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Tuesday, November 06, 2012

OT: NFL/NHL thread

i estimate that absolutely noone gives a damn about the NHL, so by folding that thread into this one, we won’t distract from what this thread is really about: boner pills, blood doping (is it low t?), and…jesus christ did mike vick just throw another ####### interception?

steagles Posted: November 06, 2012 at 12:03 AM | 8036 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: nfl, nhl

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   2101. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:10 PM (#4349423)
I thought the statement was that he found out Dec. 26th?


So did I. Although I suppose the ND statement referred to the day ND found out from Te'o.
   2102. Commissioner Bud Black Beltre Hillman Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:10 PM (#4349424)
Is there anyone here - or anyone alive - who believes every word of Te'o's statement? And every word of Notre Dame's?
There certainly doesn't seem to be, no; not sure why you're still so focused on this, as he pretty clearly lied to some degree. What *is* still at issue is whether he lied because he was in on it for publicity/Heisman gain, lied to cover up his embarrassment at getting suckered by a "girl" he'd never met, or lied for some other reason (say, relationship was a cover for being gay).
   2103. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:20 PM (#4349431)
I thought the statement was that he found out Dec. 26th?


I did too. Te'o told the school found on out Dec. 26th, claims he found out on the 6th.

On the morning of December 26th, very early morning, Manti called his coaches to inform them that, while he was in attendance at the ESPN awards show in Orlando, he received a phone call from a number he recognized as having been that he associated with Lennay Kekua. When he answered it, it was a person whose voice sounded like the same voice he had talked to, who told him that she was, in fact, not dead.


The awards show was on the 6th.
   2104. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:25 PM (#4349433)
Full transcript of Pete Thamel's interview with Te'o.

I still don't know if he's lying or duped, and now I have more questions.

TE'O: She graduated in 2011 or 2010. 2011.
SI: What was her major?
TE'O: Her major was in English and something. I'll double check.


SI: Hit by a drunk driver. What were her injuries?
TE'O: I don't know. She had a lot of different injuries.


That doesn't pass the smell test.
   2105. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:25 PM (#4349434)
NY Daily News:

An NFL scout told the Daily News that the Notre Dame linebacker’s bizarre scandal could drop him out of the first round in April’s draft.

“We had a late first-round grade on him, between 20-25 in the first round,” the scout said. “From our vantage point, part of what you liked about him is his character, his intangibles. If that’s shaky, it could definitely impact his draft status. It definitely hurts him. I would say it could drop him about a round. You wouldn’t want to take him with a premium pick. This is just bizarre, very bizarre.”

“Everybody is going to ask him about it,” the scout said. “It better be solid if he’s making up a story to cover the story. It’s getting to be a tangled web. It just doesn’t reflect well...”


http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/scout-manti-draft-stock-thrown-loss-article-1.1241810
   2106. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:30 PM (#4349440)

As a Nebraska alum and viewer of probably 90% of Dennard's career games, in my view he definitely took a step back last year (again his injuries hobbled him much of the season), I think he got 1st team on rep alone.


Perhaps, but a 7th-round pick? Lavonte David was also first-team Big 10, and he was drafted in the 2nd round. I think Dennard was a third-round talent, no worse than 4th at most. Belichick himself said that the arrest affected his draft stock.
   2107. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:34 PM (#4349441)
So... from DA's link, SI actually fact checked the story. And yet despite coming up empty at various turns it apparently didn't dawn on them that she wasn't real:

I thought that maybe she didn't graduate, so we took any reference to Stanford out of the story.

We searched for details about the car crash. Brian Te'o told our fact checker and Manti told me that a drunk driver had hit her. We couldn't find any articles about that accident and took the drunk driving reference out. It was just a car accident.


Earlier in the article:

He never specified that he'd met her in person, and I didn't ask. Why would you ask someone if he'd actually met his girlfriend who recently died?


Well, you wouldn't, unless perhaps your fact checker kept drawing blanks?
   2108. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:39 PM (#4349443)
I'm sure it's not uncommon for a fact checker to not be able to corroborate every detail in a story.
   2109. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:41 PM (#4349444)
Here Te'o says she saw him (at a game), but he never saw her. So I guess this was supposed to be before they were dating:

SI: Your girlfriend's funeral was yesterday?

TE'O: I talked to [her family yesterday]. I cried. I cried at 12 noon yesterday. At 9 a.m. California time.

SI: She was buried in California?

TE'O: She was always in California. Her family is from Hawaii but they live in California.

SI: Where did you meet her in California?

TE'O: She actually came to one of the games. She saw me at one of the games.

SI: October 15, I assume is USC?

TE'O: That was in November. But she saw me at the USC game of my sophomore year. We were still just friends, we were acquaintances.

   2110. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:41 PM (#4349447)
I'm sure it's not uncommon for a fact checker to not be able to corroborate every detail in a story.


What about any detail? Was there a single detail the fact checker was able to corroborate?
   2111. The Yankee Clapper Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:44 PM (#4349449)
Seems a little inconsistent, at least to me, to (rightfully) fault the media for not checking on the Dead Girlfriend story, but then turn around and make sweeping conclusions on what Te'o's role was when so much remains unknown.

And I don't think the Pulitzer Committee should be fawning over Deadspin, either. They seem to be holding back a lot of information. They tracked down the Photo Girl -- good for them -- but as I understand it, they don't explain the connection between her and the Creepy Guy allegedly using her photo or address why she thinks he is involved. And why are they giving anonymity to Creepy Guy's "friend" so he can say he is 80% sure Te'o knew?

Te'o may have been in on it, or he may be an extremely gullible person who was played. It's probably going to take a few more days to know which.


   2112. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:45 PM (#4349451)
TE'O: I talked to [her family yesterday]. I cried. I cried at 12 noon yesterday. At 9 a.m. California time.

Who would this "family" be? Him knowing her "family" would extend the number of hoaxers beyond one, right?

And who reported to him that she had died? Obviously she couldn't have.
   2113. JJ1986 Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:47 PM (#4349453)
they don't explain the connection between her and the Creepy Guy allegedly using her photo or address why she thinks he is involved.


