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Wednesday, May 17, 2017

Joe Posnanski: Ranking the Stadiums

The Best Places to Watch a Game: AT&T Park (San Francisco); Kauffman Stadium (Kansas City); Oriole Park at Camden Yards (Baltimore); PNC Park (Pittsburgh); Petco Park (San Diego); Safeco Park (Seattle).
Four of these — San Francisco and Pittsburgh, San Diego and Seattle — are just georgeous in every conceivable way. Honestly, you don’t have to like baseball at all to enjoy just going to the parks and taking it all in. The beauty is particularly compelling in Pittsburgh, maybe because people don’t always appreciate how beautiful a city Pittsburgh is. My old friend, the late Skip Prosser, used to say that coming through the Fort Pitt tunnel and dumping into downtown Pittsburgh was the most beautiful site in the world.

“More beautiful than Paris?” I would ask him.

“Paris?” he said. “Give me a break.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 12:39 PM | 98 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. Rennie's Tenet Posted: May 17, 2017 at 12:47 PM (#5457461)
I think Posnanski should do a ranking of the 100 greatest ballparks of all time, or maybe just numbers 30-100.
   2. aberg Posted: May 17, 2017 at 12:56 PM (#5457474)
I like how he approached this ranking, both in the categorization of like ballparks and the infusion of his personal tastes. There are so many of these lists that lack insight and are only clickbait.
   3. jmurph Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:03 PM (#5457485)
My old friend, the late Skip Prosser, used to say that coming through the Fort Pitt tunnel and dumping into downtown Pittsburgh was the most beautiful site in the world.

Prosser was obviously overdoing it a bit much there, but that is a beautiful view.
   4. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:16 PM (#5457510)
The Best Places to Watch a Game: AT&T Park (San Francisco); Kauffman Stadium (Kansas City); Oriole Park at Camden Yards (Baltimore); PNC Park (Pittsburgh); Petco Park (San Diego); Safeco Park (Seattle).

Four of these — San Francisco and Pittsburgh, San Diego and Seattle — are just gorgeous in every conceivable way.


I don't know how or why Camden Yards didn't make that cut. I'll let midwesterners stick up for Kansas City.

The beauty is particularly compelling in Pittsburgh, maybe because people don’t always appreciate how beautiful a city Pittsburgh is.


This is true, but much of that non-realization probably has to do with Pittsburgh's somewhat outdated reputation as perhaps the most smoke-and-smog polluted city in the country. And with its blue collar identity, it's hard to shake that reputation completely among those whose idea of Pittsburgh consists of fan shots at Steelers' games.
   5. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:36 PM (#5457532)
The best ballpark & ballpark experience I've ever been to has been Pittsburgh. The ballpark design is excellent. The view of the skyline & Clemente Bridge is beautiful. You have the river running adjacent to the right field stands. It's very affordable even downright cheap. You can buy the cheapest seat in the place and hang out by that spiral walkway in left field and get an excellent view. You can park your car across the bridge for about $5-10. They close the Clemente bridge before a game so you can walk across. I'd probably go to 40-50 games a year if I lived in Pittsburgh.

The most underrated city in the U.S. is Pittsburgh IMO.

Wrigley Field in the afternoon is an excellent experience. Chicago is a very underrated city as well.

Camden Yards is still a great experience.

The worst place I've ever been to was the old Kingdome in Seattle.

I haven't been to Fenway since the 1990's. It was nice because of the history but it felt like an old factory wedged into an industrial area.

The weirdest place I ever visited was Le Stade Olympique in Montreal.

Citi Field is nice but it's so damn expensive to get into NYC now. It costs me $50 just in tolls & parking to get to Citi Field from N.J. I'm not crazy about that upper deck in left field, I think it would look & feel better if it mirrored the right field Pepsi/Coke Porch. The enormous left field (great wall of flushing) was a major screw up in design. I have no idea why they didn't taylor that ballpark to fit David Wright's strengths as he entered his age 26 season.
   6. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:43 PM (#5457540)
From Error #4:

This is true, but much of that non-realization probably has to do with Pittsburgh's somewhat outdated reputation as perhaps the most smoke-and-smog polluted city in the country. And with its blue collar identity, it's hard to shake that reputation completely among those whose idea of Pittsburgh consists of fan shots at Steelers' games.


Yeah my perception of Pittsburgh before I went there was a combination of clips from the Deer Hunter, smokestacks and old industrial run down areas.
   7. villageidiom Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:54 PM (#5457561)
I don't know how or why Camden Yards didn't make that cut.
It has a view of Baltimore.
   8. Traderdave Posted: May 17, 2017 at 01:55 PM (#5457563)

The most underrated city in the U.S. is Pittsburgh IMO


Concur.
   9. SoSH U at work Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:04 PM (#5457575)
I'll let midwesterners stick up for Kansas City.


In the case of KC, there's nothing around the ballpark but parking lots and Arrowhead Stadium.
   10. Baseballs Most Beloved Figure Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:11 PM (#5457582)
Kauffman has my favorite scoreboard. The fans are very nice as well, I get the opposite feel there that I sometimes get at Yankee Stadium or Dodger Stadium where I feel as if something bad might happen at any moment.
   11. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:22 PM (#5457597)
I have no idea why they didn't taylor that ballpark to fit David Wright's strengths as he entered his age 26 season.

Rather shortsighted, don't you think, to build a ballpark to suit a team's signature player when that signature player is so likely to change over the 15 years that is the lifespan of the modern mallpark?
   12. BDC Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:28 PM (#5457601)
I still haven't been to enough current parks to comment much on overall rankings (beyond agreeing that Fenway and Wrigley are great, and Pittsburgh is beautiful).

Most of my extremes relate to bygone ballparks. The worst was Shea, which, as I often say, was still better than most other places on earth. The O in Montreal, I agree with JohnQ, was weird, if very pleasant.

My favorite ballpark experience, easily, was the RF bleachers in the Bronx when the Yankees weren't very good in the 1980s, and you could walk up any night and get a $3 ticket.

I have tickets to an entire three-game series, Rangers in St. Petersburg, later this summer. I am intrigued by Poz's characterization "dark and a little bit dangerous." The Bronx was like that in the '80s. too :)

Speaking of dangerous, I may someday be able to win a BBTF tontine as the last Primate to have seen a game in Connie Mack / Shibe. (Though I hope not for a long time if it means outliving Andy :) The neighborhood around Connie Mack was scary in the 1960s when we used to go there, but it was always for day games and I remember the park itself as bright and beautiful.
   13. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:40 PM (#5457613)

I don't know how or why Camden Yards didn't make that cut. I'll let midwesterners stick up for Kansas City.


I would guess location for both. The other four have terrific locales, as far as I know - I'm visiting Safeco for the first time this summer and am excited about it.

AT&T Park is still my favorite, would like to get to Pittsburgh sometime. Camden Yards is still a gem. I liked Nats Park quite a bit, although I know other people have said its a bit generic.

My worst stadium experience ever was the Metrodome, where my seats faced the outfield, rather than home plate, followed by RFK Stadium, which was not yet equipped for baseball really.
   14. bigglou115 is not an Illuminati agent Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:41 PM (#5457615)
For the record, he actually singles those 4 out for their aesthetic appeal within their City, they are part of the group of best places to watch a game along with Kaufman.

He only actually ranks 29, I'm guessing he hasn't been too SunTrust yet and so didn't rank it. Based on there rest of the article I'm guessing he'd put in on the"almost" category, above "weird" and below "not quite Camden."
   15. Batman Posted: May 17, 2017 at 02:43 PM (#5457621)
Rather shortsighted, don't you think, to build a ballpark to suit a team's signature player when that signature player is so likely to change over the 15 years that is the lifespan of the modern mallpark?
There was a story that the White Sox let Ed Walsh help design what became old Comiskey. That led to the White Sox winning so many World Series that they had to start losing some on purpose.
   16. SoSH U at work Posted: May 17, 2017 at 03:08 PM (#5457649)
I have no idea why they didn't taylor that ballpark to fit David Wright's strengths as he entered his age 26 season.


