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Putting aside the argument on whether they should be or not, this is a really stupid thing to say. Way to go.
I think the bigger problem is that these athletes can't make money from their existing sponsors (outside of the official IOC sponsors) in what is clearly a completely commercialized environment.
I don't think there'd be a problem with allowing it. I'm not sure it's even really prohibited. The biggest problem would be where to get the money. The US Olympic Team doesn't have that kind of cash floating around.
I think the bigger problem is that these athletes can't make money from their existing sponsors (outside of the official IOC sponsors) in what is clearly a completely commercialized environment.
I don't believe this is true.
Or Nike (or Adidas, or whoever...) ought to pay them.
I mean, the side of the argument you're presenting has merit too. But that national and olympic glory comes at a price for these guys. And there's an additional tax of public "shaming" if they decide they don't want to pay that price.
I think they all do just fine. They're allowed to wear their shoes during a game. They're allowed to endorse any manner of product that's not sports related. All the other athletes are afforded the same. They just have to wear the team uniform and clothes when they are officially representing the US. Which is pretty fair that the uniforms have to be uniform.
Wait- why do they have to make money on this opportunity to represent their country? If they don't want to do it, don't go.
Agreed.
And there's an additional tax of public "shaming" if they decide they don't want to pay that price.
Examples of who this has hurt. And not just a few weeks of bad press. Actually caused irreparable damage.
Screw Wade. If he doesn't want to play, then don't. If the US Olympic Teams are going to start paying athletes, let's start with the athletes that don't make $100 million and have to take side jobs just to be able to afford their training. Because there's a lot of them.
Why? No one gives a #### about the events they compete in most likely.
IIRC, multiple NBA players have gone on record as to being extra fatigued in seasons after the Olympics.
OTOH, I think I'm making a different argument that Wade is. I think Wade is just saying "Lots of people are making more money off of this than I am, when I'm the real show." It strikes me as a close analogue to the NCAA making money off of college basketball players.
I LOL'ed.
Harden was unanimous as the 6th man. He's clearly the 3rd best player on the Thunder, and third in minutes played and minutes per game. I'm guessing there's a game flow advantage in having him come off the bench, so that when Westbrook or Durant need to come out for a natural rest, there's not as much of a drop-off? Should more teams do this? Do teams not have the personnel to do this? Or does it not matter whether he starts or not?
Really? C'mon. Wade and James and those guys are some of the literal richest people in this country. They are higher paid than 99.9% of the population. And you're comparing them to a bunch of kids who get $0 from their work and can't even get another job besides that?
I think Wade is just saying "Lots of people are making more money off of this than I am, when I'm the real show."
IIRC, multiple NBA players have gone on record as to being extra fatigued in seasons after the Olympics.
Then don't play.
But to your point, it doesn't make it sound any better when they point it out.
Edit: Sounds like the players (or some players) should fight for, essentially, a CBA or contract with the USOC and IOC.
Just don't play, or play the two weeks while counting the endorsement money (and free training camp).
If possible, the Heat became just a little bit more hateable.
I like that statement, but I can't reconcile it with the current incarnation of the IOC that should be the caretaker of that ideal.
but it would depend on who it was making the demand. if it was just the superstars (lebron, wade, kobe), the olympics could easily live without them. if it was just the players on team USA, the olympics could live without them.
but if it was the entire NBPA, if it was the gasols and ginobilis and nowitzkis, in addition to the lebrons and wades and kobes, then i don't think the IOC could afford to play hardball. they could try to shame and smear the players to get them back in line, but there would not be anywhere near the same level of interest without them.
And now?
They easily could, and they would. People are going to watch the Olympics whether Lebron's there or not. I don't think basketball is the highest rated sport in the Olympics, and I don't think it'd make much of a difference even if it were. The IOC and all the countries would wave goodbye and just move on.
Trust me, the US Olympic Team does not want to get into the bad press of paying these guys, but not paying the guy who does hammer throw and has to work at a big box store to make ends meet. And they aren't going to pay all the US athletes. So it's going to be a non-starter.
It's just plain greed.
The amateur ideal of the Olympics is long gone, guys.
And they can get paid. Sign an endorsement deal like all the other Olympic athletes.
The Celtics won the game in OT, needing Pierce to hit a crazy tough shot to even force OT. Throttled?
Hollinger did a piece on their defense in the last few days; it has been crazy good. I am not a huge KG fan, but the guy is still a difference maker. Avery Bradley helps too.
