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Thursday, March 13, 2008

Ga. baseball team plans “Eliot Spitzer” theme night

I would imagine all those wearing Splendid Spitzer No. 9 jerseys get in for free also…

A Georgia minor league team is hoping to turn Eliot Spitzer’s scandal into a packed stadium.

The Macon Music is capitalizing on the outgoing New York governor’s prostitution-related downfall, by serving up a “Eliot Spitzer Night.” The man once known as “Mr. Clean” is invited to throw out the first pitch at the June 13th game, although he hasn’t RSVP’d.

A South Coast League official says anybody named Eliot, Spitzer or Kristen, the alleged call girl, will get $1 off admission.

The team also plans to give out a one-night stay at Washington, D.C.‘s swanky Mayflower hotel, where Spitzer’s alleged misdeeds are said to have happened.

And since Spitzer was described as “Client No. 9” in FBI documents, the ninth fan will get a prize. So will the 871st fan to buy a ticket, because that’s supposed to have been Spitzer’s Mayflower Hotel room number.

Repoz Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:27 AM | 93 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: fantasy baseball, minor leagues

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   1. Rich Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:00 AM (#2711682)
America's pastime promoting family values. Sweet.
   2. AJMcCringleberry Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:04 AM (#2711685)
Anyone bringing a hooker gets in free.
   3. unemployed Jeff Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:06 AM (#2711686)
Wow. All they need to do is give the 69th fan a prize, and it will officially be the most tasteless event ever.
   4. Every Inge Counts Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:10 AM (#2711688)
From the same town that had a hockey team named Macon Whoopee.
   5. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:13 AM (#2711690)
And New York's new governor can be the umpire.
   6. Foster Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:17 AM (#2711691)
Have fun explaining to the kids what everyone's talking about. I'm all all for wacky, but c'mon. I'm sure they had fun chuckling and brainstorming in the ticket/PR office, but no one is going to be talking about this in three months.

Of course, the idea is more that they'll get 100% free publicity tomorrow.
   7. JMM Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:18 AM (#2711692)
I'm only okay with this if Silda and/or the kids can show up and hit the team's owner in the balls with a baseball bat.

Or a sledgehammer.
   8. Foster Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:19 AM (#2711693)
And New York's new governor can be the umpire.

For those not in the know, this is funny. (He's legally blind.)
   9. Pat Rapper's Delight Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:22 AM (#2711694)
From the club's website:

During “Eliot Spitzer” Night, the following elements will exist:

1. The Music have extended an invitation for former New York Governor Spitzer to be on hand and throw out the first pitch
2. The team will give away a New York Vacation including a one night stay at the MayFlower Hotel
3. Client #9 (or fan #9) will receive a free Music prize pack
4. Any fan with the name Eliot, Spitzer, or “Kristen” along with any fan from New York will receive $1 off admission
5. The Music will play Frank Sinatra music throughout the evening in honor of New York
6. Wire Taps will be placed throughout the ballpark this evening
7. ATMs will be available for cash withdrawals not to exceed $5,000 per hour
8. Any fan who has resigned their position will be given $1 off admission
9. The 871 fan will receive a gift certificate for the Macon Music Team store.


RDF.
   10. vortex of dissipation Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:24 AM (#2711695)
5. The Music will play Frank Sinatra music throughout the evening in honor of New York


Wouldn't it make more sense to play the loop from "Revolution 9"?
   11. My guest will be Jermaine Allensworth Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:26 AM (#2711696)
Leaving issues of taste and relevance in Georgia aside, it doesn't seem like that great of a promotion. $1 off an indy league ticket for people with uncommon names (although there are plenty of Kristens around) isn't that wacky. You'd think they'd at least get in for free.

Joe Bruno Stadium would be a whole lot more natural setting for this, anyway, though Bruno has been pretty reserved through this whole thing so far.
   12. Guapo Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:30 AM (#2711697)
The team will give away a New York Vacation including a one night stay at the MayFlower Hotel

Dumb hillbillies.
   13. My guest will be Jermaine Allensworth Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:33 AM (#2711699)
I like the "fantasy baseball" tag on this article. And I laughed at No. 5, too.
   14. Howie Menckel Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:35 AM (#2711700)
(He's legally blind.)

The pointless and unnecessary efforts to avoid this fact in stories has been amusing.

