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Tuesday, July 12, 2011

OCR: MLB realignment good step during time of peace, prosperity

Realignment and it feels so good.

•Divisional teams will play each other 18 teams apiece. That’s 72 games.

•Each team will play members of the other two divisions in its league six times apiece. That’s 60 games.

•And each division will play a designated division in the other league six times apiece. In other words, the Angels would play home-and-home series against the NL East one year, the Central the next year, the West the year after that. That ensures that every team in baseball would come to Angel Stadium at least once every three seasons.

That makes 162 games.

Why not a sweeping realignment that will do away with the leagues, which no longer have executive structures or their own umpires?

Why not play more games in the same time zones, raising local TV ratings and pleasing sponsors?

Like this, for example:

WEST: Dodgers, Angels, San Francisco, Oakland, San Diego.

MOUNTAIN: Arizona, Colorado, Texas, Seattle, Houston.

SOUTH: Baltimore, Washington, Atlanta, Florida, Tampa Bay.

LAKES: Detroit, Minnesota, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Toronto.

MIDWEST: Cubs, White Sox, St. Louis, Milwaukee, Kansas City.

EAST: Yankees, Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh

.

Posted: July 12, 2011 at 12:56 PM | 59 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: business, television

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   1. Tim Wallach was my Hero Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:15 PM (#3875285)
The few remaining Pittsburgh fans might disagree...
   2. Dale Sams Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:17 PM (#3875288)
SOUTH: Baltimore, Washington, Atlanta, Florida, Tampa Bay.


Is TB actually required to show up for the games? Or can they just sign some autographs and call it a day?

EAST: Yankees, Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh


In a one-night-only playoff, the wild-cards will play each other.
The winner would be shipped immediately to the home park of the club with the best record, which will have its preferred pitching rotation in line. Thus, regular season excellence would provide an advantage in the playoffs, and wild-card teams would have to travel the dirt roads to the World Series.


So TB gets it's Golden Ticket to the divisional round, and 2 out of Yanks, Red Sox, and Phillies (with all three possibly having a better record than TB) play a one game playoff? I would stop watching baseball if that happened.....yes yes I know, it's 'not fair' as it is. There's unfair, and then there's really stupid.
   3. Jolly Old St. Nick Done Jumped The Ship Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:20 PM (#3875293)
Nice Peaches & Herb reference there, Old School Eddiot.
   4. JRVJ Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:21 PM (#3875294)
Plus, there's a lot more material for rivalries between Baltimore, D.C. and Philly, than between Baltimore/D.C. and Atlanta/TB/FL, even if you want to consider Maryland to be the "South" (which I don't, BTW).
   5. Lassus Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:29 PM (#3875306)
I'm sorry, but I will not except any name for that division but GREAT LAKES, or people will just think it's a Minnesota-based division.
   6. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:37 PM (#3875322)
Is TB actually required to show up for the games? Or can they just sign some autographs and call it a day?


Tampa Bay wouldn't win that division this year. Atlanta would. And Atlanta has better talent in the pipeline as well. If you think the Rays would cake walk that division, you're an idiot.
   7. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:38 PM (#3875324)
I'm sorry, but I will not except any name for that division but GREAT LAKES


"Accept."
   8. Dale Sams Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:42 PM (#3875334)
If you think the Rays would cake walk that division, you're an idiot.


So does the sand get in your tampon too, or can that be sealed? Unlike your mouth.
   9. TerpNats Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:45 PM (#3875341)
• Divisional teams will play each other 18 teams apiece. That’s 72 games.

• Each team will play members of the other two divisions in its league six times apiece. That’s 60 games.

• And each division will play a designated division in the other league six times apiece. In other words, the Angels would play home-and-home series against the NL East one year, the Central the next year, the West the year after that. That ensures that every team in baseball would come to Angel Stadium at least once every three seasons.

That makes 162 games.
One of my ideas is sort of similar, but under my plan, six of those 30 interleague games would be against a designated rival (owners want to make sure Angels-Dodgers, White Sox-Cubs, Yankees-Mets, Athletics-Giants occurs every year). Three games would be played against each of the other four teams in your "mirror" division, alternating home field each year, so in 2012 the Nationals would be home to the Yanks and Rays and visit the Bosox and Jays while playing six against Baltimore. In '13, Boston and Toronto visit Nats Park, with road games in the Bronx and the Trop. (I should also note that under my plan, Arizona goes to the AL West and Houston to the NL West, setting up nearly geographically identical "mirror" divisions.) The other 12 interleague games would be against four of the five teams in one of the other two divisions (two series home, two away), with pairings rotating over a 10-year cycle.

