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Friday, November 30, 2007

Newsday: Mets trade Milledge to Nats

The Mets have traded Lastings Milledge to the Nationals for catcher Brian Schneider and outfielder Ryan Church, a baseball official confirmed this afternoon. Milledge was believed to be a major chip in the Mets’ pursuit of an elite starting pitcher this offseason, but that apparently was not the case.

Thanks to Sean Forman.  May the self-immolation begin.

Andere Richtingen Posted: November 30, 2007 at 06:36 PM | 569 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: mets, nationals

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   201. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:50 PM (#2629685)
Conference call at 3- anyone have any suggested questions?

Is it because he's black?
   202. David Wrightwing obstructionist Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:50 PM (#2629687)
Conference call at 3- anyone have any suggested questions?

How do you feel about waterboarding?
   203. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:51 PM (#2629689)
Milledge was touted as the best high school position player in the draft, with off the chart tools. And he's produced at every level, including the majors. So combine great tools with solid production at young ages and you have what appears to be a future star. Pretty simple equation.

Agreed except for the bolded, since Delmon was in that draft class, if memory serves.
   204. The Non-Catching Molina (sjs1959) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:52 PM (#2629691)
Omar Minaya is going to be on live with Mike & the Mad Dog at 4:05 EST, streaming at www.wfan.com, I would think Mets fans would want to listen and call in.

This makes me glad I'm a Cubs fan...
   205. Chris Needham Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:53 PM (#2629693)
If any of you want background on the Church/Jews thing, here's one of the articles the WaPo had on it.

I think that, in some cases, his words are slightly different than what's been attributed to him. But this'll help you decide on your own.
   206. TerpNats Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:53 PM (#2629694)
What kind of ####### idiot GM would trade for a documented anti-semite to play for the Mets? Mr. "All Jews are Doomed to Hell" Church ain't gonna go over big in Long Island.
IIRC, Church's girlfriend at the time was Jewish. So don't make him out to be an Indiana Klansman circa 1925.
   207. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:54 PM (#2629696)
This is a horrible trade, even without the observation that every bad intangible Milledge supposedly possesses, Church does possess.
   208. rfloh Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:56 PM (#2629702)
Howard,

Ask Omar what he thinks of Scott Kazmir and Victor Zambrano.
   209. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:57 PM (#2629706)
The Mets are going to be a pretty tough lineup for RHers to pitch to. They absolutely need a righthanded bat to platoon Church with.
   210. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:57 PM (#2629709)
You need to ask why would the Mets trade someone who has a chance to be a star for two guys who don't. One of them who hit .230 last year, and the other one who has a tendency to get injured pretty frequently.

This is built into my question of what they thought Milledge could be.
   211. Shooty Is Disappointed With His Midstream Urine Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:58 PM (#2629711)
The A's cooled on Milledge, but only because they're set in the corners with Swisher and Buck and they didn't think his glove was good enough in center to warrant trading a Dan Haren for him. That doesn't mean the A's think Milledge is dog ####. They just didn't want to trade one of the best young pitchers in baseball for him, which is understandable.
   212. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:58 PM (#2629712)
If any of you want background on the Church/Jews thing, here's one of the articles the WaPo had on it.


He can locker next to Shawn Green.
   213. Swedish Chef Posted: November 30, 2007 at 07:59 PM (#2629713)
Conference call at 3- anyone have any suggested questions?


Have you no shame?
   214. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:00 PM (#2629716)
The A's cooled on Milledge, but only because they're set in the corners with Swisher and Buck and they didn't think his glove was good enough in center to warrant trading a Dan Haren for him. That doesn't mean the A's think Milledge is dog ####. They just didn't want to trade one of the best young pitchers in baseball for him, which is understandable.

OK, but why didn't Beanse trump the offer of Church/Schneider?
   215. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:00 PM (#2629717)
If any of you want background on the Church/Jews thing, here's one of the articles the WaPo had on it.

It sounds like he was an impressionable dupe of an ill-meaning God squadder, the defenses of whom were what I would expect of that bunch of revolting fundie Bible wavers.
   216. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:00 PM (#2629718)
What is an indisputable fact is that history has demonstrated that Milledge has a FAR better chance of getting BETTER than Church.

Nothing is a certainty. But if we have learned nothing else we know THIS much.

I do think Church could play centerfield on a limited basis if Beltran should need a rest or get hurt an owie that lingers. Clearly he is not THE centerfield solution. But of course his bat is a better fit for center than a corner position.

