Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Tuesday, July 31, 2018

OT: Soccer Thread (2018-19 season begins!)

Let’s get it on!

August 3 - English Championship (Reading v Derby)
August 4 - Scottish Premier League, League One (ENG), League Two (ENG)
August 10 - English Premier League (Manchester United v Leicester City), Eredivisie, Primeira Liga
August 11 - Ligue 1
August 17 - La Liga
August 18 - Serie A
August 24 - Bundesliga (Bayern v Hoffenheim)
August 28 - UEFA Champions League Playoff Round
September 6 - UEFA Nations League

TV Rights:
UEFA Nations League - ESPN
UEFA Champions League - Turner Sports
EPL - NBC
EFL - ESPN+
La Liga - BeIN
Bundesliga - Fox
Ligue 1 - BeIN

Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: July 31, 2018 at 01:10 PM | 1297 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: off topic, soccer

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 13 of 13 pages ‹ First  < 11 12 13
   1201. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 14, 2018 at 08:42 PM (#5787610)
Mourihno Flopp
   1202. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 14, 2018 at 11:27 PM (#5787677)
Ranieri in at Fulham. What do you all think? They have been surprisingly terrible so far, I hope they can turn it around


Baffles the hell out of me, I had them about where Wolves are in the table.

Too many changes and additions?

Seems like Jokanovic couldn't figure out how to play them (though lord knows "The Tinkerer" might not be the best choice in this circumstance).

But I absolutely love Craven Cottage, so I hope Ranieri turns it around ...
   1203. J. Sosa Posted: November 15, 2018 at 09:24 AM (#5787729)
I consistently undervalue continuity. Continuity may be especially important in a world cup year. Fulham brought in a bunch of good players but some don’t fit. Wolves in contrast brought in a couple of key pieces and both of them are Portuguese. Like the manager and a few other players that were already in place.

The other difference is system. Wolves play a sound disciplined system. Fulham setup in a naive fashion. It reminds me of Blackpool. A move should have been made sooner. With a better system I think the talent is there. They are more talented than say, Soton. And Soton still have Hughes. Also should be able to beat out Huddersfield and Cardiff. Not quite panic time but a move should have been made sooner.
   1204. jmurph Posted: November 15, 2018 at 11:23 AM (#5787810)
VAR is officially coming to the Premier League in 2019-20, apparently.
   1205. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 15, 2018 at 01:55 PM (#5787965)
Well, this is amusing (if true) on several levels and angles:

Fulham’s appointment of Claudio Ranieri as their new manager caught everyone by surprise, but it seems the Italian wasn’t Shahid Khan’s first choice to replace Slavisa Jokanovic. The Telegraph claims Arsène Wenger was approached to take over at Craven Cottage, but turned down the job because he’s holding out for the soon-to-be-vacant gig at Bayern Munich. Former Monaco boss Leonardo Jardim and former Chelsea and Tottenham boss André Villas-Boas are also reported to have “politely declined the opportunity to speak to Fulham” before the club hierarchy gave the job to Ranieri on an unspecified “multi-year” contract.


The Graun
   1206. JuanGone..except1game Posted: November 15, 2018 at 02:03 PM (#5787970)
I consistently undervalue continuity.


Meh, continuity is overrated.
/Chelsea fan
   1207. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 15, 2018 at 03:04 PM (#5788012)
4-2-3-1 for the US. This is as a general rule my preferred look. The lineup looks pretty representative too.
   1208. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 15, 2018 at 04:06 PM (#5788063)
Aaaaaargh.

No, the US don't have to "believe in themselves more".

They need to ####### pass as if they've been playing this game for most of their lives ... and ####### finish the scraps they're left with because they can't seem to do the first thing.
   1209. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 15, 2018 at 04:30 PM (#5788077)
Generally speaking, Ian Darke doesn't bother me, but he sure is during this match.
   1210. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 15, 2018 at 04:57 PM (#5788094)
That’s as depressing performance as I can remember from the US in awhile. We were garbage from the getgo. The defense was helpless, the midfield was overrun, it was dreadful. I suppose you can hope that Pulisic putting that first half chance away makes a difference but it’s likely it doesn’t and even if it does you can’t pin your game on a plan of “play like ass go 90 minutes but hope to convert your only decent chance.

I’m not sure it’s the cause of the problems but this interim coach bullshit needs to stop. Hire Sarachan if you want but we are 13 months from Trinidad and Tobago and have just been spinning our wheels.
   1211. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 15, 2018 at 05:02 PM (#5788098)
I only saw a few minutes of the US game.

In less sad news, Spain/Croatia was a cracking game, though I only saw about 30 minutes of that one too. England will be playing Croatia for all or nothing (unless, from England's perspective, they draw 0-0) in a few days at Wembley. Should be fun.

Finland lost 1-0 to Greece, but that was enough for them to clinch a fairly hard group. They will be promoted.
Luxembourg fell to earth with a critical home loss to Belarus. They almost certainly will not be promoted now.
Bosnia got the road draw at Austria to ensure promotion.

   1212. jmurph Posted: November 15, 2018 at 05:04 PM (#5788099)
That’s as depressing performance as I can remember from the US in awhile.

Strongly agree. That's the kind of performance that makes me think we're just years and years away from being relevant.
   1213. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 15, 2018 at 07:22 PM (#5788165)
That’s as depressing performance as I can remember from the US in awhile.


Strongly agree. That's the kind of performance that makes me think we're just years and years away from being relevant.


3rded ... oof, that was abject.

It's clear that there are good players in the system and pipeline, but today they looked a bunch of people off the street who met each other in the morning.
   1214. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 16, 2018 at 03:52 PM (#5788573)
France needs to score if they want to guarantee a win of their group. On top of that, if each team scores one more goal France will almost certainly win the group. Maybe that means they will actually attack this half.