It's inspiring to those who are blind or who know such; neutral yet interesting to most; and I know of no hate group that wants to protest.

It is what it is, to beat that dead horse.
   15. Nasty Nate Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:57 AM (#2711705)
... wow Connecticut, New York, and New Jersey can really pick their governor's huh? Rowland's coming off a stretch in prison, McGreevey is living in obscurity in central jersey, and now Spitzer...

then again, my state elected Mitt Romney, so who am i to talk?
   16. Benji Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:57 AM (#2711706)
And in this same vein of "humor" one of the NY minor league teams could have a Lester Maddox Night. If you can prove you're a racist high school dropout you get in free, and the mascot could get lynched during the 7th inning stretch.
   17. Foster Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:58 AM (#2711708)
The pointless and unnecessary efforts to avoid this fact in stories has been amusing.

I've seen it reported plenty, but I'm in NY. I suspect people in most other states couldn't care less who our governor is, or if he's blind.

He's also, by all accounts, a heck of a guy.

Back to the hooker jokes.
   18. Cooperstown Schtick Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:08 AM (#2711710)
I'm willing to bet that Sonny Perdue is praying for rain on June 13th.
   19. devo Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:36 AM (#2711717)
Stay classy, Georgia.
   20. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: March 13, 2008 at 06:00 AM (#2711721)
I was in Augusta, Ga. in 1989, and wanted to hit the book shops, so I looked them up in the Yellow Pages. There was a chain or two, but of the dozen independent shops, there was a precise 50-50 split: Half Christian and half porno. I kid you not. Wonder how much their clientele overlapped....You gotta love it.
   21. Curse of the Andino Posted: March 13, 2008 at 07:21 AM (#2711732)
Must have been some phonebook.

Aside, the South's underrated for literacy, among other things. As a Yankee (Maryland) small press, let me just say, Columbia, SC and Decatur, GA have two of the best book festivals around (Miami's the finest on the East Coast).
   22. Brandon in MO (Yunitility Infielder) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 07:41 AM (#2711734)
"The pointless and unnecessary efforts to avoid this fact in stories has been amusing."

Although, I heard this from Geraldine Ferraro: 'If Paterson could see, he would not be in this position. And if he was deaf (or otherwise differently abled) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept'

They should reduce admission for all fans who show up wearing pimp hats.
   23. Rickey! trades in sheep and threats Posted: March 13, 2008 at 09:09 AM (#2711736)
As a proud citizen of Atlanta let me be the next to confirm that Macon is full of yahoos. Not our fault.
   24. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:04 AM (#2711740)
was in Augusta, Ga. in 1989, and wanted to hit the book shops, so I looked them up in the Yellow Pages. There was a chain or two, but of the dozen independent shops, there was a precise 50-50 split: Half Christian and half porno. I kid you not. Wonder how much their clientele overlapped....You gotta love it.

Must have been some phonebook.

Aside, the South's underrated for literacy, among other things. As a Yankee (Maryland) small press, let me just say, Columbia, SC and Decatur, GA have two of the best book festivals around (Miami's the finest on the East Coast).


Glad to see that things have changed in Augusta over the past 19 years, and I'm well aware of many other very good book shops in the South. But that link you gave is obviously incomplete, unless by some Satanic anti-Miracle the Christian bookstores have all disappeared. Beyond that, if you look at the names on the link, it's predominately chains and textbook stores.
   25. HowardMegdal Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:25 PM (#2711746)
Although, I heard this from Geraldine Ferraro: 'If Paterson could see, he would not be in this position. And if he was deaf (or otherwise differently abled) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept'

You're just attacking Geraldine Ferraro because she can see!
   26. Misirlou's been working for the drug squad Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:29 PM (#2711748)
Wouldn't it make more sense to play the loop from "Revolution 9"?


More like Love Potion #9
   27. Misirlou's been working for the drug squad Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:39 PM (#2711754)
She's a hottie.


Not in this photo. She's a man baby!
   28. Francoeur Sans Gages (AlouGoodbye) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:46 PM (#2711760)
And New York's new governor can be the umpire.