Think 30 interleague games too much? Then knock it down to 18, rotating pairings (aside from designated rivalries) by division once every three years. Those 12 other games would become intradivisional games, with teams playing each other 21 times a year instead of 18.
   10. Famous Original Joe C Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:46 PM (#3875343)
So does the sand get in your tampon too

"vagina"
   11. Lassus Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:46 PM (#3875345)
Whoops. That was embarrassing. Minor homonym brain cramp.
   12. Dewey, Steven Wright Wannabe and Soupuss Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:50 PM (#3875351)
I can't see interleague play being expanded beyond what it already is. Teams don't particularly like it. They add additional logistical problems (more different cities to travel to, more teams to scout), and aside from the White Sox - Cubs and Yankees - Mets, the fans don't really care.

They'll never go away, because those Chicago and New York rivalry series bring in a lot of money, but there's no impetus to expand interleague play.
   13. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:54 PM (#3875355)
I was just thinking about this yesterday. I'd change it a bit:

Atlantic: NY Yankees, NY Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Toronto

Central: Washington, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Cleveland

Great Lakes: Detroit, Chicago Cubs, Chicago White Sox, Milwaukee, St. Louis

Northwest: Minnesota, Kansas City, Colorado, Seattle, Arizona

South: Tampa Bay, Florida, Atlanta, Houston, Texas

Pacific: Los Angeles, LA Angels, San Francisco, Oakland, San Diego

Why? Toronto I think should be able to compete with the big boys - Toronto is a huge market and they should market to an entire country. It wasn't that long ago that it was one of the highest spending clubs (and Philly was a mid-tier market!). I want to put Minnesota in the Great Lakes, but I thought the Cubs and Cards would want to stay together. If they don't mind separating, you could swap the Cards and Twins. The Northwest is the least geographically accurate division and would require the most travel, but its hard to fit the mountain teams in.

I don't want to see this happen, just if they did radically re-align, it would make the most parties happy.
   14. Craig in MN Posted: July 12, 2011 at 02:55 PM (#3875358)
Seattle is an awfully long way from Texas.
Minnesota makes much more sense in the Midwest division than the Lakes division, and vice versa for Chicago(x2) and Milwaukee.

I'd flip Seattle & San Diego and Milwaukee & Minnesota and perhaps Toronto & Pittsburgh. It wouldn't make for the perfect matchups, but it would be better. I'd also probably make 2 of the 4 wildcard teams "at large" bids, so they could come whichever league was stronger.

It's a bad plan tradition wise, and in dealing with the NE powerhouse teams, but if we were forced to create an MLB league from scratch (without historical differences & rivalries), with those teams, it would get a lot of support.

Edit:
So, this is about as compact and rational as you can get 6 divisions, I think:
WEST: Dodgers, Angels, San Francisco, Oakland, Seattle.
SW: Arizona, Colorado, Texas, Houston, San Diego.
MIDWEST: Cubs, White Sox, St. Louis, Minnesota, Kansas City.

LAKES: Milwaukee, Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh.
EAST: Yankees, Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Toronto.
SOUTH: Baltimore, Washington, Atlanta, Florida, Tampa Bay.

Under that scenario, with today's standings extrapolated to a full year, I think:
Philadephia, Atlanta, Detroit, San Francisco, Texas, St Louis win the Divisions. Boston & Angels win home field Wildcard slots. Yankees and Tampa are road Wildcard teams.
   15. bunyon Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:04 PM (#3875372)
I put my idea in another thread, and I like playing around with this, so here is my idea:

Three ten team leagues:

Each team plays the 9 teams in its league 11 times: 99 games
Each team plays the other 20 teams 3 times: 60 games
Total: 159 games

Three league winners advance to playoffs.

The 7 best records after that and the World Series champion from the previous year (or best 8 records, if previous champion qualifies by season record or is a league champion) play a single elimination tournament, seeded by record for the final spot.

Season ends on a Thursday. Tournament starts Saturday, played each day at the homepark of the highest seed. LCS starts Tuesday.

You get 11 teams in the "playoffs". You get a crazy last weekend for the final spot. You get a big incentive to win your league/division. You shorten the number of days of the postseason.


