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Thursday, November 16, 2017

Derek Jeter addresses Giancarlo Stanton rumors | MLB.com

That said, Jeter noted that the club has “some financial things we have to get in order,” a process that could begin with a trade of Stanton, who is owed $295 million over the next decade.

“This is an organization that’s been losing money for quite some time, so we have to turn it around,” Jeter said. “How we do that? It’s not clear. It’s easy to point the finger at him because he makes the most money, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that that’s the move that’s going to be made.

“We’re here [at the General Managers Meetings] like every other team, trying to figure out how we can make this organization better. No one has come out and said that we are specifically trading Giancarlo Stanton. We’re seeing the best way to make this organization successful, and we want it to be sustainable for a long time.”

Jim Furtado Posted: November 16, 2017 at 06:15 AM | 24 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: derek jeter, giancarlo stanton, marlins

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   1. Sean Forman Posted: November 16, 2017 at 09:12 AM (#5577113)
"Any Questions?"

"Yes, Derek if this is a business that has been losing money for quite some time why did you pay more than $1bn for it?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXnkFd373T4
   2. jmurph Posted: November 16, 2017 at 09:21 AM (#5577123)
Clapper must be delayed on the metro somewhere this morning, he hasn't yet chimed in to explain that Jeter will not in fact look to reduce payroll this year, contrary to these badly sourced reports.
   3. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:03 AM (#5577157)
“This is an organization that’s been losing money for quite some time, so we have to turn it around,”

As Sean says, this is simply unbelievable BS.
   4. Nasty Nate Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:15 AM (#5577167)
Clapper must be delayed on the metro somewhere this morning, he hasn't yet chimed in to explain that Jeter will not in fact look to reduce payroll this year, contrary to these badly sourced reports.
His corporate partners are making him not spend. That must be it! Saint Jetes wouldn't do that.
   5. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:21 AM (#5577172)
His corporate partners are making him not spend. That must be it! Saint Jetes wouldn't do that.


Well, it is their money.
   6. Jeff Frances the Mute Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:27 AM (#5577177)
As Sean says, this is simply unbelievable BS.

It is believable if you include their massive debt load.
   7. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:37 AM (#5577184)

It is believable if you include their massive debt load.


What did Loria do with the cash? You can't claim you're "losing money" if you leverage an asset up to the hilt, and pocket the loan proceeds.

If you're talking about the new owners, then WTF did they pay so much? If the business won't make money with a <50% debt capital structure, in the current low interest rate environment, you paid way, way, way too much.

   8. Sleepy's not going to blame himself Posted: November 16, 2017 at 12:15 PM (#5577316)
“How we do that? It’s not clear. It’s easy to point the finger at him because he makes the most money, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that that’s the move that’s going to be made.
So, basically, Jeter said nothing that really addresses the Giancarlo Stanton rumors. Other than reiterate that they might trade him, or might not.
   9. SoSH U at work Posted: November 16, 2017 at 12:17 PM (#5577321)
So, basically, Jeter said nothing that really addresses the Giancarlo Stanton rumors. Other than reiterate that they might trade him, or might not.


In other words, he's the same Derek Jeter as he was during his playing days.
   10. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 16, 2017 at 12:19 PM (#5577325)
So, basically, Jeter said nothing that really addresses the Giancarlo Stanton rumors. Other than reiterate that they might trade him, or might not.

Exactly. It's like 90% of the 'news' these days:

"I asked Person X the Burning Question that I had to ask Person X because I am a 'reporter,' and Person X gave exactly the non-answer that I knew he/she would give, and now I'm reporting it to you as 'news' because I'm a reporter. Media doing its job, yay!"
   11. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: November 16, 2017 at 01:39 PM (#5577421)
It is believable if you include their massive debt load.


Didn't a big chunk of the reported purchase price go directly to creditors, as opposed to Loria? IOW, aren't the answers to snapper's questions that Loria didn't get to pocket the loan proceeds and the new owners aren't carrying that debt load?
   12. The Yankee Clapper Posted: November 16, 2017 at 02:29 PM (#5577489)
So, basically, Jeter said nothing that really addresses the Giancarlo Stanton rumors. Other than reiterate that they might trade him, or might not.

Looks like they're listening to offers. I don't know if anything will come of it, but I continue to believe that the Marlins path to success is to focus on increasing revenues rather than cutting payroll. Stanton is their best asset, coming off his best season - promote the hell out of him and see where you are a year from now.
   13. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: November 16, 2017 at 02:30 PM (#5577491)
Just imagine the money GM could save if they stop the hugely expensive process of manufacturing automobiles and trucks. They would save billions!

How much Stanton makes is not, or should not be the issue. How much he brings in in excess of his expense is.
   14. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 16, 2017 at 02:46 PM (#5577508)
Didn't a big chunk of the reported purchase price go directly to creditors, as opposed to Loria? IOW, aren't the answers to snapper's questions that Loria didn't get to pocket the loan proceeds and the new owners aren't carrying that debt load?

Well, Loria got to pocket the money when he took the original loans.

He paid something like $100M for the franchise, and had $400M or so in debt. That's indicative of a huge cash-out refi.
   15. PreservedFish Posted: November 16, 2017 at 03:12 PM (#5577532)
Just imagine the money GM could save if they stop the hugely expensive process of manufacturing automobiles and trucks. They would save billions!


