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Monday, November 19, 2018

Mariners trade left-hander James Paxton to the Yankees for three prospects

As part of Mariners general manager Jerry Dipoto’s offseason of change, which isn’t a teardown, but it’s a reimagination of the roster, Seattle has traded talented, but at times enigmatic left-handed pitcher James Paxton to the New York Yankees in exchange for three prospects — left-handed pitcher Justus Sheffield, right-handed pitcher Erik Swanson and outfielder Dom Thompson-Williams.

PepTech, the Legendary Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:08 PM | 64 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: yankees

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   1. PepTech, the Legendary Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:11 PM (#5789351)
OK, any Yankee fans around (and awake) that can tell me about these guys?
   2. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:20 PM (#5789355)
Not happy about this. Maybe Sheffield will change my mind one day, but I doubt it.
   3. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:28 PM (#5789358)
Would you really describe Paxton as "at times enigmatic"? Seems like he is fairly consistent. He will likely put up a midish 3 ERA, and miss enough starts that he won't pitch more than about 150 innings. Unless enigmatic is a euphemism for injured.

That said, I don't get the urge for the Mariner's to do a tear down. Did they not just win 89 games? That will get you a wildcard more often than not. And they have some very obvious holes to fill, that could get them big improvements fairly cheaply.

ETA: After just looking it up, their pythag was only 77-85. Sheesh. Didn't think it was quite that bad. But yeah, they would need those improvements most likely, heh.
   4. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:35 PM (#5789359)
OK, any Yankee fans around (and awake) that can tell me about these guys?

Sheffield's highly regarded. #31 overall per MLB.com. Never heard of the other two.

For two years of Paxton, I'm good with this as a Yankee fan. Pitching prospects will break your heart.
   5. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:40 PM (#5789360)
Would you really describe Paxton as "at times enigmatic"?
If you’re an eagle, absolutely.
   6. Baldrick Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:54 PM (#5789366)
That said, I don't get the urge for the Mariner's to do a tear down. Did they not just win 89 games? That will get you a wildcard more often than not. And they have some very obvious holes to fill, that could get them big improvements fairly cheaply.

As an M's fan, they were terrible and the whole first three months of the season felt like a crazy illusion. There was no chance they were winning 89 games again next year.
   7. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:54 PM (#5789367)
You'd think the other GM's would have wised up by now that there are two kinds of Yankees prospects: (1) the actual prospects that they keep and (2) the "prospects" they use for trade chits who never amount to anything. If the Yankees are willing sellers on Sheffield, I'm not buying.
   8. Tin Angel Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:59 PM (#5789369)
That said, I don't get the urge for the Mariner's to do a tear down. Did they not just win 89 games?


If I recall, through the first half or so they had the best winning percentage ever in one run games. It didn't seem sustainable, and ultimately wasn't. They could get quite the haul for Edwin Diaz though.
   9. bookbook Posted: November 19, 2018 at 07:18 PM (#5789373)
Paxton should have been worth slightly more than this. To the Astros or Phillies, if not the Yanks, Jerry Dipoto is fun and exciting as a GM. Unfortunately, he’s convinced that weak stuff swing starters and speedy 4th outfielder tweener types are the undiscovered gold of Major League Baseball. In his mind, Sheffield was probably the throw in.
   10. The Yankee Clapper Posted: November 19, 2018 at 07:26 PM (#5789377)
You'd think the other GM's would have wised up by now that there are two kinds of Yankees prospects: (1) the actual prospects that they keep and (2) the "prospects" they use for trade chits who never amount to anything. If the Yankees are willing sellers on Sheffield, I'm not buying.

The Yankees have done a pretty good job (or been lucky) in recent years scouting their own prospects, and keeping the ones who could actually help (although they did once offer to include Robinson Cano in a deal). However, it's not like they are the only ones allowed to scout those players.
   11. Nasty Nate Posted: November 19, 2018 at 07:59 PM (#5789384)
Justus is served
   12. rconn23 Posted: November 19, 2018 at 08:11 PM (#5789389)
This is a good trade for the Yankees. Paxton should have cost more than this. Sheffield is good, but his upside appears to be a mid rotation starter.
   13. Master of the Horse Posted: November 19, 2018 at 08:15 PM (#5789392)
Paxton is 30 years old? This guy has taken the slow route on career pathing.
   14. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: November 19, 2018 at 08:25 PM (#5789398)
Paxton is 30 years old?