Now, the leagues:


Yankees
Mets
Red Sox
Baltimore
Philadelphia
Washington
Toronto
Cleveland
Pittsburgh
Detroit

Cubs
White Sox
Brewers
Twins
Cardinals
Royals
Reds
Braves
Marlins
Rays

Mariners
Giants
A's
Dodgers
Angels
Padres
Dbacks
Rockies
Rangers
Astros
   16. Dewey, Steven Wright Wannabe and Soupuss Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:17 PM (#3875387)
I'll add that as a White Sox fan, I really don't want to see more games against the Cubs. Those games bring out the absolute worst in Chicago baseball fans - I hate those series.
   17. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:21 PM (#3875391)
I actually like #15.
   18. MikeinMI Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:25 PM (#3875395)
It gets tricky with 6 pacific time zone teams and only two mountain time zone teams (I am counting Arizona as a Mountain team, do they do daylight savings time yet?)

So you have to have a pacific team with 2 central time zone teams. This means later starts for them and lower tv ratings.

My idea is to expand to 32 and go 8 divisions of four teams. Add Charlotte, NC and Newark, NJ. You'd get

NorthEast
Boston
NY Yankees
NY Mets
Newark

Great Lakes
Detroit
Toronto
Cleveland
Cincinnati

East
Pittsburgh
Philadelphia
Baltimore
Washington

SouthEast
Atlanta
Tampa
Miami
Charlotte

SouthWest
LA Dodgers
LA Angels
San Diego
Arizona

West
Seattle
Oakland
San Fran
Colorado

South
Texas
Houston
Kansas City
St Louis

NorthCentral
Chi Cubs
Chi WhiteSox
Minnesota
Milwaukee

You also get 2 expansion fees (owners are happy) and 50 + more MLB salaries (players union is happy)
   19. Kiko Sakata Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:28 PM (#3875398)
I'll add that as a White Sox fan, I really don't want to see more games against the Cubs. Those games bring out the absolute worst in Chicago baseball fans - I hate those series.


As a Cubs fan, I agree.

I think that putting the Cubs-Sox, Yanks-Mets, Giants-As in the same division would be a mistake. By being in different leagues/divisions, the teams develop different rivalries, they offer distinct products (most years, if you want to see Derek Jeter play in Chicago, you have to go to The Cell; to see Albert Pujols, you have to go to Wrigley). If they're in the same division, the lesser of the two teams in any given year would just get crushed in terms of attendance - why would you go watch the 7th place team when you can ride the El a few more stops and see the 3rd place team play the same damn opponent two weeks later?
   20. Slivers of Maranville (SdeB) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:29 PM (#3875401)
Why ever would you put Cubs/White Sox and Mets/Yankees together? The way it is currently set up, it makes some sense to root for both teams, as they play different opposition and are unlikely to meet in the WS. But in the same division? Inevitably the fans would just go to the games of the team that was better that year and the other would end up with the dregs.

Edit: What Kiko said.
   21. bunyon Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:31 PM (#3875403)
Does the casual fan actual think that much about what game they go to? In my experience, my non-baseball fan friends do go to baseball games. They go to 2 or 3 a year (mostly minor league) with the sole intent of sitting in the open air and drinking beer, eating hot dogs with their friends. You could play the celebrity softball winner against the Yankees and they wouldn't care.
   22. Shooty is in the Trust Tree Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:32 PM (#3875404)
Why ever would you put Cubs/White Sox and Mets/Yankees together? The way it is currently set up, it makes some sense to root for both teams

Are there people that root for both of these teams? All the Mets fans I know absolutely HATE the Yankees.
   23. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:43 PM (#3875412)
If you go for the 32 team, 8 by 4 alignment, I think you need to split the same-city teams up. I'd add Washington/Baltimore to that as well. Realigning #18 a bit:

NorthEast
Boston
NY Yankees
NY Mets
Baltimore
Newark

Great Lakes
Detroit
Toronto
Cleveland
Cincinnati

East
Pittsburgh
Philadelphia
Baltimore
NY Mets
Washington

SouthEast
Atlanta
Tampa
Miami
Charlotte

SouthWest
LA Dodgers
LA Angels
San Fran
San Diego
Arizona

West
Seattle
Oakland
San Fran
LA Angels
Colorado

South
Texas
Houston
Kansas City
St Louis
Chi WhiteSox

NorthCentral
Chi Cubs
Chi WhiteSox
St Louis
Minnesota
Milwaukee
   24. SoSH U at work Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:46 PM (#3875413)
EAST: Yankees, Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh


Hey, Vlad would get his wish and the Pirates would be in a far more winnable division than the six-team monster they're currently forced to navigate.
   25. Lassus Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:49 PM (#3875418)
Are there people that root for both of these teams? All the Mets fans I know absolutely HATE the Yankees.

