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Monday, October 01, 2012

NBA Monthly Thread, October 2012

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what the site is really about: making fun of sportswriters and immigration reform.

Famous Original Joe C Posted: October 01, 2012 at 10:16 AM | 882 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   401. Booey Posted: October 18, 2012 at 10:19 PM (#4276233)
Just watched the Jeremy Evans block and dunk. Love it. Why he rode the pine last year in favor of Josh Howard or CJ Miles is beyond me.
   402. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 18, 2012 at 10:28 PM (#4276242)
I'm an Evans fan but... how would you use him / who would you pair him with? Both Howard and Miles are quite a bit better ball handlers / have considerably more range than Evans - and it's not like Utah uses stretch fours on their second team ... and of course the four spot is crowded. The Evans archetype is one I like - a guy who can scramble stuff up - but I understand why the Jazz haven't made it work yet.
   403. smileyy Posted: October 19, 2012 at 12:51 AM (#4276355)
In weird int'l news: Romain Sato arrested in Slovenia for having a fake passport, not allowed to play in his upcoming Euroleague game.


Apparently with accusations that the arrest was to keep him from playing in the game: http://rt.com/sport/basketball/fenerbahce-forward-passport-sato-758/
   404. Booey Posted: October 19, 2012 at 11:08 AM (#4276552)
I'm an Evans fan but... how would you use him / who would you pair him with? Both Howard and Miles are quite a bit better ball handlers / have considerably more range than Evans - and it's not like Utah uses stretch fours on their second team ... and of course the four spot is crowded. The Evans archetype is one I like - a guy who can scramble stuff up - but I understand why the Jazz haven't made it work yet.


Howard and Miles (and Bell) were all kinds of terrible last year. I can't imagine Evans could have been any worse, so what would have been the harm in giving him a chance? I'm not saying he should've started or anything, but I don't see how the team would've been worse if they'd given him 15 of Josh Howards minutes at SF last year.

It'll be a little tougher this season to find PT for him if they run their big lineup more often (Jefferson at C, Favors at PF, Millsap at SF), plus working in Marvin Williams too. But I think they could have absolutely made it work last year. Corbin's obsession with veterans - even terrible ones - was almost as frustrating as Sloans (I loved Sloan, but his disdain for young players was maddening sometimes).
   405. Jimmy P Posted: October 19, 2012 at 12:48 PM (#4276631)
Nowitzki officially out for 6 weeks. Dallas is not going to be very good this year.
   406. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 19, 2012 at 01:00 PM (#4276637)
[405] That's 6 weeks before he can begin his rehab, I believe. So, yeah, DAL is definitely not making the playoffs.
   407. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 19, 2012 at 01:17 PM (#4276650)
So, it appears you were right, berg. My bad.
   408. andrewberg Posted: October 19, 2012 at 01:40 PM (#4276663)
So, it appears you were right, berg. My bad.


I was just assessing probabilities. I definitely didn't expect him to be out this quickly. In any case, this is not what I meant by getting Elton Brand more playing time.

Deron Williams is probably going to say that he didn't sign with Dallas because Dirk's knees didn't come to the meeting with him.
   409. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 19, 2012 at 02:13 PM (#4276678)
One last time, if anyone is interested in playing in a 2K13 Online Association, send me a message.* It’s going to be a Fantasy Draft (tentatively scheduled for Wednesday the 24th of October, HOF difficulty, No CPU trading, 29 game season with 7-7-7-7 playoffs and injuries are on.

*-If you message me and I don’t respond within 12 hours just post something on this thread

EDIT: PS3 and 5 minute quarters.
   410. andrewberg Posted: October 19, 2012 at 04:12 PM (#4276795)
Teams that are even just average defensively have very little chance of doing much damage in the postseason unless they score at a lights-out rate. The reverse also applies, though not quite as strongly; most studies have found that an elite defense is slightly more important to building a champion than an elite offense.


From Lowe's Grantland column on the Nets. Looks like it's "redeeming my stupid theory day" today.
   411. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 19, 2012 at 04:27 PM (#4276810)
From Lowe's Grantland column on the Nets. Looks like it's "redeeming my stupid theory day" today.
Johnson's size suggests he's an elite rebounding guard, but the numbers don't; he had virtually the same defensive rebounding rate as Ray Allen and Ty Lawson last season — about average among all guards, and the norm for Johnson's career. He can jack things up in a new context, but he's not going to morph into Evan Turner.


that made my day.
   412. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 20, 2012 at 12:19 AM (#4277264)
just a few quick thoughts on tonight's game:

1, deron williams, joe johnson, gerald wallace, and brook lopez all played 30+ minutes, and the nets still lost by 10. as a team, they shot 44/26/60 from the field/3P line/FT line, and considering all of the turnover on the roster, and the fact that brooklyn was supposed to have a pretty good offense, that seems like a pretty good indicator of the quality of the defense.

2, the most notable aspect of the sixers preseason so far is not the 4-1 record, but the fact that they've scored 100 points in all 5 games. considering their record-tying run through the playoffs last season, it's quite fun to watch an offense that doesn't suck.

3, coming into tonight's game, the sixers had shot 47% from beyond the arc. tonight, they were just 7/21, and even then, they hit their first 4 3PAs, so they actually played the last ~40 minutes shooting 3/17. and despite that, they still beat the nets by 10.

4, something that's notable about that last point is that the sixers were in the top 10 last year in 3P%, but they did that while being in the bottom 10 in 3PAs. this year, they've added 3 wings (nick young, dorell wright, and jason richardson) who took more 3PAs than anyone on last year's team, and beyond that, they appear to have doug collins' blessing to chuck it at will.


5, with all of that said, the sixers are still playing without one of the best offensive big men in the sport.
   413. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 20, 2012 at 02:04 PM (#4277487)
tonight, they were just 7/21, and even then, they hit their first 4 3PAs, so they actually played the last ~40 minutes shooting 3/17. and despite that, they still beat the nets by 10.