This is all detailed. They were high school classmates, at one point he asked her for one of the photos that was used.
   2114. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 06:50 PM (#4349456)
I'm sure it's not uncommon for a fact checker to not be able to corroborate every detail in a story.


Agreed, but Thamel did a follow up 2 months later. He whiffed on a chance to ask questions about it. He could have easily slipped in questions like "do you have a picture of her?" (assuming it was in person and not a phone interview) or "how many times did you see her?" Perfectly normal questions in that situation.

And who reported to him that she had died? Obviously she couldn't have.


"Her brother" called him.
   2115. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:03 PM (#4349465)
So with this "catfishing" - a word I just learned yesterday - would this story fit the profile of it? I mean, an elaborate network of lies with multiple people playing multiple roles (the girl, family members) and a complex scheme, all working towards the common goal of making a person believe that he was dating a girl he had never met?

Using the phone, using Twitter, scheduling meetings in Hawaii with him, having him talk to her and her brother and her parents, creating a "sister" of hers via Twitter, etc etc?

Would it go on for months and years? Would it be set up over a period of years, seeds planted *years* before they actually started dating? Is that it?

He really needs to show the phone records. If he has phone records where he talked to "her" virtually nightly over a period of four months, and frequently for a longer period than that, I will believe him, I will believe that he is the most gullible person on the planet who stretched the truth in interviews even going so far as to deceive and mislead people because he was embarrassed about the relationship being online -- but not a participant in the hoax.
   2116. Rickey! trades in sheep and threats Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:04 PM (#4349467)
Tony Gonzalez is 103 years old and runs like a paraplegic and still catches 6 passes a game for 60 yards and a TD. For years teams have tried everything to no avail. It's one of the reasons why he's one of the greatest ever.


Pos has a good bit on Tony Gonzalez up at Sports on Earth.
   2117. Petunia inquires about ponies Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:10 PM (#4349469)
Would it go on for months and years? Would it be set up over a period of years, seeds planted *years* before they actually started dating? Is that it?

That's what the Deadspin article plainly says happened.
   2118. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:12 PM (#4349470)
That's what the Deadspin article plainly says happened.


Obviously. But the question was whether this fits the profile of catfishing.
   2119. Howie Menckel Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:12 PM (#4349471)
The only Dr Phil episode I've seen in many years was a couple of weeks ago on..... catfishing.

I was just dialflipping, and rolled my eyes at first but - damn.

This was three different women who each fell for the same catfish around the same time. Two of them got the same fake pictures of the guy, even. The catfish turned out to be - a middle-aged WOMAN, not a young guy.

These were attractive women, not wallflowers. And it was similar to this - intense texting and emails, a feeling of falling in love... plus numerous plans to meet, only to have a virus or a loved one's car accident, or something else get in the way.

These went on for more than a year. The women are humiliated now, but they believed what they wanted to believe.

I don't necessarily believe any of this Notre Dame guy's story, but apparently it is true that even desirable people can fall for this. This woman even finessed the voice problem - the rare calls would be while she "had a cold" or "was hung over" or whatever.

   2120. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:17 PM (#4349473)
In a precursor to catfishing, Elaine Benes grew quite fond of Vincent, based primarily on the videos he recommended.

So it can happen.
   2121. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:23 PM (#4349475)
These were attractive women, not wallflowers.

Yeah, but Te'o's a guy. I mean, honestly, what guy gets all misty over an Internet pen pal he's never so much as met, much less touched? Did they even Skype? I mean ... please.

This thing is so postmodern and weird, I'm having problems seeing where the "hoax" is. It's not really the person themself, since Te'o did communicate with a person who I guess he became fond of. And she was a woman.(*) So in what sense did she not "exist"? She wasn't who she said she was, I guess, but you don't need the internet for that.

I guess the "hoax" is that she died of leukemia, but if she didn't in fact die, why doesn't Te'o just get back together with her?

(*) And even that doesn't really matter, if a guy could play a woman that could be attractive in an online sense, the only sense in which Te'o knew "her."
   2122. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:34 PM (#4349482)
Well, the plot thickens.

A Notre Dame fan site I infrequent had some interesting (though obviously fourth hand and not necessarily reliable) information.

A twitter account was created which only followed Te'o and the Kekua account. Right around the time of the alleged car accident, Robert Woods (USC wide receiver) tweeted the dummy account saying, "hahaha sick, what did you guys do today"

The posters there baldly stated that Tuiasosopo has some sort of USC connections and it's plausible that he knows Robert Woods in some fashion.

EDIT: the implication is that the dummy account never sent tweets to anyone so the only reason Woods would tweet that account is if he knew who controlled it.
   2123. JL Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:41 PM (#4349485)
Also, "Te'o won't give us any photos of her or let us speak to her family, out of respect for their privacy and on their request." Fine. Perfectly reasonable. But this should prompt you again to do the basic fact checking. If it checks out, fine. But then when the basic fact checking fails, go back to Te'o and be like, ummm, what's the deal here. And THEN, yes, proceed to investigate just what in the hell is going on here.


Or even basic background information. After interviewing him, you tell the intern to do some interweb searches to see what others reported on her death or the accident, what was in the obituary, etc. Maybe others have talked to the family and you can quote them. You don't have to even doubt his story to do this stuff.
   2124. The Yankee Clapper Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:46 PM (#4349487)
So with this "catfishing" - a word I just learned yesterday - would this story fit the profile of it?

I only heard the term today, but Te'o's version of the events would seem to describe a "catfishing" scenario. And if you Google the term, you can quite easily find the story of a guy who was a victim, but was able to make a documentary out of the experience and is now developing a TV show.
   2125. Howie Menckel Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:49 PM (#4349488)

that's the difference between the Podunk Press and SI, for instance - the latter factchecks everything, precisely so this can't happen. The former guy may be shoveling out 4 stories a day. Doesn't excuse a lack of verification, but it's hardly surprising, either.

The 'big dog' news operations that failed here are a looking at a systemic blunder - they had people trying to verify info, being obviously unable to do so to any factual degree (getting someone to say 'yeah, that' is not the same as documentation), then running it anyway.