My guess is there's a pretty large bell-curve of casual fans who do - as well as in other two-team cities - come playoff time.
   26. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:54 PM (#3875423)
LAKES: Milwaukee, Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh.


What lake, exactly, is Pittsburgh touching?

Hey, Vlad would get his wish and the Pirates would be in a far more winnable division than the six-team monster they're currently forced to navigate.


Throw in some improved revenue sharing, and I'd be fine with this.

Edit: As long as the new division doesn't use the DH.
   27. Slivers of Maranville (SdeB) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:54 PM (#3875425)

Does the casual fan actual think that much about what game they go to? In my experience, my non-baseball fan friends do go to baseball games. They go to 2 or 3 a year (mostly minor league) with the sole intent of sitting in the open air and drinking beer, eating hot dogs with their friends.


They may form a relatively high percentage of baseball fans, but I don't think they attend a particularly high percentage of games. One die-hard fan who goes to 81 games is equal to 27 casual fans who go to three games a year.


Are there people that root for both of these teams? All the Mets fans I know absolutely HATE the Yankees.


Right, but that's aided by the fact that they aren't in direct competition. Put them in the same division, and what's the difference between them? It'd be like Coke buying Pepsi, and selling Coke in Pepsi cans alongside the Coke cans.
   28. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 03:54 PM (#3875429)
I would kinda hate this alignment. Shocking, I know...
   29. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:00 PM (#3875435)
Just to reiterate, a "Southeast" division of Braves/Rays/Marlins/"Bobcats" would kill in this region.
   30. SoSH U at work Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:01 PM (#3875436)
What lake, exactly, is Pittsburgh touching?


Maybe the same one that Cincinnati is.
   31. SoSH U at work Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:01 PM (#3875437)
Double post.
   32. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:06 PM (#3875443)
Maybe the same one that Cincinnati is.


It seems mean to call it the "Sad, Dying, Rusted-Out Shell Of The Once-Thriving Industrial Midwest" division.
   33. LooseCannon Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:11 PM (#3875451)
I'm just going to repeat my proposal of a soccer World Cup-style season. No more divisions. No more separate leagues. The league is a round-robin of a two-game series at home and a two-game series on the road against every other team. That gets you 116 games. Take a break. Have an entire All-Star week.

Then we begin what you can think of as either the second phase of the regular season or the first phase of the playoffs. Teams get seeded into five pools of six teams. Originally, I thought 4 home and 4 away against every team in your pool, but now I am thinking of giving more incentive to do well in the first phase of the season by having teams play 7 games against the other teams in their pool, with the team that has the better record getting 4 home games and 3 road games.

The top two teams in each pool, plus four wild cards, advance to a sixteen-team playoff with your usual best of seven series.

Pluses include no more complaining about unbalanced schedules and unfair divisions. Minuses include screwing with the record books, logistics/travel, and not being able to set a schedule for the back end of the season well in advance.
   34. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:44 PM (#3875469)
WEST: Dodgers, Angels, San Francisco, Oakland, San Diego.


Renamed: "New Mexico and The Bay"

MOUNTAIN: Arizona, Colorado, Texas, Seattle, Houston.


Renamed: "We Hate New Mexico, Plus Some PacWest Hippie Treehuggers"

SOUTH: Baltimore, Washington, Atlanta, Florida, Tampa Bay.


Renamed: "There's Only One Team From The South Here"

LAKES: Detroit, Minnesota, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Toronto.


Renamed: "We Used To Have Jobs. And Canada.

MIDWEST: Cubs, White Sox, St. Louis, Milwaukee, Kansas City.


Renamed: "Places You Leave When You Come Of Legal Age For $400, Alex"

EAST: Yankees, Mets, Boston, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh


Renamed: "The Sopranos and Steelworkers Local, 412"
   35. Lassus Posted: July 12, 2011 at 04:57 PM (#3875475)
Renamed: "There's Only One Team From The South Here"

Honestly, having been through Maryland, DC, Florida, AND Georgia multiple times, I have to disagree with this. There's a whole lotta south in those places, even if they aren't up to your personal drunken hillbilly standards.
   36. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 05:09 PM (#3875486)
Honestly, having been through Maryland, DC, Florida, AND Georgia multiple times, I have to disagree with this. There's a whole lotta south in those places, even if they aren't up to your personal drunken hillbilly standards.