Bless your soul, Steagles.
   414. robinred Posted: October 20, 2012 at 04:03 PM (#4277542)
I had said earlier that I thought the BKN D would be an issue--the Lopez/Humphries combo doesn't do it for me, so I agree with Lowe. I think they do have a pretty good team, though. Blatche may help them.
   415. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:45 AM (#4277807)
Bless your soul, Steagles.
*ahem* STEAGLES

I had said earlier that I thought the BKN D would be an issue--the Lopez/Humphries combo doesn't do it for me, so I agree with Lowe. I think they do have a pretty good team, though. Blatche may help them.
deron williams, joe johnson, and brook lopez should be a pretty damn effective scoring trio. most of the other nets, though, they're not really ideal role players.
   416. smileyy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 02:06 AM (#4277831)
Is that a first recorded use of capitals in a STEAGLES post? I'm not sure I've ever seen a self-reference before :D
   417. robinred Posted: October 21, 2012 at 03:21 AM (#4277842)
Is that a first recorded use of capitals


What I like about it is that his spelling and punctuation are both pretty meticulous. He just refuses to use capitals. I have read so many of his 76ers posts at this point that I don't really notice anymore.
   418. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 21, 2012 at 03:00 PM (#4278083)
Mike Bresnahan @Mike_Bresnahan 2 minutes ago
Lakers Coach Mike Brown: It's a game-time decision for Dwight Howard tonight.

Ira Winderman @IraHeatBeat about 12 minutes ago
Heat waive Mickell Gladness and Robert Dozier, which moves Josh Harrellson closer to a roster spot.

Chris Sheridan @sheridanhoops about 20 minutes ago
BREAKING NEWS STORY: #Knicks Stoudemire out 2-3 weeks with ruptured cyst in left knee #NBA sheridanhoops.com/2012/10/21/sto…

Chris Palmer @ESPNChrisPalmer about 13 minutes ago
Kobe Bryant is the only active NBA player to have scored 60 in a game.

Chris Palmer @ESPNChrisPalmer about 24 minutes ago
There are 2 players in China who have scored 60 in an NBA game: T-Mac 62, AI 60.


   419. PJ Martinez Posted: October 21, 2012 at 07:36 PM (#4278264)
Have barely followed the league since the Howard trade, but I'm confused: Why are the LAL projections so conservative? How is it that Howard + Bryant + Gasol + Nash does not = ~60 wins? Is it just age? Or is there an injury I missed? (I know Howard's coming off one, but it sounds like he might play tonight, so.)
   420. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 21, 2012 at 07:50 PM (#4278287)
Age, poor bench, feeling that la will use their studs conservatively during the regular season, uncertainty about howard's back going forward, not sure how to project mwp.
   421. robinred Posted: October 21, 2012 at 07:51 PM (#4278290)
Hollinger thinks the bench will kill them. SCHOENE, as Pelton discusses in the Boston comment in BaskPRo 12/13, tends to take a very dim view of older players' prospects for success. Jordan Hill is fighting a back problem now, the West is deep, and I think people assume that Bryant and Nash, and possibly Gasol and Howard, will miss some games. Nash is only about a 30-33 MPG guy now, and his backup is Steve Blake. Add questions about Mike Brown to all that, and there you go.

That said, as is normally the case, the MSM/traditional media guys are mostly more bullish on the Lakers than the stathead blogosphere intelligentsia guys are.

And of course, Hollinger has them winning 53 and Pelton has them winning 55. Obviously, if things break right, a team on that level could win 60.
   422. PJ Martinez Posted: October 21, 2012 at 07:57 PM (#4278302)
Thanks, guys. That all makes sense. Still, Howard is playing with three guys who are each better than anyone he's ever played with before, plus I'm a nervous Celtics fan, so I will continue to think they are being underrated, and expect them to come out of the West.
   423. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 21, 2012 at 08:03 PM (#4278318)
Pelton/hollinger are not dismissive of them in terms of the postseason...
   424. robinred Posted: October 21, 2012 at 08:07 PM (#4278330)
plus I'm a nervous Celtics fan,


Celtics fans worrying about the Lakers right now makes about as much sense as Lakers fans worrying about the Heat. ;- FWIW, 56 of the 104 ESPN "experts" picked the Lakers to win the West, bringing knowing smirks from the Haberstroh/Mason/Abbott/Hollinger group, who like OKC and think people are once again "sleeping on the Spurs". 42 picked OKC; 6 picked SA.

Personally, I think the Lakers are third in line behind last year's finalists and I think I would put them at about 5-1 to win it. But they could certainly be the best team in the league if things go their way with health. And yes, Howard has never had guys this good around him, even if all three of them are old.
   425. robinred Posted: October 21, 2012 at 08:16 PM (#4278349)
Pelton/hollinger are not dismissive of them in terms of the postseason...


I don't think anyone is, except maybe dumb guys at Miami and OKC fan sites. But Hollinger has them 4th in the conference and is on record saying the bench is "terrible", and I seriously doubt that either of them will pick the Lakers to win the title or even to make the Finals. I assume that they will pick Miami over OKC again, which from a stathead POV makes sense.

On another note, BaskPro is pretty high on the Hawks (I have read three team essays--LAL, ATL and BOS). Has them at 49-33, pulling in at #2 in the East.
   426. PJ Martinez Posted: October 21, 2012 at 09:12 PM (#4278478)
Celtics fans worrying about the Lakers right now makes about as much sense as Lakers fans worrying about the Heat.

Oh, I'm not worried about them in the sense that they strike me as a big obstacle to a Celtics title. There are, as you note, plenty of more immediate obstacles to such an occurrence. I'm worried about them just because I think they might be really good, and that will make me really sad.

