Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Sunday, April 01, 2012

OT: NBA monthly thread: April 2012

I estimate that only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what the site is really about: JoePo leaving SI and Mike Sweeney endorsing Rick Santorum.

News link is to story on Jeremy Lin’s injury.

baudib Posted: April 01, 2012 at 05:35 PM | 2013 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags:

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 6 of 21 pages ‹ First  < 4 5 6 7 8 >  Last ›
   501. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 09:52 AM (#4102515)
Say what you will about Isiah Thomas's coaching, GMing, management skills, etc, but people really seem to like the guy and like playing for him:

Stunned by their school's decision cut loose Isiah Thomas last Friday afternoon, members of the Florida International basketball team found a clever way to support the fired coach. As a speaker introduced a highlight video from FIU's season at Monday night's end-of-the-year banquet in the team's honor, the Golden Panthers got up from their table, walked in a single-file line in front of the podium and exited the building en masse.
   502. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:09 AM (#4102532)
From Marc Stein's power ratings:

As Jeff McDonald of the San Antonio Express-News noted on Twitter, new Spur Boris Diaw has seen more wins since March 23 (10) than his old team (Charlotte) has all season.


HA!
   503. The Essex Snead Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:19 AM (#4102540)
[501] He must let players do whatever the hell they want, because I can't think of any other way to reconcile how bad his teams are w/ how much his players like him.
   504. Booey Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:37 AM (#4102564)
Say the grizzlies win it all this year (gay Randolph and gasol all healthy playing like a big 3) everyone will point to last year as the year they moved over the hump and this year as the year they put it together.

Hey now. Let's leave players sexual preference out of this...
   505. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:05 AM (#4102601)
If San Antonio is not the favorite to face OKC in the conference finals, then who is? The Lakers? The Grizzlies?


The Spurs over the last two seasons have taken OKC behind the wood shed. The Thunder have to be hoping that the Spurs run into the Grizzlies at some point. (Although, this season, the Spurs are 3-0 against Memphis)

Those three teams are interesting because they're all pretty even, but the individual matchups are very skewed. Memphis kills the Spurs, the Spurs kill the Thunder, and the Thunder have beaten the Grizzlies.

I'm still not 100% sold on the Thunder as the definitive favorite. They have some glaring weaknesses that may be exposed over a 7 game series against good teams.
   506. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:16 AM (#4102621)
He must let players do whatever the hell they want, because I can't think of any other way to reconcile how bad his teams are w/ how much his players like him.

But that's the way a lot of college coach firings are. Most of the time the players are not happy about it. Which is to be expected, the coach is probably the primary reason they chose a school.
   507. JC in DC Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:17 AM (#4102624)
I'm still not 100% sold on the Thunder as the definitive favorite. They have some glaring weaknesses that may be exposed over a 7 game series against good teams.


Can you expand on this? In my opinion, the whole issue for them is whether Durant is mature and good enough to carry them. They have solid enough "everything else" that if Durant plays to the level of player people think he is, then they should be very successful. If he does not, then I'll be surprised if they make it out of the West.
   508. JC in DC Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:18 AM (#4102626)
But that's the way a lot of college coach firings are. Most of the time the players are not happy about it. Which is to be expected, the coach is probably the primary reason they chose a school.


He's so an egomaniac that he would never tell them NOT to do that, to show class and not upstage the banquet.
   509. JJ1986 Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:20 AM (#4102628)
Can you expand on this?


Not Jimmy, but the big issue for me is that their coach is horrible.
   510. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:21 AM (#4102630)
Can you expand on this? In my opinion, the whole issue for them is whether Durant is mature and good enough to carry them. They have solid enough "everything else" that if Durant plays to the level of player people think he is, then they should be very successful. If he does not, then I'll be surprised if they make it out of the West.

Not who you're talking to but, POOMA, I still wonder whether they have enough 3 point shooting to keep defenses honest and whether Durant will be as successful against more physical postseason defenses where the refs aren't calling the touch fouls he usually gets. Then the late game creativity/playcalling issue. IIRC, they've gotten better at it, but I still have a few Durant 30+ ft 3 pointers in my head.
   511. rr Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:30 AM (#4102639)
If San Antonio is not the favorite to face OKC in the conference finals, then who is?


They are. But as I said, I think their overall depth will be less of an advantage in the post-season and it will come down to how Ginobili and to a lesser extent, Splitter, do. The Spurs won 61 games last year, remember. People have used the old "rock/paper/scissors" line to describe the West the last couple of years. It is a little less true this time, but it is still accurate to some extent.

I think people are selling OKC a little short. I see them as favorites in spite of their regular-season matchup issues with the Spurs. They have star power, shooting, size, and speed, and they have been together for awhile now. I see their biggest problem as the same one they had last year: lack of a low-post scorer, which limits late-game options (that is partly on Brooks as well).
   512. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:34 AM (#4102646)
As I said the other day, the Thunder are a step behind the East contenders defensively. They have only one shut down wing defender (Sefolosha) and his minutes are going to be severely limited in the playoffs. I think their interior defense is good, but more on a team level than an individual level (IOW, it's a reason why someone like Z-Bo hurts them). It's very possible their offense is going to be able to overcome that - it definitely will on certain nights when shots are falling. IMO, it's the same level of questions that people have about the Bulls or Heat (or Spurs); things that are being brought up because none of the contender favorites are infallible or have been consistently dominating.
   513. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:36 AM (#4102652)
Can you expand on this?
------------
I still wonder whether they have enough 3 point shooting to keep defenses honest and whether Durant will be as successful against more physical postseason defenses where the refs aren't calling the touch fouls he usually gets. Then the late game creativity/playcalling issue. IIRC, they've gotten better at it, but I still have a few Durant 30+ ft 3 pointers in my head.


