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Thursday, March 15, 2018

OT - March Madness 2018

I estimate that only STIGGLES is interested in college basketball. This thread will avoid detracting from what BBTF is truly about: the NBA and how many MLB teams are tanking.

Who will earn a soon-to-be vacated Final Four birth this year?

#1 Seeds are Kansas, Villanova, Virginia, and Xavier.

[Link goes to overview of Ken Pomeroy’s college basketball ratings]

My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: March 15, 2018 at 11:21 AM | 267 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: amateurs, basketball, college basketball, march madness

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   201. Tom T Posted: March 21, 2018 at 07:14 AM (#5640749)
Folks are working on a brace for Haas. No plan for him to play, regardless, but sounds like the hope is to make it so he can do a shoot around (with his teammates) without pain.


UPDATE: Brace completed (48 hour turnaround, no less). Isaac is happy with it, but I'm not yet clear what that means (I didn't get to see it...too busy in meetings yesterday to visit the HIRRT lab). Apparently the "NCAA decision" on the brace is actually that of the officials at the site, and could be as late as just prior to the game. While my colleagues appear to have managed to make it such that Isaac *might* be able to play (per Painter: grab a rebound and shoot with his right hand), the uncertainty regarding the approval of the brace means they still had to gameplan and prep for being without him. So, as originally conjectured, the brace makes Isaac more comfortable and allows him to warm up and practice with the team, but still doesn't make it probable he'll do anything more than cheer.

But, dang it, I bet Eric and Michael get some nice press coverage if Isaac IS cleared....
   202. Chicago Joe Posted: March 21, 2018 at 06:58 PM (#5641241)
Dang, we have a lot of double vowel 'a's at the 5....


Haa!
   203. bunyon Posted: March 22, 2018 at 09:30 PM (#5641989)
If you missed the end of the Loyola/Nevada game, a Loyola player receiving an inbound up one traveled. Calling the game was Chris Webber who, watching the replay, chuckled and said, "That's a travel." He seemed to fall out of broadcaster mode and was just a guy laughing about mistakes of his past. Pretty funny.
   204. greenback took the 110 until the 105 Posted: March 22, 2018 at 09:53 PM (#5641996)
I know I'm old, but doesn't Webber look like he's about 25? In reality it was 25 years ago that he walked before he called timeout.
   205. bunyon Posted: March 22, 2018 at 09:55 PM (#5641999)
His alma mater certainly looked good tonight. UNC probably beats them if they get past A&M but combining the score makes Michigan eleventy billion points better than Carolina.
   206. Tom T Posted: March 22, 2018 at 10:22 PM (#5642008)
He seemed to fall out of broadcaster mode and was just a guy laughing about mistakes of his past. Pretty funny.


I concur!

And Jerry Palm (a Purdue alum) did do a brief piece for CBS Sports' online division about the brace so that my colleague, Eric Nauman, got some press for the amazing effort that he and his grad students put forth in creating the brace for Haas in 34 hours (from first meeting with Isaac to final delivery). Problem is that, yeah, a broken elbow hurts. So, Purdue is very likely to lose to Chris Beard again. Bummer. I presume that if this were the pros, they'd just give Isaac a big ol' dose of cortisone and have him play as best he could. (The doctors all have declared that Isaac can't make the injury worse.) Ah well...maybe we'll make a run at reaching the Elite Eight again around 2026 or so....
   207. Greg Pope Posted: March 22, 2018 at 11:42 PM (#5642032)
I hope when I reach 80 that I’m half as coherent as 98 year old Sister Jean.
   208. bunyon Posted: March 23, 2018 at 12:35 AM (#5642043)
Like I said, no way Kentucky advances.


What a bizarre tournament.
   209. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: March 23, 2018 at 10:59 AM (#5642198)
A #9 K-State vs. #11 Loyola final is fun. Remaining #1 seeds Kansas and Villanova play tonight.

My wife, not the biggest sports-ball fan, sincerely asked me what is the big deal with buzzer beaters. She also suggested during the 2017 World Series that the Dodgers should bring in Bob Wickman.
   210. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:00 PM (#5642276)
I presume that if this were the pros, they'd just give Isaac a big ol' dose of cortisone and have him play as best he could. (The doctors all have declared that Isaac can't make the injury worse.) Ah well...maybe we'll make a run at reaching the Elite Eight again around 2026 or so....