P.S. Gun to my head I still pick Miami to repeat, but I think health is the only thing standing between LA and the Finals, and maybe between LA and the title. It's possible that age-related decline will keep them from a title, too, of course. And health is a bigger question mark for LA than it is for OKC. Still, I suspect the staheads are may be underestimating them.
   427. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 21, 2012 at 09:23 PM (#4278492)
FWIW, Hollinger began his Lakers article with:
Like everyone else, I expect the Lakers to make the conference finals and contend for a championship. Unlike everyone else, I don't expect them to be particularly imposing in the regular season, for a number of reasons.

Which strikes me as about right (I'm a little less bearish than him, but only a little).

Hollinger says 53 wins, #4 seed, B-Pro says 55/4 (and also suggests that they should get to the finals / are OKC's top obstacle in the west).
   428. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 21, 2012 at 09:26 PM (#4278498)
I expected the stat dudes to be high on Atlanta, if for no other reasons than the karmic effects of them (and I) annually underrating them (and Joe Johnson?).
The biggest short term question for me is: how are they going to succeed with no size on the wing?
   429. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 22, 2012 at 01:05 AM (#4278695)
Fluff piece on Jorts on ESPN that I thought was interesting for one line:
Harrellson has shown a wider skill set than many imagined from his days as a Kentucky Wildcat. He played almost exclusively around the rim under coach John Calipari.

"I’ve always been able to shoot the ball, but I really didn’t showcase it at Kentucky because I always played with a lot of great shooters around me," Harrellson said. "Primarily, I played my role as a 5, but coming into the league, they like guys that space the floor. And that’s my specialty."

How often do you all think this sort of thing happens? Around draft time, Jorts was evaluated like a regular big so no one thought he had a chance to ever be in the league, then the Knicks shock the world by drafting him and everyone is confused/laughs...until it turns out he's like a disease-ridden deathbed near homeless man's Kevin Love. Why wasn't it known, at all, that he could potentially be a stretch 4.5?
   430. robinred Posted: October 22, 2012 at 01:31 AM (#4278698)
Preseason, but Hollinger 1, me 0. +/- numbers:

Gasol 0 MWP +7 Howard +5 Nash + 7 Bryant +7
___

Jamison -11 Ebanks -16 Sacre -6 Blake -9 Duhon -5 Meeks -14

All the starters played 32-36 minutes, and Howard played. Kobe did more or less exactly what people supposedly want him to do with this group: 6/12 from the floor, 8/8 FTs. Howard took 12 shots, Gasol 8. MWP, surrounded by HoFers and left open a lot, took 6 3s and hit 3 of them and took 11 shots.

Nash was only 2/6 from the floor and did not take a 3. Not sold on this Princeton thing for him at all.
   431. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 03:13 AM (#4278707)
How often do you all think this sort of thing happens? Around draft time, Jorts was evaluated like a regular big so no one thought he had a chance to ever be in the league, then the Knicks shock the world by drafting him and everyone is confused/laughs...until it turns out he's like a disease-ridden deathbed near homeless man's Kevin Love. Why wasn't it known, at all, that he could potentially be a stretch 4.5?
since i was probably the only person in this thread to bring up harrellson's name prior to the draft, i'll tell you that i really had no idea that he had any offensive skill at all.


and since i know that everyone is waiting with baited breath to hear my thoughts on tonight's sixers-celtics game, which the sixers won 88-79, bringing them up to 5-1 in the preseason:


1, i want to see dorell wright play ~40 minutes per game. he has been extremely impressive, and right now, i think he is clearly the best player the sixers have on the wing. of the 4 guys they have at the position (wright, young, richardson, and turner), he is easily the best defensive player, from an individual standpoint, from a team standpoint, and from a versatility standpoint. and offensively, he's as good a shooter as any of the others, and he's been great running the floor in transition, and his handling seems to have been significantly underrated. 2 years ago, he averaged 16 points, 5 rebounds, 3 assists, a block and a steal, while leading the NBA in made 3 pointers and falling just short of a 2:1 assist:turnover ratio. if what he's done this preseason is any indication of what he's capable of doing during the regular season, i think he could easily match that, if not improve on it, due to an increase in usage and/or efficiency.

2, the defense was extremely impressive during the 2nd quarter. there were multiple plays where boston had the sixers' defense off-balance and were passing the ball around the perimeter, trying to get it to an open shooter, but every time the ball was moved, one of the sixers defenders was closing out at a full sprint and boston just never got a clean look. the whole thing looked frantic and pretty ragged, but they challenged everything and they were very effective.

3, evan turner left the game in the 3rd quarter with a sprained ankle. he was already favoring a sprained knee coming out of training camp, so, this season is not looking especially promising for him.

4, jrue holiday has had a quiet preseason in terms of scoring, but tonight, he did just about everything else. 10 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists, and 3 steals in 26 minutes.

5, jeff green had a pretty solid game for boston. 12 points, 10 rebounds, 4 blocks, and 2 steals. since i was talking about him a few days ago, i feel it's necessary to mention that he looked much better than i remember.

6, lavoy allen fouled out in 16 minutes tonight guarding kevin garnett. that's not ever good, but tonight, with andrew bynum and kwame brown sidelined with lower body injuries, and thaddeus young taking a maintenance day, that left the sixers really thin up front. if i had to guess, i'd say that dorell wright and damien wilkins combined to play ~30 minutes at PF during the game, and again, that is not ideal.
   432. andrewberg Posted: October 22, 2012 at 11:51 AM (#4278929)
2 years ago, he averaged 16 points, 5 rebounds, 3 assists, a block and a steal, while leading the NBA in made 3 pointers and falling just short of a 2:1 assist:turnover ratio. if what he's done this preseason is any indication of what he's capable of doing during the regular season, i think he could easily match that, if not improve on it, due to an increase in usage and/or efficiency.