Not a Schneider fan.................
   217. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:01 PM (#2629719)
How does this trade get made? How did the talk even start?

It's been almost two hours. I'm still in a daze. Why?
   218. Jay Is Simply Without Words Today... Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:01 PM (#2629720)
Conference call at 3- anyone have any suggested questions?


Why do the Mets hate first round draft picks?


Seriously though, ask Omar what he feels Church's role will be with the team next year and in the future. Gomez too. Ask him about making trading a promising MLB ready prospect to a division rival that they'll see 19 brazillion times a year.
   219. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:01 PM (#2629721)
Or does Milledge let them deal one of Pena-Kearns-Maxwell + pitching, pitching, pitching to Minnesota or Oakland?

Where are they going to get the pitching? Not to mention the pitching and the pitching?

Conference call at 3- anyone have any suggested questions?

Who are you and what have you done to Omar Minaya?
   220. rr Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:02 PM (#2629723)
That doesn't mean the A's think Milledge is dog ####.


I think you mean "dawg ####."

I would not move Haren for him, but he was available, uhh, a bit cheaper than that. Like I said upthread, if I just wanted to dump a guy, I'd get him out of the league/division. The whole thing is weird unless Milledge really has an Elijah Dukes,Brett Myers, or Scott Olsen-type issue that is not yet public.
   221. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:04 PM (#2629725)
Apparently Minaya said today that he offered Milledge to Baltimore, but the O's weren't interested.

Are you ####### kidding me? MacPhail isn't going to do squat this offseason.
Hey, the Orioles have Huff, Millar, and Gibbons to play LF, and Payton in CF. We can't possibly squeeze in Milledge.

(I have to admit, I was totally wrong about those guys; I thought they wouldn't do squat and the Orioles would be terrible in 2007. Boy was I mistaken.)
   222. Gaelan Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:04 PM (#2629726)
OK, but why didn't Beanse trump the offer of Church/Schneider?


What makes you think that Minaya even asked? What makes you think that Minaya would recognize a better offer if he saw one?

This trade is so bad that it has to throw all normal assumptions out the window. Why should we believe that Minaya couldn't get more for Milledge. Maybe he didn't even try. Anyone who could make this deal is capable of any kind of irrational behaviour.
   223. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:05 PM (#2629728)
Also note that of the four massively lopesided trades in recent memory--ones immediately condemned and deemed inexplicable; the AJ trade, the Kazmir trade, the Krivsky boondoggle and the Milledge trade, Bowden is involved in two of them.

And Bowden won both.

I don't understand.
   224. Shooty Is Disappointed With His Midstream Urine Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:06 PM (#2629730)
OK, but why didn't Beanse trump the offer of Church/Schneider?

Why didn't 28 other teams? Maybe he didn't get a chance.
   225. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:06 PM (#2629731)
As long as the Mets continue to make stupid trades, my contribution to BBTF lives forever.
   226. rfloh Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:08 PM (#2629735)
Or in other words, Omar is an idiot.
   227. Shooty Is Disappointed With His Midstream Urine Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:08 PM (#2629737)
OK, but why didn't Beanse trump the offer of Church/Schneider?


What makes you think that Minaya even asked? What makes you think that Minaya would recognize a better offer if he saw one?

This trade is so bad that it has to throw all normal assumptions out the window. Why should we believe that Minaya couldn't get more for Minaya. Maybe he didn't even try. Anyone who could make this deal is capable of any kind of irrational behaviour.


I'm with Gaelan here. The A's FO is probably aghast that this is all it took to get Milledge. Omar probably was talking about Dan Haren or Blanton with the A's--a large deal that would take time to negotiate--and then Omar drops this bomb. At the very least, Omar should have waited until the GM meetings to scare up a better offer. Bowden is no fool, that Nats offer would have been there next week.
   228. haven Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:09 PM (#2629738)
What makes you think that Minaya even asked? What makes you think that Minaya would recognize a better offer if he saw one?

Why didn't 28 other teams? Maybe he didn't get a chance.

Reports are going around that Minaya has said that Milledge was offered to the A's and O's and neither was interested.
   229. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:10 PM (#2629740)
Why didn't 28 other teams? Maybe he didn't get a chance.