What makes you think they wouldn't do the same in college basketball?
   211. This is going to be state of the art wall Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:06 PM (#5642285)
So uh, that Zags fan still around?
   212. bunyon Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:25 PM (#5642295)
Someone, somewhere is going to win an office pool with 11 points.
   213. Tom T Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:35 PM (#5642300)
What makes you think they wouldn't do the same in college basketball?


Knowing Doc Rowdon....

But all snark aside, it also isn't clear that Matt would go this route, as I think he has now gameplanned for NOT having Isaac in any capacity, and it might be too much of an in-game adjustment to find an effective use for a definitely-limited version of Haas.
   214. Tom T Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:37 PM (#5642302)
A #9 K-State vs. #11 Loyola final is fun. Remaining #1 seeds Kansas and Villanova play tonight.


Agreed about the K-State/Loyola matchup. While 3 of the "underdogs" won yesterday, my gut feeling is that 3 of the favorites will win tonight. (Still expecting that a Haas-less Purdue will not get past Texas Tech...if Tech gets Haarms in foul trouble early, Purdue doesn't have any palatable alternatives short of running a 5-guard offense against a very good offensive rebounding team.)
   215. smileyy Posted: March 23, 2018 at 01:49 PM (#5642309)
So uh, that Zags fan still around?


A Xavier fan who suddenly saw the West fall apart and open up a path to the Championship Game is, and is very sad.
   216. The Good Face Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:13 PM (#5642337)
So uh, that Zags fan still around?

A Xavier fan who suddenly saw the West fall apart and open up a path to the Championship Game is, and is very sad.


What's the story with Mack leaving to take the Louisville job? Is that a done deal, or what? Hope not, Mack's a really good coach and him leaving weakens the Big East.
   217. smileyy Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:33 PM (#5642359)
Mack is meeting with Louisville this weekend. The fact that the meeting is taking place tells me that its pretty much a done deal. It'd be devastating for Louisville to not be able to make that hire. He's the start and end of their list.

Reportedly Xavier is offering $3M/yr. I imagine Louisville is offering $1-2M more if not more. For reference, Archie Miller got $3.3M from Indiana with much less of a resume.

Xavier has had Travis Steele as associate head coach for a while. I imagine he'd be front-runner for the job. It'd add a lot of continuity, especially with recruiting. Xavier hasn't made an external hire since Thad Matta in...2002 I think? Miller was associate to Matta and Mack was associate to Miller.
   218. The Good Face Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:45 PM (#5642366)
Mack is meeting with Louisville this weekend. The fact that the meeting is taking place tells me that its pretty much a done deal. It'd be devastating for Louisville to not be able to make that hire. He's the start and end of their list.

Reportedly Xavier is offering $3M/yr. I imagine Louisville is offering $1-2M more if not more. For reference, Archie Miller got $3.3M from Indiana with much less of a resume.


That's a shame, but it's hard to fault Mack for walking away from truckloads of money and a sky high budget plus state of the art facilities.
   219. smileyy Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:50 PM (#5642373)
Xavier's facilities are nothing to sneeze at, and there's a report that X is offering to revamp the practice facilities for him.

It'd really be a letdown for X if he leaves. I imagine they'll survive and move on, but Mack was kind of the perfect guy for Xavier. He played there and he's the unification of their two successful coaching lines over the past 30 years of success.

Pete Gillen -> Skip Prosser -> Mack <- Sean Miller <- Thad Matta
   220. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:56 PM (#5642378)
What makes you think they wouldn't do the same in college basketball?



Knowing Doc Rowdon....

OK, maybe they wouldn't at Purdue, but I guarantee there are schools that would do just that. And the school trainers would be the ones saying there's no risk of further injury. This did just happen in state at Indiana.
   221. The Good Face Posted: March 23, 2018 at 02:57 PM (#5642379)
Xavier's facilities are nothing to sneeze at, and there's a report that X is offering to revamp the practice facilities for him.


