Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Tuesday, May 01, 2012

OT: NBA Monthly Thread, May 2012

I estimate that only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, but with our own thread, we won’t detract from what the site is really about: Bryce Harper getting mooned by a Dodgers fan, how dumb interleague baseball is, or random spamming of Yankees/RedSox news that barely counts as news.

Tripon Posted: May 01, 2012 at 10:28 AM | 2330 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags:

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 7 of 24 pages ‹ First  < 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 >  Last ›
   601. smileyy Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:00 PM (#4126572)
Apparently age limits make me swear.
   602. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:01 PM (#4126573)
Taking a different tack on the Kerr article, I got a kick out of a few of the anecdotes, in particular the one about the young player who was flummoxed by the fact that they didn't have a "Christmas Break" in the NBA where he'd just get to go home for a week or so.

Re: a (POSSIBLE! NOT SET IN STONE BY ANY MEANS!) Celtics/Sixers series -

I think I come out somewhere between STEAGLES and Moses on this. It's always hard to tell with STEAGLES if he expects the Sixers will win vs. saying he thinks they have a chance to win. I agree with the latter - depending on the schedule, if there are b2b games, for example, that could allow the Sixers to steal one agains the creaky Celtics they may not otherwise have won, and give them a leg up in potentially stealing the series.

Part of the Celtics not crashing the offensive glass is that they are generally a lousy rebounding team, but part of it is also strategy. They much prefer to get back on D and try to prevent the opponent from scoring in transition over focusing on crashing the offensive boards. I totally agree with Moses that the Sixers closing out games against a Noah and Rose-less Bulls team and a regular season game against an Indiana team that has issues of this sort of their own does not mean that the Sixers have "fixed" anything. I think Moses also makes a good point about the differences in the Celtics offense vs the InjuredBulls, in that they have two guys who can create offense on their own. I don't really buy that Evan Turner is going to shut down Rondo - Rondo didn't score much against the Sixers this year - but he did shoot 50% when he shot, and averaged 13 assists per game to boot. I think the Sixers young legs and athleticism could be trouble for the C's at times, but again, agreeing with another poster - NJ in this case - the Celtics are a very similar team in a lot of ways to the Sixers: excellent D, reliance on mid range jumpers to propel their offense. The problem for the Sixers is that the Celtics are a little bit better at those things, they have more frontline talent, and are better at closing out close games. I certainly wouldn't count the Sixers out in a (HYPOTHETICAL! ATLANTA AND CHICAGO COULD STILL COME BACK!) series between these two teams, but I'd definitely pick the Celtics, probably in 5 or 6 games. Wouldn't shock me if the Sixers won it, but I would be somewhat surprised.

I think the Celtics would give the Heat a tougher series than the Sixers - by tougher, I mean "they could win 1-3 games instead of 0-1".
   603. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:10 PM (#4126588)
If an 18-year-old is better than you, get the *($# out of the NBA.


That's not how it works, though. You don't draft the 18-year-old and cut the veteran because the 18-year-old is better. Heck, he might not be better for a year or two. You do it because you are securing the 18-year-olds rights for several years, and you expect the 18-year-old to be better by the end of that time.
   604. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:33 PM (#4126615)
That's not how it works, though. You don't draft the 18-year-old and cut the veteran because the 18-year-old is better. Heck, he might not be better for a year or two. You do it because you are securing the 18-year-olds rights for several years, and you expect the 18-year-old to be better by the end of that time.


This. The argument is that you have to draft the 18 year old or else someone else will; you can't draft him at 19 because he'll already be claimed. Meanwhile the 18 year old is taking a roster spot away from a better player, which (a) is bad for the veteran, and (b) bad for the overall quality of play.

To take the argument the other way, what if you could draft players starting at age 16? Certainly LeBron would have been drafted at 16 and many other guys too even though they were not ready and they would have just wasted a couple years sitting on the bench. Surely no one would argue that this would improve the NBA.
   605. steagles Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:33 PM (#4126616)
And Philly can barely score on the Bulls now (to reiterate, they shot less than 40% in 3 of 4 games in a series they're winning!).
even without rose and noah, chicago is still a hell of a defensive team. rose isn't exactly a defensive stopper, so lucas and watson aren't significant drags on the team defense. and noah's minutes are getting soaked up by gibson and asik, who are, at worst, really close to noah's level at that end of the floor. even with the injuries, i don't think boston's defense could play much better than the one the bulls are putting out.
-Philly doesn't get to the FT line*, yet only 2 teams are going more in the playoffs. Will that continue?
turner, williams, and holiday are each averaging 5 FTAs per game, and while that's fairly out of character for turner and holiday, it's not an unreasonable amount of attempts for them to take, considering how much they handle the ball. i don't know that that will be repeated in the next series, or over the next few years, but i do know that it's a definite possibility that it will.
-During the regular season, the Bulls and Celtics were separated by 2 3pt attempts per game (Bulls 16.9, C's 15.0) and the Bulls were 2% more accurate on 3's (37.5% vs 36.7%); so you're dramatically overstating that part.
hmm. yeah, you're right about that. i thought chicago was a much more prolific team than they seem to be. i guess korver, watson, and lucas threw my perception of that off a bit.

As a fan, I can see how finally closing out games is a relief to you. But I don't think 2 games against this decimated Bulls team and 1 regular season game (we've also seen Indiana really struggle with putting away a sub-par Orlando team) trumps the repeated failings of the last couple years. Maybe they've learned something, but I don't think we really can be sure of that based on what we've seen.

i'd agree with that. it's not a given that something's clicked, and it's also a definite possibility that this series was two steps forward, but the next one will be one step back, but one of things that's got me excited is not just that the sixers are winning, but why the sixers are winning. they're not winning these games because of andre iguodala or elton brand or lou williams, they're winning them because of jrue holiday and evan turner (and spencer hawes, i guess). the guys who are carrying this team to victory right now are not the same as the ones that have been dragging this team down in defeat for the last 10 years. holiday and turner are supposed to be foundational pieces for this team, and in this series, they're actually playing in a way that suggests they're worthy of that designation.

it's exciting.
   606. Jimmy P Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:40 PM (#4126626)
in particular the one about the young player who was flummoxed by the fact that they didn't have a "Christmas Break" in the NBA where he'd just get to go home for a week or so.

Maybe he's just a big NHL fan.
   607. Conor Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:43 PM (#4126633)
Taking a different tack on the Kerr article, I got a kick out of a few of the anecdotes, in particular the one about the young player who was flummoxed by the fact that they didn't have a "Christmas Break" in the NBA where he'd just get to go home for a week or so.


