Things are going to get worse for Boston before they start getting better, methinks...

My opinion on this stuff? You get paid really well to play baseball. If you are a starting pitcher, and it's not your day to pitch, you're telling me you can't sit in the dugout and watch the ####### game? I'd actually have less a problem with a starting pitcher using a day he's not pitching to spend some extra time with his newborn kid at home, giving his wife a break, going to be early if they're pitching the next day, whatever. But hanging out in the clubhouse, eating chicken and popping a beer or three? Not impressive.

This, ladies and gentlemen, is why you shouldn't judge a manager based on how often he drops down a bunt. There's stuff that's a lot more important than that.

Like when he pulls his starter!


Anway,

McKeon has one 1 WS championship and Francona has 2.

Josh Beckett continues to play the game the right way.

Three of the four Sox pitchers (Beckett, Lackey and Buchholz) who acted thusly are Texans.

Just saying.

Jon Lester's from Tacoma. So the least that he could have done was printed a zine about it to defend himself.

Josh Beckett: "Well at least I have Chicken!"

They read Ball Four, but they misunderstood Joe Schultz's philosophy about when the Budweiser should be pounded.

Has Beckett's work ethic been questioned much before now? This makes it sound like Beckett's always been a bit detached from the game of baseball when it isn't his day to take the ball. One wonders how much, if any, of that attitude has resulted in his erratic season-to-season stats.

None of this stuff ever was an issue or came to light until Lackey arrived in 2010...

9: Depends on the year / how well he's doing... I've seen it criticized, I've seen it get extreme praise.

"Well at least I have Chicken!"

That's what I heard at first too, but now I think I hear "at least I ain't chicken."

Either way, I'd say that Papelbon is the Leroy of the team.

Stunned that Beckett might possibly be lazy and self-absorbed. Stunned.

If you are a starting pitcher, and it's not your day to pitch, you're telling me you can't sit in the dugout and watch the ####### game

*If* you're telling me that, league-wide, starting pitchers don't at least watch the games from the club-house...this could explain a hell of a lot when I constantly see pitchers throw the wrong pitch to batters with amazing flaws*. Cause..I sure don't trust them all to do homework.

*I mean yeah, some 80% of the pitchers in the league know to throw Crawford a curve in the dirt...but what about the other 20% that kept that .298 OBP up there?

Either way, I'd say that Papelbon is the Leroy of the team.

Oh come on guys, it's totally Pedroia.

"All right guys, the Rays have given us a lot of problems in the past...I think the way we need to approach..."

"All right chums! Let's do this! DUSSSSTIINNNNN PEDROIAAAAAAA!"

I'm perplexed as to how some of the guys we're NOT talking about as problem players were acting during all of this.

For example, Dustin Pedroia. Hustles, in your face, intense 24/7. If this stuff is going on, wouldn't he have been arrested for assault and battery by September 15th? How can he not be like, "Hey, FatAss Beckett! God gave you more physical tools in your right arm than I have in my 5'8" body! If I was your size, I'd lead the league in HRs! I'm working my ass off, and you're eating chicken in the 4th inning?"

Or how about Carl Crawford? There's a local report this morning claiming that Crawford held a team meeting in September to tell the to get their #### together - and that, while a member of the Rays, Crawford threw Pat Burrell against a wall and told him to get his #### together. Is this possible? Crawford looked clinically depressed in the dugout by the end of the season. Is it possible that Crawford did this stuff, couldn't believe how bad the clubhouse was, felt that his poor start to the season undermined his own ability to be a leader in his first season on the team, and that he was thinking, "Man, I've got six more years after this?!"

Or how about Papelbon? We all thought he was this slowly-declining, me-first, good old boy dolt, and there is absolutely no evidence or accusation out there that he participated in this garbage. He had an awesome year, seemed to actually tone down the BS off the field in 2011, and appeared to be in great shape physically, as well. What does he think of this stuff?

Or even a guy like Scutaro? Scutaro is one of the lost stories of the 2011 season for the team. He had a really good year, and had an awesome September - he and Ellsbury may have been the two best players on the team in September. At the beginning of the year, is there any doubt we thought the team would NOT pick up his $6m option for 2012? Now, is there any doubt that they will? The funny thing is - does Scutaro even want to be on this team in 2012? He could probably get a 2/10 contract on the open market, which is more than he'll probably make over the next two years otherwise, and he wouldn't have to deal with the Red Sox BS. And how resentful must he be about how his excellent play last month was totally wiped out my higher-paid ##########?