You're right, Cintas is a great arena and Xavier isn't exactly cheaping out on the program. But Louisville has crazy money available and Xavier just can't compete on that front.

It'd really be a letdown for X if he leaves. I imagine they'll survive and move on, but Mack was kind of the perfect guy for Xavier. He played there and he's the unification of their two successful coaching lines over the past 30 years of success.


I'll be sad to see him go. He's a really strong coach and I'm a Big East fan. Him leaving isn't good for the conference.
   222. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: March 23, 2018 at 09:28 PM (#5642570)
Good fight by Clemson, but not quite enough.
   223. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: March 23, 2018 at 09:47 PM (#5642573)
that was a horseshit call for konate's 4th foul.

officials are screwing west virginia. they're not calling the game unfairly, but they're calling it more tightly, and that's disproportionately affecting west virginia.


this is a fun game, though.
   224. . . . . . . Posted: March 23, 2018 at 11:09 PM (#5642579)
If I were a WVU fan, I’d be pretty salty about the officiating in that game. But Nova is dammed good. They ate a big punch from WVU.
   225. Tom T Posted: March 23, 2018 at 11:16 PM (#5642582)
This did just happen in state at Indiana.


Yep, and there was that "transient neurological event" for Dayne Crist of ND during Brian Kelly's first year.

We may play it a bit more close to the vest at Purdue given we are the school with an actual athletic training program.
   226. Tom T Posted: March 23, 2018 at 11:17 PM (#5642583)
If I were a WVU fan, I’d be pretty salty about the officiating in that game.


Agreed. Getting pretty salty about the Purdue-Texas Tech game. We were unlikely to win in the first place, but if they are going to continue to allow folks to hook our 7-footers and then undercut them so they fall to the ground...well...ain't much we can really do.
   227. . . . . . . Posted: March 24, 2018 at 12:35 AM (#5642591)
I dunno man. One of the downsides of recruiting giant unathletic acromegalic stiffs for your team is that giant unathletic acromegalic stiffs tend to fall hard, stiffly, and unathletically. On the plus side, used correctly they can dominate a B1G defense.
   228. Tom T Posted: March 24, 2018 at 12:41 AM (#5642592)
One of the downsides of recruiting giant unathletic acromegalic stiffs for your team is that giant unathletic acromegalic stiffs tend to fall hard, stiffly, and unathletically. On the plus side, used correctly they can dominate a B1G defense.


Heh. True. Though Haarms won't end up being quite as unathletic.

Pissed, however, that Painter demonstrated his usual flexibility of thought and didn't get Isaac out onto the court in the last 50 seconds or so...not like there was any meaningful play that could have put him at any risk. Apparently there was a pretty good Purdue crowd present and several have noted they would have been very happy to have a break from the game to give him a loud cheer.
   229. Meatwad Posted: March 24, 2018 at 01:25 AM (#5642596)
The curse of robbie hummel strikes again. It was nice to see purdue being one of the more talked about teams here but I suspect Tom had to do with most of that. Boiler up!
   230. Tom T Posted: March 24, 2018 at 11:02 AM (#5642625)
The curse of robbie hummel strikes again. It was nice to see purdue being one of the more talked about teams here but I suspect Tom had to do with most of that. Boiler up!


Yeah, but we have plenty of Indiana-based/origin folks here (plus Chicago folks who see them play), so not too hard to generate some discussion.

I think the cool effort my collaborator did for the brace for Isaac also generated slightly greater buzz.

And at least it allowed us to hope that we might not have the *complete* Robbie Hummel experience.

Now to deal with all the fanatics demanding the firing of Painter for 4 Sweet 16s but 0 Elite 8s in 13 years. (Failing to note that Gene had only 1 Sweet 16 and 0 Elite 8s in his first 13 years....)
   231. smileyy Posted: March 24, 2018 at 02:08 PM (#5642652)
Now to deal with all the fanatics demanding the firing of Painter for 4 Sweet 16s but 0 Elite 8s in 13 years.