With [509], I'm not convinced that Scott Brooks is a good coach. I've never been impressed with his plays off timeouts and end games.

I think that their 3 point shooting is very weak, especially now since they've been giving Fisher more minutes at the expense of Cook. I also think that they could have some horrible crunch time lineups. Harden-Durant-Westbrook-Perk-Ibaka/Thabo sounds good, but you're looking at 3 on 5 when you're on offense. I believe it was Zach Lowe who's been pointing out that Westbrook just isn't that good at defense (I heard it on Rusillo's podcast). Westbrook gets steals, but he's not good at defending someone like Parker.
   514. Spivey Posted: April 10, 2012 at 12:17 PM (#4102700)
Ibaka has a decent offensive game. Perkins will be interesting. You could argue he's been awful since they traded for him. They'll need him to be better, or to give minutes to Collison late.
   515. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 12:32 PM (#4102709)
Ibaka has a decent offensive game

Not so sure on that this year. Lots of turnovers, and he can't shoot outside of the charge circle.

You could argue he's been awful since they traded for him

No need to argue, just say it. He's been awful since they traded for him.
   516. andrewberg Posted: April 10, 2012 at 12:50 PM (#4102727)
Not sure if anyone posted this yet, but Zeller and the other guy (Watford) are coming back to IU. I thought Zeller was gone for sure since it sounded like he'd go in the lotto, but good for Crean for keeping them around and taking another step toward getting that program back near the top.
   517. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 01:46 PM (#4102790)
Isn't it Tyler Zeller projecting to be the lottery pick? I don't recall seeing Cody's name up there, but I could be wrong, but I don't see Cody rated on DX's prospect board for some reason. Maybe no one thought he was coming out this year anyway?

If he were projected to be a lottery pick this year, I'm not sure I can echo "Good for Crean for keeping him around." But I hate the NCAA (but love college basketball.)
   518. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 01:49 PM (#4102795)
The OKC narrative will seem to be, yet again, "When physical defenses and elite defenders take away some of Durant's game, how does Scott Brooks respond? How does Russell Westbrook respond."

As much as I cringed at some of Westbrook's shots in the playoffs last year...if his other All-NBA running mate can't get it going, that job kind of falls on him. If the Thunder don't make the Finals, Brooks's seat would be rather uncomfortable, I'd think.
   519. Spivey Posted: April 10, 2012 at 01:57 PM (#4102814)
It was Tyler Zeller that was projected to be the late lotto. I don't think his brother is ready, though he had a good year as a freshman.
   520. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:16 PM (#4102866)
I can't wait until this is tracked more extensively.

---

I thought Cody is supposed to be the better prospect than Tyler. But I can't confirm that now, because most sites aren't including Cody now that he's going back to school.

---

Sure sounds like Rose is out again tonight:

KCJHoop: John Paxson tells #Bulls flagship station WMVP that DRose is "sore" and "we're not going to risk anything" with him.

KCJHoop: DRose said injury affected him in 4th qtr and OT. Said he's gametime and "for sure" will be back before season ends.


The fact that they're asking him if he thinks he'll play again this regular season is still very unsettling.
   521. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:19 PM (#4102874)
I thought Cody is supposed to be the better prospect than Tyler. But I can't confirm that now, because most sites aren't including Cody now that he's going back to school

IIRC, Cody was ranked 5-10 on most lists so he is the better prospect. I do remember seeing some concerns about his wingspan though.
   522. andrewberg Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:19 PM (#4102875)
It was Tyler Zeller that was projected to be the late lotto. I don't think his brother is ready, though he had a good year as a freshman.


Chad Ford projected Cody to be the 6th overall pick in his last mock draft.
   523. Conor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:21 PM (#4102881)
Cody was definitely considered a better prospect than Tyler; I think he was in Chad Ford's top 5 or so. The Zellers are a very academically oriented family, so I guess i am not totally surprised Zeller is coming back, but still, anytime a guy thought that highly of comes back, I am a little surprised.
   524. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:25 PM (#4102894)
Tom Crean can go #### himself.
   525. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:26 PM (#4102900)
I've heard that crap from IU fans about how important education is and point to Cody's brothers as proof that he'll be around forever. Luke Zeller sucked, and Tyler wasn't a real prospect until his junior season. Watford and Zeller coming back means that once again Crean will run off a kid he gave a scholarship to.
   526. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:29 PM (#4102905)
[525] Hate the game, not the player? It happens everywhere.
   527. Conor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:33 PM (#4102911)
I don't think Cody will stay 4 years or anything like that, but I am less surprised to hear this than I would for another player of his ability.
   528. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:45 PM (#4102942)
No, it doesn't happen everywhere. Is it possible to take away David Williams's offer again? Would that help clear up the situation?
   529. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:50 PM (#4102954)
You're right -- some schools don't care about competing, and won't put their boot on the ass on the player at the end of the bench until they "decide" to transfer or "decide" to forego their scholarship for a year.
   530. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:52 PM (#4102958)
And some schools hire an unethical coach, don't monitor him, then give him a standing ovation after he's caught cheating again.
   531. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:54 PM (#4102963)
That's a good reminder, that, for (probably) the last time:

Dear Kelvin Sampson,
Thanks for everything!
Love,
The Xavier Musketeers
   532. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 02:59 PM (#4102970)
And the Detroit Titans.
   533. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:04 PM (#4102980)
And the Ohio Bobcats. Sampson was a caring, giving man. Helping out other programs, calling every day to check in on recruits...what more can be said about the man?
   534. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:25 PM (#4103028)
Tom Crean can go #### himself.


