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Thursday, November 01, 2012

Marlins hire Mike Redmond

No need to stock Bushmills in Ft. Lauderdale liquor stores.

Mike Redmond has been hired by the Marlins as their new manager, sources told CBSSports.com.

Redmond received a three-year contract.

A news conference is planned for Friday.

Redmond, a former big-league catcher with the Marlins and others, is an extremely highly-regarded young guy who had been managing in the Blue Jays organization.

The Marlins moved quickly to make their hire after firing Ozzie Guillen. They are also known to have interviewed Larry Bowa, Luis Gonzalez, Lloyd McClendon and Bryan Price.

Redmond, known for a high batting average and high fielding percentage as a catcher, has been seen as a favorite since Ozzie Guillen was fired with three years to go. Redmond managed Dunedin, Toronto’s high A-ball team in 2012.

Redmond is seen in the Marlins organization in much the same way as Mike Matheny is veiewed in the Cardinals organization.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 12:13 PM | 52 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: managers, marlins, mike redmond

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   1. Swedish Chef Posted: November 01, 2012 at 12:56 PM (#4290111)
Yet another catcher becoming manager. Is it a fluke or is there such a strong coaching component in catching that they get a head start on that career?

And the absence of Larry Bowa jokes next season will be appreciated.
   2. SoSH U at work Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:03 PM (#4290121)
Is it a fluke or is there such a strong coaching component in catching that they get a head start on that career?


I think the idea, and it's a logical one, is that catcher is the position that most effectively bridges the two key elements of the game. The catcher is a hitter, but he's also intimately involved with a team's pitching staff. No other position requires that kind of involvement with the two critical team components.

   3. Fernigal McGunnigle has become a merry hat Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:03 PM (#4290122)
Braves fans will always remember Redmond as the guy who went 438/471/604 against Tom Glavine. He did that to some pretty good lefties: 432/421/514 against Buehrle, 448/500/552 against Al Leiter, 500/563/577 against Sabathia. And those are the four guys he had the most career PAs against.

Yet another catcher becoming manager. Is it a fluke or is there such a strong coaching component in catching that they get a head start on that career?


That's probably a part of it. I also think that you will usually have to have above-average intelligence to be a catcher in MLB, because there's so much to think about and to remember. Catchers are the only players who are expected to be offensive contributors but also have to know everything about pitching, so they'll know both sides of the game better than other players. Catching takes odd skills and hard work, so I'd guess that there are more players who make it to MLB on brains and effort at catcher than at any other position. All these things probably have some part in it.
   4. boteman Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:25 PM (#4290148)
#1, #2 - Plus, the catcher really must "keep his head in the game" at all times, thinking ahead a couple batters, pay attention to runners on base, know the tendencies of his pitcher and of the hitter...probably the most "involved" player in each game. Similar qualities are required of the manager for in-game tactics.

Unless he has bad breath, in which case he needs in-game Tic Tacs. Fresh mint is good for that.
   5. Ned Garvin: Male Prostitute Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:28 PM (#4290151)
No need to stock Bushmills in Ft. Lauderdale liquor stores.


No need to stock clothes either.
   6. valuearbitrageur Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:49 PM (#4290162)
I also think that you will usually have to have above-average intelligence to be a catcher in MLB


But this one took the marlins job.

The best poker playing ball players I have met are pitchers, believe it or not. Sample size caveats, obviously.
   7. DL from MN Posted: November 01, 2012 at 01:59 PM (#4290179)
#5 - I was going to say that Miami will get excited about batting practice now.
   8. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: November 01, 2012 at 02:53 PM (#4290211)
I came here to make a BP joke as well.
   9. Walt Davis Posted: November 01, 2012 at 04:06 PM (#4290281)
Yet another catcher becoming manager. Is it a fluke or is there such a strong coaching component in catching that they get a head start on that career?

Or just the latest MLB fad.
   10. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 04:29 PM (#4290303)
high fielding percentage as a catcher,



Is this the most useless statistic in baseball?