If we're lucky, they'll tighten up their standards, at least. What probably kills many of them right now is that while the puff piece "hero overcomes tragedy" saga moves the merchandise - so does undercovering a fraud. And the latter even lets you get taken seriously in the journalistic community.

   2126. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:50 PM (#4349490)
And if you Google the term, you can quite easily find the story of a guy who was a victim, but was able to make a documentary out of the experience and is now developing a TV show.


It already is a TV show on MTV. And by sheer coincidence yesterday MTV aired the movie and then a marathon of episodes.

Sometimes the jokes write themselves.
   2127. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:53 PM (#4349498)
The 'big dog' news operations that failed here are a looking at a systemic blunder - they had people trying to verify info, being obviously unable to do so to any factual degree (getting someone to say 'yeah, that' is not the same as documentation), then running it anyway.


It was more surprising, to me, to learn that they had made attempts to fact check this than if I had learned that they hadn't made any attempts.

We have both SI and ESPN (at least Gene W) making attempts to fact check, and either running into closed doors from Manti or getting past various doors but into empty rooms, and yet somehow running the base story anyway, with some modifications to account for the fact that they couldn't find any facts.
   2128. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:53 PM (#4349499)
Or even basic background information. After interviewing him, you tell the intern to do some interweb searches to see what others reported on her death or the accident, what was in the obituary, etc. Maybe others have talked to the family and you can quote them. You don't have to even doubt his story to do this stuff.

But where does even finding no obituary get you? Someone told Te'o she was dead, Te'o repeated it and would have no way of knowing otherwise ... where's the lie and the hoax? What "facts" are you even checking?

Again, postmodern to its core -- there really aren't any "facts" here to check or confirm. Accepting the premise that one can have a "girlfriend" through strictly online communication, in what sense did Teo's girlfriend not "exist"? Indeed, in what sense did Lennay Kukua not "exist"? She may have lied about her name, but there's no sense in which she didn't "exist."
   2129. The Chronicles of Reddick Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:53 PM (#4349500)
Ex-Cardinal fullback says he met Te'o's girlfriend


And the plot gets thicker.


I saw that movie "Catfish" and apparently there are people that set up all these false profiles to live these identities apart from their own. I just thought that happened on games like "World of Warcraft".
   2130. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:57 PM (#4349501)
SugarBear, are you serious with this stuff? I could see your point with the Notre Dame/character/athletes stuff, but this "where is the hoax? in what sense did she not exist?" is off the reservation.
   2131. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 17, 2013 at 07:58 PM (#4349503)
SugarBear, are you serious with this stuff?

I'm entirely serious. Read the questions again, closely.
   2132. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:01 PM (#4349505)
It was more surprising, to me, to learn that they had made attempts to fact check this than if I had learned that they hadn't made any attempts.


Agreed, but we are talking about sports writers, who are by and large useless. These are the reporters that write about narrative over fact, they aren't investigative reporters. Then again those things rarely exist anymore.
   2133. Howie Menckel Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:04 PM (#4349506)
"She may have lied about her name, but there's no sense in which she didn't "exist.""

It's plausible that maybe she never really went to Stanford, or the family didn't run a death notice in the local paper, and so on. Not a story-ender at that point.

But to not be able to turn up a single verifiable thing about this girl, her brother, etc. after reasonable professional journalistic effort is extremely implausible, even among young people these days. There are very few ciphers left.

All the big boys are probably reeling on this, but I'd guess SI most of all. One of the last bastions they had in the biz was ruthless factchecking.

   2134. The Yankee Clapper Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:04 PM (#4349507)
The article linked in #2129 doesn't specifically say that girl that the Cardinal football player met matched the photo of the Te'o "girlfriend" but that seems suggested. If so, that would seem to indicate the girl in the photo was an active participant rather than someone who had her photo misused. All this is very strange.
   2135. Rickey! trades in sheep and threats Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:07 PM (#4349509)
I only heard the term today, but Te'o's version of the events would seem to describe a "catfishing" scenario. And if you Google the term, you can quite easily find the story of a guy who was a victim, but was able to make a documentary out of the experience and is now developing a TV show.


At least a few people suggest that the entire set up for that documentary was staged.
   2136. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:09 PM (#4349510)
But to not be able to turn up a single verifiable thing about this girl, her brother, etc. after reasonable professional journalistic effort is extremely implausible, even among young people these days. There are very few ciphers left.


Yes. As far as I understand it, at most they had a Twitter account of hers. And absolutely nothing else. And this despite there being a number of highly verifiable things: birth, school, accident, family, death... existence. Okay, maybe you come up dry on one or two of those. But not all. Being shut out on *all* is highly implausible. At a minimum it absolutely requires followup with Te'o.
   2137. jobu Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:14 PM (#4349514)
Accepting the premise that one can have a "girlfriend" through strictly online communication, in what sense did Teo's girlfriend not "exist"? Indeed, in what sense did Lennay Kukua not "exist"? She may have lied about her name, but there's no sense in which she didn't "exist."

It perhaps will come out that the person in the Lennay picture was involved in the whole thing, but I think the prevailing view so far is that a dude (_____ Tuiasosopo) ingratiated himself with Te'o by getting Te'o to fall in love with a beautiful (picture of a) woman who had only an online personality. It's likely (IMHO) that all the letters, texts, etc. from Lennay were written by Tuiasosopo.

So unless Te'o is willing to adopt the "Nobody's Perfect" POV from "Some Like It Hot," or play a real-life "Crying Game," he ain't getting back together with Lennay. Because she's a man, man.
   2138. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:25 PM (#4349518)
It perhaps will come out that the person in the Lennay picture was involved in the whole thing, but I think the prevailing view so far is that a dude (_____ Tuiasosopo) ingratiated himself with Te'o by getting Te'o to fall in love with a beautiful (picture of a) woman who had only an online personality. It's likely (IMHO) that all the letters, texts, etc. from Lennay were written by Tuiasosopo.


No, this wouldn't work by itself. There has to have been more people involved than just Tuiasosopo. Because Te'o said that he spent countless nights and hours talking to this girl. So there has to be an actual female involved - i.e., more people than just Tuiasosopo, unless Tuiasosopo is REALLY good at talking in a high girly voice.