Actually, I'd argue that there are no teams from the true south there. Baltimore and DC are Mid-Atlantic cities. Florida and Florida are Florida (though Tampa comes close.) And Atlanta, while in a true, deep south state, isn't like the rest of the state by far.
   37. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 05:14 PM (#3875491)
Actually, I'd argue that there are no teams from the true south there. Baltimore and DC are Mid-Atlantic cities. Florida and Florida are Florida (though Tampa comes close.) And Atlanta, while in a true, deep south state, isn't like the rest of the state by far.


Most of the people there are offshoots from the loins of treasonous Rebs, though, and that's good enough for me.
   38. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 05:20 PM (#3875501)
Why not be more like the NFL since after all, they are the most well run sport!

AL East
New York Mets
Florida
Boston
Toronto
Baltimore

AL Central
Cleveland
Cincinnati
Pittsburgh
Houston
Chicago White Sox

AL West
Kansas City
Oakland
Colorado
Seattle
San Diego

NL East
New York Yankees
Arizona
Texas
Philadelphia
Washington

NL Central
Milwaukee
Minnesota
Chicago Cubs
Detroit
Tampa Bay

NL West
San Francisco
Atlanta
LA Dodgers
LA Angels
St. Louis
   39. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 05:55 PM (#3875538)
Most of the people there are offshoots from the loins of treasonous Rebs, though, and that's good enough for me


Actually, in Atlanta proper, most people are the offshoots from the loins of the people the treasonous Rebs bought and sold as cattle. The suburbs? About half and half treasonous Reb spawn and Yankee carpetbagger/carpetbagger spawn.
   40. Fernigal McGunnigle has become a merry hat Posted: July 12, 2011 at 06:09 PM (#3875556)
As long as we're doing crazy realignments, I'll throw out the one I adopted for my OOTP league. First, expand to 96 teams. We place them based purely on population by Metropolitan Statistical Area (and the Canadian equivalent). MSAs with over 4.3 million people get a team for every 2.65 million, meaning 12 places have 2+ teams. The smallest MSA with a team is Worcester, MA; the largest without one is McAllen-Edinburg-Mission, TX (in Canada, the smallest with a team is Edmonton, the largest without is Quebec). The league is divided geographically into 4 subleagues of 3 divisions each, 8 teams per division. Each team plays its divisional rivals 14 times, and then 4 games against the other teams in its subleagues. 1 wildcard per subleague, and the whole playoff is 4 rounds of 7-game series. My team is the Rochester Fighting Wookies.


Northeast Division
Boston-Cambridge-Quincy, MA-NH x2
Worcester, MA
Montreal-Laval, PQ
Providence-New Bedford-Fall River, RI-MA
Hartford-West Hartford-East Hartford, CT
Bridgeport-Stamford-Norwalk, CT
New Haven-Milford, CT

New York City Division
New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA x8

Erie-Ontario Division
Buffalo-Niagara Falls, NY
Rochester, NY
Albany-Schenectady-Troy, NY
Toronto-Mississauga-Brampton-Vaughan, ON x2
Ottawa–Gatineau, ON
Pittsburgh, PA
Cleveland-Elyria-Mentor, OH

Mid-Atlantic Division
Philadelphia-Camden-Wilmington, PA-NJ-DE-MD x2
Allentown-Bethlehem-Easton, PA-NJ
Baltimore-Towson, MD
Washington-Arlington-Alexandria, DC-VA-MD-WV x2
Virginia Beach-Norfolk-Newport News, VA-NC
Richmond, VA

Erie-Michigan Division
Columbus, OH
Dayton, OH
Indianapolis-Carmel, IN
Detroit-Warren-Livonia, MI
Chicago-Joliet-Naperville, IL-IN-WI x4

Southeast Division
Charlotte-Gastonia-Rock Hill, NC-SC
Raleigh-Cary, NC
Nashville-Davidson–Murfreesboro–Franklin, TN
Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Marietta, GA x2
Memphis, TN-MS-AR
Louisville/Jefferson County, KY-IN
Cincinnati-Middletown, OH-KY-IN

Subtropical Division
Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Pompano Beach, FL x2
Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL
Orlando-Kissimmee-Sanford, FL
Jacksonville, FL
Birmingham-Hoover, AL
New Orleans-Metairie-Kenner, LA
Baton Rouge, LA