Agreed.

good for Crean for keeping them around and taking another step toward getting that program back near the top.

The Big Ten looks so much better when that program is in the ####### basement.

   535. smileyy Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:26 PM (#4103029)
What's the source of the Crean hate? I don't love the guy, but I'm not close enough to the Big Ten or IU to know more.
   536. Jimmy P Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:30 PM (#4103039)
What's the source of the Crean hate? I don't love the guy, but I'm not close enough to the Big Ten or IU to know more.


For me, he works for shitty university.
   537. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:32 PM (#4103042)
Jimmy hates him because he's a Purdue fan/grad. SSR and I have never liked him since he held a press conference* saying he wasn't interested in the UI job (this was after Self left for KU and UI hired Weber) after campaigning for it but not getting any interest from the school. Minor quibbles in the grand scheme of things, obviously.

*Maybe it wasn't a press conference, it might have just been a statement. Either way, he did leverage it into a raise at Marquette.
   538. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 03:47 PM (#4103068)
Also, he acts like a complete spaz on the sidelines.
   539. just plain joe Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:00 PM (#4103084)
Also, he acts like a complete spaz on the sidelines.


Plus he looks like Dwight Shrute.
   540. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:09 PM (#4103098)
Also, he acts like a complete spaz on the sidelines.

We might be in trouble with this one next season.
   541. SouthSideRyan Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:11 PM (#4103102)
Bruce Weber didn't exactly acquit himself well in that regard either.
   542. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:19 PM (#4103112)
Some great quotes coming through on the Nets press conference in their new arena with Prokhorov:

KBergCBS: Prokhorov on Mark Cuban competing for D-Will: "Let the best man win. If he wins, I will crush him in kickboxing throwdown." (!!)
   543. Fourth True Outcome Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:30 PM (#4103129)
That is the Prokhorov we've all been waiting for!
   544. andrewberg Posted: April 10, 2012 at 04:38 PM (#4103143)
That is the Prokhorov we've all been waiting for!


It seems to me that there's some symmetry to running for office against Vladimir Putin, then trying to outspend Mark Cuban for a basketball player. His next project should be trying to get in a bidding war with facebook for a low value social networking startup.
   545. Eddo Posted: April 10, 2012 at 05:31 PM (#4103204)
It seems to me that there's some symmetry to running for office against Vladimir Putin, then trying to outspend Mark Cuban for a basketball player. His next project should be trying to get in a bidding war with facebook for a low value social networking startup.

Or to get involved in a land war in Asia.
   546. andrewberg Posted: April 10, 2012 at 05:41 PM (#4103213)
Or to get involved in a land war in Asia.


Or go in against a Sicilian when DEATH is on the line!
   547. Chicago Joe Posted: April 10, 2012 at 08:14 PM (#4103385)
Plus he looks like Dwight Shrute.


And he has a fake tan.
   548. Fourth True Outcome Posted: April 10, 2012 at 08:22 PM (#4103399)
At this point I'm hoping the C's play the Heat at some point in the playoffs, because I have no idea what would happen.
   549. rr Posted: April 10, 2012 at 08:28 PM (#4103411)
Haberstroh Tweeted that Boston is 16/24 on shots beyond 10 feet tonight, including 7/10 on 3s. So yes, when Boston is hitting that many of the numerous jumpers they take, they are tough.

Boston deserves credit for getting hot like this when everyone had written them off--but I am still pretty sure a playoff series between BOS and MIA would only look like tonight or the last meeting 1 or 2 times.
   550. The District Attorney Posted: April 10, 2012 at 08:31 PM (#4103420)
KBergCBS: Prokhorov on Mark Cuban competing for D-Will: "Let the best man win. If he wins, I will crush him in kickboxing throwdown." (!!)
And if he dies, he dies.
   551. Fourth True Outcome Posted: April 10, 2012 at 08:38 PM (#4103433)
Boston deserves credit for getting hot like this when everyone had written them off--but I am still pretty sure a playoff series between BOS and MIA would only look like tonight or the last meeting 1 or 2 times.


Oh, I don't know that I think the Celtics could take the Heat any significant percentage of the time, but based on the games they've had this season, the Celtics (admittedly potentially quite flukey) recent stretch, I think there could be some really good games.
   552. rr Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:49 PM (#4103603)
It's been well-established that ESPN's Skip Bayless is a workout fiend. He spends endless hours on the treadmill, and looks to be in fantastic shape for his age. It's also been well-established that Bayless is a fame-hungry sellout that will say anything on air (and formerly, before he realized it wasn't making him famous enough, in print) just to draw a reaction, and more eyes, and more ratings. Recently, Bayless criticized Oklahoma City point guard Russell Westbrook without the slightest bit of basketball smarts, or hint of nuance, much less research. OKC All-Star Kevin Durant rightfully took his obsessive brand of ignorance to task, and Bayless responded by pumping up his own credits as a high school point guard who finally learned that PGs should think "pass" 12 times before they fire away, on Twitter.

