He’s about building those numbers and some day being called the greatest player that ever played.

How is working to be "called the greatest player that ever played" not going to help your team win? That makes zero sense.

How is working to be "called the greatest player that ever played" not going to help your team win? That makes zero sense.

Basement, games, etc. etc.. I hope I live long enough to see the death of this kind of pathetic sportswriting.

A team of 8 A-Rods would win 130 games and go undefeated in the postseason if it had half-decent pitching.

he's no Scott Brosius--that's for sure

Amen #3. 8 ARods wouldn't win? Is he nuts? How much will gung holiness be able to do against a team where every guy's a 40 or 50 home run hitter? You hit behind the runner. Great. Team ARod just smashed three more homers.

How is working to be "called the greatest player that ever played" not going to help your team win? That makes zero sense.

You seem to think that "winning" means "using your athletic ability to score more runs than you give up". This is, of course, completely wrong. Sports is a morality play. Winners win because they are more virtuous than the other team. Special weight is given to grit, determination and scrappiness. Actual wins and losses are then determined by God, using a complicated metric that calculates the overall good character of each team, weighting individual virtue according to playing time. This calculation is too complex to permit mere mortals to make advance predictions. Oddly, however, once the games have actually been played and the winners determined, the fact that one side was preordained to win becomes completely obvious.

If you had eight A-Rods out there I doubt you would be a winning team.

Swoboda is presumably talking about at team consisting only of eight A-Rods, with no pitching staff or bench. He probably figures that the A-Rods won't be all that good at pitching, and since there are only eight of them they always have to play a man short on the field. Also, if they go with a five A-Rod starting rotation, this leaves only three A-Rods who can switch positions and relieve once the day's starting A-Rod tires out. And over a 162 game season, at least one of the A-Rods is probably going to get hurt at some point, which would put them at a real disadvantage, since there is no bench.

This must be what he means, because a team consisting of 8 A-Rods and 17 other players would be insanely, unimaginably good.

A team of 8 A-Rods would win 130 games and go undefeated in the postseason if it had half-decent pitching.

Of course I agree with the general point (who wouldn't?), but it's also true that if you had a team of 8 recent postseason A-Rods, you'd need a rotation of 4 postseason Sandy Koufaxes to win any games at all.

Well, the 2007 postseason version of A-Rod was okay, and really was only lousy in the game against Carmona where the whole team got three hits -- he had a 1.097 OPS in the other three games.

Of course I agree with the general point (who wouldn't?), but it's also true that if you had a team of 8 recent postseason A-Rods, you'd need a rotation of 4 postseason Sandy Koufaxes to win any games at all.

And if you had a team of 8 Adam Greenbergs, you'd never have an end to your half of the first inning.

Adam Greenberg is the greatest player ever!

I'd like to see an exhibition game between a team of eight A-Rods and a team of eight Ron Swobodas (career stats: .242/.324/.379). It would have to be played with a "mercy rule".

Wouldn't a team that consisted of only 8 players go 0-162? Wouldn't they have to forfeit every game for not being able to field a complete team?

#6, how does the other team hit? Off a tee?

Maybe that can be one of those ironic hellish punishments-"A-Rod, here's your team" (8 snotty-nosed 6 year olds).

And if you had a team of 8 Adam Greenbergs, you'd never have an end to your half of the first inning.

No, you'd forfeit before the first inning was over because you wouldn't be able to field any players.

Wouldn't a team that consisted of only 8 players go 0-162? Wouldn't they have to forfeit every game for not being able to field a complete team?

You can play without a complete team, you just get an automatic out every time through the lineup for the empty lineup spot.

My father was a softball ump, and after he tossed a player from the game, the team ended up losing with the tying run on base because the guy who he had tossed was due up, and they didn't have any more players.

Why the guy on base didn't get tagged out trying to score I have no idea... but it was softball, they probably weren't thinking about it that much.

#6, how does the other team hit? Off a tee?

One of the A-Rods pitches, and the other 7 play the field. Presumably they go with only two OFs or something like that.

I'd be willing to be a lot money that some writer made the same comment about Williams -- almost word for word -- 50 years ago.

Just give me a team of nine 23-year old Babe Ruths.

Just give me a team of nine 23-year old Babe Ruths.

I think we did that thread already.

If I had a team of 23 nine-year-old Babe Ruths, we would drive the other team to distraction with mischief and ribald tomfoolery.

