I could not disagree more. Bring back KG, period. The man is playing out of his mind, and I see no reason why he couldn't continue to do so for 2-4 years, barring injury.

They're doing it despite Pierce not being 100%, despite Allen being limited with bone spurs, and despite not having at least one big man they planned to have and Avery Bradley. You don't think they could be this good next year if KG comes back, Ray comes back or is replaced by Bradley and a backup, and they get a big who's better than Stiemsma to push him into Ryan Hollins' minutes?

Hard to believe a healthy Chicago wouldn't have beat either one of these teams. Yea, I'm still bitter.

The Orlando/Miami trade I can't imagine would happen. I like the deal for Miami, but you risk alienating LeBron (he came here to play with those guys specifically), Riley (he was involved in setting up this circus), and the fan base (this is the smallest issue, since winning cures all). It makes a lot of sense for Orlando unless they have reason to think that Howard wants to stick around now that they fired one of the best coaches in basketball for him.

But, Pippen didn't dominate the ball, or need to.

I think the next few years matter as far as how they're evaluated because Duncan's playing at a fringe all-star level and Garnett's playing like a top 5 big man.

I think the next few years matter as far as how they're evaluated because Duncan's playing at a fringe all-star level and Garnett's playing like a top 5 big man.

He did this against Indiana a week ago, when Miami's back was against the wall. He did it against Boston in the ECF last year. He did it against Orlando a few years back. He did it in the most memorable close of my adult life against Detroit 5 years back. Be clear about it - you expect him to dominate every playoff series en route to a title.

Robin/Hombre- I now fully understand how you feel when we psychoanalyze Kobe.

Ditto, man, ditto. You guys are probably laughing your asses off reading through this.

I think the Heat would be a better team with a non-Wade wing that was less of an alpha. Less skill overlap would be good too, but I really think the two alphas thing is the biggest issue, especially because Spo doesn't seem capable of bring Wade in line, if he's even trying.

Again, I'm not denying Garnett has played great for this playoff run. But he's had more mismatch opportunities that a 6'11, 230 pound big man (or whatever his dimensions are) probably hasn't had in my lifetime.

A part of me would love to see the 2 of them match up in the Finals to settle it.

It is hard to believe a completely healthy Chicago team (which basically never existed all season) wouldn't be able to beat a not healthy Miami team, that's true.

The Orlando/Miami trade I can't imagine would happen. I like the deal for Miami, but you risk alienating LeBron (he came here to play with those guys specifically), Riley (he was involved in setting up this circus), and the fan base (this is the smallest issue, since winning cures all).

But that's a huge caveat. I think it's quite likely KG gets banged up or injured next season, let alone sometime in the next 2-4 years. If you could freeze him in carbonite and thaw him for the playoffs, sure. And he's going to want to be paid like a star, so his salary won't decrease in line with his performance.

Especially because they have such different personalities and don't seem to like each other much (who really knows though). That would be very fun. Of course I don't think there is a bad potential finals match up.

5 His Buddy KG
Just kidding, as this might count in his favor. In fact, Duncan hates Kevin Garnett. Hates him the way liberals hate Sean Hannity. This information comes from very reliable sources, who talk about how KG has made a career of trying to punk Duncan, baiting him and slapping him and whispering really weird smack into his ear. They talk about how funny this is, because the worst thing you can do as an opponent is piss off Duncan. Then, as Malik Rose says, "he f------ destroys you." Duncan's lifetime numbers versus Garnett's teams, by the way: 19.4 points per game, 11.6 boards and a 44--17 record, including the postseason.

Duncan is diplomatic about the topic. Asked if perhaps all those years battling Garnett have softened his feelings for the man, led to a Magic-Larry type of kinship, Duncan leans back on the couch in his hotel room and grins. There is a pause. A longer pause. Finally he says, "Define kinship."

The public's expectations are irrelevant. He doesn't have to be "the best player on the floor." He has to be whatever is required to be successful, in his opinion and that of his team.

They talk about how funny this is, because the worst thing you can do as an opponent is piss off Duncan. Then, as Malik Rose says, "he f------ destroys you." Duncan's lifetime numbers versus Garnett's teams, by the way: 19.4 points per game, 11.6 boards and a 44--17 record, including the postseason.

I think that bit was posted in the last thread, but a very funny use of statistical support. Duncan's a guy with career averages of 20.3/11.3 (about the same in playoffs) on a team that's won 67 percent of regular season games since he was drafted.

Well, "successful" in the context of this team means "winning the championship." They still might, but last night they took a huge step backwards away from that goal. And they didn't win it last year, either. Also, note that I said "fairly or unfairly." You can think it's unfair if you want, but that is just an assertion.

So either angering him doesn't matter, or Tim Duncan secretly hates everyone.

Well, "successful" in the context of this team means "winning the championship." They still might, but last night they took a huge step backwards away from that goal. And they didn't win it last year, either. Also, note that I said "fairly or unfairly." You can think it's unfair if you want, but that is just an assertion.

andrew,

In a way, this all comes down to something that occurred to me that this can be summarized in a phrase that I made up AFAIK but sounds like a Simmonsism:

LeBron needs to be a little more like Kobe, and Kobe needs to be a little more like LeBron.

Note that I haven't said anything about James' mindset and I made a point of mentioning all the other factors involved here. But, even with all the bandwidth I have burned being Kobe's defense attorney, I have also always said "He shoots too much sometimes." In the context of what he has done for the franchise and what he brings to the table, the attention paid to his flaws is IMO disproportionate and often motivated by open (Dwyer, Ziller, Moore, Simmons) or conceal-it (Abbott) personal animus.

