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Saturday, January 11, 2014

Marchand: Michael Young joins Mark Reynolds as 3B option

Jeter and Young…side by side, just imagine! Plus he’s only 625 hits shy of 3000!

As the baseball world waits for “Decision 2014” on Alex Rodriguez, the Yankees have thought about alternatives if Rodriguez’s ban for this season is upheld.

Besides Mark Reynolds, the Yankees will consider Michael Young, a source told ESPN New York.

Reynolds could form a pretty powerful platoon with Kelly Johnson, though their defense would be lacking. (When you think about it, how much different at third base is that than A-Rod?)

As for the 37-year-old Young, the Yankees tried to trade for him prior to last July’s deadline when he ended up with the Los Angeles Dodgers.

In 147 games in 2013, Young hit .279 with a .730 OPS. By comparison, Rodriguez had a .771 OPS in 44 games in ‘13.

Repoz Posted: January 11, 2014 at 11:38 AM | 27 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: yankees

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   1. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 11, 2014 at 11:50 AM (#4636205)
Reynolds could form a pretty powerful platoon with Kelly Johnson, though their defense would be lacking. (When you think about it, how much different at third base is that than A-Rod?)


Let see, two guys who were never good at third vs. a guy who once was pretty good. If he's not gimpy I take A-Rod all day long.
   2. DL from MN Posted: January 11, 2014 at 11:54 AM (#4636209)
Old and bad seems to be the strategy.
   3. TRBMB Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:07 PM (#4636217)
CASHman's only strategy, given he has no capability in player development, revolves around his only skill, CASH.
   4. PASTE Thinks This Trout Kid Might Be OK (Zeth) Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:08 PM (#4636218)
Makes sense. I'd been thinking that Reynolds is far too young to interest the Yankees.
   5. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:23 PM (#4636233)
CASHman's only strategy, given he has no capability in player development, revolves around his only skill, CASH.


No GM who works for the Steinbrenners will ever be good at player development. They will be perpetually forced to give up their best draft picks to maintain their pace on a constant treadmill of one year plans.
   6. donlock Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:36 PM (#4636245)
Unless the Yankees have found a roster loophole that lets them platoon all the infield positions and still carry a pitching staff, I don't see how they could keep all these infielders: Young/Reynolds/Johnson/Roberts/ARod/ Jeter/Ryan/Nunez/ Tex?
   7. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:44 PM (#4636253)
No GM who works for the Steinbrenners will ever be good at player development. They will be perpetually forced to give up their best draft picks to maintain their pace on a constant treadmill of one year plans.

You know, you're allowed to select good players after the 1st round. Plus, there's international signings.

The Yankees will never have a top-5 farm system, but there's no reason they can't be solidly middle of the pack with the money they can spend on scouts/infrastructure/development, etc.

   8. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 11, 2014 at 12:47 PM (#4636255)
Unless the Yankees have found a roster loophole that lets them platoon all the infield positions and still carry a pitching staff, I don't see how they could keep all these infielders: Young/Reynolds/Johnson/Roberts/ARod/ Jeter/Ryan/Nunez/ Tex?

The article is saying either Young or Reynolds. Plus, Nunez is gone I think, and ARod with miss a big chunk of the season.

Opening day you're looking at Teixeira, Jeter, K Johnson, Roberts, Ryan in the IF. Then you'll have McCann and backup C, and Gardner, Ellsbury, Beltran, Soriano for OF/DH.

That leaves 2 spots, probably one more IF for 3B, and a 4th OF (Ichiro or someone else).
   9. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 11, 2014 at 01:09 PM (#4636287)
You know, you're allowed to select good players after the 1st round. Plus, there's international signings.

The Yankees will never have a top-5 farm system, but there's no reason they can't be solidly middle of the pack with the money they can spend on scouts/infrastructure/development, etc.


I think you are underestimating both the value of first round picks, and the value of picking near the front, instead of at the end, of every round. Signing free agents doesn't only mean giving up a pick, it also means no rebuilding years and that means perpetually picking in the second half of rounds. With no first rounder and picking 25th, their 2nd rounder is not much more valuable than Houstons 3rd rounder, their 3rd round similar to Houston's 4th rounder, etc, so this treadmill is nearly as bad as giving up your first and second rounders every year. When the team mandate is constantly competing it also means never building your farm system.

Your point about international signings is much more on target. The best criticism of Cashman can be why didn't they sign all the Puigs of the world when they had the chance? But going forward with the caps on international spending there won't be much help there in the future either.

And spending on scouts/infrastructure/development is almost fluff. It's hard to see large benefits from any of it. Everyone is scouting the same players, it's extremely rare that some guy appears from nowhere nowadays. Everybody coaches, but I don't see any organization turning players from what they are into something different, some players develop, some don't, but there doesn't seem to be any coaching that consistently turns raw talent into achievement any faster or better.