Or how about the player who didn't know what best of 5 meant?
   608. smileyy Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:45 PM (#4126639)

That's not how it works, though. You don't draft the 18-year-old and cut the veteran because the 18-year-old is better. Heck, he might not be better for a year or two. You do it because you are securing the 18-year-olds rights for several years, and you expect the 18-year-old to be better by the end of that time.


Yeah, that was a facile overly emotional argument. What's missing is player control and development (say, free agency clock based on age, not # of years) for players who are above replacement level. I'd be happy without age limits, with a minor league that doesn't suck and isn't the indentured servitude of the NCAA.

Edit: OTOH, many of those highly-drafted from-high-school players _were_ better than replacement level, and were able to be middle-of-the-rotation guys or starters. I think I just knee-jerk at the Harrison Bergeron-esque punishment of the extremely talented for the sins of the busts, in what's supposed to be the best basketball league in the world.
   609. smileyy Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:50 PM (#4126652)
A better title, however, would have been "Why an age limit would make the NBA owners a ton more money."


Or perhaps "Why I, Steve Kerr, should get another GM or executive position in the NBA".
   610. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:51 PM (#4126654)
In hockey, players can be drafted and still play college hockey. No reason basketball couldn't do the same ... honestly, I don't see any real issue with the team drafting a guy at 18 and signing a contract with him and still letting the guy play college basketball until age 20. There's no significant difference between that model and the current practice of drafting a guy and having him play in Europe for a couple years.
   611. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 08, 2012 at 03:54 PM (#4126657)
in particular the one about the young player who was flummoxed by the fact that they didn't have a "Christmas Break" in the NBA where he'd just get to go home for a week or so.
The NBA's War on Christmas continues.
   612. nick swisher hygiene Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:02 PM (#4126670)
610 seems so obviously right, and the solution, that--it can't be that easy. Where's the problem?

It'd be fun as hell seeing some sophomore go crazy in the tournament and then slide DIRECTLY into a late-season NBA lineup, coming off the bench to help his team into the playoffs.....
   613. Jimmy P Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:09 PM (#4126675)
Or perhaps "Why I, Steve Kerr, should get another GM or executive position in the NBA".


He was offered and turned down the Trailblazers job.

In hockey, players can be drafted and still play college hockey

They do get drafted, they don't get contracts. Then you get the fun stuff with guys signing contracts in spring after they're season is over. The Rangers picked up Chris Kreider before the last game of the season. He's been pretty useful in the playoffs.

Can you imagine teams adding guys like Anthony Davis or Thomas Robinson or Kidd-Gilchrist in April?
   614. smileyy Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:12 PM (#4126677)
Can you imagine teams adding guys like Anthony Davis or Thomas Robinson or Kidd-Gilchrist in April?


Sounds great to me.

The NBA has this crutch of having their development league (the NCAA, not the NBDL) be an incredibly popular league that makes billions of dollars.
   615. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:13 PM (#4126678)
even without rose and noah, chicago is still a hell of a defensive team. rose isn't exactly a defensive stopper, so lucas and watson aren't significant drags on the team defense. and noah's minutes are getting soaked up by gibson and asik, who are, at worst, really close to noah's level at that end of the floor. even with the injuries, i don't think boston's defense could play much better than the one the bulls are putting out.

The part where the Bulls have taken a step back is the fouling. So while, yes, I agree that the injuries haven't affected the Bulls defense, I was trying to say that the Celtics are better than the Bulls defense is playing now (especially if you look at only the 2nd half numbers for the C's).

hmm. yeah, you're right about that. i thought chicago was a much more prolific team than they seem to be. i guess korver, watson, and lucas threw my perception of that off a bit.

All 3 are backups and play limited minutes, so it's easy to see when they're in and making those shots and to miss when they're not in. Deng is the only 3pt shooter that plays extensive minutes.

i'd agree with that. it's not a given that something's clicked, and it's also a definite possibility that this series was two steps forward, but the next one will be one step back, but one of things that's got me excited is not just that the sixers are winning, but why the sixers are winning. they're not winning these games because of andre iguodala or elton brand or lou williams, they're winning them because of jrue holiday and evan turner (and spencer hawes, i guess). the guys who are carrying this team to victory right now are not the same as the ones that have been dragging this team down in defeat for the last 10 years. holiday and turner are supposed to be foundational pieces for this team, and in this series, they're actually playing in a way that suggests they're worthy of that designation.

I don't really mean to come across as raining on your parade, but I just don't see it as 2 steps forward. I see it as standing still; once Noah went down it's just hard to see Philly as anything but the favorite so they *should* win. While they still have to play the games and the Sixers still have to actually win, they're only winning because of who isn't playing for Chicago. Having said that, it's hard not to be impressed with Holiday and Turner (with the caveat that they should be outplaying Watson/Rip/Lucas/Korver; actually doing it still counts).

It's hard to analyze how much of an impact Rose and Noah's injuries have had on the Bulls mentally. Plenty of people around Chicago are talking about the Bulls' lack of mental toughness, especially in light of how much they prided themselves on it this regular season playing through the injuries. These guys are professionals and blah blah blah, but they're also human and it's a lot harder seeing Rose go down for good than seeing him get knicked up again but knowing he'll be back eventually; Noah's injury had to just squash any remaining hope. You can see the impact the injuries have had on Philly, they can see the blood in the water (that's not to say they didn't think they could win before). I think that this is part of the reason Noah insisted on trying to get back into game 3; he's the emotional leader of the team. I don't want to psychoanalyze these guys' heads from afar, but I know that it also had played a part in this.
   616. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:16 PM (#4126684)
Right. It's really two steps:

1. Why can't players be drafted at 18 and play college until 20? There's no reason, it happens in college hockey.

2. Since the NBA has a rookie wage scale anyway, where's the harm in having the drafting team pay the kid the first two years of the wage scale, even when he's playing for someone else? There's no reason, it happens with Europeans and, well, there's no reason.

   617. robinred Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:16 PM (#4126685)
Has the True Hoop crowd gone all negative all the time?


The "Hero Ball" thing has become something of an ESPN NBA meme. Arnovitz confronted Gilbert Arenas and Nick Young about it and wrote a lengthy post; Hollinger talks about it a lot now. Haberstroh has mentioned it a few times. The younger guys attached to True Hoop (Beckley Mason, Royce Webb) bring it up. Abbott has not written anything about the Lakers in quite some time that did not relate to it, and he writes about Kobe/the Lakers often. Abbott re-Tweets Hero Ball one-liners, and the other guys re-Tweet Abbott.

The flopping and tanking stuff came from the "HoopIdea" deal, which I chose to ignore.

Maybe when a writer becomes part of the establishment, that leads to going negative in many cases...

   618. Booey Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:30 PM (#4126702)
Or how about the player who didn't know what best of 5 meant?