AND there has to be people pretending to be family members of her - again, unless this Tuiasosopo was playing those roles as well.
   2139. cmd600 Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:35 PM (#4349523)
No, this wouldn't work by itself. There has to have been more people involved than just Tuiasosopo. Because Te'o said that he spent countless nights and hours talking to this girl. So there has to be an actual female involved - i.e., more people than just Tuiasosopo, unless Tuiasosopo is REALLY good at talking in a high girly voice.

AND there has to be people pretending to be family members of her - again, unless this Tuiasosopo was playing those roles as well.


Or, has been said many times, Te'o fudged these parts of the stories a bit, maybe more than a bit, to avoid embarassment.
   2140. jobu Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:36 PM (#4349524)
Because Te'o said that he spent countless nights and hours talking to this girl. So there has to be an actual female involved - i.e., more people than just Tuiasosopo, unless Tuiasosopo is REALLY good at talking in a high girly voice.

Well, from that SI interview with Te'o, most of the time they spent talking on the phone was Te'o listening to "Lennay" breathe. Literally. Literally, listening to his comatose "girlfriend" breathe. I have a pretty deep voice myself, but I'll bet I could pull that off.

It is not at all clear to me that they had many voice-to-voice conversations. I believe this guy is a gulli-bull (if not a nin-cow-poop), it's plausible that Te'o believed that a falsetto Tuiasosopo was a girl. Or, Tuiasosopo had a female friend do the limited voice work.

If you read the SI interview with that lens, it mostly hangs together. For example, when he is asked when they met, he responds that "She saw me" at whatever game it was. Te'o's answers in that interview very much smack of someone in an online relationship infused with a lot of make-believe.

   2141. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:38 PM (#4349526)
Or, has been said many times, Te'o fudged these parts of the stories a bit, maybe more than a bit, to avoid embarassment.


It's one thing to not disclose that you never met her in person because you are embarrassed that it was purely an online/phone relationship.

Quite another to literally make up the "fact" that you spent every night on the phone for 4 months talking to her. That goes beyond being less than forthcoming because you were embarrassed to outright lying.
   2142. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:39 PM (#4349527)

Pos has a good bit on Tony Gonzalez up at Sports on Earth.


Gonzalez started playing in KC when we lived out there. We stayed 4 more years and moved back to Philly since -- almost 12 years ago. My oldest son was 10 at the time; he's turning 26 next month. That's just incredible.
   2143. jobu Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:42 PM (#4349528)
Quite another to literally make up the "fact" that you spent every night on the phone for 4 months talking to her.

That's the thing--talking "to" her. While she was unable to communicate, but her breath could quicken at the sound of his voice.
   2144. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 08:51 PM (#4349536)
Well, from that SI interview with Te'o, most of the time they spent talking on the phone was Te'o listening to "Lennay" breathe. Literally. Literally, listening to his comatose "girlfriend" breathe. I have a pretty deep voice myself, but I'll bet I could pull that off.

It is not at all clear to me that they had many voice-to-voice conversations.


So now we're supposed to believe that the countless hours he spent on the phone with her included very few actual words being exchanged?

What about this, from the SI article:

And I told them, my girlfriend always told me, "Send roses while they still can smell them, tell them they love you (sic) while they still can hear it."


Or this:

As she started to make progress. She had her good days. And then the next day she'd say, "Babe my back is sore. I can't feel it. Something is wrong. I don't know what's wrong. My chest is burning."

   2145. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 09:26 PM (#4349546)
So now we're supposed to believe that the countless hours he spent on the phone with her included very few actual words being exchanged?


No, we're supposed to believe either:

A) There were actually phone calls with someone pretending to be her on the other line and he didn't know it was a ruse

or

B) He made it all up because he was embarrassed that he had fallen in love with a person he only interacted with online

Those seem to be the most likely explanations, with option B being more likely.
   2146. Rickey! trades in sheep and threats Posted: January 17, 2013 at 09:41 PM (#4349553)
Gonzalez started playing in KC when we lived out there. We stayed 4 more years and moved back to Philly since -- almost 12 years ago. My oldest son was 10 at the time; he's turning 26 next month. That's just incredible.


I'd never really considered the real heft of Gonzalez' career until I read the Pos piece.
   2147. jobu Posted: January 17, 2013 at 09:46 PM (#4349556)
my girlfriend always told me

And then the next day she'd say, "Babe my back is sore. I can't feel it. Something is wrong. I don't know what's wrong. My chest is burning."


"Told me" [via text message, perhaps]. The next day she'd say [in an e-mail, perhaps] "Babe, my back is sore...." These are not inconsistent with a mainly online relationship.

The people on BBTF, for sure, can understand that you can get pretty emotionally charged up (e.g.: angry) about something written by someone you've never even met. I've mainly lurked for the ~8 years I've been a Primer/BBTF member, but even I have seen the suppositions and ad hominem attacks that are triggered by people's words. This is the same thing, but instead, there are POSITIVE feelings triggered by the words.
   2148. Rickey! trades in sheep and threats Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:03 PM (#4349563)
Keep in mind, this is a 19, 20 year old Mormon kid. It's not hard to imagine he's just emotionally naive.
   2149. Howie Menckel Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:27 PM (#4349569)

He turns 22 next week, which is younger than I would have guessed...

   2150. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:34 PM (#4349575)
Have I missed it, or have we not heard from BTF's #1 Notre Dame/Te'o fanboy during all this?

Unless "Lennay Kekua" is Hawaiian for "Meatwad" ...

Nah. Surely not.
   2151. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:47 PM (#4349580)
or

B) He made it all up because he was embarrassed that he had fallen in love with a person he only interacted with online


If we're being asked to excuse this blatant a lie -- that he spoke to her every night for four months, as well as countless others of these kinds of lies -- then I don't particularly care whether he was in on the hoax or not. It's pretty much as bad.