I am not pointing out Beane here. I'm just making a general observation. I can understand not having a chance at the trade deadline when time is limited but it's te offseason.
   230. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:11 PM (#2629742)
Reports are going around that Minaya has said that Milledge was offered to the A's and O's and neither were interested.
Did either team know that Minaya would have accepted spare parts for him?
   231. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:12 PM (#2629744)
Honestly, I think I'd rather have Church and Schneider than Ramon Hernandez and the O's said no to that apparently.
   232. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:12 PM (#2629745)
Church is arb-eligible after 2008.
   233. Big Ears Teddy shouldn't see TFTIO Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:12 PM (#2629746)
This definitely puts paid to the Santana to NYM rumors, I would have to think.
   234. haven Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:13 PM (#2629747)
Did either team know that Minaya would have accepted spare parts for him?

No clue, but what I read seemed like a blanket statement. Didn't seem like Minaya was proposing specific deals with the A's and O's. Just shopping Milledge. But I just get that out of the tenor of what I read. I could be reading to much into the reports.
   235. Honkie Kong Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:13 PM (#2629748)
Did either team know that Minaya would have accepted spare parts for him?

Seriously. Bowden was the only one dumb enough to ask if Schneider will do.
   236. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:14 PM (#2629751)
Reports are going around that Minaya has said that Milledge was offered to the A's and O's and neither was interested.

I said earlier that I couldn't believe that MacPhail would turn down Hernandez for Milledge, but it's certainly possible that that deal was never on the table. Maybe Minaya offered Milledge and spare parts for Bedard, and MacPhail said no (apparently the Mets have been agressive suitors of bedard, so it makes sense). And maybe MacPhail had no idea that he could get Milledge for far less.
   237. Slinger Francisco Barrios (Dr. Memory) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:14 PM (#2629752)
As long as the Mets continue to make stupid trades, my contribution to BBTF lives forever.

The thing I liked about that thread is how it was revived over and over spanning a couple of years, much like a phoenix.
   238. Gaelan Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:14 PM (#2629753)
Seriously of all the inexplicable parts to this deal what was the rush? Did Minaya actually think that they had to close this deal quickly before Bowden came to his senses or went ahead and dealt Schneider elsewhere for a bag of balls?

The winter meetings are what, a couple of days away. It didn't occur to him to wait and take a walk around the lobby of a hotel, have a drink or two, and see what happens. No, he had strike while the iron was hot and ride that gravy train straight to mediocrity.

It's really quite a shame because the Mets have a lot to like and are the NL's best hope of fielding a good team this season. Instead this nonsense happens that is quite literally bad for baseball.
   239. Shooty Is Disappointed With His Midstream Urine Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:14 PM (#2629754)
Did either team know that Minaya would have accepted spare parts for him?

I am going to guess no. At least for the A's. Who the hell knows what the O's are up to sometimes.
   240. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:16 PM (#2629760)
am going to assume the Mets know something about Milledge that we don't. If it's simply a case of Randolph and other guys not liking him because of some clubhouse behavior or the music or whatever, that is a cultural prejudice/generation gap problem, perhaps with a tinge of racism involved. Certainly, if a white GM/Mgr team had traded Milledge for two white players, race would be out there.


More than a tinge. Church is the one who's lazy, a malignerer, arrogant, and not liked by teammates ... as Mets fans will unfortunately see.
   241. DCA Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:16 PM (#2629761)
AJ

Is that the Pierzynski trade? That was only bad in hindsight -- at the time, every prospect Sabean traded away turned out badly and he got an all-star C entering his age-27 season for two A-ball arms and a middle reliever.
   242. J. Cross Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:17 PM (#2629762)
Wow. Just wow.

It really is hard to root for this team sometimes. I really had no idea that Minaya had this much stupid inside him this whole time. I'd started to dismiss all of the (I thought) ridiculous rumors as stuff Minaya was too smart to do. Now I have absolutely no idea what to expect going forward. This is painfully painfully dumb.
   243. T.J. Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:18 PM (#2629763)
(T)his nonsense happens that is quite literally bad for baseball.

I don't get this. How can a lopsided trade be "bad for baseball," particularly when it's one of the better, better-finded teams who appears to have been ripped off? It's bad for Mets baseball, but not so bad for the rest of us NL fans, Nats fans in particular.

