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Wednesday, August 29, 2012

Josh Sale, Marcus Stroman To Serve 50-Game Suspensions

Stroman tested positive for methylhexaneamine, which is mostly used as a nasal decongestant or weight loss drug, while Josh Sale was caught using “methamphetamine and an amphetamine”. Sale is the fourth Tampa minor leaguer to get popped for meth this year - they may want to look into that, at some point.

Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: August 29, 2012 at 01:24 PM | 39 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: drugs, general, prospects, tampa bay rays, toronto blue jays

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   1. The District Attorney Posted: August 29, 2012 at 03:09 PM (#4221479)
You should have scared White Sox fans by just going with "Sale To Serve 50-Game Suspension".

Sale is the fourth Tampa minor leaguer to get popped for meth this year
Andrew Friedman is the one who knocks!
   2. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: August 29, 2012 at 03:10 PM (#4221480)
Too bad for Stroman. Many thought he had a fast-track to the bigs and could have even pitched in Toronto this September.
   3. Simpson Posted: August 29, 2012 at 03:50 PM (#4221535)
Dumb question, but isn't methamphetamine... meth? Why is that considered PED vs. a drug of abuse?
   4. Swedish Chef Posted: August 29, 2012 at 03:55 PM (#4221549)
methylhexaneamine

Sweden's only professional baseball player, Bryan Berglund, tested positive for this a couple of weeks ago and got a 50-game ban. What's worse, the Marlins released him after that.
   5. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:05 PM (#4221557)
Why is that considered PED vs. a drug of abuse?


I think it's a PED because meth users also pop for generic "amphetamine", which is on the PED list. I could be wrong, though.

Sale was playing pretty well for a guy on meth: .264/.391/.464 this year.
   6. Swedish Chef Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:08 PM (#4221567)
I bet that in most cases they don't use it to get wasted but to get a little extra energy, it certainly so was in the case i referred.
   7. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:24 PM (#4221594)
Too bad for Stroman. Many thought he had a fast-track to the bigs and could have even pitched in Toronto this September.

High-quality "Blue Jay meth" has been cooking in Toronto since Mr. (Devon) White played in the Skyler... er, SkyDome.
   8. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:24 PM (#4221595)
I got really worried when I saw the name "Sale" up there. Glad it's not Chris.

This should probably be a Breaking Bad thread. Walter White can go straight to ####### hell.
   9. Simpson Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:30 PM (#4221608)
Thanks Vlad. I've known some people who've been on meth, and it's not a good thing. I hope Sale gets support and treatment if he needs it, rather than just a suspension. It's a very blurry line between being addicted or not.
   10. McCoy Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:37 PM (#4221616)
First, let me say that the episodes this season have generally been pretty good but that it is getting harder to watch Breaking Bad as Walter becomes more and more truly "the bad guy".

People like rooting for the bad guy when he is interesting but they don't really like rooting for the bad guy when he is just a bad guy. I'm not saying the showrunners are doing a poor job with the character. I think they are doing a great job showing his dissent. It is just that Walter just isn't a very nice person to watch and the "interesting" things he does now are usually motivated by very sinister and unlikable things. So you can't root for him any longer.
   11. Paul D(uda) Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:40 PM (#4221621)

Could the Jays call up Stroman so that he can serve his suspension this year in the majors, instead of waiting for next year? (Since there are more games in the mlb season than the minor season)
   12. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:50 PM (#4221636)

People like rooting for the bad guy when he is interesting but they don't really like rooting for the bad guy when he is just a bad guy. I'm not saying the showrunners are doing a poor job with the character. I think they are doing a great job showing his dissent. It is just that Walter just isn't a very nice person to watch and the "interesting" things he does now are usually motivated by very sinister and unlikable things. So you can't root for him any longer.


I don't think the writers want us to cheer for Walt anymore. Seriously, is anybody rooting for Walt anymore? I've lost my patience for Walt around the middle of season 4 (maybe earlier even). I was definitely on Team Gus in season 4. He's lost all sympathy- he's no longer selling meth for his family, he's doing it because he somehow ###### up a partnership a long time ago and he can't let it go.

I've absolutely loved Walt's descent into a desperate killer (because, let's face it, that's basically what he is right now). That doesn't mean I want him to succeed. The day Walter White dies will be one of the most cathartic episodes of TV I will ever watch.
   13. Skloot Insurance Posted: August 29, 2012 at 04:54 PM (#4221644)
From a previous BA suspension story:

"Adderall is a prescription stimulant which contains an amphetamine and is also known to show a positive for methamphetamines on drug tests."

