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Wednesday, July 04, 2012

MLB: Astros trade Carlos Lee to the Marlins

Carlos Lee and Ozzie Guillen: baseball’s latter-day Odd Couple, reunited at last!

Miami acquired Houston first baseman Carlos Lee and cash considerations for prospects Matt Dominguez and Rob Rasmussen, the team announced following its 7-6, 10-inning win over the Brewers at Miller Park.

According to a source, the Astros are paying all of the remaining nearly $9 million owed to Lee, except for the pro-rated $480,000 minimum salary.

“He’s still a dangerous hitter,” Marlins general manager Michael Hill said. “He will fit nicely in the middle of our lineup. A proven run producer. We’re expecting him to come in and do what he’s done throughout his career.”

The Astros nearly sent Lee to the Dodgers last weekend and were awaiting his approval on the deal before the Dodgers backed out. Lee has a limited no-trade clause, which means there were 14 teams to which his contract couldn’t be assigned. The Marlins were not on his list, so he didn’t have a say in the trade.

Depressoteric Posted: July 04, 2012 at 10:51 PM | 31 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: astros, hilarity, houston, marlins, miami

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   1. base ball chick Posted: July 04, 2012 at 11:55 PM (#4173316)
amusement

so crane is getting stuck with almost the whole salary - i took a look at what the astros got back - doesn't look like much of anything. silly to be so angry with someone for refusing a trade that they'd dump him for so little
   2. Misirlou's been working for the drug squad Posted: July 04, 2012 at 11:58 PM (#4173319)
so crane is getting stuck with almost the whole salary - i took a look at what the astros got back - doesn't look like much of anything. silly to be so angry with someone for refusing a trade that they'd dump him for so little


And it also shows the impotence of the limited no-trade clause. So he refuses a trade to LA because he wants to stay in Houston. Did he really think it would end there?
   3. The District Attorney Posted: July 05, 2012 at 12:03 AM (#4173321)
Dominguez is regarded as an amazing fielder, and his minor league performance has generally been ok considering his age. (His 2012, however, has been horrible by any standard.) At worst, his glove prevents him from being overly horrible, and at best, he actually hits. So he should have value, even though he is clearly no longer a top prospect as he was once regarded. The (surprising) fact that the Astros are calling him up right away indicates that they must be legitimately excited about him.

If you're not going to move LoMo to 1B even after sending down Gaby Sanchez, are you ever going to do it? It seems like it's where he should be playing. (Admittedly, he's not hitting like a 1B this year, but hey, he's not hitting like a LF either.)
   4. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 12:39 AM (#4173336)
miserlou

i have no idea what clank thought - he and everyone on the planet KNEW they were gonna throw his a$$ out. i guess he was hoping that the teams he listed as OK didn't want a 1B/DH or weren't gonna spend any money and he was gambling that crane didn't want to pick up the rest of his salary - which he did

DA

might could i ask where you got that info from? it's not on any site or any release. matt dominguez has a .648 OPS at AAA new orleans. he doesn't walk and he doesn't steal. he's better than johnson/moore/bixler???

shrug

well, whatever. the team as is flat out sux
   5. booond Posted: July 05, 2012 at 12:48 AM (#4173339)
Dominguez is a worse-hitting, better fielding Chris Johnson. At best maybe he hits as well as Johnson and fields much better... Pedro Feliz with less power.
   6. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 12:58 AM (#4173344)
dominguez at ANY level has not hit as well as chris johnson

guess they are gonna send down bixler or moore if they do call dominguez up

shrug

whatever - these are the guys who think that jordan schafer is all that
   7. booond Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:00 AM (#4173346)
dominguez at ANY level has not hit as well as chris johnson


I didn't say he had.
   8. Ivan Grushenko of Hong Kong Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:06 AM (#4173347)
If Dominguez is really such an awesome defender, is there any chance he can play SS?
   9. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:07 AM (#4173348)
booooond

i know

but i am not getting why on earth this guy is considered a top prospect. or why on earth they are putting him on the ML team. might as well get mike costanza back.

it's really hard to care

i read something by one of the chron guys saying how important it is to not give no trade clauses to any future big ticket FA and it was to laugh - like any big ticket FA is gonna come to houston - carlos lee is the only one (besides andy pettitte, who apparently did so in a snit fit with the yecchs) who ever did. FA don't want to come here
   10. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:09 AM (#4173349)
ivan

looking at his minor league stats, he never has played SS - lowrie is perfectly acceptable - and this is after watching the horror show that was angel sanchez or miggy tejada. too bad tommy manzella couldn't hit ML pitching the 6 weeks of opportunity he did get because he had a really good glove
   11. booond Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:36 AM (#4173356)
but i am not getting why on earth this guy is considered a top prospect. or why on earth they are putting him on the ML team.