A beautiful break by Denmark late in the first half, and they are in excellent shape to win their group over Wales. It's not over yet though.

edit: And Gibraltar led briefly in the first half, but are now down 2-1 at home to Armenia.

edit2: that's not right. 2-1 Netherlands puts it back in NE's hands. France needs a 3-2 scoreline (NE win) or higher scoring 1-goal loss, along with NE not beating Germany, or any loss so long as NE loses to Germany.

France doesn't seem interested in attacking that much though, so 3-2 seems very unlikely.
   1215. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 16, 2018 at 04:48 PM (#5788602)
The Netherlands thoroughly outplayed France, and won 2-0. Only Lloris, who had a very good game, seemed to come to pay for the French. Their attack was mostly non-existent. Netherlands can win the group with a draw against relegated Germany. Germany will be playing for a #1 seed in Euro qualifying though (if I remember the rules right), so can't mail it in against the NEtherlands.

Denmark beat Wales in an exciting game, and will be promoted to League A. To be fair, they were probably the best of the League B teams.

Norway and Bulgaria left it late against weaker competition in their group, but both got late draws. It's neck and neck for group win and promotion and may come down to GD. In the last game, Norway has Slovenia on the road while Bulgaria has Cyprus on the road. Norway has 1 extra GD, but if they lose that and end up even on GD, Bulgaria will very likely win the tie breaker on total goals or road goals.

Macedonia now only needs a home draw against Gibraltar to be promoted.
   1216. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 16, 2018 at 05:35 PM (#5788620)
Finishing last in your group in League B (as both Ireland and Northern Ireland have already done) is a bit of a double whammy. You get relegated to League C and also get placed in pot 3 for the European championship draw, meaning that likely there will be 1 excellent (pot 1) and 1 very good (mostly pot 2) team in your same group. If UEFA uses the same seeding process for WC qualifying, you'd be faced with an extra whammy, as also would be unable to get a pot 1 or pot 2 seed in that tournament (because you are starting from League C). Sweden is in danger of facing this as well. And Germany would have the same problem (as pot 2 rather than 3, so maybe less of a big deal) if they can't manage to finish ahead of Poland (or potentially Croatia or even England).

edit: Even England could still finish as a pot 2 team, with a loss, a win by both Poland and Germany, and a fairly large GD reversal. e.g., England loses 0-1, Poland wins 2-1, Germany wins 4-1.

edit2: Sweden really has it all to play for in their group, as 2 wins and they get promoted, but a draw to Turkey and they get relegated.


   1217. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 17, 2018 at 01:58 PM (#5788808)
Tale of two halves in Turkey--Turkey dominated Sweden in the first half with Sweden doing absolutely nothing, but couldn't score. Sweden dominated the second half and got the goal they needed on a penalty. Now Sweden will play Russia for promotion next week.

Serbia got the home win it needed, and now is almost certain to be promoted to League B, and earn the euro qualifying playoff spot (more important for League C and D teams).
   1218. Sean Forman Posted: November 17, 2018 at 05:33 PM (#5788875)
Talk of a 70m move for Pulisic by Chelsea in the Mail.

Worth watching if you want to get excited about Pulisic again

https://twitter.com/usmntonly/status/1063825319436660736
   1219. spivey Posted: November 17, 2018 at 09:08 PM (#5788913)
edit: Meant for NBA thread.
   1220. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 17, 2018 at 10:05 PM (#5788927)
Quick ... name your top 5 least favorite next destinations for Pulisic!

Me:

United
Real
Bayern
Chelsea
PSG

   1221. Mefisto Posted: November 18, 2018 at 09:48 AM (#5788956)
I'd agree with those (and add some others), but these things are SO dependent on the coach. If Real hired Poch, I'd probably be fine with Pulisic going there even if I can't stand Real. If Pulisic were to go to United, he'd fill their biggest need. But I don't want him anywhere near United as long as Mourinho is the coach, even though I root for United. Change the coach and I might be fine with it.
   1222. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 09:54 AM (#5788957)
England dominated the first half, but couldn't score. If it ends 0-0 England finishes second in the group. Any other draw and Croatia finishes second. Of course, both teams want the win to finish first.

Yesterday Italy was very lively in the parts of the game I saw against Portugal, but couldn't get the goal they needed. With Portugal already winning the group and Poland already relegated, Poland may face little competition in getting the win that would likely have them retain a pot 1 spot in UEFA.

Scotland only needed a draw, but blew out 10-man Albania on the road. The Scotland/Israel game decides the group, with Scotland needing a win.
   1223. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 18, 2018 at 10:44 AM (#5788969)
This game has turned around in a big way. That Croatia lead felt undeserved.
   1224. spivey Posted: November 18, 2018 at 10:45 AM (#5788970)
The Nations League is way better than friendlies. I’m happy they made the switch.
   1225. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 10:56 AM (#5788973)
England take the group with an inspired comeback at the end. They were definitely the better team over the 90. Looked sluggish for about 25 minutes of the second half and went down a goal, but after taking off Rashford (who looked good throughout the game but took a knock and became ineffective) and Delph (who was superfluous with England down a goal), they looked very good and scored off of two set pieces.

Croatia was relegated, and if both Poland and Germany win their final games, will end up in pot 2 for Europe because of their terrible GD. Overall Croatia acquitted themselves well in the group, but over the 180 against England were clearly second best, and over 180 against Spain also the same (basically 50/50 in Croatia' 3-2 victory, but they didn't show up for the 6-0 drubbing).
   1226. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 18, 2018 at 01:16 PM (#5788997)
It’s a shame that Delph had to come off because I thought he was exceptional in the first half. As you say he was superfluous once they went down a goal but in the first half he was just running the show.