My ex-wife absolutely could not understand this no matter how many times I explained it to her. Every single year at playoff time she'd ask:

"Wait, why are they playing this team again? Didn't they beat (or lose to) them a few days ago?"

"Yes, Hon. It's a best of 7 series."

"What does that mean? Why aren't they in a winner's bracket now for beating them?"

"Because it was just one win. In a best of 7 series, you need 4 wins to advance."

"So they play the same team 7 times in a row? That's dumb."

"Well, up to 7 times. The first team to win 4 games advances."

"So what happens if one team wins the first 4 games?"

"Then the series is over. The team that wins advances and the team that loses is eliminated."

"Why wouldn't they play the last 3 games?"

"Cuz they wouldn't make a difference, so it would be a waste of time."

"That doesn't make any sense. This is stupid."

Sigh...

Now repeat that twice a year (NBA and MLB postseasons) for 11 years...
   619. Spivey Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:42 PM (#4126712)
Mose and Matt H, I do want to extend my apologies for how this season played out. It's obviously a total bummer.
   620. smileyy Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:44 PM (#4126715)

Maybe when a writer becomes part of the establishment, that leads to going negative in many cases...


Well, establishments tend not to charge readers, and instead rely on advertising and pageviews, which means that articles are incented to be "popular" or otherwise drive pageviews, rather than being incented to produce real critical analysis.

BaskPro, on the other hand, would seem to focus on producing articles that meet the interests of their paying subscribers and enticing free readers to become paying subscribers.
   621. baudib Posted: May 08, 2012 at 04:56 PM (#4126729)
I need the Sixers to beat the Celtics because I cannot stomach a spring of Devils-Rangers and Celtics beating Sixers.
   622. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:15 PM (#4126741)
I'd like to say again that Sixers/Celtics is NOT A THING YET.
   623. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:22 PM (#4126749)
I'd like to say again that Sixers/Celtics is NOT A THING YET.

Man, you're going to look like a total idiot this time tomorrow.
   624. Squash Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:25 PM (#4126750)
It's not hero-ball if Chris Paul does it. That's a smart basketball play.

In defense of this, if Chris Paul did it it likely was the smart basketball play - we can see Chris Paul passing the ball in a final set if a better option opens up. Hero Ball isn't "Every time a superstar takes a shot at the end of the game it's bad", it's when the notable "offenders" (Kobe Bryant being the one everybody singles out) gets the ball and says to himself "I'm taking this last shot regardless of whatever develops on this play even if I have to force it", which indeed usually does lead to a forced shot because everyone, offense and defense included, knows the ball isn't going anywhere.

EDIT: I'll add that I haven't seen the play in question, just a general comment on The Hero Ball Thing.
   625. baudib Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:33 PM (#4126756)
I'd like to say again that Sixers/Celtics is NOT A THING YET.


As I have the luxury of not playing the games, I am totally looking ahead to the next round.
   626. If on a winter's night a baserunner Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:33 PM (#4126757)
I'd like to say again that Sixers/Celtics is NOT A THING YET.
Wait, you think they're getting ahead of themselves?

Now, all that wistful thinking about a healthy Rondo last year is just fluff getting blown out of proportion to try to counterbalance the narrative of "Holy #### does Miami look good this year." On the other hand, Rajon Pierre Rondo is averaging 19-7-13 with a 28.5 PER so far these playoffs (second only to LeBron). And if we're really into getting worked up about small sample sizes, there's this, which is surely sustainable.
   627. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:37 PM (#4126759)
Man, you're going to look like a total idiot this time tomorrow.

I realize I'm being a bit silly about it, but at the same time I don't want to assume anything. I also can see the Bulls winning game 5 and then suddenly the pressure is on the Sixers. I feel confident about the Celtics closing out the Hawks within six but not especially about tonight. All I'm saying is that far stranger things have happened.

The Lakers, on the other hand, pencil those guys into the next round. Done and done and done.
   628. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:38 PM (#4126761)
Hero Ball isn't "Every time a superstar takes a shot at the end of the game it's bad", it's when the notable "offenders" (Kobe Bryant being the one everybody singles out) gets the ball and says to himself "I'm taking this last shot regardless of whatever develops on this play even if I have to force it"
Kobe's passing end of Game 4 of Lakers-Nuggets has gotten lost in the discussion.
   629. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 05:50 PM (#4126772)
Kobe's passing end of Game 4 of Lakers-Nuggets has gotten lost in the discussion.

They talked about it on the Basketball Jones podcast yesterday, FWIW. In particular, I liked Kobe's quote about whether he felt confident passing the ball to Blake in a situation like that - don't have the quote in front of me, but it was essentially "Duh, I passed it to him, didn't I? Of course I trust him!"

And if we're really into getting worked up about small sample sizes, there's this, which is surely sustainable.

Yeah, no, that's not sustainable. Rondo did have a fairly historic season dishing out assists though - in addition to the double digit assists streak which has only been exceeded by Magic and Stockton in the past 30 years - he's the first guy to play 50 games and have an ast% of 50+ - the others are Stockton (7x), Nash (4x), and Paul (2x).

And yes, his 2011-12 was the least valuable of those seasons - but still.
   630. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 08, 2012 at 06:21 PM (#4126785)
I'd like to say again that Sixers/Celtics is NOT A THING YET.
I bet you're more scared of the jinx than you are of the Hawks.
   631. robinred Posted: May 08, 2012 at 07:32 PM (#4126822)
Kobe's passing end of Game 4 of Lakers-Nuggets has gotten lost in the discussion.


Abbott's main post Monday was actually about that. It was, I would expect, full of passive-aggressive backhanded compliments. Didn't read it.

Kobe Bryant being the one everybody singles out)


This is mostly an Abbott/ESPN thing AFAICT. As some people have pointed out, "crunch time" is actually in some ways a misnomer for what he writes about. Abbott really mostly means last shots and one-possession games in the last 1-2 minutes.

Pelton did a piece on ISOs in the Bask Pro annual, although
he did not discuss crunch time per se (he shared some of the reason for that decision with us here).

Chris Paul

Hombre has covered this, as have others. Paul can play the way he does on last possessions in part because he is Chris Paul and has special skills.

I listened to Abbott talking about this with Rambis. According to Abbott, he broke down the video of Game 2 of the Denver/Lakers series and found "11 times" that Bynum was open "with a clear passing lane."

