Billy Bean never should have made that announcement.

Torre can't stop talking about AFraud.

Torre: I’d have no problem.

The only problem Torre would have with a gay player would be if he tried to steal Jeter away from Joe

That was A-Rod's big mistake

Good for Joe. And I suspect he's right.

Provided the first gay ballplayer isn't a disliked guy such as Pierogi or Arod, then the first gay player will be a real person his teammates and opponents already know and generally respect, not the anonymous gay man envisioned in the hypothetical questions.

In the spirit of all those Primates who are wishing for Jeter to be outed for juicing, I hope that the next player we discover to be gay is Rocker.

Taking the cream is not illegal. No matter what "Fey" Vincent said.

I hope that the next player we discover to be gay is Rocker.

Can I just say that "Rocker" would not be the way I would have finished that sentence?

Didn't this interview take place several days ago?

I know one thing: a gay player is not going to confide privately in Joe Torre and risk having Torre blab about it to sell a book.

Can I just say that "Rocker" would not be the way I would have finished that sentence?

LOL.

Didn't this interview take place several days ago?

I know one thing: a gay player is not going to confide privately in Joe Torre and risk having Torre blab about it to sell a book.


Yeah, but Jon Wiseman kinda pointed out that this got loss in all of the hub bub with the book and then A-Rod. Seems like something that should be pointed out.

Can I just say that "Rocker" would not be the way I would have finished that sentence?

If you say, "Brad Ausmus," bbc may <strike>never forgive you</strike> kill you.

Edited for accuracy.

I hope that the next player we discover to be gay is Rocker.

I'll take Robby Alomar for $1000 Alex...

Doubt it. You can get AIDS from girls, too, y'know.

If, for the point of argument, he was gay, then why would he waste all that time keeping up appearances by having sex with the woman he allegedly infected instead of with other dudes?

Can I just say that "Rocker" would not be the way I would have finished that sentence?

We all know you're a Mota guy.

Glenn Burke.

And, Lasorda and Billy Martin sure seemed to have a problem with it.

Wouldn't A-Rod be the PERFECT guy to come out of the closet? People already give him 10 times as much grief over things as he deserves and he's demonstrated the ability to play great baseball year in and year out despite the abuse. Really, if he came out this afternoon how much MORE grief would he get than what he's already going to endure in 2009?

I always found it hard to believe that anyone could hide their sexual preference for long in such a relatively small (and intimate) work environment. No wife, no steady girlfriend, no series of one night stands, no pictures of girls on your cell phone or in your wallet, no interest in getting lucky at the clubs and hotel bars, furtive time spent outside the hotel room - does it really take a Sherlock Holmes?

But if your the teammate that knows, it's not your business so you don't make a big deal about it. Just like they don't make a big deal about your PEDs and your mistresses.

Wouldn't A-Rod be the PERFECT guy to come out of the closet?

Perfect for whom? Red Sox fans? To give them one more thing to mock him about?

I think the first openly gay baseball player has to be someone invincible. A Cal Ripken-type player. I'm not sure who fits that mold today. I don't think Jeter could do it, he still generates too much backlash.

If, for the point of argument, he was gay, then why would he waste all that time keeping up appearances by having sex with the woman he allegedly infected instead of with other dudes?

These things are not necessarily binary.

Perfect for whom? Red Sox fans? To give them one more thing to mock him about?

I think the first openly gay baseball player has to be someone invincible. A Cal Ripken-type player. I'm not sure who fits that mold today. I don't think Jeter could do it, he still generates too much backlash.

Ichiro!? Papi Ortiz?

Wouldn't A-Rod be the PERFECT guy to come out of the closet?

you're right--in fact, ARod should come out of the closet even if he ISN'T gay

(he owes it to us)

I think the first openly gay baseball player has to be someone invincible. A Cal Ripken-type player. I'm not sure who fits that mold today. I don't think Jeter could do it, he still generates too much backlash.

Utley? Puojls? Sabathia, maybe before, but you can't be a Yankee and invincible.

Chris Truby?

I think the first openly gay baseball player has to be someone invincible.

Roy Hobbs. That would explain why he acted so weird when Glenn Close was around.

I think it would be awesome if Lincecum came out, heard garbage for a week, and then proceeded to whiff 15, 17, and 19 in his next three starts.