Sadly this analogy breaks down. GM doesn't get a huge subsidy just because it belongs to a federally approved monopoly with an aggressive revenue sharing scheme - but if it did, it might decide to cease making automobiles and concentrate on its modest lawnmower engine business.
   16. Ziggy: The Platonic Form of Russell Branyan Posted: November 16, 2017 at 03:13 PM (#5577536)
IIRC (which I might not) Loria took home about $900m in the deal and the rest went to creditors.

But anyway, it sounds like Jeter's partners decided that Loria's business model is a good one. And since it doesn't require competing, they might as well get rid of expensive players. Loria had to do something to appease the union, and eventually Jeter will too, but that doesn't mean that he's got to do it right away.
   17. Walt Davis Posted: November 16, 2017 at 08:04 PM (#5577726)
Stanton, Chen, Prado, Tazawa and Volquez are $68 M in 2018, $61 M in 2019 and $48 M in 2020. To get down to the rumored $55ish M per year payroll ... well, impossible really but they'd get close if they traded every other arb-eligible player and Gordon and Ziegler. Yellich, Ozuna, Realmuto, Bour all gone.

If the rumored goal is correct, they have no choice but to trade Stanton.
   18. Lassus Posted: November 16, 2017 at 08:22 PM (#5577736)
Derek Jeter addresses Giancarlo Stanton rumors | MLB.com

"Yes, we are dating."
   19. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: November 16, 2017 at 10:01 PM (#5577789)
$55ish M per year payroll


This feels like an incredibly low number in today's game. When did the last team have a payroll this low? The Astros a few years ago?
   20. Jeff Frances the Mute Posted: November 17, 2017 at 01:51 AM (#5577862)
If you're talking about the new owners, then WTF did they pay so much? If the business won't make money with a <50% debt capital structure, in the current low interest rate environment, you paid way, way, way too much.

They did this deal because they think they are going to get a big TV windfall in 2020 and are going to scrape by until then. If you include the preferred equity, that is technically not debt, they probably only have about 40% of real equity. I definitely think they paid too much, but they can probably make it work if they get the payroll below $90 million.
Didn't a big chunk of the reported purchase price go directly to creditors, as opposed to Loria? IOW, aren't the answers to snapper's questions that Loria didn't get to pocket the loan proceeds and the new owners aren't carrying that debt load?

~$900 million went to Loria. The new owners are responsible for the Marlins existing ~$400 million in debt. That is how they got to the $1.3 billion sale price. Snapper is almost assuredly correct that much, if not most, of that $400 million debt is money that was siphoned off to Loria and his family.
   21. TVerik, who wonders what the hell is "Ansky" Posted: November 17, 2017 at 04:57 AM (#5577865)
So, basically, Jeter said nothing that really addresses the Giancarlo Stanton rumors. Other than reiterate that they might trade him, or might not.


Perhaps it's my Jeter-to-English dictionary, but I thought it was a pretty strong statement of intent.

Of course they aren't gonna trade him unless the return is substantial. But the fact that Jeter says his name like that makes me agree with the Clap in #12. They're listening.
   22. Walt Davis Posted: November 17, 2017 at 06:31 PM (#5578251)
Per b-r, this year Oakland was at $52 and SD at $49. In 2016, Milw, Oak, SD and TB were all under $55. The 2014 Marlins were at $42 and the 2013 version at an amazing $25. Their 2017 payroll was about a $40 M increase on 2015-16 so I'll assume that the new ownership wants to at least get it down to 2015-16 levels (low 70s). I didn't check the accuracy of b-r's arb estimates, but they put the 2018 Marlins at $131 M so even low 70s will be a feat without trading Stanton.
   23. Jeff Frances the Mute Posted: November 17, 2017 at 07:02 PM (#5578260)
Per b-r, this year Oakland was at $52 and SD at $49. In 2016, Milw, Oak, SD and TB were all under $55. The 2014 Marlins were at $42 and the 2013 version at an amazing $25. Their 2017 payroll was about a $40 M increase on 2015-16 so I'll assume that the new ownership wants to at least get it down to 2015-16 levels (low 70s). I didn't check the accuracy of b-r's arb estimates, but they put the 2018 Marlins at $131 M so even low 70s will be a feat without trading Stanton.

The Marlins are (allegedly) trying to lower payroll by ~$55 million to get to an $85 million payroll.
   24. Khrushin it bro Posted: November 17, 2017 at 07:38 PM (#5578272)
From Cot's (http://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/al-west/oakland-athletics/)

They have been over $80 million for 4 years.

ATHLETICS PAYROLLS

Year 25-man Opening Day 40-man Year End (rank)
2017 $ 81,738,333 $ ( )
2016 $ 86,806,234 $101,408,603 (27)
2015 $ 83,889,167 $ 84,191,119 (26)
2014 $ 82,320,900 $ 91,615,851 (23)
2013 $ 61,964,500 $ 71,075,550 (27)
2012 $ 52,873,000 $ 59,493,290 (30)
2011 $ 67,094,000 $ 70,476,206 (23)
2010 $ 58,304,900 $ 61,773,644 (26)
2009 $ 62,310,000 $ 61,688,124 (27)
2008 $ 47,967,126 $ 55,223,294 (27)

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