Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Wednesday, May 30, 2018

OT - 2018 NBA Summer Potpourri (finals, draft, free agency, Colangelo dragging)

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, none of whom can be bothered to curate their own thread to avoid detracting from what this site is really about:  complaints about mayonnaise.


EDIT: image is shrunken. Mouse over to show full size. -vi

Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: May 30, 2018 at 12:56 AM | 1396 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: basketball, nba, off-topic

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 9 of 14 pages ‹ First  < 7 8 9 10 11 >  Last ›
   801. stevegamer Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:37 PM (#5691801)
I feel this misses the (big) second point of my argument - what Lebron will want. Could the Cavs offense be fine with Jordan instead of Love? Probably, Lebron is just that good. Will Lebron want to be on an offense that goes "hey, can you do even more work on this end?". That sales pitch to him will last about five seconds. Swapping Love for Jordan is unequivocally not the answer to how to take some of the burden off Lebron's shoulders. Yes, even with Jordan's defense being that good (against non-Warrior teams).


You're also missing the point that it doesn't have to be LeBron initiating the offense. If they have a good initiator on their roster, or can find one, they can run pick & roll with the offense while LeBron rests.

One issue is that what LeBron wants is often not the best thing for the team. The Heatles worked, but this set of guys he wanted, apparently including JR Smith hasn't worked nearly so well. Part of that is because the Heat had a good coach & GM who LeBron had to listen to, and they had good role players to fit. The Cavs have had a big 3 of Irving, Love, & James, and that was fine. Then they had a big 2, and it was barely enough to get out of the first round.

You show him the plan to fix the sieve like defense and the offense when he sits, because those things suck. The rest of the plan is "you're LeBron James, and you had to carry this team way too much last year on both ends of the floor. He's a smart enough guy to understand that.



I admit of thinking of Jordan as both a roll man and (erroneously, apparently) as a post-up threat, when he's really more of a putback guy with his roll offense. So maybe somebody with a plan to ell,

   802. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:40 PM (#5691804)
@Votto, how about Denver's 2019 1st rounder (top-4 protected), Mason Plumlee, and Malik Beasley for Ian Mahinmi and #15? EDIT- Or we could just do Denver's 2019 1st rounder (top-4 protected) and #43 for #15.

@Oriole, Harris is an adequate defender (better than Murray) but the team defense really struggles due to the overall lack of athleticism and length.

I thought he would be around for the Lakers at 25. Now if Melton works out in the NBA, Dandy can have ultimate bragging rights. On the other hand, if he doesn't work out, we know who to mock.

I'm probably overconfident after pulling the same stunt with Jordan Bell last year. I look forward to Melton being drafted 2-3 more times.
   803. MHS Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:40 PM (#5691805)
Melton’s role. Definitely can guard 1’s and can switch probably out to 3’s.

On offense he stands in the weak side corner at least initially.
   804. Athletic Supporter wants to move your money around Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:43 PM (#5691808)
Reposting for flip. Adding mike f who signed up for the Blazers. Votto / Washington with #15 on the clock.

FIRST ROUND
1. Magic (from PHO) - Athletic Supporter - Luka Doncic, G, Real Madrid
2. Kings - smileyy - Deandre Ayton, F/C, Arizona
3. Hawks - Der-K - Jaren Jackson Jr., F/C, Michigan State (to DAL for #5)
4. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball - Michael Porter Jr., F, Missouri
5. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL) - Mohamed Bamba - C, Texas
6. Suns (from ORL) - Oriole Tragic - Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
7. Bulls - Moses - Marvin Bagley III, F/C, Duke
8. Cavs - stevegamer - Mikal Bridges, F/G, Villanova
9. Knicks - NJ/JC - Trae Young, G, Oklahoma
10. 76ers - 57i66135 - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, G, Kentucky
11. Hornets - Berg - Lonnie Walker, G/F, Miami
12. Clippers - Thok - Robert Williams, C/F, Texas A&M
13. Suns (from LAC via CLE) - Oriole Tragic - Zhaire Smith, F/G, Texas Tech
14. Nuggets - Dandy - De'Anthony Melton, G, USC
15. Wizards - Votto
16. Suns - Oriole Tragic
17. Bucks - Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw
18. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
19. Hawks - Der-K
20. Timberwolves - Mouse
21. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
22. Bulls - Moses
23. Pacers - Paste
24. Trailblazers - mike f
25. Lakers - Hombre/rr
26. 76ers - 57i66135
27. Celtics - MHS
28. Warriors - sardonic
29. Nets - JJ1986
30. Hawks - Der-K

SECOND ROUND
31. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
32. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball
33. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL)
34. Hawks - Der-K
35. Suns - Oriole Tragic (from ORL)
36. Knicks - NJ/JC
37. Kings - smileyy
38. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless (from PHI)
39. 76ers - 57i66135
40. Nets - JJ1986
41. Magic - Athletic Supporter
42. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless
43. Nuggets - Dandy
44. Wizards -Votto
45. Nets - JJ1986
46. Rockets
47. Lakers - Hombre/rr
48. Timberwolves - Mouse
49. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
50. Pacers - Paste
51. Pelicans
52. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
53. Thunder - Fridas Boss
54. Mavericks - tshipman
55. Hornets - Berg
56. 76ers - 57i66135
57. Thunder - Fridas Boss
58. Nuggets - Dandy
59. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
60. 76ers - 57i66135

Trades:
ORL gets: #1 overall
PHO gets: #6 overall, ORL 2019-1 (unprotected)

LAC gets: Kevin Love
CLE gets: DeAndre Jordan, #13 overall

DET gets: Dario Saric, Jerryd Bayless, #38
PHI gets: Andre Drummond (!)

DAL gets: Jaren Jackson Jr., Dennis Schroder, Miles Plumlee
ATL gets: #5 and #33 overall, Wesley Matthews

ORL gets: #31 and #59 overall, Brandon Knight, Tyson Chandler
PHO gets: #35 overall, Bismack Biyombo, Terrence Ross

PHO gets: #13 overall, JR Smith
CLE gets: Marquese Chriss, Terrence Ross
   805. stevegamer Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:49 PM (#5691810)
751. MIKAL BRIDGES: I like him as a 3-and-D wing player, but with him being 21 you have to figure the upside is limited. He looks likely to be basically Robert Covington: providing good switchy defense, the ability to hit the spot-up three if he's left open out there, and that's about it. In theory that makes him comfortably a lottery pick this year, but in practice he'll fit in far better working his way into a decent team's rotation than being expected to be an upcoming star on a bad team. If he slid past pick 7 or so I'd start thinking about trading up from the mid-late first for him.


The bolded is a major part of my thinking, although his tape shows more than Covington's good switchy defense, it's really disruptive. I have heard him compared to Iguodala on D, and even if that's a bit of a stretch, the eye test says it's not too far off.

Having this mock before the player opt-ins and such meant we had to go with what we thought would happen, so it adds to the degree of difficulty.

Cavs are out of picks, but are willing to reshape the team, pick up a 2nd rounder, or something along those lines.
   806. tshipman Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:51 PM (#5691813)
On offense he stands in the weak side corner at least initially.


Not if he shoots 28% from 3... that is Roberson-esque.