Hey, Sam's back.

For team-building purposes, I believe organizations would be better off building parks that favor the pitcher than ones that are hitter-friendly. Fewer pitches means fewer visits to Doc Yocum.
   17. Bourbon Samurai is disturbed by bagel developments Posted: May 17, 2017 at 03:11 PM (#5457650)
The parks I have been in order that I enjoyed them. Camden has suffered I think from the Hilton blocking what used to be an unobstructed view.

AT&T Park
Camden Yards
Wrigley
Tokyodome
Fenway
Nats Park
Jamsil Baseball Stadium (seoul)
Old Yankee Stadium
Dodger Stadium
New Yankee Stadium
Old Memorial Stadium
Shea Stadium
Comiskey Park
Miller Park (Dome up)
   18. dlf Posted: May 17, 2017 at 03:25 PM (#5457676)
For many folks, their favorite park is the first one they went to as a child. Unfortunately, for me, that was Shea when my grandfather took me to watch the Yankees during the YSII renovation year. As a kid, I went to a ton of games, both baseball and football, at the old Met in Bloomington. I have incredibly fond memories of games there seeing Rod Carew, Fran Tarkenton, Butch Wynegar, the Hon. Alan Page, the much less honorable Disco Dan Ford and the like. The other park I visited a lot as a kid was the Murph, a park that took the beauty of San Diego and slaughtered it like a baby seal.

Worst was the Kingdome, but a game at Shea when the weather was bad and the LGA (JFK?) flights directed that way could come close.

Most unique was seeing an Angels - Expos game in San Juan when the league owned the latter and was trying to extract every last dime from Washington. The park itself seemed like a 1930s WPA construct but the fans were amazing and the pina colada vendors going through the stands added to the charm.
   19. Tom Nawrocki Posted: May 17, 2017 at 03:55 PM (#5457715)
When I was a kid, my family took a baseball vacation, going to see games at Riverfront Stadium, Three Rivers Stadium, Veterans Stadium and Shea Stadium. Four stinkers. At least back home we got to go to Wrigley and Comiskey.
   20. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:00 PM (#5457726)
When I was a kid, my family took a baseball vacation, going to see games at Riverfront Stadium, Three Rivers Stadium, Veterans Stadium

Did they call it the "Same Sh*t, Different Day" tour?
   21. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:00 PM (#5457727)
For many folks, their favorite park is the first one they went to as a child. Unfortunately, for me, that was Shea

Unfortunately for me, that was The Mistake by the Lake to watch a moribund mid-70's Indians team.
   22. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:01 PM (#5457729)
Worst was the Kingdome,

Oh, man, that place was miserable. Went there when I was 14, toward the end of its existence. I'd never known that going to a baseball game could be a depressing experience.
   23. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:04 PM (#5457733)
From SoSH #16:

Hey, Sam's back.

For team-building purposes, I believe organizations would be better off building parks that favor the pitcher than ones that are hitter-friendly. Fewer pitches means fewer visits to Doc Yocum.


I don't know who Sam is so I don't get the reference.

I think it's better overall to just to build a neutral park.

The Mets built and extreme pitcher's park. D. Wright's strength was his opposite field power and they extended the walls 10-20 ft. in right center. Then they had LF walls that were 12-15' in height. The Walls in center went from 10-16' in height and the walls in right went from 8-18' in height.

O.K. they wanted to build a park around pitching, so the first big free agent they sign is a slugging right handed LF (Jason Bay)?? Then they start to develop some young pitching and they bring the walls in.
   24. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:09 PM (#5457739)
Dodger Stadium is decades newer than the other two, and I think it is the best park in baseball for combining the wonderful history of an old ballpark with a startlingly modern vibe. Plus: Dodger Dogs.
NO! Dodger Dogs aren't just overrated - they're flat-#### BAD.
   25. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:10 PM (#5457742)
I get the opposite feel there that I sometimes get at Yankee Stadium or Dodger Stadium where I feel as if something bad might happen at any moment.
I never get that at DS. And the worst game I've seen for fights was Yankees-Angels in Anaheim.
   26. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:13 PM (#5457746)
From Billy Ripken #22:

Oh, man, that place was miserable. Went there when I was 14, toward the end of its existence. I'd never known that going to a baseball game could be a depressing experience.


I was about 30 when I went there and I had the same experience. It felt dark and gloomy and it was like being at a tracker pull or something. It made the Vet in Philadelphia feel like Wrigley Field by comparison. It was also the first time I experienced West Coast baseball. It felt more like going to a movie theatre then a baseball game.

It was odd too because the on-field product was great with Griffey jr., A-Rod, Randy Johnson, Edgar, etc.
   27. dlf Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:14 PM (#5457748)
I don't know who Sam is so I don't get the reference.


Sam M. is an openly gay professor at Brandeis Law in Louisville who used to post here a lot, is a big Mets fan, and strongly opined favorably on every aspect of David Wright, both as a baseball player and as eye candy. Not to be confused with Sam H aka Rickey. I miss Sam M's contributions here even if I'm strongly prejudiced against his type - Met's fans.
   28. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:17 PM (#5457752)
I was about 30 when I went there and I had the same experience. It felt dark and gloomy and it was like being at a tracker pull or something. It made the Vet in Philadelphia feel like Wrigley Field by comparison. It was also the first time I experienced West Coast baseball. It felt more like going to a movie theatre then a baseball game.

It was odd too because the on-field product was great with Griffey jr., A-Rod, Randy Johnson, Edgar, etc.

Yep, that was it exactly. Dreary florescent lighting, sterile turf environment, etc. At least you got some good baseball - it was Griffey's rookie year when I was there (I guess the place stuck around longer than I remembered), the team was terrible, and Griffey was hurt and didn't play.
   29. vortex of dissipation Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:30 PM (#5457769)
I'm not trying to defend it, but the Kingdome had a completely different feel depending on how full it was. With 15,000 people in there, it was dull and gloomy. In 1995 and 1997, when there were 40-50 thousand fans screaming their lungs out, it was raucous, and if not a great place to see a game from a baseball point of view, it was one of the greatest, loudest atmospheres you could imagine. But yes, when it was dull, it was brutal.
   30. Tom Ryan Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:30 PM (#5457771)
Always pleased to see someone ranking Yankee Stadium III, or The Yankee Mall, way down the list. It is after all the home of Monument Garage and was delivered by Astronaut Randy Levine. I'm a Yankee fan and perfectly happy never to go there again.
   31. Lassus Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:46 PM (#5457789)
The Kingdome was a shithole, but all you Shea-haters have no sense of urban poetry.

I mean, really, how many of you had actually walked around in 1995 Yankee Stadium anywhere but the seats? It was like being in a subway tunnel.
   32. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 04:58 PM (#5457807)
I enjoyed the article (especially the kind words about Pittsburgh), and broadly agree with most of the conclusions, but doesn't anybody proof Joe's stuff anymore? At a glance, I saw "just georgeous", "the most beautiful site in the world", "dont’ know", "steal girders", and "reallky exciting".

Get your #### together, Medium.
   33. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:10 PM (#5457820)
The big problem with Shea were the seats and the points of view because it was a multi purpose stadium. The outfield field level seats were expensive and terrible because you were facing the CF not the pitcher. As a result, you had to twist your body across a metal bar to watch the batter & pitcher. The first 3 rows of the lodge, Mezzanine and Upper level reserved were bad because of all the vendors that would walk past. The last five rows of the lodge & Mezzanine were limited viewing because of the overhang. The upper level reserved seats were terrible because they were so high up.