   632. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 07:57 PM (#4126834)
[630] - ....
   633. Tripon Posted: May 08, 2012 at 08:18 PM (#4126841)

Right. It's really two steps:

1. Why can't players be drafted at 18 and play college until 20? There's no reason, it happens in college hockey.


This has more to do with the NCAAs than the NBA. The NBA should probably change its draft rules, to something more similar to what baseball or hockey has, where you draft anybody who is considered 'eligible' instead of everyone who just opts in. But the NCAA currently considers anyone who is drafted to be a 'professional' and therefore immediately ineligible for amateur status and to play in NCAA games.


2. Since the NBA has a rookie wage scale anyway, where's the harm in having the drafting team pay the kid the first two years of the wage scale, even when he's playing for someone else? There's no reason, it happens with Europeans and, well, there's no reason.


I was thinking about this, and it would really make sense for the NBA to adopt a loan procedure like the major soccer leagues have. Draft, and sign a player and then let him play for an European team or a true minor league team for a year. The NBDL is just a sorry excuse of a developmental league. The NBA should at least force each team to carry a NBDL team as a starter.
   634. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: May 08, 2012 at 08:19 PM (#4126844)
Joe, that's fair.
   635. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 08, 2012 at 09:42 PM (#4126917)
The Atlanta radio guy is about to run out on the court and kill Josh Smith. He's really, really upset. Smith's been pretty awful, but, man, this guy's really angry.
   636. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 08, 2012 at 09:53 PM (#4126933)
Ryan Hollins should be in the D-League.
   637. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 08, 2012 at 09:58 PM (#4126941)
"JOSH SMITH IS KILLING THE HAWKS, FOLKS!" Hometown announcer isn't taking it easy on his guy, I'll give him that much.
   638. Spivey Posted: May 08, 2012 at 10:26 PM (#4126984)
Atlanta certainly pissed away that 7 point lead in the blink of an eye. I can't imagine how frustrating it is to be a Hawks fan.
   639. Spivey Posted: May 08, 2012 at 10:39 PM (#4126996)
Where's hero ball when you need it Chris Paul and Rondo! I assume this data point will be ignored by many.
   640. Conor Posted: May 08, 2012 at 10:40 PM (#4126999)
Ryan Hollins should be in the D-League


I pretty much did a double take when I saw he was playing key minutes in the 4th qtr of a playoff game
   641. tshipman Posted: May 08, 2012 at 10:53 PM (#4127025)
Has the True Hoop crowd gone all negative all the time? I rarely read the posts anymore, but seemingly 90% of the blurbs that show up in my google reader are about either flopping, hero ball, or (up until the playoffs) tanking. It's like they're tapping into the id of every middle age local columnist out there who hates the NBA.


I used to read TrueHoop every day. Abbott in particular is borderline unreadable right now. The obsession on Kobe is just annoying--anything that challenges his conclusion just gets ignored and facts are crammed into his worldview. Really frustrating.


Right. It's really two steps:

1. Why can't players be drafted at 18 and play college until 20? There's no reason, it happens in college hockey.

2. Since the NBA has a rookie wage scale anyway, where's the harm in having the drafting team pay the kid the first two years of the wage scale, even when he's playing for someone else? There's no reason, it happens with Europeans and, well, there's no reason.


This is actually a really good idea that I could get behind. I mean, I still think that colleges shouldn't be benefiting from not paying their workers, but this would be significantly better than the current system. This would allow for LeBron/whoever to play in the NBA immediately, while allowing for seasoning or draft/follow type arrangements. Basketball doesn't have the conflict of interests (shredding college pitchers' arms, runningbacks knees) that other sports do. It's no riskier playing college hoops than playing NBA practices.

I like this idea.
   642. Srul Itza Posted: May 08, 2012 at 10:56 PM (#4127028)
So -- First half of Bulls-Sixers -- Ugliest half of the post-season, or the whole year?
   643. steagles Posted: May 08, 2012 at 11:00 PM (#4127033)
it would be nice if the sixers would score more than 26 points in the 2nd half.


   644. Srul Itza Posted: May 08, 2012 at 11:04 PM (#4127040)
Look at it this way -- you score only 26 points in the half, be happy you're not down by more than 9.
   645. steagles Posted: May 09, 2012 at 12:24 AM (#4127106)
so, that was probably one of the worst sports nights of my adult life. the phillies are up 4-1 in the 7th inning? well, now they're down 7-4 in the 9th. the flyers score the first goal of the game? well, they lost 3-1, and like the rest of that series, it wasn't even that close.

the sixers are up 3-1 against a team missing its two best players? well, you're only gonna score 26 points in the first half, and then you're not even gonna get within two possessions of them in the 2nd half (by the way, for anyone who didn't catch it, deng hit 3 absolutely insane shot-clock-beating 3-pointers in the 2nd half that just killed the sixers).


it wasn't just that every team lost, it wasn't even that it the flyers season ended with their loss, it was that all 3 games were absolute punt cunches, just terrible, soul-crushing losses all around.


   646. baudib Posted: May 09, 2012 at 12:38 AM (#4127117)
I didn't get to see any of the game, and I'm glad.

This officially makes Game 2 a huge aberration. Sixers should still grind out a win in Game 6 IMO.
   647. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:35 AM (#4127132)
Hero Ball nearly pulled out a miracle in Los Angeles. I was at the Dodger game tonight, and got to see Magic Johnson in the front row. Dude is... really tall. I was surprised to see him there; I assumed he'd be at Staples Center, it being the playoffs and all.
   648. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:09 AM (#4127227)
Hero Ball nearly pulled out a miracle in Los Angeles.

Plus the money quote from Koobe (yes, I'm actually defending him here - emphasis mine):

"I wouldn't say the energy kicked in in the fourth quarter," Bryant said. "I almost bailed us out, is what happened. That's something you can't rely on if you're going to win a championship."

Thoughts on Celtics/Hawks Game 5:

-- That game (and the final play) encapsulated everything scintillating/frustrating about having Rondo as your point guard. There were great steals, fancy ball handling, no look alley-oop passes, ridiculous floaters, a ridiculous fall away three to end the 1st half - plus terrible misses, lack of focus, forced passes, seemingly wide open layup opportunities where he passed instead. He did put them back in the game with the incrdible run at the end of the 3rd. The Rondo giveth, the Rondon taketh away.

-- That game was also mostly ugly. It was compelling, in that it was close and hardfought, but it was not pretty basketball for most of the night. Thankfully, we have the Bulls-Sixers series, so it looks better by comparison.

-- Horford just played great last night. There's zero chance they win that game if he isn't playing, and playing as well as he did, especially in the 2nd half. Made defensive plays, including the last one on Rondo as time ticked out, repeatedly got open for easy hoops, blocked shots. He was everywhere.

-- That said, some pretty lousy defensive rotations late by Brandon Bass and by...