For those not in the know, this is funny. (He's legally blind.)
I thought the joke was that he was black, and the idea of a non-Caucasian being allowed to umpire in a game of base-ball was so ludicrous I guffawed heartily.
   29. SandyRiver Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:51 PM (#2711764)
More like Love Potion #9


Which has actually now been parodied into "Love client #9".
   30. bunyon Posted: March 13, 2008 at 12:59 PM (#2711767)
He's also, by all accounts, a heck of a guy.

I have a theory that this is the only way left, today, to get good people in high offices. Get them into the second spot, through hook or crook, and then have the number one die (or pay for sex).

I thought the joke was that he was black, and the idea of a non-Caucasian being allowed to umpire in a game of base-ball was so ludicrous I guffawed heartily.

I laughed at game six of the 97 NLCS too.
   31. Devin has a deep burning passion for fuzzy socks Posted: March 13, 2008 at 01:21 PM (#2711776)
McGreevey is living in obscurity in central jersey

If only. He's actually been having the Divorce From Hell, with all kinds of shenanigans from both sides over their 6-year-old daughter. The judge has had to admonish them more than once. Plus there's the ongoing fallout from his administration, the latest being the revelation that their e-mail retention policy was "Wait 30 days and erase it".
   32. Dr Love Posted: March 13, 2008 at 01:53 PM (#2711799)
I'm willing to bet that Sonny Perdue is praying for rain on June 13th.


We've got a drought, we're praying for rain every day.
   33. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:07 PM (#2711806)
Don't stop at Spitzer. Definitely have a day where anyone named Anna Nicole or Dannielynn gets a joke "last will and testament" autographed by Larry Birkhead, and on the reverse you get Smith's Playboy centerfold. I also look forward to their "9/11 Day" where the first 1,000 fans get an Mohamed "Atta Boy" bobblehead and they have a fifth-inning race in the OF between a Osama and Bush lookalikes; "Osama" is about to win, but "Bush" fires a "rocket" at him, downing "Osama" to the thunderous cheers of all. For good measure, "Bush" then waterboards "Osama"; laffs ensue!
   34. Dan Szymborski Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:12 PM (#2711812)
Maybe there's a secret movement that hates blind people out there. That braille in the elevators could say "Blinders not welcome" without the rest of us knowing!
   35. bunyon Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:13 PM (#2711814)
I also look forward to their "9/11 Day" where the first 1,000 fans get an Mohamed "Atta Boy" bobblehead and they have a fifth-inning race in the OF between a Osama and Bush lookalikes; "Osama" is about to win, but "Bush" fires a "rocket" at him, downing "Osama" to the thunderous cheers of all. For good measure, "Bush" then waterboards "Osama"; laffs ensue!

Don't forget the $1 all-pork hot dogs and $1 beer to go with that promotion.
   36. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:25 PM (#2711832)
Don't forget the $1 all-pork hot dogs and $1 beer to go with that promotion.

Touche, and also the "Let's Roll" cheerleaders on the dugout tops in birkas.
   37. jwb Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:29 PM (#2711836)
Everybody gets a free barbequed baby back rib after the rocket attack!
   38. Cabbage Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:37 PM (#2711843)
Instead of "Big Cups", the 22oz. beers will be called "Schadenfreude Cups".
   39. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:38 PM (#2711846)
Instead of "Big Cups", the 22oz. beers will be called "Schadenfreude Cups".

"Big D Cups" has a nicer ring and has less of the ivory tower stink.
   40. Boots Day Posted: March 13, 2008 at 02:58 PM (#2711865)
Maybe there's a secret movement that hates blind people out there.

Why would it need to be secret? You could put up big billboards on the highway reading, "You suck, blindies!" They'd never know.
   41. Bronco Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:01 PM (#2711868)
"$5400 bucks? I'd really have to think about it. It would be tempting though. She's a hottie."

Get a grip, gents. Unless she has kegels that could choke a python, ain't no tang worth $5400 a night.
   42. tfbg9 Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:10 PM (#2711874)
Apparently, her real name is Nina Venetta.


Gee, ya' think her thang's just a petri dish of STD's, or what? No thanks, boys. I'd rather not have my weenus become infected.

Besides, tfbg9's never paid for it in his life!
   43. Mister High Standards Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:15 PM (#2711879)
All tang will cost you at least 5400, the only question is the duration. I bet Spitzer's wife ends up costing him a heck of a lot more.

