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Thursday, April 15, 2010

OT: NHL Playoff Thread

I estimate that only 10-12 Primates care about the NHL Playoffs, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what this site is really about: the NBA playoffs and Pavement’s discography.

Cabbage Posted: April 15, 2010 at 03:44 PM | 1758 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   801. Famous Original Joe C Posted: February 04, 2011 at 01:52 AM (#3743105)
Anyone putting much stock in the Bruins? I can't myself.

If they make a deal for another forward who can put the puck in the net, I think they could be in the conversation. Right now, they're good, but a cut below the elite IMO.

By the way, this could have been said about every Bruins team since 2008 - also, 2001-2004 - also, 1988-1994...
   802. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 04, 2011 at 02:04 AM (#3743110)
I think they got pissed off at our lack of confidence...
   803. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 04, 2011 at 02:37 AM (#3743127)
Nearly a Cooke hit by Paille. For consistency's sake, I'm glad they threw him out of the game.
   804. Justin T., Director of Somethin Posted: February 04, 2011 at 02:47 AM (#3743129)
The org has certainly lost the moral high ground on the issue now.
   805. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 04, 2011 at 02:56 AM (#3743133)
What an unbelievable argument by Edwards. I mean, this is his Homery Waterloo. He actually just argued that Paille's sentence from the league should be reduced or rescinded because of how the Stars have behaved. If some Bruin deliberately threw a flying elbow at a defenseless Matt Cooke in the face, I'd cheer--and then be fine with whatever penalty the league brought against that player. But Jack is saying there should be mitigating circumstances for Paille because the Stars acted like clowns.

The org has certainly lost the moral high ground on the issue now.


Not really. It's not like Paille (or anyone on this Bruins team) has a history of that type of hit.
   806. ursus arctos Posted: February 04, 2011 at 04:26 AM (#3743167)
The organization lost the moral high ground when Milbury beat the clown at MSG with his own shoe.
   807. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 04, 2011 at 04:44 AM (#3743173)
The organization lost the moral high ground when Milbury beat the clown at MSG with his own shoe.


And then rehired him and had a whole show dedicated to "the shoe incident". Not proud of that at all.
   808. ursus arctos Posted: February 04, 2011 at 03:54 PM (#3743269)
I was a childhood Bruins fan, despite the fact that I was born and raised in NY.

I had a ticket for the shoe game (I was in college, but it was during Xmas break), but couldn't go at the last minute.

I'd always had mixed feelings about the Big, Bad Bruins (my fandom was down mostly to Orr and Cheevers and to a lesser extent ursine solidarity), but that was the last straw for me.
   809. zack Posted: February 04, 2011 at 06:15 PM (#3743367)
Eww, Q is starting Turco in Vancouver on Friday. Before hearing this information, I was 50-50 on a 5-2 'hawks win or 2-5 loss, now it's 50-50 on a 5-4 win or 1-6 loss.
   810. Cabbage Posted: February 04, 2011 at 06:23 PM (#3743372)
To be fair, its not like Crawford looked good before the break. Q just sort does whatever with the lines and goalies. He was all over the place with Niemi and Huet until the last month of the regular season.
   811. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 04, 2011 at 11:07 PM (#3743605)
#808: Did you change to some other team?
   812. ursus arctos Posted: February 04, 2011 at 11:40 PM (#3743636)
After remaining teamless for 25+ years, I cast my lot with the Canucks.
   813. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 05, 2011 at 06:01 AM (#3743835)
That's a hell of a shift.
   814. ursus arctos Posted: February 05, 2011 at 12:07 PM (#3743880)
Yeah, it is.

Which is why it took 25+ years.

And there is a bit of Cheevers in Luongo, and a hint of Orr in the Sedins.

BTW, woo hoo.
   815. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 05, 2011 at 07:43 PM (#3744114)
I do like the Canucks. I'm an identical twin also, so I think I identify with the Sedins a bit. Both of them took cheaper contracts than they could have gotten individually because they are a package deal and wanted the team to be able to afford them. They also, I think, recognize that neither of them would be as good without the other.
   816. Cabbage Posted: February 05, 2011 at 10:14 PM (#3744257)
Hawks Nucks game was very entertaining, and rather reassuring to this Hawks fan. You're not going to win every game, but the Hawks can go deep in the playoffs if they put up an effort like last night. I'd love to pin it all on the officials, but that's the way the puck bounces sometimes. They didn't convert on about a minute of 5-3, on the road, and that's just that. If you're into Corsi, they pretty much rolled.

If they play like that, they could honestly take any team in a best of 7. Of course, the problem all year has been that they dont always play like that...
   817. ursus arctos Posted: February 05, 2011 at 10:47 PM (#3744283)
These 'Nucks are an easy team to like.

And Sami Salo got two goals and was first star against Wilkes-Barre (the best team in the AHL) last night.

The Rangers' power play is criminally bad.
   818. ursus arctos Posted: February 06, 2011 at 12:07 AM (#3744343)
Finland had their first Winter Classic today.

Helsinki derby between HIFK and Jokerit in the Olympic Stadium; new Euro record for club hockey.

Here's the first minute.
   819. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 06, 2011 at 12:17 AM (#3744350)
The KHL says one of their players hit 110 MPH on a slapper in their skills competition.

