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Thursday, May 17, 2012

Dodd: Manny Ramirez gets hero’s welcome in Triple A

Dodd frank. Reform!

So we have a question for the River Cats. What message are you sending to kids when you promote a two-time drug cheat? The same one that dads send to their kids when they give a standing ovation to a player returning from drug suspension—steroids, cocaine back in the ‘80s, or other. When the player has done nothing to rehabilitate his standing, maybe with some community work?

Seems the message is clear: We don’t care about your character, kid, as long as you can paint the corner of the plate at 98 mph, or take that fastball over the wall in left-center.

End of rant. Thank you.

Repoz Posted: May 17, 2012 at 06:18 PM | 30 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
Tags: athletics

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1. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: May 17, 2012 at 06:38 PM (#4134288)

Manny Ramirez did this.

And he did this. He reacted to it by doing this. And he described it thusly.

Manny Ramirez is a bad man and an American hero.

2. phredbird

Posted: May 17, 2012 at 06:43 PM (#4134290)

End of rant.

good.

3. Dr. Vaux Posted: May 17, 2012 at 06:44 PM (#4134291)

Seems the message is clear: We don’t care about your character, kid

Why can't the message be: We don't think taking steroids makes you a bad person, and besides that, it's not proven that you did use them?

4. cardsfanboy

Posted: May 17, 2012 at 07:13 PM (#4134315)

When we see people fawning over Josh Hamilton, it makes these little rants even more ridiculous. At least Manny's drug use could be seen as helpful to the team.

Note: I'm not saying that we need to hate Hamilton or anything like that.

I do find it funny that when a player cuts his own finger off, in order to play a game(injuring himself for the team) it's seen as a hard core competitor, but when a person risks his "life"(according to anti-roid zealots) by taking PED's. it's seen as something less than noble. Both are risking their future health for performance today.

5. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 17, 2012 at 07:14 PM (#4134316)

It is disgraceful and repugnant for a player to amorally exploit the specific reinstatement process designed to handle his circumstances.

6. Dave Spiwak Posted: May 17, 2012 at 07:30 PM (#4134340)

Serious question: what message does it send to kids when someone is suspended for human chorionic gonadotropin? My kid is 3, so we're not going to be discussing PEDs anytime soon -- but doping is such an advanced art that athletes and laypeople alike don't know much about its intricacies.

7. Joey B. has ignited his October #Natitude Posted: May 17, 2012 at 07:51 PM (#4134363)

Serious question: what message does it send to kids when someone is suspended for human chorionic gonadotropin?

Pretty much the exact same message that gets sent when someone is punished for anything: there are certain rules that people in a society have to live by, and there are consequences for breaking those rules.

Now if you feel that taking human chorionic gonadotropin shouldn't be against the rules, that's certainly your right, but the majority of society disagrees. And not just American society; most of the world decided a while ago that performance enhancing drugs have no place in fair and honest athletic competition.

8. puck Posted: May 17, 2012 at 07:59 PM (#4134368)

Manny Ramirez is a bad man and an American hero.

"When you don't feel good and you still get hits...that's when you know you are a bad man."

That is hilarious.

9. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: May 17, 2012 at 08:10 PM (#4134387)

Seems the message is clear: We don’t care about your character, kid, as long as you can paint the corner of the plate at 98 mph, or take that fastball over the wall in left-center.

We're getting closer to the day when a wadded-panties media declares the real problem with baseball is the fans.

10. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: May 17, 2012 at 08:21 PM (#4134397)

I don't use the word "hero" very often, but Manny Ramirez is the greatest hero in American history.

When we see people fawning over Josh Hamilton, it makes these little rants even more ridiculous.

Maybe Manny should say his PED use is a disease.

11. base ball chick Posted: May 17, 2012 at 09:14 PM (#4134447)

the manny done the crime, done his time, no parole. so what is this writer screeching about?

and i have a lot of sympathy for people trying to get pregnant and obviously this guy doddn't

12. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: May 17, 2012 at 09:20 PM (#4134450)

Serious question: what message does it send to kids when someone is suspended for human chorionic gonadotropin? My kid is 3, so we're not going to be discussing PEDs anytime soon -- but doping is such an advanced art that athletes and laypeople alike don't know much about its intricacies.

Serious answer? Wikipedia is your friend:

Human chorionic gonadotropin or human chorionic gonadotrophin (hCG) is a hormone produced during pregnancy that is made by the developing embryo after conception, and later by the placental component syncytiotrophoblast. ... The pituitary analog of hCG, known as luteinizing hormone (LH), is produced in the pituitary gland of males and females of all ages. ... Human chorionic gonadotropin interacts with the LHCG receptor and promotes the maintenance of the corpus luteum during the beginning of pregnancy, causing it to secrete the hormone progesterone. Progesterone enriches the uterus with a thick lining of blood vessels and capillaries so that it can sustain the growing fetus. ... Because of its similarity to LH, hCG can also be used clinically to induce ... testosterone production in the testes.

13. Walt Davis Posted: May 17, 2012 at 09:32 PM (#4134461)

We don’t care about your character, kid, as long as you can paint the corner of the plate at 98 mph, or take that fastball over the wall in left-center.

Yep.

Baseball has been sending this message since the first time a local pub owner slipped a guy $1 to play for the local nine back in 1866.

Also cue Bill Conlin comparison.

14. JE (Jason Epstein)

Posted: May 17, 2012 at 10:21 PM (#4134516)

Ramirez, of course, retired from the Tampa Bay Devil Rays last season rather than serve a 100-game suspension for his second positive test for performance-enhancing drugs.

