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Monday, July 02, 2012

OT: NBA basketball July Thread 2012

I estimate that only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what the site is really about: Jim Furtado trolling his own site when he’s bored.

Tripon Posted: July 02, 2012 at 04:21 PM | 2487 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: basketball

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   2301. steagles Posted: September 09, 2012 at 02:28 AM (#4230788)
also, #NBArank is now up to the top 140 players in the NBA, and i'm pretty sure spencer hawes and evan turner have somehow made it in. other sixers yet to be ranked include jason richardson, thaddeus young, jrue holiday, and andrew bynum.
   2302. steagles Posted: September 11, 2012 at 12:38 AM (#4232218)
also, #NBArank is now up to the top 140 players in the NBA, and i'm pretty sure spencer hawes and evan turner have somehow made it in. other sixers yet to be ranked include jason richardson, thaddeus young, jrue holiday, and andrew bynum.
hawes and turner have both survived the next cut, and they are now among the 120 best players in the NBA. jason richardson did not, and is now #121.


and just to have a little poke, since it was a point of contention this summer: while evan turner is yet to be ranked, gordan heyward is not -- he came in at 123. so, in the words of shaq, "how's my ass taste, jazzfans*?"


*note: i fully understand that evan turner could be out of the top 300 by the end of next season if he shits the bed again, but for now, #### it, we goin' sizzler.
   2303. steagles Posted: September 11, 2012 at 08:56 AM (#4232343)
and just a few more notes on the sixers, from doug collins:

he's undecided as to who will start at the 4. could be hawes, could be young, could be allen. personally, i'm kind of rooting for allen to get the nod, since i think he's the best of the 3 on defense, and because his offensive game is better suited to play alongside jrue, ET, and bynum -- which basically means that he doesn't need the ball in his hands, he doesn't want the ball in his hands, and when the ball does get in his hands, it's either passed or shot in 2 heartbeats.

in addition, collins hinted at thaddeus young getting minutes at the 3. i'm not sure how well that'll work, since he's almost exclusively played the 4 in the NBA over the last 5 years, and he's really worked hard to grow his game to excel there. his quickness gives him a gimmick in the post at both ends of the floor, and while he's not a very good rebounder, he does have other advantages.

also, collins talked about potentially using a 1-in, 4-out lineup with bynum or hawes at center, and dorell wright at PF, jason richardson and nick young on the wings, and jrue holiday at the point. basically that lineup would give the sixers 4 shooters on the floor, spaced around a big man, in sets that i assume would be designed to look something like orlando's during their championship run in 2009.

   2304. Booey Posted: September 11, 2012 at 11:10 AM (#4232536)
and just to have a little poke, since it was a point of contention this summer: while evan turner is yet to be ranked, gordan heyward is not -- he came in at 123. so, in the words of shaq, "how's my ass taste, jazzfans*?"


Heh. When did Shaq say that? Lol

I'd still take Hayward over Turner 8 days of the week. It's cool though - Jazz fans tried to convince themselves that DWill was as good as Paul for years, so I understand the need for fans to justify their teams draft picks over better players they should have taken instead. :-)
   2305. steagles Posted: September 11, 2012 at 12:06 PM (#4232617)
Heh. When did Shaq say that? Lol
well, i took some liberties. this was the original video
   2306. Jimmy P Posted: September 11, 2012 at 01:26 PM (#4232736)
Works killing me right now, which is why I haven't been here in a while.

SB Nation is saying that ESPN is going to give Bill Simmons and SVG the halftime show for their tv coverage. Gotta say, that's pretty intriguing.
   2307. Jimmy P Posted: September 11, 2012 at 01:27 PM (#4232738)
after UNC's transcript issues

The NCAA has said there's no rules violations at UNC. Which is unreal.
   2308. jmurph Posted: September 11, 2012 at 03:28 PM (#4232864)
SB Nation is saying that ESPN is going to give Bill Simmons and SVG the halftime show for their tv coverage. Gotta say, that's pretty intriguing.


Weird. If true, I hope they add at least one good, experienced broadcaster. I'm generally a Simmons apologist, but he is not equipped to talk for minutes on end without a lot of stammering. I thought the halftime show last year was a bit stilted, too, with Wilbon and Jon Barry, and Wilbon is about 10 times the talker that Simmons is.
   2309. steagles Posted: September 11, 2012 at 04:06 PM (#4232903)
The NCAA has said there's no rules violations at UNC. Which is unreal.
it's carousel. once a year, the BCS conferences must sacrifice a school, so as to keep the rest of the monopoly safe for another 12 months. in 2010, it was UNC. in 2011, it was USC, and now in 2012, it's penn state.