Not buying it. Part of the reason Chara's slapper is so hard is because of how tall he is (increased leverage due to size and length of stick). Kulyash is six inches shorter...and he shot from a lot closer to the net. Add in a potentially-biased radar gun, and there you go. It has the smell of the KHL once again attempting to attract players.
   820. ursus arctos Posted: February 06, 2011 at 12:17 PM (#3744570)
I don't buy it either. They must have gotten one of Bob Feller's old speed guns. Your argument is exactly the one I would have made.

I watched some of the KHL All Star Game (it was on ESPN3); it made the NHL one look competitive. Final score, 18-16.

Wings shut out in consecutive games by Columbus and Nashville. Will cats lie down with dogs next?
   821. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 06, 2011 at 08:52 PM (#3744816)
matt cooke just took a run at ovechkin on NBC.
   822. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 07, 2011 at 05:34 AM (#3744999)
Matt Cooke is like Ty Cobb--about three people are going to go to his funeral.
   823. ursus arctos Posted: February 07, 2011 at 07:58 PM (#3745327)
Bruins have shut down Savard for the season.

Right decision, but still very sad.
   824. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 08, 2011 at 01:25 AM (#3745558)

Bruins have shut down Savard for the season.

Right decision, but still very sad.
probably playing it up to curry sympathy for his run at comeback player of the year next year.

[/colin campbell]
   825. ursus arctos Posted: February 08, 2011 at 01:45 AM (#3745570)
You guys are going to go after Greg Campbell at the deadline, aren't you?

Best playoff insurance out there.
   826. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 08, 2011 at 02:02 AM (#3745579)
You guys are going to go after Greg Campbell at the deadline, aren't you?
i'm not sure if anyone else is aware of this, but after bob clarke stepped aside as GM, ed snider offered the job to colin campbell.


we dodged a huge bullet with that one.
   827. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 08, 2011 at 02:50 AM (#3745604)
I know that was snark, but I don't think the Bruins would give up Campbell for pretty much anything right now.

Next game vs. Pittsburgh is March 5th @ Boston. Maybe I should go to the game.
   828. Drew (Primakov, Gungho Iguanas) Posted: February 08, 2011 at 03:49 AM (#3745628)
Would I be crazy if I thought the most vital Bruin was Shawn Thornton?
   829. ursus arctos Posted: February 08, 2011 at 01:28 PM (#3745723)
It's hard for me to look past Thomas and Chara.
   830. IronChef Chris Wok Posted: February 08, 2011 at 01:40 PM (#3745728)
OMFG CANUCKS BALLARD AND EDLER FACEPALM
   831. ursus arctos Posted: February 10, 2011 at 12:48 PM (#3747412)
That Habs-Bruins game last night was insane.
   832. Jamal Touch em All Posted: February 10, 2011 at 01:28 PM (#3747419)
McQuaid is slowly becoming one of my favourite players on the Bruins.

I drove all the way from Ottawa to go to Saturday's game and it was a snooze fest 0-2 match. But between last night's game and the game before Sat, against Dallas, they were probably the two best games of the year. Just my luck that I drew the short straw with a 2/3 chance of seeing an awesome game in person.
   833. zack Posted: February 10, 2011 at 05:59 PM (#3747637)
Hey, whadda ya know, Matt Cooke is a #########. I get the feeling someone is going to get fed up sooner or later.

'hawks finally get another center...except that he's garbage at the dot and hasn't even played much center this year. Not that there was much they could do, and he's probably a candidate for a rebound. Skille had effort but isn't a big loss.
   834. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 11, 2011 at 01:55 AM (#3748077)
flyers are in pretty great position now. they're completely healthy, while the team chasing them (pittsburgh) is decimated by injuries, 3 points behind, with the flyers having 2 games in hand. the flyers also have 2 games in hand on the lightning, who are 4 points behind, sitting in second place in the eastern conference.


but really, i just want to see my new handle.
   835. ursus arctos Posted: February 11, 2011 at 02:23 AM (#3748100)
I rather like Daneyko's suggestion that the NHL should quietly declare "open season" on Cooke for a week.
   836. zack Posted: February 11, 2011 at 05:48 PM (#3748393)
"I've altered my game," Cooke said, a reference to eliminating hits like the one that sidelined Boston center Marc Savard for two months last season. "I've had a meeting with the coach for not hitting a guy coming through the middle. There's a really high risk of being suspended, and I've not hit that guy."

That's beautiful, Matt.
   837. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 12, 2011 at 05:53 AM (#3748936)
so, the islanders.
   838. Gaelan Posted: February 12, 2011 at 06:50 AM (#3748955)
Great game for the Islanders. If ever there was a team that deserved that it is the Penguins. Dirtiest team in hockey. I'm surprised it hasn't happened sooner and I won't be surprised if it happens again.
   839. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 12, 2011 at 07:09 AM (#3748964)

Great game for the Islanders. If ever there was a team that deserved that it is the Penguins. Dirtiest team in hockey. I'm surprised it hasn't happened sooner and I won't be surprised if it happens again.
i didn't see anything happen to cooke though. he was suspended, right?

that's a shame.


talbot got crushed though. so did tangredi. and johnson took a big hit, as well.


i wouldn't say that's a great night, but it seems it was productive. they're gonna eat it with the upcoming suspensions, though.

so will PIT, though i guess goddard won't be too big a loss for them.
   840. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 12, 2011 at 09:10 AM (#3748978)
Just some thoughts about the Leafs:

James Reimer is looking like the goalie of the future. I know it's a small sample but he's got that confident aura about him. For a team that has not had quality goaltending since the lockout, this is a very good development.

