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Thursday, January 30, 2014

Michael Young is retiring

The Mighty Hannibal dies and Mighty No Young retires on the same day? Life ain’t fair!

Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports.com reports that Michael Young has decided to retire at age 37 rather than accept an offer from, among other teams, the Dodgers.

Young played 14 seasons in the majors, the first 13 with the Rangers and last year split between the Phillies and Dodgers. He hit an even .300 with 185 homers and a .787 OPS, although his production away from Texas’ hitter-friendly ballpark was generally underwhelming. Young made seven All-Star teams, won a batting title in 2005, and played at least 100 games at all four infield positions.

Repoz Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:19 PM | 47 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: 625 hits to go

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   1. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:24 PM (#4648972)
rather than accept a minor league offer from, among other teams, the Dodgers.
   2. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:30 PM (#4648976)
I'll leave the snark to others, almost 2400 hits including five seasons over 200 and incredibly durable. There are a hell of a lot of guys out there with worse careers.
   3. Lars6788 Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:37 PM (#4648979)
Was a juicer...
   4. A triple short of the cycle Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:38 PM (#4648981)
0.299949482192473
   5. Pat Rapper's Delight Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:38 PM (#4648982)
Years ago on a now essentially defunct Rangers listserv, Jamey Newberg and I went round and round for a few years about Young as he was breaking in and getting established. Jamey was convinced that Young's heart, determination, and work ethic were going to make him a star. I thought collapse/major regression was imminent.

It may have taken a while, but I'm glad to see I am finally vindicated today. :-)

And thanks for the memories, MY!
   6. God Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:55 PM (#4648994)
Young is one of two players in history to play at least 400 games each at 2B, 3B, and SS. (And is the only one not suspected of throwing games.)

Young's also one of nine guys in history to play 100 games at all four infield positions (and is by far the best of the nine).
   7. Davo Dozier Posted: January 30, 2014 at 06:56 PM (#4648995)
0.299949482192473
You shut your dirty mouth!
   8. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:02 PM (#4648997)
I'll leave the snark to others, almost 2400 hits including five seasons over 200

6 actually (but who's counting?)
among all MLB players with >6000 PA's and a lifetime Chadwick ratio of >.300, he has the
4th worst OPS+
   9. Srul Itza Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:06 PM (#4649002)
and is by far the best of the nine


I think, after adjusting for era and park, and considering defense, you can't say with any certainty that Young (24.1 WAR, high of 3.8) was "by far" better than Don Money (36.4 WAR, high of 5.1), Jimmy Dykes (35.2 WAR, high of 4.1) or Denis Menke (28.1 WAR, high of 6.7).

Even with all of the questions surrounding WAR, those numbers should give one pause before proclaiming Young "by far the best".

   10. Davo Dozier Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:09 PM (#4649007)
12th player to retire with a batting average of exactly .300 (min 3,000 PAs).
   11. Gamingboy Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:12 PM (#4649012)

12th player to retire with a batting average of exactly .300 (min 3,000 PAs).


Why risk losing the holy .300?
   12. Dale Sams Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:17 PM (#4649017)
I'll leave the snark to others


Ok! Thank God I won't have to wade through more "We should trade for Michael Young to replace Will Middlebrooks" nonsense.
   13. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:26 PM (#4649024)
Even with all of the questions surrounding WAR, those numbers should give one pause before proclaiming Young "by far the best".

Can we at least say he was by far the best infielder named Young?
   14. God Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:27 PM (#4649027)
Srul -- you're right. My bad.
   15. Joyful Calculus Instructor Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:31 PM (#4649032)
12th player to retire with a batting average of exactlywithin .0005 of .300 (min 3,000 PAs).


   16. Davo Dozier Posted: January 30, 2014 at 07:42 PM (#4649035)
12th player to retire with a batting average of exactly .300 (min 3,000 PAs).


11. Why risk losing the holy .300?

Frank Demaree remains the only player in history to lose a .300 batting average by making an out in the final at bat of his career. The out he made in the final at bat of his career dropped him from .300 to .299.
   17. Jim Wisinski Posted: January 30, 2014 at 09:07 PM (#4649059)
A good to very good player for a long time. He would have been better off though if he had been able to stay at 2B for most of his career, I wouldn't be surprised if he could have broken 30 bWAR (he finished at 24.1) without the years playing out of position. He was also the victim of backlash from outsized media love.
   18. Booey Posted: January 30, 2014 at 09:30 PM (#4649064)
Why risk losing the holy .300?


Just noticed that ARod's average dropped to .299 last year. There goes his HOF chances.
   19. Walt Davis Posted: January 30, 2014 at 09:34 PM (#4649065)
among all MLB players with >6000 PA's and a lifetime Chadwick ratio of >.300, he has the
4th worst OPS+


But better than the HoFer on that list.

