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Sunday, March 17, 2013

Murray Chass: RETIREMENT RIGHT PLACE FOR TORRE

It is painful to say this, but Joe Torre did such a poor job managing Team USA in the World Baseball Classic that I think Bobby Valentine could have done better.

Despite the Americans’ obvious problems hitting and scoring runs, Torre managed with the imagination of a tree trunk. [...]

Good managers, though, can adjust quickly and adapt to new circumstances.

But what do I know? Torre once told me I didn’t know anything about baseball, and neither, for that matter, did any other writer.

bobm Posted: March 17, 2013 at 05:21 PM | 18 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: joe torre

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   1. Joyful Calculus Instructor Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:00 PM (#4390131)
It's weird seeing Chass write an article agreeing with what people were saying in the BBTF threads.
   2. John Northey Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:22 PM (#4390144)
The blind squirrel found an acorn!
   3. PASTE Thinks This Trout Kid Might Be OK (Zeth) Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:25 PM (#4390147)
MAYBE TORRE SHOULD START A BLOG TO PASS THE BORING DAYS NOW THAT NO ONE WANTS TO EMPLOY HIM.
   4. Fancy Pants Handle doesn't need no water Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:34 PM (#4390149)
Murray Chass: RETIREMENT RIGHT PLACE FOR TORRE CHASS
   5. Good cripple hitter Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:42 PM (#4390153)
It's weird seeing Chass write an article agreeing with what people were saying in the BBTF threads.


Actually, he's not. His complaint is:

"Torre managed as if he had Murderers’ Row in his lineup, forgoing any kind of small-ball strategy and waiting for a three-run home run."

Most people here were complaining about Torre using too much smallball, mismanaging the bullpen, and/or being beholden too much to the players' MLB teams.
   6. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: March 17, 2013 at 08:59 PM (#4390157)
Torre once told me I didn’t know anything about baseball,


The blind squirrel found an acorn!

In this case, blind squirrel Torre sure did.
   7. tfbg9 Posted: March 17, 2013 at 09:06 PM (#4390160)
Murry Chase ladies and gentlemen, sportswriter emeritus of the New York Times.
   8. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: March 17, 2013 at 09:21 PM (#4390164)
Murry Chase ladies and gentlemen, sportswriter emeritus of the New York Times.

"I'M MURRAY CHASE, AND YOU'RE NOT."
   9. Joyful Calculus Instructor Posted: March 18, 2013 at 12:48 AM (#4390324)
[5] Oh, never mind then. I only read the headline. Never clicked the link.
   10. Halofan Posted: March 18, 2013 at 02:08 AM (#4390340)
With the tough road ahead for Girardi, on what date this season will Chass call for Torre's reinstatement in the Bronx?
   11. John Northey Posted: March 18, 2013 at 06:17 AM (#4390352)
I was only reading this little bit, not the article as I don't like to give poor writers click throughs. Ick - small ball was the problem? Did he not watch the games? The killer was the way he handled the pitchers imo - it was clearly spring training methodology, not 'we must win' methodology.
   12. catomi01 Posted: March 18, 2013 at 11:17 AM (#4390468)
The killer was the way he handled the pitchers imo - it was clearly spring training methodology, not 'we must win' methodology.


Which is exactly what I would want if one of my team's pitcher's was there...for better or worse, MLB's teams have made it very clear that the their primary concern is the regular season, and post season, not this tournament...until and unless that changes, you are not going to get the best of the best giving their all. With that in mind, might a better strategy be to use mainly short relievers? Load up a staff full of guys focused on going 1-2 innings every day, and used to that type of work load...and use 5 pitchers a game that way? If starters are not ready for a regular workload by this time in the spring, leave them in camps and take most teams closer and best set up man. The alternate in my mind is that you get guys the teams don't really care about being abused (in other words, the worst pitchers they have in camp) if you want your starter to go 6-7 innings.
   13. JJ1986 Posted: March 18, 2013 at 11:33 AM (#4390476)
With that in mind, might a better strategy be to use mainly short relievers?


The biggest problem was that Torre needed to get all the short relievers enough work. So even if they came into the game and put the first three runners on, he wouldn't pull them because they still needed to get more pitching in.
   14. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: March 18, 2013 at 11:42 AM (#4390481)
It is painful to say this, but Joe Torre did such a poor job managing Team USA in the World Baseball Classic that I think Bobby Valentine could have done better.


Except if Valentine was managing none of the coaches would be talking to each other, David Wright would have been kicked off the team because Bobby decided Wright had too big of an ego, and Valentine would have gotten into a bizarre argument with himself about whether or not he heckled Giancarlo Stanton while Stanton was fielding a fly ball.
   15. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 18, 2013 at 12:15 PM (#4390500)
Torre has been washed up as a manager for at least 10 years.
   16. Srul Itza Posted: March 18, 2013 at 01:40 PM (#4390575)
for better or worse, MLB's teams have made it very clear that the their primary concern is the regular season, and post season, not this tournament


Any reason it shouldn't be? Baseball is a business and they make their real money during the regular season and post season.

I am not one of the anti-WBC crusaders. It seems like a fun little tournament, and if it raises baseball's international profile, so much the better. But I will always find the regular season and post season more important than this, and I cannot begrudge owners with multi-million dollar investment from feeling the same way.
   17. ecwcat Posted: March 18, 2013 at 01:53 PM (#4390587)
I don't blame Torre. The pitchers were still conditioning themselves and the power hitters choked.
Chase is a bitter school girl.
   18. catomi01 Posted: March 18, 2013 at 07:29 PM (#4390756)
Any reason it shouldn't be?


Not from my point of view no...but there seem to be a fair number of sports writers who think that amounts to treason.

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