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Friday, August 11, 2017

Josh Reddick: the Astros are “down in the dumps” about the team standing pat at the trade deadline

Still, there are many who believe that the Astros failing to land a starting pitcher such as Justin Verlander, Sonny Gray or Yu Darvish bodes ill for the team’s chances and these folks have spent the past two weeks feeling kind of deflated. They’re not just fans, either. Some of the disappointed folks are Houston Astros players.

Astros outfielder Josh Reddick was on MLB Network Radio on SiriusXM yesterday and he had this to say about the front office’s lack of moves:

“I think deep down everybody in that clubhouse knew we were going to make some moves to make us a really great team to a team that put us over the edge, especially with all the moves you see moving around the league. It’s nothing against our guys, we are a great team, but any time you can make your team better you feel like should have the opportunity to do that and take full advantage. I think deep down, we all were, I don’t know if you want to say disappointed or upset, I guess we were just kind of down in the dumps because we feel like we had a pretty good shot at getting somebody to help this team get over that hump to where we needed to be.”

The Astros could still make a trade — Justin Verlander has cleared waivers and could be had, albeit for a hefty price in terms of prospects, salary obligations or both — but I find it odd that a player has the same viewpoint of fans who think a strong team MUST make a big deadline deal.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:25 PM | 42 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: astros, josh reddick

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   1. Bourbon Samurai is disturbed by bagel developments Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:36 PM (#5511377)
Keuchel was complaining about this too. i don't remember ever hearing a team's players complain like this at the deadline before.
   2. bfan Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:37 PM (#5511379)
I guess he was out of school that day they went over leverage, which he has just handed the Tigers in any negotiations with the Astros. Seriously, STFU. This helps no one except the guy who just got you to run your mouth, and the Tigers.
   3. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:40 PM (#5511387)
I guess the Astros aren't very confident in themselves.
   4. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:41 PM (#5511389)
I guess he was out of school that day they went over leverage, which he has just handed the Tigers in any negotiations with the Astros. Seriously, STFU. This helps no one except the guy who just got you to run your mouth, and the Tigers.

No. It helps the Astros players. They want their management to get reinforcements, and don't care if they overpay.

Keuchel and Reddick couldn't care less if the Astros give up some prospects who'll make the team better in 2021. They probaly won't be there. They want to win now.

The interests of the Astros players do not align with those of the ownership and the fans.
   5. Tim D Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:46 PM (#5511399)
Who ever had "leverage" in school? Economists? MBA's? Not baseball players. They see a chance to win now and they want more. They couldn't give a crap for even next year, let alone the "window." It's pretty simple.
   6. Khrushin it bro Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:50 PM (#5511406)
The interests of the Astros players do not align with those of the ownership and the fans.


The players think short term, so do fans a lot of times. I'm sure most baseball fans in Houston want them in the world series right now while they are good. They could have gotten Yu Darvish without selling the farm, just beating the Dodgers offer.
   7. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: August 11, 2017 at 02:51 PM (#5511409)
Who ever had "leverage" in school? Economists? MBA's? Not baseball players.

In fairness, the concept might have come up in the physical sense for the kinesiology majors, if they ever went to class.
   8. Tim D Posted: August 11, 2017 at 03:02 PM (#5511424)
Touche'
   9. bfan Posted: August 11, 2017 at 03:08 PM (#5511430)
The misalignment of interests is a good point, and it gets very interesting on a roster-wide basis. This also may reflect that Reddick is really thinking very strategically, here. To get a pitcher (who does not compete for a position and playing time with Reddick), the Astros might trade some of their surplus of young outfielders (Fisher; Tucker 1; Tucker 2; Cameron), with whom Reddick will compete for playing time next year. So he should be yapping, because it makes his team better and his position more secure.

You know who shouldn't be saying much of anything? Starting pitchers.

   10. Lars6788 Posted: August 11, 2017 at 03:27 PM (#5511457)
Last I checked Reddit has a guaranteed contract and while he could be made expendable, he's not quite the guy you are looking to dump unless you have a reasonable facsimile of an all-star talent waiting in the minors.
   11. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: August 11, 2017 at 03:28 PM (#5511459)
Who ever had "leverage" in school?