There are some serious pace issues standing in the way of that.
   433. GregD Posted: October 22, 2012 at 11:57 AM (#4278935)
How often do you all think this sort of thing happens? Around draft time, Jorts was evaluated like a regular big so no one thought he had a chance to ever be in the league, then the Knicks shock the world by drafting him and everyone is confused/laughs...until it turns out he's like a disease-ridden deathbed near homeless man's Kevin Love. Why wasn't it known, at all, that he could potentially be a stretch 4.5?
Harrellson had a reputation as a shooter when he transferred to UK, but he only got into the rotation at UK by becoming a bruiser (and by Orton's decision to go pro.) So the idea kind of sat behind him that he could shoot but no one had seen evidence in a while. His play in the NCAA tourney probably earned the draft pick but it is surprising if other teams didn't at least test his shooting.
   434. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 12:52 PM (#4278982)
There are some serious pace issues standing in the way of that.
that was in 2010/11. golden state played at a fast pace that year, but they were 5th in the NBA in pace, so it's not as if they were some incredible outlier.

i'm not a big fan of predictions, but i've just started to take a look at the early season schedule, and it kind of looks like they should be 13-3 going into december. with or without bynum. i say 'should', because i fully expect them to lose another game or three, but really, they have 10 games against the dregs of the NBA (NOH, TOR (x2), CLE (x2), DET, ORL, PHX, DAL, CHA), and another 6 against teams that are (mostly) in their league (DEN, NYK (x2), BOS, UTA, OKC). if they take care of business in that 1st set of games, and then split the 2nd, that's 13-3.


something else that's notable about their schedule is that they again finish the season with a pretty road-heavy stretch. 12 of their last 16 are on the road, and while there are some (supposed) gimmes there (SAC, CLE (x2), CHA (x2), DET, WAS), that could screw with their seeding going into the postseason.
   435. andrewberg Posted: October 22, 2012 at 01:40 PM (#4279028)
Last night we had our first frost of the year. The leaves are starting to fall off the trees steadily. Football is in full swing. I just attended the last wedding of the summer. And STEAGLES is predicting an .800 winning percentage for the Sixers.

Must be fall.
   436. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 22, 2012 at 03:05 PM (#4279130)
i want to see dorell wright play ~40 minutes per game...

I like Dorell and think that moving to Philly and Doug Collins could work wonders for him (and specfically his defense, which comes and goes a bit - it's been suggested because he's worried about injury).
That said, I expect a good year, not a great one.

Nash was only 2/6 from the floor and did not take a 3. Not sold on this Princeton thing for him at all.

Square peg, round hole.
They hired EJ before landing Nash, right?
   437. tshipman Posted: October 22, 2012 at 03:10 PM (#4279134)
I like Dorell Wright, but he's a chucker. He was born a chucker and he'll die a chucker. If he plays more than 20 minutes a game for Doug Collins, I'll be shocked.

Nash was only 2/6 from the floor and did not take a 3. Not sold on this Princeton thing for him at all.


Don't worry, Mike Brown is a great coach!!!
   438. madvillain Posted: October 22, 2012 at 04:08 PM (#4279205)
Last night we had our first frost of the year. The leaves are starting to fall off the trees steadily. Football is in full swing. I just attended the last wedding of the summer. And STEAGLES is predicting an .800 winning percentage for the Sixers.

Must be fall.


For some reason this memory always stick in my mind: It's Halloween 2006, I had just gotten off the train at Franklin Avenue in Crown Heights, Brooklyn around 10pm, it's like 40 degrees, dark and windy, and as I'm walking back to my apt I hear a guy holler "damn you see that Heat score, they got run over!" (or something like that). I holler back at the guy "Go Bulls!" but it gets lost in the wind.

Man that seems like a life ago that I was in Brooklyn and Ben Wallace was the big FA pickup for the Baby Bulls.

Anyways, continue on.
   439. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 22, 2012 at 05:00 PM (#4279251)
i know this is boring but... fantasy hoops poll: do you take an injured kevin love (f/c) or a less injured chris paul (g). (hth format, 18 wk regular season)
   440. JuanGone..except1game Posted: October 22, 2012 at 05:09 PM (#4279260)
Nash was only 2/6 from the floor and did not take a 3. Not sold on this Princeton thing for him at all.


Agreed, his role wasn't what I was hoping for, though he kept making the assist on someone else's assist. The offense did look overwhelming at times because of the movement of the starting 5. Even after one game, I think that an easy prediction is that the Lakers are going to easily spend the most time at the line in the league.

Couple other things for Lakers/Sacremento:
1)I can't overstate what unbelievable shape Metta is in this year. My gf has weighed in and she's sure that its a non-gluten diet.
2)Marcus Thornton was in mid-season form. I've got him on my list as the next Jet. He's going to make some GM look good once he gets to a good team and comes off the bench.
3)Aaron Brooks is one of my favorite non-Lakers. It might be because I've watched him torch Fisher over the years in playoff series, but I just don't get why he's so undervalued.
   441. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 22, 2012 at 05:27 PM (#4279275)
For some reason this memory always stick in my mind: It's Halloween 2006, I had just gotten off the train at Franklin Avenue in Crown Heights, Brooklyn around 10pm, it's like 40 degrees, dark and windy, and as I'm walking back to my apt I hear a guy holler "damn you see that Heat score, they got run over!" (or something like that). I holler back at the guy "Go Bulls!" but it gets lost in the wind.

