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Not that I'm complaining, as a Phillies fan, but still I don't see why the Braves would move Marte.
If anyone is interested, I'll put 20 bucks on Marte outhitting Renteria next year, as long as Andy gets 250 PA in the big leagues.
Is it illegal or merely unethical to use Jedi mind tricks on other GMs?
this is the absolute suck.
So we move from Betemit, Chipper/Laroche/Marte platoon at the corners to Renteria, laroche/chipper/betemit platoon at the corners for $8 mil more. screw that.
As I mentioned in the other thread, we can no longer even make fun of the Mutts :-(
The Millwood deal looked bad on talent, but at least the money went the right way. This looks bad on money and talent.
Ned Flanders: Dear Lord. That's the loudest profanity I've ever heard.
Also, I heard Gammons say that Marte was 4th on the Braves depth chart at 3B, who are #'s 2 and 3?
betimet ... and julio franco?
shut up.
this sucks.
this sucks.
this sucks.
this sucks.
Marte?! Are you kidding me?!
I had figured that he had an off year in 2005 and that was the reason that his stock seems to have fallen. He had an 878 OPS in AAA at age 21! I mean that isn't as good as David Wright or Miguel Cabrera but they aren't the standard.
gammons being an idiot..
Marte was #2 on the depth chart behind Chipper. You could say Betemit last year was ahead of him..
We have a 3B prospect in low A, Campbell. Noone else close.
Odalis Perez? Jason Marquis? Juan Cruz? Not stars, but not chopped liver, those guys. I don't think we can promise that Dan Meyer won't haunt the Braves either. And Renteria is no Sheff, Drew or Huds.
and it was a down year cos he had put up 889 OPS at AA at age 20!
And he did that with a foot injury
JD Drew: Jason Marquis, Ray King, Adam Wainwright
Hudson: Chuckie Thomas, Juan Cruz, Dan Meyer.
Which of those players is even nearly Marte's equivalent as a prospect, OFF? If the Mets did this trade, you would be screaming to the high heavens.
I hate to keep repeating myself, but Mora for Marte would have made a lot of sense. Mora's spent a fair amount of time at SS, and probably isn't much worse defensively than Renteria.
They are sticking with Betamit. He didn't get traded anywhere. He will still be on the roster. He'll probably play short if Renteria can't go, and will definately play third, because even if Chipper is injury free, the Braves will rest him.
My guess is that everyone really hopes that is the case. What the Braves likely believe is that Betamit would not outfield Renteria if he had to play SS for the entire season.
The Braves have never given up a prospect as good as Marte.
Who would be the BoSox shortstop right now if that deal doesn't happen? Machado?
Also, what would the Red Sox do with Marte if they keep him? Move Youkilis to first? Deal Youkilis?
Rumor yesterday was 5-6M.
I'm completely shocked.
They did make this trade... how quickly we forget.
I'm guessing they trade Clement for Zach Duke, Wells for Rich Harden, and then they trade Manny Ramirez and Mike Lowell for Grady Sizemore, Jhonny Peralta, and Coco Crisp. Then they'll sign them all to extensions.
Roger Clemens.
I'm assuming that's 5-6M total, not per year, right?
The problem is that that's over four years. Nothing this year, $1M each of the next two, and then the $3M buyout after that. That means the Braves are paying 8/11/11 over the next three years for a SS who looks like he's declining fast.
And fair or not, I think you have to wonder a bit about any player who fell off a cliff last season. What were they doing the years before?
Renteria fell off a cliff two years ago. A huge cliff. He actually improved a little bit last year.
Yeah, total.
And fair or not, I think you have to wonder a bit about any player who fell off a cliff last season.
Renteria was actually slightly better in 2005 than in 2004.
The Red Sox are now expected to sign a free-agent shortstop to replace Renteria rather than pursue a trade with the Devil Rays for Julio Lugo, as had been rumored the last couple of days here at the winter meetings.
By "last season," do you mean 2005? B/c Renteria didn't fall off a cliff this year. His 2005 was almost exactly the same as his 2004.