I could sort of understand that...sort of. But who are they going to land that's likely to be better than Painter?
   232. This is going to be state of the art wall Posted: March 24, 2018 at 02:16 PM (#5642653)
Wow that stat is pretty shocking to me, no elite 8s in 13 years for painter? The most shocking part is painter has been there that long and I am now that old.
   233. . . . . . . Posted: March 24, 2018 at 02:49 PM (#5642658)
Purdue is weird in that it never is comfortable with its natural place in the sports firmament. I remember grumbling about Tilller when he was winning 9 games a season and producing hall of fame QBs. Its not quite as tough a place to win in BB but it ain’t easy; competing with Butler for the recruits IU doesn’t want and aspiring to good academics.
   234. Voodoo Posted: March 24, 2018 at 05:02 PM (#5642689)
So uh, that Zags fan still around?


Ugh. Yes, that's me. March can be a cruel, cruel mistress. Particularly, when you (as a fan) look past teams you are "supposed" to beat and instead they crush you.
   235. stevegamer Posted: March 24, 2018 at 06:58 PM (#5642707)
Did anyone else catch the D2 title game? It was a fun game to watch.
   236. Chicago Joe Posted: March 24, 2018 at 08:39 PM (#5642725)
Heh, as an Illini fan, let me tell you about Robbie Hummel and curses. Or Brian Cardinal and curses.
   237. KronicFatigue Posted: March 24, 2018 at 10:57 PM (#5642740)
Is sitting a guy in foul trouble kinda like saving your ace reliever for the 9th inning? It's always seemed a bit counter productive to sit a guy b/c you don't want to be forced to sit a guy later on. Shouldn't you ride a guy as long as you can, and deal with his 5th foul if that happens? If you lose a game by a couple of points, and your best player sat a big chunk of it b/c of his 4th foul, but never got his 5th foul, couldn't you have gotten more out of him?

I'm not even sure if I believe what I'm saying. I'm sure the pressure ramps up late in the game, but that might be a self fulfilling prophecy. An excellent ball handler / free throw shooter might be "more important" late in a game. But a big man? I'm less inclined to think sitting him makes sense.
   238. KronicFatigue Posted: March 24, 2018 at 11:00 PM (#5642742)
Did anyone else catch the D2 title game? It was a fun game to watch.


I did, by accident (tv just happened to be on that channel when I turned it on) and agreed it was fun. I kinda felt the losing team gave the ball away. Whenever a team has a last possession, I feel like you can tell if/when the ballhandler is almost intentionally holding onto the ball because they want to take the last second shot. The losing team had a big man who looked kinda dominant but the PG didn't try to get it into him, then when he got in trouble kicked it out for a long distance 3.

The ending didn't live up to the rest of the game.
   239. . . . . . . Posted: March 24, 2018 at 11:15 PM (#5642743)
Well as a Michigan fan I got nothing to say other than we have one hell of a basketball coach and we got real lucky his year.
   240. stevegamer Posted: March 24, 2018 at 11:48 PM (#5642745)
Is sitting a guy in foul trouble kinda like saving your ace reliever for the 9th inning? It's always seemed a bit counter productive to sit a guy b/c you don't want to be forced to sit a guy later on. Shouldn't you ride a guy as long as you can, and deal with his 5th foul if that happens? If you lose a game by a couple of points, and your best player sat a big chunk of it b/c of his 4th foul, but never got his 5th foul, couldn't you have gotten more out of him?

I'm not even sure if I believe what I'm saying. I'm sure the pressure ramps up late in the game, but that might be a self fulfilling prophecy. An excellent ball handler / free throw shooter might be "more important" late in a game. But a big man? I'm less inclined to think sitting him makes sense.


It's not that similar, for a few reasons.

1. You use the ace reliever at some point, and normally late in the game. Yes, you may want them in the 4th inning for a base loaded jam, but if you shut that down, you then get the 4th & 5th out of them. They can 't leave & re-enter, which basketball players can do.

2. Often you see sitting for foul trouble with 2 fouls left, and players generally aren't playing the full game, so get them out, let them get some looks, and especially if it's before halftime, you can see what scheme tweaks defensively to address what's going on. Also it lets you look at another player on defense against the guy drawing fouls, and maybe that's a better defensive matchup for whatever reason.