And the Bulls swept the defending champ Heat out of the playoffs that season in the first round, before bowing out in 6 the next round. I think steagles would accept that outcome for the sixers this year.
   442. andrewberg Posted: October 22, 2012 at 05:52 PM (#4279297)
i know this is boring but... fantasy hoops poll: do you take an injured kevin love (f/c) or a less injured chris paul (g). (hth format, 18 wk regular season)


SCOENE is pretty bearish on Paul this year, it seems. That probably has less to do with his skill and more to do with settling into his surroundings with so many other guys who are going to want/need shots. Love has always been quick to recover, and I generally feel that I can piece together a playoff team in a H2H format, so an early season injury that is unlikely to linger would not prevent me from taking him. I say Love by a small margin.

Even after one game, I think that an easy prediction is that the Lakers are going to easily spend the most time at the line in the league.


Probably not a coincidence that the teams who are truly elite at this skill are LAL, MIA, OKC.
   443. Booey Posted: October 22, 2012 at 06:02 PM (#4279310)
Even after one game, I think that an easy prediction is that the Lakers are going to easily spend the most time at the line in the league.


Probably not a coincidence that the teams who are truly elite at this skill are LAL, MIA, OKC.


Plus teams may deliberatly do the hack-a-shaq on Howard.
   444. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 06:15 PM (#4279319)
Probably not a coincidence that the teams who are truly elite at this skill are LAL, MIA, OKC.
if evan turner got the kind of respect from the officials that kobe bryant, dwyane wade, and james harden get, he'd be at the FT line 8+ times per game. i'm not saying that he deserves to get that respect, but he gets hacked every time he gets into the paint, and he's such a mediocre finisher that he'd be shooting two a whole hell of a lot more often than he'd be going for the and-1.
I like Dorell Wright, but he's a chucker. He was born a chucker and he'll die a chucker. If he plays more than 20 minutes a game for Doug Collins, I'll be shocked.
i'm actually really, really optimistic about him. that's probably not very shocking, you know, me being optimistic about a sixer, but if you look at what he does, there's a whole lot to like. it's easy to dismiss him as a chucker, but he's also a good rebounder, a good defender, he gets steals, blocks, and assists. and then, yeah, he's a chucker, but he's also a very good 3P shooter, and really, the best sixers scorers over the last 15 years have been allen iverson and lou williams, so i don't think chucking is too much of a dealbreaker in this town.
   445. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: October 22, 2012 at 06:24 PM (#4279329)
if evan turner got the kind of respect from the officials that kobe bryant
If he ever earned it, he'd get it.
   446. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: October 22, 2012 at 06:33 PM (#4279345)
If he ever earned it, he'd get it.


Lord almighty but that is a circular argument.
   447. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 08:13 PM (#4279437)
halftime of sixers-knicks now.

sixers are playing without jrue holiday, evan turner, dorell wright, kwame brown, and andrew bynum. royal ivey and damien wilkins have each played 18 minutes. tyson chandler has played 18, carmelo anthony has played 15.

so, of course, the sixers are up 62-44.


can you say density?
   448. andrewberg Posted: October 22, 2012 at 08:19 PM (#4279451)
Should that say destiny, or was that just a great pun?
   449. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 08:59 PM (#4279576)
Should that say destiny, or was that just a great pun?
what does a man with two penises say when his tailor asks whether he tucks to the right or to the left?


the 2nd half has not been nearly as clean as the 1st, but hey, at least we're giving our oldest player 40 minutes of playing time in a meaningless game because noone else is healthy. so, there's that.
   450. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 22, 2012 at 09:46 PM (#4279768)
the sixers pulled out an 8 point win, ending the preseason with a (meaningless) 6-1 record.

from tonights game, there's not a whole lot to point out, but i'll go with these:

1, jason richardson was 6/12 from beyond the arc. he ended the game with 23 points, 7 rebounds, and 6 assists. that's about as good a line as i expect to see from him this season. i cannot imagine that he will ever have the ball in his hands as much as he did tonight, and it's also fairly unlikely that he'll take such a high percentage of shots, compared to the rest of the team.

2, since the season will likely begin with lavoy allen and thaddeus yonug as the starting forwards, i'll note that they combined for 30 and 21 on 13/19 shooting. young provided most of the scoring there (22 points), while allen provided the bulk of the rebounds (13 boards). if they can give you that while bynum recovers from his knee problems, that'd be pretty great.


that's pretty much it. though i could point out that the knicks are choking dogs for failing to complete a comeback against the likes of damien wilkins and royal ivey, i'll abstain from doing so. after all, the knicks were missing such noted difference makers as amare stoudemire, marcus camby, and jr smith.
   451. Booey Posted: October 22, 2012 at 11:39 PM (#4280235)
If he ever earned it, he'd get it.

Lord almighty but that is a circular argument.


This. That's why I never liked the idea of superstar calls, cuz then it becomes the chicken or the egg question; do certain players get more than their fair share of calls because they're stars, or are they stars because they get more than their fair share of calls?

(and I'm not referencing any particular player, just the general star system in place)
   452. tshipman Posted: October 23, 2012 at 01:53 AM (#4280358)
i know this is boring but... fantasy hoops poll: do you take an injured kevin love (f/c) or a less injured chris paul (g). (hth format, 18 wk regular season)


It depends on the categories and the rest of your team/the league.

Are you punting any particular category? Typically, I think that G's help more than bigs in most setups. CP3 will help you more with FT%, A, A/T, S and FG%. Love will help you more with R (obviously huge here), ppg, 3pers.