That depends on who you ask and when you ask them. If you ask A's fans, Danny Meyer is the best prospect ever. If you ask the Braves management, you would probably see they were higher on Jason Marquis then just about any pitcher that has come through their system, even refusing to give him up in the Sheffield deal.
Of course, you can ask baseball america, it seemed that they thought Bruce Chen was a better prospect when he was packaged with Jimmy Osting for Andy Ashby.
And Mark Loretta has played 328 games at SS (though not for a few years), and is -2 FRAA there for his career. He's much better at 2B, of course: +38 FRAA for his career.
Still, as a stopgap SS while Pedroia gets comfortable there again for a couple months in Pawtucket, that might not be a bad thing to do.
An eventual left side of the IF with Marte and Pedroia might not be too bad. I think I'd rather consider '06 a rebuilding year with that in prospect than watch Lugo and Huff.
Offical Friend of JWH, solid glove, righty bat (which matches with Cora's lefty bat).
Limited interest and therefore likely not to cost too much in years or dollars.
My guess is that the Yankees sign Damon for 6 years, $60 million, within the next couple days.
Hey, Nomar's available.
Other than that -
Royce Clayton
Alex Gonzalez
Rey Sanchez
Chris Gomez
Anyone else? Is Pokey Reese done, or what?
Considering that Paul Konerko got $60 Million for five years, I think it would take more to get Damon for six.
Manny to the Dodgers for Drew and Izturis, no money changing hands?
Though, that rumor was around yesterday.
Though, that rumor was around yesterday.
If Tampa would take that deal, why didn't the Braves just send Marte and Ramirez (or Davies) for Baez and Huff?
true...so replace "$60 million" with "a ton of money."
And fn Braves and fn Chipper Stripper Whipper. Fk them all.
Guys who play SS in college or even in the minors are routinely moved elsewhere by the time they make the big leagues (Pedroia), or banished from SS as they age (Loretta). OTOH, I've seen enough mediocre performers at short (glove and stick combined) to think that either of those guys might get an extended look.
Great trade for the Sox, especially in the long term. If they are in the playoff mix in July, they could rent-a-player if need be.
All hail GM by committee! It seems to be working better than bullpen by committee!
HANG ON TO MARTE! DON'T FLIP HIM FOR LUGO!
Tampa should do this in a heartbeat.
"What do you mean, you just traded Renteria to Atlanta? I just traded him to someone else!"
DB
nomar's days at shortstop appear to be numbered.
They break down the poll by state. I'm digging the red-green holiday motif.
</bitter Braves fan>
They did make this trade... how quickly we forget.
Nah, it's not Kazmir for Zambrano. More like Mora for Bordick. PWN3D.
That said, I frickin' love this trade for the Red Sox. Marte is a better prospect than Hanley, and should be a very good player very soon. Wow.
I just wanted to say that I see this deal as the Braves overpaying for a valuable commodity (Renteria 3/18), not giving up a #1 prospect for nothing. And, of course, every prospect traded by the Braves comes with the history of prospects who failed after leaving the Braves system.
But goddam I love this trade.
Mora was never considered the level of prospect that Marte has been. This would be David Wright for Bordick. This week.
They break down the poll by state. I'm digging the red-green holiday motif.
I like the random states that like Lugo the best. He probably is better than Renteria, but he's not much of a 'name'...and...Oregon and Wyoming? Is Lugo from one of those states or something?
One thing the sox can trade is money.
Life was so much more pleasant just a few days ago when I could imagine you'd been bludgeoned to death by a neighbor who'd gotten tired of your act.
OK, it looks like that's mostly due to a small sample size, on closer inspection.
I guess being a Braves fan as been too good for too long. It really sucks today.
Sample size issues, especially if Dick Cheney hasn't yet made it home for Christmas with his entourage.
Danny - the $29M breaks down as 8, 9, 9, 3(buyout). Rosenthal implies the Red Sox are responsible for the entire ($4M) signing bonus.
Also, for some reason I dislike that this thread takes me to Sox Therapy.
Beat you to it!
this could really hurt the Sox in the short term.
#### the short term!
They really should just give Pedroia the SS job. I think there's a decent chance he gives us as much production as Renteria did last year.
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