Bet on this (or another prescription ADD med) and not meth as the trigger for the recent rash of methamphetamine suspensions.

<http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/2012/08/mlb-suspends-rays-prospect-ryan-brett-two-bowling-green-teammates>

The Rays tried the trick referenced in comment No. 11 with lefty James Houser following the 2007 season. He got hit with a 50-game suspension mid-season, served half of it but by virtue of being added to the 40-man roster that November, he became a "big leaguer" no longer subject to the minor league drug program or its penalties.

<http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/2008/02/rays-use-technicality-to-get-around-ped-suspension-for-houser>
   14. McCoy Posted: August 29, 2012 at 05:09 PM (#4221669)
I don't think the writers want us to cheer for Walt anymore

I definitely don't think they want us cheering for Walt either and I give them massive kudos for going that route with the character. But it does make it hard to watch.
   15. Walt Davis Posted: August 29, 2012 at 05:38 PM (#4221694)
Dumb question, but isn't methamphetamine... meth? Why is that considered PED vs. a drug of abuse?

I was wondering along these lines too as amphetamines draw first a warning then a 25-game suspension (Mike Cameron). Did that change or is this a minors vs. majors difference?
   16. Greasy Neale Heaton (Dan Lee) Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:12 PM (#4221733)
I'm not sure it'll ever get done, but there's one hell of a book waiting to be written about the 2012 Bowling Green Hot Rods.
   17. Spahn Insane Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:34 PM (#4221747)
This should probably be a Breaking Bad thread. Walter White can go straight to ####### hell.

Seriously--knocking off Mike? WTF was that.
   18. Spahn Insane Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:36 PM (#4221748)
I definitely don't think they want us cheering for Walt either and I give them massive kudos for going that route with the character. But it does make it hard to watch.

I still find it compelling, but then, I'm sort of a masochist when it comes to my TV and movie viewing choices; I'm strangely drawn to ugliness.
   19. The Long Arm of Rudy Law Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:45 PM (#4221751)
You should have scared White Sox fans by just going with "Sale To Serve 50-Game Suspension".


It still worked on me.
   20. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:45 PM (#4221752)
I can't see either Mad Men or Breaking Bad ending happily. Jesse might live but he'll be messed up for the rest of his life. Skylar too. Walt will probably blow up Hank & Marie before he himself is blown up.

Same goes for Mad Men (without the explosions). Don Draper, like Walter White, will continue to drag people into his pit of despair.
   21. Mike Emeigh Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:50 PM (#4221760)
Dirk Hayhurst's take. I especially like this:

What bothers me about this whole issue is there are rules and procedures in place that allow the player to get a substance they are unsure of tested. There are measures to protect them and the organization for this EXACT situation. If you don’t know, you go to the trainers and you get the substance checked out. A player can’t trust a substance bought over the counter because Baseball’s testing scrutiny is more severe than the FDA’s. What normal humans walking on the street can consume, a player cannot not. Players are told this, time after time, in obnoxious, redundant meetings several times a season.


-- MWE
   22. McCoy Posted: August 29, 2012 at 06:57 PM (#4221766)
I can't see either Mad Men or Breaking Bad ending happily. Jesse might live but he'll be messed up for the rest of his life. Skylar too. Walt will probably blow up Hank & Marie before he himself is blown up.


Well, we already at some point in this season Walt gets banished for almost a year and then comes back to town with a rocket launcher in his trunk so something has to go kablooie this season and I think the final season will have Walt meeting his demise.

I don't know if Mad Men is going to end happily. Probably not but I doubt it will end badly either. It'll probably be some Sopranos like ending where we just see the characters going on with their life.
   23. danup Posted: August 29, 2012 at 07:41 PM (#4221786)
Meth is itself occasionally prescribed as a treatment for ADD, as Desoxyn; I've heard anecdotally that in that form it feels less like a high than Adderall, but it's extremely expensive and doctors are justifiably reluctant to prescribe it for other reasons.
   24. ...and Toronto selects: Troy Tulowitzki Posted: August 30, 2012 at 01:44 AM (#4221993)
Well, we already at some point in this season Walt gets banished for almost a year and then comes back to town with a rocket launcher in his trunk so something has to go kablooie this season and I think the final season will have Walt meeting his demise.

