Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Wednesday, May 07, 2014

OT: The Soccer Thread May, 2014

Real and Atletico go two rounds. Can Liverpool come back? Will Arsenal finally win a trophy?

May 7: Man City v. Aston Villa, Valladolid v. Real Madrid, Copa Liberatadores Quarterfinals (1st legs)
May 8: Copa Liberatadores Quarterfinals (1st legs)
May 10: Inter v. Lazio
May 11: Liverpool v. Newcastle, Man City v. West Ham, Atletico v. Malaga, Celta de Vigo v. Real Madrid, Roma v. Juventus
May 13: Germany v. Poland
May 14: Sevilla v. Benfica, Copa Liberatadores Quarterfinals (2nd legs)
May 15: Copa Liberatadores Quarterfinals (2nd legs)
May 16: Barcelona v. Atletico Madrid, Real Madrid v. Espanyol
May 17: FA Cup Final (Arsenal v. Hull City), DFB Pokal (Dortmund v. Bayern)
May 24: Champions League Final (Real Madrid v. Atletico Madrid)
May 27: USA v. Azerbaijan, Scotland v. Nigeria
May 28: Denmark v. Sweden, Mexico v. Israel, Cameroon v. Paraguay, Honduras v. Turkey
May 29: Chile v. Egypt, Spain v. Bolivia
May 30: England v. Peru, Portugal v. Greece, Netherlands v. Ghana
May 31: Mexico v. Ecuador, France v. Paraguay

Darkness and the howling fantods Posted: May 07, 2014 at 03:40 AM | 1176 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: soccer

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

Page 7 of 12 pages ‹ First  < 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 > 
   601. frannyzoo Posted: May 22, 2014 at 02:13 PM (#4711558)
Oh, and another flopping thing, 2-0 RM, unfortunately.
   602. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 22, 2014 at 02:48 PM (#4711591)
It's shorthand for what has come to be called the "break even rule", which allows for losses within limits as it is being phased in.


Thanks ursus.

And I'll say 2-1 Atletico. I just think it's their year. It all could have gone to hell on Sunday for them; trailing in the game, losing two key players, on the road, and instead they rallied. I just think the soccer gods are with them.
   603. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 22, 2014 at 02:52 PM (#4711593)
Sadly, I think it's going to be Real. Atletico have been running on fumes, they're starting to suffer injuries, and they just spent the week having a hell of a party while Real have been focused on the final for two weeks. I would be shocked if Atleti can pull it off.
   604. DA Baracus Posted: May 22, 2014 at 03:14 PM (#4711609)
Atleti beat then drew Real in La Liga, so they certainly have a good chance. But then, they lost 5-0 on aggregate in Copa del Rey and Real has had essentially an extra week to prepare. Hopefully this is a good, close game because as a neutral it's a very exciting match up.
   605. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 22, 2014 at 03:21 PM (#4711616)
One thing about the game is it seems like the weight of the world should be on Real. There entire existence for about a decade now has been about getting the "decima" and Atleti have already had the dream season. If Real get the first one I wouldn't be stunned if they ran away to a 3-0 or 4-0 win but if Atletico get the first one or keep it 0-0 through the first half I can see Real getting tight.
   606. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 03:33 PM (#4711631)
It's been hugely disappointing for a lot of Barcelona supporters and the board.
   607. Swedish Chef Posted: May 22, 2014 at 03:52 PM (#4711652)
One thing about the game is it seems like the weight of the world should be on Real.

I can think of football teams that have made dumb tactics or team selection decisions due to the perceived importance of the match, like when Brazil played ill Ronaldo in the 1998 WC final or Liverpool running themselves ragged to close a nine goal deficit. But I don't think teams can get the yips, it's not that kind of sport, the key moments are in the flow of the game and not telegraphed, so the players can't get nervous from dreading them beforehand. Well, thinking about it, penalties are an exception there.
   608. puck Posted: May 22, 2014 at 04:00 PM (#4711656)
How is the health of Ronaldo and Bale?
   609. Swedish Chef Posted: May 22, 2014 at 04:02 PM (#4711659)
Last I checked they hadn't gone to a witch doctor.

EDIT: Real says they're fit.
   610. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 04:02 PM (#4711660)
For the record, 606 is about Cesc.

Ronaldo and Bale are less than 100%, but will play.

Pepe is purportedly out, and there are reports that Benzema is doubtful.

I'm with Jose, the first goal will be key (though the way Atleti came back after Sanchez' wonderstrike at the Camp Nou was impressive).
   611. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:36 PM (#4711730)
Woah, Taylor Twellman says that Landon Donovan isn't in the final 23 for the World Cup.
   612. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:41 PM (#4711734)
Now confirmed.