3. You'll often see a guy sit when he gets 2 quick fouls to get to 3 or 4 fouls, because at that point there's often a bit of the other guy being in his head.

4. You might have been able to get more out of them, or they might have committed that final foul without a scheme/matchup change that you implemented.
   241. greenback took the 110 until the 105 Posted: March 24, 2018 at 11:49 PM (#5642747)
one hell of a basketball coach

Two of them AFAICT. The team's defense doesn't look anything like what Beilein has done historically, and apparently that's Yaklich's doing. Duncan F. Robinson missing open threes and playing tough D is not something I expected to see.
   242. smileyy Posted: March 25, 2018 at 12:37 AM (#5642750)
A guy in foul trouble is going to be a turnstile on D
   243. . . . . . . Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:08 AM (#5642758)
Two of them AFAICT. The team's defense doesn't look anything like what Beilein has done historically, and apparently that's Yaklich's doing. Duncan F. Robinson missing open threes and playing tough D is not something I expected to see.


Yep. And the Big Kahuna knows his limitations and has the confidence to delegate the D.

Turning Duncan Robinson into a 3-and D wing that can stand up to the A&M front court is a minor miracle.

Of all the teams, for this one to make the FF.... 2013 has more talent on its bench than this team has in its starting 5.
   244. KronicFatigue Posted: March 25, 2018 at 09:40 AM (#5642766)
A guy in foul trouble is going to be a turnstile on D


Only if he's playing not to foul out. Let's say a guy gets his 4th foul with 9 minutes left in the game. Conventional wisdom might say you sit him 5 minutes and let him play the last 4 "normally". We all agree they go back in the game at some point, right? And that they aren't a turnstile late in the game. They play normally because the risk of the 5th foul is only losing those last 4 minutes. BUT, the previously 5 lost minutes are already a sunk cost.

If you continue to play him with 9 minutes left (presuming there's no fatigue benefit from sitting him immediately and ignoring the valid emotional component suggested in #240) you can get anywhere from 0-9 minutes out of him. Sure, he might foul in that first minute, but that's equally true if you bring him back in later in the game.

Late in the game, in fact, there's a much higher risk of fouls, as it can become strategic if you're down and chasing the game. Seems like guys foul out on intentional fouls at the end all the time.

Has there EVER been a coach known for playing guys early through foul trouble?

Now a mostly off-topic follow up: I grew up watching the Big East, which then had 6 fouls for intra-conference games. The hype was that the Big East was so rough and tumble that the players needed that extra foul. Are there any other examples of conferences having their own set of rules? As an adult, it seems wild that they'd just play the game differently among themselves.
   245. SoSH U at work Posted: March 25, 2018 at 09:59 AM (#5642770)
I would definitely sit a guy immediately upon a fourth foul, assuming a significant amount of time remained. But I agree that coaches hold such a player back too long before reinserting him. I think that's especially true since you know that having your best five on the floor with five minutes left in a tight game is important. That isn't necessarily so in the last 1:30 (when, often, you're trying to foul them, or they're trying to foul you.)
   246. bunyon Posted: March 25, 2018 at 10:13 AM (#5642771)
It depends on the player. A player deemed "smart" is usually given a longer leash. As is a player who is key to the team. But, generally, teams try to muddle through with the guy on the bench. The idea is, if you can stay close, you can then put in your best lineup late and make a comeback. I think the question is a good one and I agree that coaches are probably too conservative in how they use players in foul trouble. This is especially true on good teams early in the season. The best way to learn to play in foul trouble is to do so. If I'm a team that knows I'll be playing in the tournament, if a guy gets in foul trouble in December or January, he stays in.
   247. Textbook Editor Posted: March 25, 2018 at 10:19 AM (#5642772)
Has there EVER been a coach known for playing guys early through foul trouble?