The best seats were the lodge box. The best value were outer lodge box. Infield field level was good but overpriced. The Mezzanine box was pretty good and the lodge reserved after row 3 was good.

You could buy an upper deck seat and then sneak down to the back rows of the lodge prettty easily.
   34. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:29 PM (#5457835)
My favorite ballpark experience, easily, was the RF bleachers in the Bronx when the Yankees weren't very good in the 1980s, and you could walk up any night and get a $3 ticket.

I went to New York twice in high school just to see a week's worth of Yankee games. This was in 1960 and 1961, and while the games were exciting and Maris homered 4 times in a doubleheader, the atmosphere seemed kind of staid. The year before that, it seemed half the crowd was rooting for the Orioles. I got to YS2 during the World Series against the Reds, and it was like a wake. Of course there was a very good reason for that, given that it was one of the more lopsided Series ever played, and the Yankees were on the receiving end.

I've been to close to 30 stadiums, and while Tiger, Wrigley, Camden Yards and Safeco are the most scenic, for atmosphere I don't think Baltimore's Memorial Stadium or Fenway can be beat, or Candlestick when the Dodgers were in town in the middle of a pennant race and fires 'n' fights were breaking out in the stands. But there was nothing quite like Section 34 in Memorial Stadium while the late Wild Bill Hagy was holding forth at the rate of about two beers an inning.

Speaking of dangerous, I may someday be able to win a BBTF tontine as the last Primate to have seen a game in Connie Mack / Shibe. (Though I hope not for a long time if it means outliving Andy :) The neighborhood around Connie Mack was scary in the 1960s when we used to go there, but it was always for day games and I remember the park itself as bright and beautiful.

The only time I went to Connie Mack was in 1966, when I took a train up from DC to see a doubleheader with the Dodgers. I thought that Koufax was scheduled to pitch in one of those games, but since he'd pitched only three days earlier I should've known better.

Loved the ballpark, though. I can still smell the popcorn and hot dogs, and a foul ball came within two rows of where I was sitting. And IIRC the train station was right outside the RF wall, and you could exit via the field. That was a common feature of many of the older parks, another fine tradition eradicated by the corporate set.
   35. BDC Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:30 PM (#5457837)
how many of you had actually walked around in 1995 Yankee Stadium anywhere but the seats? It was like being in a subway tunnel

True, I mostly just went straight in the RF gate and up to my seat. Yes, it was pretty awful behind the scenes. I remember two depressing stands with week-old hotdogs, and the whole area under the bleachers was badly-lit and filthy. I loved that place :)
   36. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:35 PM (#5457839)
My worst stadium experience ever was the Metrodome, where my seats faced the outfield, rather than home plate, followed by RFK Stadium, which was not yet equipped for baseball really.

That's true, but for football RFK may have been one of the best fan experiences in the NFL, as long as you weren't sitting in the 100 sections where your view was blocked by the players and coaches on the sidelines. During the Allen and first Gibbs era I don't think there was any team with a greater HFA than the Redskins, and if you went by yourself you could always get a good seat at face value from a desperate last minute scalper.
   37. ESPaul Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:48 PM (#5457847)
The place I know the best is Fenway. Seats down the 3rd baseline, regardless of level, are almost universally great, with the only disadvantage being that you can't see balls hit into the left field corner. (Doesn't bother me much.) But if you're deep in right field, especially under the overhang, it's torture -- bad sight lines, narrow seats, narrow aisles, and weirdly lots of distorted noise. Terrible for watching the game.

Been to Yankee Stadium once this year, and while it's still not great, it seems much better. Attribute that to 1) a better team and 2) the center field re-do. Mostly the former. Boy it was dreary last year. And the moat-protected seats are still embarrassingly empty.
   38. 6 - 4 - 3 Posted: May 17, 2017 at 05:53 PM (#5457851)
Best current ballpark? AT&T

Worst current ballpark? Oakland Coliseum

I went to a couple dozen Mets games at Shea growing up in CT and a couple dozen A's games after we moved to Northern CA. Shea wasn't great (worst part about it was the food--absolutely terrible), but Oakland is considerably worse.
   39. Brian C Posted: May 17, 2017 at 06:15 PM (#5457868)
I went to Pittsburgh a few years back, and while I wouldn't say that the view coming out of the tunnel is the most beautiful in the world, it's quite astonishing. I had no idea it would be like that, and driving in from the airport I was baffled - the signs indicated that downtown Pittsburgh was only a couple miles away, but I could see no city. Then you go into the tunnel and bam! It just spits you out downtown, like Super Mario coming out of a pipe. It's breathtaking even after you do it a couple of times.

I enjoyed the city and the ballpark quite a bit. There aren't a ton of cities with truly unique geography but Pittsburgh is one of them.
   40. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 06:23 PM (#5457878)
From BDC#12:

My favorite ballpark experience, easily, was the RF bleachers in the Bronx when the Yankees weren't very good in the 1980s, and you could walk up any night and get a $3 ticket.


That was a great value and a very good experience because Right Field wasn't vary far away in Yankee Stadium II. That was also back in the days when the George Washington Bridge only cost $2-3 to cross and come back. The parking was about $5. I was a Met fan but went to a lot of Yankee games back in the 1980's in those bleachers. We would just jump in the car at the spur of the moment and go to a game with $10-15 dollars in our pocket. Even with inflation, that's only about $30 and that would cover bridge tolls, ticket, parking, 1 hot dog and 2-3 beers.

That was also back in the days when the Yankees would only have about 15,000-20,000 people at a game. You could buy an $8 upper level seat at Yankee Stadium and easily sneak down to the field level. No one would be sitting in the right field field level and there were no ushers over there. You could still do that well into the mid 1990's because the big crowds didn't start coming until 1998. I can remember that Deer Park water would give you a buy 1 get one free ticket with 5 UPC Bar codes. And they were still doing this as late as 1997-1998. So you could buy a $20 outfield field level seat and get a free ticket and you would only be sitting about 3-4 rows from the field.
   41. Khrushin it bro Posted: May 17, 2017 at 07:22 PM (#5457949)
I still love Oakland Coliseum. It was better with the ice plant and view of the hills. The crazy fans, tail gating, cheap tickets and hot dogs (buns are stale though). If you spend some cash and get the seats right next to the bullpen you can bullshit with the players which is always fun. I will miss it when it's gone so hopefully they do a good job with the new stadium.
   42. Bote Man Posted: May 17, 2017 at 07:41 PM (#5457957)
That's true, but for football RFK may have been one of the best fan experiences in the NFL

Probably true. When the Nationals arrived in 2005 the fans took full advantage of the bouncy-ness of the seats that were rolled out from their stowed (football) position to their extended baseball configuration and thus without the solid support of fixed grandstands. Charlie Slowes noted it in the inaugural home broadcast and the team promised to mimic that behavior in Nats Park, but alas the stands do not bounce there. I was afraid that if enough people jumped up and down in unison that the combined stress would collapse the stands underneath them.
   43. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 17, 2017 at 08:49 PM (#5458010)
Double post, see below
   44. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 17, 2017 at 08:51 PM (#5458011)
My favorite ballpark experience, easily, was the RF bleachers in the Bronx when the Yankees weren't very good in the 1980s, and you could walk up any night and get a $3 ticket.


That was a great value and a very good experience because Right Field wasn't vary far away in Yankee Stadium II. That was also back in the days when the George Washington Bridge only cost $2-3 to cross and come back. The parking was about $5. I was a Met fan but went to a lot of Yankee games back in the 1980's in those bleachers. We would just jump in the car at the spur of the moment and go to a game with $10-15 dollars in our pocket. Even with inflation, that's only about $30 and that would cover bridge tolls, ticket, parking, 1 hot dog and 2-3 beers.