Let the decline and injuries begin!

Jokes aside I think it's a good trade for NY. I reckon Paxton is due for one of those Steve Stone years where it all just comes together for just one year and NY will benefit.

The most important thing is, and this is directed at YOU Andy, can he pitch in NY? Or is he going to go all Sonny Gray and then we can watch Andy's head explode....
   15. Tin Angel Posted: November 19, 2018 at 08:46 PM (#5789405)
The most important thing is, and this is directed at YOU Andy, can he pitch in NY?


And dat's da ding tho- can he really handle da Bronx? Jeter could. Pettitte could. Leyritz could. But dis kid? I dunno.
   16. JRVJ Posted: November 19, 2018 at 08:49 PM (#5789408)
Fun trade to start the hot stove season.

Frankly, the Mariners are in a terrible position, though they are going to start getting some salary relief after 2019 (Felix' $27MM plus $9MM from Juan Nicasio come off the books after 2019, and after 2020, they get $22MM off the books from Dee Gordon & Mike Leake).

A crazy idea, but if I were the Mariners, I'd trade for Alex Cobb and all of his contract (for org filler), get him to put up nice SAFECOish numbers during the 1st half of 2019, and then trade him for some halfway decent prospects (while kicking in a good chunk salary). That's they type of trade they should be making to speed up their rebuild…..
   17. Davo and his Moose Tacos Posted: November 19, 2018 at 09:09 PM (#5789417)
I was trying to think of the last time the Yankees traded an actual prospect for a veteran, and the prospect panned out.

Looks like the best recent example was when they gave up Ian Kennedy and Austin Jackson in the Curtis Granderson deal (Dec 2009)...or, maybe Mark Melancon as a throwin for 2 months of Lance Berkman (2010 deadline.) It’s one helluva record.

(They’ve been kinda burned by trading bench players and seeing them blossom into All-Stars on their new teams: Cervelli, Melky Cabrera, E-Nuñez, Solarte. But I mean....that’s gonna be an occupational hazard when you have a zillion dollar payroll, even your backups are great.)
   18. Walt Davis Posted: November 19, 2018 at 09:54 PM (#5789431)
Paxton is 30 years old? This guy has taken the slow route on career pathing.

Not particularly. He's got nearly 5 full years of service time. Lots of pitchers don't establish themselves in the majors until age 25-26. (For clarity he's "30" in that this upcoming season will be his age-30 season.) Should be pretty standard for a college pitcher draftee. Taken in the 4th round of 2010 which means he got only 18 innings in the minors that year. He wasn't a Scherzer type obviously (i.e. 4th round) so he debuted at A-ball in 2011, made it to AA. Spent all of 2012 in AA. AAA in 2013 plus a cup of coffee. I don't know how much was injury rehab, service time games or performance but just 17 starts in 2014, 13 of them in the majors.

Even Scherzer was drafted in 2006, didn't really establish himself int the majors until 2009 (at 24), became FA after age 29. Paxton won't become FA until after age 31 but it's really just about 110 service days difference.

It's kind of an old-fashioned trade -- two years of Paxton's current performance for 6+ years of Sheffield's future performance.
   19. Dr. Vaux Posted: November 19, 2018 at 10:07 PM (#5789432)
Sheffield's walk rate is a lot higher at AA and AAA than I'd like to see. 3.7 at AAA last year in most of the season, and 3.2 at AA the previous season. I think it's a bit generous to say he has the upside of a mid-rotation starter. Technically, of course he does, but he seems much more likely to top out as someone they'll never think twice about trading for two years of Paxton--even if Paxton goes Sonny Gray/Javier Vazquez/Kenny Rogers/Ed Whitson.
   20. . . . . . . Posted: November 19, 2018 at 10:15 PM (#5789434)
Good lefty in NYS? sign me up.
   21. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 19, 2018 at 10:36 PM (#5789438)
Good lefty in NYS? sign me up.

I'd bring back Happ too, and make it three LH SPs.
   22. The Yankee Clapper Posted: November 19, 2018 at 10:39 PM (#5789440)
I was trying to think of the last time the Yankees traded an actual prospect for a veteran, and the prospect panned out.