Bayless' ESPN co-host Jalen Rose, after a bit of research of his own, took on Skip after Bayless claimed that he started as a shot-happy point guard for a high school team that made the state finals in Oklahoma. Bayless didn't start for his high school squad, it turns out, and didn't even play for the varsity until his senior season, when he averaged 1.4 points per game.


http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/jalen-rose-calls-skip-bayless-air-trumped-high-214530179.html
   553. PJ Martinez Posted: April 10, 2012 at 10:56 PM (#4103609)
@WindhorstESPN In 14 national TV games this year Rajon Rondo has averaged 17.8 points & shot 49%. Other games: 9.6 points & shot 44%

Would be curious to see the other stats (but not curious enough to do the research).
   554. PJ Martinez Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:15 PM (#4103619)
Also kind of curious who gets Defensive Player of the Year this season. Assuming Howard won't win because of his trade/SVG shenanigans. So... LeBron? Chandler? Tony Allen?
   555. It's a shame about Athletic Supporter Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:19 PM (#4103621)
Also kind of curious who gets Defensive Player of the Year this season. Assuming Howard won't win because of his trade/SVG shenanigans. So... LeBron? Chandler? Tony Allen?


As I understand it, it's Iman Shumpert way ahead of the pack, then everyone else.
   556. tshipman Posted: April 10, 2012 at 11:42 PM (#4103635)
Also kind of curious who gets Defensive Player of the Year this season. Assuming Howard won't win because of his trade/SVG shenanigans. So... LeBron? Chandler? Tony Allen?


Has to be Chandler, right? LeBron isn't winning any more awards until he wins a championship. He may not win the MVP this year. You wanna know when you become the next MJ ...



re: OKC:
They're very dependent on getting to the foul line. Durant in particular, gets a lot of touch fouls. If they play teams particularly good at not fouling (the Spurs, for instance, or even the Lakers or the Suns), that might hurt them.
   557. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:12 AM (#4103653)
Also kind of curious who gets Defensive Player of the Year this season. Assuming Howard won't win because of his trade/SVG shenanigans. So... LeBron? Chandler? Tony Allen?


I'd probably vote for Iguodala. He's elite by both stats and reputation, and his team is still at the top of the league defensively. Iggy leads the NBA in opponent PER (8.8), and he's also 1st in on-court D Rtg among players with 1500+ minutes.

I don't really understand the Tony Allen love. Even if he is the best wing defender on a per-possession basis, he just doesn't play enough to compete with the top guys in terms of value.

Also, the Celtics and Bulls rely on a great scheme as much as individual defense, but I think that Garnett and Deng deserve to at least make the Second Team. They're the clear leaders of elite team defenses, and they're the players most responsible for the effective execution of that scheme on the court.
   558. andrewberg Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:33 AM (#4103660)
If I could have any five man defensive lineup, I'd take Lowry, Tony Allen, iguodala, Lebron, Howard. If still pick Howard as dpoy even though he won't win.
   559. Fourth True Outcome Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:00 AM (#4103677)
As a purely defensive lineup, I would switch Lowry with Avery Bradley. (I think the other four are spot on.) Lowry is a damn fine defender (and Celtics fan caveats apply, I suppose), but Bradley's defensive is stifling. Watching him harry point guards into burning more shot clock than they want to just establishing an offense is marvelous to watch.
   560. PJ Martinez Posted: April 11, 2012 at 09:03 AM (#4103725)
Good call on Iguodala. Would love to see him win it. Also agree that Garnett and Deng deserve a lot of credit.
   561. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 11, 2012 at 09:44 AM (#4103754)
You guys are all crazy. The Knicks have improved from like 26th to 5th in D-rating. Tyson Chandler should (deservingly) win.
   562. Spivey Posted: April 11, 2012 at 10:02 AM (#4103769)
What's the reason that Dwight Howard shouldn't win? I'd like to see a compelling reason why the guy who has been the best defender 3 or 4 years in a row no longer is. Especially when he's first in defensive Win Shares, has roughly the same Opponents PER as Chandler, and he's the best help defender in basketball.
   563. JC in DC Posted: April 11, 2012 at 10:31 AM (#4103789)
What's the reason that Dwight Howard shouldn't win? I'd like to see a compelling reason why the guy who has been the best defender 3 or 4 years in a row no longer is. Especially when he's first in defensive Win Shares, has roughly the same Opponents PER as Chandler, and he's the best help defender in basketball.


Because he's a douche?
   564. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 11, 2012 at 11:09 AM (#4103807)
They're very dependent on getting to the foul line. Durant in particular, gets a lot of touch fouls. If they play teams particularly good at not fouling (the Spurs, for instance, or even the Lakers or the Suns), that might hurt them.

Or the Bulls...

I'd probably vote for Iguodala. He's elite by both stats and reputation, and his team is still at the top of the league defensively.

Someone yesterday (maybe Zach Lowe) made the argument for KG winning based on the fact that Boston passed Philly in the defensive rankings.

What's the reason that Dwight Howard shouldn't win? I'd like to see a compelling reason why the guy who has been the best defender 3 or 4 years in a row no longer is. Especially when he's first in defensive Win Shares, has roughly the same Opponents PER as Chandler, and he's the best help defender in basketball.