-- RYAN HOLLINS! Why on earth did he play 19 minutes, including like 9 in a row in the 3rd-4th quarters? Unless Steimsma was hurt, I just don't get that. The CAVS cut this guy (no offense, Cavs fans). He tries out there, but he was awful on D - constantly losing Horford or showing too hard on the pick and roll, leading to easy buckets for the Hawks. Drove me crazy. Also, the Celtics, though a team with three Hall of Famers and a top five point guard, just played Ryan ####### Hollins for 19 minutes in a playoff game. I'd be so psyched right now if I was a Heat fan.

-- Really, Philips Arena? Streamers from the ceiling for a game 5 win in the first round that doesn't even give you the lead in the series, much less clinch it? Amateur hour.
   649. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:21 AM (#4127239)
Joe, that's fair.

If the Hawks go into Boston and win game 6, I will officially be scared of them.

Man, you're going to look like a total idiot this time tomorrow.

(cough)
   650. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:32 AM (#4127253)
Man, you're going to look like a total idiot this time tomorrow.

(cough)
That has nothing to do with basketball. Tee-hee!
   651. Famous Original Joe C Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:34 AM (#4127257)
That has nothing to do with basketball. Tee-hee!

I defend KOBE F. BRYANT and this is the treatment I get? You people...
   652. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:49 AM (#4127266)
so, that was probably one of the worst sports nights of my adult life. the phillies are up 4-1 in the 7th inning? well, now they're down 7-4 in the 9th. the flyers score the first goal of the game? well, they lost 3-1, and like the rest of that series, it wasn't even that close.

Boo-frickin-hoo. I'll give you the Flyers, especially the way the game winning goal was scored; I thought they looked like the best team after the first round. But a regular season May baseball game? Give me a break. And as for the Sixers, last night's "punt cunch" gets them within 5 punt cunches the Bulls have suffered this series. Speaking of, there's a great chance Taj Gibson will miss game 6 now. He stayed on the court after badly spraining his ankle, but was mostly ineffective. Soul-crushing is getting eliminated from the playoffs in the first round because of injuries in a year when you're on the short list of contenders for the title*; losing a non-elimination game in a series you're still going to win even though you're huge underdogs and have no business even being competitive is at worst a zit on your ass.

As for the game itself, that's what happens when Philly doesn't get 50 FTA (they still more than doubled the Bulls' attempts). Of Deng's 3 shot clock beater 3's, I'd say only one (the last one) was truly ridiculous; the first 2 were wide open spot up shoots. All that does is cancel out Hawes's ridiculous 3 in game 2. The Sixers are still overwhelming favorites to win the series, especially if Gibson is out/hobbled.

Last night is also why I refuse to take the Sixers seriously in the next round. They shot 32.1%. For the series, including the flukiest of all fluky shooting games, Philly is shooting 40.9% (4 of the 5 games have been sub-40%); for the season, the Bulls held opponents to 42.1% shooting.

Really, Atlanta? Streamers from the ceiling for a game 5 win in the first round that doesn't even give you the lead in the series, much less clinch it? Amateur hour.

Apparently it's a thing now. Philly did the confetti thing after both game 3 and 4 wins.

*This might actually apply to the Flyers, save the round of elimination.
   653. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:51 AM (#4127268)
I defend KOBE F. BRYANT and this is the treatment I get? You people...

So I was right!
   654. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:56 AM (#4127274)
But the NCAA currently considers anyone who is drafted to be a 'professional' and therefore immediately ineligible for amateur status and to play in NCAA games.

In basketball. Guys drafted in hockey are allowed to play. Everyone's drafted in baseball before they go to college. Hell, if you play professional baseball, you're still allowed to play football or basketball in the NCAA and not be considered a professional. I still can't figure that one out. Drew Henson made probably about as much money as Lloyd Carr at Michigan, and Henson was an "amateur."

   655. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 11:13 AM (#4127299)
Portland is interviewing GMs right now. Former Hornets GM Jeff Bowers met with Paul Allen, I believe that Indiana's current GM has an interview set up, and the Portland dream is Mitch Kupchak or Ainge.

The biggest thing in the Portland job is how willing you are to listen to and humor Allen on his basketball opinions.
   656. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 09, 2012 at 12:15 PM (#4127358)
I defend KOBE F. BRYANT and this is the treatment I get? You people...
I know! Twice in two days!

C'mon, big guy, up top!
   657. Tripon Posted: May 09, 2012 at 12:15 PM (#4127359)

In basketball. Guys drafted in hockey are allowed to play. Everyone's drafted in baseball before they go to college. Hell, if you play professional baseball, you're still allowed to play football or basketball in the NCAA and not be considered a professional. I still can't figure that one out. Drew Henson made probably about as much money as Lloyd Carr at Michigan, and Henson was an "amateur."


That's because the draft rules are different in the Hockey and Baseball. In those sports, its an opt out to be not drafted, in basketball and football, you have to submit your name to be drafted, or opt in.
   658. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:04 PM (#4127403)
That's because the draft rules are different in the Hockey and Baseball. In those sports, its an opt out to be not drafted, in basketball and football, you have to submit your name to be drafted, or opt in.

So? I don't get why the NCAA makes a distinction.

Besides them being a hypocritical exploitative organization.
   659. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:08 PM (#4127408)
Mark Titus did an interview with Oden on Grantland. I have not read it yet.
   660. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:10 PM (#4127414)

So? I don't get why the NCAA makes a distinction.


In one case the player is deciding to go pro. In the other, the player is drafted with or without his consent.
   661. Tripon Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:13 PM (#4127415)

Besides them being a hypocritical exploitative organization.


Well, here's the reason. Its the same reason why they decide to cap scholarships in the first place. If your goal to help educate young men and women, why is there a scholarship cap?
   662. nick swisher hygiene Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:39 PM (#4127442)
Something of a downer, that piece.....

"During his stay in Los Angeles, the blind dog that Greg had raised for the past four years crawled through a hotel balcony railing and fell eight stories to its death."

   663. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:41 PM (#4127445)
Its the same reason why they decide to cap scholarships in the first place. If your goal to help educate young men and women, why is there a scholarship cap?

Competitive balance, obviously. You don't want Kentucky to have 28 basketball players on scholarship, while Elon has 5.
   664. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:49 PM (#4127454)
Competitive balance, obviously. You don't want Kentucky to have 28 basketball players on scholarship, while Elon has 5.


I don't want Elon in Division 1. Why, what's the point?

Bilas actually wrote about that today.
   665. madvillain Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:54 PM (#4127459)
It's been a long couple weeks. I was literally in the wilderness during Chicago's opening game, and came back to my computer to see "Rose tears ACL". It's sports, it happens. At the same time, I've had a hard time reconciling my fandom in the face of such events.