I think that in most set-ups, CP3 is more valuable, before you get into the missing time aspect. Love is probably likely to be healthy for fantasy playoffs, and actually trying in those games.
   453. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 23, 2012 at 09:35 AM (#4280415)
Not roto style, you get points for good stuff, lose less for bad. In the abstract, Love is more valuable than Paul on a game to game basis (in part because I can use him at center) - but that's pre-missed time. (Using our scoring system, Love pre-injury projected as the #1 guy per game in the league, a hair over LBJ - Paul #4 or #5).
This is my only fantasy league (one through work, a way of roping introverts into social activities) and I'm all but a lock to make the postseason if past experience is any indication, but I'm worried about losing out on the first round bye you get from winning a six team division if I'm down my only stud for the first several weeks.
   454. andrewberg Posted: October 23, 2012 at 12:40 PM (#4280605)
Maybe I am too down on Paul this year. I bought him in the auction draft we did last year after having him ranked 3rd overall preseason, then he just played a more facilitating, less aggressive game than he had in the past. He was still really good, but I don't think he was a top 3 player last year. Maybe it was just unrealistic to return to the 22-11 pace he had before hurting his knee. Then, I offered to help a friend with his keeper team this year in a league that really prefers heavy usage over efficiency and Paul sunk all the way to the 15-20 range in preseason rankings. I have to be careful not to let that bleed into my analysis of him here.
   455. andrewberg Posted: October 23, 2012 at 12:52 PM (#4280621)
What are thoughts on Damion Lillard here? I look at his age and weak college competition as red flags, and SCHOENE is not wild about him, but his preseason results hve been really good and lots of NBA people seem to love him. What is a realistic expectation for him?
   456. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: October 23, 2012 at 01:07 PM (#4280636)
I like Lillard. I don't really mind his age... once you get past the top young guys, most of the time a young draft pick is just going to eat up roster room for a couple years while he develops and even if he does end up being a star you'll have to pay for his best years. I don't think Lillard is going to be a star but I think he's going to be a very solid player and his team/cost controlled years are going to be his prime. And he has some upside simply by virtue of we don't really know what he's going to do against better competition, too.
   457. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 23, 2012 at 01:27 PM (#4280658)
I like him too - view his floor as a better shooting, more willing to pass (but less physical) Stuckey. And Stuckey is a better player than people give him credit for.
   458. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 23, 2012 at 02:03 PM (#4280688)
   459. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: October 23, 2012 at 02:28 PM (#4280710)
This is pretty amazing (on the ending of Rockets-Sonics Game 7 in 1993), h/t to Pelton's tweet. I remember watching that game and I certainly didn't notice either.
   460. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 23, 2012 at 03:14 PM (#4280757)
The Spurs have released NBA Champion Eddy Curry.
   461. Booey Posted: October 23, 2012 at 03:30 PM (#4280769)
#459 - Wow, that is pretty cool. I'd never heard about that until now. I'm sure the Rockets didn't do this on purpose, but I think it's interesting that according to the rules of the time, they COULD have and possibly won the game using a cheap trick like this.

Does anyone know if the rule this link references has since been changed so that any points a 6th player scored wouldn't count?
   462. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 23, 2012 at 04:20 PM (#4280865)
I saw a zillion tweets to that article - it's pretty amazing.

SA: I'd read that SA was debating between Curry and Brown - looks like they waived both.
   463. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: October 23, 2012 at 04:29 PM (#4280878)
SA: I'd read that SA was debating between Curry and Brown - looks like they waived both.


A trick question!

</connery>
   464. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 23, 2012 at 04:57 PM (#4280933)
Some mini-projections from Lowe. I agree with a lot of these...
   465. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 23, 2012 at 05:02 PM (#4280940)
"benji" is the 30 for 30 film that's on ESPN tonight. not being alive in 1984, and not being from chicago, i really am not at all familiar with the story, but when the previews for the second run of 30 for 30 films came out, this probably the most intriguing to me.
   466. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 23, 2012 at 05:16 PM (#4280955)
"benji" is the 30 for 30 film that's on ESPN tonight. not being alive in 1984, and not being from chicago, i really am not at all familiar with the story, but when the previews for the second run of 30 for 30 films came out, this probably the most intriguing to me.

I was too young to understand exactly what happened, but I was aware of his death (and Len Bias's). It was a huge deal in Chicago, and it was a big deal for the UofI basketball team. He was a pretty big and significant get for Henson. I am looking forward to the film as well.

Simeon has a great tradition of basketball talent, including Wilson, Rose, Nick Anderson, Deon Thomas and Bobby Simmons.
   467. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 23, 2012 at 05:33 PM (#4280982)
Some mini-projections from Lowe. I agree with a lot of these...
Miami Will Lead the League in Points Per Possession
i don't think that'll happen. i don't think they'll shoot 3s or be good enough in the post to lead the league. personally, my money would be on san antonio.
This Will Be It for Memphis
considering that there wasn't even supposed to be an "it" for memphis to begin with -- seriously, zach randolph was eating his way out of the league when they got him, they traded pau gasol for an unknown 50th pick, and tony allen plays 30 MPG for them -- that's not exactly the most meaningful prediction. they're already playing with house money.
The Hawks Will Be Playing in the No. 4–vs.–No. 5 Playoff Series
...They've got the goods to do it, with...three creative pick-and-roll ball handlers (Devin Harris, Lou Williams, and Jeff Teague) with distinct individual styles.
just to mention the most glaring question, can any of those 3 be on the floor at the same time? there's only 1 ball to play with on offense, and considering all 3 are undersized guards who are average-to-below defensively, they don't really seem like complementary talents.

Gerald Green Will Average in Double Figures and Emerge As One of the Season's Feel-good Stories
Nikola Pekovic Will Put Up All-Star Numbers, Become a Borderline Household Name
i agree with both of these. both players were big favorites of mine throughout last season and going into this past offseason.

Thaddeus Young Will Play the Most Power Forward Minutes in Philadelphia
For now, this is a wish more than a hope.


yeah, i'm right with him on this, too.
   468. The Buddy Biancalana Hit Counter Posted: October 23, 2012 at 06:37 PM (#4281041)
can any of those 3 be on the floor at the same time? there's only 1 ball to play with on offense, and considering all 3 are undersized guards who are average-to-below defensively, they don't really seem like complementary talents.

