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Sunday, November 19, 2017

Gabe Kapler’s only season as a manager gave hints for how he will lead Phillies

Here’s a very good read about Kapler.

Or the minor-league style just did not suit him. Kapler would bring his own organic eggs and organic peanut butter and organic whatever on the road with him. It was difficult to trust the options at rest stops and budget hotels across the South Atlantic League.

“He was so into health,” Still said. “He’s addicted to ice cream. So he would sit there and lick ice cream but have a cup and spit it into it. He would lick it just for the taste but didn’t want to eat it. I told him, ‘Dude, that’s like Unabomber type stuff.’ That’s a thing he did.”

Jim Furtado Posted: November 19, 2017 at 11:42 AM | 34 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: gabe kapler, phillies

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   1. winnipegwhip Posted: November 19, 2017 at 08:29 PM (#5578615)
So spittons will return to the Phils clubhouse but it will be for Ben & Jerrys not Redman.
   2. Shock Posted: November 19, 2017 at 09:42 PM (#5578622)
This sounds like it has a chance to be a highly entertaining disaster.
   3. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 19, 2017 at 11:14 PM (#5578637)
Seems like this pretty much confirms what was suggested in an article posted right after Kapler was hired - he has an eating disorder. I would have to think that would/should be a red flag in a manager.
   4. don't ask 57i66135; he wants to hang them all Posted: November 20, 2017 at 12:12 AM (#5578646)
in related news, 2B cesar hernandez recently started an internship at three mile island.
   5. Sunday silence Posted: November 20, 2017 at 12:33 AM (#5578648)
Seriously if you like Bobby valentine you'll love this guy.
   6. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:09 AM (#5578699)
I don't know what kind of manager Kapler will be - I know he's an intelligent guy with plenty of experience in baseball - but he certainly seems to be the exact opposite of Terry Francona.
   7. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:23 AM (#5578708)
This sounds like it has a chance to be a highly entertaining disaster.

Yeah. He seems waaaaay too intense to survive long.

“Everything he does to the extreme,” said Large, who now works in player development for the Pittsburgh Pirates. “He wants to see how far he can go in anything."


That's just not going to work over the long haul.
   8. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:34 AM (#5578713)
“He was so into health,” Still said. “He’s addicted to ice cream. So he would sit there and lick ice cream but have a cup and spit it into it. He would lick it just for the taste but didn’t want to eat it. I told him, ‘Dude, that’s like Unabomber type stuff.’ That’s a thing he did.”


The legendary Archie Moore, considered by many to be the greatest lightheavyweight champion of all-time (but not be me!) used to follow a similarly weird dietary program at some points in his career, where he would chew meat bu spit it out and swallow the juices. Later he got involved with Dick Gregory and all manner of odd vitamin and supplement megadosing. Also he knocked out Ted DiBiase's dad.
   9. The Good Face Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:39 AM (#5578717)
Yeah. He seems waaaaay too intense to survive long.

“Everything he does to the extreme,” said Large, who now works in player development for the Pittsburgh Pirates. “He wants to see how far he can go in anything."

That's just not going to work over the long haul.


Billy Martin 2.0 maybe? Although I'm not sure how well a guy like Billy would work with today's players...
   10. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:45 AM (#5578720)

Billy Martin 2.0 maybe? Although I'm not sure how well a guy like Billy would work with today's players...


Thing is, Martin was a genius as a tactical manager. He kept getting so many chances because he was really, really good. Of course, even that could only save him for so long, and he wore out his welcome quickly. If Martin were merely good, his career would have been every short.

What are the odds that Kapler is that good a manager?
   11. The Good Face Posted: November 20, 2017 at 10:52 AM (#5578726)
Thing is, Martin was a genius as a tactical manager. He kept getting so many chances because he was really, really good. Of course, even that could only save him for so long, and he wore out his welcome quickly. If Martin were merely good, his career would have been every short.

What are the odds that Kapler is that good a manager?


Yeah, that's the thing; as good as Billy was (and he was good), his personality never let him stay in a job for long. Kapler might not be quite as toxic as Billy was (alcoholism, anger management issues, etc.), but I could easily see his personality rubbing a lot of people the wrong way. Obviously winning fixes everything, but as you say, what are the odds Kapler has some secret sauce that'll put him head and shoulders above every other manager?
   12. dog poop god Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:14 AM (#5578733)
We'll see. Every manager fails eventually.