When the Leafs signed Beauchemin and Mike Komisarek, they thought they were acquiring the foundation of a defense that would lead the team to the playoffs. Beauchemin was solid but Komasirek has been an unmitigated disaster. He has fallen so far back on the depth chart that when Beauchemin got traded, Keith Aulie, the kid they called up from the minors, played 22 minutes while Komisarek played less than 10.

Kessel has been catching a lot of flak recently but he's still generating a ton of chances. Not worried about him at all.

Grabovski and Kulemin have been outstanding this year.

I think the Leafs make some noise the rest of the way. They won't make the playoffs because I think Buffalo will make as Miller is finding his grove. The Leafs can't beat Buffalo and that'll keep them out of the playoffs but this team will finish strong in my opinion.
   841. ursus arctos Posted: February 13, 2011 at 02:52 PM (#3749353)
They looked decent for the first period last night and then did the usual El Foldo.

They're the Leafs.

The Isles were a disgrace. John Brophy's Long Island Ducks would have been embarrassed.
   842. zack Posted: February 14, 2011 at 04:31 PM (#3749853)
Speaking of the Sabres, congratulations to any Sabres fans on the new ownership, looks like a really solid win. Any time a Buffalo sports team is up for sale there's an even chance the team will be relocated, so hopefully this cements the team in the area for a good number of years. It'd also be nice to spend to the cap once and awhile.

Most Sabres fans are calling for Regier's head with the ownership change. It may be time for a change just based on time, but he's really gotten a bad rap. That Vanek offer sheet is so completely out of line with anything any other GM has ever had to deal with, and the players he gets #### for letting leave were likewise ridiculous overpays for their new teams. Would you want Drury's, Briere's contracts on your team?
   843. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 14, 2011 at 04:43 PM (#3749859)

Would you want Drury's, Briere's contracts on your team?
yes. yes, i'm quite happy having danny briere's contract on my team.


That Vanek offer sheet is so completely out of line with anything any other GM has ever had to deal with
and speaking of this, i believe that same summer bobby clarke put an offer sheet out for ryan kesler. how ####### amazing would that have been if he was on this team, too?
   844. zack Posted: February 14, 2011 at 04:47 PM (#3749864)

yes. yes, i'm quite happy having danny briere's contract on my team.


That's because he got impregnated with flyer-spooge and turned into a sniveling little ####.
   845. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 14, 2011 at 04:50 PM (#3749866)

That's because he got impregnated with flyer-spooge and turned into a sniveling little ####.
turned into? the guy was a cheap piece of #### his entire career. it didn't take coming to the flyers to bring that out in him.

besides, how can you hate the guy? the guy turned heel on quebec and chose to play for the rival flyers instead of the hometown* canadians. how can you hate someone who is also hated by francophones? that's just not right.


*i believe the team he rooted for as a child was the nordiques, so montreal wasn't really ever his hometown team.
   846. zack Posted: February 14, 2011 at 05:01 PM (#3749883)
Heh, I don't have any feelings either way about Briere. I strongly dislike the Flyers as a team, but Hartnell and I guess Pronger are the only players I dislike individually.
   847. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 14, 2011 at 05:07 PM (#3749893)

Heh, I don't have any feelings either way about Briere. I strongly dislike the Flyers as a team, but Hartnell and I guess Pronger are the only players I dislike individually.
yeah, but hartnell's not really good enough or cheap enough to be truely hated.

and the pronger hate probably has nothing to do with him being a flyer.
   848. Gaelan Posted: February 14, 2011 at 05:27 PM (#3749907)
The Isles were a disgrace.


I don't understand this statement. I intensely dislike cheap shots and attempts to injure. My dislike for cheap shots and attempts to injure lead me to dislike the Penguins as they are the dirtiest team in the league. If the NHL were to treat the Penguins like they deserve and punish them for the way they play this wouldn't have happened. However NHL justice is arbitrary and haphazard and has allowed the Penguins to avoid punishment too many teams. In the absence of legal justice it is moral to act outside the law. What the Islanders did was noble and good. They stood up for what was right and I'm glad it happened.

The hypocritical suspensions and fines for the Islanders make me sick. If the NHL cared about any of this they would have suspended Cooke for the season last year like he deserved. Failing that he should be gone for the year now. They say that they want to protect players from head shots while not acknowledging that this was just retribution for previous head shots. If they had punished Cooke more severely and suspended Talbot none of this would have happened. This is all on Campbell and the Penguins.
   849. Justin T., Director of Somethin Posted: February 14, 2011 at 06:18 PM (#3749942)
Eh, the guy who went after Talbot should probably be gone for at least 20 games. That was Bertuzzi-esque, but you only get punished if something bad unintentionally happens. The inherent danger of the act doesn't matter in Colin Campbell's world.