I mean, the boring answer is that you use him on ugly bench lineups or in garbage time until you figure out what the hell you can do with him.
   807. tshipman Posted: June 13, 2018 at 10:56 PM (#5691817)
751. MIKAL BRIDGES: I like him as a 3-and-D wing player, but with him being 21 you have to figure the upside is limited. He looks likely to be basically Robert Covington: providing good switchy defense, the ability to hit the spot-up three if he's left open out there, and that's about it. In theory that makes him comfortably a lottery pick this year, but in practice he'll fit in far better working his way into a decent team's rotation than being expected to be an upcoming star on a bad team. If he slid past pick 7 or so I'd start thinking about trading up from the mid-late first for him.


The bolded is a major part of my thinking, although his tape shows more than Covington's good switchy defense, it's really disruptive. I have heard him compared to Iguodala on D, and even if that's a bit of a stretch, the eye test says it's not too far off.


This is not a criticism of you, Stevegamer, but oh my goodness, what a disappointment for the Cavs if all they get out of Kyrie Irving is a 22 year old 3 and D player.

Again, I'm blaming Koby Altman and Dan Gilbert here.
   808. MHS Posted: June 13, 2018 at 11:16 PM (#5691823)
Not if he shoots 28% from 3... that is Roberson-esque.


The one thing, I think works for him over the Roberson types or Semi Ojeleye in Boston last year is he does have a handle so he can drive and also pass. Passing especially, so if you do leave him alone he doesn't need to brick it. He can attack or find a cutter.

I like Melton, I think he can pretend to fill a role now. With that said for him to have a role for a good team his shot needs to come around. To be clear this IMHO is a big overdraft. The biggest in the draft so far.

The problem is even if his shot comes around he is only a starting quality player. I loved him in the late 20's.

To be clear i don't think this was particularly good value. He is almost certainly the worst player selected thus far and their are several wings and initiators who I think are probably better.

   809. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: June 13, 2018 at 11:21 PM (#5691828)
One issue is that what LeBron wants is often not the best thing for the team. The Heatles worked, but this set of guys he wanted, apparently including JR Smith hasn't worked nearly so well.
I think Lebron would DEFINITELY want DeAndre Jordan on his team, and if he could swap Love to get Jordan, he'd do it in a heartbeat.

I really like what Stevegamer's done in our fake draft. I'm iffy on Bridges, but Ross is a good fit and plays defense, Chriss is young and athletic and away of Phoenix might finally get a chance to develop, and Jordan fills a desperate need. The Cavs were a top-5 offensive team last year but the second-worst defense in the NBA. Cleveland should happily — HAPPILY — trade some offense for a significant upgrade on defense. If Lebron stays, I think this version of the 2019 Cavs is an improvement over the current version.
   810. stevegamer Posted: June 13, 2018 at 11:39 PM (#5691835)
This is not a criticism of you, Stevegamer, but oh my goodness, what a disappointment for the Cavs if all they get out of Kyrie Irving is a 22 year old 3 and D player.

Again, I'm blaming Koby Altman and Dan Gilbert here.


Well, it's a bit more complicated than that, and they got more than just that, but still it's close.

Out: Irving

In: Ante Zizic, 2018 1st round #8 pick, a 2020 2nd round draft pick
In but dealt on: Thomas, Crowder (unsure which 2020 pick was dealt)

Out in Thomas/Crowder deals: Thomas, Crowder, Rose, Shumpert, 2018 1st round #25 pick, 2020 & 2024 2nd round picks, $2.1M cash and a Eurostash player.
In from Thomas/Crowder deal: Clarkson, Hood, Hill, Nance Jr, and a Eurostash player.

Net Out: Irving, Rose, Shumpert, 2018 1st round #25 pick, 2024 2nd round pick, $2.1M cash
Net in: Zizic, Clarkson, Hood, Hill, Nance Jr, 2018 1st round #8 pick

So it's +17 spots in the draft, plus an assortment of players that aren't better than Irving, but are likely more useful than Rose/Shumpert. Not a great haul, but it's what happens when an All-Star is disgruntled and forces his way out of town.
   811. stevegamer Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:03 AM (#5691847)
Speaking of Kyrie, I just realized Uncle Drew is heading to the big screen. Could be this generation's Space Jam, but without nearly as much comedic talent.
   812. Booey Posted: June 14, 2018 at 01:33 AM (#5691859)
Could be this generation's Space Jam


Not sure if that's a good thing or not. Space Jam was pretty bad (although Bill Murray's line, "Larry's not white. Larry's clear," was pretty funny).

An entertainingly bad NBA movie that often gets overlooked is Like Mike, with Lil Bow Wow. It's basically just the basketball version of the early 90's baseball film Rookie of the Year, but it features an impressive cast of early 2000's NBA superstars (Dirk, Nash, Admiral, Payton, Kidd, Webber, 'Zo, Iverson, VC, TMac, etc).
   813. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:27 AM (#5691875)
@Votto New offer. Trey Lyles and Denver's 2019 1st rounder (top-4 protected) for #15. This past season Lyles shot 38% from 3 on high volume, averaged 19 and 9 per 36, and is still just 22.
   814. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: June 14, 2018 at 07:55 AM (#5691885)
Dandy, I accept your trade. Lyles probably does not have the upside of the guy I was looking at (Knox), but Washington is in win-now mode, and needs frontcourt help. Denver's pick next year will likely be in the same range as this pick.

FIRST ROUND
1. Magic (from PHO) - Athletic Supporter - Luka Doncic, G, Real Madrid
2. Kings - smileyy - Deandre Ayton, F/C, Arizona
3. Hawks - Der-K - Jaren Jackson Jr., F/C, Michigan State (to DAL for #5)
4. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball - Michael Porter Jr., F, Missouri
5. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL) - Mohamed Bamba - C, Texas
6. Suns (from ORL) - Oriole Tragic - Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
7. Bulls - Moses - Marvin Bagley III, F/C, Duke
8. Cavs - stevegamer - Mikal Bridges, F/G, Villanova
9. Knicks - NJ/JC - Trae Young, G, Oklahoma
10. 76ers - 57i66135 - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, G, Kentucky
11. Hornets - Berg - Lonnie Walker, G/F, Miami
12. Clippers - Thok - Robert Williams, C/F, Texas A&M
13. Suns (from LAC via CLE) - Oriole Tragic - Zhaire Smith, F/G, Texas Tech
14. Nuggets - Dandy - De'Anthony Melton, G, USC
15. NUGGETS (from Wizards) - Dandy
16. Suns - Oriole Tragic
17. Bucks - Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw
18. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
19. Hawks - Der-K
20. Timberwolves - Mouse
21. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
22. Bulls - Moses
23. Pacers - Paste
24. Trailblazers - mike f
25. Lakers - Hombre/rr
26. 76ers - 57i66135
27. Celtics - MHS
28. Warriors - sardonic
29. Nets - JJ1986
30. Hawks - Der-K

SECOND ROUND
31. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
32. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball
33. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL)
34. Hawks - Der-K
35. Suns - Oriole Tragic (from ORL)
36. Knicks - NJ/JC
37. Kings - smileyy
38. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless (from PHI)
39. 76ers - 57i66135
40. Nets - JJ1986
41. Magic - Athletic Supporter
42. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless
43. Nuggets - Dandy
44. Wizards -Votto
45. Nets - JJ1986
46. Rockets
47. Lakers - Hombre/rr
48. Timberwolves - Mouse
49. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
50. Pacers - Paste
51. Pelicans
52. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
53. Thunder - Fridas Boss
54. Mavericks - tshipman
55. Hornets - Berg
56. 76ers - 57i66135
57. Thunder - Fridas Boss
58. Nuggets - Dandy
59. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
60. 76ers - 57i66135

Trades:
ORL gets: #1 overall
PHO gets: #6 overall, ORL 2019-1 (unprotected)

LAC gets: Kevin Love
CLE gets: DeAndre Jordan, #13 overall

DET gets: Dario Saric, Jerryd Bayless, #38
PHI gets: Andre Drummond (!)