A top athlete’s beauty is next to impossible to describe directly. Or to evoke. Federer’s forehand is a great liquid whip, his backhand a one-hander that he can drive flat, load with topspin, or slice — the slice with such snap that the ball turns shapes in the air and skids on the grass to maybe ankle height. His serve has world-class pace and a degree of placement and variety no one else comes close to; the service motion is lithe and uneccentric, distinctive (on TV) only in a certain eel-like all-body snap at the moment of impact. His anticipation and court sense are otherworldly, and his footwork is the best in the game — as a child, he was also a soccer prodigy. All this is true, and yet none of it really explains anything or evokes the experience of watching this man play. Of witnessing, firsthand, the beauty and genius of his game. You more have to come at the aesthetic stuff obliquely, to talk around it, or — as Aquinas did with his own ineffable subject — to try to define it in terms of what it is not.

That was David Foster Wallace from '06 in an rather famous essay musing on the "Federer as Religion". In it he comes as close as possible to capturing the essence of it all. Why we post on message boards about it, why we text our friends when we see something amazing, why we let our days and lives be influenced by people we do not know and can only imagine being through dreams and faded memories of small(er) time glories.

Rose's injury sucks, it sucks hard. It's sad for sports, sad for all his fans and sad for him. It's also a part of the game. I'm not sure if there is any real takeway here, other than that to mute our fandom in the face of adversity is impossible. Sure I can avoid watching the games (I'm not a huge fan of funeral marches, and that's what this current Chicago team is on, sans their 2 best players), but I can't avoid peaking at the scores and an occasional glance at how Rose is coping as he awaits surgery and uncertainty.

The stats tell us that young ballers come back well from ACL injuries. But a part of me firmly believes that the Rose we have come to know and love, the soaring in between Wade and Lebron and finishing over them Rose from the ECF of last season is gone, never to return. I hope not, and that's all we can do as fans, hope and wait.
   666. smileyy Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:54 PM (#4127461)

So? I don't get why the NCAA makes a distinction.


To protect the billions of dollars they make from the NCAA tournament?
   667. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: May 09, 2012 at 01:57 PM (#4127464)
Bilas actually wrote about that today.

Oh, well, that settles it then. Jay Bilas has spoken.
   668. GregD Posted: May 09, 2012 at 03:00 PM (#4127521)
Competitive balance, obviously. You don't want Kentucky to have 28 basketball players on scholarship, while Elon has 5.
If I remember correctly the scholarship limit was put in place specifically to keep Kentucky and Kansas from stockpiling too much talent. When freshmen couldn't play, in particular, Rupp and Phog Allen would try to sign 15-20 freshmen to try them out for a year. They could transfer later, but the weakness of the scouting and their persuasiveness (and perhaps the fringe benefits) meant that it wasn't unusual for them to have insanely stacked freshmen teams, with like 3 of the 4 best centers in the country and other ridiculous situations, and for other programs to be scrounging for leftovers. That wouldn't happen now because top players are eligible as frosh, have higher expectations for quick playing time, and are much more aware of their potential competition.

I don't think that many teams would try it now, anyway. Both Coach K and Calipari seem to work against having depth on the grounds, I think, of chemistry. If you can isolate the 7 people you really want to play, then the other players can either hang around or leave and you don't have the fighting over playing time that you can get if you really have 11 good players. Calipari has been pretty clear that in his interviews that he only wants to play 7 people and is okay with just playing 6.
   669. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 04:25 PM (#4127601)
Over/Under: SVG is fired before Memorial Day.

I'll take the under, meaning I think he'll be gone before that.
   670. smileyy Posted: May 09, 2012 at 04:54 PM (#4127632)
Now that you mention it, I'm surprised he hasnt been fired already.
   671. andrewberg Posted: May 09, 2012 at 05:27 PM (#4127660)
If ORL doesn't fire SVG, it would likely mean they have resolved to trade Howard before the start of next year.
   672. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: May 09, 2012 at 05:52 PM (#4127673)
:: Sigh ::
Remember, a basketball team follows the lead of its coach and its best players. They have to be in synch or everything falls apart like it's the end of a Jenga commercial. That's why the Spurs never go away — because Gregg Popovich and Tim Duncan built something that transcends the grind of any season. That's why the Lakers never cave — because Kobe's teammates are petrified to let him down. That's why the Celtics never folded before the 2012 deadline — because Doc Rivers, Rajon Rondo and the vets had built too much collective pride to get submarined by rumors and hearsay. That's why Miami ebbs and flows depending on the moment — because their best player (and the league's best player, by far) can't totally decide what he wants to be.
   673. JJ1986 Posted: May 09, 2012 at 05:56 PM (#4127678)
Miami "ebbs and flows" to a better record than the Celtics or Lakers and a better postseason performance so far.
   674. robinred Posted: May 09, 2012 at 06:04 PM (#4127683)
“They’re committing three people,” Bynum said. “It is what it is. I just have to find another way to get the ball and be effective. They have the ball, they’re looking to get it to me. It’s not like they’re not trying.”


--

As to Simmons, leading up to the 2009 Playoffs, Simmons called James the best teammate among truly great players "since Magic Johnson" and waxed rhapsodic about the Cavs' little rituals, his favorite being the one where they would all pose for a fake picture.

He also said that the "fake cameraderie" of the Lakers, since they all obviously hated Kobe and were just pretending they didn't, would probably doom them. Then the Lakers won twice, the Cavs lost before the Finals twice, and James went to Miami.

Simmons has many plusses, but the revisionism/bias on his psychic chemistry narratives is one of the big minuses.

My own take is that Kobe is pretty much the same guy he has always been, good and bad included, and his team has ebbed and flowed based on talent and coaching. Ditto James.
   675. Jimmy P Posted: May 09, 2012 at 07:08 PM (#4127712)
I attended just enough Clippers games this season to know when Paul gets "The Look."

------
When Chris gets The Look, it's all over. Somebody has to pay.


Sounds a lot like hero ball
   676. nick swisher hygiene Posted: May 09, 2012 at 07:14 PM (#4127714)
674--you'd think a guy with season tickets who knows everything the author of that piece knows would've picked his Clips to take down the Grizzlies, wouldn't you?
   677. smileyy Posted: May 09, 2012 at 07:30 PM (#4127725)
That's why the Spurs never go away — because Gregg Popovich and Tim Duncan built something that transcends the grind of any season.


I had no idea that Pops had welded together Manu Ginobili in his garage, or that Tim Duncan had drafted Tony Parker.

Simmons mistakes talent for "character".
   678. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: May 09, 2012 at 07:41 PM (#4127731)
Simmons mistakes lots of things for "character".
   679. tshipman Posted: May 09, 2012 at 10:35 PM (#4127916)
Simmons mistakes lots of things for "character".