So, I have no love for the Pens and I don't think the Isles are a disgrace, but they got off pretty easy thanks to the usual gross incompetence.
   850. zack Posted: February 14, 2011 at 11:12 PM (#3750186)
What are you talking about, Justin!?? Next thing you'll be saying that it should be illegal to drive drunk even if you don't hit someone, and that attempted murder should be a crime! Nonsense.
   851. ursus arctos Posted: February 14, 2011 at 11:42 PM (#3750209)
"Noble and Good"?

Calling up a minor league goon solely for the purpose of creating havoc, sucker punching Talbot from the side, beating Tancredi when his bell was clearly rung are "noble and good"?

Do you write Charles Bronson movies for a living?

Cooke is also a disgrace in my book, but what the Isles did would have been out of place in the old EHL.

If your point is that the greatest disgrace is the league's shambolic "discipline system" and Colie in particular than perhaps we don't really disagree.
   852. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:01 AM (#3750221)
They looked decent for the first period last night and then did the usual El Foldo.

It was their 5th game in 8 nights and the team just seems to play better with Reimer in net. The Leafs are in a weird spot right now. They want to showcase Giguere so they can get something (anything?) for him.
   853. ursus arctos Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:21 AM (#3750230)
The Flyers just got better. Versteeg should fit in well there.
   854. Yardape Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:24 AM (#3750232)
When the Leafs signed Beauchemin and Mike Komisarek, they thought they were acquiring the foundation of a defense that would lead the team to the playoffs. Beauchemin was solid but Komasirek has been an unmitigated disaster.


I'm sure Burke did think he was getting the foundation of a great defence, but thinking Komisarek was part of it was just foolish and pretty mmuch showcases Burke's faults as a GM. Komisarek is exactly the kind of player Burke will overrate: big, without much skill. Komisarek is basically a zero offensively and competent but not great in his own end. He's not a bad guy to fill out the backline, but thinking he's a top-tier defenceman is being blinded by size.
   855. Flynn Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:37 AM (#3750237)
Ursos - a Puck Daddy listener?

The Isles-Pens game gave a bad taste in my mouth. It just reminded me of minor league hockey and fighting to put butts in seats. I know it's because everybody on God's green earth hates Matt Cooke and some of the Penguins, but damn do I hate fighting. I wouldn't ban it, since I think that could end up giving pests free license, but I played a rough sport too in rugby and while everybody has a punch up now and then it's not something that's actually condoned in the game.
   856. A Random 8-Year-Old Eskimo Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM (#3750242)
intensely dislike cheap shots and attempts to injure. My dislike for cheap shots and attempts to injure lead me to dislike the Penguins as they are the dirtiest team in the league....In the absence of legal justice it is moral to act outside the law. What the Islanders did was noble and good. They stood up for what was right and I'm glad it happened.

The is a ridiculous statement. Cooke is a thug, a disgrace and the NHL has handled him incredibly poorly. However, that does not excuse or condone the thuggish behaviour of the Islanders on Friday. The attempted sucker punch of Talbot could have ended his career or worse. Gilles threw a vicious elbow into a player and then attempted to beat him up when he was clearly injured. (And, to add insult to injury, mocked him from off the ice). Martin avoided the protocol of going to the penalty box after a fight has broken up to challenge a goaltender who unintentionally injured Martin's teammate during a fight that both players consented to.

The fact someone is Matt Cooke's teammate does not give you a licence to try to viciously injure them through sucker punches, vicious elbows or beating upon an injured players. The Islanders, namely Martin, Gilles and to a lesser extent Healey, deserved a much more thorough punishment than they received.
   857. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:46 AM (#3750244)
The Flyers just got better. Versteeg should fit in well there.
eventually the lack of draft picks is gonna kill us, but with carter and richards locked up into the 21st century, hopefully we'll be able to retool on the fly.


as for versteeg, he looks like he's got a bit of skill. i think i remember him from last year's playoff run, playing on bolland's wing on CHI's checking line. kind of small, though. i guess that fits in with the rest of the flyer forwards, but it'd be nice to have 1 wing in the top 9 who's bigger than 6'2.

also, i don't much like the $3 million cap hit this year and next, though. if it means that zherdev has to go, i'd be fine with it. same for nodl. but ville leino is set to be an unrestricted free agent next year, and it'd absolutely suck if this was a preemptive move to replace the guy next year.
   858. ursus arctos Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:48 AM (#3750247)
Flynn, I listen to the podcast, but I'm usually several days behind. Why do you ask?
   859. Tike Redman's Shattered Dreams (shayborg) Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:51 AM (#3750249)
The is a ridiculous statement. Cooke is a thug, a disgrace and the NHL has handled him incredibly poorly. However, that does not excuse or condone the thuggish behaviour of the Islanders on Friday. The attempted sucker punch of Talbot could have ended his career or worse. Gilles threw a vicious elbow into a player and then attempted to beat him up when he was clearly injured. (And, to add insult to injury, mocked him from off the ice). Martin avoided the protocol of going to the penalty box after a fight has broken up to challenge a goaltender who unintentionally injured Martin's teammate during a fight that both players consented to.

The fact someone is Matt Cooke's teammate does not give you a licence to try to viciously injure them through sucker punches, vicious elbows or beating upon an injured players. The Islanders, namely Martin, Gilles and to a lesser extent Healey, deserved a much more thorough punishment than they received.