Jedi Cashman: "These aren't the prospects you're looking for."
   23. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: November 19, 2018 at 10:58 PM (#5789444)
I guess I'm glad the Yanks got another starter, but then this is another starter who doesn't even average 6 innings a start. There's a reason that bullpens wear out as the season winds down.
   24. vortex of dissipation Posted: November 19, 2018 at 11:53 PM (#5789463)
I guess I'm glad the Yanks got another starter, but then this is another starter who doesn't even average 6 innings a start. There's a reason that bullpens wear out as the season winds down.


Paxton led the American League in complete games and shutouts.
   25. Chip Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:24 AM (#5789469)
Dombrowski re-signing the lefty masher Pearce as the short end of the Red Sox 1B platoon a day before this looks even smarter now.
   26. bookbook Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:38 AM (#5789472)
Paxton was taken in the first round in 2009 by the Blue Jays and didn’t sign. He pitched independent league, I rhink, before the Ms took him in the 4th round in 2010. Boras (I think) cost him money and a year.
   27. Blastin Posted: November 20, 2018 at 05:35 AM (#5789485)
Paxton threw a no hitter last year. He just sometimes gets lit up (by the Yankees!).

I agree, bring back Happ and get an infielder and a cheap reliever.
   28. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 07:36 AM (#5789490)
A decent trade for both teams from my perspective. Sheffield is a young lefthander who has been clocked as high as 98MPH even if he sits around 92-94MPH and has two other pitches graded as MLB-average. He’s had some control/command issues that I’m guessing lead the Yankees to think he wouldn’t be ready for their rotation until 2020 or 2021, making him expendable for a team that is trying to win in 2019.

Swanson came over in the Beltran trade as a secondary piece and did well in AA and AAA (in 2018: 121.2 IP, 2.66 ERA, 2.91 FIP, 10.28 K/9, 2.15 BB/9, .210 AVG) based mainly on a nice moving fastball that sits in the mid-90s. There’s some thought that he’s eventually headed for the bullpen because the fastball is more advanced and impressive than his secondary pitches (IIRC the Yankees had him scrap his slider as a lost cause last year) but he’s probably MLB-ready or damn close to it. He was Rule 5-eligible this offseason so I think a lot of people expected him to be moved to a rebuilding team since there wasn’t a clear-cut path for him to help the Yankees in 2019 and he’d undoubtedly have been taken given those 2018 numbers.

If Paxton stays healthy this should be a good swap all-around, and I think it was concerns about his durability that kept the Mariners asking price where it was. Several of his DL stints were due to flukey things but some guys just seem to find flukey things.
   29. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 08:21 AM (#5789497)
Brief overview of the trade and prospects involved at RAB.

Looking at MLBTR the Mariners fans don’t seem to like the trade.
   30. Der-K: at 10% emotional investment Posted: November 20, 2018 at 08:51 AM (#5789502)
BA apparently had Swanson as the #11 prospect in the Yankees org, which surprises me.

Good deal for NYY. Could easily work for Seattle (Sheffield looks good) but I'm less confident there.
   31. Esmailyn Gonzalez Sr. Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:01 AM (#5789505)
Paxton is 30 years old? This guy has taken the slow route on career pathing.

He's also Canadian, so he grew up playing 1.5 months a year...
   32. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:04 AM (#5789506)
I guess I'm glad the Yanks got another starter, but then this is another starter who doesn't even average 6 innings a start. There's a reason that bullpens wear out as the season winds down.

Teams don't want their starters going more than 6 anymore, unless it's a blowout.

Bullpens get tired because they refuse to let anyone pitch 2-3 innings in relief. If you did that, with an 8 man pen, they wouldn't wear down. What wears them down is needing 4 pitchers every night to get you 3 IP, instead of 1-2.
   33. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:10 AM (#5789510)
I guess I'm glad the Yanks got another starter, but then this is another starter who doesn't even average 6 innings a start. There's a reason that bullpens wear out as the season winds down.


Paxton led the American League in complete games and shutouts.


Right, two complete games and one shutout.

But on further examination, I think Blastin has the right perspective. Paxton had 11 games where he logged 7 or more innings, and 11 games where he didn't even make it through 6. Kind of like the little girl with the curl, and with a so-so 108 ERA+.

Not saying that I don't like the trade, but that rotation still needs more patching up, starting with Corbin.