DAL gets: Jaren Jackson Jr., Dennis Schroder, Miles Plumlee
ATL gets: #5 and #33 overall, Wesley Matthews

ORL gets: #31 and #59 overall, Brandon Knight, Tyson Chandler
PHO gets: #35 overall, Bismack Biyombo, Terrence Ross

PHO gets: #13 overall, JR Smith
CLE gets: Marquese Chriss, Terrence Ross

DEN: gets #15 pick
WAS: gets Trey Lyles, DEN 2019 first-rounder
   815. JC in DC Posted: June 14, 2018 at 08:09 AM (#5691889)
Why is Washington in win now mode?

[ed] or, to put it differently, win WHAT now mode?
   816. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: June 14, 2018 at 08:35 AM (#5691893)
   817. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:08 AM (#5691907)
Washington is way over the cap, so I think you have to send someone (Meeks?) back to make that trade work.
   818. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:13 AM (#5691910)
I’ll accept old, suspended, unwanted Jodie Meeks for cap purposes.

Does Votto need to reapprove the trade or should I proceed with my pick?
   819. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:17 AM (#5691913)
Does Votto need to reapprove the trade or should I proceed with my pick?
I can't imagine he would be against dumping Meeks.
   820. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:26 AM (#5691921)
Dandy, how about this adjustment (works per the Trade Machine, in line with your suggestion in #802):

Nuggets get: #15 pick, Mahinmi
Wizards get: 2019 #1, Lyles, Mas. Plumlee

It would be fun to simulate a season with all these re-configured teams.
   821. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:46 AM (#5691934)
I'd rather keep it the way it was, just adding Meeks's dead salary. Don't want to go too crazy messing with the team continuity, if that's alright with you.
   822. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:55 AM (#5691942)
thoughts on picks:
williams: i'm not surprised he went early. he's a guy that analytics guys love, and this board is more analytically inclined than most.

melton: we don't know how much he may have improved from last year because we didn't see him play, which makes him an interesting upside play. it's higher than i'd go, but not unbelievably so.

walker: a bunch of guys in this draft class are being compared to donovan mitchell, but i think walker is the only one who has enough wiggle to make the comp stick. i don't love him, but it's not hard to see how other people might.


just a heads up:
assuming the guy i want is still there, i'm willing to package #26, #39, and luwawu or korkmaz to get on the clock. i'm also willing to eat a contract assuming it and/or the player isn't terrible.
   823. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:57 AM (#5691946)
Atlanta has cap room to eat bad contracts... just sayin' folks
   824. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:59 AM (#5691948)
assuming the guy i want is still there, i'm willing to package #26, #39, and luwawu or korkmaz to get on the clock.

There's a way to go until 22, but we can talk about something if your guy is still there then.
   825. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:03 AM (#5691953)
Offers for Portland:

Brooklyn gets: #24, Meyers Leonard
Portland gets: #45
or
Brooklyn gets: #24, Meyers Leonard, Moe Harkless
Portland gets: #45, DeMarre Carroll
or
Brooklyn gets: #24, Evan Turner
Portland gets: #45, Jeremy Lin
or
Brooklyn gets: #24, Evan Turner
Portland gets: DeMarre Carroll
   826. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:04 AM (#5691954)
Cleveland should happily — HAPPILY — trade some offense for a significant upgrade on defense.

Agree with Hombre, I think a Love/DeAndre swap would significantly improve Cleveland. I don't think that's enough- they couldn't stop there and call it a summer- but it would be a good move.
   827. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:06 AM (#5691958)
PHO is willing to deal #16.
   828. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:08 AM (#5691959)
Okay, deal. (Meeks + #15) for (Lyles + Denver's 2019 first).

to put it differently, win WHAT now mode?


Right or wrong, the Wiz have committed to their core of Beal (24), Wall (27), and Porter (24)*. Lyles (22) fits their timeline better, and can be a rotation player for okay-to-good teams. For sure, bottom-half playoff seeds in the East aren't the greatest thing in the world, and frankly, with their talent, they've definitely underperformed.

Knox is intriguing, but I'm not in love with anyone at this point, and Denver's 2019 pick will likely be in the same 10-15 range.

*That contract is scary, and I'd be looking to move Wall if they could.
   829. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:13 AM (#5691964)
@Votto that's a nice deal for you. No way that DEN ends up with a pick higher than #5 next year. They're supposed to be shooting for the playoffs.

I feel like Lyles should be a pretty good player, even if he hasn't shown as much, yet.
   830. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:31 AM (#5691982)
Right or wrong, the Wiz have committed to their core of Beal (24), Wall (27), and Porter (24)*. Lyles (22) fits their timeline better, and can be a rotation player for okay-to-good teams. For sure, bottom-half playoff seeds in the East aren't the greatest thing in the world, and frankly, with their talent, they've definitely underperformed.

Knox is intriguing, but I'm not in love with anyone at this point, and Denver's 2019 pick will likely be in the same 10-15 range.

*That contract is scary, and I'd be looking to move Wall if they could.
i wouldn't worry about porter at all. he's a good defender, he spreads the floor, he doesn't turn the ball over or make poor decisions. he's only 25 and his contract only runs 2 more years, plus a player option.

wall's contract has franchise crippling potential, though. you can't trust him with the ball at the end of games, he makes poor decisions, he doesn't make his teammates better, his teammates don't seem to like him, and from ages 29-32, he'll cost 38MM, 41MM, 44MM, 48MM.
   831. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:33 AM (#5691985)
Okay, deal. (Meeks + #15) for (Lyles + Denver's 2019 first).

Awesome. The Denver Nuggets select Miles Bridges, F, Michigan St

To be perfectly honest, for some reason I thought that Miles Bridges was already taken. Otherwise I would’ve selected him at 14 and tried to trade up for Melton. I guess that’s why NBA teams have draft boards, get input from multiple people, and focus exclusively on the draft while it’s happening.

Further explanation to follow.
   832. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:43 AM (#5691990)
Wall is a problem. It isn't that he isn't good. He is. The problem is that is all he is. Good. And the resources he demands both on the court (touched) and off the court (cap space) is crippling.

John Wall is purgatory.

He just isn't good enough to drive a team to a better finish, and he requires too much ball and too much cap space to get enough production from other spots.