The seven cuts from the 30 are Donovan, Parkhurst, Evans, Goodson, Corona, Edu, and Boyd
   613. Darkness and the howling fantods Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:43 PM (#4711736)
Wow. He takes Green and leaves Donovan.
   614. CWS Keith plans to boo your show at the Apollo Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:44 PM (#4711737)
That's crazy. He hasn't scored yet for the Galaxy this season, but you can't tell me he shouldn't -- at the very least -- be a bench option. Ugh. Do not like.
   615. KronicFatigue Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:46 PM (#4711738)
I was worried that US wouldn't accumulate a single point in group play, and wow, can't say that the roster alleviates any concerns.
   616. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: May 22, 2014 at 05:59 PM (#4711742)
I suppose the rationale for Davis over LanDo is that Davis is better on set pieces. The US probably won't be scoring much from open play and their hope is to nab a late goal off a set piece. Probably why Wondo's there too. I'm pretty sure I'd still rather have LanDo though.

He's really stacked the back four too.

When was the last time a team has had to use its third goaltender in the WC? I don't really see the point of bringing Rimando; if the US loses Howard and Guzan for whatever reason they're ###### anyway.

EDIT: Also I'm surprised to see Yedlin over Evans but my Sounders fan co-worker tells me not to be surprised about that.
   617. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 06:00 PM (#4711744)
You have to bring three keepers, that was the basis of the squad increase from 22 to 23.
   618. Mefisto Posted: May 22, 2014 at 06:01 PM (#4711745)
Donovan's played like crap for a year now, but I'm still stunned by this.
   619. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 06:04 PM (#4711747)
ESPN trolling full out.

Tweet from SportsCenter

Landon Donovan has scored 5 goals in the World Cup - as many as Lionel Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo & Robin van Persie have COMBINED.
   620. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: May 22, 2014 at 06:08 PM (#4711751)
19 of 23 have surnames between A and J in the alphabet.
   621. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 22, 2014 at 06:48 PM (#4711780)
Wow that's a shocker. I'll give Klinsmann credit for having the balls to do that. I don't particularly like it but I'm open to being convinced.
   622. KronicFatigue Posted: May 22, 2014 at 07:31 PM (#4711805)
Let's say you think Donovan is the 24th best USMNT player. Isn't bringing him over the 23rd best worth it just for the marketing standpoint? Not in terms of money, but in terms of growing the game. If he's not the most recognizable name in US soccer, he's darn close. Isn't part of the value of the WC in growing interest in the game, which helps us in the future?
   623. Textbook Editor Posted: May 22, 2014 at 07:39 PM (#4711812)
Color me stunned. So if someone gets hurt between now and the start of the WC, can they change the 23-man roster? I have no idea how that works...
   624. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 22, 2014 at 07:42 PM (#4711814)
Let's say you think Donovan is the 24th best USMNT player. Isn't bringing him over the 23rd best worth it just for the marketing standpoint? Not in terms of money, but in terms of growing the game. If he's not the most recognizable name in US soccer, he's darn close. Isn't part of the value of the WC in growing interest in the game, which helps us in the future?


The flip side to that is you send a message to the younger players that jobs are won on merit not name recognition. Also this will have a pretty substantial impact on marketing. The lead story on ESPN's main page right now is that Landon Donovan is off the US roster. I suspect if he was not on the roster it would get a sidebar mention "US announces 23 man WC roster." Add to that that people will hopefully wonder who these guys are that Donovan was left off and they'll get to know guys like Green, Gonzalez, Johansson among others.
   625. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 22, 2014 at 07:49 PM (#4711816)
Having said what I said above the more I think about this the more I don't like it. World Cups are weird animals. It creates a travel and a playing schedule that I think makes experience useful. The US doesn't have so much institutional memory that leaving someone like Donovan off the roster makes a lot of sense to me.
   626. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 22, 2014 at 08:42 PM (#4711836)
Wooooooah.
   627. Scott Lange Posted: May 22, 2014 at 09:40 PM (#4711858)
The flip side to that is you send a message to the younger players that jobs are won on merit not name recognition.


But is this really merit? I mean, its awfully hard to make an argument that there are 20 field players better than Donovan, even in 2014. This really, really feels like Klinsmann just sending a message that this is his team.

That, or Landon slept with Wynalda's wife.
   628. Baldrick Posted: May 22, 2014 at 10:38 PM (#4711884)
Crazy. I'll admit to being enough out of the loop on our guys right now that I couldn't really say whether he's playing well enough to justify the spot. But I'm still shocked.

The flip side to that is you send a message to the younger players that jobs are won on merit not name recognition.