Or just the latest MLB fad.


I thought it went back quite a way. Isn't the catcher usually considered the on-field manager/captain? As far as I can remember, catchers were seen as more cerebral. In any player poll of who would make a good future manager, catchers dominate the list.
   11. Ray (RDP) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 04:54 PM (#4290322)
I think the idea, and it's a logical one, is that catcher is the position that most effectively bridges the two key elements of the game. The catcher is a hitter, but he's also intimately involved with a team's pitching staff. No other position requires that kind of involvement with the two critical team components.


I agree, and would add that the catcher is also intimately involved with the manager and pitching coach as far as planning and executing the strategy for the pitcher. Even though that's only one part of what goes into "managing," it's a big part, and in gives a catcher the experience to assist on a strategy level. Someone like Adrian Beltre is not involved in this kind of aspect.

Slightly OT but re Giambi and him being floated as a candidate for the Rockies' job, I was sifting through my copy of Baseball Prospectus, the 2000 annual, and Giambi's player comment mentioned that Billy Beane went out of his way to ask for Giambi's comments on roster decisions. I found this comment interesting in light of Giambi's recent connection with the vacant Colorado job, as it seems like Giambi was interested in managing even as a younger player. I would love to see him become a player-manager in 2013, basically as a PH and backup 1B.

(Though I haven't checked b-r to see whether he still has some offensive skills, e.g., the ability to mash RHP; I know he can still take a walk, which may be enough: a PH really only needs to be a better hitter than the pitchers he's batting for. Maybe it's not the ideal use of a roster spot, but neither is the 18th reliever on the staff.)
   12. philphan Posted: November 01, 2012 at 04:58 PM (#4290329)
Will Mark Redman be his pitching coach?
   13. boteman Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4290330)
#5, 7, 8 - Is there something I should know? What am I missing?
   14. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4290331)
It seems like 1B is the position that produces the fewest managers. Mattingly is one I suppose and Giambi could be another.
   15. Ray (RDP) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:01 PM (#4290334)
Giambi had a reverse platoon split in 2012; scanning his last three seasons, I didn't see anything that strongly suggests he couldn't be a good PH.
   16. SM Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:08 PM (#4290338)
Is player-managing still allowed? I know the NBA banned it, I kind of assumed MLB had done the same.
   17. SM Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:12 PM (#4290342)
Looks like it is still allowed in baseball. (The NBA's ban was to avoid salary-cap circumvention by playing players extra to be the coach, although I'd think it'd be easy enough to just count all money paid players as player salary even if they also coach.)
   18. Austin Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:12 PM (#4290343)
I think this makes Redmond the first guy to manage in the majors whom I've also watched as a player. I remember him mostly as Joe Mauer's mediocre backup.
   19. Fernigal McGunnigle has become a merry hat Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:21 PM (#4290358)
I think this makes Redmond the first guy to manage in the majors whom I've also watched as a player. I remember him mostly as Joe Mauer's mediocre backup.


That's how it starts. Then there aren't any players older than you and there are managers younger than you, your favorite childhood players start dying of old age...
   20. Walt Davis Posted: November 01, 2012 at 05:51 PM (#4290390)
I thought it went back quite a way.

You thought what went back quite a way -- former catchers as managers or catchers having a rep as the most cerebral of positions? I was only commenting on the former.

Using games managed among fairly recent managers:

non-Cs: LaRussa, Cox, Anderson, Mauch, Weaver, Durocher, Alston, Piniella, LaSorda, Baker, Williams, Tanner, Kelly, Hargrove, Valentine, Johnson, Martin, Howe, Robinson, Fregosi, Showalter, Alou, Garner, Schoendienst, Francona, Gardenhire, Zimmer, Tracy, Gaston, Manuel

Cs: Torre, Leyland, Houk, Bochy, Scioscia

We're down to 1700 games managed, you can keep going if you want. Catchers might be over-represented but it's hardly lopsided. The only position that seems seriously under-represented is pitcher (La Sorda's the only long-serving one of recent vintage, yes?).