I don't recall specifics of how the timing of this worked out (in terms of when he picked up each foul, when he sat, etc.), but Clyde Drexler picked up 4 first-half fouls in the 1983 NCAA Championship Game against NC State and played only 25 minutes total (he did not foul out FWIW). I recall that being a pretty big deal (him even being on the court to pick up his 4th), but NC State was leading at halftime and I think/suspect that had something to do with the dice-rolling there (I can't recall the last time a guy with 3 fouls was allowed to play in the 1st half in a game I watched; usually guys get pulled after their 2nd first-half foul).
   248. . . . . . . Posted: March 25, 2018 at 04:28 PM (#5642829)
The Italian kid on Nova has a chance to be an NBA rotation player. Decent athleticism, decent length, can shoot, moves well without the ball, aggressive D.
   249. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: March 25, 2018 at 06:35 PM (#5642855)
Now a mostly off-topic follow up: I grew up watching the Big East, which then had 6 fouls for intra-conference games. The hype was that the Big East was so rough and tumble that the players needed that extra foul. Are there any other examples of conferences having their own set of rules? As an adult, it seems wild that they'd just play the game differently among themselves.
The NCAA allowed some experimentation with a shot clock and a 3 point shot before the 1982-83 season. A bunch of leagues experimented with one or both -- the ACC that year was the major conference to do both, with a 19'9" 3 point line and a 30 second shot clock that was turned off for the last four minutes of the game. Here's a contemporary NYTimes article on the various changes.

A lot of the impetus for these experiments was the extreme tedium of the 1982 ACC Championship game, where UNC had a one point lead with 8 minutes left and proceeded to hold the ball on the perimeter for a bit over 7 minutes as Virginia sat back in their zone, doing nothing. When the NCAA opened up the possibility of the rule changes, Dean Smith was probably their biggest advocate among ACC coaches even though his Four Corners offense sort of ruined pre-shot clock basketball.

In looking this up I found NC State's 1983 ACC Tournament wins over UNC and Virginia on YouTube. The both feature Dick Vitale. It's sort of amazing to remember that he was a decent color announcer before he became all shtick all the time.
   250. . . . . . . Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:14 PM (#5642862)
This Duke-Kansas game is excellent. College ball isn’t played much better than this.
   251. bunyon Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:15 PM (#5642863)
I think Smith was an advocate because he realized how powerful the four corners was. Basically, a team that could handle the ball and shoot free throws won any game in which they led by 5 in the second half.
   252. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:20 PM (#5642865)
NEWMAN!!!!
   253. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:30 PM (#5642868)
DUKE LOSIN' 'N' STORMY TESTIFYIN'!
   254. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: March 25, 2018 at 07:51 PM (#5642871)
I think Smith was an advocate because he realized how powerful the four corners was. Basically, a team that could handle the ball and shoot free throws won any game in which they led by 5 in the second half.

except against Marquette in 77
   255. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: March 25, 2018 at 08:45 PM (#5642874)
Theoretically, who would be the better match-up for Michigan? Villanova or Kansas?
   256. bunyon Posted: March 25, 2018 at 08:46 PM (#5642876)
@255: They won't play either team.
   257. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: March 25, 2018 at 08:55 PM (#5642878)
I think Smith was an advocate because he realized how powerful the four corners was. Basically, a team that could handle the ball and shoot free throws won any game in which they led by 5 in the second half.

except against Marquette in 77

Yeah, that was the game where Marquette was way ahead at the half, Carolina erased the entire deficit to go ahead by a point or three, Marquette was losing its cool----and then Carolina went back to Stall Ball. Totally killed their momentum, and when Marquette regained the lead Carolina couldn't come back a second time. That was the dumbest coached game of Dean Smith's career.
   258. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: March 25, 2018 at 10:32 PM (#5642898)
@255: They won't play either team.

Hypothetically.
   259. SPICEY WITH A SIDE OF BEER ON A BABYYYYYYY Posted: March 25, 2018 at 10:38 PM (#5642900)
Theoretically, who would be the better match-up for Michigan? Villanova or Kansas?

I think the simple answer is Kansas because they're (probably) worse than Villanova. Nova combines a pretty unique combination of creating highly efficient shots with some physicality and toughness on defense.
   260. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: March 25, 2018 at 10:51 PM (#5642905)
Marquette killed it at the line that day. Even with the BS Technical/flagrant called on Marquette's Bernard Toone,after Toone reacts to getting poked in the eye after UNC first attempts to foul Toone, UNC deserved to lose. That last minute lasted forever. God bless Al.
   261. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: March 25, 2018 at 11:37 PM (#5642917)
Marquette killed it at the line that day.