Approximate budget for my week-long trip to New York from DC in 1961, for the Mayor's Cup game against the Giants and 4 games each against the White Sox and the Orioles:

Bus fare northbound: $4
Train fare southbound: $6
Lower 5th Avenue Hotel (6 nights): $60
Meals (Howard Johnson's & ballpark): $28
Subway rides (7 round trips) $2.10
Tickets (7 general admission, upper deck behind the plate): $9.10
Programs (9, including 2 doubleheaders): $0.90

Total cost: $110.10, or about $897.40 in today's dollars.

I wonder how much this sort of a trip would cost today?
   45. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:32 PM (#5458035)
I'm in for putting Pittsburgh and San Francisco's parks as my favorite all around ballpark experiences, with San Diego in 3rd. (a nod to Fenway and Wrigley, but they still must be punished for both having repulsive elements).

I don't think Seattle (Safeco) is quite in that upper tier, but will lead any group in denouncing the Kingdome as my least favorite. Safeco has handled the retractable roof design the best (thus far), whereas all other retractable roofs have flat out killed the beauty of the day game due to the imposing shadows from the roof panels (Hat tip to Harveys, as that was his chief beef with Miller Park). I'll support Kaufmann Stadium as a top 10 park, and yes it is a parking lot oasis, bordered by interstates, but that's not a big bug, to me. Of course most of my ballgame experiences was spent tailgating outside of Co. Stadium. There's something extremely attractive about that experience to Midwesterners.

one other random stadium comment (I've been to a game at 35 past or present MLB parks): I remember feeling slightly guilty for ripping on Yankee Stadium when asked what I thought about it, after my first visit. The in the stands crowd atmosphere was the best, but the reference above to the Subway Tunnel is how I described it.
   46. VCar Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:34 PM (#5458039)
Been to 20-25 stadiums, and Kingdome is near the bottom. But the 1 game I saw there was great. Mussina vs Johnson in 98 (I'm an O's fan). Figured on a pitchers' duel, but both were gone by the 6th. O's down by 1 with 2 outs in the 9th and 2 strikes on Raffy, who singles home 2 to put them ahead to stay.
   47. BDC Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:40 PM (#5458044)
I'll spend a bit more than $897 (not much, though) to fly to Florida and see three games on July. Interesting era conparison.
   48. PreservedFish Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:46 PM (#5458047)
I still love Oakland Coliseum.


Me too.

I have a lot of affection for the old cookie cutter stadiums. A lot of it is just me being sentimental - I grew up going to Shea as often as I could. A lot of it is selfishness - I really love to buy a cheap ticket and feel like I have a section all to myself.

But to put it simply, at the Oakland Coliseum I feel like I can concentrate on baseball to whatever extent I want, whereas the experience at AT&T is fraught with distractions. Also, you don't need to take a ####### blanket to a game in Oakland.
   49. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:57 PM (#5458058)
Sam M. is an openly gay professor at Brandeis Law in Louisville who used to post here a lot, is a big Mets fan, and strongly opined favorably on every aspect of David Wright, both as a baseball player and as eye candy. Not to be confused with Sam H aka Rickey. I miss Sam M's contributions here even if I'm strongly prejudiced against his type - Met's fans.


In addition to this, Sam was adamant that the Mets should have reconfigured an already-constructed Citifield because of what it was doing to Wright's power. He was kind of alone in that position.

And yes, he is missed.
   50. PreservedFish Posted: May 17, 2017 at 09:59 PM (#5458062)
Total cost: $110.10, or about $897.40 in today's dollars.

I wonder how much this sort of a trip would cost today?


The cheapest non-hostel non-flophouse non-dormitory hotel in Manhattan for a random few days in July appears to be The Jane. I've stayed there before, it's in the West Village, which is my favorite neighborhood on earth, but the room was literally the same footprint as a queen bed. A twin bed and then about 12 square feet next to it. It costs about $90 per night. Shared bathroom in the hall.

Edit > the only item in Andy's list that is comparatively cheaper today is probably the bus, with the rise of the unbelievably cheap Chinatown services.
   51. PreservedFish Posted: May 17, 2017 at 10:00 PM (#5458063)
In addition to this, Sam was adamant that the Mets should have reconfigured an already-constructed Citifield because of what it was doing to Wright's power. He was kind of alone in that position.


What's more notable now is that he was the biggest Daniel Murphy backer on the site.
   52. JohnQ Posted: May 17, 2017 at 10:14 PM (#5458073)
From Jolly Old St. Nick #44:

Bus fare northbound: $4
Train fare southbound: $6
Lower 5th Avenue Hotel (6 nights): $60
Meals (Howard Johnson's & ballpark): $28
Subway rides (7 round trips) $2.10
Tickets (7 general admission, upper deck behind the plate): $9.10
Programs (9, including 2 doubleheaders): $0.90

Total cost: $110.10, or about $897.40 in today's dollars.

I wonder how much this sort of a trip would cost today?


Wow, do you have a photographic memory or do you still have the complete itinerary and cost for your triple written down somewhere?

The inflation rate is about 8X from 1961, so that's about $500 for the hotel. I'd have to think that a lower 5th avenue hotel would be much more expensive now. I just stayed at a Marriot in Poughkeepsie for 1 night and it cost me $175 for a double. I would think the hotel rates would be the biggest increase.

The tickets cost you about $75 adjusted for inflation. I would imagine the same seats in the new stadium would roughly cost you about $200 for 7 games.

Programs are like magazines now full of ads and they cost about $10. You paid about $7.50 in 2017 dollars for your programs. They would cost you about $80 now.

The subway rides cost you about $16 in today's dollars. The same ride would cost you about $42.
   53. Bote Man Posted: May 17, 2017 at 11:57 PM (#5458124)
What's more notable now is that [Sam M.] was the biggest Daniel Murphy backer on the site.

O, the irony.
   54. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:25 AM (#5458131)
I also loved Oakland Stadium. When I lived in the Castro it was before PacBell opened and getting to Candlestick with no car was a nightmare. Also, the stories were famously true, it was cold and miserable. I had a brief moment one night where I considered throwing myself off the back of the upper deck into the parking lot because hitting the ground would actually make me warm.

Because of all this - and Tim Hudson - I would take the BART out to Oakland stadium. Faster, cheaper, friendlier. I spent three seasons watching AL games like a traitor. A warmer, happier traitor.
   55. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:28 AM (#5458135)
A twin bed and then about 12 square feet next to it. ... Shared bathroom in the hall.

Pretty sure that fails the "non-dormitory" test.
   56. theboyqueen Posted: May 18, 2017 at 01:06 AM (#5458142)
I also loved Oakland Stadium. When I lived in the Castro it was before PacBell opened and getting to Candlestick with no car was a nightmare. Also, the stories were famously true, it was cold and miserable. I had a brief moment one night where I considered throwing myself off the back of the upper deck into the parking lot because hitting the ground would actually make me warm.


For people my age (40), growing up in the south bay, I almost can't imagine becoming a Giants' fan. Oakland had a team full of flashy stars (Canseco/McGwire/Rickey/Stewart/etc), were good every year, played in a lovely stadium that was always packed, and had Bill King and Lon Simmons calling the games. The Giants had the most miserable stadium experience imaginable (everything about it including just getting there), an endless array of prematurely balding white guys, never won anything, a manager who seemed to be several generations bygone (hum baby), and the "U-ribe" chants.