This isn't Simmons, though. This is everyone. People mistake hitting an unsustainably high number of three pointers as a sign of character, or grittiness, or wanting it.

Semi-random events are hated by the rational mind.

Edit: also, Jesus Christ that Greg Oden article is a downer.
   680. Tripon Posted: May 09, 2012 at 11:14 PM (#4127949)


I don't want Elon in Division 1. Why, what's the point?

Bilas actually wrote about that today.


I know Butler didn't make the tourney last year, but did he already forget that they made the NCAA finals two times in a row?
   681. Booey Posted: May 09, 2012 at 11:15 PM (#4127951)
Edit: also, Jesus Christ that Greg Oden article is a downer.


Just like his career.
   682. CFBF Is A Golden Spider Duck Posted: May 10, 2012 at 12:04 AM (#4127982)
Did the Heat and Knicks really need three days of recovery from game four?
   683. outl13r Posted: May 10, 2012 at 12:31 AM (#4127986)
676- In Simmons defense (which I really don't like to do) his justification for not picking LAC was because he picked Memphis vs Miami in the finals at the beginning of the year and wanted to be consistent.
   684. outl13r Posted: May 10, 2012 at 12:32 AM (#4127987)
Did the Heat and Knicks really need three days of recovery from game four?


No; the media wanted three days to be able to write about the Heat and the Knicks.
   685. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 10, 2012 at 10:41 AM (#4128124)
I missed the end of the Clips/Grizz game (and by that, I mean the entire 2nd half), did Paul get hurt or something? Hollinger had a weird tweet about him maybe not playing in game 6, and nothing else I can find seems to indicate he's that injured.

---

Did the Heat and Knicks really need three days of recovery from game four?

No; the media wanted three days to be able to write about the Heat and the Knicks.


Baron Davis needs more than 3 days to recover. This complaint comes up every year, and every year the NBA drags out the first round as long as possible.

---

Rose's injury sucks, it sucks hard. It's sad for sports, sad for all his fans and sad for him. It's also a part of the game. I'm not sure if there is any real takeway here, other than that to mute our fandom in the face of adversity is impossible. Sure I can avoid watching the games (I'm not a huge fan of funeral marches, and that's what this current Chicago team is on, sans their 2 best players), but I can't avoid peaking at the scores and an occasional glance at how Rose is coping as he awaits surgery and uncertainty.

I hear what you're saying, but I can't not watch. Gibson says he's playing tonight, so there's a non-zero chance the Bulls win and force game 7, but it's not likely (and he's not likely to be anywhere near 100%).

Not that I'm asking anyone to feel sorry for me or anything, but it's been a rough 6+ months as a Chicago fan*. First, the Bears lose 2 of their best players (Cutler and Forte); stuff like that happens even more in football, but the Bears were 7-3 when Cutler went down and finished 8-8. Considering the 9-7 Giants won the Super Bowl, there was always a chance of contention from the Bears. Then, the Hawks lost their 2 best players (Toews and Hossa). The Hawks had the best record in the NHL when Toews was knocked out (he was arguably the best player in the league at that point and was in the top 3 of scoring); he came back for game 1 of the playoffs but was clearly not the same. Hossa was knocked the #### out in game 3 of the first round. The Hawks lost in 6, but 5 of the games (and 3 of their losses) were in OT where every little bit counts. And now Rose and Noah (Noah's probably only the Bulls' 3rd best player, but he's better than a 1 armed Deng). That's 3 contending teams having their season ruined by injury. Too bad. At least the Cubs have Theo...

*This doesn't count the ridiculous collapses by both the Illinois football (6-0 start, finished 6-6) and basketball (15-3 start, finished 17-14 plus a first round loss in the NIT) teams that rightfully cost both coaches their jobs.
   686. Maxwn Posted: May 10, 2012 at 11:00 AM (#4128151)
I missed the end of the Clips/Grizz game (and by that, I mean the entire 2nd half), did Paul get hurt or something? Hollinger had a weird tweet about him maybe not playing in game 6, and nothing else I can find seems to indicate he's that injured.

It's on the front page of ESPN now. They're saying Blake has a sprained left knee and Paul has a strained right hip flexor and a jammed right middle finger.

Simmons has already tried to walk back his "things are different for the Clippers now" column because "Griffin and CP are hurt".
   687. JC in DC Posted: May 10, 2012 at 11:07 AM (#4128158)
So, I just read the Oden article and I have a few impressions.

(1) The article sucks: I find it poorly written, surprisingly uninteresting and unthoughtful. Very superficial.
(2) I feel for Greg Oden a great deal, which is no different than I felt before, but I don't buy any of the articles suggestions that Oden was pressured to get back on the court early. Portland's medical staff may very well be to blame for some of Oden's troubles, but nothing in the article makes me more disposed to think that;
(3) Grantland needs to raise its standards. That's a crappy piece from every perspective. It reads like a mediocre HS newspaper piece.
   688. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: May 10, 2012 at 11:46 AM (#4128203)
I'm not sure that Grantland was the right place for it, but I don't think you get that interview without the author in question (AAU and college teammate of Oden). It was superficial, I didn't find it well written, but I'm still glad I read it.
   689. Fourth True Outcome Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:22 PM (#4128283)
I feel for Greg Oden a great deal, which is no different than I felt before, but I don't buy any of the articles suggestions that Oden was pressured to get back on the court early.


Mark Titus, the author of the piece, had an interview with a Portland radio station about the piece that BlazersEdge has posted. He makes it explicit that Oden himself doesn't give credence to blaming Portland at all:
In Greg's defense, he didn't blame anybody but himself. Anything you read in the article that you get the feeling he's blaming other people, that was probably me sticking up for him a little bit. I wrote in the article, I tried to bait him into saying that it's Portland's fault that he kept getting hurt. He wouldn't say it. He said, 'No, listen, I made the decision, I knew I didn't feel well, if I didn't want to come back, I could have just said no.' He takes responsibility but it was more or less me sticking up for him. I don't know if people got that confused or what but he's never blamed anything on anybody.


I would agree that the article isn't well-written, but the value it has is in its access to Oden and his thoughts (certainly far more than the author's take), which, as Der K points out, would be impossible were it written by anybody but his former teammate.
   690. andrewberg Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:25 PM (#4128284)
(3) Grantland needs to raise its standards. That's a crappy piece from every perspective. It reads like a mediocre HS newspaper piece.