There's a difference between "shouldn't" and "won't". Howard has no chance of winning, because of the voters and all the shenanigans. As to shouldn't, Orlando has fallen to 11th in DRtg this season after being 3rd last year, 3rd the year before, and 1st the year before that. That at least supports the narrative or claims that Dwight isn't the same defender this year (be it lack of effort, distractions, whatever) because most of the team is the same as last year. And I think Chandler has a compelling case as being better this year anyway, as the individual (not perfect) defensive stats are close and the team defensive stats/impact are pretty impressive and favor Tyson quite a bit.

---

It was nice of the Bulls defense to show up last night. It was also nice to see that version of Rip, even if it only lasted for one quarter. If he can be that type of player with any sort of consistency (and Rose can stay healthy, obviously), I'll feel much more confident that the Bulls can actually beat Miami/OKC. And how about that defense by Korver in the 4th?

Bulls play the Heat tomorrow in Chicago and again next week in Miami. They probably need a split to keep HCA, which does matter more to the Bulls than Heat. I almost think Rose should rest again tomorrow - it's going to be a tough game and while I want him to play as much as possible I (perhaps foolishly) think he's more likely to retweak something against Miami than say Detroit on Sunday. Sounds like it if was up to Rose, he would have played last night. That makes me think he will play tomorrow. While I'm talking about the playoffs, I'd like to state that I'd prefer the Bulls see the Bucks in the first round, but would still rather face the Knicks than the Sixers.
   565. andrewberg Posted: April 11, 2012 at 11:33 AM (#4103837)
As a purely defensive lineup, I would switch Lowry with Avery Bradley. (I think the other four are spot on.) Lowry is a damn fine defender (and Celtics fan caveats apply, I suppose), but Bradley's defensive is stifling. Watching him harry point guards into burning more shot clock than they want to just establishing an offense is marvelous to watch.


I actually agree from what I've seen, I'm just deferring to the guy I have seen more and whose stats are drawn from a bigger sample. If Bradley plays full time next year and keeps up what he has done, I'd put him in the backcourt too.

What's the reason that Dwight Howard shouldn't win? I'd like to see a compelling reason why the guy who has been the best defender 3 or 4 years in a row no longer is. Especially when he's first in defensive Win Shares, has roughly the same Opponents PER as Chandler, and he's the best help defender in basketball.


Chandler and KG have both been wonderful. In fact, I'd probably bet that Chandler does win based on the reasons NJ and Moses have provided in his favor and against Dwight. Still, dragging a bunch of non-defenders to a respectable defensive performance by playing one one five gets Chandler to Dwight's level, not beyond it.
   566. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 11:42 AM (#4103852)
What's the reason that Dwight Howard shouldn't win? I'd like to see a compelling reason why the guy who has been the best defender 3 or 4 years in a row no longer is.

Because he's not trying. Which shows how good he is and can be. Even when he's half assing it, he's still one of the best defenders in the game.
   567. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 11, 2012 at 11:57 AM (#4103883)
Still, dragging a bunch of non-defenders to a respectable defensive performance by playing one one five gets Chandler to Dwight's level, not beyond it

"Non-defenders" is a charitable description of the non Chandler, Shumpert, Jeffries Knicks. "Respectable defensive performance" is also an understatement. /Chandler Stumping

EDIT: Heh, Hollinger tackled the subject in his column today and came down in favor of Chandler.
   568. It's a shame about Athletic Supporter Posted: April 11, 2012 at 12:06 PM (#4103898)
I don't think Chandler is going to win (regardless of whether or not he should). Being at best the 3rd biggest story on a .500 team that was expected to be better doesn't usually put you in line for awards.

I also don't think Howard is drawing dead here. Drama seems to be a huge disqualifier for MVP but I don't see people caring much when discussing dPOY or all-NBA.

I think Ibaka has a chance.
   569. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 11, 2012 at 12:24 PM (#4103928)
I think Ibaka has a chance.

That is literally the first time I've seen anyone mention his name - online, during a game, etc - for DPOY. So that would make me think that, no, he wouldn't have a chance. Then again, he is first in blocks per game by a huge margin. So I can picture someone scanning the stats at the end of the year, seeing that, and voting for him. Not enough people will do that for him to win though, especially if Durant is going to win the MVP (and I think he will) and since no one sees the Thunder as a top defensive team.
   570. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:06 PM (#4104006)
I'm starting to get my hopes up for this Celtics team. For them to make any noise in the playoffs they'll need to ride some hot shooting and, given the mediocrity of their O, their defense will need to be for real. But internally, I'm well into STEAGLESian territory. I think we have a chance against anybody, and a better matchup with Miami than most. Bulls still scare me, though, and Rose has very little to do with why: they more than anyone would expose our lack of big bigs. Still, with Garnett and Bass stretching those rotations... I need to stop, I'm starting to believe myself. This next week will be interesting.