When Mussina was asked a few years ago whether he would play with a gay teammate, he said, "I assume I already have."

Roy Hobbs. That would explain why he acted so weird when Glenn Close was around.

Hobbs isn't gay--he was just acting weird because he had seen Fatal Attraction

That Mussina is *such* a whore. No HoF for him!

When Mussina was asked a few years ago whether he would play with a gay teammate, he said, "I assume I already have."

*checks*

nope, Mussina was never on the same team as Mike Piazza, not even an All-Star team. Moving on.

When Mussina was asked a few years ago whether he would play with a gay teammate, he said, "I assume I already have."

Timlin said pretty conclusively he has and it wasn't a big deal, which is odd because Timlin is also someone who has stated his disapproval of homosexuality.

I think the first openly gay baseball player has to be someone invincible. A Cal Ripken-type player. I'm not sure who fits that mold today. I don't think Jeter could do it, he still generates too much backlash.

I was thinking Robbie Alomar, but then again maybe not.

In the spirit of all those Primates who are wishing for Jeter to be outed for juicing, I hope that the next player we discover to be gay is Rocker.

ditto on both

Jeter because of the mancrush so many NYC mediots have on him, and Rocker, because he's just such a living breathing redneck stereotype.

and Rocker, because he's just such a living breathing redneck stereotype.

but he's got a purty mouth...

I was thinking Robbie Alomar, but then again maybe not.

for some reason there were rumors floating around last year that Robbie Cano was gay

Timlin said pretty conclusively he has and it wasn't a big deal, which is odd because Timlin is also someone who has stated his disapproval of homosexuality.

Reality often has this happy effect on stupidity.

Timlin said pretty conclusively he has and it wasn't a big deal, which is odd because Timlin is also someone who has stated his disapproval of homosexuality.

Well, it being odd assumes the only way to "disapprove" of homosexuality is loud and angry. I have about the same number of co-workers as a MLB player (give or take) and I work well with a lot of people with whom I have strong disagreements (and, in some cases, what I would call disapproval of their lifestyle choices)* and yet this isn't what we talk about. We talk about work and small-talk. On occasion we have thoughtful discussions about meaningful topics. Given the atmosphere and type of job, there may be more heated tension in a clubhouse but I certainly can imagine decent people working together with people they don't like or don't approve of.

FWIW, I'm sure some of my co-workers don't approve of how I live my life.


* Mostly religion. Take two players, one a devout, conservative Christian and the other a drinking, womanizing atheist (not that the atheist must have these traits, just for argument). Can these two not work/play together even as they disapprove of their respective lifestyle choices? Of course they can - they do in pretty much every clubhouse in the US. I would assume it would be fairly similar with an out-homosexual. Sure, there will be some loud, obnoxious types who make life uncomfortable for all involved but the majority response, I'd guess would be professional treatment. I wouldn't volunteer to be the first openly gay player as there would be a lot of unpleasantness but I don't think (and this isn't to minimize it) that he would experience anything close to what Jackie Robinson did.

Timlin said pretty conclusively he has and it wasn't a big deal, which is odd because Timlin is also someone who has stated his disapproval of homosexuality.

You don't know anyone you get along with whose, say, politics you disapprove of?

He is merely setting the table for Don Zimmer to come out of the closet.

and Robbie Cano rumors? It was based on the fact he hit like a girl for most of the year.

Take two players, one a devout, conservative Christian and the other a drinking, womanizing atheist (not that the atheist must have these traits, just for argument). Can these two not work/play together even as they disapprove of their respective lifestyle choices? Of course they can

Unless that devout, conservative Christian is Chad Curtis.

Reality often has this happy effect on stupidity.

Yes, but he said those comments publicly in the order you wouldn't expect. In 2002, he claimed "I already have, knowingly, and it wasn't a problem." His anti-gay comments were delivered after Millar and the other Sox went on Queer Eye in 2005.

Either he was born-again during that time frame, which altered his view of homosexuality, or he's able to separate his own feelings on homosexuality from how others' homosexuality impacts the work environment in a way few seem able to.

Timlin said pretty conclusively he has and it wasn't a big deal, which is odd because Timlin is also someone who has stated his disapproval of homosexuality.

I generally disapprove of homosexuality and yet when I had a gay roommate, it wasn't a big deal. I really didn't care.

