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Saturday, February 17, 2018

OT - 2017-18 NBA thread (All-Star Weekend to End of Time edition)

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, none of whom can be bothered to curate their own thread to avoid detracting from what this site is really about:  eliminationist rhetoric and precognition.

Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: February 17, 2018 at 02:09 AM | 6535 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: basketball, nba, off-topic

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   5001. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:45 AM (#5679478)
Kerr is no genius in-game tactician (to wit: Walton's reasonable success as interim) but he's exceptionally good at player development, in part because of the above, which I think is 100% correct.

Agree.

I might go the other way, Mouse. Houston is talking about running Gordon at the point, but I think I consider trying the Harden show, where he's driving and bombing away (yes, even after some bad shooting days), see if I can steal one on the road. Still ruminating.
   5002. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:58 AM (#5679485)
You cannot plan for game 7. You can't. You have to take your chance in game 6. If Paul can play, he plays. Too much can go wrong. You've got to take the shot in front of you.
   5003. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:03 AM (#5679488)
I doubt any of us think they should risk making Paul's injury worse, but I agree with those who think Houston has to go for it in game 6. I know home teams are massive favorites, historically, in game 7s, but I think I'd probably take the Warriors if it gets to that point.
   5004. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:10 AM (#5679495)
Lowe on Trevor Ariza
Glad to see a longtime favorite of mine gets some press.
   5005. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:13 AM (#5679497)
but I agree with those who think Houston has to go for it in game 6


If things go off the rails though, how much burn do you give to get back in it, versus live to fight another day? If everyone thinks the players looked really out of gas last game, does it make sense to burn energy once (if) things go south.

I don't know the right answer, or even if there is a right answer, but I think it is worth thinking about.
   5006. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:38 AM (#5679511)
I see Draymond taking the heat but that looked like a bad pass from Curry to me? I guess there's a case Draymond did something he wasn't supposed to do, but I'm unclear on that.


No, it was a fine enough pass from Curry. Wasn't perfect, but Green looked down before he caught the ball, so the TO is all on him.

I agree with a lot of people here that Green is taking too much heat on the pass to Cook - it looks like Curry also breaks free top of the key right as Cook starts shooting, so maybe he could have moved the ball along - but if Cook is in the game and that open, he should shoot then.

Green should be getting heat for the TO and for passing instead of calling timeout on the missed FT (meaning GS couldn't advance the ball). There was also an offensive rebounding chance he had where he tipped the ball instead of grabbing it. He didn't have a good last couple of minutes.

---

With all the focus on the officiating these playoffs, maybe the worst call so far was the "inadvertent whistle" on the Harden travel that they waved off. WTF was that? I know HOU missed and GS rebounded afterwards, but that's completely inexplicable.
   5007. stanmvp48 Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:40 AM (#5679512)
Yeah, I was just about to ask about the Harden non travel. Defensive contact probably caused him to take extra steps, but they miss that all the time and it is not reviewable as I understand it.
   5008. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:41 AM (#5679513)
Justin Kubatko @jkubatko 2h2 hours ago

The Warriors have lost their last two games despite recording a higher field-goal percentage, 3-point percentage, and free-throw percentage than the Rockets in each game. No other team in NBA history has suffered back-to-back losses like that in a single postseason.


I think I saw Harden has missed his last 20 3PA, too. It's crazy that the Rockets have won these 2 games. Their defense really has been something else.
   5009. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:41 AM (#5679514)
Agree on that final point, Moses. That was a pretty clear travel. Kerr should've blown a kidney protesting that.
   5010. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:45 AM (#5679515)
Why was Green the guy catching that pass, versus Durant?
   5011. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:00 AM (#5679521)
My impression on the Harden non-travel was that the ball was actually poked loose, and another ref saw that, so after the refs conferred the call was reversed (which is not the same as a formal review). I could be wrong, though.
   5012. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:05 AM (#5679526)
Why was Green the guy catching that pass, versus Durant?