Anyway he wasnt paying for the tang, he was paying for it to leave.

The myspace page is a riot. "Whatever destroys me makes me stronger"
   44. Spahn Insane Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:24 PM (#2711890)
Anyway he wasnt paying for the tang, he was paying for it to leave.

That's a pretty hefty shipping cost.

And presumably, Spitzer's wife wasn't offering a one-time engagement. (Perhaps I shouldn't presume that...)
   45. tfbg9 Posted: March 13, 2008 at 03:40 PM (#2711910)
Loose Lips Sink Spitz
   46. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:29 PM (#2711970)
Although, I heard this from Geraldine Ferraro: 'If Paterson could see, he would not be in this position. And if he was deaf (or otherwise differently abled) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept'


So where are all the posters who were certain that Obama would have to be handled gingerly this election?
   47. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:32 PM (#2711971)
Looks like the myspace page is down, or has been hijacked.


It's still there, kevin. I particularly enjoyed,

"Ashley Alexandra Dupre's Details... Here For:

Dating, Serious Relationships, Friends"

Oops--forgot one!
   48. Ray (RDP) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:35 PM (#2711975)
So where are all the posters who were certain that Obama would have to be handled gingerly this election?


Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but as far as I can tell, Ferraro is evidence of that point. She made a strong comment about Obama -- and had to resign over it.
   49. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:41 PM (#2711983)
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but as far as I can tell, Ferraro is evidence of that point. She made a strong comment about Obama -- and had to resign over it.


As usual, I could have been clearer. I see Clinton regularly exploiting race to try to win the nomination. I did think we were going to have to wait until the general to see this kind of thing (Bill Clinton's comments comparing Obama's to Jesse Jackson's primary wins, doctoring a photo to make Obama look darker, the 'well as far as I know he's not a Muslim' response from Hillary, leaking the photo of Obama in Kenyan clothing to Drudge, Ferraro's junk), but it's not like Democrats aren't able to screw up a near-automatic win.
   50. tfbg9 Posted: March 13, 2008 at 04:44 PM (#2711991)
doctoring a photo to make Obama look darker


I am as anti-Clinton as can be, but this charge is silly. Nobody darkened any images on purpose. The other stuff is true.
   51. Joey B. "disrespects the A" Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:10 PM (#2712021)
As Obama himself pointed out, it is pretty damn ironic. Early on you had people openly questioning whether he was "authentically black", being multiracial and not descended from slaves. Now that he's got the full-fledged support of blacks that Hillary and her bunch felt entitled to, it's only because he's black!

And it hardly needs to be said that the Hillary gang are the last ones who should be saying that other people are "lucky to be who they are", as if their gal really made it on her own without any help.

But this is what happens when you live in the cesspool of identity politics.
   52. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:26 PM (#2712043)
So where are all the posters who were certain that Obama would have to be handled gingerly this election?


That was Andy and to some extent me. The point was that using race against Obama might backfire badly, and that certain types of personal attacks against him might backfire as well with certain voters--not that he can't be attacked on issues, mistakes or positions. As Ray says, Ferraro's stepping down and HRC's apology to black voters, after her initially luke-warm "disagreement", demonstrates there is some truth in that idea. The "first" of anything in the sociohistorical sense always carries with it extra elements that lead to conflicts.
   53. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:27 PM (#2712045)
Which still isn't as bad as the Francesspool of identity sports fandom.


Pedroia is very lucky he is who he is. He wouldn't be in this position if he weren't short, white, saber-friendly and scrappy.
   54. Barca Posted: March 13, 2008 at 05:49 PM (#2712064)
Apparantly she is embarassed by the situation:

http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2008/03/amid-charges-of.html
   55. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 06:58 PM (#2712120)
That was Andy and to some extent me. The point was that using race against Obama might backfire badly, and that certain types of personal attacks against him might backfire as well with certain voters--not that he can't be attacked on issues, mistakes or positions. As Ray says, Ferraro's stepping down and HRC's apology to black voters, after her initially luke-warm "disagreement", demonstrates there is some truth in that idea. The "first" of anything in the sociohistorical sense always carries with it extra elements that lead to conflicts.