Texas Division
Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington, TX x2
Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown, TX x2
San Antonio-New Braunfels, TX
Austin-Round Rock-San Marcos, TX
El Paso, TX
Oklahoma City, OK

Central Division
St. Louis, MO-IL
Kansas City, MO-KS
Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington, MN-WI
Omaha-Council Bluffs, NE-IA
Milwaukee-Waukesha-West Allis, WI
Tulsa, OK
Edmonton, AB
Calgary, AB

Great Western Division
Seattle-Tacoma-Bellevue, WA
Portland-Vancouver-Hillsboro, OR-WA
Vancouver-Surrey-Burnaby, BC
Phoenix-Mesa-Glendale, AZ
Tucson, AZ
Albuquerque, NM
Salt Lake City, UT
Denver-Aurora-Broomfield, CO

Southern California Division
Los Angeles-Long Beach-Santa Ana, CA x5
Riverside-San Bernardino-Ontario, CA
San Diego-Carlsbad-San Marcos, CA
Bakersfield-Delano, CA

Northern California Division
Oxnard-Thousand Oaks-Ventura, CA
Fresno, CA
San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont, CA x2
Sacramento–Arden-Arcade–Roseville, CA
San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara, CA
Honolulu, HI
Las Vegas-Paradise, NV
   41. Slivers of Maranville (SdeB) Posted: July 12, 2011 at 06:14 PM (#3875562)
You have Honolulu, but no Puerto Rican teams, Fernigal?
   42. Dale Sams Posted: July 12, 2011 at 06:15 PM (#3875565)
Tulsa has to go to fukking Calgary??? But the furthest OKC goes is to El Paso?
   43. Fernigal McGunnigle has become a merry hat Posted: July 12, 2011 at 06:50 PM (#3875613)
The west is a huge mess no matter what you do. Those poor computer players go through hell! I'm more upset about putting the Ohio teams in 3 separate divisions.

You have Honolulu, but no Puerto Rican teams, Fernigal?


Yeah, that was a screw up, because I went by a Wikipedia list of MSAs that doesn't include San Juan. By the time I figured that out I'd already aligned everything and didn't want to go through it again.
   44. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 12, 2011 at 06:50 PM (#3875614)
Why not play more games in the same time zones, raising local TV ratings and pleasing sponsors?

Like this, for example:

MOUNTAIN: Arizona, Colorado, Texas, Seattle, Houston.


None of those other teams are in the same time zone as Seattle.
   45. base ball chick Posted: July 12, 2011 at 07:04 PM (#3875635)
stop putting houston in the *&($@! DH league thank you and please stop sending houston to the pacific league

we have enough trouble as it is without losing half of the 4 dozen fans we got left
   46. TerpNats Posted: July 12, 2011 at 07:05 PM (#3875637)
If only the economy were better, MLB could expand to Sacramento and Portland, tack them onto the six current West Coast teams, and in effect recreate the PCL of yore as one of four 8-team divisions or leagues.
   47. Random Transaction Generator Posted: July 12, 2011 at 07:28 PM (#3875664)
I was about to submit a satirical idea of 64 teams spread across the North American continent, when Fernigal absolutely blows it out of the water with his 96 team monstrosity. The only way that would work is if you had some Euro-style relegation league system. You couldn't possibly show the highlights of 48 major league games every night, and the All-Star game rosters would have to double in size.

As well, I can't imagine that the fans in Vancouver would be happy to see their #1 starter be Jo-Jo Reyes.
   48. andrewberg Posted: July 12, 2011 at 07:37 PM (#3875672)
Tulsa has to go to fukking Calgary??? But the furthest OKC goes is to El Paso?


Once we get that single issue sorted out, the league should be good to go.
   49. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 08:25 PM (#3875708)
I was about to submit a satirical idea of 64 teams spread across the North American continent


30 MLB + 14 International League + 16 Pacific League + 14 Mexican League = 74 teams

The infrastructure is there.
   50. DL from MN Posted: July 12, 2011 at 08:26 PM (#3875709)
You can do the realignment with very little league crossover