   833. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:44 AM (#5691991)
Dandy, congrats you got the good bridges!
   834. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:45 AM (#5691993)
I wondered how far Miles Bridges would fall. He *was* #8 on The Ringer board until yesterday, and he's #11 on the HoopsHype aggregate board. I wasn't planning on taking him at #16.
   835. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:46 AM (#5691995)
Awesome. The Denver Nuggets select Miles Bridges, F, Michigan St

just a heads up:
assuming the guy i want is still there, i'm willing to package #26, #39, and luwawu or korkmaz to get on the clock. i'm also willing to eat a contract assuming it and/or the player isn't terrible.
aaaaaaaaand he's gone.

that was quick.
   836. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:50 AM (#5691998)
i wouldn't worry about porter at all. he's a good defender, he spreads the floor, he doesn't turn the ball over or make poor decisions. he's only 25 and his contract only runs 2 more years, plus a player option.

For 26, 27, 28.5, it's a huge, huge problem. That contract is approaching untradeable (he also has a 15% trade kicker, so it's basically 30 a year)- they could probably move him but not for a favorable return.
   837. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:03 AM (#5692019)
For 26, 27, 28.5, it's a huge, huge problem. That contract is approaching untradeable (he also has a 15% trade kicker, so it's basically 30 a year)- they could probably move him but not for a favorable return.


I couldn't disagree more. Porter is the best player on the team. They shouldn't be looking to move him.

Wall is the problem.
   838. mike f Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:09 AM (#5692025)
JJ, I'm very interested in dumping Turner, but there are some guys I like that might be around at 24. What's the status of your proposal in 699?
   839. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:11 AM (#5692030)
I couldn't disagree more. Porter is the best player on the team. They shouldn't be looking to move him.

Wall is the problem.


Wall is a problem. Mahinmi is also a problem. Brooks is probably a problem. They have a lot of problems, let's not choose just one!

I also didn't say they should be looking to move Porter. I like Porter and what he brings; I also believe very strongly you can't pay supporting players that kind of money.*

And I think Beal is pretty clearly their best player.

*Unless your main guys are much better than Wall/Beal.
   840. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:29 AM (#5692056)
I also didn't say they should be looking to move Porter. I like Porter and what he brings; I also believe very strongly you can't pay supporting players that kind of money.


He isn't a best guy on a championship caliber team. They don't have that guy. They don't even have a second best player on a championship team guy right now. Maybe Beale has the skills to be it but he hasn't statistically produced at that level. Is a 3rd banana in a championship caliber team worth that kind of money?

The third guy on finals teams over the last 2 decades production has been clustered around 8 win shares, which is what Porter has produced. Intuitively it is reasonable that the one of the best shooting, switching, defending wings in the league who has some handle is an 8 win share player.

And I think Beal is pretty clearly their best player.


He hasn't;t been by the box score or on/off metrics in either of the last two years. I understand why you would think that, when I watch the Wizards it looks like he should be their best player but he just hasn't produced as much as Porter.

I get that its weird to have the third guy before you have THE guy and you need to have paths to getting THE GUY and really their only path to that right now is the draft but that doesn't make Porter the problem.

They should be trying to sucker the kings or the knicks to whomever into trading for Wall but that ship may have sailed.
   841. Athletic Supporter wants to move your money around Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:33 AM (#5692063)
I think Votto has it right. The Wizards are probably ######, but the only scenario in which they aren't ###### is the one in which the Wall/Beal/Porter nucleus takes a step forward. They can't really blow it up, so it feels right to bet on that scenario, however unlikely it may be.
   842. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:38 AM (#5692067)
Intuitively it is reasonable that the one of the best shooting, switching, defending wings in the league who has some handle

I think this is a big oversell on Porter's actual output. He scores 14 points a game, only takes 4 threes. His USG is 18. 91% of his 3s are assisted. He creates no offense for anyone else. He is exactly the kind of player that gets overrated in these metrics.

(Also, again, I actually like Porter, he's good.)

EDIT: He took 8 shots a game in the Raptors series! Scored 10ppg.
   843. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:39 AM (#5692070)
For 26, 27, 28.5, it's a huge, huge problem. That contract is approaching untradeable (he also has a 15% trade kicker, so it's basically 30 a year)- they could probably move him but not for a favorable return.

you're acting like he's wiggins or barnes or aaron gordon; he's not.


i wonder if there's a deal to make between WAS, ORL and CHA. something like:
ORL: batum, mahinmi, oubre, #11, #15
CHA: wall, fournier
WAS: kemba, vucevic, ross, marvin williams


wall seems like the kind of star that CHA usually chases, and the team around him would actually be pretty close to ideal with a bunch of 3 and/or D forwards/wings that don't need/want to handle the ball (fournier, MKG, lamb, monk, zeller, kaminsky, howard)

WAS would get some needed depth, versatility and shooting, and kemba can't be less willing than wall to share playmaking responsibilities with beal.

ORL would create an interesting/ish young core. gordon/oubre/isaac, maybe trae young at #6, zhaire smith at #11 and robert williams at #15.
   844. stevegamer Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:43 AM (#5692077)
Anyone have interest in Tristan Thompson or Kyle Korver?
(ducks, just in case)
   845. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:46 AM (#5692080)
you're acting like he's wiggins or barnes or aaron gordon; he's not.

I don't how many times I have to say that I think he's good, but here's another one: I think he's good.
   846. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:00 PM (#5692095)
Porter may be their best regular season player, but Wall seems to be their best playoff performer. Wall's quickness is elite and can generate offense. IMO Porter's defense is good but not elite, and his offense seems to take a hit in the playoffs because he can't create his shot very well.

I also think it's easy to blame the Wall/Beal/Porter core, and that almost certainly is not a good enough core to win a title, but looking at the 82games stuff, it seems like the real issue is those guys are pretty darn good, the problem is the rest of their team. They don't have good big man play, their bench is weak, and they don't shoot enough 3s.
   847. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:06 PM (#5692101)
They don't have good big man play, their bench is weak, and they don't shoot enough 3s.

Good points. I like the fake Lyles trade that Votto made above.
   848. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:10 PM (#5692105)
Anyone have interest in Tristan Thompson or Kyle Korver?
(ducks, just in case)

i think i have enough cap room to take korver, but i'd probably prefer to sign someone younger as a free agent.


   849. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:14 PM (#5692107)
@ShamsCharania
Sources: NBA Draft lottery teams were informed Wednesday that Missouri’s Michael Porter Jr., a projected high-lottery draft pick, canceled second Pro Day workout Friday because of hip spasms and would undergo tests.
   850. JC in DC Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:25 PM (#5692115)
He's got Philly written all over him.
   851. Stevey Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:41 PM (#5692128)
You're also missing the point that it doesn't have to be LeBron initiating the offense. If they have a good initiator on their roster, or can find one, they can run pick & roll with the offense while LeBron rests.


They should run more of the offense through Love, who at .633 points per post touch, and while not being a roll man like Jordan, Nance, or Thompson, is still above average there, is exactly the offensive player you are looking for.

One issue is that what LeBron wants is often not the best thing for the team.


Absolutely agree, but not doing what Lebron wants means not having Lebron, which is a lot worse than having Lebron build you a sub-optimal roster.

the offense when he sits


You haven't. An offensive consisting almost solely of Hill-Jordan pick and rolls is not as good one of Love post-ups, Hill-Love pick and rolls, and Love's ability to spread the floor and pass the ball.