As for DPOY, I'd have to think it's Chandler's to lose.
   571. andrewberg Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:18 PM (#4104031)
For them to make any noise in the playoffs they'll need to ride some hot shooting


Up until a couple of late Pierce misses, every single Celtic who attempted a FG shot 50% or better last night. That's a pretty impressive performance. Probably not sustainable, but pretty impressive anyway.
   572. The kids disappeared, now Der-K has too much candy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:29 PM (#4104055)
I saw Ibaka mentioned in the DPOY discussion (Haberstroh compared his work with LBJ's?). Regardless, I don't see that happening.
Not sure who will win. If I had a vote, first four guys I'd research are Howard, Chandler, James, and Iguodala.
   573. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:43 PM (#4104081)
In the NHL Draft Lottery last night, the Blue Jackets did not get the first pick. Now, the NHL has a much more restrictive lottery (only the five worst teams can get the first pick). Even with a ~50% chance of winning the top pick, they still didn't. Just something to remember, even when you have the best odds to win, there's still a higher probability that you won't. Same as in the NBA.
   574. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:47 PM (#4104087)
I'm starting to get my hopes up for this Celtics team. For them to make any noise in the playoffs they'll need to ride some hot shooting and, given the mediocrity of their O, their defense will need to be for real. But internally, I'm well into STEAGLESian territory. I think we have a chance against anybody, and a better matchup with Miami than most. Bulls still scare me, though, and Rose has very little to do with why: they more than anyone would expose our lack of big bigs. Still, with Garnett and Bass stretching those rotations... I need to stop, I'm starting to believe myself. This next week will be interesting.

To play the guy with the bucket of cold water for a minute here, didn't the C's own the Heat in last year's regular soon, too? I do see how the current version of the C's with KG at the 5 might match up better with the Heat, but I don't think it's going to turn out much better than last year. Not only is the C's shooting from last night unsustainable, so is their current defense (both Lowe and Hollinger wrote about that yesterday).

Well, the Bulls without Rose did just fine against the hot-streak C's last week, so I could see why you'd feel that today.
   575. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:48 PM (#4104089)
In the NHL Draft Lottery last night, the Blue Jackets did not get the first pick. Now, the NHL has a much more restrictive lottery (only the five worst teams can get the first pick). Even with a ~50% chance of winning the top pick, they still didn't. Just something to remember, even when you have the best odds to win, there's still a higher probability that you won't. Same as in the NBA.

What are the odds for the Oilers winning 3 years in a row?
   576. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 01:52 PM (#4104096)
What are the odds for the Oilers winning 3 years in a row?


Pretty freaking low. They were the worst team the previous two years, and the second worst this year.

It's been a while since I took a probability class, so I can't do it off hand.
   577. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:00 PM (#4104119)
Does anyone like the randomness of the NBA Lottery? Except the winners, I guess. I know you want to discourage tanking, but the Bobcraps are clearly the most awful team in the NBA (without even trying), its a travesty for them to not get the #1 pick, if you want the #1 pick to go to the worst team.
   578. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:01 PM (#4104123)
Even with a ~50% chance of winning the top pick, they still didn't. Just something to remember, even when you have the best odds to win, there's still a higher probability that you won't.


Well, that's not really true if you have a 50% chance of getting the first pick.
   579. Los Angeles El Hombre de Anaheim Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:03 PM (#4104125)
But internally, I'm well into STEAGLESian territory. I think we have a chance against anybody, and a better matchup with Miami than most.
I don't see why not. Rose is apparently never going to approach 75% health this season, and the Bulls can't win without him. In their last 10 games, Miami's played six games against very good teams, and lost five of them while averaging 84 points a game in those games; it may be that the league has adjusted to Miami's Oregon offense. I wouldn't bet my house on it, I don't see why Boston couldn't beat either of those teams at this point.
   580. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:10 PM (#4104141)
Does anyone like the randomness of the NBA Lottery? Except the winners, I guess. I know you want to discourage tanking, but the Bobcraps are clearly the most awful team in the NBA (without even trying), its a travesty for them to not get the #1 pick, if you want the #1 pick to go to the worst team.

Is my memory off or was there a time when all the teams in the lottery could change positions based on the ping pong balls instead of just the top 3? If so, I liked that a lot better. I'm not a fan of the current format.
   581. The kids disappeared, now Der-K has too much candy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:14 PM (#4104150)
On cue, Hollinger (insider) covered this today. He endorsed Chandler, noting that Garnett (who was my #5 guy to check out), James, Iguodala, and Deng had strong resumes as well.
Bradley was his 1st team PG (no Rondo, no Lowry on the three teams), Allen 2nd team SG (behind Iggy), Ibaka 3rd team center (behind Tyson and Howard).

   582. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:14 PM (#4104151)
[580] Sounds like that was only in '85 and '86: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBA_Draft_Lottery
   583. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:22 PM (#4104158)
Well, that's not really true if you have a 50% chance of getting the first pick.


Hence the ~ in front of the 50%.

Does anyone like the randomness of the NBA Lottery? Except the winners, I guess. I know you want to discourage tanking, but the Bobcraps are clearly the most awful team in the NBA (without even trying), its a travesty for them to not get the #1 pick, if you want the #1 pick to go to the worst team.

Then you truly have a race to the bottom. Now, this season, Charlotte is already well below New Orleans, but last year there was a 2 game difference. Before the lottery, teams would be actively trying to not win. Even more than tanking. And, let's say there's a guy that's as good as Lebron, teams are going to try and start losing halfway through the season.
   584. Moses Taylor, Moses Taylor Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:34 PM (#4104190)
I don't see why not. Rose is apparently never going to approach 75% health this season, and the Bulls can't win without him. In their last 10 games, Miami's played six games against very good teams, and lost five of them while averaging 84 points a game in those games; it may be that the league has adjusted to Miami's Oregon offense. I wouldn't bet my house on it, I don't see why Boston couldn't beat either of those teams at this point.