He lied at every turn, or engaged in half-truths and deceptions. A "girlfriend." He "spoke" to her every night for four months. He spoke to "her family." He "visited" her. He "met" her. He commented about her AFTER he supposedly found out it was a hoax. Even assuming every inference in his favor, the whole thing was one big pile of half-truths and deceptions, if not flat out lies. I am not particularly interested in excusing that type of nonsense because he was embarrassed about... an online relationship? That is supposed to justify this behavior? He played everyone for fools.
   2152. DA Baracus Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:57 PM (#4349584)
I think it's equally ridiculous. Just the most plausible ridiculous explanation.
   2153. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 10:59 PM (#4349587)
This is true. He's either a crass conniver or the world's biggest idiot. Neither looks particularly good on a resume. (Not that "I play defense like a dying nonexistent woman when the opponent is an actual football team" does, either, I suppose.)
   2154. Dave Spiwak Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:09 PM (#4349591)
Maybe this is all part of some Joaquin Phoenix-esque long-form performance art gag.
   2155. The Yankee Clapper Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:19 PM (#4349598)
Here's an article referencing Five Bizarre Tales of Alleged Internet Dating Impostors. Weird stuff.
   2156. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:43 PM (#4349610)
I am wondering if the "car crash" wasn't a premature attempt to end the hoax -- either because the perpetrators got nervous because Te'o was getting a much higher profile, and beginning to talk about his girlfriend to the press, because the woman who was playing Kekua got cold feet, or for some other reason. After all, according to the link above (can't find it now -- the reporter revisiting his interview notes), she was in a coma after the 'accident', and expected to die. Te'o actually got a call from her 'brother' saying that it was time to say his goodbyes. Perhaps they just wanted to cash out, if that was the scam: "Oh, sorry, your girlfriend died. Can you send $5000 to help with funeral expenses? Oh, and don't bother coming. She'd rather you played the football game."

If so, then the hoax was put back on immediately again -- she didn't 'die' from the accident. Maybe one of the hoaxers didn't want it to end and sent Te'o a message that she 'miraculously' pulled through, and the rest of the hoaxers had to go along or be found out. I don't know, it might not be any more bizarre than the other hypotheses.
   2157. steagles Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:49 PM (#4349611)
so, what's the best outcome for te'o here?

i mean, if he's gay, yeah, i agree with the post from yesterday that he should just double down and milk that #### as far as it'd get him.


otherwise, i think he'd be best off to stay away from the camera and just try to connect with a single NFL team that has a pick in the mid-late first round and just make sure that he won't fall beyond that pick.

nothing good can come from him talking again, so until you get cash in your pocket, don't.
   2158. zenbitz Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:50 PM (#4349612)
Just read the deadspin article. While he may have been duped at first, it seems at some point (my guess is before she "died"), it sure seems like he was in on it by the time her sisters account surfaces.
and the offical statements have the taint of "vaugely beliveable cover up".
Anyway, victimless non crime. Will keep him out of MLBs hall of fame, i guess.
   2159. NTNgod Posted: January 17, 2013 at 11:50 PM (#4349613)
I heard AJ McCarron tweeted that he ###### Miss Alabama on the second date, but some people are saying he didn't even get in her pants until the fifth.


If you want real family "dirt", McCarron's uncle did get busted a few months back as part of a pedo ring.

Look up the Brittney Wood case (McCarron's cousin by marriage) - the case has methheads galore, a missing girl, incest, a bunch of the family getting arrested, a suicide, family infighting. It's like every stereotype of rural Southerners come to life, but sadly does involve a still-missing, and presumably dead, young mother.
   2160. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 18, 2013 at 12:10 AM (#4349617)
So the funeral was supposedly the same day as the game that he played in? "She" wanted him to go to the funeral. Well, what about a wake the day before? Some other memorial service? He couldn't attend that?

Also, I don't think the idea that he knows this Ronaiah Tuiasosopo really supports the idea that this was some random catfishing. But who knows.

Steagles, I again state my belief that he will have to talk at some point soon - and that he will.
   2161. DA Baracus Posted: January 18, 2013 at 12:12 AM (#4349618)
"She" wanted him to go to the funeral.


No. "She" specifically told him to not go if it interfered with him playing a game. "It's what she wanted."
   2162. Ray (RDP) Posted: January 18, 2013 at 12:23 AM (#4349622)
Yeah, I meant "She" didn't want him to go.

So what happened after "She" "died"? Did her family stop calling him? Her brother? Did he hear no more from them?
   2163. steagles Posted: January 18, 2013 at 12:33 AM (#4349629)
Steagles, I again state my belief that he will have to talk at some point soon - and that he will.
starve the beast. the university will be behind him because they don't want the bad press. his teammates will be behind him, at least unless he's some gaping jackass that we also haven't known about. the perpetrators (or co-conspirators) will keep quiet because the more that comes out the worse they look.

all that leaves you with what? the girl who talked to deadspin? the more she talks the more likely it'll be that holes appear in her story, so that's actually good for te'o.


the worst thing that could happen if te'o keeps his mouth shut is that his teammates start coming out and air their grievances in the press.

but if he comes out and explains himself and isn't convincing, then the school walks away from him, his teammates pull out all the dirty laundry from his time at notre dame, and anyone who's even remotely involved gets interviewed by bryant gumble on HBO.


if you're te'o, just cut your losses. take the hit, fall out of the top 10 or the top 20, but get into the NFL, make some money, and go forward from there.
   2164. jobu Posted: January 18, 2013 at 12:37 AM (#4349630)
Also, I don't think the idea that he knows this Ronaiah Tuiasosopo really supports the idea that this was some random catfishing

I don't think it was random.

I think it's one of two things:
- Ronaiah Tuiasosopo is a jock-sniffer who crafted a way to get close to the ND team (witness all the supportive texts sent by "Lennay" to other team members)
- Ronaiah Tuiasosopo had an unrequited crush on Te'o, and, in a perverse way, found a way for Te'o to fall in love with him. It's Cyrano on top of all of the other mythic elements involved

I feel pretty confident in the above, but who knows. It could also be that Te'o is gay (NTTAWWT) and this was all a cover story. Or he really is a bad guy who hyped this so a true defensive player could actually win the Heisman. I really doubt that, though. I've known some really trusting, highly religious, sheltered folks that I'm sure would be susceptible to this kind of thing.