I hope the team is going to pay Ben Cherington well...because he's gonna earn his money!

Or how about Papelbon? We all thought he was this slowly-declining, me-first, good old boy dolt, and there is absolutely no evidence or accusation out there that he participated in this garbage. He had an awesome year, seemed to actually tone down the BS off the field in 2011, and appeared to be in great shape physically, as well. What does he think of this stuff?

He thinks, "I'm a free agent, and I did all those things so I could make my chicken money!"

#15 - Well, as Ortiz said in his most recent interview with ESPN "Come on, that happened in 2004 as well. It happened in 2007..." So, maybe we, as people who have no clue how an MLB clubhouse operates, don't know what the hell it's all about and we should stop being morally outraged over something that isn't a big deal. I am upset about an apparent lack of conditioning from the pitchers - the clubhouse stuff really doesn't bother me at all.

I am upset about an apparent lack of conditioning from the pitchers - the clubhouse stuff really doesn't bother me at all.

I wonder if that's why Beckett takes so damn long between pitches... fat bastard needs to catch his breath.

15 - Maybe, just maybe, all this #### is being overblown and that while there were problems in the clubhouse they weren't nearly as devastating as being reported.

Or maybe a bunch of lazy, fat-assed drunk druggies somehow managed to win 90 games while the rest of baseball was living a spartan existence.

Has Beckett's work ethic been questioned much before now? This makes it sound like Beckett's always been a bit detached from the game of baseball when it isn't his day to take the ball. One wonders how much, if any, of that attitude has resulted in his erratic season-to-season stats.

Not the same thing, but I remember people talking about his gut at the beginning of 2008. There have certainly been some questions about his conditioning.

Jon Lester's from Tacoma. So the least that he could have done was printed a zine about it to defend himself.

Nice.

Or maybe a bunch of lazy, fat-assed drunk druggies somehow managed to win 90 games while the rest of baseball was living a spartan existence.


Right - I wonder how often stuff like this happens on other teams, but you just don't hear about it because they didn't have dramatic collapses that people were looking to explain.

I'm not defending the behavior. Just saying I don't know how unique it is.

If only they could've shown the commitment to physical conditioning and ascetic restraint of, say, the championship '86 Mets.

I heard the Boston starting pitchers stayed in the clubhouse during the games to guard the chicken and beer from David Ortiz between his at bats.

Red Sox have announced they are hiring Mike Leach as head coach.

If only they could've shown the commitment to physical conditioning and ascetic restraint of, say, the championship '86 Mets.

I wonder if a team that behaves like that can win in this era. I rather doubt it. Too much of a competitive disadvantage.

The Mets won 108 games in 1986, all of them with an empty dugout.


CHASS: BALLPLAYERS SAY WATCHING GAMES THEY WILL NOT PLAY IN BORING AS HELL, MR. PRESIDENT!

I heard the Boston starting pitchers stayed in the clubhouse during the games to guard the chicken and beer from David Ortiz between his at bats.

Well, after Manny stole Pedro's feast one can hardly blame them.

Three of the four Sox pitchers (Beckett, Lackey and Buchholz) who acted thusly are Texans.

My older brother lived in Dallas in '80-81. He's always told the story that the big issue at the time is whether they should outlaw drinking while driving.

Speaking of the 1986 Mets, isn't it part of the legend of Game 6 that Keith Hernandez, after making an out earlier in the 10th inning, dejectedly went back to the clubhouse - not the dugout, but the clubhouse - and was smoking while watching the rest of the inning on a TV? I don't know about you, but if my team was two outs from losing the World Series, but I knew that we were a baserunner and a home run away from tying the game, I'd probably stick around to watch...and expect the rest my teammates to do the same thing.

I think a few others above are correct - we are probably assuming that the Sox behavior in 2011 is 180 degrees different from other teams...and I'm not sure that's true.

30-no, he had opened a beer and was drinking it.

#30 - The story of Hernandez in the clubhouse is that he saw the first hit on TV, then stayed put right in his place and ordered everybody else around to do the same, for fear of jinxing it. He wasn't undressed or anything, he was still ready to go out for another inning.

he was still ready to go out for another inning.

After half a beer, yes. I guess so.