I don't have to time to do the calculations, but I'll just go ahead and say that ARod's teams have won more games than Ron Swoboda's

#17 makes me think this has already been hashed out here, but it's a fun curiosity problem to ask which player would form the best eight person team, together with average pitching (of course, if you make it nine person and include pitching, the answer is obviously a young Babe Ruth). I can't think of anyone who is obviously better than ARod. A team of 8 Babe Ruths or Ted Williams's or Barry Bonds's would have a lot of problem playing the infield, being lefthanded (of course, they might hit well enough that it wouldn't matter). 8 Honus Wagners would probably beat 8 A-Rods, maybe 8 Willie Mays's, and 8 Rogers Hornsby's could probably fake the defense enough to do it.

If I had a team of 23 nine-year-old Babe Ruths, we would drive the other team to distraction with mischief and ribald tomfoolery.

My pitching staff of four Rube Waddells wouldn't even notice that crap. They'd be too busy chasing fire wagons.

Wouldn't a team that consisted of only 8 players go 0-162? Wouldn't they have to forfeit every game for not being able to field a complete team?

And if you had to do this and still play the games, would you elect to go with a three man infield or a two man outfield?

I thought the idea was that on the team with 8 A-Rods, none of them would want to risk playing catcher and damaging their perfect body with bruises and crouching.

I'd be willing to be a lot money that some writer made the same comment about Williams -- almost word for word -- 50 years ago.

you would be right

it was more like 60 years ago, but who's counting

#17 makes me think this has already been hashed out here, but it's a fun curiosity problem to ask which player would form the best eight person team, together with average pitching (of course, if you make it nine person and include pitching, the answer is obviously a young Babe Ruth). I can't think of anyone who is obviously better than ARod. A team of 8 Babe Ruths or Ted Williams's or Barry Bonds's would have a lot of problem playing the infield, being lefthanded (of course, they might hit well enough that it wouldn't matter). 8 Honus Wagners would probably beat 8 A-Rods, maybe 8 Willie Mays's, and 8 Rogers Hornsby's could probably fake the defense enough to do it.

Yes, if the clones are pitching, 9 Ruths win by a landslide. No amount of defense could outweigh his pitching advantage over the other sluggers.

If the clones aren't pitching, you probably take the best hitting SS (or a 3B or 2B that could have played SS).

ARod, Wagner, or Hornsby are the obvious choices. I don't think any of the RH OFs is enough better of a hitter to offset the defense.

Yes, if the clones are pitching, 9 Ruths win by a landslide. No amount of defense could outweigh his pitching advantage over the other sluggers.

I think a team of all Ted Williamses would do reasonably well, although those two innings of pitching aren't much to go on.

I say the clones of little old ME could beat all of the clones of Ruth, A-Rod, or anyone else, even on their best day.*

*Provided, of course, that four of my clones get to be the umpires.

Mini-Ditka could beat 9 A-Rods.

Why not a team of 9 Wes Ferrell's or Don Drysdale's or Walter Johnson's or Rick Ankiel's (21-y.o. pitcher, 28-y.o. hitter model) or Bob Gibson's or something? Outside of Ruth as the obvious #1, I wonder if a top pitcher who is athletic and can handle a bat wouldn't be the best bet for something like this.

Just curious Met fans ... do you have to put up with a Swoboda-based article every spring training? Or is he only an expert on A-Rod?

8 Tony Phillips would be an interesting choice -- not sure how his defense rated at all those positions.

Smokey Joe Wood (1912)?

I have a feeling that Mays could have been a fine shortstop if he tried.

If the same guy had to pitch every inning, as opposed to having 10-13 clones, maybe you take the former 3B Tim Wakefield ;)

Ankiel would be a really interesting figure here, if he weren't lefty which would limit him at 2B/SS defensively. (Ichiro!, sadly, also a lefty.)

Who's an exceptional-hitting pitcher... Micah Owings, Mike Hampton, Dontrelle Willis, Carlos Zambrano, Livan Hernandez? I tend to think that Honus Wagner¹ would be a better full-time pitcher than those guys would be a full-time hitter and fielder (especially the last two ;) I can never know that for sure, but I feel pretty damn confident about it.

I guess you raise the stakes if you're talking about a Walter Johnson or Bob Gibson, which would give you an entire staff of guys who would give up two runs per game under regular competition. I think I still take Honus's pitching over Johnson/Gibson's hitting and fielding, but at that point I'm completely guessing even more than before.