EDIT: And obviously re-signing Happ.
   34. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:19 AM (#5789514)
This looks like a good deal for both teams. MLB player for prospect trades come with inherent risk but Sheffield and Swanson are more than just lottery tickets, both pitched well in the upper minors and Sheffield got a cup of coffee (albeit he got pounded but 2.2IP).

While I'm not surprised to see Mariner fans are skeptical I think fans are often unrealistic about the return on players. To get a top 50 prospect for a guy who has never qualified for an ERA title looks like a pretty good deal. Paxton is a good pitcher so it's a good get for the Yankees but I don't know what more the Mariners should have reasonably been targeting.
   35. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:22 AM (#5789515)
Not saying that I don't like the trade, but that rotation still needs more patching up, starting with Corbin.

EDIT: And obviously re-signing Happ.


Umm, no. They're not going to sign enough guys to make CC the 6th starter. Not happening.

They will sign Corbin OR Happ, hopefully Happ. He'll be much cheaper, and is a much more consistent pitcher.
   36. Ziggy's screen name Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:25 AM (#5789518)
I'll co-sign on 34. This one looks like it's fair to everybody. M's and Yanks fans may think differently, but, you know, endowment effect.
   37. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:29 AM (#5789520)
I'll co-sign on 34. This one looks like it's fair to everybody. M's and Yanks fans may think differently, but, you know, endowment effect.

I think it's a great deal for the Yankees. What's the opposite of endowment effect?
   38. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:44 AM (#5789530)
I think it's a great deal for the Yankees. What's the opposite of endowment effect?


Are you saying you are poorly endowed?
   39. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 09:46 AM (#5789531)
Are you saying you are poorly endowed?

Never had any complaints.
   40. geonose Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:19 PM (#5789655)
For clarity he's "30" in that this upcoming season will be his age-30 season.

He's also 30 in that he just had his 30th birthday.
   41. jmurph Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:23 PM (#5789662)
I was trying to think of the last time the Yankees traded an actual prospect for a veteran, and the prospect panned out.

Who has a good answer for this one?
   42. Master of the Horse Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:25 PM (#5789665)
40--hilarious
   43. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:26 PM (#5789667)
Who has a good answer for this one?

Davos in [17].

Jackson and Kennedy for Granderson. Melancon for Berkman.
   44. jmurph Posted: November 20, 2018 at 12:30 PM (#5789674)
Yeah but he asked it, he was looking for more, I think (which also made me curious).
   45. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 20, 2018 at 01:10 PM (#5789695)
Jake Cave had a pretty nice year this year for Minnesota after being traded in Spring Training.

James Pazos has been a good reliever for the Mariners the last two years.

   46. bbmck Posted: November 20, 2018 at 01:43 PM (#5789716)
Yankee June Draft Picks that signed with 10+ career WAR (38):

Kept (11): Dellin Betances, Brett Gardner, Ron Guidry, Phil Hughes, Derek Jeter, Aaron Judge, Don Mattingly, Thurman Munson, Andy Pettitte, Jorge Posada, David Robertson

Taken by Rule 5 or Expansion Draft (3): Brad Ausmus, Carl Everett, Willie Upshaw

Traded (24): Stan Bahnsen, Jim Beattie, Tyler Clippard, Jim Deshaies, Greg Gagne, Mike Heath, LaMarr Hoyt, Austin Jackson, Nick Johnson, Ian Kennedy, Al Leiter, Mike Lowell, Andy McGaffigan, Scott McGregor, Fred McGriff, Doc Medich, Mark Melancon, Eric Milton, Hal Morris, Mike Pagliarulo, Dan Pasqua, Eric Plunk, JT Snow, Bob Tewksbury

December 9, 1982: Fred McGriff traded by the New York Yankees with Dave Collins, Mike Morgan and cash to the Toronto Blue Jays for Tom Dodd and Dale Murray.
   47. Nasty Nate Posted: November 20, 2018 at 01:49 PM (#5789720)
I was trying to think of the last time the Yankees traded an actual prospect for a veteran, and the prospect panned out.
Unless I'm forgetting some trades, the Yankees have had surprisingly few of the trades where they send away prospects considered elite at the time. When they trade for stars, there is usually some other variable. E.G. Stanton came with the giant contract, and Clemens and A-Rod cost actual MLB talent. It doesn't seem like they have been involved in the Moncada-for-Sale type trades ... although I may be only retroactively attributing this.