Why is Boston, one game behind Atlanta, seeded ahead of them? Is that some odd playoff matchup rule, or does ESPN have it wrong? http://espn.go.com/nba/standings
This could be the greatest playoffs of our lives, but you're gonna let it be the worst. "Ooh, we're not going to believe with you, Simmons, you're a Boston sports troll." Well just kiss my ass from now on! I'm not gonna take this. The Heat, they're dead men! The Bulls, dead! Lakers, dead!
Division winner gets a top 4 seed.
Is Rondo bitter because he didn't make the cut last time around?
Duh. Thanks. I guess someone has to win that division, since the Sixers are playing possum.
Right. This isn't about some nostalgia. Don't go if you don't want to. You shouldn't need to be paid for the privilege to do this. You're literally traveling the world on the USOC's dime, playing the sport you love with your buddies, and repping your country. If that doesn't appeal, please don't go. I don't watch Olympic basketball much anyway. I prefer the track stuff.
No one's saying it's easy, no one's pooh-poohing the energy it takes to do this, and nobody's ignoring the toll it takes on a guy's body. Don't ####### go. Most people will understand if you can't physically do it, if you don't want to throw yourself into that grind. Just don't tell me that you need to get paid. There are a bunch of other really terrific players who would love to play on Team USA for free. If you don't wanna go, get out of the way.
Come now, Rose has had injury problems but there's no indication he's going to get fat before the playoffs. It's not like he's Shaq.
Agree with this. Ideally, I would like these Olympic tournaments (hockey also) to generate funds to support the sports - that is, to create money to fund the development of the sport around the world. Unfortunately, I don't believe that's where the money will end up going.
Nah. But I think they need to be in the Sweet 16 or at least win a tournament game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Olympic_Committee#Revenue_distribution
Unfortunately, the first half of that statement sounds like an awful lot of dead hookers lining an awful lot of pockets.
Without Muhammad, UK probably needs either Lamb or Teague to for some reason defer the draft to be a realistic #1 pick. They'll be young but terrific inside with Noel and Poythress and Wiltjer in backup and a good chance of bringing one more in for depth. A good but not super-dominant wing player in Goodwin coming in, and a fine point guard in Harrow who sat out this year after transferring from NC State. But unless Teague or Lamb returns, they'll be one player short in the backcourt. Or they'll have to play three big men and count on Poythress being able to run the 3 the way Kidd-Gilchrist could.
Is it really going to be
IU
UL
UK
as the top 3 coming into next season? The Ohio River will be in flames.
Rumors around Ky have Calipari about to get a commitment from Anthony Bennett, a top 10 player who is a true PF, so they'd solve their backcourt problems by just getting bigger across the frontline, move Poythress--who is awesome--to the 3 and count on Goodwin being able to run the 2. If he can, and if Harrow is at least as good as he was at NC State, they'll pose some serious problems though they still need at least depth in the backcourt.
It is strange to follow Cal's Cats. Only twice in my memory has recruiting been genuinely fun to follow--now and the height of the Hall era when he pulled in ludicrous (if often mismatched) classes. And that one ill-fated class of Sutton's. But for Tubby and Pitino, great recruiters in their own way, each class seemed to hinge on 1 key player, and if they lost him the class fell apart. Calipari takes the suspense out of it. He misses on some, but he's always got backup plans galore.
The Grizzlies beat Phoenix tonight, but fail to move up because OKC and SAS both lost at home to the LA teams. What the hell good are .700 teams if they can't beat the teams you need them to in the stretch run?
Probably just a coincidence.
Why should people look down on the NBA guys for not wanting to go to the Olympics? They're risking their health and livelihoods so that other people can make a ton of money. Forget that.
Yeah, I'm not a conspiracy theorist when it comes to the refs, but the officiating was bad all around, and those late calls against the Celtics, while each probably defensible (or at least semi-defensible) in a vacuum, were pretty weird to see. Just glad they gutted it out. They looked (understandably) tired.
I started to write a post early this week during the WC contender discussion about why SAN, while probably a decent matchup vs OKC, likely won't make much noise beyond the 1st round, but didn't complete it. Pop is an unbelievable coach, and while he has that team humming in the Reg Season, I just don't think their built for the playoffs. When teams get to turn up the defensive intensity on their outside shooters and can win the match-up with Duncan/Blair (clearly better are MEM - Gasol/Zbo, LA - Gasol/Bynum and about even LAC - Blake/DeAndre) there going to have trouble.