So, how does that square with taking Green, then? Or was the Green selection fait accompli and this is designed in part as damage control?

For those more plugged in, how about the other decisions?
   629. Mefisto Posted: May 22, 2014 at 10:57 PM (#4711894)
I find it hard to believe that, on the merits, Green is better. Or Brad Davis. Frankly, Dempsey has played like crap lately. So I'm really not sure what's going on.
   630. ursus arctos Posted: May 22, 2014 at 11:33 PM (#4711902)
623, in the event of an injury serious enough to prevent a player on the 23 from participating in the tournament at all, the Federation can apply to FIFA for a medical waiver to replace the injured player. It is quite rare in practice, but does happen.

Mty theory on this is that Klinsi doesn't think that he is getting out of the group with or without Donavan, and has therefore decided that it is preferable to give WC experience to guys who can contribute to the Copa America Centenario and 2018. I'm not sure that I agree with him, but I can see the reasoning if that is what he believes.
   631. Baldrick Posted: May 22, 2014 at 11:56 PM (#4711906)
I don't think they'll get out of the group either, but I generally think it's a terrible terrible idea to plan for the future in these things. You get a chance at the World Cup once every four years. You should do absolutely everything you can to improve your chances at it. Planning for the future is a fool's errand when it comes to this tournament.

If it really is the case that the only way to get Green to play for the US was to dangle a slot, I suppose that's the sort of exception I can accept.
   632. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:56 AM (#4711925)
As the day's gone by I'm more and more bummed that Donovan was left off the team.

I think ursos is onto something when he mentions trying to build a team for the future. Of course I think it's silly to try to build a 2018 World Cup roster in 2014. But using the 2014 WC to prepare for the 2016 Copa America, where the US has an opportunity to do fairly well? Eh, I could buy that.

But that still doesn't really explain why you'd take 32-year old Davis over, say, Joe Corona. I dunno; I guess it's the set pieces.

The current theory in my head is LanDo was offered a non-starting role on the team, as Klinsmann wants to find a stable starting 11 for 2014 and beyond. Donovan declined and Davis got his spot.

So I'm guessing the starting 11 will look something like this.
Jozy
Johnson - Dempsey - Zuzi
Jones - Bradley
DMB - Besler - Cameron - Chandler
Howard
   633. Scott Lange Posted: May 23, 2014 at 06:58 AM (#4711945)
It's just classic "blame the best player," just like Bill James used to talk about. Donovan's not at his peak, so we won't take him, period. Never mind that Brad Davis is the same age and not at his peak either, and never mind whether off-peak Donovan is better or worse than current-Davis. We've got to send a message to the most talented guy to teach him a lesson for not being perfect. Joe Torre bats A-Rod 8th; Klinsmann leaves Donovan off the time entirely. Message sent. Goodbye, nose. Take that, face.
   634. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 23, 2014 at 06:58 AM (#4711946)
Klinsmann has some balls, I'll give him that. I actually feel very underwhelmed by the squad heading into the Cup. Jozy and Dempsey aren't in great form and I have no confidence in our fullbacks at all. I think this is going to be a rough one which is why I'm surprised Klinsmann had the balls to make a controversial roster decision. He's already going to take heat when we flame out in the group stage and now the criticism is going to be cranked up with this decision.
   635. Fancy Pants Handles lap changes with class Posted: May 23, 2014 at 07:54 AM (#4711953)
World Cups are weird animals. It creates a travel and a playing schedule that I think makes experience useful.

I really don't see much evidence for that.

With the weather and travel schedule in Brazil, I would go with athleticism and stamina over experience 10 times out of 10.
   636. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 23, 2014 at 08:51 AM (#4711976)
PSG are going to pay 40 million for David Luiz of all people. Mourinho must be pretty happy to get 40 million to play with for a player he probably didn't rate.
   637. Randy Jones Posted: May 23, 2014 at 09:15 AM (#4711982)
Luiz is good, but $40M? Didn't PSG get hit with the same transfer spending limit that City did?

RE: Donovan, I agree with 633. Out of form Donovan is still better than several other guys on the squad. Makes no sense unless he was creating issues because he wasn't going to start or something like that.
   638. I am going to be Frank Posted: May 23, 2014 at 09:58 AM (#4711995)
What is the most realistic scenario for the US? Germany is clearly better and Portugal is better and has one of the two best players in the world. Ghana may or may not have the US' number, but I think that's at best around a 50/50 proposition.