AL East
NYY
TB
Bos
Bal

NL East
NYM
Cin
Pitt
Phi

NL Southeast
Wash
Atl
Mia
Charlotte

AL Great Lakes (and Newark)
Det
Tor
Cle
Newark

AL Central
Min
CHW
Tex
KC

NL Central
Hou
Stl
CHC
Mil

AL West
LAA
SEA
Col (one team moves)
Oak

NL West
LAD
SD
AZ
SF

That puts the 3 NY area teams in 3 separate divisions, maximizing TV revenue for everyone. Only Colorado has to change leagues and I think everyone (except Ubaldo Jimenez) wants to see the DH in Colorado. There is a top 3 media market in each division except the NL SE (NY, NY, ATL/WASH, NY, CHI, CHI, LA, LA). All division games are within time-zone except for Colorado. Baseball maximized for television.
   51. DL from MN Posted: July 12, 2011 at 08:48 PM (#3875732)
With a Charlotte expansion team, I'm assuming that bumps Durham back down to the Carolina League as an affiliate?
   52. andrewberg Posted: July 12, 2011 at 09:04 PM (#3875747)
With a Charlotte expansion team, I'm assuming that bumps Durham back down to the Carolina League as an affiliate?


It seems like Charlotte has done more harm than good to the NFL, and I know that the NBA wishes it had never expanded there. I know the MLB is more of a regional product, but it isn't very easy to grow a fanbase in the South. Maybe if the pitcher came to the mound in a stock car they would have more of an allegiance.
   53. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 12, 2011 at 09:35 PM (#3875758)
I was about to submit a satirical idea of 64 teams spread across the North American continent, when Fernigal absolutely blows it out of the water with his 96 team monstrosity. The only way that would work is if you had some Euro-style relegation league system. You couldn't possibly show the highlights of 48 major league games every night, and the All-Star game rosters would have to double in size.


My Strat-O-Matic league has these teams (a few fictional ones) represented:

Aberdeen
Adelaide
Amsterdam
Arizona
Athens
Atlanta
Ballykissangel
Baltimore
Bangkok
Barcelona
Barnsley
Bath
Bedford
Bejing
Belfast
Berlin
Birmingham
Blackburn
Blackpool
Boise
Boston Bees
Boston Red Sox
Bradford
Brighton
Brisbane
Bristol
Brooklyn
Brussels
Bucharest
Budapest
Buffalo
Cairo
Calgary
Cambridge
Canberra
Cardiff
Charlotte
Chester
Chiba Lotte
Chicago Cubs
Chicago White Sox
Chunichi
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Colorado
Columbus
Cork
Coventry
Crawley
Crystal Palace
Detroit
Dibley
Dover
Dublin
Dundrum
Dunedin
Dunfermline
Durham
Edinburgh
Edmonton
Elizabeth
Felixstowe
Fife
Fleetwood
Florida
Gibraltar
Glasgow
Gotham City
Gothenburg
Griffith Park
Grimsby
Halifax
Hamamatsu
Hamilton
Hanshin
Hartford
Hatfield
Havana
Hawaii
Haworth
Hendon
Hinata City
Hiroshima
Homestead
Hong Kong
Houston
Hull
Indianapolis
Ipswich
Jersey
Kansas City Monarchs
Kansas City Royals
Kendal
Kensington
Kia
King's Lynn
Kintetsu
Kitakyushu
Kyoto
Lancaster
Las Vegas
Leeds
Leicester
Lisbon
Liverpool
Los Angeles Angels
Los Angeles Dodgers
Louisville
Lyme Regis
Madrid
Manchester
Melbourne
Memphis
Mexico City
Milan
Milton Keynes
Milwaukee
Minnesota
Monaco
Montreal
Moscow
Mumbai
Munich
Nankai
New Orleans
New Westminster
New York Giants
New York Mets
New York Yankees
Newark
Newcastle
Niigata
Nippon Ham
Northampton
Notting Hill
Nottingham
Oakland
Ohio
Oklahoma City
Orix
Oslo
Ottawa
Oxford
Paddington
Paris
Pembroke
Perivale
Perth
Philadelphia Athletics
Philadelphia Phillies
Pittsburgh
Plymouth
Portland
Preston
Providence
Quebec City
Reading
Regina
Richmond
Rockford
Rome
Sacramento
Salisbury
San Diego
San Francisco
San Juan
Seattle Mariners
Seattle Pilots
Seibu
Shanghai
Sheffield
Shrewsbury
Silverstone
Softbank
Soho
Southampton
Spokane
St. Helens
St. Louis Browns
St. Louis Cardinals
Stockholm
Stoke-on-Trent
Stranraer
Stratford
Sunderland
Sydney
Syracuse
Tacoma
Taipai
Taiyo
Tampa Bay
Texas
Tohuku Rakuten
Toledo
Toronto
Troy
Vancouver
Västerås
Venice
Victoria
Vienna
Vilnius
Warsaw
Warton
Washington Nationals
Washington Senators
Wellington
Wessex
Winchester
Winnepeg
Yakult
Yokohama
Yomiuri
York
   54. bookbook Posted: July 12, 2011 at 09:41 PM (#3875764)
I like #50. I'd also like to see each team choose at the beginning of the year whether they're going to go with a DH for their home games that year or not. Talk about your big strategic decisions (maybe we should let 'em switch at the all-star break?).
   55. Rickey Fredonia Fudge Duckery Precious Twiddle Posted: July 12, 2011 at 09:59 PM (#3875772)
It seems like Charlotte has done more harm than good to the NFL, and I know that the NBA wishes it had never expanded there.