He's not considered a top prospect. He's living off his high school rep. They added him to the ml roster because it validates the trade - not that it does but that's how bad organizations work.
   12. Tricky Dick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 02:30 AM (#4173362)
Luhnow's explanation for sending Dominguez directly to the major league team is not altogether clear. Chris Johnson has a minor injury, and he said that, for the time being, Dominguez would be insurance for Johnson's injury, while also providing the major league coaching staff time to evaluate him. The Astros will decide over the All Star Break whether to keep Dominguez at the major league level. It's possible that this is a holding pattern in case additional trades open up spots on the major league roster.
   13. RollingWave Posted: July 05, 2012 at 05:12 AM (#4173366)
I think Carlos Lee just wants to star on the Franchise.
   14. Rants Mulliniks Posted: July 05, 2012 at 07:15 AM (#4173371)
The only thing remarkable about Carlos Lee at this point is that's he's the toughest guy to K in MLB. Odd stat for a 270-lb first baseman.
   15. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 05, 2012 at 08:26 AM (#4173382)
And it also shows the impotence of the limited no-trade clause. So he refuses a trade to LA because he wants to stay in Houston. Did he really think it would end there?


That limited no-trade clause got him dealt to a state with no income tax, rather than a state with one of the higher rates in the nation. A not inconsiderable difference for a guy who is, by all appearances, only in it for the money at this point.
   16. flournoy Posted: July 05, 2012 at 08:34 AM (#4173387)
Why didn't Carlos Lee have a full no-trade clause? He was a ten-and-five guy. Or does that status not exist anymore?
   17. Tricky Dick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 08:43 AM (#4173390)
No. 16: 5 & 10 still exists. But Lee waived his 5 & 10 rights when he negotiated his contract. In exchange, he received a lengthtier partial no trade clause.
   18. BDC Posted: July 05, 2012 at 09:39 AM (#4173413)
Huh. I guess he did hate the idea of playing in LA, after all :)
   19. Johnny Sycophant-Laden Fora Posted: July 05, 2012 at 10:12 AM (#4173429)
dominguez at ANY level has not hit as well as chris johnson


Not a huge fan of Dominguez, but at 21 Dominguez hit .258/.312/.431 in New Orleans- at 21 Chris Johnson hit .212/.251/.266 in the NY Penn League
at 22 Dominguez has been bad in AAA, but at 22 Dominguez hit just .261/.298/.401 split between the Sallie and the Carolina league

throw in his glove and through age 22 Dominguez has been afar better player than Johnson was through the same age

considering where the Astros are as a team right now, taking a flyer on Dominguez makes a lot of sense- as to whether he should stay in AAA or go up??? Considering where the Astros are as a team right now, that doesn't really seem to matter much either (easy for me to say as anon-Astros fan)

   20. The District Attorney Posted: July 05, 2012 at 10:29 AM (#4173439)
might could i ask where you got that info from? it's not on any site or any release.
Not sure what you mean? That Dominguez is getting called up? That was on Rotoworld. (He's on my Strat-O-Matic team, which is really the only reason I know anything about him. He was drafted after Brian Dinkelman, but before Eric Surkamp!) That he used to be considered a top prospect? He was the 12th overall pick, Baseball America #64 in 2009, and #81 in 2011.

Anyway, don't get me wrong, he wasn't BA top 100 before this season and he then proceeded to go out and play horrendously. But he's young, so you can still hope he figures out what the hell he's doing at bat, and his glove gives him a higher floor.
   21. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 11:39 AM (#4173512)
the same age, chris johnson was in college. it's kind of silly to compare hs picks with college picks using "the same age" instead of "the same year in OB". i meant that his minor league stats, looking at any year, are not as good as chris johnson's cumulative stats.

we haven't had a great glove third baseman since vinny castilla and at least he could hit.

actually, my team (in my remembered lifetime - say, since 1990) hasn't really had that many great glovers - we had biggio at second and Bagwell at first (before 2000) we had caminiti in the early 90s and he really was teh awesomeness, and vinny castilla in, i think 01. most of the SS have been average or less except for adam everett, who was ozzie freaking smith without the backflips - at least until carlos lee broke his leg in 07. berkman had a gold glove year at first in 08. richard hidalgo had a really great glove. of course, we had beltran and bourn in center. none of them ever got the props they deserved for their gloves, especially everett.

well, i guess we're gonna watch dominguez play ML 3rd base for a while.

he can't make this team any worse, at least I can say THAT
   22. JRVJ Posted: July 05, 2012 at 11:41 AM (#4173516)
If I may, Carlos Lee has a rather large (for Panama) cattle ranch, and he comes to Panama to visit it often, even during the regular season.