Bringing a young team then makes sense, but as several have mentioned, bringing Davis makes no sense. If he's trying to make it out of the group I guess he can go one of two ways:
(1) Sitting deep and then playing on the counter - which means Donovan still is the best players for that (I haven't watched any MLS, but I'd imagine he has some of his speed).
(2) High and consistent pressing - Donovan isn't the best fit there, but a Dempsey/Altidore combo is really a bad fit for that. I guess Klinsmann has to start Dempsey and Altidore and he didn't like Donovan's sabbatical and perceived lack of commitment.
   639. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:21 AM (#4712002)
I was worried that US wouldn't accumulate a single point in group play, and wow, can't say that the roster alleviates any concerns.


Agreed.

Klinsmann has some balls, I'll give him that.


Don't confuse balls with stupidity and arrogance.

The current theory in my head is LanDo was offered a non-starting role on the team, as Klinsmann wants to find a stable starting 11 for 2014 and beyond. Donovan declined and Davis got his spot.


Doesn't look like it. Donovan is sad he's not on the team, so this isn't a Nasri thing, and then you've got Klinsmann's son tweeting "HHAHAHAHAHAHAH DONAVAN HAHAHAHAA I DIDNT EVEN NOTICE UNTIL PHONE NOTIFIED ME HAHA."
   640. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:29 AM (#4712006)
This team looks pretty weak and "transitional", but Robbie Findley played big minutes for the USMNT in 2010, so who knows.
   641. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:34 AM (#4712011)
What is the most realistic scenario for the US?


It's all down to that first game. We NEED to beat Ghana then try and steal a point from Germany or Portugal and hope 4 points gets us through.

The more I think about this the more I don't like it. I made some arguments above as to why it might pay off but there are a lot of good counterarguments and I'm just not seeing a good argument in favor of it.
   642. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:39 AM (#4712014)
This team looks pretty weak and "transitional", but Robbie Findley played big minutes for the USMNT in 2010, so who knows.


And that was a bad decision by Bradley. Buddle was better.

We NEED to beat Ghana then try and steal a point from Germany or Portugal and hope 4 points gets us through.


I wouldn't bet a dollar they get a point off Germany or Portugal.
   643. CWS Keith plans to boo your show at the Apollo Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:39 AM (#4712015)
FWIW, Dempsey has started the MLS season quite well -- eight goals in nine games. I wish I had the breakdown of how many of those were penalties, but going off of memory, I don't think it's more than three.

On the US full-backs, I actually think this is the best group they've had, at least in my time following the USMNT. In Chandler and Johnson, you've got two who are receiving regular playing time in a top European league. Yedlin is a proper full-back who's a good athlete and actually has some good passing skills, unlike Brad Evans who is more of a jack-of-all-trades spare part. Beasley held his own in the few games he was played at LB(*). Cameron's also an option, although the word is that he'll be played at CB. Just to put it into perspective, the full-backs on the 2010 roster were Cherundolo, Jonathan Spector and and Jonathan Bornstein. Bob Bradley was possibly still using Bocanegra out wide, too.

Lastly, I want to (again) bemoan the injury woes of Stuart Holden. Would've been nice to have seen him and Bradley get a significant stretch of games together. Oh well.

(*)CONCACAF minnows are obviously a bit different than Ghana, Germany and Portugal, but still.
   644. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:45 AM (#4712017)
Just to put it into perspective, the full-backs on the 2010 roster were Cherundolo, Jonathan Spector and and Jonathan Bornstein. Bob Bradley was possibly still using Bocanegra out wide, too.


The FBs in 2010 were Bocanegra and Cherondolo for the first 2 games and Cherondolo and Bornstein for the last 2, Bocanegra moved to CB.
   645. KronicFatigue Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:45 AM (#4712019)
Check out this tweet from Klinsmann's son about Donovan.
   646. CWS Keith plans to boo your show at the Apollo Posted: May 23, 2014 at 10:54 AM (#4712026)
The flip-side to my optimism about the US full-backs is that they're presumably going to have to do a lot of defending, and I don't know much about Chandler's nor Johnson's abilities without the ball. Johnson's best moments have seemingly come further forward, and Chandler, quite frankly, hasn't really put in an extended run of good shifts for the USMNT.
   647. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:10 AM (#4712038)
   648. JuanGone..except1game Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:18 AM (#4712044)
Luiz is good, but $40M? Didn't PSG get hit with the same transfer spending limit that City did?

These are the times when I realize that I'm always club > players, as cruel as that non-sentimental attitude is. Love his style, personality and leadership for all his warts but if PSG is offering $40M, Chelsea almost have to take it. PSG is also talking Hazard, but that seems more like my summertime plans with Paula Patton.

Please stop reminding me about Stuart, as the whole thing just makes me sad. USMNT would just have a completely different complexion with him.
   649. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:24 AM (#4712052)
That's 40 million POUNDS STERLING for Luiz, not $40 million.