I like the pick.
   13. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:16 AM (#5578734)
what are the odds Kapler has some secret sauce that'll put him head and shoulders above every other manager?

He'd spit it out if he did.
   14. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:26 AM (#5578742)

Haven't RTFO yet, but from an article that someone posted here a few weeks ago, written by Kapler, he seems to be fairly self-aware that his past dietary and workout habits weren't psychologically healthy, and seems to have mellowed out a bit since then. Not saying that he'll be a great manager, but I wouldn't write him off because of this stuff.
   15. Spahn Insane, stimulus-funded BurlyMan™ Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:27 AM (#5578743)
I'd say the word "extreme" is a red flag for a managerial candidate in pretty much any field, but certainly for a major league team with a bunch of young players. This'll be interesting to watch, to be sure.
   16. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:37 AM (#5578748)
Haven't RTFO yet, but from an article that someone posted here a few weeks ago, written by Kapler, he seems to be fairly self-aware that his past dietary and workout habits weren't psychologically healthy, and seems to have mellowed out a bit since then. Not saying that he'll be a great manager, but I wouldn't write him off because of this stuff.

That was the article I was referring to above - I got the impression that he had maybe dialed it back to about 90% of his former intensity, but that was still well into red-flag territory. We shall see...
   17. dlf Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:38 AM (#5578751)
Thing is, Martin was a genius as a tactical manager. He kept getting so many chances because he was really, really good.


It may be that we are working on different definitions of 'tactics' but I never thought that was Martin's particular genius. I'm not old enough to remember his Twins or Tigers teams and only vaguely remember him in Texas, but in NY and Oakland, I thought he was marvelous at short-term motivation. He got the team to play really hard and many players performed better for him than can be expected based on their career norms. (Of course he burned out quickly and both players as well as marshmallow salesmen turned on him in the end.) But his in-game tactics (other than, towards the end of his career - famously so in Oakland - how long he went with starters) didn't strike me as unusual or any better than the norms of his time. I guess that I'd say that his strength was more strategic than tactical.

...

The media want Kapler to fail. He will fail - all managers eventually do - but it will be spectacular *because* of his tenuous relationship with a conformist driven sports media.
   18. Golfing Great Mitch Cumstein Posted: November 20, 2017 at 02:43 PM (#5578889)
The article was favorable towards Kapler. The players' comments were supportive and the writer emphasized the connections he made with players. You cannot tell whether it is just because the writer didn't dig too hard and framed things in a positive light, though. The writer did also mention Kapler's embrace of sabermetrics, including being selective at the plate and not calling for many sacrifice bunts. If he has dialed back the intensity (and he won't have to worry about bringing organic peanut butter to a Hardees on the road) and can connect with players the way he seemed to have done, he could be fine.
   19. SoSH U at work Posted: November 20, 2017 at 02:50 PM (#5578892)
The writer did also mention Kapler's embrace of sabermetrics, including being selective at the plate and not calling for many sacrifice bunts.


Unless the parent club specifically instructed it, which I think would be mistaken, I wouldn't want my A-league manager refraining from calling for sac bunts. You really want your manager to be more interested in skill development than maximizing run expectancies at that level, and thus identifying which player can lay the occasional bunt down is more useful for the organization, I think.
   20. Golfing Great Mitch Cumstein Posted: November 20, 2017 at 03:21 PM (#5578919)
Regardless of what it means for development, Kapler's dislike of the sacrifice demonstrates he understands its lack of value, which is what is important at the majors.

Regarding the development aspect, I followed a team in the same league whose manager loved to bunt. So much so he was taking the bat out of the hands of his best hitters. I think an organization would want ABs to be used to work on hitting, especially that far down the development ladder.
   21. SoSH U at work Posted: November 20, 2017 at 04:04 PM (#5578941)
Regardless of what it means for development, Kapler's dislike of the sacrifice demonstrates he understands its lack of value, which is what is important at the majors.


Sure, but that seems to be a trait he shares with all managers at the big league level these days. For instance, today's most bunt-happy American League manager orders many fewer sac bunts per season than Earl Weaver did.

Regarding the development aspect, I followed a team in the same league whose manager loved to bunt. So much so he was taking the bat out of the hands of his best hitters. I think an organization would want ABs to be used to work on hitting, especially that far the development ladder.


I don't think there's ever any shortage of opportunities there.