I don't doubt I'm more cynical than you, and that's not something I'm happy about--it's just that I'd be very surprised if all of this wasn't largely orchestrated by the Clintons, who are clearly willing to take the risk, and the hit, if it gets Hillary the nomination. And it's clear enough, too, after the last month, that Hillary will do anything to win the nomination, even at the risk of destroying the party in the general--her asserting that she and McCain are ready to be commander-in-chief, and that Obama isn't, made that perfectly clear.

Ferraro has been making these statements for the last two weeks in a variety of venues, smearing the tripe, if you will. It wasn't some accidental off-the-cuff blunder.


That's great stuff, Barca:

"Unfortunately, that would involve meeting with members of Congress, and many of our member don't want to risk having the photos become public," said Preston. Lafester "Sly" Williams, president of the Big Dollar Pimp Association, said his group would comply with greater oversight and control systems.
   56. Joey B. "disrespects the A" Posted: March 13, 2008 at 07:34 PM (#2712147)
I'm starting to think that Hillary's chestnuts might yet get pulled out of the fire at the last minute, thanks to this Dr. Jeremiah Wright, now that he's beginning to get attention in the mainstream media for the first time.

I think Obama may have no choice in the end but to disassociate himself from this guy, because when people start seeing that his spiritual advisor is a total maniac who screams "God damn America" at the top of his lungs, that is not going to play too well at all in mainstream America.
   57. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 09:34 PM (#2712266)
Stay classy, kevin.

I'm starting to think that Hillary's chestnuts might yet get pulled out of the fire at the last minute, thanks to this Dr. Jeremiah Wright, now that he's beginning to get attention in the mainstream media for the first time.


I don't think it will just be Wright, Joey--it'll be Wright, it'll be the lie that Obama was whispering one thing to the Canadians on NAFTA while he was publicly saying something else, it'll be tarring (pun intended) Obama with an association, no matter how distant, with any and every black extremist, it'll be casting just a little doubt on whether he's really a Christian, on whether he has a secret agenda, and so on and so on. Since Clinton has no chance to win in the regular delegate count she has to make him unelectable in the eyes of the super delegates, and that means smearing, lying, and so on. She'll try to, make no mistake about that.
   58. Francoeur Sans Gages (AlouGoodbye) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 09:54 PM (#2712279)
She'll try to, make no mistake about that.
And if she succeeds, then I'm sure President McCain will be very grateful for her help.

While I had a suspicion that the Democrats would find some way to lose the election from their invincible position, I still find it incredible.
   59. bunyon Posted: March 13, 2008 at 10:12 PM (#2712292)
While I had a suspicion that the Democrats would find some way to lose the election from their invincible position, I still find it incredible.

If the Dems lose this election, they should blow up the party and see what takes its place. There is just no way they should have lost in 2000, 04 or 08. If they can't even win ONE of those, they have no business operating.
   60. Guapo Posted: March 13, 2008 at 10:21 PM (#2712297)
I think I'm going to like the new guy:

David Paterson just gave his first public address since Eliot Spitzer's resignation yesterday.

"Just so we don't have to go through this whole resignation thing again," one ballsy reporter asked, "have you ever patronized a prostitute?" Patterson thought for a minute. "Only the lobbyists," he said.
   61. BeanoCook Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:02 PM (#2712312)
If the Dems lose this election, they should blow up the party and see what takes its place. There is just no way they should have lost in 2000, 04 or 08. If they can't even win ONE of those, they have no business operating.


I'd agree with this. However, watching them lose elections they should have won going away has been fun to watch for me. Reading about how Hillary spent her money, $100,000 finger sandwiches in Iowa, $5,000 for snow shovels on a sunny day, etc....has been a hoot.
   62. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:10 PM (#2712317)
While I had a suspicion that the Democrats would find some way to lose the election from their invincible position, I still find it incredible.


It may look a little different when it is one-on-one again, but the idea that the Demos are "invincible" would only be true if Bush were going for a third term. McCain, flaws and all, is the best the Repubs have among the people in their party who want the job. I said over a year ago, on one of the first political threads, that while I thought Hillary Clinton would likely be the nominee, she cannot win the general. I still believe that. Obama/McCain will be very close if that is the matchup. Clinton/McCain will be as well, but I think McCain will edge her out.