I think Lebron would DEFINITELY want DeAndre Jordan on his team


The Cavs tried to get him for a draft pick earlier this year, so he's not averse to it, but that the Cavs weren't willing to budge on giving up just a draft pick says enough to me. If Lebron really wanted to swap Love for Jordan in a heartbeat, they could have done that already.

   852. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:45 PM (#5692132)
The Denver Nuggets select De'Anthony Melton, G, USC

The Denver Nuggets select Miles Bridges, F, Michigan St

What I most wanted out of this draft was to upgrade Denver's team defense and athleticism while balancing out the roster, ideally by unloading a big man and adding a starting-caliber 3 and a combo guard.

That's exactly what I did, though perhaps at less than optimal value, giving up both Trey Lyles and a 2019 1st rounder in the process. Here's my rationale:

The Nuggets have so many bigs that Lyles is expendable. Even though in a vacuum he's their best and most promising backup, his shaky defense is a poor fit next to Jokic. When I realized that no one would trade a useful wing for Plumlee or Faried, I pivoted to moving Lyles. Faried actually complements Jokic a bit better, both conceptually and based on lineup data. I think Faried will bounce back this season if given more consistent minutes. In addition, I dreaded the prospect of offering Lyles a market contract next summer; tying up so much long-term money on bigs is a recipe for disaster in today's NBA.

As for Bridges, his explosive leaping ability adds an extra dimension to the offense. With the passing and spacing afforded by Jokic and Millsap, Bridges can be a terror on cuts to the rim. Bridges should space the floor as well, projecting to be an outside shooting threat, though his current form is a bit more deliberate than you’d like. 85% free throw shooters tend to figure it out. He also has sneaky secondary ball handler potential, with a quick first step, a decent handle for his position, and a knack for passing both off the catch and off 1-2 dribbles.

I’m not too concerned about Bridges’ underwhelming wingspan (6’9.5”) and lack of steals defensively, which seem to be partially responsible for him slipping. His strength and athleticism offset his subpar length, and Michigan State plays a very conservative defensive scheme that suppresses steals.

Could I have drafted Bridges at 14 and then gotten Melton later on by packaging Lyles and #43? Probably? I guess I'll never know for sure. But I don't mind giving up next year's first rounder. As of now, the 2019 draft looks terrible.

I think both the 2018 and 2019 drafts are really light on initiators with the potential to be above-average starters. I see Melton as one of those guys. I don’t think his outside shot is a lost cause, and I pretty strongly disagree with MHS as to Melton’s upside if his jumper comes around. Plenty of guys, including guards, shoot like that their freshman year and become decent or better outside shooters in the pros--Mike Conley and Jrue Holiday to name a couple. And if Melton can shoot, isn’t “Jrue Holiday clone” a fairly likely outcome? Their college stats are strikingly similar.

I’d rather take my chances trying to improve Melton’s jumper as opposed to drafting any other point/combo guard still available and trying to improve his vision, anticipation, and athleticism (or two of those three areas). Serviceable backup point guards are relatively easy to find.
   853. JC in DC Posted: June 14, 2018 at 12:49 PM (#5692138)
If you wanted a PG as a serviceable backup with a solid 3 shot, you could've traded back and gotten Brunson rather than overdrafting Melton. But it's cool to see your thinking.
   854. aberg Posted: June 14, 2018 at 01:26 PM (#5692167)
They should run more of the offense through Love, who at .633 points per post touch, and while not being a roll man like Jordan, Nance, or Thompson, is still above average there, is exactly the offensive player you are looking for.


Saying that the Cavs shouldn't trade Love because they need to run the offense through him is counterfactual. He has been on the team for four years and they have never come close to running the offense through him.

No, you can't run the offense through DAJ, but there is as much evidence that the Cavs will run the offense through Love as there is that they would run it through DAJ. I agree with the comments above that it addresses the bigger of their two needs (team defense), even if they would need to make a second move to address the secondary playmaker hole.
   855. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 01:44 PM (#5692184)
If you wanted a PG as a serviceable backup with a solid 3 shot, you could've traded back and gotten Brunson rather than overdrafting Melton. But it's cool to see your thinking.

Sorry I wasn't clear. My point was that I didn't just want a serviceable backup with a solid jumper because I can get that kind of guy whenever. I'm confident I can use part of the MLE on someone like that or trade a second rounder for him if needed. What I wanted was a potential starter-level guy, even if he's substantially more likely to bust. Plus I'm not sure a conventional backup point guard would be particularly helpful given all the passing and ball handling on the roster. The nominal starting point guard averages 3 assists a game, and the offense is great.
   856. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 01:52 PM (#5692196)
@Der-K: care to move up to #16? Ideas?
   857. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:01 PM (#5692212)
I'm on deck to draft but I'm a teacher, it's the last day of work for the summer, and I'm about to go sit in the sun and drink beer for the foreseeable future. So if/when my pick comes up I either will not notice, or maybe do something weird. Which I'm fine with but just wanted to put that out there ahead of time.

It's exacerbated by the fact that I'm not sure which direction I want to go with my pick, between taking maybe a more talented player that has slipped but wouldn't be a great fit, to a less-talented, better fit guy. We'll see which way the High Life leads me.
   858. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:05 PM (#5692218)
Dandy, if you project Melton as a potential point guard that is a much different evaluation than mine. I see him as a wing, but if he can initiate he is worth a ton more. I don’t see him as being athletic enough to be a primary initiator, but I completely agree with you on how bad this class is in that regard, and stretching for a guy you like in that role makes a ton of sense.
   859. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:20 PM (#5692233)
The Denver Nuggets select Miles Bridges, F, Michigan St


I like Bridges, too. He's one of those guys that gets nitpicked because he stayed in college two years.

Is the Trade Machine projected wins just based on PER? Because hypothetical GM me would trade Gortat for Vucevic (salaries and length are about the same), which according to the Trade Machine makes WAS 4 wins better and Orlando 4 wins worse. Athletic Supporter, if you're still looking to dump Vooch, that is an open offer.

Griffey: enjoy your summer.
   860. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:23 PM (#5692238)
It's exacerbated by the fact that I'm not sure which direction I want to go with my pick, between taking maybe a more talented player that has slipped but wouldn't be a great fit, to a less-talented, better fit guy. We'll see which way the High Life leads me.