It's pretty amazing how the situation has completely inverted since.
   57. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 18, 2017 at 01:22 AM (#5458146)
For people my age (40), growing up in the south bay, I almost can't imagine becoming a Giants' fan. Oakland had a team full of flashy stars (Canseco/McGwire/Rickey/Stewart/etc), were good every year, played in a lovely stadium that was always packed, and had Bill King and Lon Simmons calling the games. The Giants had the most miserable stadium experience imaginable (everything about it including just getting there), an endless array of prematurely balding white guys, never won anything, a manager who seemed to be several generations bygone (hum baby), and the "U-ribe" chants.

You must have selective amnesia for 1989 - I'm the same age as you and grew up in Champaign, IL, so of course the Cubs' 1989 playoff appearance was a big deal. But that Giants team had its fair share of excitement. I vividly remember loving the battle of sweet-swinging first basemen, Mark Grace vs. Will Clark (hairline notwithstanding). Plus the Giants had Kevin Mitchell, who was beyond badass that year. Granted, Robby Thompson and Scott Garrelts didn't exactly inspire passion, but still.

All that said, I loved those A's teams as well. Even had a replica '70s gold and green jersey.
   58. shoewizard Posted: May 18, 2017 at 01:33 AM (#5458148)
In chronological order of experience. Not the most impressive list, and missing some of the iconic stadiums, but eventually I'll get there.

1964 Shea
1968 Old Yankee
1985 Old Busch
1988 Veterans
1992 Kingdome
1998 Chase
2001 AT&T
2001 Coliseum
2006 New Busch
2007 Dodger
2007 Petco
2016 Angels

By the way, Royals attendance Tanking Hard off by most in basell, a whopping 18% from last year, back down to 26K a game
   59. theboyqueen Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:06 AM (#5458150)
You must have selective amnesia for 1989


Believe me, I don't -- the earthquake makes that year hard to forget. But sweeping the Giants in the midst of getting worked by the Dodgers and the Reds seems kind of fitting for the era, in retrospect.

It also always seemed like half the Giants' starting rotation could have gotten discounts at Denny's (Reuschel, Krukow, Don Robinson who seemed much older than he actually was). For myself and my friends, the team always seemed like a weird joke compared to the A's.
   60. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:13 AM (#5458151)
It also always seemed like half the Giants' starting rotation could have gotten discounts at Denny's (Reuschel, Krukow, Don Robinson who seemed much older than he actually was).

Fair point, although Reuschel probably had been cut off at Denny's years prior. But wasn't Robinson actually fairly old? I thought he came up for a few cups of coffee with the Pirates in the late '70s/early '80s before sticking around.

EDIT: Upon looking it up, I am completely wrong. Robinson pitched 100+ games between 1978-1981, but in my defense, that would support him being old.
   61. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 03:51 AM (#5458154)
For the most part, I thought Poz’ evaluation was pretty good.

The more ballparks I go to, the more underrated I find Comerica. (Also, the more I miss Tiger Stadium. I feel for any stadium fan who never got to go there.)

Every time I go to Fenway, I’m annoyed by people constantly walking in front of me and the narrow seats. I leave disappointed, yet for whatever reason, can’t wait to go back.

Went to Dodger Stadium in 95. (Saw Sammy Sosa hit the 10,000th home run in Cubs history, same weekend Mantle died.) I could not figure out what the big deal was. Maybe you need to be a Dodgers fan but there was nothing I found to be unique.

Shea was a sh**hole, but it was my sh**hole. Saw hundreds of games there and even though I enjoy Citifield, nothing can replace the feelings your childhood ballpark engenders.

The latest Yankee Stadium is an abomination. Poz gave this mausoleum a pass. In fairness, the exterior is beautiful and corridors are roomy. Of the 25 +/- MLB parks I’ve been to, once you are sitting in your seat, YS3 is the worst of the lot. Antiseptic and aesthetically abominable are the best things I could say about it. Loudest noise I'd ever heard at a ballpark was Girardi's triple in Game 6 of 96 WS. Compare that to the acoustically-challenged YS3 which sounds like a cricket-fest (the bug, not the sport). Then again, how much noise can a couple of thousand empty seats enclosed in concrete make?

Was at the opening day of YS2 where I saw the aforementioned disco Dan Ford hit the first home run. The corridors really felt like tubes. The interesting thing about the life span of YS2 is the transformation of the surrounding neighborhood. When it first opened, it was scary. When it closed, it was absolutely fine.

I got the Camden thing when I took my first road trip there in 93. Since then, I’ve been to most of the non-West Coast new ballparks (I hate 5+ hour flights!), and most of them are great, though PNC really did stick out. While still fun, Camden is no longer unique.

I think Poz was a little unfair to Houston. It's quirks were/are a bit contrived (left field seemed absurdly close) but a great place to watch a game and exponentially better than the Astrodome. I remember going to a Cubs series and with the radar consistently showing between 100 & 102 mph for Kerry Wood and, moreso, Kyle Farnsworth. That bit of absurd Texas hyperbole was occasionally interfered with the latest falling price of Enron's stock price.

Visited Coors last week to watch Cubs series; great ballpark and fans, the latter being the norm outside of the northeast.

Have decided it’s time to increase visits to minor league ballparks. Tired of the major league expense and don’t enjoy large crowds or parking jams after games. Would appreciate suggestions on must-see MiLB ballparks, especially if there are multiple ballparks within reasonable driving distance of each other.
   62. dlf Posted: May 18, 2017 at 08:31 AM (#5458195)
Have decided it’s time to increase visits to minor league ballparks. Tired of the major league expense and don’t enjoy large crowds or parking jams after games. Would appreciate suggestions on must-see MiLB ballparks, especially if there are multiple ballparks within reasonable driving distance of each other.


The Pensacola Blue Wahoos stadium is too new to be iconic, but it's great. Think San Fran's new waterfront park shrunk down to AA size. It is right on the water and a poke just over the LF fence goes into the Gulf of Mexico. As a perk, the beaches along the Florida panhandle and into Alabama are gorgeous. As far as other nearby parks, Mobile is an hour to the west and Biloxi another hour and a half then on into New Orleans about an hour further West. Heading north, Montgomery, Jackson and Birmingham are all within about 4 hours of P'cola and Jacksonville is about that far to the east, plus down from the panhandle there are a ton of low minor league teams.
   63. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 08:45 AM (#5458204)
Have decided it’s time to increase visits to minor league ballparks.

The Utica Blue Sox are available.


Would appreciate suggestions on must-see MiLB ballparks

Except for this part. It's basically bleachers. But you're only like 90 minutes from Cooperstown!
   64. john_halfz Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:09 AM (#5458218)
I submit the following based on my visits

1) Wrigley; 2) PNC; 3) Busch; 4) Fenway; 5) AT&T; 6) Dodger; 7) Camden; 8) Safeco; 9) Coors; 10) Yankee Stadium II 11) Miller; 12) Progressive; 13) Comerica; 14) Petco; 15) Shea; 16) Citi; 17) Nationals; 18) Great American; 19) Yankee Stadium III; 20) Angels; 21) New Comiskey; 22) Candlestick; 23) Turner; 24) Metrodome 25) Oakland; 26) Citizens Bank; 27) Tropicana

This reflects atmosphere and aesthetics and has nothing to do with my interest in the teams. When people sing along to Here Comes the King, even though the Cardinals are loathsome, Busch is way up the list.
   65. JohnQ Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:16 AM (#5458222)
From dejarouehg#61:

Shea was a sh**hole, but it was my sh**hole. Saw hundreds of games there and even though I enjoy Citifield, nothing can replace the feelings your childhood ballpark engenders.