Perhaps I need to adjust my expectations for Rose's health this season, but I don't necessarily think it's true he won't be 100% healthy. The ankle sprain can happen to anyone, and while it's a kick in the nuts on top of the other stuff, if the other stuff isn't bothering him (and they're saying it's not; then again, it's not like they'd say otherwise) then it's just a possible blimp. It doesn't seem nearly as bad as the ankle problem he had in last year's playoffs; he seemed over that halfway through the ATL series. Looking at it glass half full, he's getting a lot of rest this season and if healthy he will be quite fresh relative to most of the competition.

As for not being able to win without him, I'm also not sure that's completely true. They're not going to beat Miami or OKC in a series without him, but I think they could beat almost any other possible opponent in a series without him*. They're an elite team with him, but they're still damn good without him**.

*Homer alert. But compare them without him to the other East teams; they've already beaten all of the possible first round opponents this year without him. Again, that includes Boston just last week in the middle of this amazing stretch by the C's; like 570 said, the non-Rose Bulls are not a good matchup for the C's.
**They would have a lot of similar problems to teams like Ind, Phi, Atl have in that there's no go to scorer, but I'm not convinced any of those teams are better than the non-Rose Bulls.
   585. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:41 PM (#4104206)
Then you truly have a race to the bottom. Now, this season, Charlotte is already well below New Orleans, but last year there was a 2 game difference. Before the lottery, teams would be actively trying to not win. Even more than tanking. And, let's say there's a guy that's as good as Lebron, teams are going to try and start losing halfway through the season.


Oh, I agree that going by straight record produces incentives that are bad for the NBA. Honestly, part of me thinks that Charlotte is _so bad_ that they shouldn't get a #1 pick until there's more pieces for a future All-NBA player to work with.
   586. andrewberg Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:48 PM (#4104218)
585 begs the question- setting team allegiances aside, where would people most like to see Anthony Davis play? There is a sort of fascination to me with the idea of him manning the paint with Biyombo. They could grow into a really scary interior defense. I don't want him to go to New Orleans simply because I don't want his career to have the specter of going to the league-owned team over it (not that I think the league would rig it, but I don't want to hear people complain about it for a decade). I would enjoy seeing him play with Wall, and even though I don't like Detroit, I would enjoy seeing him play with Monroe, as well.
   587. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 02:58 PM (#4104233)
Charlotte and New Orleans strike me as barren wastelands currently -- I think Davis would be wasted there. Wall + Davis would probably improve Washington dramatically -- Wall needs another quality player, and if they don't get Davis, I don't trust Washington to draft well.

The other places I'd like to see him go is to a team that's on the mediocrity treadmill and needs one more star to push them into contention. Denver and Portland (pre-implosions) and Houston seem to fit this criteria in the abstract.

If I could address two problems with the draft, they would be:
(1) Allow bottom-feeders to get rapid infusions of talent in the form of multiple lottery picks. Davis and MKG probably wouldn't be a bad reboot for Charlotte or New Orleans.
(2) Allow fringe playoff teams (just missed or seeded 5-8) to get infusions of talent to get them off the treadmill without having to blow their team up.

This might mean that not every team gets a first round pick. Though that would be a dramatic change from traditional drafts, I don't think that's a bad thing. Teams outside the draft could trade into it, perhaps even with luxury cap / salary cap considerations taken into account -- e.g., "Hey BadTeam, here's a serviceable glue guy who can help your rookies, you can have him without a cap hit"

OTOH, maybe the problems with bad teams are simply poorly run teams (Washington, New Orleans, LAC historically), and they shouldn't get help from the NBA. But at the same time, future stars shouldn't be exiled there either.
   588. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:24 PM (#4104278)
585 begs the question- setting team allegiances aside, where would people most like to see Anthony Davis play?

Phoenix (if they keep Nash), Cleveland, Washington, Portland. I think him with Irving and Thompson would be awesome in Cleveland.
   589. Los Angeles El Hombre de Anaheim Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:25 PM (#4104280)
Perhaps I need to adjust my expectations for Rose's health this season, but I don't necessarily think it's true he won't be 100% healthy. The ankle sprain can happen to anyone, and while it's a kick in the nuts on top of the other stuff, if the other stuff isn't bothering him (and they're saying it's not; then again, it's not like they'd say otherwise) then it's just a possible blimp.
I'm leaning towards the "they're not telling us something" side of things on "the other stuff" because there's just so much of it. Beyond that, I don't think that a guy who's been so hurt he hasn't been able to play consistently for weeks would suddenly get healthy in the playoffs — Thibs would have to be positively Belichickian to unveil a healthy DRose at the end of April.

That said, they're 4 wins better than Miami with 8 to play. If they just split their last two games with the Heat, they'll probably take HCA even if Rose misses all of those games. That'd be big for May.

As for not being able to win without him, I'm also not sure that's completely true. They're not going to beat Miami or OKC in a series without him, but I think they could beat almost any other possible opponent in a series without him*. They're an elite team with him, but they're still damn good without him**.
I made that point last week when I argued that OKC blowing out the Bulls without Rose was still a very impressive feat. But whereas I'd take Chicago without hesitation over Boston if Rose is healthy, I can definitely see Boston pushing, and even beating, the Bulls in a long series with their advantage at PG being the main factor.

Wall + Davis would probably improve Washington dramatically -- Wall needs another quality player, and if they don't get Davis, I don't trust Washington to draft well.
Wall + Nene + Davis would look tremendous.