The best bang for their buck is probably management tools so they have a much better view of the talent in and out of their system and make better decisions, so all those scouts and coaches reports aren't lost in file cabinets, but I'm just assuming they already have spent the money on systems that do a lot of that.
   10. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 11, 2014 at 01:13 PM (#4636296)
I think you are underestimating both the value of first round picks, and the value of picking near the front, instead of at the end, of every round. Signing free agents doesn't only mean giving up a pick, it also means no rebuilding years and that means perpetually picking in the second half of rounds. With no first rounder and picking 25th, their 2nd rounder is not much more valuable than Houstons 3rd rounder, their 3rd round similar to Houston's 4th rounder, etc, so this treadmill is nearly as bad as giving up your first and second rounders every year. When the team mandate is constantly competing it also means never building your farm system.

Yet, StL with many of the same issues (i.e. always good), is perennially churning out major league talent from mid-round draft picks.
   11. Ivan Grushenko of Hong Kong Posted: January 11, 2014 at 01:19 PM (#4636300)
Yet, StL with many of the same issues (i.e. always good), is perennially churning out major league talent from mid-round draft picks

And Boston
   12. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 11, 2014 at 01:38 PM (#4636324)
Yet, StL with many of the same issues (i.e. always good), is perennially churning out major league talent from mid-round draft picks.



St. Louis had 10 first round picks in the last 10 years and 13 compensation picks. Their average first pick was taken around 20th.

The Red Sox had 7 first round picks int the last 10 years and 18 compensation picks. Their average first round pick was probably 27th until last year's 7th.

The Yankees have had 6 first round picks in the last 10 years and 10 compensation picks. Their average first pick was taken around 30th.

So the yankees get fewer picks than both the Red Sox and Cardinals, and have to pick after both teams every round for a decade.

Edit: I'm not disagreeing that it's achievable, but not in the way the Yankees have been run. Clearly the Sox were smart enough to let players walk and accumulate comp picks to offset the picks they lost in FA signings and their lousy draft positions. The Yankees would have been smart to let both A-Rod and Jeter walk, but even if Cashman wanted to do it, the Steinbrenners wouldn't allow it.

They are on a treadmill where every year they have to be competitive and it means sacrificing the farm system to do it. The Cardinals and Red Sox don't seem to have the same imperative. The Sox big move in 2012 wasn't a pre-trade deadline deal to fix the team and make every effort for the playoffs, it was clearing the decks for the following year. I believe the Yankees will just get older and more decrepit until all the wheels come off at once in a horrible season (far worse than last year), before the Steinbrenners finally realize they have to refresh their young talent.
   13. Dale Sams Posted: January 11, 2014 at 05:12 PM (#4636462)
And Boston


??

I guess you can call Will Middlebrooks ML talent, but the jury is out on that. Bradley was a first round pick and hasn't 'made it' yet. Pedroia, Lester, Ellsbury and Buchholz was a long time ago, and I don't think taken in middle rounds. Bogaerts was a FA signing...

So who are we talking about?
   14. ptodd Posted: January 12, 2014 at 04:08 AM (#4636793)
The Sox big move in 2012 wasn't a pre-trade deadline deal to fix the team and make every effort for the playoffs, it was clearing the decks for the following year.


The Yankees were in a pennant race when Santa Clause came, so he flew on to Boston. Red Sox were lucky enough to have hired the worst manager in the world and could wave the white flag for Santa to pop down the chimney with the gift that keeps on giving.

Also, the Red Sox had not done much with the draft for a number of years since Ellsbury, Pedroia, Papelbon. Lester and Buchholz bonanza that came up in 2006-2007. Most of their top young guys since were international amateur free agents, XB, Iglesias, Doubront. I will believe in the pitching prospects when I see them in action. JBJ and WMB are draft picks, but its uncertain how good they will be,
   15. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: January 12, 2014 at 08:11 AM (#4636797)
I wouldn't be surprised if they sign Stephen Drew in the next 48 hours. I know I know they want to stay under the luxury tax....l'll believe it when I see it.
   16. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: January 12, 2014 at 09:56 AM (#4636810)
The Yankees will never have a top-5 farm system, but there's no reason they can't be solidly middle of the pack with the money they can spend on scouts/infrastructure/development, etc.


Baseball America's NYY minor league rankings:

2006 - 17
2007 - 5
2008 - 5
2009 - 15
2010 - 22
2011 - 5
2012 - 13

That looks solidly in the middle of the pack.
   17. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 12, 2014 at 12:45 PM (#4636873)
That looks solidly in the middle of the pack.

They've had the prospects, but they haven't developed.