I don't doubt I'm more cynical than you, and that's not something I'm happy about--it's just that I'd be very surprised if all of this wasn't largely orchestrated by the Clintons, who are clearly willing to take the risk, and the hit, if it gets Hillary the nomination.


I am not as cynical about the Clintons as most people, so I am agnostic on whether it was Ferraro being unguarded and dumb, or if the Clinton campaign put her up to it to play on resentments.
   63. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:11 PM (#2712318)
However, watching them lose elections they should have won going away .


And this is based on what?
   64. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:21 PM (#2712321)
I'm fairly sure the Democrats will lose in November. Doesn't bother me, frankly. They ceased to be a real opposition party a while back. If you can't rally and bring articles of impeachment against Bush, for christ's sake...

This just in: percentage of Americans who believe Obama is a Muslim: 13
Percentage of Clinton's vote in Missouri that came from Republicans: 24
   65. Latnam's first name is Bob Lemon's middle name Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:31 PM (#2712323)
I haven't read the comments as I just assume this turned into a political conversation, I just want to say that I moved to Macon last October, and I couldn't be more proud.
   66. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:36 PM (#2712324)
I haven't read the comments as I just assume this turned into a political conversation, I just want to say that I moved to Macon last October, and I couldn't be more proud.


Well, Whoopee for you.

Maybe the BTF bigwhigs should set up a catch-all Election 2008 politics thread, so those of us who are into it will not annoy those who are not.
   67. Latnam's first name is Bob Lemon's middle name Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:38 PM (#2712327)

Well, Whoopee for you.

Maybe the BTF bigwhigs should set up a catch-all Election 2008 politics thread, so those of who are into it will not annoy those who are not.


Well, that's kinda rude.... Forgive me for commenting on the article, how dare I?!
   68. Zach Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:43 PM (#2712328)
Candidates matter. Is it really surprising that Gore and Kerry were beatable? Would you honestly be surprised if Obama or Hillary lost this year?

The Republicans have the advantage that a generally liberal press acts as a strong screening mechanism. If the situation were reversed, I could see them going with Romney or Huckabee and facing a nasty shock in the general election.

For a liberal candidate from a liberal state, the general election might be the first time they've faced continued scrutiny from an opposition press. I can't help but think that if there were a conservative counterpart to the New York Times reporting through the primary season, Kerry never would have seemed like a viable candidate in the first place.
   69. rr Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:44 PM (#2712329)
Well, that's kinda rude.... Forgive me for commenting on the article, how dare I?!


You misunderstood. I was saying I think it might be better if we kept the election on one thread, instead of having it periodically hijack other stuff. But that's not my call.
   70. Zach Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:45 PM (#2712330)
Sorry for getting sucked into the politics thread. I'll be good now.
   71. caprules Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:45 PM (#2712331)
Percentage of Clinton's vote in Missouri that came from Republicans: 24


You post this without commenting on it. Do you believe these are people that will be voting for Clinton in November? Or was there a movement in the state to attempt to get the candidate they think can be beat the nomination?
   72. Boots Day Posted: March 13, 2008 at 11:47 PM (#2712334)
But this is what happens when you live in the cesspool of identity politics.

So are you supporting the white male candidate, or one of the other candidates?
   73. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 01:34 AM (#2712403)
You post this without commenting on it. Do you believe these are people that will be voting for Clinton in November? Or was there a movement in the state to attempt to get the candidate they think can be beat the nomination?


I put it up just as an fyi thing, and because it surprised me a little.
On due consideration I have a hard time imagining that Clinton is swinging that many Republicans to the Democratic side for the duration of 2008. I've heard second hand, fwiw, that Limbaugh et al were encouraging Republicans to vote for Hilary to help her stay in the race so that she could keep 'bloodying' Obama. That seems more likely to me than large numbers of Mississippi Republicans deciding, hey, that Clinton woman would make a pretty good president after all!
   74. rr Posted: March 14, 2008 at 01:57 AM (#2712430)
ark,

You meant Mississippi all along, not Missouri, right?
   75. Swedish Chef Posted: March 14, 2008 at 02:11 AM (#2712445)
I hope the next time a politician caught with his pants down drags out his family for his big apology, his wife will give him a hard kick in the groin at the press conference.
   76. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 02:27 AM (#2712453)
ark,

You meant Mississippi all along, not Missouri, right?


Uh. Heh. Er. Yes. Mississippi.