Lost in all the brouhaha about Donovan, I'm pretty happy for guys like Wondo and Beckerman. Klinsmann certainly hasn't been a snob about MLS players and it's not hard to envision a future where almost the entire squad are MLS based (provided our servicemen ever stop finding love in Germany...)
   650. I am going to be Frank Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:38 AM (#4712067)
The US needs players playing at a high level in England, Italy, Spain and Germany. No matter how good MLS gets, the competition won't be as good as the top four European leagues. Brazil's split should be something the US strives for - players in the domestic league filling specific roles and depth. Obviously the US doesn't have those top-echelon players, but I think a Bradley being a regular starter at West Ham or Newcastle is better for the national team than him playing in Toronto. I'd agree that bringing guys who are playing well in MLS is much better than some guy on the fringes of a squad in Europe (Jozy notwithstanding).
   651. I am going to be Frank Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:47 AM (#4712072)
BTW its pretty sad that the CONCACAF qualification winner is going to need a minor miracle to get out of the group stages. We really should have less spots, but thank god for TV money!

Konoplyyanka, Liverpool target is now being considered by United. If the information in the article is credible, it would sting a bit if the player would still prefer United over Liverpool despite United being out of Champions League.

It looks like the Luiz to PSG is coming closer to fruition - 40M pounds is an amazing number. I still think Chelsea have the best depth at CB in the Premier League.

   652. The Buddy Biancalana Hit Counter Posted: May 23, 2014 at 11:52 AM (#4712075)
The US needs players playing at a high level in England, Italy, Spain and Germany. No matter how good MLS gets, the competition won't be as good as the top four European leagues. Brazil's split should be something the US strives for - players in the domestic league filling specific roles and depth. Obviously the US doesn't have those top-echelon players, but I think a Bradley being a regular starter at West Ham or Newcastle is better for the national team than him playing in Toronto. I'd agree that bringing guys who are playing well in MLS is much better than some guy on the fringes of a squad in Europe (Jozy notwithstanding).


I agree. Considering that, depending how heavily you weight on playing time against the highest level of competition, our best non-Bradley outfield players heading into this World Cup might be Geoff Cameron, Alejandro Bedoya, Fabian Johnson, Timothy Chandler, Jermaine Jones, and Aron Johansson, I don't know that leaving Donovan off the roster will make a huge difference in our results.

That being said, I don't think there's a convincing argument for leaving Donovan off and I feel bad for him personally. I also feel bad that Donovan's absence will probably overshadow DeMarcus Beasley's accomplishment of playing in four World Cups. Beasley's not much of a left back these days but he was seriously underrated in his prime.
   653. JuanGone..except1game Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:06 PM (#4712081)
Shooty, I'm 'Merican. Don't bother me with that funny money stuff. Also, Telegraph now says 50 Lbs insteed of 40 and that its agreed to.

Frank, That's my case on the Chelsea boards this morning. Chelsea has great cover for Terry, Cahill with Ivanovic, Kalas, Zouma (who was superb for Saint-Étienne) and Omerou (who played well at 'Boro last year). The bigger issue is CM where Luiz/Matic was our best pairing, but this puts us in a Vidal, Koke or Pogba discusssion, which makes my greedy mouth water.
   654. Randy Jones Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:06 PM (#4712082)
That's 40 million POUNDS STERLING for Luiz, not $40 million.

I actually meant euros and not dollars, but since I was typing a monetary value I reflexively used the dollar sign. Was too late to edit when I noticed it.

Anyway, if it's pounds and not euros, that is even more insane.
   655. Mefisto Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:10 PM (#4712084)
Sitting deep and then playing on the counter - which means Donovan still is the best players for that (I haven't watched any MLS, but I'd imagine he has some of his speed).


I think we can safely say that Donovan is faster than Brad Davis.

The more I think about this, the less sense it makes to me. Yes, Donovan is off his game these days, but he still could have been used late if we needed a goal. Much more so than Davis, certainly.
   656. Dale Sams Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:28 PM (#4712101)
This really, really feels like Klinsmann just sending a message that this is his team.


How'd that work out for Steve McClaren with Becks?
   657. I am going to be Frank Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:30 PM (#4712103)
Chelsea still have Matic, Ramires, van Ginkel and old man Lampard. Plus I think Mourinho may drop Oscar back there more. I assume Mikel is gone. Plus I'm sure there is a returning loanee or two who can fight for a spot (Chaloboah?). Chelsea have to buy two strikers (one if Costa is done) which is really expensive nowadays, a fullback or two, and I'm sure another attacking midfielder, just because.