Now, if the Marlins, for example, were to give away their entire team right after winning the World Series, that would be bad for baseball.
   244. Jay Is Simply Without Words Today... Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:19 PM (#2629764)
And to add insult to injury, this probably means Jesus Flores will become the Nationals starting catcher. I'm really angry at Omar right now.
   245. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:19 PM (#2629765)
Is that the Pierzynski trade? That was only bad in hindsight -- at the time, every prospect Sabean traded away turned out badly and he got an all-star C entering his age-27 season for two A-ball arms and a middle reliever.

If you take that away then Bowden won two of three and the Mets got raped in two of three.

that's even worse.
   246. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:20 PM (#2629767)
Church is arb-eligible after 2008


thanks .

so if he has a decent year, they are going to have to pay him.
this deal gets crazier by the minute.
   247. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:20 PM (#2629768)
The thing I liked about that thread is how it was revived over and over spanning a couple of years, much like a phoenix.
Oooh, good analogy.
I've said this after the Brewers inked Kendall, and I'll say it again: As a Dodger fan, I don't like Colletti but I thought it was unseemly to criticize the man for rumored moves he didn't make. ("Cabrera for Kemp, LaRoche, Billingsley AND Kershaw? The fool!") Now, Omar's trade of Milledge - this actually happened.
   248. DL from MN Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:20 PM (#2629769)
Can Bowden flip Milledge to the A's for pitching?
   249. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2629771)
MacPhail should offer the Mets Brian Roberts for FMart, Gomez, Humber, and Gotay. At least in that case the Mets would be getting a good player.
   250. Famous Original Joe C Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:21 PM (#2629772)
As long as the Mets continue to make stupid trades, my contribution to BBTF lives forever.

Wow, I forgot how much people thought of Justin Huber then. How quickly times change.
   251. Gaelan Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:22 PM (#2629773)
I don't get this. How can a lopsided trade be "bad for baseball," particularly when it's one of the better, better-finded teams who appears to have been ripped off? It's bad for Mets baseball, but not so bad for the rest of us NL fans, Nats fans in particular.


It's bad that the one chance the NL had of fielding a respectable team has gone down the drain. It means yet another year of mediocrities chasing mediocrity. It also means that the one NL team that had a chance of getting Santana now has no chance which means that the inbalance between the NL and AL is only going to grow when Cabrera goes to the AL.

Seriously there isn't a single good team in the NL right now. There isn't a single team that would have a reasonable chance of making the playoffs in the AL. That's embarrasing and bad for baseball.
   252. TerpNats Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:24 PM (#2629780)
(T)his nonsense happens that is quite literally bad for baseball.

I don't get this. How can a lopsided trade be "bad for baseball," particularly when it's one of the better, better-finded teams who appears to have been ripped off? It's bad for Mets baseball, but not so bad for the rest of us NL fans, Nats fans in particular.

Now, if the Marlins, for example, were to give away their entire team right after winning the World Series, that would be bad for baseball.
T.J., you don't get it. If it's not good for N.Y., Boston, L.A. or the North Side of Chicago, it's not good for baseball. Fox and ESPN told me so.
   253. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:25 PM (#2629781)
Good lord. Gomez might be ready in 2009. It'd be a miracle if Fernando is. The last thing we need is Jeff Wilpon's opinions forcing the stupid yet again. We've certainly been down that road before.

No one can possible be as awful as Jim Dolan, but there's way too much Jim Dolan in Jeff Wilpon for Mets fans to sleep comfortably.
   254. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:26 PM (#2629782)
Seriously there isn't a single good team in the NL right now. There isn't a single team that would have a reasonable chance of making the playoffs in the AL. That's embarrasing and bad for baseball.

This really doesn't make the 2008 Mets worse. It might make them slightly better. Long-term, this is a bad deal but not in the short-term.
   255. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:27 PM (#2629784)
No one can possible be as awful as Jim Dolan, but there's way too much Jim Dolan in Jeff Wilpon for Mets fans to sleep comfortably.
Does Wilpon front a vanity blues band?
   256. vortex of dissipation Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:27 PM (#2629785)
Church and Schneider. It certainly isn't as good a return as a German WW2-era bomber, and a Spanish fighter pilot to be named later.
   257. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:27 PM (#2629786)
There isn't a single team that would have a reasonable chance of making the playoffs in the AL. That's embarrasing and bad for baseball.
There's quite a bit of young talent in the NL West. One of those teams may develop into a special one. But that's a big "May" and is likely to take a couple of years from this point.
   258. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2629787)
It's bad that the one chance the NL had of fielding a respectable team has gone down the drain. It means yet another year of mediocrities chasing mediocrity


i got quite the giggle out of this ..Yeah 'cus the only team in the NL is the Mets ..
   259. AJMcCringleberry Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2629788)
#### THIS ############# ####. SERIOUSLY, #### THIS TEAM.