(Emphasis mine.)

I wonder if Todd added the "Devil" on purpose.

15. Kurt Posted: May 17, 2012 at 10:37 PM (#4134535)

Seems the message is clear: We don’t care about your character, kid, as long as you can paint the corner of the plate at 98 mph, or take that fastball over the wall in left-center.

This, and its corollary (being able to paint the corner of the plate at 98 mph or take that fastball over the wall in left-center doesn't make you a better or worse human being than anyone else), seem like pretty damn good messages for kids to learn.

16. BWV 1129 Posted: May 18, 2012 at 01:55 AM (#4134606)

Am I missing something here? I'm pretty forgiving of the alleged PED users before it was banned by rule; I consider that usage part of the game at the time. But Manny knowingly broke the rules twice. I think that's pretty damning.

He also attacked an old man because he couldn't get enough tickets. This is an honorable, respectable person? He's a rule-breaker and a bully. I'm not sure why we should just be laughing him off.

17. KT's Pot Arb Posted: May 18, 2012 at 02:20 AM (#4134618)

Because he's been punished. In fact, he's had to miss extra games cause he retired then changed his mind. No one is saying he's a great person, what baseball player is? Josh Hamilton, when he's not channelling the Mick with a young lady in a honey tonk's bathroom?

18. BWV 1129 Posted: May 18, 2012 at 02:36 AM (#4134623)

I'm not saying he doesn't have a right to come back. I'm just not sure why we should be celebrating him.

19. PreservedFish Posted: May 18, 2012 at 02:42 AM (#4134625)

It's fun to watch him play baseball.

20. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 18, 2012 at 03:37 AM (#4134631)

Before Manny Ramirez pulled his bad shit -- back in 1999, say, or 2004 -- was one speck of his acclaim for being an honorable, respectable person? Haven't there been enough counterexamples of shining heroes (e.g. Rose, Garvey, Gooden, Puckett, McGwire) that anyone should have gotten past the premise long ago? At least the BBWAA turns a buck on the illusion and another buck on dismantling it; they've got an excuse.

21. BWV 1129 Posted: May 18, 2012 at 03:41 AM (#4134632)

But some of Manny's malfeasances -- like Rose's -- actually violated rules of the game.

22. PreservedFish Posted: May 18, 2012 at 04:08 AM (#4134634)

Maybe it's the tedium of the steroid debates on this very site, but I just don't care about the issue. Manny was one of the most talented and fun players in baseball. He was a joy to watch. Can't that be enough?

23. BWV 1129 Posted: May 18, 2012 at 04:22 AM (#4134635)

Sure. It's just a bit odd to me that we have a column where someone's all "This guy got caught cheating, maybe we shouldn't celebrate him" and a bunch of people get angry with him because he doesn't see Manny as being as fun, or whatever.

I mean, I don't even care about steroids, really. It just strikes me as odd, is all.

24. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 18, 2012 at 04:42 AM (#4134641)

Serious question: what message does it send to kids when someone is suspended for human chorionic gonadotropin?

It teaches them a valuable lesson: that there are a lot of fascist morons in the world.

25. Justin T is expanding the aperture of awareness Posted: May 18, 2012 at 04:46 AM (#4134642)

This guy's article consists of whining about a AAA team trying to capitalize on the rare opportunity they have to showcase a player of this sort. Trying to sell some tickets. They should be ashamed? They're supposed to hold their noses while this guy comes through town?

Offering ticket packages built around his time with the team is not celebrating him. Nor is it a "questionable promotion". It's business.

"Bring an empty creatine container, get two free tickets" would be a questionable promotion.

26. KT's Pot Arb Posted: May 18, 2012 at 01:24 PM (#4135031)

But some of Manny's malfeasances -- like Rose's -- actually violated rules of the game.

So that's why I felt so bad every time I watch a game with a spit-baller, or a pitcher doctoring the ball, or Jose Molina framing balls into strikes, or a team stealing signs, esp. from the outfield with binoculars.

I saw Manny smoke a home run over the center-field fence in spring training. Somehow, I didn't feel bad watching it, just the opposite. Not sure what is wrong with me.

27. The Yankee Clapper Posted: May 18, 2012 at 02:47 PM (#4135118)

Manny knowingly broke the rules twice. I think that's pretty damning.

He also attacked an old man because he couldn't get enough tickets. This is an honorable, respectable person? He's a rule-breaker and a bully. I'm not sure why we should just be laughing him off.

Manny also overflowed a clubhouse toilet after wiping his butt with a bath towel. A very bad man.

28. Jittery McFrog Posted: May 18, 2012 at 03:10 PM (#4135145)

It's just a bit odd to me that we have a column where someone's all "This guy got caught cheating, maybe we shouldn't celebrate him" and a bunch of people get angry with him because he doesn't see Manny as being as fun, or whatever.

Well, the author's criticizing the crowd's reaction. I'm guessing the crowd went to the baseball game to have fun. Watching Manny hit is fun. Cheering for Manny's hitting is fun. That's the connection to fun. It doesn't seem terribly odd to me.

29. Kurt Posted: May 18, 2012 at 03:20 PM (#4135153)

I'm just not sure why we should be celebrating him.

Why should we celebrate any baseball player?

30. Heinie Mantush (Krusty) Posted: May 18, 2012 at 03:38 PM (#4135172)

Based on this thread, you'd think Manny was Hurricane Carter.

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Dodd: Manny Ramirez gets hero’s welcome in Triple A

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