All the Bayern players seem to want nothing to do with United. I wonder who the real targets are.
   658. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:36 PM (#4712106)
That being said, I don't think there's a convincing argument for leaving Donovan off


There is none. Klinsmann and Donovan simply don't get along.
   659. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 23, 2014 at 12:42 PM (#4712110)
All the Bayern players seem to want nothing to do with United.

I guess those guys don't want round 2 of Van Gaal any time soon. I CAN NOT wait for Rooney and Van Gaal to fall out. It is going to be glorious.
   660. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: May 23, 2014 at 01:16 PM (#4712129)
I find it hard to believe that, on the merits, Green is better. Or Brad Davis. Frankly, Dempsey has played like crap lately. So I'm really not sure what's going on.
I haven't watched a ton of Sounders games, but Dempsey's been absolutely fantastic in the minutes I've seen, and he has the best underlying stats of any attacking player in MLS.

He has scored seven non-penalty goals and assisted two in about 700 minutes. A "Scoring Contribution" of 1.17 / 90 min is best in the league among players with over 600 minutes, second only to Joao Plata among players with over 300 minutes.

His underlying stats are just as good. 43 shots, including 18 from the danger zone, for about six expected goals. And 17 key passes, including 7 to the danger zone, for about 2.5 expected assists. Dempsey xSC/90 of about 0.75 is best in MLS. We expect high-volume attacking players to convert shots at a higher rate than low-volume shooters, so it's unsurprising Dempsey is outperforming his xG. But too high a rate of G/xG and it's probably a fluke. Dempsey's right in the sweet spot.
   661. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 23, 2014 at 01:19 PM (#4712131)
Is Dempsey now the US' designated PK taker? For some reason I have it in my head that he was having a rough time with PKs (I know he missed one against Mexico) and that's something you can't afford if it comes up in a WC game.
   662. Juilin Sandar to Conkling Speedwell (Arjun) Posted: May 23, 2014 at 01:35 PM (#4712141)
Chelsea still have Matic, Ramires, van Ginkel and old man Lampard.

Van Ginkel is the big one - Luiz spent much of the year playing the role that had originally been designated for him in the side, had he not been injured. He's very, very good and Mourinho seems to like him a lot. I'm not worried about the defensive midfield.
   663. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 01:43 PM (#4712146)
Is Dempsey now the US' designated PK taker?


If only by default. Wondolowski can also take them.
   664. Mefisto Posted: May 23, 2014 at 02:09 PM (#4712157)
Fun Factoid from another site (and which I therefore can't vouch for): Messi, Rooney, Zlatan, and CR7 have, collectively, scored 3 goals in 31 WC games. Donovan has 5 in 12.
   665. AuntBea Posted: May 23, 2014 at 02:10 PM (#4712159)
I really hope the US does well, but my best guess is 1 point in the group. I think they have maybe a 20% chance of advancing.
   666. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 02:18 PM (#4712167)
Fun Factoid from another site (and which I therefore can't vouch for): Messi, Rooney, Zlatan, and CR7 have, collectively, scored 3 goals in 31 WC games. Donovan has 5 in 12.


It's true. I also like: since his return from sabatical, Donovan is 2nd on the USMNT in goals and 1st in assists.
   667. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: May 23, 2014 at 02:45 PM (#4712178)
Stuart Holden should retire from professional soccer and devote his time full-time to the national team, like Lucas Neill.
   668. ursus arctos Posted: May 23, 2014 at 02:48 PM (#4712181)
The David Luiz fee is reportedly up to FIFTY MILLION POUNDS STERLING.

I am now fully subscribed to MCoA's view that this window is going to see serious fee inflation, at least at the very top end.
   669. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:09 PM (#4712191)
The David Luiz fee is reportedly up to FIFTY MILLION POUNDS STERLING.

Look, I know PSG can afford it etc etc, but for David Luiz? It's bad enough Chelsea have oligarch money without them getting a share of sheik money, too.
   670. JuanGone..except1game Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:21 PM (#4712201)
Van Ginkel is the big one

You are right about Van Ginkel, who was a tough loss so early on as he was the one pre-Matic CM that could serve as a metronome to link to the attack. I was suprised that Van Gaal didn't at least take him on the provisional squad with the Strootman loss, so I'm a little worried that he isn't even close to back despite time in training.

Just saw that Craig Bellamy has hung up his boots. I've never been able to reconcile his good reputation for his charity, with his otherwise horrid behaviour on and otherwise off the pitch.
   671. jmurph Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:28 PM (#4712205)
Just saw that Craig Bellamy has hung up his boots. I've never been able to reconcile his good reputation for his charity, with his otherwise horrid behaviour on and otherwise off the pitch.


I certainly enjoyed his time with Manchester City. He played with unparalleled energy, for better or worse, usually for the better. When he and Tevez were both playing hard, they were quite the pressing pair of forwards.