I could not agree with you more. What Martin did to Talbot (whether or not he violated the "code" by not accepting the invitation to fight) and what Gillies did to Tangradi both had no place in hockey. Yes, Cooke is an ass, and I'll be glad when he's off my team, but Talbot laid a clean hit on Comeau that happened to cause a concussion, and Tangradi was in the minors the last time the Pens played the Isles. I cannot believe that any hockey fan can defend those actions, much less call them "noble and good".
   860. ursus arctos Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:52 AM (#3750250)
STEAGLES, it isn't a deep draft, that 3rd was never going to be anything and the 1st isn't worth a heck of a lot either.

I'm still surprised, because I thought he was going back to Chicago.
   861. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 15, 2011 at 12:53 AM (#3750252)

The Isles-Pens game gave a bad taste in my mouth. It just reminded me of minor league hockey and fighting to put butts in seats. I know it's because everybody on God's green earth hates Matt Cooke and some of the Penguins, but damn do I hate fighting. I wouldn't ban it, since I think that could end up giving pests free license, but I played a rough sport too in rugby and while everybody has a punch up now and then it's not something that's actually condoned in the game.
i heard a line pretty recently from someone regarding banning fighting in the NHL that basically said 'what's the point?' it's not like 80 million fans are gonna show up all of a sudden because it's banned. most anyone who has a problem with fighting will have just as much of a problem with the stick fouls and open ice hits. you're not gonna gain a single viewer by doing away with it, but you'll alienate a hell of a lot of old fans with it.
   862. Langer Monk Posted: February 15, 2011 at 01:09 AM (#3750264)
For what it's worth, I think banning fighting will only increase the likelihood of the dangerous hits. I'm with Gaelen on most of what he said (not the noble and good part, unless the Devils were beating the #### out of some Rangers, but that's neither here nor there.)

If Cooke and Talbot escape punish in the past, the Isles were going to take matters into their own hands on the ice. They lost the plot themselves (Gilles, Martin and Healey probably should have all gotten 10 games as well... the blindside punch on Talbot maybe deserved 15-20) but with the discipline system virtually non-existent or, at best, random, the Isles were bound to make their point and figure they'd get little punishment for it. This snowball started long ago with Campbell being crap, and opening the door for street justice.

On the other hand, old school Patrick Division fun.
   863. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 15, 2011 at 01:17 AM (#3750268)
Versteeg isn't a bad player but getting a first and third for him without having to take on salary is the right move for the Leafs. The Leafs are going to have some money to spend this offseason.
   864. Flynn Posted: February 15, 2011 at 01:06 PM (#3750509)
Flynn, I listen to the podcast, but I'm usually several days behind. Why do you ask?


The Danyenko comment. I remember hearing him say it on Puck Daddy.

i heard a line pretty recently from someone regarding banning fighting in the NHL that basically said 'what's the point?' it's not like 80 million fans are gonna show up all of a sudden because it's banned. most anyone who has a problem with fighting will have just as much of a problem with the stick fouls and open ice hits. you're not gonna gain a single viewer by doing away with it, but you'll alienate a hell of a lot of old fans with it.


Will they? The World Juniors and Olympics ban fighting and are watched by virtually every hockey fan around. I think even the biggest fight loving hockey fan is still a fan of hockey and wouldn't abandon the sport. If they would, then good riddance. Go watch cockfighting or something.

Edit: Also, fighting all but disappears during the playoffs. Are people turning off the playoffs?

For what it's worth, I think banning fighting will only increase the likelihood of the dangerous hits.

What I've seen from Europe suggests this isn't the case.

Saying that, I wouldn't ban fighting. But I'd look to systematically eliminate goons from hockey. Hockey fights are boring and pointless, and keeping guys on a team who play a nominally offensive position like the wing and score 4 points a year is taking jobs away from more skilled players. Obviously a big problem right now is the stupid disciplinary system headed by an idiot in Colin Campbell and I'd love to see that reformed too.
   865. zack Posted: February 15, 2011 at 04:10 PM (#3750601)
Right, supplementary discipline should be enough to limit dirty play on its own. Nothing happens on the ice that isn't recorded in some fashion. Of course, the NHL's supplementary discipline does not achieve that because it is capricious. But you don't need fighting for that.
   866. Gaelan Posted: February 15, 2011 at 04:33 PM (#3750628)
In order to believe what I said you need to believe the following things, all of which are reasonable.

1) The Pittsburg Penguins are the dirtiest team in the league and deserve comeuppance.
2) In a system of arbitrary and capricious justice it is noble and good to exact retribution.
3) In teams sports there is no individual responsibility. The group is responsible for the actions of an individual and may be punished in lieu of the individual.

In addition I'd add that the comparisons to Bertuzzi are myopic. Martin's actions weren't anything like Bertuzzi's. He was trying to start a fight while Talbot skated away. He wasn't trying to hurt him and once he got him down he didn't hit him. The only bad thing was Gillies punching the guy while he was knocked out and then yelling at him afterward. He also was given a huge punishment by NHL standards.