Kinematicians!
   12. Tim D Posted: August 11, 2017 at 03:30 PM (#5511466)
Guessing, but I doubt Reddick had it at Georgia Middle College.
   13. LA Podcasting Hombre of Anaheim Posted: August 11, 2017 at 04:50 PM (#5511522)
Last I checked Reddit has a guaranteed contract
4chan, on the other hand, can be DFA'd immediately.
   14. The Duke Posted: August 11, 2017 at 06:02 PM (#5511559)
He needs Crash Davis course in dealing with the media. Stupid thing to say. It won't be the first time or last time a player says something stupid.
   15. Bug Selig Posted: August 11, 2017 at 06:31 PM (#5511569)
Who ever had "leverage" in school?
Engineers.
   16. Walt Davis Posted: August 11, 2017 at 06:34 PM (#5511571)
Yep, a nearly mint 4/$52 contract through 2020 in his hands, Reddick isn't all that worried about Messrs Tucker et al. Meanwhile Quintana, Gray and Verlander would be around for another 2-3 years so would help in the short- and medium-term (to varying degrees at varying costs). The prospect price on Quintana was high and the one on Verlander might be too but Gray could have been had for less than their top prospect. And the Dodgers didn't have to give up either of their top 2 for Darvish.
   17. Greg K Posted: August 11, 2017 at 06:41 PM (#5511574)
It would be fun if Reddick specifically laid out who on the 25-man roster he wanted replaced.
   18. I am Ted F'ing Williams Posted: August 11, 2017 at 07:25 PM (#5511592)
I believe Freud would call this penis envy.
   19. Satan Says Posted: August 11, 2017 at 07:25 PM (#5511593)

Keuchel was complaining about this too. i don't remember ever hearing a team's players complain like this at the deadline before.

It's a common player sentiment. You heard similar things two seasons back from the Dodgers when they didn't go after Cole Hamels.
   20. LA Podcasting Hombre of Anaheim Posted: August 11, 2017 at 07:31 PM (#5511594)
It's completely understandable from a player's point of view. I hate it when people say that this is"stupid." It's such a dismissive, arrogant, and needlessly mean sentiment.
   21. Satan Says Posted: August 11, 2017 at 07:42 PM (#5511600)
Not sure why public honesty is such a terrible thing. Workers will always havw a diffwrent perspective from management.
   22. Tin Angel Posted: August 11, 2017 at 08:56 PM (#5511627)
It's completely understandable from a player's point of view. I hate it when people say that this is"stupid." It's such a dismissive, arrogant, and needlessly mean sentiment.


Agreed, but it is one thing to feel this way and another to say it to the press. As mentioned above, it does nothing except make it harder for the Astros to get a deal done.
   23. Satan Says Posted: August 11, 2017 at 09:41 PM (#5511665)
it does nothing except make it harder for the Astros to get a deal done.

How so?
   24. bfan Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:03 PM (#5511689)
It's a common player sentiment. You heard similar things two seasons back from the Dodgers when they didn't go after Cole Hamels.


and who would not be a part of this dodgers team now if they had gotten Cole Hammels?
   25. bfan Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:05 PM (#5511690)
It's completely understandable from a player's point of view. I hate it when people say that this is"stupid." It's such a dismissive, arrogant, and needlessly mean sentiment.


No; if he really feels that way, I am sure he has the GM's cell phone number. Just call him, or better yet, walk up there and talk to him. Saying this stuff through the press does no one any good (except the Tigers).
   26. The Duke Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:23 PM (#5511722)
It's absolutely a stupid thing to say - in public. As an employee, if I call a member of the press and tell him that my Board should have increased the dividend this quarter and we are all disappointed that it didn't get done that's a firing offense. If I say to my buddies at lunch, it's fine.

Got a gripe with the boss? Pick up the phone and air it out. Don't call a reporter.

   27. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:25 PM (#5511725)
The 3 or 4 guys at the bottom of the Astros' roster must love this talk. Hope they're rookies.
   28. Joyful Calculus Instructor Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:47 PM (#5511745)
This from a guy whose numbers were down in the dumps after getting traded last year.
   29. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 11, 2017 at 10:56 PM (#5511754)
It's absolutely a stupid thing to say - in public. As an employee, if I call a member of the press and tell him that my Board should have increased the dividend this quarter and we are all disappointed that it didn't get done that's a firing offense.

Well, if you had a 4 year, $52M contract, it wouldn't be stupid, because you'd be praying that they fire you. That way you get all $52M and can go work for someone else, earning even more.
   30. DFA Posted: August 12, 2017 at 02:16 AM (#5511802)
The 3 or 4 guys at the bottom of the Astros' roster must love this talk. Hope they're rookies.


Agree. It kind of surprises to think that mid season acquisitions don't cheapen the eventual ring, maybe? I don't know if I'm putting it right. But from all the meetings in February, to the drills, to the meaningless games in March when you are ready to go, doesn't that kind of strengthen the bond in October? When I hear the completely understandable sentiment, I wonder about the guys who would be replaced, the guys who won't pitch in the 7th inning or pinch hit for the pitcher in the 6th. Of course, it's been a long time since my team won a World Series, so what do I know?
   31. Joyful Calculus Instructor Posted: August 12, 2017 at 09:17 AM (#5511817)
[29] No. The new team pays the league minimum and it gets deducted from the first team's obligation in that case.
   32. Astroenteritis Posted: August 12, 2017 at 10:36 AM (#5511826)
I don't remember so much complaining from players about a team's failure to make deadline moves. It makes me wonder if there isn't some deeper, underlying issue or contentiousness between players and management. It's going to be interesting to see how the rest of the season plays out, but it's hard to believe the morale of a team in their position in the standings could take such a sudden downward spiral. It doesn't speak well of the players' belief in themselves. Of course if you're pitching the way some of them are right now it wouldn't lead to much confidence.
   33. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 12, 2017 at 10:56 AM (#5511832)
[29] No. The new team pays the league minimum and it gets deducted from the first team's obligation in that case.