Don't think that's quite correct. The scene was showing one year ahead, nothing to do with "banishment" only that he's out of state at that point that he purchases a M60 (I thought, perhaps wrong). On the lamb more than likely considering the plates, his rough appearance.
   25. Jim Kaat on a hot Gene Roof Posted: August 30, 2012 at 04:56 AM (#4222007)
AFAIK all adhd drugs (certainly adderol and vyvanse) break down in the body as amphetamine and so would show in drug testing as identical to meth. That's gotta be what these guys are taking.
   26. Greasy Neale Heaton (Dan Lee) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 10:21 AM (#4222200)
AFAIK all adhd drugs (certainly adderol and vyvanse) break down in the body as amphetamine and so would show in drug testing as identical to meth.
I certainly hope that's not the case, what with me searching for a job while on medication for a raging case of ADHD. I'd prefer not to have to tell potential employers, "No, I don't do meth, that's a prescribed medication."

It seems like it could be true, though, and it wouldn't be difficult to prove the medication was prescribed. Just a pain in the butt.
   27. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: August 30, 2012 at 10:53 AM (#4222250)
AFAIK all adhd drugs (certainly adderol and vyvanse) break down in the body as amphetamine and so would show in drug testing as identical to meth. That's gotta be what these guys are taking.
I'd guess it's more likely "natural" weight-loss drugs than tightly regulated ADHD drugs.

The NY Times reported a year ago that a ton of these "natural" diet pills or supplements contain straight-up drugs. Even a lot of them that aren't skirting or afoul of regulations have amphetamine-like effects.

Given that I assume Stroman at least was looking to cut weight in advance of the draft, I would strongly bet it was a weight loss supplement that he bought over the counter.
   28. Moeball Posted: August 30, 2012 at 11:47 AM (#4222357)
People like rooting for the bad guy when he is interesting but they don't really like rooting for the bad guy when he is just a bad guy.


This is the fine line they have always walked with Dexter, as well.

One thing I've always thought would be fun in a kind of twisted way - what if Dexter had been around in Florida back when Aileen Wuernos ("Monster") was doing her thing? A string of dead guys would have started showing up - as usual, Dexter would have been ahead of the rest of the police on solving the case and identifying the killer - but then he would have realized that the guys Aileen was acing were low-lifes who were probably intent on raping or killing her. Dexter would have then concluded that she was also just "taking out the trash" as he refers to it. What to do, what to do? Does he ice her or does he let her essentially just keep being one of his lieutenants?
   29. Greg K Posted: August 30, 2012 at 12:19 PM (#4222436)
One thing I've always thought would be fun in a kind of twisted way - what if Dexter had been around in Florida back when Aileen Wuernos ("Monster") was doing her thing? A string of dead guys would have started showing up - as usual, Dexter would have been ahead of the rest of the police on solving the case and identifying the killer - but then he would have realized that the guys Aileen was acing were low-lifes who were probably intent on raping or killing her. Dexter would have then concluded that she was also just "taking out the trash" as he refers to it. What to do, what to do? Does he ice her or does he let her essentially just keep being one of his lieutenants?

I've only ever seen the first episode of Dexter, it kind of surprises me that this hasn't come up. Has Dexter not come across any killers he feels share his world view?
   30. The Long Arm of Rudy Law Posted: August 30, 2012 at 12:43 PM (#4222491)
I've only ever seen the first episode of Dexter, it kind of surprises me that this hasn't come up. Has Dexter not come across any killers he feels share his world view?


Julia Stiles played a woman who was kind of his partner for a while.
   31. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 02:15 PM (#4222681)
I've watched the first two seasons of Breaking Bad but had little interest in watching beyond that. Walter letting Jane die was the turning point for me. After that, I just didn't care about the characters, and the ridiculous implausibility of the show in general became too much to stomach.
   32. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 03:53 PM (#4222865)
AFAIK all adhd drugs (certainly adderol and vyvanse) break down in the body as amphetamine and so would show in drug testing as identical to meth. That's gotta be what these guys are taking.

I'd guess it's more likely "natural" weight-loss drugs than tightly regulated ADHD drugs.

You're not kidding about tightly-regulated.

Every month I have to request a paper prescription, and then I've got a short window of time to get it filled. I can't request it too soon, as they won't give it to me (or the insurance won't pay). If I wait too long, I run out. Then I forget to get it refilled (because, duh, I have ADD). Then (in at least one case) my doctor stops prescribing it because it's not showing up in my bloodstream. Well, no ####, dumbass; I haven't taken it in two weeks because I keep forgetting to get it filled.