I know what you mean, but that's an exaggeration. I'd say it's more like a feature from a small town daily than a HS paper (I work at a University and read its daily paper; it is better than that). Still, I often found myself either being jolted out of the narrative by the poor flow or wondering how he drew a conclusion from what was in the article. What Der K said is certainly a mitigating factor. Also, Simmons starting hyping Mark Titus from his days writing Club Trillion even though that blog had a lot of the same drawbacks as this article.
   691. JJ1986 Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:26 PM (#4128285)
Is Titus the same guy who made the comments about Evan Turner mentioned a few pages ago?
   692. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:31 PM (#4128289)
I attended just enough Clippers games this season to know when Paul gets "The Look."

This nonsense is a recurring theme of Simmons's schtick/oeuvre -- games are often decided by turning point moments of clarity revealed and identifiable by the body language of a player or group of players. And among the very best identifiers of the moments and body language is none other than ... Bill Simmons.

There is no "Look," there is no "Secret," you can't tell that a team has irredeemably given up on its coach by two guys' body language in one huddle, and the Red Sox don't lose playoff games because the crowd senses doom and loses its mojo.

God, how annoying.
   693. Der-K and the statistical werewolves. Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:31 PM (#4128290)
691: yup
692: yup
   694. andrewberg Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:37 PM (#4128299)
There is no "Look," there is no "Secret," you can't tell that a team has irredeemably given up on its coach by two guys' body language in one huddle, and the Red Sox don't lose playoff games because the crowd senses doom and loses its mojo.


New rule! Simmons can only write about games or seasons when a player or team had "the look" or "the secret" if he identifies it before it happens. He can record all "looks" and "secrets" on twitter and hire an intern to keep score. In six months, he will stop writing about looks and secrets.
   695. HMS Moses Taylor Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:40 PM (#4128302)
I know what you mean, but that's an exaggeration. I'd say it's more like a feature from a small town daily than a HS paper (I work at a University and read its daily paper; it is better than that). Still, I often found myself either being jolted out of the narrative by the poor flow or wondering how he drew a conclusion from what was in the article. What Der K said is certainly a mitigating factor. Also, Simmons starting hyping Mark Titus from his days writing Club Trillion even though that blog had a lot of the same drawbacks as this article.

There's some parts in there where it's clear Titus is trying to copy Simmons' style and it doesn't work. I thought the same thing as you; while reading it I was distracted and the terribleness of the writing. A strong editor could have made a difference.

Is Titus the same guy who made the comments about Evan Turner mentioned a few pages ago?

Yeah, and I can never tell how serious Titus and Turner are being.
   696. JC in DC Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:47 PM (#4128308)
I gotta say, I don't know what thoughts of Oden's I learned from the article. My criticism is ultimately that it failed on that count: as Howard Stern would say, the guy was a bad interviewer. I didn't learn much at all from his non-probing questions.
   697. baudib Posted: May 10, 2012 at 01:47 PM (#4128309)
This nonsense is a recurring theme of Simmons's schtick/oeuvre -- games are often decided by turning point moments of clarity revealed and identifiable by the body language of a player or group of players. And among the very best identifiers of the moments and body language is none other than ... Bill Simmons.

There is no "Look," there is no "Secret," you can't tell that a team has irredeemably given up on its coach by two guys' body language in one huddle, and the Red Sox don't lose playoff games because the crowd senses doom and loses its mojo.


If Dewey Evans didn't get a bad feeling when he tapped his glove, Bucky F. Dent would have never hit that homer.

   698. steagles Posted: May 10, 2012 at 03:07 PM (#4128429)
Is Titus the same guy who made the comments about Evan Turner mentioned a few pages ago?

Yeah, and I can never tell how serious Titus and Turner are being.
whether it's a work or a shoot, i think it's absolutely hilarious.
Since I take pride in getting under people’s skin, Evan presented a prime opportunity for me to have a little fun. Unfortunately, he took my playful jabs personally and would retort with the kind of insults that suggest that maybe he was taking the verbal debate a little too far. Basically, my comments prompted an “Oh no he di-unt!” response from onlookers whereas Evan’s comments prompted an “Umm…Evan…you can’t say things like that to people and still be accepted by society” response from onlookers.
   699. JuanGone..except1game Posted: May 10, 2012 at 03:57 PM (#4128514)
Wow, don't know how Birdman recovers from this.
   700. Athletic Supporter can feel the slow rot Posted: May 10, 2012 at 04:11 PM (#4128523)
I'm waiting for more evidence. Birdman seems like such a nice young man.
Page 7 of 24 pages ‹ First  < 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 >  Last ›

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
danielj
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogOT: Politics, August 2014: DNC criticizes Christie’s economic record with baseball video
(5641 - 1:06pm, Aug 27)
Last: Johnny Sycophant-Laden Fora

NewsblogDavid Justice Says Put Barry Bonds in Baseball Hall of Fame Despite Steroid Use Late In Career
(102 - 1:06pm, Aug 27)
Last: Jimmy

NewsblogPosnanski: Blaming the fans
(33 - 1:05pm, Aug 27)
Last: What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face?

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread - August 2014
(339 - 1:04pm, Aug 27)
Last: AROM

NewsblogRoyals Walk Off; Ned Yost Complains About Attendance
(1 - 12:56pm, Aug 27)
Last: Rough Carrigan

NewsblogOT: NBC.news: Valve isn’t making one gaming console, but multiple ‘Steam machines’
(743 - 12:54pm, Aug 27)
Last: snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster)

NewsblogBrooklyn Cyclones, Nickelodeon to host '90s night
(8 - 12:54pm, Aug 27)
Last: Manny Coon

NewsblogMariners Extend GM Jack Zduriencik
(29 - 12:53pm, Aug 27)
Last: Johnny Sycophant-Laden Fora

NewsblogOT: The Soccer Thread August, 2014
(663 - 12:49pm, Aug 27)
Last: J. Sosa

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player: 1957 Discussion
(29 - 12:42pm, Aug 27)
Last: Tubbs & Minnie Miñoso don't fear Sid Monge

NewsblogGleeman: Oscar Taveras is hitting and Mike Matheny is happy
(8 - 12:39pm, Aug 27)
Last: Sleepy supports unauthorized rambling

NewsblogDaily Orange: Beyond the box score—SU club uses statistics to further baseball knowledge
(14 - 12:34pm, Aug 27)
Last: Lance Reddick! Lance him!

NewsblogOT August 2014:  Wrassle Mania I
(85 - 12:29pm, Aug 27)
Last: andrewberg

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 8-27-2014
(14 - 11:23am, Aug 27)
Last: salvomania

NewsblogByron Buxton, Addison Russell, Mark Appel named to Arizona Fall League rosters | MiLB.com
(10 - 11:04am, Aug 27)
Last: Boxkutter

Page rendered in 0.9532 seconds
52 querie(s) executed