It looked like Curry was going to come up right behind Green to get a shot. So like a dribble hand off or something, with Green screening Curry's man (can't remember who it was).
   5013. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:14 AM (#5679532)
Yeah but you need to account for multiple contingencies and Durant is longer, quicker, and a better shot. (And I say this as someone who has been pretty frustrated with Durant's play for several games.)
   5014. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:28 AM (#5679543)
In non-playoff news, Duncan/Leroux had a pretty brutal assessment of the Wiz's offseason/future on the Dunc'd On podcast the other day (I think it was the post game 5 Celtics/Cavs pod). I recommend it, and have appreciated their offseason previews, or whatever they're calling them.
   5015. JJ1986 Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:37 AM (#5679555)
In non-playoff news, Duncan/Leroux had a pretty brutal assessment of the Wiz's offseason/future on the Dunc'd On podcast the other day (I think it was the post game 5 Celtics/Cavs pod). I recommend it, and have appreciated their offseason previews, or whatever they're calling them.
They are both super-low on Otto Porter, which might be correct at the highest levels of playoff basketball, but I think he's still a pretty positive player in the regular season. I think the Wiz should probably stretch Smith and Meeks, trade Mahinmi and a first for someone on a one-year bad contract (Jeremy Lin? Old friend Jared Dudley?) and get a little bit of breathing room that way. Sign some big men to cheap contracts and probably fail to find another wing who can shoot.
   5016. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:41 AM (#5679559)
Porter and Gortat for Drummond, Galloway, and Buycks. Who says no? Washington, right?
   5017. Robert S. Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:50 AM (#5679568)
Kerr deserves a huge amount of credit for his epiphanies about the offense, both the initial approach and then the death lineup. He also deserves a ton of credit for keeping the locker room free of drama (we'll see how long this holds if GSW doesn't win the championship this year and the same team is mostly brought back next season).

I think there are some serious questions to be raised about his late-game management and his ability to actually get through to the players when it matters. I couldn't help but think back to Ezeli getting roasted in Game 7 last night when Cook was taking one of the biggest shots of the game. Cook was so nervous that he couldn't even catch the ball and was totally oblivious to a wide-open Curry. Kerr didn't put Cook in a position to succeed. More important, three of the best shooters in NBA history didn't have the ball in their hands.

The Warriors have admitted that they were coasting all season. That's not great, but it isn't necessarily the end of the world in the NBA - as long as they can flip the switch like the Cavs. They aren't doing that, though; they're playing their sloppiest ball of the season in the biggest games and now the best-case scenario is they're playing Game 7 on the road. If Stevens is coaching the Warriors the last minute of Game 4, he calls a TO to advance the ball, and has a lights-out ATO play ready to go. Meanwhile, Kerr lounged on the sideline and hoped for the best from an offense that was out of rhythm for most of the game and was particularly awful during the 4th. He did have a play to get Curry a decent shot after the lucky foul was called, but they never should've been in that position in the first place. We all saw the clip of him telling KD a nice story about MJ and isoball last night, which KD proceeded to ignore while he jacked up a whole bunch sub-optimal shots even though Curry and Klay were shooting well.

It's not Kerr's fault when Draymond plays sloppy and makes bad decisions like last night or that Iguodala's hurt. It's his fault that he doesn't have his team prepared to execute in crunch time and that he's making bad decisions there himself. They're totally falling apart at the point in the game where a bunch of kids in Boston with less experience and talent have repeatedly stolen games this postseason.
   5018. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:51 AM (#5679570)
If the Sixers miss out on James and McCollum they should call Washington about Beal.
   5019. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:54 AM (#5679573)
The Warriors have admitted that they were coasting all season. That's not great, but it isn't necessarily the end of the world in the NBA - as long as they can flip the switch like the Cavs.

Huh?
   5020. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:57 AM (#5679575)
Tim MacMahon @espn_macmahon 27m27 minutes ago

"Not good," a Rockets source replied to a text asking about Chris Paul (hamstring) feels this morning.


Iggy may have been enough to be a difference in the last couple of games for the W's (maybe?), but if Paul is done...

There's a chance the W's could still win the 2 if Paul plays of course, but if they win with him out I think we'll all feel a little cheated.
   5021. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:59 AM (#5679577)
If Stevens is coaching the Warriors the last minute of Game 4, he calls a TO to advance the ball, and has a lights-out ATO play ready to go. Meanwhile, Kerr lounged on the sideline and hoped for the best from an offense that was out of rhythm for most of the game and was particularly awful during the 4th.

Oh come on
   5022. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:03 PM (#5679580)
I imagined Steve Kerr in a bowler hat saying, "This is fine" while his house burned around him during his press conference last night.