there's a quota. every year, one school must get ass-hammered, but never more than one, and never less than one.
   2310. steagles Posted: September 11, 2012 at 04:07 PM (#4232904)
there's a quota. every year, one school must get ass-hammered, but never more than one, and never less than one.
come to think of it, that's may not be the best phrase to use considering the circumstances.
   2311. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 11, 2012 at 04:13 PM (#4232913)
Love a good bromance:
For the second consecutive offseason the Oklahoma City Thunder star has joined the Miami Heat Most Valuable Player for a series of collaborative and grueling two-a-day workouts near James' hometown in Akron, Ohio.
   2312. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 11, 2012 at 05:34 PM (#4233019)
   2313. puck Posted: September 11, 2012 at 05:59 PM (#4233035)
That's funny. I wonder if he did that all on his own, or if that's a budding sponsorship deal. Both those companies are Denver-based.
   2314. Booey Posted: September 11, 2012 at 11:31 PM (#4233308)
2312 - Love it. And it doesn't surprise me that only 1 person responded to the Chipotle offer - that place is nasty a$$.

Noodles and Co, OTOH, meet you in 5, JaVale!

   2315. Tom Cervo, backup catcher Posted: September 12, 2012 at 12:21 AM (#4233345)
2312 - Love it. And it doesn't surprise me that only 1 person responded to the Chipotle offer - that place is nasty a$$.


Pfft, you only say that because you have Cafe Rio around. You bastard.

hawes and turner have both survived the next cut, and they are now among the 120 best players in the NBA. jason richardson did not, and is now #121.


and just to have a little poke, since it was a point of contention this summer: while evan turner is yet to be ranked, gordan heyward is not -- he came in at 123. so, in the words of shaq, "how's my ass taste, jazzfans*?"


Hayward's underrated because he looks like he's 11.
   2316. steagles Posted: September 12, 2012 at 12:49 AM (#4233357)
Hayward's underrated because he looks like he's 11.


so, we can now quantify the difference between evan turner and gordon heyward:
heyward is the 123rd best player in the NBA

and now, evan turner can be called the 119th best player in the NBA.

where gordon heyward is a 5.09 (whatever the #### that means), evan turner is an almost exponentially better 5.15.


the difference between the two is just, such a vast chasm, that, to compare them against one another seems like an effort in comparing an elephant against, well, maybe just a slightly smaller elephant.


hawesome also came off the board, at 118. that gives 3 of the 4 slots between 118 and 121 to the sixers, and that also means that there's only 3 sixers in the top 100: thaddeus young, jrue holiday, and andrew bynum.

and i could be wrong, but i believe nikola pekovic has now surpassed lavoy allen as the highest riser between last year and this.
   2317. Booey Posted: September 12, 2012 at 01:17 AM (#4233368)
Pfft, you only say that because you have Cafe Rio around. You bastard.


Meh. I'm a snob when it comes to Mexican food. Cafe Rio is better than Chipotle for sure, but I'm not a huge fan of theirs either for the same reason; when you've grown up eating at authentic Mexican restaurants for years, these new Americanized semi-fast food imitations just don't cut it (Costa Vida is another I'd put in this group).

You want real Mexican food in the Salt Lake area, try the La Frontera/La Puente/La Fuente franchise. Simply divine.

   2318. Tom Cervo, backup catcher Posted: September 12, 2012 at 01:56 AM (#4233381)
Meh. I'm a snob when it comes to Mexican food. Cafe Rio is better than Chipotle for sure, but I'm not a huge fan of theirs either for the same reason; when you've grown up eating at authentic Mexican restaurants for years, these new Americanized semi-fast food imitations just don't cut it (Costa Vida is another I'd put in this group).

You want real Mexican food in the Salt Lake area, try the La Frontera/La Puente/La Fuente franchise. Simply divine.


I'm in Tucson now so we have awesome Mexican food, but no good quick burrito places like Cafe Rio. It may be fast food but there's no other food I'd rather get that is that cheap. I'm sure I'll be coming up for Christmas so I'll have to go to one of those and I'm sure I'll end up going to Red Iguana as well, which is very good.

I'm excited that I should be able to stay longer this year and it looks like there will be a couple Jazz games I can go to. I think the last one I was at was in 2007 against the Warriors when Fisher showed up in...OT I believe.
   2319. Booey Posted: September 12, 2012 at 10:57 AM (#4233635)
I'm in Tucson now so we have awesome Mexican food, but no good quick burrito places like Cafe Rio. It may be fast food but there's no other food I'd rather get that is that cheap. I'm sure I'll be coming up for Christmas so I'll have to go to one of those and I'm sure I'll end up going to Red Iguana as well, which is very good.


For cheap and fast Mexican, I actually prefer the Beto's/Alberto's type places over the Cafe Rio and Chipotle types. Mainly cuz they don't skimp on the cheese. If my heart doesn't skip a beat a few times when I'm eating it, I'm not interested.

