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Saturday, August 04, 2012

Mike Hargrove Never Suspected Steroid Use Was Rampant, Doesn’t Think Proven Cheaters Belong in HOF

See here, public Hargrove.

How much he knew of players using steroids:

“I will be brutally honest with you, I never heard anybody talk about or whisper anything like that. When you talk about how much stronger the players were and how much more productive they were everybody talks about year-round conditioning and tremendous nutrition, better eating habits and better training methods so I never suspected it. I just didn’t. I don’t think I was like an ostrich with my head stuck in the sand. I truly believe with the improved training methods, I mean every club had a strength coach which they hadn’t had ever before, weightlifting had become the norm where before it was a taboo activity and with the increase in dietary methods and the nutrition that was available and is available the people that I have talked to and listened to and heard talk, attributed it all to that. I remember when (Ken) Caminitti came out and said that he thought 80 percent of the major league players were taking steroids. My first thought was other than being shocked at somebody who said that, was that he was absolutely and totally wrong. Now that you look at it and see what has been going on I’m not sure that 80 percent was high enough. I was shocked and believe me I was in on some brutally frank conversations and I never heard a whisper of it so they hid it well.”

How he would handle the voting for the Hall-Of-Fame when it comes to guys linked with steroids:

“Yeah I would. The ones who have not been proven or been suspected of indulging in that culture I would. (Host: What about the others? (Barry) Bonds, (Roger) Clemens, (Sammy) Sosa, (Mark) McGwire, Manny (Ramirez) has tested positive.) I love Manny Ramirez to death. I really, really do and it makes me really sad that he got caught up in this stuff but the guys that have been proven that they did it, no I wouldn’t put them in. As good of players that they were and for what they did and the numbers that they put up they would not have my vote, no. Take a guy like Jim Thome, I’ve known Jimmy since he was 19-years-old and he would be the last person that I would ever believe or suspect of doing anything like that so I think he is legitimately a Hall-Of-Famer and should go in. Jack Morris I think should go into the Hall-Of-Fame and I think it’s a crime that he hasn’t been elected into the Hall-Of-Fame but the guys that have been proven that they had done it I don’t think they should be in just like I don’t believe Pete Rose should be in.”

Repoz Posted: August 04, 2012 at 07:46 AM | 12 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: history, hof, roids

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   1. dejarouehg Posted: August 04, 2012 at 12:11 PM (#4200483)
2 minor leaguers were telling me about it at a wedding in 1992, where they spoke of how many used it, naming one small-time major leaguer specifically. Caminitti speaks about it in SI. Kenny Rogers speaks about it in SI. Sorry, I'm calling "bullsh*t" on Grover.
   2. Athletic Supporter was shiny, now he's all rusted Posted: August 04, 2012 at 01:40 PM (#4200523)
Hargrove: "I'm shocked, SHOCKED to find out that steroid use is going on in here!"
   3. bobm Posted: August 04, 2012 at 01:48 PM (#4200526)
How he would handle the voting for the Hall-Of-Fame when it comes to guys linked with steroids:

“Yeah I would. The ones who have not been proven or been suspected of indulging in that culture I would. ... Jack Morris I think should go into the Hall-Of-Fame and I think it’s a crime that he hasn’t been elected into the Hall-Of-Fame but the guys that have been proven that they had done it I don’t think they should be in just like I don’t believe Pete Rose should be in.”


Newsflash: Jack Morris linked to steroids users by Mike Hargrove! :)
   4. Monty Posted: August 04, 2012 at 03:03 PM (#4200557)
(Barry) Bonds, (Roger) Clemens, (Sammy) Sosa, (Mark) McGwire, Manny (Ramirez) has tested positive.


Did that happen?
   5. Kiko Sakata Posted: August 04, 2012 at 03:19 PM (#4200565)
Did that happen?


An anonymous source allegedly told some reporter that Sosa's name was on the (anonymous, confidential) list of players who tested positive in 2003 (the testing that had no penalties but set up penalty-based testing for the next year). This was never confirmed by anybody on the record and Sosa himself never said anything about it one way or the other.

EDIT to add: ESPN story
   6. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: August 04, 2012 at 05:51 PM (#4200612)
Hargrove: "I'm shocked, SHOCKED to find out that steroid use is going on in here!"


Attendant: Your needle, sir.
Hargrove: Ah, thank you.
   7. Walt Davis Posted: August 04, 2012 at 07:49 PM (#4200641)
In those wacky, post-Animal House days, we planned a food fight at my high school. We were all talking about it pretty openly in the hallways and such -- granted in a bit of a wink-wink way but anybody listening to us would have known something was gonna happen at lunch.

The teachers were shocked and quite pissed off (Jesuit school, they held the entire shcool in detention that afternoon).

This lesson taught me how little attention teachers pay to students.
   8. Bruce Markusen Posted: August 04, 2012 at 11:55 PM (#4200734)
So even if Hargrove did know, what was he supposed to do? Make specific accusations based on hearsay and gossip? Suspend players?

The managers were put in a ridiculously bad, no-win situation by the players using steroids. It wasn't the managers who were breaking the rules. This was all on the players, and MLB's inability to respond to the situation.
   9. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: August 05, 2012 at 12:36 AM (#4200744)
It wasn't the managers who were breaking the rules.

no one was breaking the rules--there were no rules about steroids then
   10. cardsfanboy Posted: August 05, 2012 at 12:42 AM (#4200747)

The managers were put in a ridiculously bad, no-win situation by the players using steroids. It wasn't the managers who were breaking the rules. This was all on the players, and MLB's inability to respond to the situation.


Everyone was put in a no win situation. That is why people should just acknowledge it happened, accept that it was the era, the same way that racism kept players out, but still acknowledge who was the best of the era. No one is saying "oh forget it happened" but it's ridiculous to hold players to a standard that was nearly an impossible standard to do, with the forces pushing you to cheat.

You have writers every year, fully in the know, who kept writing stories using code words (vitamins, best shape of his life crap) You have owners and a players association who refused to publicly talk about it, as it would hurt their position at the negotiation table. You had "chicks dig the long ball", GM's telling the 25th man he has to "show him he's committed to doing everything" type of wink comments. You have a culture that has 40 years of cheating with pills and greenies, 100+ years of cheating period, lack of any real comments from anyone in charge. Designer drugs and even legal supplements skirting the borders of the law, and every year a suspected player going out and having the year of his life and getting a huge contract.
   11. Monty Posted: August 05, 2012 at 01:50 AM (#4200753)
An anonymous source allegedly told some reporter that Sosa's name was on the (anonymous, confidential) list of players who tested positive in 2003 (the testing that had no penalties but set up penalty-based testing for the next year). This was never confirmed by anybody on the record and Sosa himself never said anything about it one way or the other.


Good enough. Stone him!
   12. PASTE Transcends Almost All Generations (Zeth) Posted: August 05, 2012 at 09:33 AM (#4200787)
Well, I for one feel much better now that I know what the Human Rain Delay thinks about steroids.

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