I don’t know how it is doing ratings and fan interest wise but from my perspective the Nations League is a huge success. As Spivey says it’s a big step up from friendlies and beyond that it’s better than even a qualifying tournament because for the first time we have teams at all levels competing against one another. I have one minor complaint and one minor concern;

Minor complaint - I wish the semi-final/final rounds were taking place sooner than next June. It feels like they are going to sacrifice some of the momentum that they’ve built up here. I suspect when June rolls around and I have a few important games to watch I’ll feel differently.

Minor concern - The promotion/relegation, while a good idea, may create some unbalanced groups next time around. For example, we could have a League B group of Germany-Czech Republic-Israel which will lack some drama. Looking around the groups though it looks like League A and League B are the places where that will be an issue (the promoted teams have a tall order in League A). I think League C and League D should be competitive and may have the effect of elevating the lower teams a bit.
   1227. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 03:05 PM (#5789009)
The minor concern is a fair point--in a way it's too easy to be relegated/promoted.

Another way to arrange the groups could be something like 2 groups of 5 at the top level, and 3 groups of 5 at each of the other levels. You could then relegate the bottom team in each group, with a tie breaker used to relegate a third team from the top level. Each team would play the others once rather than twice, with two games home and two away. In a setup like that Iceland and probably Poland get relegated, but Germany probably doesn't.


This year some of the League D groups were a bit unbalanced. In particular, Georgia and Belarus were significantly better than their competition, at least by ELO, and I guess there was a tiny bit of drama for Belarus, but both teams in the end won their groups fairly easily, as expected. It could happen again next year if Slovenia ends up being even halfway decent, as they have been in the recent past. The same could probably be said about Montenegro as well, should they be relegated to League D. Of course, it depends on the group seedings/draws.

The cometitive problem with league D is that there are just a lot of true minnows that have no realistic chance over several games against a team like Georgia. That said, I'm not sure I would change it, because Georgia or its equivalent is about the lowest quality team I'd want to see in the European finals.
   1228. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 18, 2018 at 03:22 PM (#5789012)
Yeah, I’m not really advocating a change. As I said, both things are minor, but they are imperfections worth noting. I think the real success of the Nation’s League will be League D becoming more competitive over the years. If teams like San Marino and Malta can become competitive that’s good all the way around,
   1229. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 03:39 PM (#5789013)
Crazy game in Switzerland. Belgium was gifted an early goal via true defensive clownshoes, and quickly got another. That meant Switzerland had the impossible task of needing 4 to take the top spot in the group. All they've done since then is completely outplay Belgium, scoring 3 in the process, two of which were top notch. At the half they are up 3-2 and within sight of a huge result.
   1230. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 03:49 PM (#5789016)
I'm not sure much can be done for San Marino. Their population is only 33,000 or so.

As an interesting note, one of the lowest ratings of any FIFA team belongs to Niue, population 1600. That's just a little bit more than the Vatican (and who wouldn't want to see the Vatican field a team in the european qualifiers...)

edit: Niue is not a FIFA member, but is an OFC member, so can compete in the OFC cup. According to Wiki, it has only played two games, both in 1983, losing 0–19 to Papua New Guinea and 0–14 to Tahiti.
   1231. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 18, 2018 at 04:31 PM (#5789032)
And Switzerland just got their 5th... another pretty goal. That should do it. Belgium, Spain, and possibly France won't make the last 4.
   1232. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 19, 2018 at 04:00 PM (#5789297)
Netherlands might have a brighter future (compared to their own recent past), but they don't look ready for the big time just yet. Germany is up 2-0 and it could be more--it's not an even game right now. De Ligt hasn't looked great and has been a step slow and out of position at times, and de Jong has been quiet.
   1233. spivey Posted: November 19, 2018 at 04:08 PM (#5789302)
Didn't Netherlands beat France pretty comprehensively last week? Don't get me wrong they seem on talent to be a clear tier below, but Europe in general seems to have more parity than I am used to. And Belgium giving up 5 unanswered goals to Switzerland?
   1234. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 19, 2018 at 04:31 PM (#5789315)
Yes, on Netherlands. My post was just a reaction to the hype. (Switzerland is generally not, and wasn't of late, the beneficiary of hype, so no need for a reaction there.) But now Netherlands has finally scored... one more and they would win the group.

The teams from greater Scandinavia (inclusive of Finland and Iceland) have been on the move this tournament. Denmark is up to League A. Finland and now Norway are up to League B. Iceland is down to League B. Sweden could make it a clean sweep if they beat Russia tomorrow.

To round things out, Slovakia is about to be relegated to League C (where they don't really belong, and should be fairly dominant). Cyprus is close to being relegated to League D (where they probably belong), Macedonia will be promoted to League C (where they probably belong). Slovenia was already relegated to League D (where they surely don't belong).

edit: and Germany missed yet another golden chance. A fair score to this game would probably be 2.5-0.5
edit2: and there's the second! That sums up Germany's year. They dominated this game and needed a win, led all the way and then blew it.

   1235. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 19, 2018 at 04:44 PM (#5789319)
Germany is now in danger of losing their Pot 1 slot... it would just take a draw by Poland. Croatia is safe in Pot 1.

Of course, the big news is that none of France, Belgium, Spain, or Germany made the semis for the tournament. Those were probably the top 4 rated teams coming in. England might actually be the favorite to win it now.
   1236. PepTech, the Legendary Posted: November 19, 2018 at 05:43 PM (#5789343)
They dominated this game and needed a win, led all the way and then blew it.
That 90th minute goal was not exactly cheap. Nice to see the Dutch winning again.
   1237. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 19, 2018 at 06:21 PM (#5789356)
That 90th minute goal was not exactly cheap. Nice to see the Dutch winning again.
Yeah it was a fine goal. It's just a case of Germany having many chances for almost the entire game, and putting away only two of them, and the Netherlands having just two or three right at the end, and also putting away two of them.