Of course, this isn't related to the performance (or lack thereof) of the copious amounts of medium- and lower-tier prospects they have traded away.
   48. PepTech, the Legendary Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:11 PM (#5789734)
Dipoto has stated openly that the M's are tired of being mediocre and are aiming for 2020 or 2021, effectively punting at least the next season. That's probably a good idea, although I'm skeptical they can turn it around that quickly.

Given that, it makes sense to ditch Paxton now for six years of Sheffield. Who knows, maybe you can get Paxton back if he's worth paying in two years. Paxton is a bit of an injury risk (more so than most pitchers, I mean).
   49. Baldrick Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:12 PM (#5789735)
I guess I'm glad the Yanks got another starter, but then this is another starter who doesn't even average 6 innings a start. There's a reason that bullpens wear out as the season winds down.

There were like 20 guys in all of baseball who averaged more than 6 innings a start last year.
   50. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:21 PM (#5789744)
Not saying that I don't like the trade, but that rotation still needs more patching up, starting with Corbin.

EDIT: And obviously re-signing Happ.


Umm, no. They're not going to sign enough guys to make CC the 6th starter. Not happening.


Except that December's 6 starters often wind up being July's 3 or 4, and the chances are good that CC's knee will have given out again by then. And you never can tell when one of those offseason acquisitions will wind up performing like Sonny Gray, so it's best to have multiple options.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There were like 20 guys in all of baseball who averaged more than 6 innings a start last year.

And if you want to win a World Series, it might not be a bad idea to have 2 of them on your team. Bullpens are reliable until they're not.
   51. Blastin Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:26 PM (#5789748)
...the Red Sox had two?

They are not starting the year with 6 full time starters. "Just in case" is a terrible use of resources. If they run out of pitchers mid year, they'll get more.


But I want them to get Corbin, and an infielder, and a reliever, I think.
   52. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:35 PM (#5789752)
They are not starting the year with 6 full time starters. "Just in case" is a terrible use of resources. If they run out of pitchers mid year, they'll get more.

Exactly.

But I want them to get Corbin, and an infielder, and a reliever, I think.

Corbin has bust written all over him. Coming off a career year. Past health problems. His velocity dropped by 1,4 MPH from 2017. Hard pass.

If you look at the contract projections (e.g. MLBTR) people are talking 6/130 for Corbin vs 3/48 for Happ. I'd much, much, much rather have Happ at those prices.
   53. Blastin Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:44 PM (#5789756)
Well at those prices, yeah. I like Happ fine.

God, I've been looking at a lot on this trade, and the butt-stupid "HE'S NOT AN ACE" crowd is... I just can't. Severino is "not an ace." So... was David Price, who was awful in October, an ace before he remembered how to pitch in the middle of the Houston series?

Just get good players.
   54. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:48 PM (#5789760)
God, I've been looking at a lot on this trade, and the butt-stupid "HE'S NOT AN ACE" crowd is... I just can't. Severino is "not an ace." So... was David Price, who was awful in October, an ace before he remembered how to pitch in the middle of the Houston series?

Yes. The idea that top-20 pitchers, in all of MLB, are "not aces", is asinine. To define "ace" so that there are only 5 in all of baseball is not useful.
   55. Dr. Vaux Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:48 PM (#5789761)
Yeah, I don't think the Yankees are dumb enough to sign Corbin.
   56. Blastin Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:50 PM (#5789763)
I can see a definition of "ace" as top 30, based on there being 30 teams, and if a team is lucky enough to have several top 30 pitchers, then bully for them.

But what people really mean is "bulldog man who doesn't smile in October and shreds his shoulder/elbow to SACRIFICE" or whatever Smoltz is always talking about.

Be better!
   57. Dr. Vaux Posted: November 20, 2018 at 02:52 PM (#5789764)
Wow, I've fallen off in terms of posts. At one time I was no. 42, and now I'm down to no. 69. I don't show up in the list for some reason, but that's where I'd be. I guess the demise of game chatters is what's responsible for that.
   58. Biscuit_pants Posted: November 20, 2018 at 03:55 PM (#5789795)
I can see a definition of "ace" as top 30, based on there being 30 teams, and if a team is lucky enough to have several top 30 pitchers, then bully for them.
My own personal definition involves at least 3 years of high performance. Being a top 40 pitcher 3 years out of 4 or 5 makes you an ace. There are of course exceptions to every rule, Dwight Gooden being an ace after like 3 pitches, but I like to see a couple of years of top performance for me to think of you as an ace.
   59. DCA Posted: November 20, 2018 at 04:41 PM (#5789821)
My definition is "if this guy is going for your team, he's usually clearly better than any pitcher that your opponent could start against him." (that is, clearly better than 15 other teams' best SP).