It all depended when you went to Shea and where you sat. Shea in a decent seat during the summer when the Mets were playing well in a crowded ballpark was pretty good. There was ample parking and it was easy to get in and out. Shea in September or April could be lousy because of the cold wind from Flushing Bay. It made it even worse if the team was lousy.
   66. TomH Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:36 AM (#5458239)
How can you love Oakland? Drab, gloomy, and last August (wife & I's first visit there) I needed my gloves and ski mask for a game in early August. There were so few fans (and 1/3rd of them decked in Oriole Orange for the visitors), and with the bullpens warming up so close to the field, I thought for sure this was some exhibition game that didn't really "count" in the standings. The pitchers could throw the ball down the middle, as with the wind that night howling in, no one could hit a baseball more than 330 ft.
   67. Nasty Nate Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:51 AM (#5458251)
But if you're deep in right field, especially under the overhang, it's torture -- bad sight lines, narrow seats, narrow aisles, and weirdly lots of distorted noise. Terrible for watching the game.
I agree, and I avoid sitting there. But I do have a fondness for that area, and will sometimes stroll down there. It really feels like old Fenway, and the people there are an interesting rag-tag mix.
   68. JohnQ Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:53 AM (#5458255)
This is how I would rank the MLB ballparks I visited:

The Top
1-PNC (Pittsburgh) Best overall experience, affordable as well.
2-Wrigley-great atmosphere during a weekday afternoon. Seats in the 200 level behind home plate are great and relatively cheap.
3-Yankee Stadium II-great atmosphere late 70's mid-late 90's, good views from seats and surprisingly affordable during the 70's, 80's, 1990's early 2000's.
4-Camden Yards-great atmosphere & experience.
5-Fenway (mid 1990's, I think it's nicer now)

Next
6-Citi Field (Mets), big step up from Shea but it's missing some things.
7-Citizens Bank (Phillies) I think this was a bit underrated of the new parks.
8-Milwaukee County Stadium (Underrated Ballpark)
9-Shea Stadium (Under the right circumstances it could be good, under different circumstances it could be awful)
10-Yankee Stadium III, It's like a huge airport terminal. Equally impressive & impersonal. Expensive. Most class conscious ballpark in MLB.

Bottom
11-Le Stade Olympique (Expos, most bizarre & unique experience at a MLB game. You could get a great seat really cheap with the exchange rate. I sat right behind the Expos dugout for $25 American in 2000)
12-KIngdome (poor lighting, grey, dull but I watched Griffey Jr, A-Rod, Randy Johnson & Edgar in 1996).
13-Veteran's Stadium (Dull, bland & generic)
   69. PreservedFish Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:57 AM (#5458258)
How can you love Oakland? Drab, gloomy, and last August (wife & I's first visit there) I needed my gloves and ski mask for a game in early August.


Oakland has some of the best weather in the country. You got unlucky.
   70. Brian C Posted: May 18, 2017 at 10:09 AM (#5458273)
Have decided it’s time to increase visits to minor league ballparks. Tired of the major league expense and don’t enjoy large crowds or parking jams after games. Would appreciate suggestions on must-see MiLB ballparks, especially if there are multiple ballparks within reasonable driving distance of each other.

There was a recent thread on MiLB ballparks here headed by a pretty good article.

Minor league ball is a lot of fun, and cheap, and there are tons of places to go. I try to take at least a couple of weekend road trips each summer to hit up new places - easy to do in the midwest.
   71. zack Posted: May 18, 2017 at 10:19 AM (#5458284)
I've never been, but I'm gonna be sad when the Rays leave the Thunderdome. Sure, it's ugly and terrible, but when you flip a game on you know instantly it's in Tampa regardless of the shot.

I've mentioned before my fondness for similarly-crap RFK. Adjusted for inflation, the $3 tickets to get a whole section to yourself are...$3.75. And the stadium is in easy biking distance. Can't beat it.

Would appreciate suggestions on must-see MiLB ballparks, especially if there are multiple ballparks within reasonable driving distance of each other.

I assume you've been to Cyclones games? Bowman Field in Williamsport, PA is ancient and beautiful.
   72. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 10:34 AM (#5458289)
I assume you've been to Cyclones games?

To continue my traitorous ways, the ferry to the stadium and view and complete overall experience is far better for the Staten Island Yankees. Broooklyn and its inhabitants are all so tiresome, and the Cyclones is a total tourist experience; but those SI Yankee games are pure baseball. (Which is how I always felt about Shea and Yankees' stadiums, in reverse.)

One minor league park that mirrored the Kingdome for awfulness was whatever they had in Portland OR for awhile, 90s/2000-ish? I don't even know if it's still there.
   73. SandyRiver Posted: May 18, 2017 at 11:32 AM (#5458359)
all you Shea-haters have no sense of urban poetry.

I mean, really, how many of you had actually walked around in 1995 Yankee Stadium anywhere but the seats? It was like being in a subway tunnel.


Had some decent Shea experiences, but also my worst in my (limited) MLB-game experience. Mid 60s, Dodgers in town which always filled the place, and our seats were in the uppermost of all those multicolored decks, about 2 rows from the top and 5 seats from the rightmost edge. It really seemed like we were closer to the airliners coming from La Guardia than to home plate. It was about this time of year but the weather was far from today's 90F forecast - closer to 60 with strong winds, and I'd dressed for baseball, not late season football. Game was terrible, too, if one liked the Mets. Early in the game one Dodger led off with a single, stole 2nd, next batter singles and the throw to home wasn't remotely close, batter takes 2nd. Repeat 2-3 times. Why the OFs kept making futile throws to home, and why no one thought of cutting them off for a play at 2nd... It was like watching a HS team playing a LL farm team.

Really liked pre-reno YS - last game seen there was 1968 when it was still 461 to (slightly left) center. It was like a cavern with the height of the 3rd deck and the overhanging façade - probably felt that way for infielders and batters, too. The 3rd deck was nearly as steep as an I-Max theater, so even when high above we'd be relatively close to the field.

for atmosphere I don't think Baltimore's Memorial Stadium or Fenway can be beat,


I think that atmosphere at Memorial depended on context. In spring 1966 things were rocking, with good play and newly-arrived Robbie doing amazing things. In 64-65 (early/late season, during the college terms) the park was rarely more than 1/4 full, except for the one Colts game I attended. I think it was a game in late season 1965 when the crowd was so tiny that the infield chatter was clearly audible to my upper deck seat.
   74. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 18, 2017 at 11:51 AM (#5458392)
From Jolly Old St. Nick #44:

Bus fare northbound: $4
Train fare southbound: $6
Lower 5th Avenue Hotel (6 nights): $60
Meals (Howard Johnson's & ballpark): $28
Subway rides (7 round trips) $2.10
Tickets (7 general admission, upper deck behind the plate): $9.10
Programs (9, including 2 doubleheaders): $0.90

Total cost: $110.10, or about $897.40 in today's dollars.

I wonder how much this sort of a trip would cost today?


Wow, do you have a photographic memory or do you still have the complete itinerary and cost for your triple written down somewhere?


I've got a pretty good memory, but I also like to double check when the info is available to do so.

The room price at the long gone Grosvenor Hotel on 5th Avenue near 8th Street I definitely remember. There was another hotel called the Van Rensselaer (sp?) a few blocks east that was only $5, but the rooms there were kind of creepy so I decided to splurge.

When I dug out the programs, I discovered they were 15 cents, not a dime, so that would have added 45 cents to the total. But the $1.30 general admission ticket price was right, and though the concession prices weren't listed, all I ever ate there were a couple of hot dogs and sodas, and they couldn't possibly have come out to more than a buck a game.

The 15 cent subway prices I confirmed by googling.

The bus and train prices were educated guesses from memory, but I think they're pretty accurate.

The Howard Johnson's restaurant prices were if anything an overestimate, especially since my meals there consisted of nothing but hamburgers and milkshakes.

And the CPI inflation index says that $1.00 in July of 1961 is now worth $8.15.