As for those who don't like fighting in hockey you can go take your fandom somewhere else. I'm sorry to go all Canadian on you but I have no need for your cosmopolitan tyranny. Fighting in hockey is what makes hockey the greatest game in the world because it is the only game that treats its violence as an organic feature of the competition.
   867. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 15, 2011 at 04:41 PM (#3750636)
Fighting in hockey is what makes hockey the greatest game in the world because it is the only game that treats its violence as an organic feature of the competition.
sounds like someone should be a brock lesnar fan.
   868. zack Posted: February 15, 2011 at 05:11 PM (#3750670)
Hockey fights aren't organic at all, that's the problem. Maybe 10% of fights are between people a) involved in the dispute and b) are actually pissed. The rest are sideshow acts.
   869. Flynn Posted: February 16, 2011 at 12:26 AM (#3751200)
Indeed. I don't have a problem with two guys fighting for a puck in the corner and getting rough, it's the fact that it's usually enforcer v enforcer is proof enough most fights are anything but organic. Heck the whole fighting code (fight your own size, drop all the equipment before you start,etc) takes the spontaneity out of it.

A skill player like Michael Cammalleri getting in his one fight a decade is funny. Watching Georges Laraque get in his 50th is just dull.
   870. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 16, 2011 at 04:00 AM (#3751335)
Very entertaining game between the Leafs and Bruins tonight. Some comments:

Mikhail Grabovski had an epic game tonight. Twice, he got crunched by Chara. The second time he got hit by Chara, he was actually really foggy as he needed help to get to the bench. He ended up scoring the game winning goal in the last minute of the game on a 1 on 3 rush. Seriously, this is one of those games you'll remember about him. Outstanding.

Kessel scored a couple goals tonight, his first against Boston. I haven't been worried about him at all because he has been getting chances. He and Grabovski also hit the post as well tonight.

Keith Aulie and James Reimer continue to impress. Aulie has stepped in from the minors and is playing 22-24 minutes a night and has looked comfortable. Reimer was really steady, couldn't really be faulted for the goals the Bruins scored, and made some huge saves down the stretch.

Mike Komisarek played less than 13 minutes tonight, fewer than a Gunnarson, a guy that has been a scratch lately. That's not good value for a guy making 4.5 million a year.

Tim Thomas was awful tonight. He looked shaky the whole game.

The Leaf and Bruin management were talking a lot tonight. Kaberle may soon be an ex-Leaf.
   871. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 16, 2011 at 04:56 AM (#3751365)
Highlights of Grabovski's game.
   872. Raskolnikov Posted: February 16, 2011 at 05:54 AM (#3751382)
If Cooke and Talbot escape punish in the past, the Isles were going to take matters into their own hands on the ice. They lost the plot themselves (Gilles, Martin and Healey probably should have all gotten 10 games as well... the blindside punch on Talbot maybe deserved 15-20) but with the discipline system virtually non-existent or, at best, random, the Isles were bound to make their point and figure they'd get little punishment for it. This snowball started long ago with Campbell being crap, and opening the door for street justice.

1) The Pittsburg Penguins are the dirtiest team in the league and deserve comeuppance.
2) In a system of arbitrary and capricious justice it is noble and good to exact retribution.
3) In teams sports there is no individual responsibility. The group is responsible for the actions of an individual and may be punished in lieu of the individual.



So true, and why what the Islanders did was necessary and just.
   873. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 17, 2011 at 03:07 AM (#3752096)
rumors from philadelphia are that the flyers will waive nikolai zherdev in the coming days. with leino out of the lineup for a game due to injury, zherdev was still scratched in favor of dressing both carcillo and shelley.
   874. Justin T., Director of Somethin Posted: February 17, 2011 at 04:01 AM (#3752129)
At this moment, with the Kings having defeated Columbus, all five Pacific Division teams are in top 8 in the WC.
   875. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 19, 2011 at 06:12 PM (#3754138)
i'm watching a 17 minute highlight reel from that islanders-penguins game, and i really want zenon konopka. i don't think he'd raise the odds of winning the cup by very much, but i just really like him.
   876. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 19, 2011 at 06:22 PM (#3754146)
interesting subtext to the versteeg acquisition:

Speaking of Leino by the way, there’s been a lot of talk regarding a contract extension. Both sides have been talking and were gaining some traction. Recently Holmgren approached Leino and gave him an option. Sources say he told Leino we can get the deal done now or add Versteeg and wait until after the season. Leino responded quickly “I want to win a Cup”.

The trade for Versteeg takes away the necessary tag room available to sign Leino to a contract now. In other words, there isn’t enough space under next years salary cap to sign Leino today. Holmgren assured Leino that the deal will get taken care of after the season once the necessary moves are made to create cap room. For now the deal has been halted which is of no concern to Leino whose main priority is winning. There is certainly some risk considering there is no offer on the table but the trust factor is certainly in play.

It’s one thing to be impressed by Holmgren but it an era of rich spoiled athletes it gives you an idea of the type of person Leino is as well. How many players would turn down millions of dollars and financial security for the better of the team? You could probably find some in the NHL but outside of pro hockey I’m not so sure.
   877. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 20, 2011 at 09:54 PM (#3754643)
the heritage classic is being played in about 2 hours on versus. canadian outdoor hockey. should be a blast.
   878. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 21, 2011 at 12:24 AM (#3754708)
game on. 14 degrees, -2 windchill.

apparently there will be no zamboni due to the thinness of the icesheet. they're worried it'll crack.
   879. zack Posted: February 22, 2011 at 04:48 PM (#3755748)
It’s one thing to be impressed by Holmgren but it an era of rich spoiled athletes it gives you an idea of the type of person Leino is as well. How many players would turn down millions of dollars and financial security for the better of the team? You could probably find some in the NHL but outside of pro hockey I’m not so sure.