You're right about that: 23 for 25 compared to Carolina's 11 for 16.
   262. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: March 26, 2018 at 09:47 AM (#5642965)

except against Marquette in 77


And you can watch the entire game on YouTube.
   263. The Good Face Posted: March 26, 2018 at 09:55 AM (#5642969)
The Italian kid on Nova has a chance to be an NBA rotation player. Decent athleticism, decent length, can shoot, moves well without the ball, aggressive D.


He's been projected for mid-late 1st round in the 2019 draft in a number of mocks. His biggest weakness is his mental game; you can expect at least one or two "WTF was he thinking?" plays from DiVincenzo every game, including an inexplicable love for lazy bounce passes. He's like a white Kris Dunn in many ways. Apparently within the Villanova program he has a reputation of being an absolutely unstoppable 1 on 1 player.

I think the simple answer is Kansas because they're (probably) worse than Villanova. Nova combines a pretty unique combination of creating highly efficient shots with some physicality and toughness on defense.


Kansas is basically playing like Villanova this year. Savvy, veteran point guard, lots of good shooters on the wings, spread the floor and rain threes. They're just a little worse at being Villanova than Villanova is, a notch behind on both offense and defense.
   264. Tom T Posted: March 26, 2018 at 10:26 AM (#5642998)
Purdue is weird in that it never is comfortable with its natural place in the sports firmament. I remember grumbling about Tilller when he was winning 9 games a season and producing hall of fame QBs. Its not quite as tough a place to win in BB but it ain’t easy; competing with Butler for the recruits IU doesn’t want and aspiring to good academics.


It isn't quite *that* bad, but...generally, yeah.

Post-Knight, luring good basketball recruits has only required a reasonable effort. Gene's last years were crap mostly because he'd grown completely tired of recruiting and refused even to go visit the kids, saying "If they want to come here, they will." Drove his assistants NUTS. (Cuonzo Martin lived down the street from me for several years while he worked with Gene...the stories he'd tell us all....)

However, Purdue does sit in a goofy place in the basketball firmament...it arguably has the best B1G history (most titles, *nearly* a winning record against all opponents...grumble...Thad Matta...grumble), but Purdue just doesn't seem to be able to turn strong regular season success into great post-season success. Purdue has also managed never to be ranked #1 during the season (a fact that often surprises folks).

I would, however, quibble slightly and note that there was NOT much grumbling when Joe was actually winning 9 games (which only occurred 3 times, twice with Drew, once with Orton). However, Tiller retired-in-place once the previous AD declared that he wasn't going to get a dime of additional funding once the stadium improvements were announced...and I can't blame him. Why bust his butt recruiting and coaching if the total pot of money available to the program was effectively going to shrink each year? The 2004 season with Orton (the season of "the fumble") was really the last of the good years and the grumbling thereafter could be argued to be relatively well-earned as Joe and Jim Chaney stagnated the offense and Joe failed to (be able to??) hire competent replacements on the defensive coaching front. 2006 wasn't bad, per se, but it was pretty clear by then that the wheels were coming off.
   265. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: March 26, 2018 at 10:29 AM (#5643002)
Marquette was losing its cool-


That wasn't an unusual thing for Marquette in that era. The stories told by anybody associated with that program at the time suggested was a normal occurrence (to lose their cool). Legendary stories of fights, even amongst each other. MU point guard Lloyd Walton getting decked by a teammate (Delsman) in practice. Al challenged the teammate to hit him, and Delsman tried to deck McGuire. Later that year in the Tourney, at halftime vs KU, McGuire told anybody who was done playing to get the hell out there, Lloyd Walton started to get undressed and McGuire tackled him. Majerus had to get them separated. They came back to beat KU in the semis, losing to NC St. in the final.
   266. this is normal 57i66135. move on, find a new slant Posted: March 31, 2018 at 09:12 PM (#5646338)
jay wright's suit is completely blanketing kansas's offense, and his hair has their defense completely mesmerized.
   267. smileyy Posted: April 01, 2018 at 12:16 AM (#5646385)
I lol'ed, stiggles
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