A good to very good player for a long time. He would have been better off though if he had been able to stay at 2B for most of his career, I wouldn't be surprised if he could have broken 30 bWAR (he finished at 24.1) without the years playing out of position.

MYoung, 27-34: 312/360/463, 5600 PA, mostly SS/3B
MYstery, 27-34: 310/377/459, 4300 PA, mostly 3B, some DH

Fun with raw numbers! Our mystery guest is Paul Molitor. By OPS+ that's 130 for Molitor and just 113 for Young. Still, by oWAR, it's Young 33 vs. Molitor 30 but Young loses 11 wins to defense. Of course Molitor contributed a ton before 27 and after 34 while Young adds essentially nothing, but it's interesting that for their "primes," they were rather similar. As Jim suggests, maybe he'd have remained a league-average 2B, he'd have been tied in WAR with Molitor.
   20. Rickey! On a blog from 1998. With the candlestick. Posted: January 30, 2014 at 09:37 PM (#4649069)
I always expected him to be better than he was, but that's a career to be proud of. Good on ya, Micheal Young.
   21. BDC Posted: January 30, 2014 at 09:48 PM (#4649072)
I often felt I spent half my time here defending Young and half trashing him. He was that underrated and that overrated. Retire In Peace, Michael.
   22. Infinite Joost (Voxter) Posted: January 30, 2014 at 10:11 PM (#4649078)
. Lars6788 Posted: January 30, 2014 at 05:37 PM (#4648979)
Was a juicer...



. . . is a one-note moron now on my ignore list.
   23. Davo Dozier Posted: January 30, 2014 at 10:41 PM (#4649093)
18--Yep, and it happened in his second to last game of the season.
   24. Tripon Posted: January 30, 2014 at 10:44 PM (#4649095)
rather than accept a minor league offer from, among other teams, the Dodgers.


Nah, Ned loves signing gritty, can't play anymore, and shitty infielders to major league deals so it hard for him to cut him later when its clear he doesn't have anything else left deals. Young would have gotten a major league contract if he wanted to come back.

Young likely didn't want to ride the bench for $1 million more likely.
   25. Davo Dozier Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:35 AM (#4649122)
I honestly wonder if that desire to keep his career batting average at .300 played even the tiniest of factors in his decision making process.
   26. Mom makes botox doctors furious Posted: January 31, 2014 at 06:11 AM (#4649150)
Hall of Pretty Darn Good
   27. formerly dp Posted: January 31, 2014 at 08:08 AM (#4649154)
I know this is going back a ways, but did anyone expect Young to have this sort of career when the Blue Jays dealt him for Estaban Loiaza? It took him two fairly mediocre years before he settled into his normal .300/.340/.440 groove, and I'm not confident the Jays would have had the patience to stick with him through those first couple of years. At the time they dealt him, he looked promising but not particularly special in the minors-- hitting .275/.340/.426 as a 23 year-old at AA, with some decent speed. IIRC the Jays at the time had a gaggle of indistinguishable 2B prospects, and some SS, including Homer Bush, Joey Lawrence (maybe, can't remember), Cesar Izturis, Felipe Lopez, and Chris Woodward. They even had Ryan Freel kicking around. Young turned out to be the best of the bunch.
   28. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 31, 2014 at 08:45 AM (#4649158)
Hall of Pretty Darn Good

Inner Circle Hall of he's so overrated he's underrated.
   29. Jacob Posted: January 31, 2014 at 09:02 AM (#4649161)
the Jays at the time had a gaggle of indistinguishable 2B prospects, and some SS, including Homer Bush, Joey Lawrence (maybe, can't remember), Cesar Izturis, Felipe Lopez, and Chris Woodward. They even had Ryan Freel kicking around. Young turned out to be the best of the bunch.


Whoa!
   30. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: January 31, 2014 at 09:31 AM (#4649170)
Young likely didn't want to ride the bench for $1 million more likely.

What a nice option to have, even if you decide you don't need it. Can I have one of those, please?
   31. Mom makes botox doctors furious Posted: January 31, 2014 at 09:38 AM (#4649172)
"Inner Circle Hall of he's so overrated he's underrated."

Don't be a wet blanket about it : )

   32. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 31, 2014 at 10:00 AM (#4649178)
Don't be a wet blanket about it : )

I'm actually complimenting Young. He was a damn fine player. But, he got so overrated the backlash has led to us making fun of him, and not recognizing how good he was.

Same phenomenon with Jeter.
   33. Mickey Henry Mays Posted: January 31, 2014 at 10:45 AM (#4649192)

Same phenomenon with Jeter.


Maybe the phenomenon is the same but the level isn't.
   34. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: January 31, 2014 at 10:47 AM (#4649195)
Maybe the phenomenon is the same but the level isn't.

Correct.
   35. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: January 31, 2014 at 10:54 AM (#4649199)
For Michael Young it was more like "Because he's bad now we have to pretend he was never good".