EDIT: I'm also reminded of the fairly epic City-United match in 2009. Bellamy had a great goal from an impossible angle late to tie it up 3-3, but then the late Michael Owen got the winner in the 23rd minute (roughly) of Fergie time. Bastards.
   672. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:47 PM (#4712227)
Bellamy is one of my all time favorite players. He's one of those guys who just seems like a great guy to have as a teammate, always seemed to be working his ass off.
   673. ursus arctos Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:49 PM (#4712230)
Bellamy is probably the closest to a true Jekyll and Hyde of the Premier League era. I know a number of Cardiff and Wales fans who would happily trust their children with him, and yet all the stories are true.
   674. I am going to be Frank Posted: May 23, 2014 at 03:56 PM (#4712235)
United extend Evra for another year. It probably don't preclude a Shaw signing but if United does spend 35M pounds on Shaw he should probably be playing pretty much every game. Don't know if that will happen with Evra around. Maybe Evra will surprise me and be content with 10-15 odd games, but United won't have a ton of extra games next season.
   675. Commissioner Bud Black Beltre Hillman Posted: May 23, 2014 at 05:08 PM (#4712284)
On Donovan, it's pretty hard to separate personal stuff from commitment to the team, given Klinsmann's position. Did any of the other veterans take time off and explicitly participate in USMNT training at reduced intensity? I can see that being a pretty big deal for a coach who's trying to build a youth-topflight culture.

That said, if USMNT were my first rooting choice, I'd be pretty upset about a very good player being left off (and the implication that Klinsmann's focus is on grooming kids for 2018, rather than doing as well as possible in 2014).
   676. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 05:14 PM (#4712287)
Did any of the other veterans take time off and explicitly participate in USMNT training at reduced intensity? I can see that being a pretty big deal for a coach who's trying to build a youth-topflight culture.


Timothy Chandler balked multiple times at playing for the US, Donovan worked his way back on to the World Cup Qualifying team after taking time off. But Chandler is going to Brazil and Donovan isn't. That's hypocritical at best, petty at worst by Klinsmann.
   677. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: May 23, 2014 at 05:21 PM (#4712292)
Maybe the team is planning to intentionally lose all their games, like France in 2010. Then four years later, France's popularity with soccer fans was eclipsed by a similar, much less populous country just to the north.
   678. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 05:24 PM (#4712294)
Canada did score for the first time since the Reagan administration today, so you might be on to something.
   679. The Kentucky Gentleman, Mark Edward Posted: May 23, 2014 at 06:35 PM (#4712346)
Timothy Chandler balked multiple times at playing for the US, Donovan worked his way back on to the World Cup Qualifying team after taking time off. But Chandler is going to Brazil and Donovan isn't. That's hypocritical at best, petty at worst by Klinsmann.


Chandler has the benefits of being younger than Donovan (making it more likely he'll play on future US teams), playing a position that the US is not particularly deep at, and currently being in form. I think the third point is the most overlooked in this whole thing.
   680. DA Baracus Posted: May 23, 2014 at 07:05 PM (#4712365)
Chandler has the benefits of being younger than Donovan (making it more likely he'll play on future US teams), playing a position that the US is not particularly deep at, and currently being in form.


Well, a month ago Chandler returned from being out since February, and played a game and a half. Tough for me to say he's in better form. But even if he is, all those points are irrelevant if Donovan is not on the team for "culture" reasons. Donovan tried to work his way back into the team, Chandler avoided it.
   681. frannyzoo Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:08 AM (#4712550)
A bit drab in the first half of Derby-QPR, punctuated by crosses to nowhere and a stabbing sensation in the Wolves section of my heart every time Kevin Doyle appears on the screen. Rooting for Derby here, although they sacked a Clough to get here. Promotion or administration for QPR?
   682. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:11 AM (#4712552)
Getting into nyc in 15 minutes, hoping to catch the end of the derby qpr match. According to the Google there's a bar that should have the game right at Penn station
   683. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:18 AM (#4712553)
QPR in big trouble now.
   684. Randy Jones Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:22 AM (#4712555)
The red card was the right call though.
   685. ursus arctos Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:23 AM (#4712556)
682, the Irish Times across the street should have the match on.

It is dire, though.

The game, not the pub.
   686. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:38 AM (#4712565)
Got to legends on 33rd. Haven't missed a thing. Have Derby had this much possession all game?
   687. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:39 AM (#4712566)
Ah, I see. Didn't get here in time to see the red.
   688. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:46 AM (#4712567)
Wasted opportunity by Derby there, but it's gotta come the way they're dominating. Unless there's no extra time and I'm completely forgetting it.