No problem, we'll do it like a fantasy league autodraft and you can take the highest rated player who picked up a massive injury too late for his rating to plummet.
   861. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:29 PM (#5692246)
Thanks Votto, I plan to. And if anyone is high on Knox or Sexton or whatever and wants to trade up to 17 for two later picks, let me know.
   862. JC in DC Posted: June 14, 2018 at 02:36 PM (#5692250)
re initiators and the like and the 2019 draft: we are looking at a time when most of these guys are 17/18/19 years old. They will look "underbaked" (unlike JR Smith, who's overbaked). Drafting, projecting a year out, determining who won drafts and such is a very different game than even 5 years ago. I think some of these guys have high "initiator" potential, Young, Sexton, Walker, Brunson, maybe even Knox, but a lot is going to depend upon the coaching/system they develop in. I would've, for instance, taken a flyer on Sexton over Melton. But many of these guys will bust, and a few will bust out, and we won't really be able to tell if it's because some GM had the right insight, or b/c a kid was groomed well by teammates/coaches/system.
   863. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:07 PM (#5692274)
Of just plan old luck.
   864. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:09 PM (#5692276)
PHO selects C. SEXTON, Alabama.
   865. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:17 PM (#5692284)
I’m going to follow Sexton really closely. That dude is a real animal and those guys are always fun to watch. I hope he lands some where fun.
   866. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:23 PM (#5692289)
FIRST ROUND
1. Magic (from PHO) - Athletic Supporter - Luka Doncic, G, Real Madrid
2. Kings - smileyy - Deandre Ayton, F/C, Arizona
3. Hawks - Der-K - Jaren Jackson Jr., F/C, Michigan State (to DAL for #5)
4. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball - Michael Porter Jr., F, Missouri
5. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL) - Mohamed Bamba - C, Texas
6. Suns (from ORL) - Oriole Tragic - Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
7. Bulls - Moses - Marvin Bagley III, F/C, Duke
8. Cavs - stevegamer - Mikal Bridges, F/G, Villanova
9. Knicks - NJ/JC - Trae Young, G, Oklahoma
10. 76ers - 57i66135 - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, G, Kentucky
11. Hornets - Berg - Lonnie Walker, G/F, Miami
12. Clippers - Thok - Robert Williams, C/F, Texas A&M
13. Suns (from LAC via CLE) - Oriole Tragic - Zhaire Smith, F/G, Texas Tech
14. Nuggets - Dandy - De'Anthony Melton, G, USC
15. Nuggets (from WAS) - Dandy - Miles Bridges, F, Michigan State
16. Suns - Oriole Tragic - Collin Sexton, G, Alabama
17. Bucks - Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw
18. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
19. Hawks - Der-K
20. Timberwolves - Mouse
21. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
22. Bulls - Moses
23. Pacers - Paste
24. Trailblazers - mike f
25. Lakers - Hombre/rr
26. 76ers - 57i66135
27. Celtics - MHS
28. Warriors - sardonic
29. Nets - JJ1986
30. Hawks - Der-K

SECOND ROUND
31. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
32. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball
33. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL)
34. Hawks - Der-K
35. Suns - Oriole Tragic (from ORL)
36. Knicks - NJ/JC
37. Kings - smileyy
38. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless (from PHI)
39. 76ers - 57i66135
40. Nets - JJ1986
41. Magic - Athletic Supporter
42. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless
43. Nuggets - Dandy
44. Wizards -Votto
45. Nets - JJ1986
46. Rockets
47. Lakers - Hombre/rr
48. Timberwolves - Mouse
49. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
50. Pacers - Paste
51. Pelicans
52. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
53. Thunder - Fridas Boss
54. Mavericks - tshipman
55. Hornets - Berg
56. 76ers - 57i66135
57. Thunder - Fridas Boss
58. Nuggets - Dandy
59. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
60. 76ers - 57i66135

Trades:
ORL gets: #1 overall
PHO gets: #6 overall, ORL 2019-1 (unprotected)

LAC gets: Kevin Love
CLE gets: DeAndre Jordan, #13 overall

DET gets: Dario Saric, Jerryd Bayless, #38
PHI gets: Andre Drummond (!)

DAL gets: Jaren Jackson Jr., Dennis Schroder, Miles Plumlee
ATL gets: #5 and #33 overall, Wesley Matthews

ORL gets: #31 and #59 overall, Brandon Knight, Tyson Chandler
PHO gets: #35 overall, Bismack Biyombo, Terrence Ross

PHO gets: #13 overall, JR Smith
CLE gets: Marquese Chriss, Terrence Ross

DEN: gets #15 overall
WAS: gets Trey Lyles, DEN 2019-1 (protected #1-4)
   867. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:26 PM (#5692292)
@KGGS you are on the clock if you still have time in your workday.
   868. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:26 PM (#5692293)
Okay, I'll wait a little bit to see if anybody wants to trade up for this pick. If not, I'll take a guy in an hour or so.
   869. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:31 PM (#5692301)
@KGGS is there a contract you were looking to unload, yourself?
   870. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 03:36 PM (#5692309)
I mean, there's like 5 guys on the Bucks with contracts I'd like to move. Henson, Snell, Delly are the main ones I guess, and they're all serviceable players.
   871. Willard Baseball Posted: June 14, 2018 at 04:07 PM (#5692331)
I feel like Sexton is a steal at 16. I would rather have him than Trae Young. I think you have to have a complement to either one of them to cover their weaknesses, but I think Sexton has a good chance to be a starter on a playoff team.
   872. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: June 14, 2018 at 04:09 PM (#5692334)
@Oriole, you mentioned liking Faried. How about Faried for Dudley?
   873. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 04:27 PM (#5692349)
@Dandy not sure that works for me. Dudley can shoot the three and is like $4M cheaper.
   874. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 04:58 PM (#5692378)
@KGGSJ ideas on what you would want back for Snell and #17?
   875. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:06 PM (#5692387)
My blurbed reads on the latest picks:

ROBERT WILLIAMS: Scouts are dreaming of Clint Capela, I guess, but he looks like short Andre Drummond without the rebounding. I don't like betting on guys whose "if" is "if he starts consistently giving a #### after getting drowned in money and the NBA lifestyle" rather than "if he improves his technique" or even "if he can stay healthy".

ZHAIRE SMITH: Looks a good bet to play lockdown perimeter defense, but too small to guard NBA wing players and not good enough a shooter to really be a dynamic scorer against NBA defenses that will just go under every screen set for him. His athleticism is probably going to get him drafted in the lottery in this draft, but I like him more in the early 20s range. He is the kind of player I'd love to see a top-tier coach get hold of, but that's not likely since he's one of the 15 best players on the board.

DE'ANTHONY MELTON: I think Dandy will be semi-vindicated when Melton goes in about the 18-25 range rather than in the second round as mocks are projecting him. I like him: good body, works his ass off, seems a good bet to take well to good coaching. Really unpolished and it's unclear if he has the potential to develop into playability on offense. Elite defense takes you only so far when (1) you're 6'3 and (2) your team is essentially playing 4-on-5 on offense. I wish he was a better shooter, but still, looks like a first round prospect to me, at least in this class. One of the reports I read said Marcus Smart is probably his ceiling, and that may be right.

MILES BRIDGES: If you're high on him you see versatility. I see a guy who's going to have a hard time converting his strengths (spot-up shooting and raw power, mostly) into effective NBA skills with his short arms and bad handle. I really worry he won't be able to play impact defense or impact offense in the NBA. The potential's there for a high energy smallball 4 who you can't leave open behind the arc, but I'm not high on his ability to reach it.

COLLIN SEXTON: Sounds like he wants to be Russell Westbrook when he grows up, but Sexton's skills aren't THAT good. Still, I'd be inclined to pick Sexton pretty high if I needed a perimeter guy and trusted my coach. Unfortunately not a great many teams who pick in the mid-late lottery fit that description, and the wrong coach/situation could bust the hell out of him. Still a top ten pick in this draft, I think. Pretty decent shot to at least turn into Eric Bledsoe.
   876. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:09 PM (#5692389)
eh, I don't know what you'd have that I want. I'd like to get a pick back a little higher than 35. Did you have any ideas?
Edit: this is to Oriole
   877. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:26 PM (#5692399)
@KGGSJ if you are looking for first-rounder coming back, then you are correct to say that I can't help.