Edit: That said, it probably still is fine. In my heart of hearts I still think the Warriors will win. The problem is there's a chance Houston just hits a bunch of threes in one of these games and it won't matter how well the Warriors play.
   5023. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:23 PM (#5679593)
[5021] I agree, Moses, but there's something to Robert's point. They have performed oddly poorly for a team with that offensive talent, that has been together for two years, and that is experienced. To my second point, I'm surprised that two years in, they still (or at least right now) are so out of sync. Some of that has to be attributed to Houston's defense, I think. Some of it, I'm not so sure about.
   5024. JJ1986 Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:24 PM (#5679594)
Paul is out for Saturday.
   5025. NJ in NY (Now with Baby!) Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:32 PM (#5679597)
[5024] Well, we've got one Game 7.
   5026. Tin Angel Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:34 PM (#5679600)
The problem is there's a chance Houston just hits a bunch of threes in one of these games and it won't matter how well the Warriors play.


Right. Harden is 0 for his last 20 three's. He is going to go off one of these games, and even if the Warriors offense returns, Harden could single-handedly win on of these next two.
   5027. Quaker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:35 PM (#5679603)
So if Paul can't play G7 and the W's take the series, the Warriors will have 1) beaten the Rox w/o CP3 in two critical games 2) the Spurs w/o Kawhi last year and 3) the Cavs mostly w/o Love & Kyrie in 2015. That seems like a heavier than normal dose of injury luck.
   5028. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:36 PM (#5679604)
Ugh. So awful. I've enjoyed watching Paul's ruthlessness. Such a fighter.
   5029. tshipman Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:39 PM (#5679606)
If Stevens is coaching the Warriors the last minute of Game 4, he calls a TO to advance the ball, and has a lights-out ATO play ready to go. Meanwhile, Kerr lounged on the sideline and hoped for the best from an offense that was out of rhythm for most of the game and was particularly awful during the 4th.


Gosh, it must be so much better to win theoretical championships than actual ones.

Btw: This is exactly the kind of post that I'm talking about when I complain about Stevens being overrated.
   5030. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 12:59 PM (#5679624)
Marc Stein @TheSteinLine
The Rockets are naturally going to make these announcements one game at a time, because that’s the right thing to do strategically, but the pessimism emanating from Houston about Paul’s ability to bounce back for a potential Game 7 is unmistakable
   5031. Booey Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:00 PM (#5679625)
As much as it sucks from a competition standpoint to see CP3 miss crucial games with the Finals - and most likely title - on the line...having to make due without your All Star point guard at random and inconvenient times is also just part of the Chris Paul experience. Any team that signs him knows he's not exactly an iron man and this risk is part of the package.
   5032. Fourth True Outcome Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:01 PM (#5679627)
If nothing else, this is as good a chance as James Harden could ask for to salvage his playoff reputation. If he can take a game off of the Warriors without CP3 to make the finals, he can shake off any questions about how "clutch" he is.
   5033. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:24 PM (#5679639)
If Stevens is coaching the Warriors the last minute of Game 4, he calls a TO to advance the ball, and has a lights-out ATO play ready to go. Meanwhile, Kerr lounged on the sideline and hoped for the best from an offense that was out of rhythm for most of the game and was particularly awful during the 4th.

Color me skeptical that he'd have been dumb enough to call timeout and allow the Rockets to substitute for the injured player in the backcourt instead of playing 5-on-4 and getting an uncontested shot.
   5034. Rally Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:25 PM (#5679640)
The Warriors have admitted that they were coasting all season. That's not great, but it isn't necessarily the end of the world in the NBA


Probably the case for every great team in NBA history with a multi-year finals streak.
   5035. Booey Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:43 PM (#5679647)
Probably the case for every great team in NBA history with a multi-year finals streak.


Yep. The Bulls won "only" 57 games in their last title season of the first 3-peat (1993). The Lakers had a good but nothing special 56-58 wins in 5 of Kobe's 7 Finals seasons. LeBron's teams won 60 games just once in his 8 Finals appearances (plus twice in seasons he didn't make the Finals).
   5036. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: May 25, 2018 at 01:59 PM (#5679655)
I don't know who exactly is at fault for this - I think a combination of Harden and D'antoni - but the crazy thing to me was Paul hurt his hamstring and couldn't run back so Golden State got a wide open 3 and Houston was lucky they missed it and got the rebound.

