17. Tom Nawrocki Posted: October 07, 2012 at 01:57 PM (#4257868)
Then why is he fine with firing whatever coaches they want if it'll buy him another year in the big chair?


Really? This is an example of being a horrible human being? If your boss tells you that you need to make changes in some of the people who work for you, you're some kind of evil back stabber if you agree?

You've clearly decided not only that Jim Tracy is satanic, but that anything and everything he does can be interpreted, somehow, of his evilness. That's fine, but you should realize it's gone way beyond being convincing to anyone else.
   18. Tom Nawrocki Posted: October 07, 2012 at 01:58 PM (#4257870)
C) "Taking the credit for successes and blaming others for failures". Now, the Pirates did not have any successes during his time in charge, but there are probably legitimate examples of the latter.


Tracy went out of his way to give Clint Hurdle a lot of credit for the success of the 2009 Rockies.

Sometimes, people learn from their mistakes.
   19. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: October 07, 2012 at 04:23 PM (#4258184)

D) Sacrificing babies to Satan


Thereby ripping off Chris Truby's schtick wholesale. Shameless!
   20. Tripon Posted: October 07, 2012 at 04:48 PM (#4258201)
Jim Tracy is a piece of ####. If you need an example, just look at the way he handled the 2005 Dodger season by stabbing Paul Depodesta in the back and then running off to Pittsburgh when he realized that he went too far to stay in L.A.

Edit: Or Hee Seop Choi and the 1B situation.

Or starting Oscar Robles and putting him to hit 3rd. #### Jim Tracy.
   21. Tom Nawrocki Posted: October 07, 2012 at 06:01 PM (#4258321)
Well, Tracy just resigned, so it's pretty much academic now.
   22. KJOK Posted: October 07, 2012 at 06:06 PM (#4258334)
Score one for Geivett.

   23. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: October 07, 2012 at 06:07 PM (#4258336)
"next week" was going to start 8 hours from now! Tracy got the drop on them!
   24. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 07, 2012 at 06:34 PM (#4258430)
The difference is that the opinion Vlad constantly repeats has some merit to it.


Ya hear that Hal? Bud is letting you keep your money now! Loria is going to pass the hat after every game!
   25. Tripon Posted: October 07, 2012 at 08:01 PM (#4258565)
You know Joba, the Dodgers are probably going to have a $300 million payroll next year, and their fans aren't ######## about revenue sharing.
   26. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: October 07, 2012 at 08:49 PM (#4258602)
They will be once they realize the true victimization of their poor owners who painstakingly built their great franchise up from nothing.
   27. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 07, 2012 at 09:50 PM (#4258663)
You've been saying pretty much the exact same thing every year since he was hired.


I keep thinking that the Rockies are, at some point, going to start care about the management team doing a terrible job, and thus put pressure on the manager and GM. Managing in a bizarre, consequence-free environment, then of course Tracy has no incentive to be evil, since there's no need for him to cover up his failings.

Sometimes, people learn from their mistakes.


Yes, sometimes "people" do. Tracy doesn't qualify as such, for obvious reasons. He's about halfway between a creepy wax figurine and one of the homicidal cowboy robots from Westworld.

In a near-criminal act of shameless nepotism, he brought in two of his ex-Dodger cronies (Mike Edwards and Jose Hernandez) to sit on the Pirates bench (instead of promising Pirates prospects who could have sat on the bench, like J.J. Furmaniak or whoever), and another ex-Dodger (Cesar Izturis) to be the backup shortstop, a role that he was if anything overqualified for.