I'm excited that I should be able to stay longer this year and it looks like there will be a couple Jazz games I can go to. I think the last one I was at was in 2007 against the Warriors when Fisher showed up in...OT I believe.


Loved that game. Probably my favorite game I ever attended in person. I always hated Fisher (even when he was with the Jazz), but that 3 he hit was an instant classic in team history.
   2320. andrewberg Posted: September 12, 2012 at 02:23 PM (#4233915)
Weird. If true, I hope they add at least one good, experienced broadcaster. I'm generally a Simmons apologist, but he is not equipped to talk for minutes on end without a lot of stammering. I thought the halftime show last year was a bit stilted, too, with Wilbon and Jon Barry, and Wilbon is about 10 times the talker that Simmons is.


That might be interesting if they get a host. Neither of those guys is equipped to steer the conversation. I listen to Simmons' podcast when he has a guest I like, and it always meanders excessively, even when he has interesting things to say.

I'm in Tucson now so we have awesome Mexican food, but no good quick burrito places like Cafe Rio.


At least you're close to Los Pollos Hermanos.
   2321. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 13, 2012 at 07:38 PM (#4235330)
The Knicks' '12-'13 offense is about to be unguardable:
Chris Broussard ?@Chris_Broussard
Olajuwon will be in NY next week to work out with @Amareisreal @carmeloanthony @tysonchandler & @MarcusCamby23 story on http://Espn.com
   2322. Tom Cervo, backup catcher Posted: September 14, 2012 at 12:46 AM (#4235445)
For cheap and fast Mexican, I actually prefer the Beto's/Alberto's type places over the Cafe Rio and Chipotle types. Mainly cuz they don't skimp on the cheese. If my heart doesn't skip a beat a few times when I'm eating it, I'm not interested.


I have to be drunk to enjoy places like Beto's, and even then I'd only eat there because it's the only place open

Loved that game. Probably my favorite game I ever attended in person. I always hated Fisher (even when he was with the Jazz), but that 3 he hit was an instant classic in team history.


IT's got to be up there for me as well. Jordan's GW in game 6 is far more memorable, but I didn't enjoy the outcome nearly as much. I wish I could say I was at the game when Stockton broke the assists record but one of my sisters (who didn't and doesn't really care about basketball) got to go. /still bitter

At least you're close to Los Pollos Hermanos.


Plus we're finally getting some good meth.
   2323. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 14, 2012 at 07:48 AM (#4235496)
Knicks in 2013?:
"I just wanna say -- the freakin' Knicks, man. I think they're going to be a good team," Bosh said. "Nobody's really talking about them, and I don't like it. They're flying under the radar right now. I think the Knicks are gonna be a very good team."


Knicks in 2013.:
"If we settle for anything less," he told the New York Post yesterday, "we already start off losing."
He also raised the stakes by naming a couple of teams that he thinks the Knicks could beat in order to secure the 2013 'chip. "Lakers, Heat," he said. "Whoever."
   2324. andrewberg Posted: September 14, 2012 at 02:43 PM (#4235985)
The Knicks should probably be a little better this year. A lot went wrong last year, including copious injuries to almost every key player, and a weird coaching transition that probably won't repeat itself.

On the other hand, they are also uniquely situated to be overrated by other players. Players probably look at Amare and assume he has something left in the tank because they don't want to consider the possibility that players can be physically spent at age 28. He is a unique case, though, and I would be surprised if he ever truly recovered from his lingering back/knee problems to become anything more than an above-average player. Carmelo also has cache beyond his true value, possibly because he runs with the Lebron/CP3/Wade group and carries himself like a star. If Melo really was a top 10 guy and Amare still was an All-Star, then gunning for the top of the East would be very realistic. They're not, so it's not.
   2325. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: September 14, 2012 at 05:21 PM (#4236152)
Pruiti to okc, as a video analyst
   2326. andrewberg Posted: September 14, 2012 at 06:00 PM (#4236192)
Pruiti to okc, as a video analyst


Definitely a good news/bad news thing, as I will truly miss his breakdowns.
   2327. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: September 14, 2012 at 08:42 PM (#4236258)
Agreed.

Think I did this before, but: per hoopdata, who led the league in charges last year?
   2328. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 14, 2012 at 09:29 PM (#4236282)
[2324] Related, this happened last night:
Iman Shumpert ?@I_Am_Iman
Y'all better leave Cutler alone cuz the second he throw a TD y'all wanna jock...ride or die and support ur team

“@Lsnow816: @I_Am_Iman Cutler passes about as good as Melo” Watch ur mouth homey. Deadass. Don't disrespect my vet

Iman Shumpert ?@I_Am_Iman
I'm off twitter, homey jus blew me wit dat last comment

And then this morning:
Iman Shumpert ?@I_Am_Iman
Lost my head last night. I won't apologize tho. I'm nothin more than a #RealKnicka #90sKnicksFans will understand. I'm all about my team

Iman Shumpert ?@I_Am_Iman
I refuse to let people get away with disrespect, u can criticize but don't disrespect people that pour their heart out into this league
   2329. kpelton Posted: September 15, 2012 at 02:13 AM (#4236383)
Think I did this before, but: per hoopdata, who led the league in charges last year?