That Tim Lincecum! What a fraud! Cy Young my arse. His ERA's over 5!
   36. Pat Rapper's Delight Posted: January 31, 2014 at 11:25 AM (#4649212)
I know this is going back a ways, but did anyone expect Young to have this sort of career when the Blue Jays dealt him for Estaban Loiaza?

Nope, as I alluded to in [5].
   37. Tripon Posted: January 31, 2014 at 11:33 AM (#4649218)
Maybe the phenomenon is the same but the level isn't.


The problem Young had is that teams were able and willing to replace him with better players, starting with A-Rod, Kinsler, Elvis Andrus, etc.

Jeter never faced that problem. The Yankees installed him at SS, and even in his prime A-Rod couldn't force the Yankees to move Jeter.
   38. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: January 31, 2014 at 11:35 AM (#4649219)
Ok! Thank God I won't have to wade through more "We should trade for Michael Young to replace Will Middlebrooks" nonsense.


This was a thing? By Red Sox fans?

I have no love for Ye Olde Team, but I'd all sorts of rather have a cost-controlled Mr. Jenny Dell on my team than 2014 Michael Young. Despite the fact that he had a career to be proud of, I don't think he has a whole lot left.
   39. Rickey! On a blog from 1998. With the candlestick. Posted: January 31, 2014 at 11:46 AM (#4649221)
It's reasonable to say Young was a poor man's Derek Jeter. Same basic skill sets. Same basic deficiencies. Just that Jetes had a better helping of the skills.
   40. zonk Posted: January 31, 2014 at 11:52 AM (#4649226)
It's reasonable to say Young was a poor man's Derek Jeter. Same basic skill sets. Same basic deficiencies. Just that Jetes had a better helping of the skills.


Well, and the gift baskets.

Gift baskets go a long way.
   41. Rickey! On a blog from 1998. With the candlestick. Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:00 PM (#4649234)
Well, and the gift baskets.


And when I say "skill sets" I never mean "penis."
   42. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:16 PM (#4649247)
Frank Demaree remains the only player in history to lose a .300 batting average by making an out in the final at bat of his career. The out he made in the final at bat of his career dropped him from .300 to .299


I want to say John Kruk was the opposite. He had a hit with the White Sox that raised his lifetime average to .300, then retired after the game.

EDIT: He did go 1-1 in his last game; however, his lifetime average coming into that game was .30005 (and finished at .30023). His batting average ended that year (1995) at .308, which was the lowest it had been in a month.
   43. Davo Dozier Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:28 PM (#4649255)
42--Kruk actually retired right in the middle of the game!

Full story

But after complaining of pain in his knees during his comeback with the White Sox, Kruk finally called an end to his 10-year major league career Sunday by retiring after a first-inning single off Scott Erickson in the White Sox's 8-3 loss to Baltimore.

Kruk left the ballpark during the middle of Sunday's game so he could escape without making a big deal out his retirement. Kruk left a statement for the media that read:

"The desire to compete at this level is gone. When that happens, it's time to go."

Kruk finished with a lifetime batting average of .300, with 100 home runs and 592 RBI.

On Sunday, manager Terry Bevington planned to leave him in at DH so he could go out the way he desired. "He wanted to go out with a hit," Bevington said. "He wanted to wait until he got a hit. He was geared up. He was playing that first at-bat like the seventh game of the World Series."

Kruk hobbled all the way to first base. He went into the dugout after the inning was over, said good-bye to his teammates, got in a car with his parents and headed home to West Virginia.


Doing the math reveals he was actually hitting .300 before that final at bat, so the story doesn't quite work...but still. Odd way to go out!
   44. alilisd Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:36 PM (#4649262)
Young is one of two players in history to play at least 400 games each at 2B, 3B, and SS. (And is the only one not suspected of throwing games.)

Young's also one of nine guys in history to play 100 games at all four infield positions (and is by far the best of the nine).


That's good stuff!
   45. Misirlou's been working for the drug squad Posted: January 31, 2014 at 12:37 PM (#4649263)
BBREF lists Kruk's weight at 170. I wonder what it would have been had he put the other foot on the scale.
   46. Mickey Henry Mays Posted: January 31, 2014 at 01:27 PM (#4649294)

The problem Young had is that teams were able and willing to replace him with better players, starting with A-Rod, Kinsler, Elvis Andrus, etc.

Jeter never faced that problem. The Yankees installed him at SS, and even in his prime A-Rod couldn't force the Yankees to move Jeter.


Probably because one was Derek Jeter A #1 Duke of New York and the other was just plain ol' Michael Young.
   47. Rants Mulliniks Posted: January 31, 2014 at 01:43 PM (#4649303)
#27 - I think Young's lack of range would have been too great to overlook playing 80-90 games a year on turf.

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