In terms of actual MLB talent produced, especially from the US draft, they have to be near the bottom.
   18. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: January 12, 2014 at 01:05 PM (#4636881)
Does that include the MLB talent traded away? The players who contributed to those rankings include Austin Jackson, Jose Tabata, Mark Melancon, Ian Kennedy, and Zach McAllister, plus a few others I can't recall offhand (Melky Cabrera?). If all those players stayed with the Yankees that would change your assessment of how the Yankees develop talent without actually changing the Yankees' minor league talent.
   19. chris p Posted: January 12, 2014 at 01:31 PM (#4636900)
Also, the Red Sox had not done much with the draft for a number of years since Ellsbury, Pedroia, Papelbon. Lester and Buchholz bonanza that came up in 2006-2007. Most of their top young guys since were international amateur free agents, XB, Iglesias, Doubront. I will believe in the pitching prospects when I see them in action. JBJ and WMB are draft picks, but its uncertain how good they will be,

lester was drafted way back in 2002 (by mike port, before theo was hired).

the '05 draft was the bonanza ... they got ellsbury, buchholz, and jed lowrie that year. they drafted, but did not sign pedro alvarez, as well.

then they started trading (almost) everybody with any sort of promise ... '06 netted dan bard, who they kept, but also justin masterson and josh reddick. '07 got middlebrooks, but also anthony rizzo (dan butler and drake britton were from that draft and look like potential role players). and then they had a couple mediocre (or unlucky if you want to talk about ryan westmoreland) drafts ...

after the nick punto trade, it looks like they have recommitted to keeping their minor league talent. with ranaudo, workman, and cecchini from '10 and barnes, bradley, owens, swihart, and betts from '112 all looking good ... though it's too early to tell, of course.
   20. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 12, 2014 at 02:16 PM (#4636924)
The Yankees were in a pennant race when Santa Clause came, so he flew on to Boston. Red Sox were lucky enough to have hired the worst manager in the world and could wave the white flag for Santa to pop down the chimney with the gift that keeps on giving.


Exactly my point. Had it been the Yankees, management would never have quit on that season, they would have fired Ricky Bobby Valentine and done everything possible to fix holes to make a playoff run. The Red Sox were 5 games over .500 July 1st, and still over .500 on August 1st and within striking distance of the wildcard with 55 games left. I'm sure the Steinbrenners goad Cashman into taking on some bad contracts to fill team holes to ensure the team ends up close to .500 with a shittier draft position.

And none of this rebuts my main point, that building your farm system is much harder when you give up lots of first round picks and perpetually draft at the end of rounds. The Cardinals have done better, but they haven't given up first rounders, they've collected compensation picks and they've typically drafted near the middle, not end of rounds.

And whether it's debatable whether the Red Sox have done better than the Yanks or not, they certainly should have given a flood of extra comp picks and better draft positioning.
   21. valuearbitrageur Posted: January 12, 2014 at 02:39 PM (#4636952)
And here are the most interesting names that Cashman's drafts produced since 2004

Year Player (WAR)
2004 Phil Hughes (6.3)
2005 Brett Gardner (19.3)
2005 Austin Jackson (19.1)
2006 Dave Robertson (9.7)
2006 Ian Kennedy (9.2)
2006 Joba Chamberlin (7.1)
2006 Mark Melancon (2.7)
2007 Drew Storen (2.3)
2008 David Phelps (2.1)
2008 Gerrit Cole (1.5)
2009 Adam Warren (0.9)
2009 Jake Petricka (0.6)
2010 Preston Claiborne (0.3)

Guys drafted but unsigned
2004 Chris Davis
2005 Doug Fister

Looks like a lot of dreck after 2006, and bupkis after 2010, but it takes a few years for prospects to blossom and drafting at tail end of rounds I think adds to that time, so maybe it looks a little worse than it should but it looks pretty bad.

Derek Jeter was a #6 pick, Pettite a 22nd rounder, Posada a 24th round pick.

Mariano, Cano, Melky Carbrera, & Bernie Williams were international free agents. It seems like being canny about signing international FAs is the biggest part of their last dynasty. The new international signing rules make it seem no longer an area where the Yankees can outspend or outwit their competitors.
   22. The District Attorney Posted: January 12, 2014 at 03:17 PM (#4637011)
And Scott Sizemore joins the 2B/3B crew.

I think the Yanks are doing a good job of finding enough freely available, decent guys that they should to be able to avoid any huge infield holes. You still need to ask, though, who in this lineup is particularly better than league average at their position. McCann, for sure. Ellsbury probably has a floor of league-average, and some potential (although I don't think all that many people think it's all that likely) to be great. Everyone else is questionable to varying degrees IMHO.
   23. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige Posted: January 12, 2014 at 03:46 PM (#4637053)
I would say Gardner is above average as is Beltran. They have a good outfield situation.
   24. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: January 12, 2014 at 03:56 PM (#4637057)
I was going to post something similar, but then I re-read the DA's "particularly better" and decided that he was really asking something more like "who in this lineup is clearly among the best at his position?"
   25. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: January 12, 2014 at 04:28 PM (#4637099)
Guys drafted but unsigned
2004 Chris Davis
2005 Doug Fister


Gerrit Cole and Drew Storen go in that group too.
   26. bookbook Posted: January 12, 2014 at 04:54 PM (#4637139)
#18, you're forgetting Jesus Montero.
   27. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: January 12, 2014 at 06:30 PM (#4637217)
It seems like Jesus Montero's career and Michael Pineda's career both immediately ended after the trade, so that shouldn't change much.

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