Sadly I haven't found an xG source for these games.

England is currently very slight favorites over Portugal to win the Nations League, then NE then SW: 31%, 30%, 22%, 18% (roughly, and rounding).
   1238. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 20, 2018 at 11:48 PM (#5789907)
Fairly eventful day in the Nations League. Poland got the goal it needed to remain in Pot 1 in Europe. Germany now in pot 2. Sweden got the win to be promoted to the big leagues at the expense of Russia. Scotland held on to beat Israel by a single goal, so it is promoted as well. Israel losing by only 1 goal allowed them to grab a pot 3 spot in Europe. One fewer goal and they would have been in pot 4. Montenegro lost, but avoided relegation to League D by a single GD. Kosovo dominated their only real group rival and got promoted.

With 20 teams qualifying for the euro finals before the playoffs, it seems very likely that all League A teams will either qualify directly or reach the playoff (that's good news for Iceland), and the same is likely true of League B (which is very good news for teams like Northern Ireland). Group C and D teams will mostly have had to win their groups to make the playoff. This year that means at least one of Scotland/Finland/Norway/Serbia (though Serbia is certainly good enough to qualify directly, assuming they don't get stuck in a hard group, which would open the door for Romania) and one of Georgia/Belarus/Kosovo/Macedonia will make the finals.
   1239. Mefisto Posted: November 22, 2018 at 08:39 AM (#5790320)
I'm having serious doubts that US Soccer will ever get its act together. We have no men's coach yet. Jill Ellis is still in place. And it's gotten so bad that on the women's side, where we should dominate, our U17s were eliminated at the group stage.
   1240. Esmailyn Gonzalez Sr. Posted: November 22, 2018 at 10:14 AM (#5790325)
our U17s were eliminated at the group stage.

and Brazil too...but not Canada!
Past Champions of the tournament...Japan, France, North Korea (x2), South Korea
   1241. Baldrick Posted: November 22, 2018 at 12:04 PM (#5790332)
I'm having serious doubts that US Soccer will ever get its act together. We have no men's coach yet. Jill Ellis is still in place. And it's gotten so bad that on the women's side, where we should dominate, our U17s were eliminated at the group stage.

It's not that I disagree with the underlying sentiment, but the US women are favorites (maybe heavy favorites) to win consecutive World Cups next summer. And if the US had a B team, it would probably be an odds-on favorite to make the semifinal. With all the (many) issues at the youth level, we're still turning out better players than anyone else in the world.

I'm not saying US Soccer deserves much or any credit for that fact, but it's a little too soon for total doom and gloom.
   1242. Mefisto Posted: November 22, 2018 at 12:14 PM (#5790335)
Fair enough, but if the USWNT goes out early, can I give in to doom and gloom then?
   1243. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 23, 2018 at 06:38 PM (#5790503)
Who could have seen something like this coming ... It's for the players!

Conmebol is lobbying Fifa to stage the World Cup every two years rather than every four, president Alejandro Domínguez confirmed on Friday.

Having seen the success of the Uefa Nations League, he would also be open to the possibility of expanding that to include South American teams.

“The proposal we have made to Fifa is to play the World Cup every two years and not every four,” Domínguez said. “Instead of having the Nations League in between we can just go ahead every two years and have a World Cup and that is for everyone.

“It’s for the players because they could play four World Cups if we move to a two-year cycle. If we stay with this format many players will not be able to play more than two.

“There are many solutions. We could hold the tournament in Europe, South America, North America, Africa and Asia without such a long wait. So we see an opportunity there and there is a proposal put forward to Fifa.”

Money, needless to say, is a motivating factor. “In terms of economics Fifa make money and give more money,” Domínguez said.


Link
   1244. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 23, 2018 at 07:34 PM (#5790510)
Who could have seen something like this coming


Speaking of which ...

José Mourinho believes Anthony Martial, Luke Shaw, Marcus Rashford and Jesse Lingard need to become more competitive to realise their potential, with Manchester United’s manager stating that generally the new generation of footballers are too pampered.

The quartet are United’s brightest young players, yet Mourinho continues to strive to help them comprehend what is needed if they are to take a place among the elite.

“They’re lacking maturity,” he told Univision, a US Spanish-language TV channel. “For example, Luke Shaw. When I got here two years ago, the boy didn’t even know how to compete. Great potential, yes, but he doesn’t know how to compete. And when we talk about Luke Shaw, about Martial, about Lingard, about Marcus Rashford, we’re talking about boys with great potential but who still are lacking – a word I can’t say but you like to say a lot – having that [courage]. They’re lacking a bit of this.”


Graun

I just can't think of another coach who constantly slagged off his players in public like this.

Probably a decent approach if you are angling for a nice, fat pay-off, though ...

   1245. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 24, 2018 at 12:23 PM (#5790605)
From The Graun:

Tottenham Hotspur (4-2-3-1) Lloris; Aurier, Foyth, Alderweireld, Davies; Sissoko, Dier; Eriksen, Alli, Son; Kane.