Note, whether we should count folks like Leyland (or LaRussa or LaSorda) who never really played in the majors and worked their way up through the coaching system is unclear to me -- i.e. the position they played likely had no impact on their hiring as ML managers since they had proven they knew what they were doing as they worked their way up. It may have had something to do with them getting coaching opportunities to start with but that's a different pile to dig into. Of those who went from long ML career to managing (in generally quick fashion), you've got:

Piniella, Baker, Hargrove, Valentine, Johnson, Martin, Howe, Robinson, Fregosi, Alou, Garner, Schoendienst, Francona, Gaston, Robinson (and maybe Gardenhire and Zimmer?) vs. Torre, Bochy and Scioscia.

Anyway, if managers are predominantly Cs, it's a new trend. If it's still just something like 1 out of every 6-7 managers is a former C, that's in line with history. Of relatively new managers (I'll let you guys look up the minor-leaguers)

non-C: Ventura, Sveum, Mattingly, Gibson, and maybe Giambi

C: Metheny and Redmond and maybe Alomar (interim manager last I heard)

I'm not sure that constitutes a trend. Or did I forget somebody.
   21. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: November 01, 2012 at 06:00 PM (#4290401)
Catchers might be over-represented but it's hardly lopsided.


No one said it was.

For the 2012 season, 9 of 30 managers had been catchers, which is a pretty healthy clip.
   22. Good cripple hitter Posted: November 01, 2012 at 06:16 PM (#4290409)
#5, 7, 8 - Is there something I should know? What am I missing?


Actual headline from USA Today's website: Marlins replace Ozzie with batting-cage nudist.

"Ballplayers do some strange things. I did them naked," Redmond said. "I had to break a losing streak, so I did it by taking batting practice in the cage wearing nothing but spikes and batting gloves."

"And the next thing I knew, I was doing it seven or eight straight days."

The rest is history. The Marlins rallied and won the World Series that year.
   23. GregD Posted: November 01, 2012 at 06:27 PM (#4290418)
I miss Larry Bowa on BTF quite a bit. On the baseball field, considerably less
   24. JJ1986 Posted: November 01, 2012 at 06:40 PM (#4290430)
Alomar (interim manager last I heard)


Bench coach in Cleveland though he still might get the Toronto job.
   25. Tom Nawrocki Posted: November 01, 2012 at 06:57 PM (#4290438)
C: Metheny and Redmond and maybe Alomar (interim manager last I heard)


Does Eric Wedge still have a job?
   26. Tom Nawrocki Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:00 PM (#4290441)

It seems like 1B is the position that produces the fewest managers. Mattingly is one I suppose and Giambi could be another.


Tom Kelly and Mike Hargrove were both first basemen. As was Joe Torre at the end of his career.
   27. Eric J can SABER all he wants to Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:01 PM (#4290442)
high fielding percentage as a catcher,

Is this the most useless statistic in baseball?


It's in a close race with range factor for a first baseman.
   28. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:21 PM (#4290450)
Redmond continued the nude BP thing at least w/ Minnesota - other players (T.Hunter, for one) joined in as well.
   29. phredbird Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:28 PM (#4290454)
That's how it starts. Then there aren't any players older than you and there are managers younger than you, your favorite childhood players start dying of old age...


then one day you look up and you're older than the freakin president of the united states ...
   30. DL from MN Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:47 PM (#4290469)
I fondly remember the "Smell 'em" Twins. Good luck to Redmond in Miami.
   31. flournoy Posted: November 01, 2012 at 08:24 PM (#4290485)
I think this makes Redmond the first guy to manage in the majors whom I've also watched as a player.


That can't be right. Ozzie Guillen, A.J. Hinch, Robin Ventura, and Mike Matheny, to name a few off the top of my head, are all very recent players.
   32. cardsfanboy Posted: November 01, 2012 at 08:49 PM (#4290492)
Is this the most useless statistic in baseball?