And then instead of calling a timeout (and they had 2!) Harden came down, took a shitty contested off the dribble 3 while Paul was injured in the corner, and they were lucky the ball got knocked out of bounds or Golden State would have played 5-4 again. I really didn't understand what I was watching there.
   5037. Quaker Posted: May 25, 2018 at 02:02 PM (#5679656)
Color me skeptical that he'd have been dumb enough to call timeout and allow the Rockets to substitute for the injured player in the backcourt instead of playing 5-on-4 and getting an uncontested shot.


No one was injured in Game 4.
   5038. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 02:14 PM (#5679658)
No one was injured in Game 4.

I think most NBA coaches (Stevens included) agree that pushing after a miss is a better option than an immediate timeout.

Was there a point before Green passed the ball to Thompson that the transition opportunity was effectively over and a timeout should have been called? I lean towards no. Thompson probably should have called for a timeout immediately once he was trapped in the corner, though. That would have left about 4-5 seconds to get a good shot out of a set play.

The game 5 end of game failures were primarily on Green. First for not calling a timeout immediately after getting the rebound the missed free throw. Second for the turnover on the pass from Curry. He had a miserable last 10 seconds.
   5039. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 02:28 PM (#5679661)
This is hilarious:
Dan Feldman @DanFeldmanNBA
Rockets 3-point shooting in Game 5, by closest defender:

Open or wide open: 27%
Tight or very tight: 40%
   5040. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 03:23 PM (#5679674)
Paolo Uggetti @PaoloUggetti
James Harden needs to show up without CP3, but something to note: The Harden-Ariza-Gordon-Tucker-Capela lineup has posted a +35 net rating in 61 playoff minutes
   5041. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 03:45 PM (#5679681)
I really can't believe Paul is out for the next game. Such a crusher. I think GSW was probably the favorite anyway, but I would love to have seen Houston go for the jugular in game 6.
   5042. zenbitz Posted: May 25, 2018 at 03:45 PM (#5679682)
That 4th quarter last night reminded me why I don't like basketball.
   5043. KronicFatigue Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:07 PM (#5679695)
I only watched the last 6 or so minutes of the game and was shocked by how sloppy it was. I'm sure it's just nostalgia speaking, but I remember 90's Knicks playoff games where turnovers were the result of BRUTAL defense, not just sloppy passes. 24 second violations were earned and rare. Sure, Oakley would lazily throw away an outlet pass every now and again, but I honestly don't recall any games being decided by who threw the ball away less in those 10 years I watched religiously.

EDIT: Reggie Miller game, and I guess that Larry Bird stealing the inbounds play that I only saw in highlights.
   5044. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:20 PM (#5679705)
Eyeballing turnovers per game in the playoffs over the years (back through 96-97), looks like the median (I went with the 8th best team every year) is pretty consistently in the 12-14 per game range. I have no idea how to do that by quarter, so I suppose it's possible all of those were prior to crunch time in the 90s, but I doubt it!
   5045. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:20 PM (#5679706)
Forgot the link to turnovers per game.
   5046. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:26 PM (#5679710)
By percentage of possessions, turnovers have decreased slightly over time in the playoffs by my eyeballing. You have to account for the quicker pace of today's game.
   5047. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:33 PM (#5679712)
and the permissive rules about traveling and carrying in the contemporary game.//old man
   5048. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:53 PM (#5679717)
Golden State would probably turn the ball over even more against those early 90s Eastern Conference thug teams, because they get especially loose with the ball when they're up like 50 points.
   5049. Fourth True Outcome Posted: May 25, 2018 at 04:56 PM (#5679719)
It depends on the rules! If they played with handchecking I'm sure the Dubs would only be up 35.
   5050. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: May 25, 2018 at 05:00 PM (#5679721)
If the Sixers miss out on James and McCollum they should call Washington about Beal.
ymmv, but i'd put beal over mccollum. beal's younger, more athletic and a better defender.


nylon calculus had a nice little writeup about euroleague stats.
Luka Doncic: Obviously enough good things have already been said about the potential No. 1 pick and his dominance in Europe at just 19 years of age. He finished second in EuroLeague in both BPM and VORP and led the ACB in both categories as well — as impressive a resume as is possible for a European prospect.

EuroLeague: +5.1 OBPM, +1.8 DBPM, 2.3 VORP (99th percentile in BPM)

Spanish ACB: +4.7 OBPM, +4.2 DBPM, 2.2 VORP (99th percentile in BPM)

and:
Jonah Bolden: The early second-round pick by the 76ers in 2017 has had a really good stash year in the Israeli BSL and EuroLeague. Bolden’s shooting and offensive impact regressed for last season (negative OBPM in both leagues), but his defensive value was still clear. Bolden would be a good candidate to join the 76ers this offseason as a cheap bench player.