Not feeling confident about this one, even at "home" ...
   1246. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 24, 2018 at 12:50 PM (#5790609)
Spurs have started really strong, and that second goal was an absolute gift. I'd very much like to see Chelsea lose their first game this year though I suspect they'll lose several by season's end.
   1247. ckash Posted: November 24, 2018 at 02:01 PM (#5790622)
Quite the ass whuppin' Spurs put on Chelsea today. Today is proof that Luiz is cooked and not a legit Champions League quality CB. Jorginho absolutely cannot play defense. An upgrade at CB and another defensive-minded MF to spell Kante and even team up with him in certain situations are vital if the club wants to finish top 4.
   1248. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 24, 2018 at 02:24 PM (#5790626)
Mostly agree, but I don't think Arsenal is that good yet this year, and we know ManU isn't. Chelsea may not need to get any better the finish 4th.
   1249. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 24, 2018 at 03:57 PM (#5790642)
Bloody bugger ... that was not what I was expecting from Spurs v Chelsea ... where did that come from?

Surprised in both directions ...

MCoA's rough xG ... 4.0 - 1.1

His summary? "That's a paddlin'"
   1250. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 24, 2018 at 06:11 PM (#5790662)
Just bugnuts ...


BUENOS AIRES, Nov 24 (Reuters) - The second leg of the Copa Libertadores final between River Plate and Boca Juniors was suspended on Saturday after Boca players were hurt when their bus was attacked outside the stadium by River fans, officials said.

“One can’t play in these conditions,” Alejandro Dominguez, President of the South American Football Confederation, (CONMEBOL) told reporters. The match was rescheduled for Sunday, kicking off at 5 pm local time (2000 GMT).

Several Boca players were injured either by glass from broken windows or from toxic gas after River fans pelted their coach with missiles as it approached the ground, local media reported.
   1251. spivey Posted: November 24, 2018 at 06:37 PM (#5790666)
That’s a good reminder of how good Spurs can be when Alli and Son are healthy and fresh
   1252. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: November 25, 2018 at 02:11 AM (#5790775)
#1250 That should just be a forfeit.
   1253. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 25, 2018 at 10:59 AM (#5790817)
It's comforting to know Robert Plant hasn't ditched his locks.
   1254. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 25, 2018 at 11:09 AM (#5790818)
I assume Huddersfield-Wolves is our game because there is some contractual obligation to get every team the Sunday afternoon spot. Still, nice start and with a goal it should stay pretty open.
   1255. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 25, 2018 at 12:40 PM (#5790856)
Judging by today's performance, Wolves have a long way to go to challenge the top 6. This might end up as Huddersfield's only win away from home all year. (Probably not... they had 3 away wins last year). It's the first time they've scored 2 in a game as well. (They scored 2 or more 6 times last year.)
   1256. spivey Posted: November 25, 2018 at 05:47 PM (#5790929)
I don't watch the MLS at all, but my understanding is Atlanta/Red Bull are the best two teams in the league, and perhaps 2 of the best teams of all time. They're playing on turf, of course.
   1257. spivey Posted: November 25, 2018 at 05:51 PM (#5790932)
Wolves did draw City, and look better doing it than a few of the top 6 teams did. They could use a striker like Lukaku though. I still believe in their all around talent, but they don't seem to have any big time goal scorers, and you need that.

That said, there is a big gap behind the top 5. I think City is far and away #1, #2-5 are pretty even, and then a big gap. United have so much talent that I think they'll turn around a bit.
   1258. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 25, 2018 at 06:04 PM (#5790933)
United have so much talent that I think they'll turn around a bit.


Are we talking before or after they fire you-know-who?
   1259. spivey Posted: November 25, 2018 at 06:34 PM (#5790938)
The waving off of that goal is really weird to me in the Red Bulls/Atlanta game. There is a guy a bit in an offside position but I don't think it affects Guzan there. Although he is kind of blocking Guzan. That's a weird one. When you're reviewing that sort of stuff, I just feel like so many goals can get taken off the board. And that's not a good thing for soccer. That's NFL level TD calls that are "There are no flags on the field"
   1260. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 25, 2018 at 06:38 PM (#5790939)
I’m with you Spivey. I watched it several times and I just didn’t see it at all. As you say I don’t think soccer is improved by having fewer goals scored.
   1261. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 25, 2018 at 07:00 PM (#5790946)
New York really need a goal here. The difference between 2-0 and 2-1 is massive.
   1262. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 25, 2018 at 07:13 PM (#5790948)
Ouch, Red Bull’s are done. 95th minute goal for Atlanta.
   1263. spivey Posted: November 25, 2018 at 07:14 PM (#5790949)
I think it's good for MLS that a team like Atlanta wins the title, so I love that they're pouring it on Red Bulls.
   1264. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 25, 2018 at 08:28 PM (#5790978)
538 thinks KC is as good or better than NYRB. I can't say, as I haven't been following the league.

I thought the waving off of the goal was a little rough. At some point it's a judgment call... if the ball had come a little close to the player in an offside position I would have definitely said so. To reverse that particular call via VAR though seemed pretty harsh to me. I'm not complaining. Anything RB-themed is a plague on humanity, and it's nice to see the Atlanta success story go rewarded.
   1265. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 25, 2018 at 09:30 PM (#5790992)
Portland get a goal ruled out after a delayed off sides call. The asssistant waited to allow play to carry on if they wanted to VAR it but it looked like the right call.
   1266. Sean Forman Posted: November 26, 2018 at 04:03 PM (#5791229)

The waving off of that goal is really weird to me in the Red Bulls/Atlanta game. There is a guy a bit in an offside position but I don't think it affects Guzan there. Although he is kind of blocking Guzan. That's a weird one. When you're reviewing that sort of stuff, I just feel like so many goals can get taken off the board. And that's not a good thing for soccer. That's NFL level TD calls that are "There are no flags on the field"


Looks like a very good call to me. The NYRB player was directly between guzan and BWP when the ball was struck. Guzan was trying to look around him.