This was one of my favorite discoveries researching the book.
   2330. andrewberg Posted: September 15, 2012 at 02:36 AM (#4236390)
  Roy has expressed confidence all offseason: "I want to be ready to deliver.  A lot of people think I'm going to be limited.  I tell them, 'Go ahead and think that way.'  I'm not cautious about anything.  I'm confident everything will go well." 


I remain extremely cautiously optimistic.

Good reports on Ricky! too, who is back in the US.
   2331. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: September 15, 2012 at 04:27 PM (#4236670)
Dudes with 30+ charges (per hoopdata.com):

DeMarcus Cousins 50
Jose Juan Barea 42 (Barea is notorious for this and had a higher chg/min than did Cousins)
Marcin Gortat 38
Ersan Ilyasova, Kyle Lowry 37
Blake Griffin 32
Kemba Walker, Nicolas Batum 31
Brandon Knight, John Wall, Thaddeus Young 30

I would never have guessed him, but it makes some sense in retrospect.
(Glen Davis had 20, if you're wondering.)

Most minutes played without drawing one: Nikola Vucevic, 813. Boozer and Brand drew only one each (a Duke PF thing?) - and stars/superstars Kobe (who famously is disinclined to take them), Durant, Howard, and Bynum had the least among 2000 minute guys, with two a piece.

   2332. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: September 16, 2012 at 04:40 PM (#4237377)
Ok, this was kind of cute.

One more bit of charge business: the following are the only dudes to take as many charges (min 10) as they've garnered steals or blocked shots.
J.J. Barea (42 charges, 21 steals, 0 blocks)
Samaardo Samuels (20 of each)
Brockman (16 charges, 4 steals, 1 block)
Raja Bell (15 charges, 13 steals, 2 blocks)
Ryan Hollins (12 charges, 12 blocks, 4 steals)

Barea and Brockman are the notable entries there, I think.
   2333. andrewberg Posted: September 16, 2012 at 10:36 PM (#4237585)
0 blocks for Barea still seems high.
   2334. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 17, 2012 at 03:11 PM (#4238168)
Hollinger began his season projection series today. Looks like they’re doing two teams every weekday starting with OKC and MIA and working backwards in order of elimination. For the most part, I thought the scouting reports/player cards were a good read. Thought Hollinger did an especially good job evaluating defense as he used Synergy, on/off numbers and the 82games positional numbers as well as a bit of personal observation. I did take issue with Westbrook getting dinged by Hollinger because of his assist rate. It’s hard to pile up assists when the top scorers on your team like to put the ball on the floor and create.
   2335. andrewberg Posted: September 18, 2012 at 05:07 PM (#4239437)
I have been wolfing down these Hollinger player previews. He is pretty exhaustive on the players, but does not talk about how that translates to the team as a whole. I don't blame him, since he's churning out two of these tomes per day. Here are some of the takeaways I have had:

-Miami has take the court spacing thing to heart. Basically every role player on the team is meant to be a stand-still three point shooter. Chalmers, Allen, Lewis, Miller, Jones, Battier, even Jorts. Cole and Haslem are the exceptions, and even Haslem plays the same game a few feet closer to the hoop.

-It is funny that OKC is employing Thabeet and Jones. I feel like both of those guys are obscenely laconic. I hope they make them carpool and room together so one of them has to take the initiative to open the doors and stuff.

-On the Boston breakdown, I kept waiting to get to the real center. KG plays center for them, but it is more of a modified lineup where they can space teams out with their string bean center. As I make my way through the profiles, I realize that the only true centers are Fab Melo and Jason Collins. They might actually miss the Stiemer.

   2336. kpelton Posted: September 18, 2012 at 07:23 PM (#4239574)
He is pretty exhaustive on the players, but does not talk about how that translates to the team as a whole.

Team previews come separately next month.
   2337. robinred Posted: September 18, 2012 at 07:44 PM (#4239595)
I have been wolfing down


Heh.
   2338. Jimmy P Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:11 PM (#4241166)
The Spurs have released their new uniforms.

I think they look plain and boring. Lukas has it right, they look like a practice uniform, and I can't help but nothing the absence of words and the open space. Kind of like they're saving it for some other logo or words...
   2339. Fourth True Outcome Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:23 PM (#4241184)
The Celtics have just picked up some manna from heaven for the veteran minimum. Seems like a pretty good move to get a solid backup, and the definitely needed another big man.
   2340. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:38 PM (#4241214)

The Celtics have just picked up some manna from heaven for the veteran minimum.