I seriously had to switch doctors over that. Now I've got a reminder in Outlook on my work computer that pops every month so I remember to get it refilled at the right time.

The fact that I would have much less trouble getting Norco or Vicodin just makes me shake my head.
   33. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 04:57 PM (#4222952)

You have to get a paper prescription every month? Does that require an in-person visit to the doctor's office? And does he do a blood test every time? That sounds really annoying.
   34. Don Geovany Soto (chris h.) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 05:07 PM (#4222961)
You have to get a paper prescription every month? Does that require an in-person visit to the doctor's office? And does he do a blood test every time? That sounds really annoying.

I don't need to actually make an appointment every time, but yeah, I have to stop by the office and sign for it in a special log they have for Schedule II drugs.

My last doctor did the blood test every three months.

Yes, it's annoying as hell.
   35. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: August 30, 2012 at 05:29 PM (#4222994)
I've watched the first two seasons of Breaking Bad but had little interest in watching beyond that. Walter letting Jane die was the turning point for me. After that, I just didn't care about the characters, and the ridiculous implausibility of the show in general became too much to stomach.


Well, Breaking Bad is definitely a show about Bad People Doing Bad Things. Even the people I feel sympathy for in this show- Mike the Cleaner and Jessie, specifically- are pretty much horrible people. Jessie's a meth dealer and Mike is a professional killer.

So this is a misanthropic show, to be sure. Jane's death was one of the first signs that Walt was a horrible person, and I still think he's a horrible person, but I'm still emotionally invested in basically every main character.

I will agree that there is a degree of implausibility in Breaking Bad, but no more so than your average TV show. I'd give it a try again.

EDIT: At the very least, watch Breaking Bad for the performances. Giancarlo Esposito, Jonathan Banks, Bryan Cranston, Aaron Paul, and even Bob Odenkirk deliver some of the best performances you'll ever see on TV. The lighting & sets on this show are amazing too.
   36. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: August 30, 2012 at 08:55 PM (#4223111)

Mark, the show is beautifully shot, I'll give you that. Jane's death just seemed so out-of-character for Walt. Up until that point he was a decent guy just trying to make some money from his family and for his medical care. To me the change in personality was too sudden and drastic. The show tries to provide some justification for it (he did it out of concern for Jesse, I suppose) but it didn't seem plausible to me.

On top of that, there's no reason for Walt and Jesse not to be dead or in prison. They're incompetent and attract a tremendous amount of attention to themselves. And the show makes Albuquerque look like Ciudad Juarez.
   37. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: August 30, 2012 at 10:22 PM (#4223172)
Mark, the show is beautifully shot, I'll give you that. Jane's death just seemed so out-of-character for Walt. Up until that point he was a decent guy just trying to make some money from his family and for his medical care. To me the change in personality was too sudden and drastic. The show tries to provide some justification for it (he did it out of concern for Jesse, I suppose) but it didn't seem plausible to me.


Walt killing Jane was the first time he "broke bad," if you will. He had killed people in the past (Crazy 8, Tuco sort of), but this was the first time he did it for selfish reasons. He didn't want Jane going to the cops, and he didn't want to lose Jesse (and the money, and the meth) to Jane.

Considering what Walt's done since Jane's death, it's perfectly in line with his character arc. The Walter White from season 1 is *completely* different from the Walter White of season 5.

And my original point is that you don't need to cheer for Walter White to watch this show. Hell, anybody cheering for Walt at this point is probably a sociopath.
   38. McCoy Posted: August 30, 2012 at 10:29 PM (#4223179)
Don't think that's quite correct. The scene was showing one year ahead, nothing to do with "banishment" only that he's out of state at that point that he purchases a M60 (I thought, perhaps wrong). On the lamb more than likely considering the plates, his rough appearance.

Well, he was using a fake ID, driving an out of state car, and forgot that it was his birthday. Now it is possible that he didn't get banished but it seems likely to me he had to flee the state for awhile.

Yeah, I think it was an M60 now that you mention it.
   39. McCoy Posted: August 30, 2012 at 10:33 PM (#4223182)
And my original point is that you don't need to cheer for Walter White to watch this show. Hell, anybody cheering for Walt at this point is probably a sociopath.

And that is probably what makes this show so great and so hard to watch nowadays. They created some outstanding characters that we've invested a lot in and they didn't follow the standard TV character arc so they've become more disgusting instead of becoming more cool.

I do think Walter White and his madcap adventures have gotten more and more implausible as the series goes along but hey it's good television.

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