I understand that, I was talking about an employee in the real world. If I had a 4 year guaranteed contract, the absolute best thing that could happen to me professionally would be getting fired.

It doesn't speak well of the players' belief in themselves.

I think Keuchel and Reddick believe in themselves, they just think a bunch of their teammates are crappy.
   34. LA Podcasting Hombre of Anaheim Posted: August 12, 2017 at 12:06 PM (#5511849)
When I hear the completely understandable sentiment, I wonder about the guys who would be replaced, the guys who won't pitch in the 7th inning or pinch hit for the pitcher in the 6th.
Nobody bats an eye when general managers, front office guys, owners, fans, and analysts talk about replacing guys. When players say it, it's supposed to be something crazy? Reddick cares about those borderline guys on the roster like everyone else: they're important to the extent that they help him and the team wins games. The fact that he shares a clubhouse with some of those people doesn't mean he can't be friendly, civil, and professional with them even as he sees (first hand!) that they aren't an asset to the team. As for the replaceable guys, those guys are pros. They know what's up. I don't see the Dodger or Yankee clubhouses get all weepy because someone had to be kicked to the curb to make room for Gray or Darvish.

Players don't always speak out so honestly, so I get that it's a little surprising that Reddick did. For both him and Keuchel to broadcast the same sentiment speaks to the idea that a bunch of other guys in the Astros clubhouse feel exactly the same way.
   35. Baldrick Posted: August 12, 2017 at 01:28 PM (#5511870)
I was pretty skeptical of "the Astros are screwing themselves by not making a move" as a narrative, but this is definitely a strong data point in favor of it being a mistake.
   36. JJ1986 Posted: August 12, 2017 at 02:17 PM (#5511887)
Glancing at their roster, it seems pretty clear that Mike Fiers is the guy who'd be replaced.
   37. Shibal Posted: August 12, 2017 at 04:20 PM (#5511944)

I don't remember so much complaining from players about a team's failure to make deadline moves. It makes me wonder if there isn't some deeper, underlying issue or contentiousness between players and management.


Doesn't Luhnow have a reputation of treating players more like commodities than people? I don't think you'd hear that from the clubhouse publicly if they thought otherwise.

   38. Walt Davis Posted: August 12, 2017 at 08:10 PM (#5512051)
At the moment, their rotation is Keuchel, Fiers, Morton, Peacock and a warm body. So if they made a trade, it's the warm body that loses a rotation spot and maybe a roster spot. When McCullers comes off the DL, they would have a choice if everybody else is healthy. Peacock has been pitching well this year but it's the first time he's had real success in the majors and he started the year in the pen so he probably goes back to the pen. Come the playoffs, they'd have a choice between Fiers and Morton. Fiers certainly has the better career track record.
   39. JJ1986 Posted: August 12, 2017 at 08:21 PM (#5512056)
Collin McHugh is healthy now, so I'd have him and Morton as the 3/4 when McCullers returns and Fiers as the #5. That ignores that Peacock has been better than all of them this year, but I think he'd be the first one moved to the bullpen.
   40. Dog on the sidewalk Posted: August 12, 2017 at 08:23 PM (#5512058)
You're forgetting McHugh who, while he has not looked great since he's come back, has been pretty good the past few years. He's got to be ahead of Fiers.

edit: JJ wins
   41. base ball chick Posted: August 13, 2017 at 12:06 AM (#5512209)
the astros are looking as bad in the second half as they looked good in the first

the starters look awful (excewpt for, hard to believe, peacock) and the bullpen looks worse. even devenski is struggling.

youneverknow when things are gonna come together and shrugging things off because "everything" is supposed to gel next year is exactly how the natinils screwed themselves.

if the players are this openly NOT happy, this is not saying good things. remember the shawn chacon/ed wde thingy that went down 10 or so years ago??
   42. Random Transaction Generator Posted: August 13, 2017 at 03:28 PM (#5512382)
i don't remember ever hearing a team's players complain like this at the deadline before.


Jose Bautista complained about the Jays inactivity at the deadline in 2014. They were 1.5 games back of the division lead going into the game on August 1st.

The Jays then proceeded to go 9-17 and fall out of playoff contention by the end of the month (10 games back of the division, 9.5 back of the (only) wild card).

Edit: And in 2015, AA remembered all of that and decided to go for it...and it was fantastic.

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