I'm a Celtics fan, and I approve it if only to see Simmons' reaction.
   2341. Jimmy P Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:40 PM (#4241219)
The Celtics have just picked up some manna from heaven for the veteran minimum.


KG can practice his fighting now.
   2342. steagles Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:44 PM (#4241226)
The Celtics have just picked up some manna from heaven for the veteran minimum. Seems like a pretty good move to get a solid backup, and the definitely needed another big man.
i remember when this offseason started and i was kind of hoping the sixers would get darko to sure up the defense in the middle.


now? i'm just kinda giggling, because i assume this is a move that's intended to counter the sixers' addition of andrew bynum.



   2343. Jon T. Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:56 PM (#4241244)
they got him for the veterans minimum. I assume he is just taking Steimsma's minutes. It's not like he is a key addition or anything.
   2344. Fourth True Outcome Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:56 PM (#4241246)
now? i'm just kinda giggling, because i assume this is a move that's intended to counter the sixers' addition of andrew bynum.


There's certainly some truth to that, I suspect, but I also think they just really needed another big man. Unless you're irrationally high on Fab Melo's ability to contribute quickly, they only had Chris Wilcox and Jason Collins behind KG. I don't know that you can count on KG being healthy for a full season at this point, and without him they would have been painfully thin.

Really, though, I think the move was made because of the comedy, intentional and otherwise, that seems will result inevitably from putting Darko in that lockerroom and with Tommy Heinsohn announcing him...
   2345. Jon T. Posted: September 20, 2012 at 01:56 PM (#4241247)
I am liking this NBA player countdown, Iggy is 28th, I wonder where Bynum will be
   2346. robinred Posted: September 20, 2012 at 02:01 PM (#4241253)
Milicic is a good idea for Boston.
   2347. robinred Posted: September 20, 2012 at 02:03 PM (#4241255)
johnhollinger John Hollinger
OMG @sportsguy33 rooting for Darko. This will be awesome.
42 minutes ago
   2348. smileyy Posted: September 20, 2012 at 02:48 PM (#4241326)
Those Spurs uniforms look like change for change's sake. I always thought they had a fairly classic timeless uniform.
   2349. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: September 20, 2012 at 03:03 PM (#4241350)
I assume that between Darko and the return of Wilcox, who was rounding into a really efficient finisher for Rondo and a solid part of the defensive system when he went down, we'll see a lot more of KG shifting back to the 4 with a bench center, depending on matchups. He's got to be excited about that, given his quotes about how he "hates, hates, hates" playing center.

Also, the Cs can credibly roll out both tiny lineups, with three guards and Pierce at the 4, and huge ones, with Green and Pierce at the wings and KG and (Wilcox/Darko) up front.

I'm getting really excited for this season. This is by far the deepest roster the Celtics have had in the Garnett era.
   2350. Russlan is fond of Dillon Gee Posted: September 20, 2012 at 03:58 PM (#4241418)
Those Spurs uniforms look like change for change's sake. I always thought they had a fairly classic timeless uniform.

I think they are just an alternate jersey. They are pretty ugly.
   2351. smileyy Posted: September 20, 2012 at 04:17 PM (#4241448)
[2350] I hope so. On that front, I'm all for experimentation.
   2352. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: September 20, 2012 at 05:41 PM (#4241528)
Celtics waive Keyon Dooling. It's a move with very little on-court impact, but I'm going to miss his defensive stance and (especially) his quotes for the press. Classy guy.

Also, something about the shade of those new Spurs uniforms just makes them look like sweatpants to me.
   2353. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: September 20, 2012 at 06:34 PM (#4241567)
Uh oh.
BREAKING NEWS: #Suns Channing Frye sideline indefinitely with dilated cardiomyopathy, an enlarged heart. Details to follow.
However, this does have the silver lining of cleaning up the Suns' frontcourt rotation. Also, it makes room for Beasley to get some time at the 4, which is where he's played better than as a wing.
   2354. Spivey Posted: September 20, 2012 at 06:59 PM (#4241584)
Channing Frye is better than Beasley, so I don't think "clearing up space" is a legitimate argument here.
   2355. Every Inge Counts Posted: September 20, 2012 at 08:04 PM (#4241627)
NBATV is playing Hoop Dreams right now. This movie is just great. Nothing to do with the NBA, but just needed to be said (obviously...)
   2356. Spivey Posted: September 20, 2012 at 08:35 PM (#4241649)
I owned Hoop Dreams on VHS for the last decade. It was literally the only reason why I owned a VHS player for most of that time. I gave it to my dad half a year ago. 2355 prompted me to check online, and Amazon sells it on DVD, Criterion Collection. It seriously could be my favorite movie ever.