https://twitter.com/MattDoyle76/status/1066837524969123840/photo/1
   1267. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 26, 2018 at 04:23 PM (#5791236)
Based on that photo, I agree. It looked less bad than it was live because the offensive player was moving left (from Guzan's POV) while the ball was tailing right, but the first, most critical, part of it's trajectory must have been almost completely blocked from Guzan's POV.
   1268. spivey Posted: November 26, 2018 at 04:51 PM (#5791243)
He did block Guzan, though I don't think Guzan saves it regardless. Maybe there's some judgment call there, and I can see why you'd give the benefit to the keeper. But I don't think he gets it, and that's part of why I have mixed feelings on it.
   1269. jmurph Posted: November 27, 2018 at 10:36 AM (#5791379)
Manchester City are supposedly closing in on a deal for US goalkeeper Zack Steffen, for reasons that are entirely unclear to me (his motivations, I mean- obviously having a decent backup is useful with Bravo out). Perhaps he'll be immediately loaned out for a year or two before being sold?
   1270. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 27, 2018 at 10:48 AM (#5791396)
I'd assume the backup keeper at Man City is making more money than the Columbus Crew starter. Beyond that is the prestige and hey, he's young and the US has a track record for keepers playing at a high level. Spend the rest of the year as the backup there, maybe play some Cup competitions, then next year who knows. Either he gets a shot or as you say he gets loaned out.
   1271. jmurph Posted: November 27, 2018 at 01:46 PM (#5791528)
City Watch @City_Watch
After joining Manchester City and assuming he cannot acquire a work permit right away, Zack Steffen will be loaned to Patrick Vieira's Nice in France's Ligue 1. [@MassiveReport]
   1272. spivey Posted: November 27, 2018 at 04:00 PM (#5791584)
I think it's been mentioned how Bayern have been struggling here, but it's gotten even worse. They're in 5th place in the Bundesliga, and have the 6th best goal differential. I'm sure they'll qualify for CL, but it really looks like their consecutive titles is in jeopardy.
   1273. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 27, 2018 at 04:12 PM (#5791590)
Apparently, at least according to one of the TNT broadcasters, a fellow named Ben Zeemer plays striker for Real Madrid.

   1274. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 27, 2018 at 05:08 PM (#5791611)
ManU with the ugly win at home against Young Boys. Since they will most likely finish 2nd in the group, they will probably be overmatched against their knockout round opponent, and will go out again. You never know though.

The only real drama left in the groups is whether Bayern can takefirst place with at least a draw on the road, and the big surprise: Shakhtar needing a win at home against Lyon to snatch 2nd place. That was unexpected, and it's roughly a 50/50 proposition.
   1275. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: November 28, 2018 at 10:29 AM (#5791764)
I think it's been mentioned how Bayern have been struggling here, but it's gotten even worse. They're in 5th place in the Bundesliga, and have the 6th best goal differential. I'm sure they'll qualify for CL, but it really looks like their consecutive titles is in jeopardy.

Yeah a CL still looks very likely. But their main problem is how well Dortmund is playing. They are now 9 points off first place, and rapidly approaching the point where they can't afford any more bad results.

Getting pegged back from a 3-1 lead this weekend by Fortuna Düsseldorf (2nd last in the BL, now 1 point ahead of last place Stuttgart) was ugly for them (but very fun to watch for everyone else - some nice goals, and a hat trick in there). They just looked completely discombobulated at the end.

I think by far their biggest problem right now is that Neuer looks like a shell of his former self.
   1276. frannyzoo Posted: November 28, 2018 at 01:22 PM (#5791858)
Not watching much Ligue 1 this year, but Monaco is showing themselves to be every bit as bad as standings would indicate. Shambolic defending. Not that I mind.
   1277. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 02:46 PM (#5791905)
Yes, and Falcao not covering himself with glory either.

Ligue 1 is performing very poorly in Europe this year. Hopefully that will continue for 2 more hours.

edit: they are about to lose all their teams from Europa, and Monaco just finished 4th in the CL so are totally out. Lyon and PSG are in a dogfight to advance in the CL, and PSG could even conceivably finish 4th, though it's pretty unlikely.
   1278. The Marksist Posted: November 28, 2018 at 02:55 PM (#5791911)
I have the nerves for this PSG game. Really, really want to win and take the worry out of qualification.
   1279. The Marksist Posted: November 28, 2018 at 03:37 PM (#5791930)
welp
   1280. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 03:47 PM (#5791934)
Liverpool looked totally overmatched. Lucky that they are still in it.

Neymar complaining that it should not have been a penalty is especially sweet.
   1281. The Marksist Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:02 PM (#5791942)
Neymar complaining that it should not have been a penalty is especially sweet.


He is amaaaaaazingly unlikable. Just, totally off the charts annoying. Surprises me every time I watch him.
   1282. jmurph Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:03 PM (#5791943)
He is amaaaaaazingly unlikable. Just, totally off the charts annoying. Surprises me every time I watch him.

Totally agree.
   1283. J. Sosa Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:03 PM (#5791944)
Look, I know Klopp is much smarter than me, but for the love of all that is holy what the #### is with his undying love for the Henderson, Milner, Wij hydra. It sucks. I get that Keita and Fabinho don’t fully grasp the system yet, but I can’t adequately express without a great deal of profanity how much I hate that those two don’t play in favor of the vortex of suck that is Hendo/Wij/Milner.
   1284. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:04 PM (#5791946)
If both group B games end up in a draw, Spurs are locked into 3rd, and thus Europa.
   1285. aberg Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:37 PM (#5791956)
That was a beautiful attack by Spurs, made that much better by the situation.
   1286. The Marksist Posted: November 28, 2018 at 04:55 PM (#5791969)
welp
   1287. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 05:04 PM (#5791972)
538 still gives Red Star a 30% chance of at least a home draw against PSG. I think that's probably a bit high if Liverpool is leading. Any win by Liverpool combined with a draw by PSG gives Liverpool first in the group, and sends PSG home I think.
A 2-goal win by Liverpool and they advance, even if PSG wins (but then they would advance in second place).
   1288. spivey Posted: November 28, 2018 at 07:52 PM (#5792038)
Look, I know Klopp is much smarter than me, but for the love of all that is holy what the #### is with his undying love for the Henderson, Milner, Wij hydra. It sucks. I get that Keita and Fabinho don’t fully grasp the system yet, but I can’t adequately express without a great deal of profanity how much I hate that those two don’t play in favor of the vortex of suck that is Hendo/Wij/Milner.