I'm not either, for what it's worth.
I agree. It's a labor issue for me and I will usually side with labor when the matter at hand is as one sided as this. The Olympics generate an obscene amount of money for its administrators and too often, as in the case of the NCAA, "amateurism" is used as a red herring when the issue of pay for play is brought up. These athletes are risking their health (and thus future income potential) and should play for free while the administrators pocket all the money and take little risk?
_________
Also, congrats to Knicks fans. I look forward to our first round matchup. JR Smith is a great player.
I don't hate the player I hate the game. However, coach Cal can do what he does because he has setup an elaborate system of funneling money and agents towards his recruits. I'm not saying it's "pay for play". But it's more like the people he knows behind the curtain -- and worldwide Wes is Oz here -- that allow him to do what he does.
Again, it's hardly just an issue with Cal and Kentucky, but he's the most glaring example of what you can do with connections and a "see no evil hear no evil" AD. The SEC is full of them, especially in FB. Heck, Petrino was fired for lying to his boss IMO, not for being shady as ####.
In other hilarious news, right now the Warriors can't trade any of their 2012-2014 firsts or any of their 2012-2016 seconds.
Who decides this stuff? That has got to be one of the most worthless items I have ever seen. Apparently the Clippers had traded a top 55 protected 2R to Denver prior to this so that explains why it isn't just top 50 protected, but what's the point? Looking further, it looks like this was traded to the Raptors for Hassan Adams and cash. Is this just making a mockery of a rule that says that you can't trade something for nothing? Even weirder, the Clips waived Hassan Adams 2 hours after making the trade. For some reason this fascinates me. I guess it's a random cap shenanigan?
So I suspect things are even stranger and perhaps sketchier but less direct than just funneling money through agents.
No one is doubting this. And, they CAN STILL MAKE MONEY. Unlike the NCAA which totally prohibits them from making any money at all, these guys still get their NBA paychecks. They get their NBA endorsements. They can even sign endorsements specifically for the Olympics. It's two ####### weeks. Where, in that two weeks, they get a free trip to another country, free lodging, free food, free tickets to pretty much any event they want there, and tons of other free ####. Plus, this is the important part, it's voluntary. They can not go. If it doesn't mean that much that you need the motivation of money, then don't go.
Why should people look down on the NBA guys for not wanting to go to the Olympics?
I'm not. I've said numerous times to not go. My looking down on them is their greed and whining for not getting paid for it.
I wouldn't go if I didn't have a guaranteed contract. But, they'll still get paid if they ruin their careers there. They will get their entire NBA contract, unlike if they end their career in college.
Besides, I brought this all up because Wade threw his hat into the Dumb Contest that he, Dwight, and Lebron seem to be having.
What do these 3 guys have in common?
Boring Christian names!
I dunno, I can still see them passing Philly for the 7 seed. As things stand now today though, the only dud first round matchup would be Mia/Philly (sorry, steagles). If NYK got to 7 and PHI dropped to 8, then there wouldn't be any dud matchups.
I'm not sure it's whining. I guess Wade was asked if they should be paid, and he said yes. He's played for Team USA before, he's going to play this summer; you may be right that they shouldn't get paid but I don't think he was whining about it.
(To be fair, I only read the quotes, I didn't actually see the interview).
Though he would've been served the best by just saying what Lebron did.
Given our lack of a PG, I am terrified of the possibility of a NYK-MIA matchup and the havoc Chalmbers, Wade and LeBron would cause on the perimeter.
By the way, kudos to Carmelo Anthony for completing one of the most flawless coach killings I can remember. To be able to play unprecedented levels of terrible basketball for months on end until the point where the coach is fired, immediately state upon that coach's firing that you weren't really trying, and then almost immediately play much better basketball than you've ever really played (though you've probably matched this production in other spurts) and have almost not a single national media member call you out requires true skill.
Yeah; I'm thinking of what they did to us the last time we played them, and we had Lin for that game.
*though i'm saying that more because of mike miller and mario chalmers than because of wade, or even james, really. the 3 pointer kills the sixers, and when miami hits them, the sixers just have no chance.
Is Melo the new Vince Carter?
All-world scorer? Check.
Unlikable if he's not on your team? Check.
Dogged it to get off a team he didn't want to play for? Check.
Started dogging it in his new metro NY area home when things didn't go the way he wanted? Check.