Charlotte is a boom town, but it is a banking town. One of the big two (Bank of America) hasn't had a great few years, and the other (Wachovia) was gobbled up by Wells Fargo during the bailouts. Charlotte got hit pretty hard by the financial sector meltdown, and unlike Manhattan it doesn't have a lot of secondary industry (and tourism) to balance out that hit.

I know the MLB is more of a regional product, but it isn't very easy to grow a fanbase in the South. Maybe if the pitcher came to the mound in a stock car they would have more of an allegiance.


Maybe if there were more teams around the southeast, such that people didn't have to plan their baseball around week long vacations or three-day weekends into other regions/cities, there would be more "fans."

Baseball fans in the south are either Marlins fans (Miami metro), Rays fans (Central and North FL), Braves fans (GA, AL, TN, SC), or transplants (South FL, suburban ATL.) Once you get into NC you start hitting Mets fans, mostly. Thus, Dial.

If you put a team in Charlotte, it would play as well as Kansas City or Pittsburgh, I think.
   56. zachtoma Posted: July 12, 2011 at 10:00 PM (#3875773)
Peace and prosperity are about?
   57. DL from MN Posted: July 12, 2011 at 10:27 PM (#3875797)
Charlotte would probably be a bad market in terms of attendance but it locks up several minor television markets. TV pays the bills.
   58. TerpNats Posted: July 12, 2011 at 10:40 PM (#3875809)
Charlotte would probably be a bad market in terms of attendance but it locks up several minor television markets. TV pays the bills.
You run a Charlotte franchise, you emphasize weekend series a la Cincinnati or St. Louis, working to create ballgame/hotel packages to entice people from around the Carolinas and set up weekend season plans, principally for markets not far away (Greenville/Spartanburg/Anderson/Clemson to the southwest, Winston-Salem/Greensboro/High Point to the north). Offer discounts on Monday-Thursday games for fans in the Charlotte metro area. It wouldn't be a lead-pipe cinch, but it could succeed.

A Charlotte franchise would probably also get TV/radio deals from the Research Triangle (Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill), now a top 25 market. In fact, come 2025 or 2030 the Triangle might make more sense as a MLB market than Charlotte; it's certainly more stable from an economic perspective, thanks to UNC, NCSU and Duke.
   59. Arch Stanton Posted: July 12, 2011 at 10:54 PM (#3875834)
I have lived near Charlotte my whole life, so it's weird for me to come here and simultaneously bury Charlotte and praise it.

Charlotte did support the NBA until George Shinn started screwing cheerleaders, mismanaged his money, tried to blame his problems on the city, and then ran off. The Bobcats have been so poorly marketed, it's kind of amazing they're still in town. I honestly wish they'd leave just because I feel sorry for them.

The Panthers have had their ups and downs, but there has generally been good support. The fans are fair-weather, but maybe once their kids grow up as lifelong Panthers fans that'll turn around.

Having said all that...

I would love love love to have professional baseball in Charlotte, but I don't see any possible way this market could support it. There's just not enough "here" here.
   60. DL from MN Posted: July 13, 2011 at 04:16 PM (#3876634)
If not Charlotte then we're back to Montreal, Mexico or Portland.

W/Montreal

AL East
NYY
Montreal
Bos
Bal

NL Southeast
Wash
Atl
Mia
Tampa Bay

w/Mexico

NL South
Wash
Atl
Mia
Houston

NL Central
Mexico City
Stl
CHC
Mil

w/Portland

NL South
Wash
Atl
Mia
Houston

NL Central
Colorado
Stl
CHC
Mil

AL West
LAA
SEA
Portland
Oak

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