According to Fangraphs, his has been one helluva contract for the M's.

I never noticed how Simmons's career trailed off. It looks like he should have hung up his spikes in 1939, but he played in four more seasons over the next five years, accumulating less than 100 games played in all that time. Never did reach 3000 hits.

Meh, still too terrible to get in the Hall of Fame.

Meh, still too terrible to get in the Hall of Fame.

Yeah, he'd really drag the standards down.

Lets just add Tim Raines to this thread, and we'd have the typical Ichiro! thread.

Since no one cared to take up the Al Simmons tangent, how 'bout I throw out a question: How on earth is the guy who plays almost every game, who holds the single-season hits record and the record for most consecutive 200-hit seasons, NOT the fastest to 2000 hits?

How on earth is the guy who plays almost every game, who holds the single-season hits record and the record for most consecutive 200-hit seasons, NOT the fastest to 2000 hits?

The first of these three actually works against him (or, not for him). He's 2nd-fastest based on # of games. Simmons had seasons with only 159 and 163 hits in his 3rd and 4th seasons, but he did those in only 106 and 119 games. Simmmons got his 2,000th hit very early in his 11th big-league season, so on a per-season basis, Ichiro beats him by just more than one full season (I assume Ichiro is the fastest to 2,000 hits on a per-season basis or per team-games).

Since no one cared to take up the Al Simmons tangent, how 'bout I throw out a question: How on earth is the guy who plays almost every game, who holds the single-season hits record and the record for most consecutive 200-hit seasons, NOT the fastest to 2000 hits?

Ichiro played in seasons of 162 games compared to the 154-game skeds of Simmons' time. And other than his rookie season, Simmons' numbers carried out over a full season would have led to 10-straight 200 hit seasons in the 152-game schedule (and if you're measuring hits by number of games, playing less than a full season doesn't hurt your cause).

Why did Simmons do it in fewer games than Ichiro?

1) Ichiro may have the record for hits in a season (262 hits in 161 games), Simmons has a season with almost as many hits (253 hits in only 153 games). In other words, Simmons actually had more hits per game than Ichiro in those matching seasons.
2) This record is a "rate" record - who had the highest hit-per-game average among those with at least 2000 career hits - and Simmons' hits-per-game rates are remarkable. For example, as a 25-year-old, Simmons played in only 106 games...but had exactly 1.5 hits per game, with 159. Ichiro has average 1.5 or more hits per game three times: his rookie year, his hit-record season, and this year (he'll almost certainly stay above 1.5 through the end of 2009). Simmons did it four times, and just missed a 5th time.

Simmons got hit 2000 very early in his age 32 season. Ichiro got it late in his age 35 season. Simmons got another 927 hits in his career, and was pretty much done after his age 36 season.

Ichiro will be fascinating to watch in the next three to five years - he is a unique figure in baseball history, with unique circumstances (although he appears nowhere in his Top 10 career comps, he and Minnie Minoso has some similarities in career paths). To me, his ability to get to 3,000 hits depends on the answers to two questions:

1) Can he avoid either significant or frequent injuries? Even if he continues to play at a high level, if he starts missing 30 games a season, he'll probably run out of time (like Simmons).
2) When his speed starts to go, what effect will that have on his game? Will he start losing significant numbers of infield hits? Is there a chance he'll develop additional power to compensate (but, perhaps, at a cost in hits)?

I'm rooting for him, but I don't see him getting to 3,000 unless he drags out his career beyond when he is an average ballplayer...

To answer the question from another angle, batting averages were ridiculously high in the late 20s and early 30s. In his first six years, Bucketfoot Al hit .308, .387, .341, .392, .351, .365 without once leading the league in hitting. (He led the next two years, with averages of .381 and .390.)

I wonder if Simmons holds the record for most seasons with batting average over .380 or .390 or whatever, without ever hitting .400?

These are Ichiro's batting averages, roughly converted to their equivalents in Al Simmons' Philadelphia...

.402, .379, .354, .418, .338, .352, .396, .347, .402

My favorite number is Ichiro's converted 2004 - not just the .418 average, but 280 hits in 154 games.

Note: to be clear, I'm not making any claims about what Ichiro "would have done" in such a context. Just comparing league averages and giving rough equivalents.