The bottom line is, I don't want my A-league skipper worrying too much about winning ballgames, whether that leads to bunting too much or not bunting at all.

Of course, that has zero bearing on how Gabe Kapler will do with the Phils.
   22. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: November 20, 2017 at 04:29 PM (#5578956)
including being selective at the plate and not calling for many sacrifice bunts.


Don't swing at balls and don't give away outs....it's revolutionary stuff redefining sabermetrics right before our eyes!

I kid, I kid. Kapler's a pretty smart guy and it will be interesting to see if his intellect can at times override his intensity in order to gel with a group of young players.

I hope for the best and wish him well. I like it when teams try stuff that's a bit unorthodox.
   23. reech Posted: November 20, 2017 at 06:30 PM (#5579066)
Of course every Philly "pundit" isn't so enamored of Kapler:
https://deadspin.com/howard-eskin-is-very-upset-that-new-phillies-manager-ga-1820089781
   24. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: November 20, 2017 at 07:14 PM (#5579084)
#23, thanks for the link

I RTFA then unfortunately the first 2 comments. 2nd comment was waaay to descriptive for my tastes.
   25. dog poop god Posted: November 20, 2017 at 07:54 PM (#5579107)
he won't have to worry about bringing organic peanut butter to a Hardees on the road

Not eating Hardees is always a wise move. I got labeled a health nut at work for not eating crap, basically, and drinking mineral water.

Spirulina smoothies didn't help.
   26. dog poop god Posted: November 20, 2017 at 08:04 PM (#5579111)
Not to get too descriptive, cocunut oil is good with a partner, not so good alone. There are some good all natural alternatives I'll leave to tbe borderlands of personal exploration and discovery.

I like the way Eskin goes "think of the children" in the process of publicizing the details. Sorry to tell you this, Howard -- kids discover their fun spots long before they learn how to read.
   27. stevegamer Posted: November 20, 2017 at 08:12 PM (#5579116)
Of course every Philly "pundit" isn't so enamored of Kapler:
https://deadspin.com/howard-eskin-is-very-upset-that-new-phillies-manager-ga-1820089781


That's funny - if Howard Eskin only loves one person, it's himself.
   28. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: November 20, 2017 at 11:22 PM (#5579205)
“He’s addicted to ice cream. So he would sit there and lick ice cream but have a cup and spit it into it. He would lick it just for the taste but didn’t want to eat it. I told him, ‘Dude, that’s like Unabomber type stuff.’ That’s a thing he did.”


This is bar none one of the weirdest behaviors I have ever heard of.
   29. Blastin Posted: November 21, 2017 at 05:23 AM (#5579230)
Sometimes during a long race my stomach is acting up. And studies have shown that swishing sugary sports drinks in your mouth is better than nothing. I can't really swallow well when my stomach is failing because I might puke (and then have to stop to deal with that), so I sometimes basically gargle Gatorade mid-marathon.


Endurance sports are weird though.

He's just doing that while sitting around.
   30. reech Posted: November 21, 2017 at 11:00 AM (#5579341)


That's funny - if Howard Eskin only loves one person, it's himself.


Still better then Bill Conlin.
   31. Omineca Greg Posted: November 21, 2017 at 11:10 AM (#5579349)
This is bar none one of the weirdest behaviors I have ever heard of.

Apparently it's a common enough thing associated with eating disorders.

This blog post is well written. By necessity, it's an individual, personal story, but she's not the only one.
   32. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 21, 2017 at 02:11 PM (#5579550)

Sometimes during a long race my stomach is acting up.

For what it's worth, I have found that eating "real" food like almonds and dried fruit rather than gels and goos, and drinking water rather than Gatorade, helps with this on long runs. And I feel much better after the race too.
   33. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 21, 2017 at 09:59 PM (#5579892)
but he certainly seems to be the exact opposite of Terry Francona.


The Phillies fans hated Francona, so this might be good? ;)
   34. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: November 21, 2017 at 10:10 PM (#5579894)
I sometimes basically gargle Gatorade mid-marathon.


I've run two marathons and maybe a dozen halfs, and I cannot imagine finishing without being able to swallow water. Though I guess Alberto Salazar didn't drink any water during the famous Duel in the Sun, so I guess it can be done. I just have a hard time featuring putting a liquid or foodstuff in your mouth and forcing yourself not to swallow it.

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