I would guess further that Tuiasosopo decided at some point he wanted to end it, and, knowing how head-over-heels Te'o was, the only way out was to put Lennay in a coma. The only problem is, Te'o is Tebow-esque in his religiousness, and he wasn't the kind of guy who was going to leave his comatose "girlfriend." It only added to his devotion--standing by her was the right thing to do. So Tuiasosopo actually had to kill her off to actually end it.

The "resurrection" I do find hard to explain/understand, unless Tuaisosopo longed for his connection to Te'o and the team, and he thought he might be able to resuscitate it.
   2165. zenbitz Posted: January 18, 2013 at 02:00 AM (#4349653)
Ronaiah Tuiasosopo is a jock-sniffer who crafted a way to get close to the ND team (witness all the supportive texts sent by "Lennay" to other team members)
- Ronaiah Tuiasosopo had an unrequited crush on Te'o, and, in a perverse way, found a way for Te'o to fall in love with him. It's Cyrano on top of all of the other mythic elements involved


It seems likely that it's one of these, at least initially. Or maybe 2b - weird hopeful flirting with plausible denability. "What? you're a dude" with hope of "Hey, maybe that could work" but 99% chance of "Na Na, fooled' ya into thinking I was a girl"

But also could just be a goof on Te'o (since they knew each other), then Te'o finds out and just rolls with it ...

Or he really is a bad guy who hyped this so a true defensive player could actually win the Heisman.


Why does it have to be so sinister? He's 21 and a football player for cripes sake. Maybe it was just a prank that got out of hand. I mean "making up stuff to reporters" isn't a crime is it?
   2166. Greg K Posted: January 18, 2013 at 04:03 AM (#4349670)
Yeah, but Te'o's a guy. I mean, honestly, what guy gets all misty over an Internet pen pal he's never so much as met, much less touched? Did they even Skype? I mean ... please.

What makes this story kind of interesting for me is that I have a history of online relationships. I grew up in Toronto and while I was in high school met a girl from Saskatchewan (about 1000 miles away) online. We talked for over a year or so and met twice in that period (she visited me for a week once, and I visited her for a week).

At that point I went to a univeristy in Saskatchewan pretty much exclusively because of the relationship. We subsequently broke up, though we still stay in touch. Things actually worked out really great for me in the long run. For loads of other reasons me going to school in Saskatchewan was far, far better for me than had I gone to school in Toronto (as I likely would have).

Anyway, this is all to say that I can identify a bit with some of the theories advanced about this guy. In that, at the time I definitely lied about certain aspects of the relationship to friends and family because it's kind of embarassing. Even to this day I feel kind of silly admitting it. But I've actually come across a surprising amount of people of my generation who have similar experiences.

All of which isn't to say I believe this guy at all...but the experience of meeting people online and associating with them almost exclusively online (I probably talked to this girl for almost a year before actually meeting here, and to be honest I had probably already decided to move out to her before meeting her in person) is more common than you might think.
   2167. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 09:04 AM (#4349694)
You visited each other for a week, twice. Therein lies the material difference.

   2168. JJ1986 Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:08 AM (#4349720)
"Catfishing" seems to me like it would have to be a very time specific thing. Maybe 2000-2005 or sometime before voice chat became something that everyone has access to. I don't see how it goes on anymore. "I don't have a webcam"? They cost a few bucks.
   2169. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:14 AM (#4349722)
Whatever the truth is of this story I'm thankful for it as it's hilarious and it makes Notre Dame look stupid. Can't ask for much more than that. It's interesting that this has turned into a bigger scandal for the school than the death of Declan Sullivan though, really, I guess it's understandable. This scandal is sexier and touches on a larger conversation about our culture.
   2170. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:23 AM (#4349728)
It's interesting that this has turned into a bigger scandal for the school than the death of Declan Sullivan though, really, I guess it's understandable. This scandal is sexier and touches on a larger conversation about our culture.

And Lizzy Seeberg, the 19-year-old St. Mary's student who committed suicide after her (entirely plausible) allegation of sexual assault against an ND football player went uninvestigated by the authorities.

To the Notre Dame higher-ups, Manti Te'o is a victim worthy of tears and sympathy, and school-funded investigators, but Lizzy Seeberg and Declan Sullivan -- you know, actual students -- are fodder to be marginalized by The Machine.

Stay classy, ND.
   2171. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:28 AM (#4349733)
To the Notre Dame higher-ups, Manti Te'o is a victim worthy of tears and sympathy, and school-funded investigators, but Lizzy Seeberg and Declan Sullivan -- you know, actual students -- are fodder to be marginalized by The Machine.

I'm curious, what should Notre Dame have done to not marginalize them?
   2172. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:28 AM (#4349734)
Maybe 2000-2005 or sometime before voice chat became something that everyone has access to. I don't see how it goes on anymore. "I don't have a webcam"? They cost a few bucks.

That's where the story falls apart. The idea that you wouldn't move your online relationship with your "girlfriend" to at least video chats is preposterous on its face.
   2173. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:33 AM (#4349742)
I'm curious, what should Notre Dame have done to not marginalize them?

Well, for starters, investigate her claims and kick the perps off the team. In addition to being sexually assaulted (probably), she was sent menacing texts in an effort to shut her up.

And then don't hide the records of what happened from her family, as ND did.

The disparate treatment afforded Manti Te'o and Lizzy Seeberg is an abject disgrace, on a number of levels.
   2174. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:33 AM (#4349743)
So what happened after "She" "died"? Did her family stop calling him? Her brother? Did he hear no more from them?


Te'o was exchanging tweets with an account that was supposedly Lennay's sister for at least a while. The Deadspin article talks about it.
   2175. Greg K Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:37 AM (#4349749)
That's where the story falls apart. The idea that you wouldn't move your online relationship with your "girlfriend" to at least video chats is preposterous on its face.

I would never, ever...ever, EVER use a video chat, or skype or the like. For any reason whatsoever...ok, maybe if it was job-related. And I'm probably in a position where it would make sense for me to use (being on a different continent from family and many friends).

Though I think it's fair enough to say the vast majority of girlfriends who are actual people wouldn't let me get away with that.