An accomplishment like this requires only 2 inputs: Batting average and ABs per game. Ichiro's batting average is far from historical (.333). But what he excells in is ABs per game. He is:

1) A leadoff hitter
2) In a high offense era
3) Who rarely walks
4) Who is a good defensive player and thus rarely replaced late in the game
5) Who plays every day and thus has few if any 1 AB games

Ty Cobb had a batting average of ~.370 through his first 1400 games . But Ichiro must destroy him in the AB/G category to beat him to 2,000 hits. Through 1915, Cobb played 1397 games, 5253 AB, and 1935 Hits. Through today, Ichiro has 1402 games, 5999 AB, and 2,000 hits. And the difference is not all walks. Cobb had 519 walks and 5958 PA, Ichiro 405 and 6498.

Well, I guess we can all agree that Suzuki is no Ty Cobb.

Yeah, he's not an #######.

Through 1915, Cobb played 1397 games, 5253 AB, and 1935 Hits. Through today, Ichiro has 1402 games, 5999 AB, and 2,000 hits. And the difference is not all walks. Cobb had 519 walks and 5958 PA, Ichiro 405 and 6498.

Since I'm a fan of Wade Boggs and he had a very high BA and tons of hits his first several years, here's how Boggs compares through his first 1402 games:

6373 PA, 5396 AB, 1861 H, 885 BB, .345 BA.

That covers eight full seasons and two partial ones for Boggs (the partial ones being his rookie year and then my cutoff at 1402 games midway through the 1991 season). In the eight full season Boggs led the league in PA three times, BA five times, and hits once (topping out at 240 hits). Seven straight 200-hit seasons in there. And four straight 100-walk seasons, twice leading the league.

Well thanks to this thread I did some research for a THT Live piece on Ichiro.

Questions looked at in it:

What's the most hits anyone ever amassed in their ages 27-35 seasons? (That's Ichiro's career). Any guesses where Ichiro ranks there?

What's the most hits anyone ever attained in a 9-year period? Any guesses what the high is, and who has it?

Lastly, what does this mean for Ichiro's future? What can we expect from him, provided he stay healthy? No, it's not the most original question, but it's a natural follow-up.

Neutralizing his stats for the 1929 Philadelphia A's run environment Ichiro would have 2116 hits in 6416 PA thus far.

And I guess we can all agree that Ichiro is no Wade Boggs.

A question for those with the BBRef skills:

How many players have gotten 900+ hits from age 36 onwards? Just browsing through various player pages, I see Rose, Molitor, Rickey, Biggio, Lofton.

From Chris' article, most hits from 36 on.

#19,

The link in post 16 actually includes a link to a PI Search resutls.

9 guys have topped 900 hits from age 36-onward. 7 of them topped 1,000.

Kenny Lofton only had 647, though. Not sure how you got him.

EDITED: beaten to the punch by MCoA.

Ahh thanks.

Just did some random searching of my own.

Anson had 1474 hits from his age-36 season on.
Yaz had 1006 hits from his age-36 season on.

EDIT: oh sure, if you want to do it the easy way...

MCoA, was it you who recently noted Ichiro's gift for quote-making? I'll add this to the mix, from Jim Caple's column currently the lead on ESPN's MLB page:

"I think one of the requirements for being a DH is weighing at least 200 pounds, so maybe if I was that heavy I would do it,'' he said. "[But] the day I weigh 200 pounds is the day I'm inside a coffin.''

This one's not quite as good, but:

"I'm not a fortune teller, so I don't have the ability to look into the future,'' he told reporters Sunday about the possibility of 3,000 hits. "But that's why it's fun, because the future is unknown.''

Also, this quip isn't bad from Caple:

He reaches first base faster than Derek Jeter on a date.

And today's James Weisbergian "he could have hit more home runs, if he had wanted to" quote goes to Bill Hall:

"Obviously, he can hit the ball out of the ballpark whenever he wants. All you just have to watch him in [batting practice] to see how far he can hit the ball. But he doesn't get outside of himself during the game, which is a compliment to the discipline he has to stay in his approach and do what he wants to do. Yeah, he can probably hit 30 to 40 home runs if he wanted to, but he might strike out a little more and his average would drop a little more.''

As to how well he can maintain his performance into his late 30s, Caple notes a decent sign:

With 54 infield hits this season, he likely will finish with the second largest total of his career (63 is his high, in 2001).

Ichiro on facing Matsuzaka:
"I hope he arouses the fire that's dormant in the innermost recesses of my soul. I plan to face him with the zeal of a challenger."