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Friday, August 10, 2018

Fancred Sports : Jon Heyman: Mets still plan to go outside for next GM, here are potential candidates being mentioned

Considering their payroll situation Cherington would be a good fit. Of course, he’s probably smart enough to wait for a better situation.

Jim Furtado Posted: August 10, 2018 at 07:46 PM | 13 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: ben cherington, mets

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   1. bobm Posted: August 11, 2018 at 02:21 PM (#5725150)
I know there are only 30 such jobs but IMO no decent GM takes this job without Manfred banning the Wilpons almost Frank-McCourt-style from baseball operations.
   2. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 11, 2018 at 03:11 PM (#5725156)
I know there are only 30 such jobs but IMO no decent GM takes this job without Manfred banning the Wilpons almost Frank-McCourt-style from baseball operations.

Why? If they're going to give you a 4 year contract at $4-5M per year, you take the damn job.

You do your best, and if they meddle too much, you make them fire you. A GM can always refuse ownerships' orders. Their only recourse is to fire you, which isn't much of a threat when you have a guaranteed contract.
   3. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 11, 2018 at 03:44 PM (#5725164)
A GM can always refuse ownerships' orders. Their only recourse is to fire you, which isn't much of a threat when you have a guaranteed contract.

That's probably an overbid, as outright insubordination might actually be grounds for terminating a GM's contract. But the overall point remains, it's not like the GM will personally lose money if ownership insists on signing Jose Reyes to a multi-year contract. Well, maybe on that playoff bonus clause. If you're an established GM, likely to have multiple offers, you probably pass on the Mets job unless its structured to your liking, but if you're a front office guy trying to break into the GM ranks, you take the job and hope for the best.
   4. akrasian Posted: August 11, 2018 at 03:52 PM (#5725168)
How many GM jobs a year open up - and how many of those already have somebody picked out for the opening?

Also, how many hot candidates one year remain hot in subsequent years, without other candidates surpassing them?

If there's a good job offer, you pretty much have to take it. You may never get another shot. Even if you do, will it be better than the Mets' offer?
   5. Walt Davis Posted: August 11, 2018 at 04:58 PM (#5725180)
Cherington hasn't been a GM/PBO for three seasons now, he's in no position to decline the offer of a top job.
   6. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 11, 2018 at 05:05 PM (#5725183)
That's probably an overbid, as outright insubordination might actually be grounds for terminating a GM's contract.

Well, if you have a reasonable job description in your contract, overt micromanagement is going to violate it. The GM's position calls for him to make player personnel decisions. If he refuses to execute an order that he thinks is a bad baseball move, the Wilpon's recourse is to fire him. It doesn't void his contract.
   7. greenback made it work, honey Posted: August 11, 2018 at 06:31 PM (#5725205)
Well, if you have a reasonable job description in your contract, overt micromanagement is going to violate it. The GM's position calls for him to make player personnel decisions. If he refuses to execute an order that he thinks is a bad baseball move, the Wilpon's recourse is to fire him. It doesn't void his contract.

If I'm a billionaire owner with a vanity project baseball team, I'm not going to give my GM a contract that lets him ignore me without consequences. Actually, my first interview question would be how he would handle a request from ownership for a multi-year contract for somebody like Jose Reyes. Does this guy have the skill to convince me such a suggestion is a mistake without implying (or outright stating) that I'm an idiot for making such a suggestion.
   8. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: August 11, 2018 at 07:08 PM (#5725222)
But the overall point remains, it's not like the GM will personally lose money if ownership insists on signing Jose Reyes to a multi-year contract.


As though the loss of money were the only possible reason one might not want to work in a situation like this.
   9. Adam Starblind Posted: August 12, 2018 at 09:38 AM (#5725311)

You do your best, and if they meddle too much, you make them fire you. A GM can always refuse ownerships' orders. Their only recourse is to fire you, which isn't much of a threat when you have a guaranteed contract


If I owned the team, I would want to make the GM get approval for deals that go beyond his current contract, or perhaps by more than a year or two. The GM's career interests are not perfectly aligned with the team's over the medium term.

That's obviously not the same as making him keep Jose Reyes on the 25-man all year.
   10. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 12, 2018 at 11:11 AM (#5725318)
If I owned the team, I would want to make the GM get approval for deals that go beyond his current contract, or perhaps by more than a year or two. The GM's career interests are not perfectly aligned with the team's over the medium term.

That's obviously not the same as making him keep Jose Reyes on the 25-man all year.


Agree with that totally. A veto over major decisions is totally appropriate. But making positive decisions against the wished of your GM is not. If you're at that point, fire him.

If I'm a billionaire owner with a vanity project baseball team, I'm not going to give my GM a contract that lets him ignore me without consequences. Actually, my first interview question would be how he would handle a request from ownership for a multi-year contract for somebody like Jose Reyes. Does this guy have the skill to convince me such a suggestion is a mistake without implying (or outright stating) that I'm an idiot for making such a suggestion.

I'd want someone with enough balls to tell me I'm being an idiot. Assuming the goal of this project is to win (finishing last doesn't help your vanity much) having a toady GM is a bad move. If you can't tell your boss his idea is bad, he or she is a terrible boss.
   11. greenback made it work, honey Posted: August 12, 2018 at 11:29 AM (#5725322)
I'd want someone with enough balls to tell me I'm being an idiot. Assuming the goal of this project is to win (finishing last doesn't help your vanity much) having a toady GM is a bad move. If you can't tell your boss his idea is bad, he or she is a terrible boss.

There's a clear difference between identification of a mistake and classifying someone as an idiot. If a GM is treating me, the billionaire boss that way, then he's almost assuredly doing the same thing to everyone else. That GM would be the terrible boss, and I don't want anything to do with him. The pool for GM talent it too deep to deal with that kind of abuse.
   12. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 12, 2018 at 11:43 AM (#5725326)
There's a clear difference between identification of a mistake and classifying someone as an idiot. If a GM is treating me, the billionaire boss that way, then he's almost assuredly doing the same thing to everyone else. That GM would be the terrible boss, and I don't want anything to do with him. The pool for GM talent it too deep to deal with that kind of abuse.

Obviously I'm not saying literally call him an idiot. But if the owner suggests that the GM trade DeGrom for Justus Sheffield, and Austin Romine, the GM should be able to say "That's an awful idea and would be a terrible deal for us" without having to butter up the owner.

Everyone should be able to tell their superiors or subordinates that an idea is bad. Criticizing ideas is not the same as criticizing the person. Smart people have lots of awful ideas. And the refusal to contradict the ideas of the boss is a major source of corporate dysfunction. I see it every day.

I've literally been on projects where 30 experienced people are in the room, in 100% agreement that the whole concept of the project is wrong-headed, and not a single one of the senior people was willing to communicate that to the big boss.
   13. bobm Posted: August 12, 2018 at 01:00 PM (#5725345)
If you can't tell your boss his idea is bad, he or she is a terrible boss.

Fred and Jeff say Hi.

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