EuroLeague: -0.6 OBPM, +4.3 DBPM, 1.1 VORP (93rd percentile in BPM)

Israeli BSL: -0.6 OBPM, +3.7 DBPM, 0.8 VORP (91st percentile in BPM)
   5051. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 05:14 PM (#5679724)
"Kevin Durant is Iso’ing More Than Russell Westbrook in the 2018 Playoffs and Less Efficiently"
   5052. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: May 25, 2018 at 06:15 PM (#5679737)
It's May and James Harden is underperforming and Chris Paul is injured? Why I never!

OK, that's snarkier than called for, I admit. But this:

Right. Harden is 0 for his last 20 three's. He is going to go off one of these games, and even if the Warriors offense returns, Harden could single-handedly win on of these next two.


Is far more optimistic than is called for, I think. Harden probably couldn't stretch that streak to 30 if he tried, but it's not that likely he's going to catch fire, either.

My expert take is that without Paul the Rockets are ######.

I think were the Rockets my team I would be inclined to go ultra-aggressive even by the Rockets' standards in Game 6: come out doing basically nothing but firing threes, see if you can catch fire and build a big early lead for the refs to spend the next three quarters whittling away at (sorry).

But the trouble with the "Rest Harden if you're down by double digits in the third" strategy is that Golden State gets to make substitutions, too. Pull Harden to rest him for Game 7 and Kerr doubtless will do likewise with Curry and Durant. Not sure there's a way the Rockets can come out ahead with a rest-the-star strategy when Golden State has more stars.
   5053. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 06:20 PM (#5679740)
Man in the Arena, PASTE. You're better than that!
   5054. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: May 25, 2018 at 06:31 PM (#5679742)
I'm really not. :)
   5055. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 07:47 PM (#5679749)
"Entering his 99th game of the season, in his 15th year, LeBron James not only leads the @NBA in minutes. He’s now played 398 more minutes, 12 percent more, than the next guy on the list."
   5056. Harlond Posted: May 25, 2018 at 08:45 PM (#5679769)
George Hill made his first shot, gotta like the Cavs' chances.
   5057. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: May 25, 2018 at 08:52 PM (#5679773)
Kevin Love and Tatum knocked heads sharply. This is terrible: Love is down, and he's had several concussions already. Each takes less of a hit than the last—I hope he's okay. I'd prefer Tatum keep his brain in good condition, too, not that I was consulted.
   5058. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: May 25, 2018 at 08:54 PM (#5679774)
Van Gundy, after the head knock:
How there was not a foul on that, I don't know.
I'll take the no-call, but I agreed with this one more than most.
   5059. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:08 PM (#5679784)
Doubling Horford seems like a bad plan in theory and is working out badly in practice, too.
   5060. KronicFatigue Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:18 PM (#5679802)
Should a player be credited with an assist if the person he passed to draws a shooting foul? Why or why not?
   5061. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:23 PM (#5679808)
"Cavs have outscored the Cs 34-23 since Kevin Love left the game with a head injury."

Turnovers killing the Celtics in the first half. Cavs only have one (a reverse of how this series has mostly gone so far).
   5062. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:28 PM (#5679813)
Should a player be credited with an assist if the person he passed to draws a shooting foul?
Each ref should give the pass a rating on aesthetics from 0.0 to 10.0, and only if the mean score is ≥ 1 standard deviation above the rolling average from the last 30 games should it be an assist.

What? The question was "should".
   5063. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:40 PM (#5679827)
James plays the whole first half. 25, 5, 5.
   5064. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:47 PM (#5679834)
Al Horford needs to play himself off the milk carton in the second half.
   5065. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 09:47 PM (#5679835)
Apparently Love is done for the night, still being evaluated for a concussion.

Al Horford needs to play himself off the milk carton in the second half.

Tatum, too.
   5066. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:03 PM (#5679846)
More old guy stuff: All this bad basketball makes me think the Bulls roll these teams.
   5067. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:03 PM (#5679847)
Cleveland's in the bonus with over 9 minutes left?