Now to a state I can remember and even spell: Hillary is today claiming the Michigan results were fair (as I'm sure you know, Obama and Edwards withdrew their names from the ballot) and should be recognized.
   77. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: March 14, 2008 at 02:47 AM (#2712466)
So where are all the posters who were certain that Obama would have to be handled gingerly this election?

That was Andy and to some extent me. The point was that using race against Obama might backfire badly, and that certain types of personal attacks against him might backfire as well with certain voters--not that he can't be attacked on issues, mistakes or positions. As Ray says, Ferraro's stepping down and HRC's apology to black voters, after her initially luke-warm "disagreement", demonstrates there is some truth in that idea. The "first" of anything in the sociohistorical sense always carries with it extra elements that lead to conflicts.


Yeah, that was me, and I think that the events of the past two days have shown that at least for now, my instincts were correct. You only have to read the various forums that accompanied the news stories to note that blacks (and many whies) are very plssed at both Clinton and Ferraro, with more than a few of them saying that they'll sit it out if Clinton wins the nomination. As a Democrat, I find it more than a little disheartening, if not that surprising, that McCain has been far quicker to shoot down racially oriented remarks than Clinton is. But Ferraro is such a complete redass that I doubt if she needs Hillary to egg her on in her six pack of gonorrhea running off at the mouth schtick. She's fully capable of acting like that on her own.

Knocking Obama on associations with people like Wright is silly, since obviously Wright isn't "influencing" Obama's opinions on race. But in and of iself you can't say that this sort of BS represents anything particularly racial---all candidates have potentially embarrassing associations that often get brought up, and in this case better now than in the Fall. Anyway, he's been questioned about Wright for at least half a year, and has probably answered the questions to the satisfaction of anyone this side of the Limbaughs. I doubt if it'll cost him any votes in November.

And if McCain runs a clean campaign and keeps the focus on experience, he has a very good chance of attracting enough independents to let the warring Democrats present the Republicans with another E-Z Pass to the White House. The people running Clinton's campaign have shown themselves to be absolute geniuses in the fine art of tone deafness, and I have to think it stems from the same bunker mentality that's been Hillary's m.o. since more or less forever. In many ways those people of hers might as well be Republican operatives, for all the help they're giving McCain come November.
   78. Dr Stankus and the Semicolons Posted: March 14, 2008 at 03:11 AM (#2712482)
Chestnuts? Must be filberts.

Now Paula Jones. THERE'S some chestnuts.


How do they compare with your coworker's?

Remember when you said she had nice tits?

Then remember when you panicked that she might read it on this public board?

That was fun.
   79. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 03:29 AM (#2712492)
Yeah, that was me, and I think that the events of the past two days have shown that at least for now, my instincts were correct. You only have to read the various forums that accompanied the news stories to note that blacks (and many whies) are very plssed at both Clinton and Ferraro, with more than a few of them saying that they'll sit it out if Clinton wins the nomination.


But Clinton does understand that she can't win the presidency without winning the nomination, and if she has to polarize the party along racial lines to win the nomination, she'll do it--I believe that's obvious by now. We know it's essentially impossible for Clinton to end up with a majority of the nonsuperdelegates--and we know she knows this--she therefore understands that to get enough superdelegates to take the nomination she has to ruin Obama so that he's no longer perceived as a viable candidate in the general election. It's what she has to do to win, and she's willing to do it.

Knocking Obama on associations with people like Wright is silly,...


I agree, but I also would have thought letting the idea linger that Obama was a Muslim was silly as well, sort of along the lines of claiming that Saddam Hussein was allied with Al-Qaida prior to 9/11...
   80. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 03:45 AM (#2712501)
And if McCain runs a clean campaign and keeps the focus on experience, he has a very good chance of attracting enough independents to let the warring Democrats present the Republicans with another E-Z Pass to the White House. The people running Clinton's campaign have shown themselves to be absolute geniuses in the fine art of tone deafness, and I have to think it stems from the same bunker mentality that's been Hillary's m.o. since more or less forever. In many ways those people of hers might as well be Republican operatives, for all the help they're giving McCain come November.