Edit: Obviously, I am buying it.
   2357. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2012 at 11:16 PM (#4241745)
Those Spurs uniforms look like change for change's sake.
WELCOME TO OBAMA'S AMERICA.
NBATV is playing Hoop Dreams right now. This movie is just great. Nothing to do with the NBA, but just needed to be said (obviously...)
Oh, man, that was one of the most emotionally wrenching documentaries I've ever seen. It should be required viewing for every high school player in America.
   2358. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: September 21, 2012 at 12:43 AM (#4241768)
The scene where Arthur plays one-on-one against his father is one of the most affecting pieces of film I've ever seen. Incredible movie start to finish.
   2359. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: September 21, 2012 at 01:35 PM (#4242181)
BBTF fantasy basketball league. 16 teams max; scoring based on Hollinger's Game Score:
(Points x 1.0) + (FGM x 0.4) + (FGA x -0.7) + ((FTA-FTM) x -0.4) + (OREB x 0.7) + (DREB x 0.3) + (STL x 1.0) + (AST x 0.7) + (BLK x 0.7) + (PF x -0.4) + (TO x -1.0)
League is #17814; PW is albright
   2360. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: September 21, 2012 at 07:04 PM (#4242623)
Bad link - use this:

BBTF fantasy basketball league. 16 teams max; scoring based on Hollinger's Game Score:
(Points x 1.0) + (FGM x 0.4) + (FGA x -0.7) + ((FTA-FTM) x -0.4) + (OREB x 0.7) + (DREB x 0.3) + (STL x 1.0) + (AST x 0.7) + (BLK x 0.7) + (PF x -0.4) + (TO x -1.0)
League is #17814; PW is albright
   2361. GregD Posted: September 21, 2012 at 09:20 PM (#4242685)
I owned Hoop Dreams on VHS for the last decade. It was literally the only reason why I owned a VHS player for most of that time. I gave it to my dad half a year ago. 2355 prompted me to check online, and Amazon sells it on DVD, Criterion Collection. It seriously could be my favorite movie ever.
Have you seen Stevie? A documentary he made after Hoop Dreams? About a kid in southern Illinois whom Steve James was a Big Brother to for a few years then lost track of? Totally, absolutely devastating.
   2362. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 24, 2012 at 12:01 PM (#4244122)
Kyrylo Fesenko

@KyryloFesenko
Just landed in Chicago. Tomorrow I have a workout with the Bulls. Really excited to see Korver, Boozer and Brewer!


Uh...

Kyrylo Fesenko

@KyryloFesenko
My bad, people. I didn't know, that Kyle and Ronnie is gone from Chicago. Thank you for info.
   2363. Booey Posted: September 24, 2012 at 12:14 PM (#4244132)
Kyrylo Fesenko

@KyryloFesenko
Just landed in Chicago. Tomorrow I have a workout with the Bulls. Really excited to see Korver, Boozer and Brewer!


What's with the Bulls wanting to pick up all the old Jazz castaways?

I think Raja Bell might be available. Have at it, Chicago.

   2364. robinred Posted: September 25, 2012 at 02:12 AM (#4244864)
NBA rank, 16-20:

16 Parker
17 Anthony
18 Bosh
19 Nash
20 Aldridge

Minnesota, apparently looking to make their roster as white as the True Hoop writing staff, added Louis Amundson today.
   2365. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 11:39 AM (#4245120)
NBA rank, 16-20:

16 Parker
17 Anthony
18 Bosh
19 Nash
20 Aldridge


With Kobe, Howard, and Pau still to come, this means the Lakers have 4 of the top 20 players (if you believe these rankings) Of course, since Bynum hasn't been listed yet either, I guess they still would have even if they hadn't gotten Dwight.

I'm a little surprised that DWill is still in the top 15, though I guess none of the guys already listed are clearly better.
   2366. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 11:46 AM (#4245131)
Who's left, anyways?

LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Howard, P.Gasol, Paul, Rose, Westbrook, Durant, Dirk, DWill, Love, Griffin, Bynum. One more...

(and the above were listed in random order)
   2367. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 11:47 AM (#4245134)
[2366] Has Rondo been listed?
   2368. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 11:52 AM (#4245140)
#2367 - D'oh! I don't think so, so he's got to be it.

Lots of great PG's these days. That's 5 of the top 15 and 7 of the top 20.
   2369. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 12:11 PM (#4245169)
I don't get the Tony Parker thing and I guess I probably never will.
   2370. robinred Posted: September 25, 2012 at 12:14 PM (#4245179)
Rondo has not been listed yet; and I saw a little ESPNoise to the effect that Rondo should not be ahead of Garnett, who was #22.

The rankings are based on 104 ESPN "experts" opinions.
   2371. andrewberg Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:05 PM (#4245236)
Minnesota, apparently looking to make their roster as white as the True Hoop writing staff, added Louis Amundson today.