Sounds like cap circumvention to me!
   880. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 22, 2011 at 08:22 PM (#3756015)
the bruins are 5th in the NHL in goals scored. the hell is that? aren't they supposed to be a terrible offensive team with a strong defense. if they can score, too, that's just not ideal.
   881. Langer Monk Posted: February 23, 2011 at 04:58 AM (#3756363)
16-1-2.

This will either be the greatest thing I've ever seen, or the biggest gut-punch since 1994.
   882. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 23, 2011 at 05:14 AM (#3756371)
This will either be the greatest thing I've ever seen, or the biggest gut-punch since 1994.

I think Buffalo or New Jersey makes it and defeating the Flyers in the first round with the Flyer goaltending getting outplayed. The Flyers have been looking for stability at that position for 15 years.

The Leafs are playing pretty well as well right now. 7-2-2 this month. James Reimer has been phenomenal. The Leafs have been selling at a time when they are palying some of their best hockey of the season.
   883. Langer Monk Posted: February 23, 2011 at 05:21 AM (#3756376)
Leafs, Devils and Isles are playing better than almost anyone right now, strangely enough.

I would think that if the Devils come all the way back, and Parise's healthy, they would be the most dangerous team come late April. Long, long way yet though to go.
   884. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 23, 2011 at 05:29 AM (#3756378)
I would think that if the Devils come all the way back, and Parise's healthy, they would be the most dangerous team come late April. Long, long way yet though to go.

I don't think they are going to make it all the way back. It usually takes 90+ points, which means they are still going to need at least 34 points in the last 22 games. It would be epic but they are trailing to many teams after an already amazing run. But if they do make it, I don't think they'll get beyond the second round. Every games has basically would have been live or die since the midpoint of the season.

It's incredible that they've even entered the conversation.
   885. Langer Monk Posted: February 24, 2011 at 01:23 AM (#3756988)
It's incredible that they've even entered the conversation.


It's a little like the 10 or 11 game winning streak a few years ago that vaulted them ahead of the Rangers and Flyers to win the division. But, you know, on the other hand, not even close. 16 wins in 19 games, trimming some 18 points already off the deficit in about 6 weeks, to get within 9 of 8th place Canes (with a game in hand), and 13 of NYR (2 in hand).

I have trouble thinking they will make it, as you point out, but my god what they've done so far. The playoff chances website has 94 pts as a near certainty as no worse than 8th. The 'good news' is their schedule is somewhat favorable, as in they have a number of games still against teams they need to catch. But these next two in Florida are the most important.

What I've enjoyed most (I know most people hate them, but that's okay), is the drive shown since Jan 8th. I've said to others that this team had it's heart ripped out vs Carolina in the playoffs two years ago, and despite having a good record last year, the team appeared heartless, and was downright disgusting vs the Flyers. If nothing else, I hope this is a good sign for 2011-12.
   886. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: February 25, 2011 at 04:52 AM (#3757865)
Kessel has been catching a lot of flak recently but he's still generating a ton of chances. Not worried about him at all.


I said this on the 12th and he now has 6 goals in his last 5 games. He's got 25 goals on the season, mostly playing with a center who broke a 14 game pointless streak tonight. He could be a 40-50 goal scorer with a true number 1 center.

Leafs win again and are now only 4 points behind the Canes for the 9th spot. The Leafs are the youngest team in the league and the way they are playing right now makes me more optimistic about them than I have been in years.

The biggest problem that the Devils have with making the playoffs is that they are chasing too many teams. A nine point deficit is tough to overcome but now they are chasing 3-5 teams and these teams play each other a lot down the stretch. Somebody has to get those two points.
   887. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 25, 2011 at 11:48 PM (#3758378)
What I've enjoyed most (I know most people hate them, but that's okay), is the drive shown since Jan 8th. I've said to others that this team had it's heart ripped out vs Carolina in the playoffs two years ago, and despite having a good record last year, the team appeared heartless, and was downright disgusting vs the Flyers. If nothing else, I hope this is a good sign for 2011-12.
you got beat because the flyers were and are the better team.


i think we talked about him somewhere, but erik gustafsson has been called up to replace chris pronger, who left yesterday's game after getting hit in the hand by a slapshot. that's pronger, o'donnell, and bartulis who have gotten banged up in the last week. that's not good.
   888. STEAGLES is all out of bubblegum Posted: February 26, 2011 at 09:47 PM (#3758854)
flyers with a few moves today. claimed D nick boynton off waivers from chicago. he's not gonna make it to philly in time for tonight's game, so gustafsson is still a go. to make room for his salary, JVR was sent to the minors, hopefully temporarily, since he's been playing pretty well. nik zherdev will be in the lineup instead.

other news:
marco sturm was claimed off waivers by WAS
craig rivet was claimed off waivers by CLB
   889. zack Posted: March 03, 2011 at 04:59 PM (#3762409)
At the beginning of the season, I was convinced that the West had 5 contenders who were a clear cut above the rest of the teams. Sure enough that I would've put good money on it.

So it's nice to see San Jose, Chicago and (until yesterday) LA back up with Detroit and Vancouver.