Edit: #### YOU TOO OMAR.
   260. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:28 PM (#2629789)
Good news!

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya
   261. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:30 PM (#2629792)
Gaelan:

Would you have written the same thing if the Brewers had traded Yovani Gallardo for a pack of smokes and had won 88 games instead of 83 in 2007?
   262. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:30 PM (#2629793)
we’ll have as good a combination as you have

Left 36, Right 24, Left 36
   263. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629794)
Good news!

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya


And it gets better!
   264. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629796)
"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya


so Estrada is getting cut.

Boy Estrada and Barrett's value sure took a nose dive this season ..
   265. Shooty Is Disappointed With His Midstream Urine Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629797)
Good news!

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya


You have to appreciate the comedy. I would take Jeremy Brown and Rob Bowen over Castro and Schneider. All right, maybe not, but it's close enough that I'd think about it. Omar is nuts.
   266. Jay Is Simply Without Words Today... Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629798)
Good news!

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya


Mission Accomplished!
   267. J. Sosa Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629799)
I feel bad for Mets fans.

That said, I think its safe to lay to rest the "Bowden is the worst GM in history" talk. There are plainly at least two GMs worse than he is. I had always assumed that Minaya was under pressure from MLB when he did the Colon deal, now, I'm not so sure. For Mets fans' sake, I'm concerned over what Minaya has planned for the "splash" he's going to make on the starting pitching front. 100 mil for Carlos Silva? A raft of the prospects that remain in the system for Willis?
   268. The District Attorney Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:31 PM (#2629800)
Wow, I forgot how much people thought of Justin Huber then.
Not his fault he never got to play.

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya
Are you sure he meant Major League Baseball?

I hope he says that to Mike & the Dog. That'd be fun.
   269. Bad Doctor Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:32 PM (#2629801)
Seriously there isn't a single good team in the NL right now. There isn't a single team that would have a reasonable chance of making the playoffs in the AL. That's embarrasing and bad for baseball.

As an NL fan, my reaction to this was just like that Simpsons episode where Marge says, "Homer, I think you'd agree I've had to put up with a lot in this marriage--" and Homer opens his mouth to protest, sees Bart and Lisa shaking their heads "no" at him, and, almost dutifully, closes his mouth.
   270. Loren F. Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2629803)
Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya

Combination of what? Is Schneider even an upgrade over Lo Duca?
   271. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2629804)
i got quite the giggle out of this ..Yeah 'cus the only team in the NL is the Mets ..
How about the non-Met teams which have represented the NL in the World Series the last three years with win totals of 89, 83 and 90? #252 seems pretty spot-on, although I might be willing to bet that the NL is at or near its nadir as a league.
   272. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:33 PM (#2629805)
So no Castro chance, after all.

“I had a very close relationship with the kid. To trade him was extremely difficult for me. But Lastings, I think he’s gonna be fine. Lastings is developing well. Has he made mistakes along the way? Yes, he’s made mistakes. But you talk to him about them, he’s taking care of those mistakes. He can play center field. He’s just a young man developing.” - Omar Minaya
   273. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2629807)
That said, I think its safe to lay to rest the "Bowden is the worst GM in history" talk. There are plainly at least two GMs worse than he is.

Are you saying Omar's one of the worst GM's in baseball? Because his record with the Mets is still pretty clearly in the positive.
   274. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:34 PM (#2629808)
This is for Sam.

“We’re not thinking in those terms- we’re very happy to have him as our guy. We’re looking at Ryan Church as being our outfielder. Milledge is an outfielder, because of his age, you don’t know the upside. But we’re thinking of Church as our everyday guy.”
   275. AJMcCringleberry Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:37 PM (#2629812)
Milledge is an outfielder, because of his age, you don’t know the upside.

WHAT!?!?
   276. Tony Ling Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:37 PM (#2629813)
Good news!

"Brian Schneider’s going to be our everyday catcher- we’ll have as good a combination as you have in baseball." - Omar Minaya


Quoting my friend - "does that take into account the combination of Jorge Posada and who gives a ####?"
   277. Joshemy Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:38 PM (#2629815)
So, another year of "FREE CASTRO!" chanting. Sweet!