Wpa for the win.
   33. Nasty Nate Posted: November 01, 2012 at 09:02 PM (#4290500)
If Giambi is hired, we would be the first person to play one year and then manage the next since...?
   34. Austin Posted: November 01, 2012 at 09:50 PM (#4290531)
That's how it starts. Then there aren't any players older than you and there are managers younger than you, your favorite childhood players start dying of old age...

I'd say it starts when you're older than at least one major league player (for me, Bryce Harper was the first to meet this criterion). But yes, I'm sure I'll look up one day a couple decades from now and realize that I'm older than everyone on the field.

That can't be right. Ozzie Guillen, A.J. Hinch, Robin Ventura, and Mike Matheny, to name a few off the top of my head, are all very recent players.

I'm probably one of the youngest semi-regular commenters on this board (20 years old), and I didn't start following baseball with any seriousness until 2007.
   35. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 09:56 PM (#4290536)

If Giambi is hired, we would be the first person to play one year and then manage the next since...?


Jake Taylor?
   36. boteman Posted: November 01, 2012 at 10:16 PM (#4290559)
#22 - Thanks for that link. Miami certainly can be the place for the nudist. While I remember the name Mike Redmond, I'll be damned if I can remember anything about him: what he looks like, that he was a catcher, whether he was any good, etc. That doesn't mean much since that was during my personal doldrums when I was not paying much attention to baseball.

From that article comes the more interesting tidbit: "Redmond will be the fifth Marlins manager since 2010." OUCH! Welcome to the Jeff Loria meat grinder.
   37. Walt Davis Posted: November 01, 2012 at 10:19 PM (#4290564)
For the 2012 season, 9 of 30 managers had been catchers, which is a pretty healthy clip.

WHICH WOULD MAKE IT A RECENT TREND OUT OF STEP WITH THE HISTORICAL MIX as my rather long list of long-serving managers dating back about nearly 50 years demonstrated I thought.

Which could mean it is just the latest MLB fad -- ooh, look, that manager-former catcher was successful, we should hire a former catcher as manager.

   38. Boileryard Posted: November 01, 2012 at 10:22 PM (#4290565)
If Giambi is hired, we would be the first person to play one year and then manage the next since...?

Jim Fregosi started the 1978 season as a player with the Pirates and finished it as a manager with the Angels.
   39. base ball chick Posted: November 01, 2012 at 10:48 PM (#4290588)
28. Der_K Posted: November 01, 2012 at 07:21 PM (#4290450)

Redmond continued the nude BP thing at least w/ Minnesota - other players (T.Hunter, for one) joined in as well.


- torii hunter taking batting practice nude?

here and i swore that wouldn't nothing get me back to minute maid park. i didn't know that nothin included nothin on

   40. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: November 01, 2012 at 10:54 PM (#4290594)
WHICH WOULD MAKE IT A RECENT TREND OUT OF STEP WITH THE HISTORICAL MIX as my rather long list of long-serving managers dating back about nearly 50 years demonstrated I thought.


First, providing a list of long-serving managers doesn't refute the question asked by Swedish Chef or the comment AG1F made. Chef asked if catchers have a leg-up on getting hired, not whether they become greater at a far higher percentage. (It's possible this hiring is a recent trend, though what you've delivered so far doesn't come close to answering that question).

Second, no one said that catchers are being hired in overwhelming numbers - that was your mistaken inference. Your own list of managers indicates that the long-serving managers of the past 50 years are still disproportionally, if mildly so, represented by former catchers.

   41. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: November 01, 2012 at 11:23 PM (#4290614)
Ha, Lisa! my ploy worked!

***

Walt, I think you're underestimating what percentage of managers were historically were ex-backstops. Looking at five seasons...
1951: 38% of games were managed by ex-catchers.
1961: 28%
1971: 8%
1981: 27%
1991: 33%
   42. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 11:51 PM (#4290631)
I'm not sure that constitutes a trend. Or did I forget somebody.