Yet another independently defensible move. Amundson can be the fifth big behind Love/Williams and Pek/Stiemsma. He can fill in as a spot backup if one of those four gets hurt and suck up minutes in blowouts. He will play hard and defend pretty well and they got him for the minimum. The fact that all of these moves make sense in a vacuum makes the race thing more defensible, but also stranger in a way.

LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Howard, P.Gasol, Paul, Rose, Westbrook, Durant, Dirk, DWill, Love, Griffin, Bynum. One more...


I'm a little surprised that Pau remains ahead of Bosh and Aldridge. I know his numbers take a hit due to usage, but he has also aged and some of the slippage is probably legitimate decline. Hard to pinpoint, I guess.
   2372. Famous Original Joe C Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:37 PM (#4245278)
I don't get the Tony Parker thing and I guess I probably never will.

I don't either!
   2373. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:41 PM (#4245285)
Parker: Someone has to be overrated on the Spurs, right?
The fact that all of these moves make sense in a vacuum means we have to be discussing the Wolves.
   2374. robinred Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:47 PM (#4245293)
The fact that all of these moves make sense in a vacuum makes the race thing more defensible, but also stranger in a way.


I was just making a joke. I don't think Kahn is making a conscious effort to get a bunch of white dudes; I think it has just worked out that way, and I think it is sort of funny. No offense intended.

Mostly, I said it because like all good Laker Fanboys, I never pass up an opportunity to tweak True Hoop.
   2375. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:48 PM (#4245294)
I don't get the Tony Parker thing and I guess I probably never will.


Count the ringzzz!!!!!
   2376. robinred Posted: September 25, 2012 at 01:48 PM (#4245295)
Joe C-

I sent you an email from my new account about two weeks ago (WRT politics, not basketball).

Did you get it?
   2377. robinred Posted: September 25, 2012 at 02:03 PM (#4245312)
13 Bynum
14 Griffin
15 P Gasol
   2378. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 02:33 PM (#4245357)
5 of the top dozen now are PG's.

Williams and Rondo should've been ranked already, IMO.

And Dirk may be getting a bit of a career bonus...
   2379. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 02:37 PM (#4245362)
[2377] Agreed on all counts.

EDIT: In a ranking of best players RIGHT NOW, I would take Nash over Parker and Williams without thinking twice.
   2380. andrewberg Posted: September 25, 2012 at 02:46 PM (#4245373)
I was just making a joke. I don't think Kahn is making a conscious effort to get a bunch of white dudes; I think it has just worked out that way, and I think it is sort of funny. No offense intended.


I agree completely. It's funny to me specifically because it just worked out that way, similar to the way it would be funny if Andris Biedrins somehow made 20 consecutive free throws. The odds are about the same.
   2381. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:06 PM (#4245461)
This DRose commercial is both awesome and horrifyingly painful at the same time. Well done, adidas.
   2382. Jon T. Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:11 PM (#4245470)
I agree completely that Rondo should not be ahead of Garnett. I would have moved both KG and Duncan into the top 20. as for the remaining 10

Lebron
(gap)
Durant
Chris Paul
Howard
(Gap)
Kobe
Love
Wade
Westbrook
(gap)
Rose
Deron Williams
   2383. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:13 PM (#4245474)
11 Dirk
12 Rondo
   2384. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:30 PM (#4245491)
Holy ####, I just realized this means Deron Williams got voted a Top 10 player.
   2385. Manny Coon Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:39 PM (#4245500)
Deron Williams over Pau Gasol and Blake Griffin is crazy to me. As for Gasol over guys like Aldridge and Bosh, I think Gasol is a still a significantly defender than both of them, so I think it reasonable he is ahead of them.

Griffin in general seems to low to me. Sure he's got a lot of holes in his game still, but the stuff he does well he does really well.
   2386. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:39 PM (#4245501)
Westbrook
(gap)
Rose


Crazy /partial fanboy reaction. Unless you mean today, injury and all.
   2387. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:54 PM (#4245521)
Can we please do a BBTFRank? Please? Pretty please? It will kill time until we get ready to make our Lakers-Heat Finals predictions. How about everyone gives a grade of 1-10 (10 being the best) to each player ranked in ESPN's Top 50 and then you're allowed to give grades to 10 more guys that you feel are Top 50 quality. Average the grades* and voila, BBTFRank. I will volunteer to collect the votes or we can do an excel sheet on Google Do...Drive or we can use another method if someone has a better suggestion.