Damn, some serious hating going on here. I've got a couple of 'Pool fans that are pretty into soccer that like those guys, especially Gini. I find he goes in and out of games way too often - but I don't watch their team the way I watch others. I think Henderson and Milner play exactly the kind of ultra physical, box to box, pressing style that Klopp's press demands.

But Henderson and Milner are pretty damn good. They'd each start for Tottenham. Hell, if we had both I'd probably throw Milner at left back and start 'em both.

--

Tottenham - they're starting to round into form. Real shame they dropped points at PSV when they played so well, but christ, I'll be interested to see the Barca/PSV game xG because it looks like PSV hit the post a few times. PSV's better than I was expecting. I have to admit I'm getting excited about Tottenham having to go to Camp Nou and get a victory. I mean, it sucks that it's still the group stages, but those are the kind of results you probably have to get to win the thing. I think Barca may be starting a weak squad and they've not been at the top of their game this year either. They outplayed Tottenham in the first leg but Tottenham is way healthier and seems fresher as well. Also this is why the CL is fun. Win or lose, it's exciting to see your team go into the Camp Nou with their tournament on the line and not only that, they almost certainly have to win. #### it, let's do it. That said, I wouldn't be shocked by PSV drawing or even winning, and Barcelona won't be playing their best squad, I'm guessing.

Also Sissoko's had a hell of a run, and it's been a huge relief. I would still love them to get a guy like Rabiot, though, in the winter window.

--

PSG is really good. The little combination play between M'Bappe and and Neymar is scintillating stuff. They're both so fast, and Neymar is so skilled with the ball at his feet. I don't like Neymar much, but you can't doubt his skill, he's really quite brilliant.

As far as Ligue 1 goes, I'm rooting for Lyon to get a point or more against Shaktar. I think they can. They've pushed City more than any team in the EPL, and they're second in the league, so sure, let's see what they can do.
   1289. spivey Posted: November 28, 2018 at 07:55 PM (#5792039)
538 still gives Red Star a 30% chance of at least a home draw against PSG. I think that's probably a bit high if Liverpool is leading. Any win by Liverpool combined with a draw by PSG gives Liverpool first in the group, and sends PSG home I think.

Really? That's interesting and a terrible rule. I think GD should absolutely win out over any h2h stuff.
   1290. Mefisto Posted: November 28, 2018 at 08:07 PM (#5792043)
PSV xG 3.1
Barca xG 2.1

   1291. J. Sosa Posted: November 28, 2018 at 08:33 PM (#5792049)
Re: 1288

Yes, they are too limited. Wij recycles the ball which is fine depending on who he is with. But his best position is probably as a holding six. Which means Henderson is effectively playing what is essentially one of the two eights. I hate it. Teams last year setup stupidly and allowed the front three to tear them apart. Now? They just ignore the midfield, bypass it entirely.

Nobody is going to hurt you or play an incisive ball. Milner in isolation is fine. Even with Wij maybe fine. But that particular mix of those three is terrible. Teams just load up on the front three, gain possession, and bypass the mids. Nobody from the midfield can break lines. I would never have believed how badly losing Ox has hurt the team.

To be honest, I am getting quite worried about Fabinho. Ox took half a season but that was a different role. Still time. But when we are talking these super duper high end matches like today or last year’s final, the midfield really stands out like a sore thumb. Which was the whole reason they brought in two top end mids.

Don’t get me wrong, I love Milner, have acquired a taste for Wij, and tolerate Henderson’s clattering tough guy act when not playing as a six, but as a unit, woof.
   1292. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: November 28, 2018 at 08:56 PM (#5792054)
Also Sissoko's had a hell of a run, and it's been a huge relief


Well, it helps that Poch finally figured out where he plays best. Part of the AM band certainly wasn't it ...
   1293. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 09:26 PM (#5792062)
It seems like more and more soccer competitions are using head to head before overall GD. I think head to head is a better tiebreaker for unbalanced groups, because it's not really a measure of an accomplishment to put up 6 on minnows rather than 3, and it's also not that much of an indicator of team quality. The CL had gone to a more unbalanced group format in recent years with teams from the top few leagues much better than everyone else.

The rule is affecting all the groups right now, for better or worse. For example, Spurs will go out on HtH (more road goals allowed) to Inter if both teams end up even on points, despite having the same overall GD and more group goals scored. I can see the logic of that one either way.

If Liverpool and PSG both win, Liverpool and Napoli will be tied for 2nd in the group. If overall GD and GF were used, Liverpool would just need any win to advance. However, since HtH is used, Liverpool needs a 1-0 win or any 2-goal win. 2-1 won't do it for them. I could also see the logic of this one either way.

In the three-way scenario (PSG draw, Liverpool win), if overall GD were used PSG would likely advance on GD simply because they blew out Red Star 6-1 at home. That seems less than ideal. As it stands, the first tiebreaker is 3-way HtH. where Liverpool would have 2 wins and 2 losses (6 points), while PSG and Napoli would have 1 win, 1 loss and 2 draws each (5 points). Thus Liverpool would advance on the (to my mind, at least) more appropriate tie breaker while PSG and Napoli would revert to HtH between the two, which Napoli would win on away goals.