That is also, obviously, true of James, perhaps to an even greater degree than it is of Bryant. But that doesn't mean that no one should ever criticize anything James does, or that looing at his 4th quarter work in the context of the team makes one into Bill Plaschke. Miami lost a huge, huge game last night. James didn't play very well late in the game. We can talk about that, just like we can talk about Kobe going 2/10 in the 4th quarter of the OKC game.

I'm done picking against them.

, but there isn't one of you who thought they'd win more than one game (if that) from the Heat, either

Right, they lost, but (I inferred) you were saying his performance should be evaluated on whether he's the best player on the floor. Not just that the public will do that.

Probably, but there isn't one of you who thought they'd win more than one game (if that) from the Heat, either.

Maybe I'm missing the point, but I'm asking a question about why the strategy changes in the 4th. Is that speculative or silly? I'm interested in it.

Right, they lost, but (I inferred) you were saying his performance should be evaluated on whether he's the best player on the floor.

Also, Fireball?

This is a good point. I brought up the transition defense earlier, and JVG harped on it during the game last night. The Heat got a little lucky, if you will, that Allen missed 3 3's down the stretch (then again, the C's did get the 2 from Pietrus and the dagger from Pierce, so maybe not).

Not to pick on baudib - I didn't see this coming either.

Why shouldn't this be part of the analysis? He's the best player in the league.

Good call. 19.4/11.6 didn't seem worthy of posting to back up that anecdote (I mean the SI writer, not the primate who posted it).

I think to play at that level, to be at that level, an athlete has to go to a pretty dark place. It isn’t just athletes. I think it’s a place great writers go, great performers, great composers, great scientists, great doctors, great lawyers and so on. I’ve never been there myself, but I imagine it to be a place where nothing else matters, where no one else matters, where there is one overpowering goal and that goal drives every action, ever move, every inspiration. I think it’s a place Michael Jordan loved going -- a place he desperately misses going now that he spends his days tearing tags off the back of underwear and building the worst team in NBA history. I think Tiger Woods loves going to that place. Kobe Bryant. Joe Montana. Tom Brady. Mark Messier. I know Roger Clemens loved going there.

LeBron? Obviously, I’m making this all up as I go along but … no, I don’t think so. I think LeBron loves playing basketball for the fun of it. You know when LeBron looks happiest? When his team is up by 20 and he can pass the ball behind his back. I don’t mean that as a knock -- well, OK, maybe I do -- but did you see the joy he felt at the end of Game 1 of this series when the Heat were destroying the Celtics? This, I believe, was why he came to Miami to play with D-Wade and Chris Bosh in the sun -- to destroy teams and have some fun doing it.

LeBron? Obviously, I’m making this all up as I go along but … no, I don’t think so. I think LeBron loves playing basketball for the fun of it. You know when LeBron looks happiest? When his team is up by 20 and he can pass the ball behind his back.

baudib Posted: May 14, 2012 at 06:26 PM (#4131349) ... If Bosh doesn't play, it means Miami beats Boston in 6 instead of 4-5. 903.

As to the Lebron needs a little more Kobe in him point of view

I just think our ability to measure those factors, combined with the diminishingly small sample that we can analyze prevents us from reaching any meaningful conclusions. Besides, none of us are psychologists, so we might as well be judging them based on skull shape.

We don't know when the Heat should be using an elbow pick-and-roll to high-low when Pierce is on Wade on the left wing. But we know what competitive drive means, we know what having guts means, we know what selfishness and leadership mean

As to the Lebron needs a little more Kobe in him point of view

I am not at all sure that I believe that. But I think a lot of people do

I don’t mean that as a knock -- well, OK, maybe I do -- but did you see the joy he felt at the end of Game 1 of this series when the Heat were destroying the Celtics? This, I believe, was why he came to Miami to play with D-Wade and Chris Bosh in the sun -- to destroy teams and have some fun doing it.

That is an interesting post, but I actually think the X's and O's of a basketball game are significantly less complicated than human psychology. I also tend to think that we are more expert in the former. In fact, I think we are so wildly deficient in knowledge about psychology that we often don't realize how wrong we are when we talk about it. ("We" being the people on this board- including myself, but even PHD psychologists will tell you that there is a lot more that they don't know than what they do know)

But don't you think that we think we know a lot? I mean, it seems so easy.

Nine years into James’ career, we’re still getting a handle on whether he is “clutch.” We’ve seen him play enough big games that we can probably draw some conclusions:

• He melted down in the 2011 NBA Finals, and badly. He did not want the ball very often and was mostly content to float around the perimeter. It was ugly and strange, and it was also distinct from LeBron’s more run-of-the-mill “clutch” failures — the same sort that Wade suffered on Sunday.

• He will go through bouts of clear and obvious tentativeness, possessions on which he passes too readily. But he is such a clever passer that those passes will often be productive in ways even seasoned viewers will miss on first watch, as some dishes were in Game 4. We saw this as well during Miami’s Game 2 loss against the Pacers. He is never going to be an unconscious “crunch-time” gunner on the level of Wade or Kobe Bryant. Sometimes his team will be better for that, and sometimes it will be worse for it.

But don't you think that we think we know a lot?

Edit: I mean, Kendrick Perkins and Ibaka swung that OKC/Spurs game via their shooting. Perk and Ibaka!

That's obviously not my intent.

What leverage does Orlando have?

Who says no to Wade for Howard straight up? (Trade Machine says the salaries work.) That seems like a decent deal for both teams.

Amazing shot by Durant, but wow, the Spurs are out of this world right now.

The officials have been all home court here in the 4th.