And as you show, nearly all those prices today have gone up way beyond the CPI, and when I checked StubHub for similar seats for midweek games against the Royals and the Red Sox, the Royals game prices began at only $15, or about $4.40 more than the CPI, but the same seat for the Red Sox game would be $45. Needless to say, dynamic pricing wasn't around then, and anyone with $1.30 could get a seat right behind the plate no matter who the opponent was.

OTOH you couldn't fork over $24.53 a year back then and get to watch every Major League game on your TV in HD color. Not all the changes have been for the worse.
   75. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:03 PM (#5458417)
I think that atmosphere at Memorial depended on context. In spring 1966 things were rocking, with good play and newly-arrived Robbie doing amazing things. In 64-65 (early/late season, during the college terms) the park was rarely more than 1/4 full,

In 1961 friend of mine and I skipped school to see a twi-night DH in Baltimore when Maris had hit 58 home runs with 3 games to go before he got to the 154th game, which was the unofficial deadline for breaking Ruth's record, revisionist history to the contrary. We left the Trailways station in downtown DC around 7:00 in the morning and got to Memorial Stadium around 9:00, certain that there'd be lines already forming. Instead, as it turned out the stadium was empty, but the gates were open and until the ushers showed up around 3:00 we had the whole joint pretty much to ourselves. The attendance that night was 31,317, which considering the weather wasn't that bad (it easily beat the crowd in New York for Maris's 61st), but considering what we thought it would be, we could've slept in. The crowd mostly came to root against Maris, who went 1 for 8, but that was when Baltimore fans treated visiting teams like Duke fans treat Carolina. It was an entirely different era.
   76. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:06 PM (#5458425)
Wrigley.................... Seats in the 200 level behind home plate are great and relatively cheap.


Shoosh, one of the few bargains left. Hidden gems should remain hidden.

And to all, thanks MiLB info.
   77. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:22 PM (#5458460)
It all depended when you went to Shea and where you sat.


First game September 1972, four rows behind home plate. $4.50 seats! (Bob Robertson hit a hanging Jerry Koosman curveball in direction of LF bullpen. To my 8 yr old eyes, I thought it went over. Saw Clemente get hit 2991. Mother told us she had a crush on Richie Hebner, who when he mailed it in for the Mets years later, rented a house one block over from ours. Never told my mom about it.)

First Shea game with son, ironically within 15 feet of my first game seats, $150 (or $165) per ticket in 2002 (?) vs Red Sox.

I sat everywhere in the place. The day before or day after Pete Rose hit 3 home runs in 78, we spent a freezing cold night in the top row of the GA seats ($1.50), because we wanted to be by ourselves. Why we didn't move down in the freezing cold was beyond me but we had good view of the LGA runway through the back screen.

Best was loge, especially between the bases. Was great to see everyone else get foul balls.

I hated the glare sitting in the field boxes on 3B side, or watching the wrappers and garbage swirl in the outfield for 5 innings. When I brought friends from out of town to Shea, never a kind word was heard.

But, while I can easily forget names and numbers of people I've just met at business encounters, I have vivid recall on games back to a 73 double-header when, sitting in lousy upper deck seats that our neighbor bought, I watched the Cards sweep the Mets and Seaver lose. Not sure which still hurts more, seeing Seaver lose or being forced to leave mid-way through the second game.


   78. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:49 PM (#5458501)
Broooklyn and its inhabitants are all so tiresome


Thank you!

Agree with JohnQ re: Shea. Could be a great experience (Doc Gooden vs Montreal, 50,000+ in the park, the whole building shaking), or utterly wretched (a hot summer day, you're dressed in a t-shirt, but you're sitting in the shade and the wind comes swirling in at 20 mph so it feels like about 60 degrees). Early 80s, bad team, you could walk up, get a $3 general admission ticket, they wouldn't bother to open the upper deck, so you could wander the mezzanine and find a good spot. Then they crossed us up, got good for a few years, priced us out of the market.
   79. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 18, 2017 at 12:55 PM (#5458510)
Not sure which still hurts more, seeing Seaver lose or being forced to leave mid-way through the second game.


Saw The Franchise at Shea in '81, when he was with the Reds. He won, every Mets fan in the place went home happy.

Opening Day in '83, the Mrs and I decided to go to Shea for his return. Able to get cheap seats way way way up. He matched goose eggs with Carlton for 6 innings, Mets finally scored in the 7th or 8th, Doug Sisk added 3 shutout innings for the win. Great day.
   80. JohnQ Posted: May 18, 2017 at 01:53 PM (#5458603)
From Hysterical & Useless #78:


Agree with JohnQ re: Shea. Could be a great experience (Doc Gooden vs Montreal, 50,000+ in the park, the whole building shaking), or utterly wretched (a hot summer day, you're dressed in a t-shirt, but you're sitting in the shade and the wind comes swirling in at 20 mph so it feels like about 60 degrees). Early 80s, bad team, you could walk up, get a $3 general admission ticket, they wouldn't bother to open the upper deck, so you could wander the mezzanine and find a good spot. Then they crossed us up, got good for a few years, priced us out of the market.


I can remember going to a Friday night Dwight Gooden game in May of 1984 and the place was nuts, like a rock concert. That was one of the best experiences I ever had at a baseball game. I went to Shea in August of 1975 to see the Dodgers and we sat in the Mezzanine on the the third base side. It felt like it was 40 degrees because of the wind coming off of Flushing Bay. I went to an August 1987 game against the Phillies and the place was insane. Gary Carter hit 2 HR and the Mets scored 6 runs in the 5th and 13 runs overall. I went to a September 1997 game and the Mets were out of it and it was about 40 degrees in the place.
   81. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 01:56 PM (#5458607)
Saw The Franchise at Shea in '81, when he was with the Reds. He won, every Mets fan in the place went home happy.


Saw him, I think in 79, shut out the Mets at Shea, 8-0. I remember him hitting a double. (I was always fascinated with pitcher's batting.) It was only the second game I saw him win in person though he clearly didn't throw as hard as he did. Never had great seats when he pitched. (I wanted to sit where the photographer was who took his picture for the 1974 Topps card. (Hate that card, love the angle.))

Doug Sisk, well that brings back memories, most of which consist of balls in the dirt that didn't fool anyone in games that mattered. That day might have been his career peak.
   82. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:00 PM (#5458615)
I can remember going to a Friday night Dwight Gooden game in May of 1984 and the place was nuts, like a rock concert.


I went to a Gooden game in May 84. I remember they played the Dodgers, Doc struck out 14, Pedro Guerrero hit a monster blast (loudest noise on a batted ball I've ever heard other than Jay Buhner hitting a HR at YS to the ambulance in LF)over the LCF bleacher area - don't recall if bleachers were actually in place at the time. Crazy game. Ended on a ball to RF (Danny Heep?) who relayed to Kelvin Chapman to Mike Fitzgerald to nail tying run at home to end the game. It was awesome. Also remember that I went with a college friend who was born the same day JFK was shot. Yet, I can't remember most of my passwords.
   83. dejarouehg Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:01 PM (#5458617)
Saw The Franchise at Shea in '81, when he was with the Reds. He won, every Mets fan in the place went home happy.


Saw him, I think in 79, shut out the Mets at Shea, 8-0. I remember him hitting a double. (I was always fascinated with pitcher's batting.) It was only the second game I saw him win in person though he clearly didn't throw as hard as he did. Never had great seats when he pitched. (I wanted to sit where the photographer was who took his picture for the 1974 Topps card. (Hate that card, love the angle.))

Doug Sisk, well that brings back memories, most of which consist of balls in the dirt that didn't fool anyone in games that mattered. That day might have been his career peak.
   84. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:05 PM (#5458623)
Doug Sisk... That day might have been his career peak.