EDIT: again, not saying I believe anything about this guy's story.
   2176. DA Baracus Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:41 AM (#4349753)
Some administrators were pressing for a unilateral public disclosure by the school, while others wanted to let Te'o himself make the stunning news public, the source said. Notre Dame officials were in contact with Te'o's agent, Tom Condon of Creative Artists Agency, and were told the Heisman Trophy runner-up planned to release his version of events Monday. The decision was made to wait and let Te'o and CAA control the message.


Bullshit.
   2177. NJ in DC (Now with temporary employment!) Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:46 AM (#4349755)
Some of the posts on this thread make me think people haven't seen Catfish. You would be shocked at the amount of people carrying on online relationships for years, in 2012/13, who have never spoken to or seen (in live format) their "S/o"

EDIT: Funny enough, this week's episode was about a good looking, QB of the football team type who fell in love with some girl he'd never met who claimed to live in the same state and she managed to get away with not seeing him for perhaps over a year or so (IIRC). When Nev (showrunner) got them to meet, turned out she was a he.
   2178. JJ1986 Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:48 AM (#4349761)
I've seen Catfish the movie, but I was certain that the whole thing was fake.

edit: even if the perpetrator was real, the "victim" almost certainly suspected it and let it continue to shoot the film.
   2179. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:50 AM (#4349763)
If there's a TV show about catfishing, one naturally wonders whether the catfishing is created for the TV show.

EDIT: Or what JJ said.
   2180. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:50 AM (#4349764)
That's where the story falls apart. The idea that you wouldn't move your online relationship with your "girlfriend" to at least video chats is preposterous on its face.


I think you're selling people's ability to believe just about anything and behave extremely awkwardly short. Especially when it comes to relationships.
   2181. Greg K Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:51 AM (#4349765)
Some of the posts on this thread make me think people haven't seen Catfish. You would be shocked at the amount of people carrying on online relationships for years, in 2012/13, who have never spoken to or seen (in live format) their "S/o"

I'd actually recommend it to a few based on this thread. It could be quite surprising I'm thinking.

Obviously there's a lot fishy, and just plain unbelievable elements about Te'o's case. It seems pretty obvious he's lying about a great deal. But some of the elements aren't that far out of leftfield for the run of the mill online relationship these days.

EDIT: It wouldn't surprise me if "Catfish" was a hoax. But at a certain level it doesn't really matter.
   2182. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:53 AM (#4349770)
Well, for starters, investigate her claims and kick the perps off the team. In addition to being sexually assaulted (probably), she was sent menacing texts in an effort to shut her up.

The investigation was turned over to the county prosecutor (as it should have been from the beginning). The 10 day delay in the investigation definitely looks bad.

With respect to kicking the accused out of the university, there is a complicating event in ND's past.

This is all from memory but back in the late 90's or ealy 00's a woman accused three ND players of raping her. ND immediately kicked them out and later the woman recanted her story a la Duke Lacrosse. In that situation the university had acted quickly but ended up just making a bad situation worse. When the prosecutor elected to not press charges because of the death of the victim and conflicting witness statements I can't be that critical of letting the player be.

Now, as to his non-football playing neanderthal friend who sent her those texts, I hope he was booted but we will never know because of federal laws.
   2183. ASmitty Posted: January 18, 2013 at 10:58 AM (#4349775)
Catfishing is real, but the movie Catfish is very transparently staged.

Te'o is clearly a raging liar, but as has been pointed out, his motivation for being a raging liar remains unclear.

As for me, I cannot believe how incredibly gullible and naive people are about online relationships. Until you see them on Skype or in person, THEY ARE A MAN.
   2184. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:01 AM (#4349778)
The investigation was turned over to the county prosecutor (as it should have been from the beginning). The 10 day delay in the investigation definitely looks bad.

So Notre Dame itself feels compelled to do a thorough investigation of whether a football player's online "girlfriend" was real, but not to investigate in any way, shape, or form whether two of its football players sexually assaulted a woman and sent her threatening texts?

You can see how disproportionate and senseless that is, right?
   2185. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:02 AM (#4349780)
As for me, I cannot believe how incredibly gullible and naive people are about online relationships. Until you see them on Skype or in person, THEY ARE A MAN.

Seriously. Didn't people learn anything from Bart Simpson catfishing Mrs. Crabapple? What I don't get is what's the appeal for the deceiver in these situations? It seems like a lot of trouble just to #### with someone like that. That's just way too much work for me. I prefer lazy practical jokes and mindfucks.
   2186. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:05 AM (#4349786)
So Notre Dame itself feels compelled to do a thorough investigation of whether a football player's online "girlfriend" was real, but not to investigate in any way, shape, or form whether two of its football players sexually assaulted a woman and sent her threatening texts?

What are you talking about? How was it "not investigated in any way shape or form"?
   2187. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:09 AM (#4349791)
Seriously. Didn't people learn anything from Bart Simpson catfishing Mrs. Crabapple? What I don't get is what's the appeal for the deceiver in these situations? It seems like a lot of trouble just to #### with someone like that. That's just way too much work for me. I prefer lazy practical jokes and mindfucks.

My wife showed me a TMZ article where Tuiasosopo auditioned for The Voice and told them some outlandish sob story about a car accident where a friend was rendered comatose. Apparently he just likes to do this stuff for fun and/or attention.
   2188. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:10 AM (#4349793)
How was it "not investigated in any way shape or form"?

They turned it over to prosecutors, as you said. Notre Dame, the institution, did not investigate the sexual assault charge or the threatening texts. They did, however, investigate the entirely trivial, bordering on juvenile, issue of whether a football player's online "girlfriend" was real.

Moreover, the Athletic Director referred to the football player as a "victim" and shed tears for him. Did he ever do the same for Declan Sullivan or Lizzy Seeberg -- actual victims of the football program?
   2189. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:12 AM (#4349796)
My wife showed me a TMZ article where Tuiasosopo auditioned for The Voice and told them some outlandish sob story about a car accident where a friend was rendered comatose. Apparently he just likes to do this stuff for fun and/or attention.

He is besmirching the legendary name of Tuiasosopo! Crissakes, that family is practically football royalty.
   2190. bunyon Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:19 AM (#4349803)

They turned it over to prosecutors, as you said. Notre Dame, the institution, did not investigate the sexual assault charge or the threatening texts. They did, however, investigate the entirely trivial, bordering on juvenile, issue of whether a football player's online "girlfriend" was real.