Despite the refs, Boston really can look young and immature on the road.
   5068. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:05 PM (#5679849)
The Bulls may roll these Eastern teams, but who is Bill Wennington and Steve Kerr and John Paxson guarding against Golden State? ####### no one, that's who.
   5069. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:06 PM (#5679850)
Boston really can look young and immature on the road.

Tatum in particular is having a deer-in-headlights game so far (though he just hit a couple shots, so we'll see).

And yeah, I think it's understood that this year's Eastern Conference did not have a team as good as the Jordan Bulls.
   5070. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:06 PM (#5679851)
They're also a team giving significant minutes to Rozier and Morris. They're not that talented without Irving and Hayward (which is why a lot of people give Stevens credit).
   5071. KronicFatigue Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:09 PM (#5679853)
So is there any value in the "swatting" motion of a block attempt as opposed to just being as long as possible... Like a pole. Every time I see a player block a shot out of bounds it looks like the defender could have maintained possession just by taping the ball
   5072. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:09 PM (#5679854)
The Bulls may roll these Eastern teams, but who is Bill Wennington and Steve Kerr and John Paxson guarding against Golden State? ####### no one, that's who.


Nonsense. First, there's a kind of implied racism in singling out all the white guys. Why couldn't Kerr and Paxson chase Thompson around? And I like the matchups Pippen, Jordan, Rodman, and Harper provide. They'd roll 'em right the #### up.
   5073. JC in DC Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:12 PM (#5679856)
And to be clear, I meant ALL the bad basketball, not just this bad basketball.
   5074. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:17 PM (#5679860)
Nonsense. First, there's a kind of implied racism in singling out all the white guys. Why couldn't Kerr and Paxson chase Thompson around? And I like the matchups Pippen, Jordan, Rodman, and Harper provide. They'd roll 'em right the #### up.

Bill Cartwright would also be wearing oversized clownshoes in such a series. He'd be getting shimmied on the regular.
   5075. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:17 PM (#5679862)
Jeff Green having one of those once-every-several-months Jeff Green games.
   5076. smileyy Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:17 PM (#5679863)
Minus the obligatory stiff in the center, the second generation Bulls would have / did have a fearsome switch-everything defense. Timelining and all, but they'd have some trouble spacing the floor in the modern NBA.
   5077. Howie Menckel Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:18 PM (#5679864)
Every time I see a player block a shot out of bounds it looks like the defender could have maintained possession just by taping the ball

ask Bill Russell about that before he dies. was a pet peeve of his
   5078. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:25 PM (#5679867)
They're also a team giving significant minutes to Rozier and Morris.

Rozier with 23 through three, plus 6 assists. (Morris, on the other hand...)
   5079. nick swisher hygiene Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:25 PM (#5679868)
Yeah, the 3-point divide is....hard to understand. Is it like the HR divide in baseball? So Jordan's Bulls just look closer to the present, but they're really like some pre 1920s Cubs team: they were playing a different game...
   5080. smileyy Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:53 PM (#5679879)
LeBron gonna LeBron
   5081. PJ Martinez Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:53 PM (#5679880)
Man, those threes... not really anything you can do about that.
   5082. Tin Angel Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:54 PM (#5679881)
LeBron is pretty good.
   5083. SteveF Posted: May 25, 2018 at 10:54 PM (#5679882)
The game was won/lost in the second quarter.
   5084. smileyy Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:09 PM (#5679883)
46/11/9 on 52% shooting. F'ing unreal.
   5085. KronicFatigue Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:14 PM (#5679884)
The narrative is now prefect for LeBron to go to Philly next year. He gave everything to Cleveland, and almost single handedly took them to another finals. Now he can go to Philly and chase rings without it looking like it.
   5086. greenback took the 110 until the 105 Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:15 PM (#5679886)
LeBron is pretty good.

Yes. Yes, he is.
   5087. jmurph Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:18 PM (#5679887)
The game was won/lost in the second quarter.

Yeah the upside is they somehow kept it reasonably close despite the disastrous 2nd quarter and the super human LeBron performance, and twice had the ball down 7 around the 6 and 4 minute marks of the 4th.