I would also just like to mention that Jonathan Toews is a God-King. 27 points in the last 17, during which the hawks have collected 65% of their points, compared to 54% overall. He apparently decided to drag the hawks kicking and screaming into the playoffs.
   890. Cabbage Posted: March 03, 2011 at 05:22 PM (#3762453)
I would also just like to mention that Jonathan Toews is a God-King. 27 points in the last 17, during which the hawks have collected 65% of their points, compared to 54% overall. He apparently decided to drag the hawks kicking and screaming into the playoffs.

You got that right.

Moreover though, it looks like Duncan Keith finally remembered that he was Duncan Keith. The defense in general has finally figured out how to work the breakout. It seemed like the biggest difference this year was in how the team worked possession into the offensive zone. Last year, the d-men could handle the forecheck and setup a nice rush with a series of 15-20 foot passes. For most of the seasons, it looked like the backline would fluster under the forecheckers, fling the puck 60 feet towards the attacking zone, and hope the forwards could outmuscle the opposition on the blue line.

The PK still inexplicably sucks. Its like they've forgotten how to block shots. I suppose hockey special teams are a lot like bullpen performance.
   891. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: March 04, 2011 at 04:00 AM (#3763108)
Since the last time I posted, the Leafs have gone 2-0-2. Those two ties hurt pretty badly because they had 4 separate one goal leads in one of those games and a 2-goal lead in the other. Reimer had to leave the second one and Giguere and the Leafs predictably gave up the lead.

Tonight, the Leafs beat the Flyers despite two goals by Kris Versteeg, a guy the Leafs traded to the Flyers earlier this season. Versteeg was set up beautifully two times by Mike Richards. Nice bit of revenge for him but luckily for the Leafs, they managed to win the game. Both teams were a little bit sloppy and I don't think the Flyers played a particularly good game.Their goalie played well but gave up a soft one for the winner. Their power play looked pretty bad which is especially egregious considering how crappy the Leafs penalty kill can be at times.

We've generally been talking about the Leafs, Sabres, Carolina, New Jersey, and Atlanta fighting for one spot but the Rangers are collapsing. They are currently 8th, only two points ahead of the Sabres (3 more games played than Buffalo) and three points ahead of the Leafs (1 more played than Toronto). They are only one point behind the Canes. The Leafs have made up 15! points up on the Rangers since the All-Star break.

Tyler Bozak has to be one of the most useless players in the NHL. The Leafs have been playing extremely well since the All-Star break. Kessel in particular has been very hot. But Bozak, despite getting 20 minutes of ice time a game, and playing with Kessel, only has 4 points in 16 games and is a -9. It's ridiculous. Kessel is a -2 during the same time but has 15 points.
   892. Yardape Posted: March 04, 2011 at 04:17 AM (#3763117)
Reimer had to leave the second one and Giguere and the Leafs predictably gave up the lead.


Ah, remember last year, when the Leafs traded for Giguere, had a nice little stretch of games and he was supposed to have solved all the Leafs problems? Good times.
   893. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: March 04, 2011 at 04:36 AM (#3763135)
Ah, remember last year, when the Leafs traded for Giguere, had a nice little stretch of games and he was supposed to have solved all the Leafs problems? Good times.

The Leafs have been a very good second half team for the last three years but it never spills over to the next season. I still don't think they'll make the playoffs this year but they have a ton of money to spend in the offseason and I think they are a team on the rise. I think they are the youngest team in the league. That said, it's hard to determine how good a team is when they are playing with a hot goalie. We need a bigger sample to determine whether or not Reimer is a flash in the pan.

The Leafs do have some young depth at that position. Reimer, Gustavvson, Scrivens, and Rynnas.
   894. ursus arctos Posted: March 04, 2011 at 04:33 PM (#3763365)
The Canucks are starting to concern me a bit, as they clearly aren't playing with anywhere near the intensity of the clubs they are playing against, virtually all of which are in mad scramble for playoff places in the in the West. They can certainly afford to coast for a while, but will need to be better than this when the playoffs start if we aren't going to see yet another El Foldo.
   895. Cabbage Posted: March 04, 2011 at 08:16 PM (#3763585)
Given how intense Nucks fans got over past two playoff exits, anything less then the Finals would send them collectively off a cliff.
   896. ursus arctos Posted: March 04, 2011 at 11:10 PM (#3763766)
If they somehow manage to go out to Chicago, I predict mass suicides off the Lion's Gate Bridge.
   897. Fear is Moses Taylor's Bacon Bits Posted: March 04, 2011 at 11:22 PM (#3763775)
Not that I want to see that exactly, ursus, but I would enjoy the Hawks beating them again quite a bit...
   898. ursus arctos Posted: March 05, 2011 at 01:47 AM (#3763890)
I'd concentrate on making sure that you get into the playoffs first, man. Three points separate 11th and 4th. It's bizarre.
   899. Cabbage Posted: March 07, 2011 at 04:33 PM (#3765283)
I didnt realize the Rangers had such an impressive goal differential. I dont know how well pythags apply to hockey, but I have to imagine that would bode well for their playoff chances.
   900. Justin T., Director of Somethin Posted: March 07, 2011 at 04:45 PM (#3765291)
I'd concentrate on making sure that you get into the playoffs first, man. Three points separate 11th and 4th. It's bizarre.

Ahh, the joys of 3-point games.
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