I'm not sure if they should be on the floor together, but they probably will be. The Hawks don't have any good* perimeter defenders. If they're a top-15 defensive team, Smith and Horford will probably both deserve All-Defense consideration.

I figure they'll lean on Teague/Harris/Williams more against teams who can be attacked by little guards off the dribble and Korver/Morrow/Jenkins against teams they want to attack through Smith and Horford. I suspect we'll see more of the latter as Larry Drew has emphasized the three-pointer and Ferry has shown a clear affinity for shooters so far.

*DeShawn Stevenson is a competent defender, but, he's also DeShawn Stevenson. And I'm hoping (finally) to be right about Damion James being useful but I'll wait until he actually makes the team before jinxing that.
   469. Jimmy P Posted: October 23, 2012 at 06:43 PM (#4281050)
Jeff Van Gundy comments on his brother and ESPN. Pretty strong words here.
   470. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 23, 2012 at 06:54 PM (#4281061)
AV Club gave Benji a B- (they are generally much more well disposed to these pics)

I'm down w/ both STEAGLES'/467 and Buddy's 468. Did anyone see the deadspin takedown of DeShawn the other day? Pretty amusing.
   471. Jimmy P Posted: October 23, 2012 at 07:21 PM (#4281081)
Are we not doing the head-to-head BTF Fantasy League?
   472. JJ1986 Posted: October 23, 2012 at 07:36 PM (#4281094)
Are we not doing the head-to-head BTF Fantasy League?


I'd be up for one.
   473. tshipman Posted: October 23, 2012 at 10:00 PM (#4281164)
I guess if someone sets it up, I'd play.

I want to see Der K in it this year!
   474. andrewberg Posted: October 23, 2012 at 10:57 PM (#4281195)
I set it up last year and have the stored league info in Yahoo if people want me to fire it up again. I'd be happy to do it, but it seemed like a large portion of the league kind of checked out early last year. If we have 10-12 really interested people, let's do it.
   475. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 24, 2012 at 12:40 AM (#4281261)
so, i'm just finishing "benji" right now.


that might be the best 30 for 30 they've done yet. at the least it's right alongside the two escobars, into the wind, and once brothers. just an awful, awful story, in every way, but powerful, and very well presented.


i don't know that this is meaningful, but something that all 4 of these 30 for 30 films have in common, at least for me, is that i really knew nothing about the subjects before watching them. i mean, i knew who vlade divac was, and i knew pablo escobar, but for the most part, i was hearing everything in these films for the first time.
   476. tshipman Posted: October 24, 2012 at 12:47 AM (#4281265)
I set it up last year and have the stored league info in Yahoo if people want me to fire it up again. I'd be happy to do it, but it seemed like a large portion of the league kind of checked out early last year. If we have 10-12 really interested people, let's do it.


Yeah, towards the end there it was me, you and a couple of other guys and that was about it.
   477. jmurph Posted: October 24, 2012 at 08:36 AM (#4281319)
Re: Fantasy hoops, I'm confused. League info was posted here a few weeks ago and I (and others) joined. Was that not the same group from last year? Maybe it was the Lounge league? All I know is the draft is this Sunday, and I expect to do poorly.
   478. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 24, 2012 at 10:22 AM (#4281392)
I'd be willing to play but:
* I'm normally not a great owner - I put effort into my draft and am hands off 'til then - I thought you guys deserved better
* Draft is Sunday? This weekend is pretty bad for me - I'll probably be available as of, say, 8pm EDT on Sunday, but not until then.
   479. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 24, 2012 at 12:17 PM (#4281495)
Haven't done more than a real quick scan of it yet, but... Hardwood Paroxysm has a downloadable season preview. (free, at that)
First thought: there are better products out there (BPro's annual for one), but this is interesting and worth your time.
   480. andrewberg Posted: October 24, 2012 at 12:26 PM (#4281504)
What was posted before was the Lounge league.
   481. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 24, 2012 at 01:22 PM (#4281572)
How good would Gerald Green be if he wasn't missing part of a finger / could keep better control of the ball?
   482. Fourth True Outcome Posted: October 24, 2012 at 02:12 PM (#4281618)
Primer retweet from @johnschuhmann:
Deron Williams actually signed a contract (with contingencies) on a house in Dallas this summer. Backed out after choosing to stay with BKN.

I didn't realize it was that close. Makes for some interesting alternate history...
   483. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 24, 2012 at 02:38 PM (#4281659)
I didn't realize it was that close. Makes for some interesting alternate history...

Not sure I could watch an episode of Shark Tank if Cubes wasn't on it.

---

I am so glad the preseason is almost over. I am the opposite of so glad that Funk and King are still the Bulls' TV announcers. Late in the 4th quarter last night*, they decided to revisit some of Stacey's keys to the game (why they do that in the preseason is...I'll move on). Anyway, one of the points was to limit the Thunder in transition and they showed that OKC was scoring over 100 points/game so far in the preseason (...). At that point, OKC was obviously going to finish under 100 points on the night so Stacey deemed that a success for the Bulls. He said that with a completely straight face, and while I'll give him a pass on not pointing out it was the preseason or that the Bulls slow pace always skews that number, but I won't give him a pass on not mentioning that neither Durant or Westbrook played and that might be a reason why they didn't score 100 last night. Geez.

*Only thing interesting about last night is that Harden was 2/17 from the floor. The entire offense revolved around him, but he had missed a bunch of time, so there's absolutely nothing to learn from that whatsoever.
   484. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: October 24, 2012 at 04:42 PM (#4281850)
so, i'm just finishing "benji" right now.

that might be the best 30 for 30 they've done yet. at the least it's right alongside the two escobars, into the wind, and once brothers. just an awful, awful story, in every way, but powerful, and very well presented.