No wife, no steady girlfriend, no series of one night stands, no pictures of girls on your cell phone or in your wallet, no interest in getting lucky at the clubs and hotel bars

Geez... then again, maybe everyone just assumes that I'm gay.

Yes, but he said those comments publicly in the order you wouldn't expect.

Ah. Well.

I got nuthin'.


I generally disapprove of homosexuality and yet when I had a gay roommate, it wasn't a big deal. I really didn't care.

Why not have it not be a big deal and not care generally, then, as opposed to disapproving generally, as you say you do? That doesn't seem to make sense.

I always found it hard to believe that anyone could hide their sexual preference for long in such a relatively small (and intimate) work environment. No wife, no steady girlfriend, no series of one night stands, no pictures of girls on your cell phone or in your wallet, no interest in getting lucky at the clubs and hotel bars, furtive time spent outside the hotel room - does it really take a Sherlock Holmes?

A gay player could have a wife or girlfriend, could pretend to hit on girls at the bars (or not go to them at all), could have a boyfriend or husband back home and not need to spend furtive time outside the hotel room.

Hopefully when a gay ballplayer goes public it is not in a situation where he is being sued for secretly having AIDS and knowingly transmitting it to people.

Why not have it not be a big deal and not care generally, then, as opposed to disapproving generally, as you say you do? That doesn't seem to make sense.

One can morally oppose a behavior while still believing that the person who practices it deserves to be treated with dignity and common courtesy.

This is pretty much the Christian message with regard to all sin (hate the sin, love the sinner). Of course, people often do a poor job of living up to this.

Even Vito from "The Sopranos" got outed eventually.

When this discussion came up before someone suggested that the first active player to come out will be a marginal type of guy (like Billy Bean, for instance) who makes the rational decision that there's more money to be made in book deals and speaking engagements than in his baseball career. IOW, when it finally happens it's going to be a real disappointment.

One can morally oppose a behavior while still believing that the person who practices it deserves to be treated with dignity and common courtesy.

A moral opposition to homosexuality strikes me as so null-set nonsensical that I have a hard time basing any kind of logical conclusion on it, I guess.

Even Vito from "The Sopranos" got outed eventually.

Well we can only hope that our closeted big leaguer will know better than prancing about in leather in a public watering hole.

One can morally oppose a behavior while still believing that the person who practices it deserves to be treated with dignity and common courtesy.

A moral opposition to homosexuality strikes me as so null-set nonsensical that I have a hard time basing any kind of logical conclusion on it, I guess.

my sense of it has always been that too-vocal opposition to gays disguises certain insecurities, and these are people one can dismiss. the people who can be level-headed and treat gays with respect while disapproving of them make me more nervous. they've drunk the koolaid and actually believe they are right about something.

When this discussion came up before someone suggested that the first active player to come out will be a marginal type of guy (like Billy Bean, for instance) who makes the rational decision that there's more money to be made in book deals and speaking engagements than in his baseball career.

Was that discussion just after that exact scenario happened with the first NBA player to come out? (well, he came out on the occasion of his retirement, I think)

Was that discussion just after that exact scenario happened with the first NBA player to come out?

That was John Amaechi.
And, yes, there was a book to be sold.

Take two players, one a devout, conservative Christian and the other a drinking, womanizing atheist (not that the atheist must have these traits, just for argument). Can these two not work/play together even as they disapprove of their respective lifestyle choices? Of course they can

I can't recall where I read it, but a veteran ballplayer was interviewed about gays in the sport. He said he's played with homosexuals and he's played with evangelicals - and by far the evangelicals cause more clubhouse problems.

No wife, no steady girlfriend, no series of one night stands, no pictures of girls on your cell phone or in your wallet, no interest in getting lucky at the clubs and hotel bars

Yes except I've known many of gay men who dated, or even married and fathered children. Heck I know several "gay" men who while identified as gay most of their adult life, and felt guilt about also being attracted to women as well. While also knowing “lesbians” who hook up with a guy one night then feel the need the next day to prove their butchness by hitting on more women. Or “straight” men who figure they are still straight as long as they don’t say I love you to the guy give them a BJ or if they only fool around with guys while they are drunk. Sexuality (especially with a little booze or money mixed in) becomes very blurred for a lot of people.

Sexuality (especially with a little booze or money mixed in)...

I like it when my client pays me with money she's dunked in her Cosmo.