Gelb should probably just change his handle back to that now.
   278. Gaelan Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:38 PM (#2629816)
i got quite the giggle out of this ..Yeah 'cus the only team in the NL is the Mets ..


All the other teams are striving to be average. You're a Cub fan. That's a team that strives to be mediocre.

Would you have written the same thing if the Brewers had traded Yovani Gallardo for a pack of smokes and had won 88 games instead of 83 in 2007?


I had/have high hopes for the Brewers. Unfortunately I moved to Wisconsin in mid-August and got to watch first hand how average that team really is. Besides the number of wins is irrelevant. Somebody has to win the games. But if you look at the Red Sox, Yankees, Indians and Angels and then look at any NL team you can't help but shudder. The NL needs a team to step up and lay a beating on everyone else so that the GM's will stop deluding themselves that their teams are good.
   279. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2629817)
Seriously there isn't a single good team in the NL right now. There isn't a single team that would have a reasonable chance of making the playoffs in the AL. That's embarrasing and bad for baseball.


For this year, this doesn't make the Mets appreciably worse. May even make em better for this one year. Regardless, its good for baseball to have lots of team going for a pennant. It fuels interest in lots of cities, and a mediocre team can win the World Series. Anything can happen in a seven game series, just ask the 2006 Cardinals. What is bad for baseball is to have one dominant team in a league with a bunch of also-rans.

Its bad for New York Mets fans, sure, but don't project this as being bad for baseball.

Mission Accomplished!


Milledge is an outfielder, because of his age, you don’t know the upside.


I just had a flashback to last night's "30 Rock."

"No way those kids were born after 1993!"

"These Dominican birth certificates state they were!"
   280. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2629818)
How about the non-Met teams which have represented the NL in the World Series the last three years with win totals of 89, 83 and 90?

Parity and talent are different. If the NL representative to the WS went 81-81 during the regular season and the NL went .500 against the AL, the NL wouldn't be the worse league. It would be the worse league if it went less than .500 against the AL, even if its rep was 100-62.
   281. aleskel Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:39 PM (#2629819)
say this about Omar, he knows the cardinal PR move:

always announce bad news on a Friday
   282. AJMcCringleberry Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2629820)
Why does this team always have to make stupid moves? People wonder why I always get nervous around trade deadline time.
   283. J. Sosa Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:41 PM (#2629821)
re: 274

I don't see "clearly in the positive". He threw a bunch of money at Martinez. He took on Delgado's contract. He threw a bunch of money at Beltran. Wright and Reyes were in the system. He took advantage of the two headed monster in Baltimore for Maine (who are no longer in power). He took advantage of Littlefield for Perez (who is no longer in power). I'm also taking in consideration the historically bad Colon trade. Which was followed up by what BP referred to (IIRC) as the "Biddles and bits" trade. Which was one of the few lines I've ever found funny that came out of BP.

Granted Russlan, the "at least two" comment was off the cuff, but you have to consider that Minaya's "good" moves that didn't involve throwing money at people were moves with people that are no longer employed as GMs.

I'd say Krivsky is worse than Minaya. And Bavasi. That's off the top of my head. I'll have to think on it some more. Suggestions?
   284. Mike Emeigh Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2629822)
Bowden won both.


He hasn't won this one yet.

Schneider is a strong defensive catcher, and I'd expect his bat to revive some getting out of RFK, where he has hit very badly. Church gives the Mets a left-handed hitting option in the OF that they didn't have, and I suspect he is more likely to accept a limited role than Milledge would have been (it's unlikely that Milledge would have played regularly in 2008, IMO). If the Mets win a pennant in 2008, I'm sure they'll be pretty happy with the deal.

-- MWE
   285. Dag Nabbit is a cornucopia of errors Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:42 PM (#2629824)
   286. Jay Is Simply Without Words Today... Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:43 PM (#2629825)
“We’re not thinking in those terms- we’re very happy to have him as our guy. We’re looking at Ryan Church as being our outfielder. Milledge is an outfielder, because of his age, you don’t know the upside. But we’re thinking of Church as our everyday guy.”


We've secretly replaced the brain of Omar Minaya with the brain of Jim Duquette. Let's see if anyone notices
   287. J. Sosa Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:43 PM (#2629827)
re: 284

Sabean. So that's three. Others?
   288. Jimmy P Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629829)
Why does this team always have to make stupid moves? People wonder why I always get nervous around trade deadline time.