Girardi.
   43. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: November 01, 2012 at 11:51 PM (#4290632)
I'm not sure that constitutes a trend. Or did I forget somebody.


Girardi.
   44. Ray (RDP) Posted: November 02, 2012 at 12:44 AM (#4290658)
Girardi.
   45. Harmon "Thread Killer" Microbrew Posted: November 02, 2012 at 11:10 AM (#4290810)
According to a random Google search, there were 13 former or one-time catchers managing in MLB during the 2009 season:

1) A. J. Hinch, Arizona Diamondbacks - was a catcher for the Athletics, Royals, Tigers, and Phillies between 1998-2004.
2) Eric Wedge, Cleveland Indians - Red Sox and Rockies between 1991-1994.
3) Jim Leyland, Detroit Tigers - catcher in the Tigers' minor league system between 1964-1969.
4) Fredi Gonzalez, Florida Marlins - catcher in the Yankees minor league system between 1982-1987.
5) Mike Scioscia, Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim - catcher for the Dodgers between 1980-1992.
6) Joe Torre, Los Angeles Dodgers - catcher for the Braves and Cardinals between 1961-1970. Became a 3B/1B in 1971 and played until 1977.
7) Ken Macha, Milwaukee Brewers - began minor league career as a catcher but became primarily a 1B/3B/OF.
8) Joe Girardi, New York Yankees - caught for the Cubs, Rockies, Yankees, and Cardinals between 1989-2003.
9) Bob Geren, Oakland Athletics - caught for the Yankees and Padres between 1988-1991 and 1993.
10) John Russell, Pittsburgh Pirates - played catcher along with 1B/OF for the Phillies, Braves, and Rangers between 1984-1993.
11) Bruce Bochy, San Francisco Giants - caught for the Astros, Mets, and Padres between 1978-1980 and 1982-1987.
12) Don Wakamatsu, Seattle Mariners - caught for the White Sox in 1991.
13) Joe Maddon, Tampa Bay Rays - catcher in the Angels minor league system between 1976-1979.
   46. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: November 02, 2012 at 11:26 AM (#4290821)
From that article comes the more interesting tidbit: "Redmond will be the fifth Marlins manager since 2010."

technically, he'd be the 6th, if you count Brandon Hyde's one-game interim stint
   47. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: November 02, 2012 at 11:43 AM (#4290827)
While I remember the name Mike Redmond, I'll be damned if I can remember anything about him: what he looks like, that he was a catcher, whether he was any good, etc.

My recollection is that he is the same person as Matt Treanor.
   48. JJ1986 Posted: November 02, 2012 at 11:52 AM (#4290831)
Treanor is the one with the celebrity wife.
   49. Swedish Chef Posted: November 02, 2012 at 11:58 AM (#4290835)
While I remember the name Mike Redmond, I'll be damned if I can remember anything about him: what he looks like, that he was a catcher, whether he was any good, etc.

He's also a 9-dan Go pro in Japan.
   50. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: November 02, 2012 at 12:10 PM (#4290846)
Redmond, a former big-league catcher with the Marlins and others, is an extremely highly-regarded young guy

I found this phrasing highly amusing, so I did my first handle change in quite some time.
   51. zachtoma Posted: November 02, 2012 at 12:38 PM (#4290869)
The only position that seems seriously under-represented is pitcher (La Sorda's the only long-serving one of recent vintage, yes?).


That's probably because most pitchers who go into coaching become pitching coaches. Also, wasn't Bud Black a pitcher?
   52. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: November 02, 2012 at 12:46 PM (#4290879)
You're right, Bud Black was a pitcher. And so was the new superstar of managerialism, John Farrell.

Also Larry Dierker, Roger Craig, and Larry Rothschild (Devil Rays manager 1998-2001, of whom I have absolutely no memory).

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