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Sunday, June 10, 2012

Neyer: Umpires—Not Commissioner—Holding Up Expansion Of Video Review

Instead of asking the umpires to make any of those judgments, MLB could simply treat every foul ball turned into a fair ball and caught ball turned into a trapped ball like an automatic double. After all, there’s really no good reason for automatic doubles to be automatic doubles. In a just world, if you’ve got a fast runner on first base and there are two outs and a long fly ball bounces over the fence, the fast runner would score every time. But he doesn’t. He’s stuck on third base, which has cost teams uncounted runs over the years.

They could just say that a reversed call in the infield is an automatic single, the runners moving up one base, and a reversed call in the outfield is worth two bases, just like an automatic double.

I’m not saying that’s what I would do. I like ambiguity and arguments, and I want to see the umpires making more judgments rather than fewer, assuming the judgments lead to more justice rather than less. But that does seem like a solution that all the stakeholders might get behind.

bobm Posted: June 10, 2012 at 10:02 AM | 17 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: replay, umpires

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   1. Ivan Grushenko of Hong Kong Posted: June 10, 2012 at 11:26 AM (#4152894)
These seem like really stupid ideas
   2. BDC Posted: June 10, 2012 at 11:41 AM (#4152900)
After the third reversed call, teams could go into a penalty bonus situation where each additional reversed call gained (or lost) an extra base. Any player complaining about this would be assessed a technical foul and have to throw a strike to the opponent's cleanup hitter.
   3. Morty Causa Posted: June 10, 2012 at 11:57 AM (#4152915)
The rules and the play in baseball needs to be simplified, not made more complicated. The game as play in the MLB is slow enough as is--too slow by far.
   4. Jason Collette Posted: June 10, 2012 at 12:51 PM (#4152975)
I've always preferred a system like the NFL has where MLB managers can decide when to throw the challenge flag. If they get the first one wrong, they lose the second. If they get 2 right, they get a third one. Put some strategy into it.
   5. Darren Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:10 PM (#4152994)
I always hated that about the NFL system. If an ump/official makes a mistake, there shouldn't be some risk assessed to the manager of one team. If you have replay, enforce it fairly and consistently. Leave the managers out of it.
   6. Mayor Blomberg Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:26 PM (#4153015)
If the ump/official made the mistake, there's no risk involved. The risk is that the ump might not have made the mistake.

As for the ideas, they're less stupid than the rhetorical structure within which they are couched.

   7. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:28 PM (#4153020)
MLB could simply treat every foul ball turned into a fair ball and caught ball turned into a trapped ball like an automatic double.


Wow. This is just profoundly stupid. So stupid, in fact, that it could only be intentional stupidity. There are certainly ways that MLB could codify what happens on a reversed call instead of leaving it up to the umpires, but one-size-fits-all would just create more controversies than more replay would resolve.

EDIT: and I guess maybe it was intentional, based on what follows, but I still think it would make things worse rather than better.
   8. catomi01 Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:34 PM (#4153033)
Simplest is best in my opinion...make the crews 5 man, with one in the booth...if he spots something that needs review, he buzzes the crew chief to review the play for adjustment as needed. I can't see the umpires turning down a proposal that employees 15 additional members of their union.
   9. cercopithecus aethiops Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:42 PM (#4153057)
Boundary calls should be done like tennis. Yeah, it would cost a bunch of money to install a bazillion cameras and the computerized video analysis system, but it's worth it if it means that a manager can just point to the pressbox to have the call flashed on the jumbotron within about six seconds or so.

Of course (as someone mentioned in an earlier thread) there is one aspect of the tennis system that would never fly in baseball -- playing a let.
   10. jwb Posted: June 10, 2012 at 01:49 PM (#4153070)
MLB managers can decide when to throw the challenge flag.


With the way fields are crowned, a manager can't see the foul line on the other side of the field.
   11. Bob Tufts Posted: June 10, 2012 at 07:21 PM (#4153374)
Simplest is best in my opinion...make the crews 5 man, with one in the booth...if he spots something that needs review, he buzzes the crew chief to review the play for adjustment as needed. I can't see the umpires turning down a proposal that employees 15 additional members of their union.


Exactly catomi01 - they will gladly trade some loss of autonomy for a few jobs.
   12. Karl from NY Posted: June 10, 2012 at 10:54 PM (#4153430)
The NFL challenge system only works because there are more team personnel upstairs watching the replays with the ability to signal to the coach to call for a challenge. Can that work in MLB? Most of the time when a manager is on the field arguing, he doesn't even know whether the call was actually missed, he hasn't seen any video of the play.
   13. PreservedFish Posted: June 10, 2012 at 11:54 PM (#4153448)
I've always preferred a system like the NFL has where MLB managers can decide when to throw the challenge flag. If they get the first one wrong, they lose the second. If they get 2 right, they get a third one. Put some strategy into it.


I hate this idea so much. Challenge flags have no place in baseball. The umpires themselves need to call for reviews. I've been putting forth the plan in #8 in every one of these threads, and most people agree that it's the best possible solution.

You need a plan that, as much as possible, feels like the hand of God coming down to just unobtrusively correct errors. Simplicity simplicity simplicity.
   14. Sleepy's still holding up that little wild bouquet Posted: June 11, 2012 at 12:48 AM (#4153462)
You need a plan that, as much as possible, feels like the hand of God coming down to just unobtrusively correct errors. Simplicity simplicity simplicity.

The union will never agree to lightning tasers from heaven the upper deck, aimed by angels robots, striking heretics Angel Hernandez every time he blows a call, but that's free will collective bargaining agreements for you...
   15. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: June 11, 2012 at 12:59 AM (#4153466)
#### em all. Fire every last one of them and call the AAA guys. Let them reapply for their jobs if they sign a pledge never to make the game about themselves. Umpiring will improve, and I'll never have to read about Joe West again.
   16. spycake Posted: June 11, 2012 at 07:43 AM (#4153503)
#### em all. Fire every last one of them and call the AAA guys. Let them reapply for their jobs if they sign a pledge never to make the game about themselves.


Umpires? Or managers?
   17. Lassus Posted: June 11, 2012 at 08:02 AM (#4153505)
if they sign a pledge never to make the game about themselves.

Umpires? Or managers?


Fans.

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