And here I thought the White Sox would make the dumbest trade this winter.
   289. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629830)
Sabean. So that's three. Others?

Buzzie's boy in Seattle?
   290. Harris Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629832)
I think this is a straight up trade marginalia for marginalia. I like Schneider and Church, and I recognize that neither is spectacular and neither is atrocious. I wholly believe Milledge will end up in the same class when all is said and done.
   291. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629833)
Church gives the Mets a left-handed hitting option in the OF that they didn't have

Michael, Michael, Michael. Have you forgotten Shawn Green?

Tsk, tsk.....

Edit:

I know he's a free agent. But I thought there was word on re-signing. If no, my error
   292. The Wilpons Must Go (Tom D) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629835)
Seriously though, ask Omar what he feels Church's role will be with the team next year and in the future. Gomez too.

There is no reason to believe that Gomez has a future with the Mets. With Gotay buried and Milledge purged, its clear to me that only established players need apply.
   293. HowardMegdal Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629836)
“We’ve been through this before when we traded Kris Benson. As a General Manager, you take that into account. But there are decisions we have to make… I remember when we traded Kris Benson, a lot of people didn’t understand it at the time. But here we are with John Maine today.”

This is an interesting quote. It was about fan misunderstanding, but which two Mets have high-profile off-the-field issues?
   294. formerly dp Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:45 PM (#2629837)
Well, this sucks.

I'm in the midst of sending out job apps for next year, and this actually makes me root for a job outside of NYC so I won't be tempted to remain a Met fan after this retarded bull$hit. Milledge is going to be a great hitter, and it sucks that we've supplied the Nats with 1/4 of their young starting lineup because Omar's an idiot. F**king jackasses. Seriously.

At least of the jobs I have an app in for is Georgetown. Not a huge fan of DC, but at least they'll have a fun team to watch there.

You never deal a talented player when his value has bottomed out unless you have to. If nothing else, he'd be a young player having a monster year in AAA.
   295. Gaelan Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:46 PM (#2629838)
For this year, this doesn't make the Mets appreciably worse.


Not getting worse isn't the goal. And the imbalance between the leagues is bad if you want fans to be interested in the league as a whole instead of their parochial fiefs. Entering the offseason the Mets had hopes of signing Posada and trading for Santana. That would have been a team poised to play with the big boys. Instead you have this rotting pile of crap and a team that could have been great is just another team amongst the rest of the blah that is the NL. What a waste.

What I wanted was the Mets to actually be good and lay a beating on everyone else in the hopes that it would drive lazy teams like the Cardinals to say Cesar Izturis and Kip Wells might be good enough to beat out the rest of the dreck in the midwest but we have loftier goals so we're not going to settle this year and waste the best player in the league by surrounding him with crap and then hoping to get lucky in the playoffs while we pat ourselves on the back with all the money we're making.

The NL is a minor league. That's sad.
   296. Boriole Forester Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:47 PM (#2629839)
I'm sure fans of a lot teams feel that way. The O's could have offered Ramon Hernandez, they could have thrown in cash too. But from what I remember, MacPhail's asking price is a bit higher.


The MacPhail and company might be thinking along the lines that that can't afford more off-the-field character/clubhouse issues, what with Huff spanking pornstars on the air or whatever, all of the juicing, the Millar cheerleading, etc. I'm not saying they're right, but the position is defensible.
   297. Neil Kinnock...Lord Palmerston! (Orinoco) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:48 PM (#2629840)
I'd expect his bat to revive some getting out of RFK, where he has hit very badly. Church gives the Mets a left-handed hitting option in the OF that they didn't have,

Schneider is moving out of RFK ... to Shea.

Beltran is a switch hitter who hit better from the left side. Marlon Anderson and Chavez are both lefties. If Omar can't find a lefty corner OF on the cheap he's stupider than I thought.

No, it's impossible for Omar to be more stupid than I think of him now. The whole affair is utterly contemptible.
   298. bibigon Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:49 PM (#2629841)
Serious question - would Mets fans have been happier with Flores and Church instead of Schneider and Church?
   299. haven Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:49 PM (#2629842)
I might be mistaken, but aren't the Nationals in the National League? So how does this specific trade hurt anyone except the Mets?
   300. I Love LA (OFF) Posted: November 30, 2007 at 08:49 PM (#2629843)
Did anyone tell Omar Scheneider hit .235 last year?
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