Have a good summer!
   878. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:34 PM (#5692404)
Eh, to hell with it, I'll take Kevin Knox. He strikes me as a poor man's Jabari and an extremely rich man's DJ Wilson (last year's first rounder).

Bad at rebounding, no handle, but a lot of scoring upside and young enough to have good projection. I am not happy with this pick but Knox seems too talented to pass on.
   879. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:45 PM (#5692412)
@KGGSJ that could be a great value pick. FWIW he's jumped to #7 (!) on the The Ringer's latest board.
   880. NJ in NY (Now with Baby!) Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:45 PM (#5692413)
   881. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:51 PM (#5692416)
@Oriole, I saw that too. Think it might reflect how clueless the Bulls decision makers are more than his talent though.
   882. PASTE, Now with Extra Pitch and Extra Stamina Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:57 PM (#5692418)
nbadraft.net has Knox going 17th to Milwaukee, just as he did here.

I suspect The Ringer is going to prove closer to the mark (although I personally don't like Knox).
   883. aberg Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:58 PM (#5692420)
NJ- the reason to be jealous of Laker fans is that Pelton article today where he outlines how they can get Lebron, PG, and Leonard this summer, and it's not insane.
   884. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: June 14, 2018 at 05:59 PM (#5692421)
Not since Malik Monk has an alliterative Kentucky freshman with 5 letters in his first name and 4 letters in his last name made such a sudden jump in the mock drafts just before the draft.
   885. JC in DC Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:05 PM (#5692423)
I like Knox
   886. Athletic Supporter wants to move your money around Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:07 PM (#5692424)
@Votto, I'm not sure what a Gortat-for-Vucevic swap gets me. Vooch is younger and at least has been experimenting with a 3 point shot so maybe he can become functional in that dimension too, and Gortat's a million more. So I'll pass on that.
   887. MHS Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:10 PM (#5692429)
eh, I don't know what you'd have that I want. I'd like to get a pick back a little higher than 35. Did you have any ideas?
Edit: this is to Oriole


The Celtics are willing to trade down from 27 to 35 for a future late first or high second.

In theory something like.

35 this year and
1st next year if after 22
2nd next year if before 35.
If after 35 second in 19 and 20.

Not sure you have those picks but if you do.
   888. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:22 PM (#5692436)
@MHS it's a sensible offer, and I'd do it if there were anyone I absolutely must have before #35 in this draft. Since there isn't, I'll pass.
   889. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 06:43 PM (#5692444)
@SouthSideRyan and the Spurs are on the clock at #18.

FIRST ROUND
1. Magic (from PHO) - Athletic Supporter - Luka Doncic, G, Real Madrid
2. Kings - smileyy - Deandre Ayton, F/C, Arizona
3. Hawks - Der-K - Jaren Jackson Jr., F/C, Michigan State (to DAL for #5)
4. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball - Michael Porter Jr., F, Missouri
5. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL) - Mohamed Bamba - C, Texas
6. Suns (from ORL) - Oriole Tragic - Wendell Carter Jr., C, Duke
7. Bulls - Moses - Marvin Bagley III, F/C, Duke
8. Cavs - stevegamer - Mikal Bridges, F/G, Villanova
9. Knicks - NJ/JC - Trae Young, G, Oklahoma
10. 76ers - 57i66135 - Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, G, Kentucky
11. Hornets - Berg - Lonnie Walker, G/F, Miami
12. Clippers - Thok - Robert Williams, C/F, Texas A&M
13. Suns (from LAC via CLE) - Oriole Tragic - Zhaire Smith, F/G, Texas Tech
14. Nuggets - Dandy - De'Anthony Melton, G, USC
15. Nuggets (from WAS) - Dandy - Miles Bridges, F, Michigan State
16. Suns - Oriole Tragic - Collin Sexton, G, Alabama
17. Bucks - Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw - Kevin Knox, F, Kentucky
18. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
19. Hawks - Der-K
20. Timberwolves - Mouse
21. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
22. Bulls - Moses
23. Pacers - Paste
24. Trailblazers - mike f
25. Lakers - Hombre/rr
26. 76ers - 57i66135
27. Celtics - MHS
28. Warriors - sardonic
29. Nets - JJ1986
30. Hawks - Der-K

SECOND ROUND
31. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
32. Grizzlies – Willard Baseball
33. Hawks - Der-K (from DAL)
34. Hawks - Der-K
35. Suns - Oriole Tragic (from ORL)
36. Knicks - NJ/JC
37. Kings - smileyy
38. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless (from PHI)
39. 76ers - 57i66135
40. Nets - JJ1986
41. Magic - Athletic Supporter
42. Pistons - Crosseyed and Painless
43. Nuggets - Dandy
44. Wizards -Votto
45. Nets - JJ1986
46. Rockets
47. Lakers - Hombre/rr
48. Timberwolves - Mouse
49. Spurs - SouthSideRyan
50. Pacers - Paste
51. Pelicans
52. Jazz - Booey/Cervo
53. Thunder - Fridas Boss
54. Mavericks - tshipman
55. Hornets - Berg
56. 76ers - 57i66135
57. Thunder - Fridas Boss
58. Nuggets - Dandy
59. Magic - Athletic Supporter (from PHO)
60. 76ers - 57i66135

Trades:
ORL gets: #1 overall
PHO gets: #6 overall, ORL 2019-1 (unprotected)

LAC gets: Kevin Love
CLE gets: DeAndre Jordan, #13 overall

DET gets: Dario Saric, Jerryd Bayless, #38
PHI gets: Andre Drummond (!)

DAL gets: Jaren Jackson Jr., Dennis Schroder, Miles Plumlee
ATL gets: #5 and #33 overall, Wesley Matthews

ORL gets: #31 and #59 overall, Brandon Knight, Tyson Chandler
PHO gets: #35 overall, Bismack Biyombo, Terrence Ross

PHO gets: #13 overall, JR Smith
CLE gets: Marquese Chriss, Terrence Ross

DEN: gets #15 overall
WAS: gets Trey Lyles, DEN 2019-1 (protected #1-4)
   890. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2018 at 07:35 PM (#5692483)
JJ, I'm very interested in dumping Turner, but there are some guys I like that might be around at 24. What's the status of your proposal in 699?
The Clippers wanted more in the three-way trade, and I'm already not sure I'm getting a good deal; I'd rather make a two-team deal. We can wait until 24 is on the clock (or all your guys get picked) and look at trades then if that works for you.
   891. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: June 14, 2018 at 08:16 PM (#5692503)
He's got Philly written all over him.
i can only hope.
MILES BRIDGES: If you're high on him you see versatility. I see a guy who's going to have a hard time converting his strengths (spot-up shooting and raw power, mostly) into effective NBA skills with his short arms and bad handle. I really worry he won't be able to play impact defense or impact offense in the NBA. The potential's there for a high energy smallball 4 who you can't leave open behind the arc, but I'm not high on his ability to reach it.

i'm not a huge believer in bridges' upside, either, but there's a good chance that he'll be a productive 2nd-tier 3+D wing, like marvin williams, kent bazemore, demarre carroll, josh richardson, and so on.

i was willing to trade up to get him because the sixers wouldn't need him to be a primary or secondary initiator, they wouldn't need him to be their best perimeter/wing defender, they wouldn't need him to score 15-20 PPG. he would just be (hopefully) a better version of justin anderson, with the potential to grow into a lesser version of jimmy butler.
   892. Thok Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:11 PM (#5692523)
The Clippers wanted more in the three-way trade, and I'm already not sure I'm getting a good deal; I'd rather make a two-team deal. We can wait until 24 is on the clock (or all your guys get picked) and look at trades then if that works for you.