EDIT: If Washington gets Davis, what are the chances that Calipari goes to Washington as well and reunites with Wall and Davis?
   590. jmurph Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:26 PM (#4104281)
I think him with Irving and Thompson would be awesome in Cleveland.


Can't we all agree that nothing positive should happen to a Dan Gilbert-owned sports franchise after his post-Lebron insanity?
   591. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:35 PM (#4104299)
I could be wrong, but I don't think Calipari is interested in the NBA. I don't think what makes him successful in NCAA basketball would make him successful in the NBA. The two jobs, despite having "basketball coach" in their title, are remarkably different.
   592. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:36 PM (#4104302)
[588] I was under the impression that Thompson wasn't doing anything of note in Cleveland, but I haven't watched any Cavs basketball.
   593. andrewberg Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:50 PM (#4104324)
Wall + Nene + Davis would look tremendous.


Although not on Davis's level, Kevin Seraphin has had some really tremendous games this year. He had something like 24-12 on 15 FGA against Orlando the other night... but it was against Big Baby.
   594. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:51 PM (#4104326)
Can't we all agree that nothing positive should happen to a Dan Gilbert-owned sports franchise after his post-Lebron insanity?


Guy gets angry and throws a tantrum because his franchise lost a huge chunk of it's value due to a young guy's whims? I'll cut him some slack for that. He's definitely not on the list of owners that I think are worse. There are a few that I think deserve winning teams less.
   595. jmurph Posted: April 11, 2012 at 03:54 PM (#4104330)
Was Gilbert not one of the primary whiners in the Paul-Lakers fiasco? (Legitimately asking)

   596. Los Angeles El Hombre de Anaheim Posted: April 11, 2012 at 04:00 PM (#4104335)
He was. Apparently, other teams should not be allowed to try and get under the salary cap, lest his Cavs lose out on a share of other people's money.
   597. rr Posted: April 11, 2012 at 04:02 PM (#4104338)
Was Gilbert not one of the primary whiners in the Paul-Lakers fiasco? (Legitimately asking)


He was the highest profile due to the email leak, but Jordan and Cuban popped off about it as well. I have excerpted Gilbert's email to Stern about it twice already on the thread. Gilbert, like many people, was afraid that if the Lakers got Paul, they would also get Howard, and he mentioned that in the email. He also mentioned the Gasol deal.

Gilbert of course also OKd the Sessions deal at the deadline.
   598. smileyy Posted: April 11, 2012 at 04:15 PM (#4104349)
[594] OTOH, I'm sure he didn't mind getting that franchise value via the bounce of a ping-pong ball. Not to mention reaping the rewards of paying LeBron $4-5M a year when he had him cost controlled.
   599. jmurph Posted: April 11, 2012 at 04:24 PM (#4104353)
Thanks RR and El Hombre, I thought I was remembering that right. Yeah, no sympathy for Gilbert. With apologies to any Cavs fans lurking here, I really hope they don't land the top pick again this year.
   600. Jimmy P Posted: April 11, 2012 at 04:26 PM (#4104355)
Yeah, no sympathy for Gilbert.

I have no sympathy for him. But, I'm not actively going against him, either. I just don't see what he's done that's so horrible.
Page 6 of 21 pages ‹ First  < 4 5 6 7 8 >  Last ›

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Chicago Joe
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogOT: NBC.news: Valve isn’t making one gaming console, but multiple ‘Steam machines’
(1352 - 2:09am, Dec 19)
Last: Maxwn

NewsblogSaint Pete City Council Tells Rays NYET!
(3 - 1:57am, Dec 19)
Last: Dale Sams

NewsblogPadres Acquire Derek Norris – MLB Trade Rumors
(12 - 1:38am, Dec 19)
Last: Infinite Joost (Voxter)

NewsblogOT: Politics - December 2014: Baseball & Politics Collide in New Thriller
(4879 - 1:26am, Dec 19)
Last: tshipman

NewsblogRoyals sign Kris Medlen to two-year deal - MLB Daily Dish
(25 - 11:39pm, Dec 18)
Last: Barnaby Jones

NewsblogOT: NFL/NHL thread
(9159 - 11:35pm, Dec 18)
Last: Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip

NewsblogThe 4 surprisingly quiet teams of the MLB offseason
(2 - 11:25pm, Dec 18)
Last: JJ1986

NewsblogThe 2015 HOF Ballot Collecting Gizmo!
(61 - 11:25pm, Dec 18)
Last: Dr. Chaleeko

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread - December 2014
(707 - 11:22pm, Dec 18)
Last: Famous Original Joe C

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 12-18-2014
(42 - 9:34pm, Dec 18)
Last: Pops Freshenmeyer

NewsblogMatt Kemp's arthritic hips hold up deal with Padres
(41 - 9:05pm, Dec 18)
Last: Jeff Frances the Mute

NewsblogAre Wil Myers' flaws fixable? | FOX Sports
(103 - 8:09pm, Dec 18)
Last: ReggieThomasLives

NewsblogHow Will MLB Handle Big Changes With Cuba? - BaseballAmerica.com
(2 - 6:13pm, Dec 18)
Last: TDF, situational idiot

NewsblogMLBTR: Padres-Rays-Nationals Agree to Three-Team Trade
(56 - 6:03pm, Dec 18)
Last: boteman

NewsblogRoyals sign Edinson Volquez for two years, $20 million
(19 - 5:33pm, Dec 18)
Last: Nasty Nate

Page rendered in 0.6661 seconds
47 querie(s) executed