The downside is LeBron will also feature in game 7, last I checked. I don't love that.
   5088. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:40 PM (#5679892)
They're also a team giving significant minutes to Rozier and Morris. They're not that talented without Irving and Hayward (which is why a lot of people give Stevens credit).

rozier had a +2 BPM this year and he's up to +4.5 in the playoffs (for some reference, kyrie's playoff BPM was +4.8 when he won the title with lebron).

even without kyrie and hayward, BOS has a full max player (horford), two top 3 picks (brown, tatum) and two other top 16 picks (rozier, smart).

really though, my biggest takeaway from this series is that the sixers stabbed themselves in the dick in the last minute of two different games against BOS, they blew a 20 point first half lead in another game, and they shot 31% from beyond the arc for the series. this was here for the taking, and they ###### it up over nothing. ####.
The narrative is now prefect for LeBron to go to Philly next year. He gave everything to Cleveland, and almost single handedly took them to another finals. Now he can go to Philly and chase rings without it looking like it.
let's hope he still has two intact MCL's by the time that can happen.


   5089. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:45 PM (#5679893)

Bill Cartwright would also be wearing oversized clownshoes in such a series. He'd be getting shimmied on the regular.


First 3 peat, not the 2nd.
   5090. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: May 25, 2018 at 11:47 PM (#5679894)
LeBron in elimination games since 2011:
45-15-5
31-12-2
32-8-4
32-10-11
37-12-4
31-10-5
32-18-9
41-16-7
41-8-11
27-11-11
31-10-11
41-13-8
45-8-7

46-11-9 tonight.
   5091. smileyy Posted: May 26, 2018 at 12:10 AM (#5679901)
The bum only has 3 triple doubles in all of those.
   5092. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: May 26, 2018 at 12:17 AM (#5679904)
I don't know what to say about LeBron that already hasn't been said. A few times in that game I thought he looked exhausted and then he'd hit a dagger three or just drive to the basket and make a great play.

Rozier and Brown had awesome games. Horford and Tatum were largely invisible.

Jeff Green is just so irritating to watch sometimes. He looks like he should be a really good player but sometimes he's very often useless.

It is surprising to me that veteran players like Horford and Hill, guys who are experienced and talented players, play so differently on the road than at home.
   5093. Howie Menckel Posted: May 26, 2018 at 01:08 AM (#5679908)
ah, Seattle-Washington


Marc Kestecher
‏Verified account @marckestecher
2h2 hours ago

Cavs force a game 7. Warriors look to do likewise tomorrow. We haven’t had BOTH conference finals go 7 games since 1979.
   5094. maccoach57 Posted: May 26, 2018 at 01:43 AM (#5679911)
I see Paul will miss G6. I don't think Paul playing G6 on a twitchy hamstring would have been a good call in any case. Get it as close to 100% as you can for G7 and try to take down GS at home. If you get down 20 or so in G6, sit Harden.

My gut says that James will not let Cleveland lose Game 7, but I may be underrating HCA, Boston's young combo forward guys, and Stevens.
   5095. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: May 26, 2018 at 02:59 AM (#5679914)
The Bulls may roll these Eastern teams, but who is Bill Wennington and Steve Kerr and John Paxson guarding against Golden State? ####### no one, that's who.

Bill Cartwright would also be wearing oversized clownshoes in such a series. He'd be getting shimmied on the regular.

The idea that the Bulls would somehow be obligated to play guys who were on the roster solely to guard the post and absorb fouls in a post-dominated era is absurd. The least mobile players who'd see regular action would probably be Kukoc and Dele, backed by a switching swarm of Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, Harper, Buechler and Burrell. Randy Brown might get sent out to harass Curry for 10 minutes a night. Defense would be the least of that team's worries.
   5096. PJ Martinez Posted: May 26, 2018 at 08:55 AM (#5679935)
Apparently the last time both Conference Finals went to seven games was 1979. Kind of surprised it's been that long.
   5097. . . . . . . Posted: May 26, 2018 at 10:15 AM (#5679942)
The basketball has been so bad I think that everyone would’ve preferred shorter series. Last night was brutal.
   5098. Davo's Favorite Tacos Are Moose Tacos Posted: May 26, 2018 at 11:01 AM (#5679948)
Is there any sort of serious push for a shorter regular season, or is it just cranks on the Internet? These guys are looking at 100+ games by the time the Finals come around—it’s starting to show!
   5099. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: May 26, 2018 at 11:21 AM (#5679950)
Is there any sort of serious push for a shorter regular season, or is it just cranks on the Internet? These guys are looking at 100+ games by the time the Finals come around—it’s starting to show!


I think everyone is on board with a shorter regular season except the owners, who will allow such a thing over their dead bloated corpses.
   5100. sardonic Posted: May 26, 2018 at 11:40 AM (#5679951)
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