He bullied Littlefield into trading for Izturis in order to make him the starting shortstop down the stretch over a better player, Jack Wilson. He dragged in a bunch of ex-Dodger NRIs (Edwards, Hernandez, Franquelis Osoria, Elmer Dessens, etc.) and did his level best to maximize their playing time, often at the expense of better players. Hernandez, for example, was a career-long SS and 3B, and was in obvious physical decline as a 36-year-old. In spite of these facts, he received the bulk of his playing time as a Pirate at first base, so that Tracy wouldn't have to use the infinitely-more-skilled Craig Wilson (an actual first baseman capable of 1B-caliber production) at the position. And even when he was forced to play existing Pirates, he made creepy attempts to reshape them into doppelgängers of players who had played under him with the Dodgers:

Quite curiously, the shortcomings that Tracy had in personnel or instructional matters seemed to originate from his never-ending emotional tie with the 2004 Los Angeles Dodgers, the $100 million team he managed to the West Division title. He spoke about them incessantly, to the media and to the players. He even tried to recreate them, it seemed. Before Tracy had donned a Pirates uniform, in the winter of 2006, he met with center fielder Chris Duffy and told Duffy he should play like Dave Roberts, the Dodgers' leadoff man, even though all Duffy and Roberts had in common was being fast. Among the instructions: Duffy, a line-drive hitter, was told to pound the ball into the ground. He failed miserably, quit baseball for a month and has yet to recover. Tracy told shortstop Jack Wilson, a three-time runner-up for the Gold Glove, that he did not like his approach to ground balls, that it should be more like Cesar Izturis of the 2004 Dodgers. Wilson had his worst defensive year in 2006 and, at Tracy's behest, Izturis was acquired from the Chicago Cubs this past July. It was at Tracy's urging that Wilson nearly was traded to Detroit in late July, after which Wilson batted .401 in the season's final two months. There was more: Jose Castillo was told to be like Adrian Beltre. Bench players were told to be versatile like Jose Hernandez, who also was acquired. Even Tracy's batting orders were modeled based on profiles of the 2004 Dodgers. -Dejan Kovacevic, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, October 6, 2007


The most Jim Tracy moment of Tracy's entire tenure with the Pirates was this game. Top of the seventh, Pirates are up 7-3, John Grabow's in trouble, with one run in already and the bases loaded with two outs. Tony Clark, who'd hit 17 HR in 221 AB that year in his last hurrah is up at bat, and Tracy goes to the pen not for any of his usual high-leverage relievers, all of whom are fresh and waiting. No, he reaches for Marty McLeary, a 31-year-old fringe talent and try-hard type who'd just been called up a week before to act as the mopup guy, and who was carrying a 7.36 ERA and .946 OPS against from a handful of games earlier in the year. McLeary didn't have time to do a full warmup, so he just went out there half-cold to do or die for queen and country. Well, he died. Grooved a pitch, grand slam, tie game. Pirates eventually lose 9-8, and after the game, Tracy totally throws McLeary under the bus for failing to execute, because that's just the kind of shifty crapweasel he is.
   28. Tom Nawrocki Posted: October 08, 2012 at 12:00 AM (#4258838)
It's interesting to me that Tracy is evil if he lets his GM fire a coach or two (post 12), and he's evil if he bullies his GM into trading for players he wants (post 27). Basically, no matter what relationship he has with the front office, it's wrong.

   29. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 08, 2012 at 12:56 AM (#4258900)
It's interesting to me that Tracy is evil if he lets his GM fire a coach or two (post 12), and he's evil if he bullies his GM into trading for players he wants (post 27). Basically, no matter what relationship he has with the front office, it's wrong.


Tracy only has one kind of relationship with anyone, and it's the type of relationship that all narcissistic sociopaths have with their marks: imposing his will upon them, milking them for everything he can get, and then cutting them loose once they become an inconvenience. Tracy likes having his guys in place, but he doesn't like that as much as he likes not being fired, so if it's him and a loyal lieutenant going into the water, Tracy's the one who's going to end up wearing the life jacket, even if he has to tear it off of the other guy's body.
   30. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 08, 2012 at 02:34 AM (#4258932)
You know Joba, the Dodgers are probably going to have a $300 million payroll next year, and their fans aren't ######## about revenue sharing.


Well they've lived through the McCourt era, siphoning off Dodger revenue for the frivolous entertainment of plutocrats is nothing new for them.

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