I've probably said enough about this already, but it's also the reason why Man City has not yet clinched top spot in its group despite a +9 GD to Lyon's +1 (Lyon has a win and a draw against City, while City got all 9 GD from Shakhter in 6-0 and 3-0 victories).

Similarly, Pizen has a -10 GD but could still easily finish 3rd in their group due to having a win and draw against its "competition" for bottom spot, CSKA Moscow. In that group, the top 2 are so much better than the bottom two that GD across the two mini-groups has little meaning. (To be fair, CSKA did manage to upset Real Madrid at home, 1-0, but xG had it as 0.5-2.0 for Real Madrid).

Of course, the best examples are probably from Europa, where the talent level within a group can be even wider. Dudelange is in a group of 3 otherwise decent teams: Milan, Betis, Olympiacos. That group could very easily end up in a 2-way tie for 1st or 2nd place, or even a 3-way tie, with Dudelange losing all its games. At that point GD would be almost entirely determined by which of the teams did a better job converting its chances against poor Dudelange (expected GD after 6 games probably about -15)--probably not a very good way to decide a group.



   1294. spivey Posted: November 28, 2018 at 09:47 PM (#5792066)
Destroying minnows does reflect team quality imo, though I understand not loving the optics of teams really trying to run it up in those situations. Also, Liverpool's poor GD is as much due to losing by multiple goals to Red Star as anything else. I think you have the Spurs/Inter backwards, as Spurs scored an away goal and Inter did not. But yeah, it seems like this is the way they've moved. I just don't like h2h because I think when you're dealing with these small sample sizes, you get weird outcomes that aren't well reflected in team quality and xG and I think reducing the tiebreaker to be something that reflects just 2 games instead of 6 isn't ideal. I'm probably in the minority, since the change is being made.
   1295. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 28, 2018 at 10:21 PM (#5792074)
Scoring goals against minnows is a measure of team quality, yes, but the 3rd goal and especially the 5th goal against a minnow is much less a measure of team quality than any goal against a team of equal ability. On top of that, there are only 6 games in a group--the purpose in competitions isn't to measure relative team quality but to reward accomplishment in a small set of games. The 5th goal against a minnow is essentially no accomplishment at all, and thus shouldn't be rewarded at all. Unlike a league with 38 games, the best teams are only slightly likely to score more goals against a minnow in group of 4 over a couple games than the better than average teams.

Sorry on Spurs yes I knew that but forgot to look at the table. They "only" have to get the same number of points away to Barca as Inter gets at home facing PSV.
   1296. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: November 29, 2018 at 08:52 AM (#5792115)
I definitely prefer Head to Head over total goals. I think Aunt Bea is correct that at some point being able to run it up against a crummy team isn't really proving anything.
   1297. AuntBea calls himself Sky Panther Posted: November 29, 2018 at 12:55 PM (#5792220)
Big turnaround in Moscow. Spartak led early and mostly had the upper hand, but two late goals from Vienna and they are now leading the group. The result was mostly neutral for Rangers, who host Villarreal today. This is turning out to be the tightest group, top to bottom, in Europa.
Page 13 of 13 pages ‹ First  < 11 12 13

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

News

All News | Prime News

Old-School Newsstand


BBTF Partner

Dynasty League Baseball

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
BarrysLazyBoy
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogPadres get Ian Kinsler to play all over infield - The San Diego Union-Tribune
(13 - 10:09am, Dec 16)
Last: Morty Causa

NewsblogWhy gambling used to scare baseball and why it doesn’t anymore
(45 - 9:34am, Dec 16)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

NewsblogOT - NBA Thread (2018-19 season kickoff edition)
(3703 - 9:29am, Dec 16)
Last: JC in DC

NewsblogThibs' Hall of Fame Tracker
(494 - 9:17am, Dec 16)
Last: DanG

NewsblogRed Sox owe $12 million in luxury tax, showing why they'd want to shed payroll
(1 - 9:17am, Dec 16)
Last: Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature

NewsblogCardinals prospect Griffin Roberts suspended 50 games for a drug of abuse
(5 - 9:05am, Dec 16)
Last: Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle

NewsblogTHE HALL OF FAME VALUE STANDARD (Bill James rank 25 worst players in HOF & 25 best not in the HOF)
(93 - 8:18am, Dec 16)
Last: Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad)

NewsblogYankees To Sign J.A. Happ
(36 - 12:16am, Dec 16)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

NewsblogThe Athletic: What It's Like to Cover an Indians Three Team Trade on a Flight with the Front Office and No WIFI
(5 - 12:08am, Dec 16)
Last: Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim

Gonfalon CubsNow what?
(355 - 11:12pm, Dec 15)
Last: Quaker

Hall of Merit2019 Hall of Merit Ballot
(14 - 10:30pm, Dec 15)
Last: Howie Menckel

NewsblogOT - College Football Bowl Spectacular (December 2018 - January 2019)
(92 - 10:13pm, Dec 15)
Last: Lance Reddick! Lance him!

Hall of Merit2019 Hall of Merit Ballot Discussion
(352 - 9:58pm, Dec 15)
Last: Howie Menckel

NewsblogSome MLB front offices are starting to embrace an out-of-the-box idea to boost trading at the winter meetings
(36 - 7:37pm, Dec 15)
Last: cardsfanboy

NewsblogFrom a hospital bed in Las Vegas, Mariners GM Jerry Dipoto finalizes a trade for Edwin Encarnacion
(8 - 5:53pm, Dec 15)
Last: snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster)

Page rendered in 0.6314 seconds
46 querie(s) executed