McCain may well appear to run a clean campaign, and I agree that as a strategy it's likely his best. There are plenty of willing surrogates and 527s happy to slander and smear, so he's covered there, and there's no chance at all he'll tell them to shut up and go back to their caves. I don't agree that Hillary is particularly tone deaf, at least not in the last month, as she has managed to bring race to the fore without hopelessly sullying herself. That part of her campaign has been brilliant (sickening, but brilliant), in that it revived a candidacy all but stone dead just a few weaks ago--remember how some serious commentators were talking about her resigning from race for the good of the party?
   81. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: March 14, 2008 at 03:59 AM (#2712508)
Well, arkitekton, if Clinton wants to go down in history as the person who's blasted the Democratic base in half with her surrogates' poisonous comments, I guess that's her privilege. But if she thinks that she can win the election after having secured the nomination that way, she's f ucking nuts. She may be making a few tactical gains among the racially resentful in the short run, but she must think that those people whom her surrogates are totally alienating today are all going to swallow bottles of amnesia potion # 9 in six weeks. I doubt it. These people who think that the Democrats can win by mimicking Karl Rove are simply deluding themselves.
   82. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 11:39 AM (#2712576)
Andy--it doesn't make sense to me either, but I've rarely had a win no matter the cost mentality. I don't doubt Clinton will offer Obama a prominent position in a Clinton administration (though the backtracking on her claim that Obama isn't ready to be commander in chief, but with the implication that he may be ready shortly after August 28th, in which case wouldn't he be a swell VP? is hilarious in its audacity).

These people who think that the Democrats can win by mimicking Karl Rove are simply deluding themselves.


Which is, I suspect, what separates intelligent, thoughtful guys like you who routinely consider the greater good from Hillary and her cohort--they're not interestied in the Democrats winning, they're intersted in they themselves winning. The party is a vehicle, and very little more than that.
   83. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 01:16 PM (#2712601)
she must think that those people whom her surrogates are totally alienating today are all going to swallow bottles of amnesia potion # 9 in six weeks. I doubt it.

If they're like me, they'd rather vote for McCain than Clinton, and they get more justified with every passing day.
   84. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: March 14, 2008 at 01:34 PM (#2712610)
These people who think that the Democrats can win by mimicking Karl Rove are simply deluding themselves.

Which is, I suspect, what separates intelligent, thoughtful guys like you who routinely consider the greater good from Hillary and her cohort--they're not interestied in the Democrats winning, they're intersted in they themselves winning. The party is a vehicle, and very little more than that.


Since I'm willing to give most everyone the benefit of the doubt, including Hillary Clinton, I can only hope that she comes to her senses and realizes the potential damage to the whole society that her campaign surrogates are fomenting. There is more to life than winning an election.

she must think that those people whom her surrogates are totally alienating today are all going to swallow bottles of amnesia potion # 9 in six weeks. I doubt it.

If they're like me, they'd rather vote for McCain than Clinton, and they get more justified with every passing day.


My personal choice would have to be constrained by the thought of McCain's Supreme Court and regulatory commission apppointments, but if it were merely a matter of demonstrated political character, I'd take McCain in a blink. Nearly all politicians are almost by definition classic Type A personalities who are best appreciated at a distance, but there's little I've read about McCain that doesn't say to me than he's better than nearly any pol who's risen to his level of public recognition.
   85. Exploring Leftist Conservatism since 2008 (ark..) Posted: March 14, 2008 at 04:20 PM (#2712760)
If they're like me, they'd rather vote for McCain than Clinton, and they get more justified with every passing day.


Interesting, Doc--how do you tend to vote, if you don't mind my asking?

My personal choice would have to be constrained by the thought of McCain's Supreme Court and regulatory commission apppointments,...


For me there's also the small matter of the occupation of Iraq. There's no evidence that the occupation has increased the likelihood of political reconciliation within Iraq, it has nothing useful in common with US troop presence in Korea, Germany, or Japan, it distracts enormously from actually making the world and the US safer, and it's not sustainable. McCain is so wrong on this I couldn't vote for him if this were the only issue, let alone the activist right-wing judges he'd appoint, the presposterous war time tax cuts for the wealthy, and so on.


...but there's little I've read about McCain that doesn't say to me than he's better than nearly any pol who's risen to his level of public recognition.


As Raymond Chandler said, "that's like being the guy in the leper colony with the most fingers."

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