Never won anything of note in the NBA? Check.
Often checked out on the defensive end? Check.
He's a better player than Carter was, I think, but there are some similarites there.
Comparing their stats (VC; Melo), it probably favors VC (considering his decline phase factored in):
PER/TS%/eFG%/ORtg/DRtg/WS48
VC: 20.4/53.6%/48.7%/109/106/.144
Melo: 20.3/54.3%/47.7%/107/107/.128
VC missed more games due to injury, so that's a point in Melo's favor. VC ran his reputation down a lot more, but Melo still has time to catch him. Pretty damn close though.
if he's not on your team? Check.FTFY.
As anybody using his or her head thought it would, thought it would, Kobe's USG has dropped a little since the Sessions deal. Sessions' USG as a Laker is 20.4
But there is some OK stuff about the knee treatment in the piece.
Wade failed the "How not to give honest answers to stupid questions" test.
Unlikable if he's not on your team? Check.
FTFY.
Yeah, fair. I was trying to be diplomatic.
I think he failed the "Does Wade think about what he says" test.
Lehrer should have avoided all things basketball in the article. The Berri thing that Moses joked about was actually OK and seemed like a reasonable point.
Yeah, he's a homer. What do you want me to say?
The Bulls are still a bad matchup for them, and the Heat are still obvious favorites in a seven game series. The Celtics are also a single injury away from being cooked.
For me, I thought they were as done as he did. I think a lot of the fun right now (and optimism) for us Celtics fans is that this seemed to come out of nowhere. It's also the last run for this team, one who we've (read: Celtics fans only) come to love over the past five years. They fight like hell and will make any team work come playoff time, even if they lose. I'm going to miss this team when it's gone, and the days are numbered. Why not throw ourselves into believing it could happen one more time? I was convinced that they were done in 2010 as well, and they came within a whisker of winning the title.
Hollinger had an Insider piece today that included them as title contenders. I think they are as low as you can get on the "title contender" totem pole - they belong there in a "stranger things have happened" sort of way. But they play great defense, they play well together, and if they can stay healthy, I think they are either the 3rd or 4th best team in the East, and I'd probably pick them to beat anyone but Chicago or Miami in a seven game series.
If they could make the second round and push the Heat or Bulls to seven, I'd be esctatic. But for them to just get to the Finals, they need to get hot against Miami, have one of Lebron or Bosh crap the bed again or Wade be hurt, have Rose still be hurt in the Conference Finals, AND stay healthy themselves. That's a combination of things that *could* happen, sure, but it's too many ifs to have any reasonable expecation of it actually coming to fruition.
Simmons writes about the NBA as two versions of the same guy: NBA Fan/Historian Simmons and Boston Boy Bill. He is also, in his own words, "reactive about sports" so he tends to look at small sample/smicrocosms and draw big conclusions.
Both versions are smarter than his critics give him credit for; neither version is as smart as Simmons thinks it is.
With the C's likely winning the division now and seemingly headed for the 4 seed, they're more likely to face Chicago in round 2 and not Miami.
So part of my reaction was that the article was just an extension of the tweet from before, but he only talks about Miami. He mentions Rose in passing (the part about Bradley guarding him), doesn't mention OKC at all, and only mentions the SA loss in a footnote. So to focus on Miami (and those 2 regular season wins while ignoring the Chicago and SA losses) as proof they're a contender and how'd they'd match up in playoffs got under my skin, especially since they'd have to beat Chicago to likely even have a shot at Miami.
If he was writing that column about the Knicks, Bulls, Lakers, etc., I would have found it unreadable. I get it.
As we've discussed, Chicago's size makes them a terrible matchup for the Celtics. I'd still pick Miami to beat Chicago (or Boston, obviously) in a series.
Who knows who will come out of the West? I'm sticking with OKC, but who among the top five would really shock you? I'm even starting to buy Memphis a little.
I would be quite shocked if Vinny Del Negro managed to win three playoff series in a row.
IMO OKC is still the clear favorite, recent losses notwithstanding. They're the best team, they have the best player, best crunch-time lineup, and likely homecourt. I would peg them at about 50% to get out of the West with the Spurs second at like 15-20%.
You know you want to.
I kind of don't want to wait - does anyone have a link to that?
5/8 exactly on the nose; 8/8 on teams in.
4/8 exactly on the nose; 7/8 on teams in (damn you Howard, you flip-flopping bastard!)
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