Upgrade the weirdly protected second round pick from next year to a second round pick from this year, and we can talk.
   893. stevegamer Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:16 PM (#5692527)
848. i think i have enough cap room to take korver, but i'd probably prefer to sign someone younger as a free agent.


If you decide you want to bring #26 back to Philly, just let me know. He fits just fine on the Cavs, but wanted to gauge interest.
   894. tshipman Posted: June 14, 2018 at 09:25 PM (#5692530)
I'm on deck to draft but I'm a teacher, it's the last day of work for the summer, and I'm about to go sit in the sun and drink beer for the foreseeable future. So if/when my pick comes up I either will not notice, or maybe do something weird. Which I'm fine with but just wanted to put that out there ahead of time.


See now, this is the kind of quality roleplay I expect from the Sacramento, Orlando, Bulls front offices.

***

I like Collin Sexton, and was mildly surprised at how far he fell.
   895. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:01 PM (#5692548)
See now, this is the kind of quality roleplay I expect from the Sacramento, Orlando, Bulls front offices.


I laughed.

LAC gets: Kevin Love
CLE gets: DeAndre Jordan, #13 overall


The more I look at this, the less I get the hate for this move. It's not obvious to me that DeAndre Jordan is a worse player than Love; he's less of a creator but much better on defense. DeAndre was #23 in last offseason's BTF rank; Kevin Love was #25. Love just went through a season where he was injured and didn't play particularly well. DeAndre has one less year on his deal which is better for the potentially rebuilding Cavs.

And Cleveland netted out the #13 pick, which they then used to dump JR Smith's toxic contract and pick up a shorter deal in Terrence Ross and flyer in Chriss.

The only thing I realized while looking this up was that Jordan actually has a player option for this season, so it's possible that he wouldn't opt in to get traded to Cleveland (or opt in in general). I think it's totally find to assume for the sake of this draft that he did, it's just for fun anyway.
   896. Oriole Tragic: doomed to mysterious ignomy Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:10 PM (#5692551)
@sardonic JR Smith can be bought out for ~3MM at the end of the upcoming season, so it's not really a longer deal than Ross' paper, although it is certainly more expensive.

I do not believe in Love, so I thought stevegamer's deal was a good one for CLE. Maybe the best deal of the draft.
   897. Thok Posted: June 14, 2018 at 10:54 PM (#5692562)
The only thing I realized while looking this up was that Jordan actually has a player option for this season, so it's possible that he wouldn't opt in to get traded to Cleveland (or opt in in general). I think it's totally find to assume for the sake of this draft that he did, it's just for fun anyway.


This is mostly why I did the deal; I'm not expecting Jordan to accept the player option unless the Clippers trade him to a contender, and I expect Love to play better away from Lebron James. If I'm losing DeAndre Jordan no matter what, trading a 13+an asset I can't use for Kevin Love is a win for the Clippers.

Even treating it as a challenge trade, it's not unreasonable that Kevin Love on the Clippers could outplay DeAndre Jordan+the 13th pick on the Cavs.
   898. Booey Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:03 PM (#5692564)
I do not believe in Love


Aw, that's so sad! You must've had a hard life, Oriole... :-(



(Kevin Love's name is the gift that keeps on giving!)
   899. tshipman Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:24 PM (#5692567)
I think IRL, DJ would reach out to LeBron and receive some kind of assurance that he'd be coming back before the deal were done.

I strongly doubt that Jordan would opt in without that.
   900. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: June 14, 2018 at 11:33 PM (#5692572)
See now, this is the kind of quality roleplay I expect from the Sacramento, Orlando, Bulls front offices.
yeah, I appreciated this too. Thankful that the Bucks front office isn't included in that skid row, although they're not far behind.

Anyway, the fake Bucks are still willing to try to trade for Kemba Walker or into the second round for... something. We'd give like 2 million imaginary dollars for a second round pick, or some real assets if we were getting a player back.

Also, still interested in Korver. Not sure what it would take to get him though. If the Cavs can acquire an earlyish 2nd rounder, I would trade Bledsoe and something for Korver and the pick. I guess there would need to be salary coming back so maybe Bledsoe & Henson for Korver, Hill and the pick. Something like that. Although I guess the Cavs have DAJ now so they have no use for Henson.
Page 9 of 14 pages ‹ First  < 7 8 9 10 11 >  Last ›

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

News

All News | Prime News

Old-School Newsstand


BBTF Partner

Dynasty League Baseball

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Eugene Freedman
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogBrewers Surprise Bob Uecker by dressing as him for flight to Pittsburgh
(5 - 2:06pm, Jun 21)
Last: Batman

NewsblogSABR? OMNICHATTER hardly even knew'er! for June 21, 2018
(23 - 2:05pm, Jun 21)
Last: Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB)

Gonfalon CubsClicking
(80 - 2:04pm, Jun 21)
Last: Zonk is a cagey fellow

NewsblogOT - 2018 NBA Summer Potpourri (finals, draft, free agency, Colangelo dragging)
(1395 - 2:01pm, Jun 21)
Last: SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 6-21-2018
(6 - 1:46pm, Jun 21)
Last: vortex of dissipation

NewsblogOTP 2018 June 18: How Life Imitates the Congressional Baseball Game
(1102 - 1:44pm, Jun 21)
Last: The Yankee Clapper

NewsblogOT: Soccer Thread (World Cup)
(653 - 1:17pm, Jun 21)
Last: Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB)

NewsblogTaking Back the Ballparks - Astros voting thread
(30 - 1:12pm, Jun 21)
Last: Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant

NewsblogFormer MLB pitcher Kevin Brown reportedly held two mail thieves at gunpoint until police arrived
(299 - 12:45pm, Jun 21)
Last: Lassus

NewsblogHow Major League Teams Are Using Bobbleheads to Skirt Tax Laws
(12 - 11:58am, Jun 21)
Last: David Nieporent (now, with children)

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 6-20-2018
(19 - 11:21am, Jun 21)
Last: What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face?

NewsblogBBTF ANNUAL CENTRAL PARK SOFTBALL GAME 2018
(121 - 11:03am, Jun 21)
Last: Stormy JE

NewsblogKelvin Herrera Trade Start of Something Big for Nationals
(47 - 10:25am, Jun 21)
Last: snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster)

Hall of MeritCannonball Dick Redding
(155 - 10:16am, Jun 21)
Last: DL from MN

Sox TherapyA Pleasant Trip So Far
(21 - 9:56am, Jun 21)
Last: karlmagnus

Page rendered in 0.7351 seconds
46 querie(s) executed