It was very good. I didn't realize how little of the story I actually knew. It was very well made and very moving.
   485. Jimmy P Posted: October 24, 2012 at 04:59 PM (#4281874)
Ric Bucher left ESPN? While I didn't agree with everything he said, I did like him.
   486. Booey Posted: October 24, 2012 at 05:50 PM (#4281941)
Ric Bucher left ESPN? While I didn't agree with everything he said, I did like him.


He made a comment about Jazz fans/Mormons some years back that I thought was idiotic (which he later apologized for), but overall I've always thought he was pretty good too.
   487. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 24, 2012 at 06:29 PM (#4281974)
Agreed. Rumor is he may soon return on a consultant/contractor basis.

All star ballot will now be for 2 posts, 2 wings, and a pg. I approve.
   488. andrewberg Posted: October 24, 2012 at 06:34 PM (#4281980)
All star ballot will now be for 2 posts, 2 wings, and a pg. I approve.


I read that it was 2G, 3F. Your version is better, but I don't think we're there yet.
   489. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 24, 2012 at 09:03 PM (#4282145)
i think my league pass teams this year should be toronto (valanciunas, lowry), houston (asik, jones, lamb, white, martin), sacramento (DMC, robinson, johnson, thornton, thomas, and JIMMER~!~!), utah (jefferson, favors, kanter, millsap, evans), and san antonio (popovich).

i figure that'll be a good mix of styles. toronto plays at a low pace and takes a lot of 3s, plus with valanciunas and lowry, they should have a really fun pnr. then houston has asik and terrence jones, who are two really exciting defenders, and also kevin martin and royce white and jeremy lamb, who have very unique offensive profiles. sacramento has a really interesting frontcourt, and i'm a really big fan of james johnson. utah has a massive frontcourt, so they should be good for some physicality. and san antonio is actually good, which makes them different from each of the other 4 teams.

and in addition to all of the young talent, there's quite a few philly natives there. lowry in toronto, marcus morris in houston, tyreke evans and jason thompson in sacramento, randy foye in utah, and gary neal in san antonio.


other factors in my decision making are the frequency of national games, and eastern/western conference affiliations, given that i'll be able to see a lot more of the eastern conference teams, due to their being in direct competition with the sixers.
   490. mjs Posted: October 24, 2012 at 09:58 PM (#4282318)
I'd be up for a yahoo league; ready to make bad decisions every turn of the draft.
   491. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 24, 2012 at 10:12 PM (#4282363)
my bad, andrew.

wait - so is the draft on sunday?
   492. Tripon Posted: October 24, 2012 at 11:21 PM (#4282626)
I have a league set up that needs to be filled. Draft is this Sat, 3 PM. Plenty of spots too. (Although I will probably have to change the time to Monday evening due to partying, uh I mean "visiting" SF this weekend.

Here's the link if anybody is interested.

http://www.truebluela.com/2012/10/17/3519926/true-blue-l-a-fantasy-basketball-league

Edit: The link is to the page with the information and password to join the league, not the link itself to the league. You will find the league's link on the page though.
   493. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: October 25, 2012 at 12:02 AM (#4282706)
so, andrew bynum's knee is still bothering him after about a month of rest following his orthokine treatment in germany. in addition, he's had multiple injections of synvisc, which is supposed to be some ultra-lubricant for arthritic joints.

now, what's holding him up is apparently not related to these treatments, but rather it's a bone bruise that is lingering.


now, i'm not a medical technician, but after seeing what's happened with chase utley the last few years, i'm gonna say that the main problem here is the month of rest, rather than any of the injections. i'm sure it's probably safer to stay off your feet and let everything heal, but i can't help but feel that you'll get better faster if you push through the soreness and immediately get back on your feet.
   494. madvillain Posted: October 25, 2012 at 01:07 AM (#4282725)
*ahem* STEAGLES


I think this is where I say "just remember ALL CAPS when you spell the man's name!"

now, i'm not a medical technician, but after seeing what's happened with chase utley the last few years, i'm gonna say that the main problem here is the month of rest, rather than any of the injections.


I'm going to go another route: He's a 7 footer with a history of knee problems, that he continues to have knee problems is nobody's surprise, no matter what cutting edge techniques they are using.
   495. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: October 25, 2012 at 02:12 AM (#4282737)
I watched the second half of the Lakers-Clippers game this evening. It's amazing how much actually watching Nash and Gasol working together undermines my offseason-stoked Lakers rage. Phenomenal passing is the quickest non-food way to win my affection. Also, who was that monster impersonating Eric Bledsoe and how did he learn to play basketball so well? One steal short of a triple-double.
   496. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 25, 2012 at 06:16 AM (#4282758)
   497. Bitter Mouse Posted: October 25, 2012 at 09:00 AM (#4282804)
amazing how much actually watching Nash and Gasol working together


I love great passing and PG play. Nash is one of my favorite players. I hate the Lakers. It would be a close tie, but Kobe pushs them into the against column. It will be hard to be that against them this yer though.
   498. NJ in DC (Now unemployed!) Posted: October 25, 2012 at 09:41 AM (#4282832)
Did rr ever post his predictions?

EDIT: Pablo Prigioni is like a poor man's old Rubio. He's looked very much like a contributor in the pre-season.
   499. Der-K, the bloodied charmer Posted: October 25, 2012 at 09:51 AM (#4282842)
I think this is where I say "just remember ALL CAPS when you spell the man's name!"

Probably told you this before, but I LOVE that album.

   500. Jimmy P Posted: October 25, 2012 at 11:35 AM (#4282939)
I have a league set up that needs to be filled. Draft is this Sat, 3 PM. Plenty of spots too. (Although I will probably have to change the time to Monday evening due to partying, uh I mean "visiting" SF this weekend.


I signed up. The league is set for the draft Monday, though.

I may not make the draft live, but I'll try and prerank
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