I suspect that this has being helped by their being direct flights from Houston to Panama, but also by the fact that the flight time is not too long. Miami has even more flights to Panama, and they are at least an hour shorter.

Don't discount that variable when discussing Lee's decisions.

(BTW - COPA Airlines, Panama's national airline, does have a flight from Panama to LAX, but obviously, the flight time is much longer than from Houston or Miami).
   23. base ball chick Posted: July 05, 2012 at 01:27 PM (#4173622)
JRVJ

how on earth could he come often during the regular season?

he isn't going there at 11 PM after a night game then taking the first thing in the morning flight to houston or any other city. he wouldn't hardly even get 24 hours if he took off after a sunday afternoon game and had to take the next flight back - AND that isn't almost ever houston to houston

i thought he actually checked in at his ranch in TEXAS that is south of houston during the season if he had a few extra hours - he hardly got a day off and he always showed up even if he asn't playing
   24. JRVJ Posted: July 05, 2012 at 02:03 PM (#4173683)
I've seen news reports of him coming down during the season.

I figure he does it when there's a day game followed by an off-day (which could also be a travel date).

And yes, it would be a lightning fast trip, but no reason why he can't do those.
   25. Johnny Sycophant-Laden Fora Posted: July 05, 2012 at 03:09 PM (#4173772)
. it's kind of silly to compare hs picks with college picks using "the same age" instead of "the same year in OB"


no, age is FAR more relevant/predictive than how many years someone has been in "organized ball"

The odds of someone having a breakout at age 23 are pretty much the same for the college guy as it is for the guy playing in the minors since age 18.

i meant that his minor league stats, looking at any year, are not as good as chris johnson's cumulative stats.


doesn't work like that, you have to at least try to match up age and level- what Chris Johnson hit at age 24 in Round Rock really doesn't mean anything unless:

1: You are comparing it ti what others did at ages 23-25 in the PCL; or
2: He so blew the PCL away (he didn't), that you had to look to see what he'd do in the MLB...

Chris Johnson is just another guy who happened to have a pretty good first extended look in the MLB, but 2011/2012 is more consistent with his minor league track record- and when added to that track record you have player whose resume fairly screams/yawns, "meh"

Dominguez may never hit enough to be a worthwhile MLB player, but he fields and he's young, in 3 years he might be something, Chris Johnson... meh.

Getting even a quasi-prospect for Lee at this point has to be seen as an unmitigated plus
   26. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: July 05, 2012 at 03:29 PM (#4173786)
Getting even a quasi-prospect for Lee at this point has to be seen as an unmitigated plus.

Houston is paying the freight on Lee. For around 9 million, I would think that they can do a little better than a quasi-prospect.
   27. DL from MN Posted: July 05, 2012 at 04:25 PM (#4173848)
For around 9 million, I would think that they can do a little better than a quasi-prospect.


Except Lee isn't worth $9M to anyone. The $9M gets paid to Lee if he's on the team or not. Rasmussen looks like the best player in the trade so the Astros win.
   28. donlock Posted: July 05, 2012 at 05:10 PM (#4173929)
My guess is this is Lee's last year in the majors, certainly at $9 million.Why would you turn down the opportunity to play for a winning team with the Dodgers? It's only for three more months or so and half of that would be away games.

It seemed obvious that Houston wanted him to be gone. He may have messed up a little better trade for them by refusing LA. They could have really messed him up by trading him to Minnesota or Oakland (or name any bad team not on his no-trade list).

Even if he wants to keep playing, he will be a free agent after the season and can sign with any team that will take him.

Didn't Palmiero refuse a trade to Boston from Texas in his walk year?
   29. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: July 05, 2012 at 05:56 PM (#4173977)
The $9M gets paid to Lee if he's on the team or not. Rasmussen looks like the best player in the trade so the Astros win.

Fair enough, especially if Rasmussen is worth something more than Dominguez. Lee certainly looks like a sunk cost.
   30. The District Attorney Posted: July 08, 2012 at 10:46 PM (#4176600)
So they sent Dominguez right back down. Kind of weird.
   31. base ball chick Posted: July 09, 2012 at 12:42 AM (#4176696)
the weird part was having him in the majors in the first place.

what is even weirder is justin maxwell not having surgery for bone chips in his ankle and sending him back on the field when he needs to have surgery.

they are gonna call up brett wallace, i guess, so they can decide what to do with him because jonathan singleton is gonna get called up this fall

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