He was really good for a short time, but the ball moved so much he was always either walking people or pitching behind in the count. Kept the ball in the ballpark as well as anybody.
   85. Khrushin it bro Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:13 PM (#5458636)
I echo the statements about the 80's A's versus Giants where the Giants were boring (minus Will the Thrill, Kevin Mitchell and maybe Matt Williams) and Candlestick being terrible. I was born in 1980 and am indifferent towards the Giants and love the A's. I guess all my Giants friends fell for the catchy ads and didn't actually go watch games. Either that or they didn't notice that it took forever to get to Candlestick and that it was super cold.
   86. Nasty Nate Posted: May 18, 2017 at 02:27 PM (#5458659)
Shea was the first non-Fenway baseball park I went to, and I was in awe of its size upon approach as viewed through the opening in the outfield.
   87. base ball chick Posted: May 18, 2017 at 03:34 PM (#5458753)
of course i loved the Dome

i never get why people don't like the Box real too particular much. it's fine

i also don't get what is wrong with having parking lots all around the stadium, unless it means it takes forever to get in and out

i LOVE sam M

why did he leave?
   88. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 03:51 PM (#5458787)
i LOVE sam M
why did he leave?


Some dick kept giving him a hard time on a legal question. I think Sam was feeling the exposure given his public presence outside the site.
   89. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 03:56 PM (#5458793)
Shea was the first non-Fenway baseball park I went to, and I was in awe of its size upon approach as viewed through the opening in the outfield.

Unable to get in, I watched about 9 outs of a sliver of the 2000 WS game 1 with binoculars from the subway platform and/or stair platform, don't remember exactly which. Cops kept shooing me off and finally threatened to take me in if I didn't cut out.
   90. base ball chick Posted: May 18, 2017 at 04:01 PM (#5458800)
88. Lassus Posted: May 18, 2017 at 03:51 PM (#5458787)
i LOVE sam M
why did he leave?

Some dick kept giving him a hard time on a legal question. I think Sam was feeling the exposure given his public presence outside the site.


GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

like WHICH lawyer her knows more constitutional law than sam?????????????????????????????

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
   91. JohnQ Posted: May 18, 2017 at 05:27 PM (#5458917)
From Dejarouehg #82:

I went to a Gooden game in May 84. I remember they played the Dodgers, Doc struck out 14, Pedro Guerrero hit a monster blast (loudest noise on a batted ball I've ever heard other than Jay Buhner hitting a HR at YS to the ambulance in LF)over the LCF bleacher area - don't recall if bleachers were actually in place at the time. Crazy game. Ended on a ball to RF (Danny Heep?) who relayed to Kelvin Chapman to Mike Fitzgerald to nail tying run at home to end the game. It was awesome. Also remember that I went with a college friend who was born the same day JFK was shot. Yet, I can't remember most of my passwords.


I'm almost 100% certain that was the game I went to. Just looked it up at baseball reference. It was Friday May 25, 1984, Memorial Day Weekend. Gooden didn't pitch another Friday home game in May. He pitched 2 Friday home games in June but the Mets lost both of them. The Mets won 2-1. Gooden struck out 14 and only gave up 3 hits and walked 3. Rick Honeycutt started for the Dodgers and was relived by Pat Zachary. George Foster hit a HR and drew a walk. It was one of the last MLB games Rick Monday ever played in. He only played about 20 MLB games after that and was finished by June of '84.

It was the top of the 9th with the Mets up 2-0. Gooden gave up the HR to Guerrero so it was 2-1. D. Johnson brought in Orosco to pitch. Lemmie Miller hit a fly ball to 1b for the first out. Steve Yeager pinch hit for Mike Scioscia and hit a fly ball to left for the second out. Jose Morales pinch hit for Terry Whitfield and hit a single. Dave Anderson came in to pinch run for Terry Whitfield. Danny Heep didn't play in that game. R. J. Reynolds hit a double to CF, Mookie Wilson relayed it to Kelvin Chapman then to Mike Fitzgerald to get Anderson out at the plate.

That was the first time I went to game with just a group of friends. We were 17-19 years old and we took my friend's mom's Pinto station wagon. My 19 year old friend bought us beers because the drinking age was 19 in N.Y. It was the first time I was in Shea Stadium in 5 years and there was a lot of buzz about this Gooden kid. We sat in the upper deck behind home plate and for some dumb reason we decided to sit all the way on the last two rows. Then we thought we were so cool because we were still in high school drinking beers in public. I do remember Gooden striking out 10+ and the place going nuts. That was also the first time I ever saw a ballpark doing the Wave. I also remember running out of Shea towards the car and it was pandemonium. People were screaming & cheering and I remember some guys throwing fire crackers. Easily one of the best times I ever had a baseball game.
   92. The Honorable Ardo Posted: May 18, 2017 at 06:34 PM (#5458955)
#1: Wrigley
#2: Everywhere else (and I've been to AT&T and Safeco).

Then again, I grew up at old Tiger Stadium, so Wrigley's main concourse, trough urinals, pillars, and great (as noted by others) upper-deck seats behind home plate give me warm fuzzy feelings.
   93. No.19 Posted: May 18, 2017 at 09:21 PM (#5459057)
Well, haven't been to that many ballparks, but I am an Oakland A's fan so have been to the Coliseum plenty of times. It's definitely not attractive, but the new management has actually spent some effort this season to spiff it up with murals, better beverage options, and food trucks! Plus the newish video screens are tons better than the old ones. I hear the A's offer of a monthly pass for $19.99 is closing quickly; it'll be interesting to see how many people take advantage of it.

I have to admit, though, that although Oakland is usually warmer than San Francisco, night games at the Coliseum are still often pretty chilly!
   94. villageidiom Posted: May 19, 2017 at 09:01 AM (#5459171)
How can you love Oakland?
They play baseball there.

I mean, we can ##### about any stadium as not measuring up to the others, but the worst MLB stadium has baseball. It's great.
   95. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 19, 2017 at 09:29 AM (#5459184)
Pinto station wagon


That car was da bomb!

Literally.
   96. dejarouehg Posted: May 19, 2017 at 10:07 AM (#5459203)
I mean, we can ##### about any stadium as not measuring up to the others, but the worst MLB stadium has baseball. It's great.
Amen.

From what I've seen of A's fans on TV, they seem to have a blast in spite of the ballpark and independent of the team's record. Reminds me of Brewers fans in the early 90's. Went to a game in August 93 between MWB and DET and the parking lot was jammed for tailgating. Had to be more people in the lot than ever came into the ballpark.
   97. PepTech Posted: May 19, 2017 at 11:53 AM (#5459294)
I enjoyed the article (especially the kind words about Pittsburgh), and broadly agree with most of the conclusions, but doesn't anybody proof Joe's stuff anymore? At a glance, I saw "just georgeous", "the most beautiful site in the world", "dont’ know", "steal girders", and "reallky exciting".
+1 to Vlad's comments; this kind of thing really annoys me for some reason. If Joe is just throwing stuff online, the least he could do is spellcheck; that would catch the egregious ones, although "steal" girders would probably still get through.

Mind you, I type lousy, but I'm not getting paid for my words, either. And I have enough pride to fix what I can, once I notice it. This article has been up for a couple of days now; it's hard to believe someone hasn't made someone aware.
   98. theboyqueen Posted: May 19, 2017 at 02:11 PM (#5459435)
I have to admit, though, that although Oakland is usually warmer than San Francisco, night games at the Coliseum are still often pretty chilly!


The problem was particular to Candlestick in the summer (which is the foggiest, windiest season there...the weather for 49er games was usually lovely since they played in the fall/winter during the daytime). That place, at night, in the summer, is definitely the coldest place on earth.

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