I don't have time now, but it would be a fun exercise to identify the best SP on every team, rank them, determine the #16 and then list all the SP who are clearly better than him. Those are the aces.
   60. Master of the Horse Posted: November 20, 2018 at 04:45 PM (#5789822)
59--What if your team trashed the idea of starters and made all pitchers 'outmakers'? Asking for a friend in Milwaukee
   61. Michael Paulionis Posted: November 20, 2018 at 05:01 PM (#5789826)
My own personal definition involves at least 3 years of high performance. Being a top 40 pitcher 3 years out of 4 or 5 makes you an ace. There are of course exceptions to every rule, Dwight Gooden being an ace after like 3 pitches, but I like to see a couple of years of top performance for me to think of you as an ace.


Yeah, I don't think anyone was waiting for Doc or Clemens to hit 3 years before christening them. Lincecum is a recent example.

Also, there are Aces that are born but maybe not quite made: Kerry Wood, Francisco Liriano, Andy Bynes, Ben McDonald, etc.

I think it is important to see Starters show durability/consistency, but I think it is antithetical to have to wait 4-5 years before bestowing them with elite status.
   62. Greg Pope Posted: November 20, 2018 at 05:11 PM (#5789830)
I don't see "ace" as being top 30. An Ace is a guy you would be fine starting game 1 of the World Series. That's a fan's definition. Probably pretty similar to DCA's definition, but not really tied to a number. I'd guess there are usually 10-15 aces in MLB at any given time. With the fact that some teams have more than one, that means that more than half of MLB doesn't have an Ace. Which I'm fine with.

Now, that also means that a team can't just go out and get an Ace every offseason.
   63. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 20, 2018 at 05:20 PM (#5789831)
OK, any Yankee fans around (and awake) that can tell me about these guys?


Mike Axosa over at RAB about the secondary guys:

7. I don’t have a strong opinion about Thompson-Williams. He had a nice breakout season this year and I was curious to see whether his new launch angle approach worked at Double-A going forward. Now I’ll have to watch from afar. As far as I’m concerned, Swanson is the second piece in this trade, and he’s a quality prospect who will probably help the 2019 Mariners more than Sheffield. He’s an older prospect (25) with good stuff and good numbers, and he’s basically big league ready. Had he not been traded, the Yankees would’ve added Swanson to the 40-man roster prior to today’s Rule 5 Draft protection deadline and there’s a pretty good chance we would’ve seen him on shuttle duty this year. The thing is, the Yankees are loaded with pitching prospects like Swanson. They don’t have obvious spots for Domingo German and Luis Cessa, both of whom are out of options. Mike King, Jonathan Loaisiga, and Chance Adams will be in Triple-A. Trevor Stephan, Nick Green, Garrett Whitlock, and Nick Nelson are right behind those dudes in Double-A. Swanson’s a quality prospect who will have a much greater opportunity at big league playing time with the Mariners than he would’ve with the Yankees. The Yankees’ farm system is an Erik Swansons factory these days. They should trade guys like him as the second piece for impact big leaguers like James Paxton eight times a week and twice on Sundays.


RAB
   64. Michael Paulionis Posted: November 20, 2018 at 05:22 PM (#5789832)
59--What if your team trashed the idea of starters and made all pitchers 'outmakers'? Asking for a friend in Milwaukee


Hader and Jefferies are more "Ace" than any possible "Ace" Starters Milwaukee has. They are better than most teams' "Ace"'s. I don't think any non-Brewer fans are willing to call Chacin, Miley, Chase Anderson, or Davies "Ace" pitchers. This feels like it's just a Brewer thing nowadays. Construct a rotation with a bunch of overachieving #3-4 starters in the mold of Cal Eldred, Chris Bosio, Doug Davis, Jeff Suppan, Braden Looper, Matt Garza, Chris Capuano, and Yovani Gallardo. Sure, you have the rare Ben Sheets, Zach Greinke, C.C. Sabathia, etc., but most of the time the "Ace" is a luxury the Brewers can't afford.

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