*-Outside vote guys would get ranked in order of (1) appeared on most ballots, then (2) average grade on those ballots. For example, Player A ranked on 2 outside ballots as a 7 would be below Player B ranked on 5 outside ballots with grades of 4 7s and 1 6. Or some other better system.
   2388. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 25, 2012 at 04:57 PM (#4245529)
Can you set up a document/survey for us to fill in? How easy is that to do? Because I'd participate for sure.
   2389. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:03 PM (#4245538)
1. Kobe Bryant
2. Everyone else.

AMIRITE?!
   2390. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:07 PM (#4245547)
I love ranking things, I'd be in for that.

Crazy /partial fanboy reaction. Unless you mean today, injury and all.


As opposed to? As sad as it is, I think we have to assume until proven otherwise that given the severity of the injury, Rose will never get back to his previous level until proven otherwise, and might not get close.
   2391. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:12 PM (#4245557)
1. Kobe Bryant
2. Everyone else.

AMIRITE?!


I think you mean:

1. Kobe Bryant
1000. Everyone else.

The gap is just that big.
   2392. andrewberg Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:17 PM (#4245565)
As for Gasol over guys like Aldridge and Bosh, I think Gasol is a still a significantly defender than both of them, so I think it reasonable he is ahead of them.


Granting the premise, I think that's a reasonable conclusion, but I'm not sure I do agree that Gasol is a significantly better defender. Bosh has similar strengths and weaknesses- good athlete, good length, pretty quick, works hard, can be pushed around by bigger guys, not an intimidating help defender. What is the reason to think Bosh is significantly worse?
   2393. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:28 PM (#4245587)
As opposed to? As sad as it is, I think we have to assume until proven otherwise that given the severity of the injury, Rose will never get back to his previous level until proven otherwise, and might not get close.

Considering the number of ACL injuries and recoveries (see Peterson, Adrian), I see no reason to assume that at all. Yes, there's a risk, but I don't want to go overboard either.

Also, I'm still touchy on the Westbrook/Rose stuff (talking points that include both context and Rose was better the last 2 years anyway, etc).
   2394. andrewberg Posted: September 25, 2012 at 05:35 PM (#4245597)
I think I would narrowly take Rose over Westbrook over the rest of their respective careers, but it is much closer than it was before Rose's injury. In fact, it is basically a toss-up.

Edit: Part of it is that Rose is likely to miss a good chunk of this season. If both guys have 5-8 productive years left, and Rose misses at least half of this season, then he has to be 6-10% better the rest of that time to come out ahead.
   2395. Manny Coon Posted: September 25, 2012 at 06:22 PM (#4245637)
Granting the premise, I think that's a reasonable conclusion, but I'm not sure I do agree that Gasol is a significantly better defender. Bosh has similar strengths and weaknesses- good athlete, good length, pretty quick, works hard, can be pushed around by bigger guys, not an intimidating help defender. What is the reason to think Bosh is significantly worse?


It's mostly subjective on my part, Gasol does block more shots, but that isn't enough evidence on it's own (he's also the best rebounder, but that doesn't mean too much either). I might just be overreacting because I think Gasol often doesn't get enough credit for his defense and he's been a key player on a lot of good defense teams, but I might be giving him too much career credit. I may also be underestimating Bosh's and Aldridge's defense; Bosh I think has improved his defense since going to Miami and Aldridge has really good defense +/- numbers the last few years. Overall those guys are all close and I'd easily take all of them over Parker or Williams.

   2396. Spivey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 06:28 PM (#4245644)
I'd take Westbrook over Rose going forward and not think twice. Yeah, we don't need to go overboard with Roses' injury, but we're not exactly comparing him to chopped liver either. I'd take Westbrook over Paul going forward too.... (This is more a statement on thinking Paul is going to decline fast and hard, though I'm sure I'll get called out for this.)

Aldridge seems to be pretty underrated at 20. He seems to be similar to Bosh and Gasol, both of whom I like, but he is a little more versatile on where he can play inside. I'd take him over both. Nevermind the clowns like Anthony and Williams that are ranked above him and many others.
   2397. Gold Star - just Gold Star Posted: September 25, 2012 at 07:53 PM (#4245687)
We're only at seven owners for the BBTF fantasy hoops league. C'mon, people!

League is #17814; PW is albright
   2398. Booey Posted: September 25, 2012 at 07:53 PM (#4245688)
I'm not sure I do agree that Gasol is a significantly better defender. Bosh has similar strengths and weaknesses- good athlete, good length, pretty quick, works hard, can be pushed around by bigger guys, not an intimidating help defender.


Both ugly as sin itself...
   2399. Fourth True Outcome Posted: September 25, 2012 at 08:05 PM (#4245696)
Both ugly as sin itself...


What, you have something against raptor-faced men?
   2400. smileyy Posted: September 25, 2012 at 08:07 PM (#4245698)
I signed up for the league -- I hope I don't have to miss the draft like I did last year. Really took away a lot of my motivation for participating. But I don't think I'll be in Las Vegas this time.
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