Bear, I basically agree with you about big time college athletics and Te'o. But, surely, you can see that criminal acts (like rape) must be investigated by law enforcement. The Te'o case doesn't appear to involve any crime - certainly no one is claiming to be the victim of a criminal act. Thus, it's a PR problem. One that centrally involves Notre Dame. Of course, they're going to investigate that.

Athletes, especially in D-1 football and men's basketball are a hybrid between employee and student. Their jerseys are sold, they make appearances representing the school. When one of them is in trouble with a non-criminal act, the university almost always involves itself in the situation. Now, whether these sports should be such big-time, professional programs (I don't think they should, either) doesn't matter in our universe: they are. There is a ton of money in involved and, so, no school is going to let a student go out and take care of this themselves.

If a student is accused of a crime, they would probably like to investigate on their own (and some, no doubt, do) but they risk more serious trouble and, so, those get referred to the authorities.
   2191. Pops Freshenmeyer Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:20 AM (#4349804)
They turned it over to prosecutors, as you said. Notre Dame, the institution, did not investigate the sexual assault charge or the threatening texts. They did, however, investigate the entirely trivial, bordering on juvenile, issue of whether a football player's online "girlfriend" was real.

You keep stating things as if they are facts. I don't have a clue what your basis is. If it makes you feel better, the last article I looked up (which now I can't find) said the investigation was conducted jointly by the county and campus police.

EDIT: and the investigation included the sender of the text messages.

   2192. ASmitty Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:21 AM (#4349807)
What I don't get is what's the appeal for the deceiver in these situations? It seems like a lot of trouble just to #### with someone like that. That's just way too much work for me. I prefer lazy practical jokes and mindfucks.


Attention whoring, escapism, general craziness.

Here's a personal example:

A while back a woman contacted me on Twitter. She was objectively gorgeous and apparently into all of the same weird a off beat things I was into. Naturally, I assumed she was a man/middle aged woman/homely nerdy girl hiding behind a gorgeous picture or two. Nevertheless, I frequently exchanged non-flirtatious messages with "her" because we DID have common interests and I enjoyed the conversation.

After a few weeks, she surprised me by asking if I had Skype, which I do. She asked if she could Skype me, and I agreed. Turns out...she really was drop-dead gorgeous. The pictures were not fake.

For quite a while after that initial Skype session we communicated daily by text, by phone calls, or by Skype. I kept my guard up, though, because she was on the other side of the country and I still didn't truly know her.

Needless to say, after a few months I found out she was married and had children. I was a fun, attentive, far-away man to provide spice to her otherwise dull and listless life. It was pure escapism for her.

Never have I been more appreciative of my skepticism.
   2193. DA Baracus Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:21 AM (#4349808)
He is besmirching the legendary name of Tuiasosopo!


It's unfair. He's dragging down Marques. Everyone knows Marques was the QB of the best season of Rick Neuheisel's career, and was a part of Bill Callahan's. He's played with Jerramy Stevens, Rob Johnson and Bill Romanowski, among others. Think about all the people now tainted by this.
   2194. bunyon Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:23 AM (#4349809)
My wife showed me a TMZ article where Tuiasosopo auditioned for The Voice and told them some outlandish sob story about a car accident where a friend was rendered comatose. Apparently he just likes to do this stuff for fun and/or attention.

He is besmirching the legendary name of Tuiasosopo! Crissakes, that family is practically football royalty.


I haven't read to closely - basically this thread is my source of info - but it sort of sounds like this guy has been doing this awhile and the Te'o case is simply one where he landed his first big hit. The mark both fell for the girl and didn't catch on. You need both: if the mark doesn't fall in love, it doesn't matter if he buys the act or not. And, obviously, if the guy doesn't buy the act, then the game is up anyway. Te'o may have both bought it and fallen for her and then become embarrassed by the online nature of the relationship. If he does figure out later that he's been duped, raise the embarrassment an order of magnitude.

Basically, Tuiasosopo sounds like a serial catfisher and Te'o sounds both gullible, not terribly bright and not strong enough to come clean as soon as it is apparent something is out of order. If this is a catfish, it's the 80 pound, 40 year old mythic beast that everyone has hooked but no one reeled in.
   2195. DA Baracus Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:24 AM (#4349810)
I hope ASmitty is (understandably) holding back on that story.
   2196. bunyon Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:26 AM (#4349812)
the investigation was conducted jointly by the county and campus police.

Those are almost always directed by the "real" cops. The campus cops are there to act as a go between.
   2197. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:27 AM (#4349819)
It's unfair. He's dragging down Marques. Everyone knows Marques was the QB of the best season of Rick Neuheisel's career, and was a part of Bill Callahan's. He's played with Jerramy Stevens, Rob Johnson and Bill Romanowski, among others. Think about all the people now tainted by this.

How dare you not mention Manu. You are dead to me!
   2198. The Id of SugarBear Blanks Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:28 AM (#4349821)
But, surely, you can see that criminal acts (like rape) must be investigated by law enforcement.

Of course -- as a law enforcement matter. There's nothing saying the athletic department or university can't take a parallel look to see if the players should still be on the team. That kind of thing happens all the time. Some schools have Student Disciplinary Councils and the like that look at such things.

When one of them is in trouble with a non-criminal act, the university almost always involves itself in the situation.

Only if it impacts on NCAA compliance issues. The university does not, and cannot, get involved with personal issues involving the athlete solely as civilian. What do you think all the hullaballoo about trying to get scholarships to involve pizza and walking around money are all about? If schools could pay an athlete's lawyers if the athlete got a, say, DWI, why would there be all the talk about getting pizza and walking around money to athletes?



   2199. DA Baracus Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:28 AM (#4349822)
How dare you not mention Manu. You are dead to me!


I was trying to keep him out of it!
   2200. ASmitty Posted: January 18, 2013 at 11:28 AM (#4349823)
So, did you nail her?


Bahahahaha! Nope, never met her. And actively tried to steer conversations to non-intimate topics, because I know what the internet is, and what it is not.

Back in the day, lonely housewives read romance novels. Now, they try to write their own online.
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