Of course, one thing we're noticing here is a severe timeline issue. Other than Ankiel and maybe Owings, all the pitchers whose batting lines seriously suggest potential full-time players are very old guys, because the level of hitting that you can achieve without really practicing continues to decrease as the level of competition increases. But I guess we can agree to ignore that.

Which I guess in turn means we have to throw in Freedom Fries Bob Caruthers. Oh, and Martin Dihigo and a bunch of Negro Leaguers! Sadly, Double Duty Radcliffe did not simultaneously pitch and catch. Hey, Kendry Morales was the ace starter on the Cuban national teen team! I'm rambling now.

¹ Who did pitch 8.3 IP without allowing an earned run, BTW! Although he gave up five unearned runs in those 8.3 IP. I thought he was popular with his teammates?? Maybe the backup SS was lousy... ;)

I have a feeling that Mays could have been a fine shortstop if he tried.

Mantle started as a SS, and was so good they moved him to CF for fear of the safety of the patrons sitting behind 1B.

SS is a lot tougher than CF, and pure speed and athleticism buys you a lot less.

I just want to think of the absolute joy of watching 8 Rickey Hendersons play baseball at the same time.

But we are missing an important factor here: injuries. What if you factor in body type and assume that while one of your 8 is out, it's replacement O and D? That bumps down a team with an A-Rod catcher.

Of course I agree with the general point (who wouldn't?), but it's also true that if you had a team of 8 recent postseason A-Rods, you'd need a rotation of 4 postseason Sandy Koufaxes to win any games at all.

I'd take an 0 and whatever in the postseason over not having the chance to play in October any day of the week. It should take the average person less than a second to come to the same conclusion, too.

Besides, he has been a good (thought not as good as he normally is during the regular season) performer in the postseason anyway for his career.

Just curious Met fans ... do you have to put up with a Swoboda-based article every spring training? Or is he only an expert on A-Rod?

I don't really remember seeing an article from him each spring, Walt, but based on this one, I'd rather not see any more.

BTW, my father photographed him right after the Amazin's won the World Series in '69. Our family proudly displays a photo taken of both of them from that same shoot in the family album.

I always thought the all Ozzie Smith team, plus an average pitching staff, would be fun to have. They wouldn't be a great offensive team, but they would score some runs. (They'd also lead the league in runners left on base.) They'd be the ultimate small-ball madness team - there'd be no reason not to bunt and steal and hit and run like crazy. They'd be best in a huge, HR-suppressing ballpark (something like Busch in the 80's), and you'd tell that pitching staff to throw strikes and get the ball put in play.

I always thought the all Ozzie Smith team, plus an average pitching staff, would be fun to have.

Yeah, but a couple of them would be injured before each game from mid-air collisions caused by their backflips. ;-)

A 25-man all Babe Ruth team just went 137-17 in Baseball Mogul. I think that wins.

I just want to think of the absolute joy of watching 8 Rickey Hendersons play baseball at the same time.

The post-game press conference would also be fun, since the Rickeys would refer both to themselves and their teammates as "Rickey", causing all sorts of confusion.

"I used to play with another guy who called himself 'Rickey' all the time."
"That was ME!"

"I used to play with another guy who called himself 'Rickey' all the time."
"That was ME!"

Don't you mean: "That was RICKEY!"

Ichiro!, sadly, also a lefty.[\quote]

Ichiro throws righty. He's a natural right-hander who learned to hit lefty.

The all-Ryne Sandberg team would be pretty good. The defense would be terrific, especially in the infield, and you get both speed at the top of the lineup and power in the middle. He's probably not much of a pitcher, though.

Ichiro throws righty. He's a natural right-hander who learned to hit lefty.

Whoops, shoulda checked that. Then I'd definitely like to see the team of the nine Ichiros, that would be awesome. He can't be that bad a pitcher if he can hit low 90s...

Ty Cobb could have won with 7 clones of himself -- AND no pitchers, if he wanted to.

I don't really remember seeing an article from him each spring, Walt, but based on this one, I'd rather not see any more.

Well, I meant more like how Koufax shows up every spring for the Dodgers and lots of guys for the Yankees, etc. and thought maybe the spring Swoboda quote was like swallows returning to Capistrano for Mets fans. Cuz then at least it would make sense that some reporter actually asked Swoboda what he thought about AROD.

Re: Your handle

CP, congrats, welcome to Hell.

For some reason, I thought that Ron Swoboda was dead. Guess not, huh? At any rate, I wonder if anyone thought to ask him about Art Shamsky?