Finding myself rooting for qpr now. Guess I really have no strong feelings about this game
   689. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:48 AM (#4712568)
Oh, Derby. No extra time now.
   690. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:50 AM (#4712569)
Talk about a poachers effort. Wow. I'm surrounded by happy qpr fans.

Who was that Derby centerback? Someone needs to put him on suicide watch.
   691. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:50 AM (#4712570)
I feel terrible for Derby and I find myself feeling a bit ill that Fernandes and his schtick is back in the PL. Good on 'Arry and Niko, though.
   692. frannyzoo Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:54 AM (#4712574)
In the Brit dictionary under the word "gutted"...
   693. Randy Jones Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:54 AM (#4712575)
That's rough for Derby, but yeah, terrible defending on the goal.
   694. ursus arctos Posted: May 24, 2014 at 11:57 AM (#4712577)
Good God, Keogh's perfect pass to Zamora is going to go down in playoff history. Nice finish, but there is no way that ever should have been a hint of a chance. Derby's defense appears to have nodded off given that all of the action had been at the other end.
   695. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: May 24, 2014 at 12:03 PM (#4712579)
Just learned some qpr songs. And just got texted by the people I'm meeting that they're on the 7 and inbound. That was a perfect way to kill 30 minutes.

Eta: don't think I can convince my people to spend 2 hours watching the CL final on a gorgeous day, so up Atletico!
   696. puck Posted: May 24, 2014 at 01:11 PM (#4712611)
Who was that Derby centerback? Someone needs to put him on suicide watch.


Who was defending Hoilett on the wing? Add that guy to the list. One guy (a mid) closed on him on the touchline right after the throw and knocked the ball partly away, and this other guy sauntered over as if he's a neutral observer, allowing Hoilett to recover, then decides too late to try to contest the ball and goes down, leaving Hoilett free to make his run and the cutback.
   697. puck Posted: May 24, 2014 at 01:16 PM (#4712615)
Well, I thought the announcers said something about QPR having 170 million (pounds?) in debt. Are they going to stay up this time?
   698. frannyzoo Posted: May 24, 2014 at 01:58 PM (#4712630)
No Arda Turan today...not even on the bench. No Turan, No Party, I'm afraid. Over/under on minutes played by Costa? I'd put the line at about 38.
   699. JuanGone..except1game Posted: May 24, 2014 at 02:17 PM (#4712645)
Ugh, QPR in my life once more.

Edit: CL Prediction if anybody cares: Atletico wins on penalties in 1-1 draw. Koke MOTM.
   700. puck Posted: May 24, 2014 at 02:19 PM (#4712647)
flip
Page 7 of 12 pages ‹ First  < 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 > 

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
HowardMegdal
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogTrading for Price would be right move for Cubs | FOX Sports
(72 - 1:45am, Jul 23)
Last: Mess with the Meat, you get the Wad!

NewsblogOMNICHATTER 7-22-14
(52 - 1:38am, Jul 23)
Last: AT-AT at bat@AT&T

NewsblogChase Headley traded to New York Yankees from San Diego Padres - ESPN New York
(90 - 1:33am, Jul 23)
Last: Walt Davis

NewsblogCowboy Monkey Rodeo taking the Minors by storm
(8 - 1:29am, Jul 23)
Last: spike

NewsblogSports Reference Blog: 1901-02 Orioles Removed from Yankees History
(28 - 1:29am, Jul 23)
Last: SoSHially Unacceptable

SABR - BBTF ChapterWho's going to SABR??
(45 - 1:12am, Jul 23)
Last: Joey Numbaz (Scruff)

NewsblogAs shifts suppress offense, time has come to consider a rule change
(38 - 12:28am, Jul 23)
Last: SoSHially Unacceptable

NewsblogOTP - July 2014: Republicans Lose To Democrats For Sixth Straight Year In Congressional Baseball Game
(2718 - 12:25am, Jul 23)
Last: The Yankee Clapper

NewsblogMLB: Astros telecasts catching on to advanced metrics
(12 - 12:24am, Jul 23)
Last: jwb

NewsblogOT: Monthly NBA Thread- July 2014
(821 - 11:18pm, Jul 22)
Last: robinred

NewsblogFSAZ: D-backs cut off McCarthy’s cutter controversy
(26 - 11:08pm, Jul 22)
Last: billyshears

NewsblogThree Moves The Red Sox Should Make - Tony Massarotti - Boston.com
(35 - 10:24pm, Jul 22)
Last: Select Storage Device

NewsblogOT: The Soccer Thread July, 2014
(318 - 9:58pm, Jul 22)
Last: Darkness and the howling fantods

NewsblogRangers' Yu Darvish Pushes for a Six-Man Pitching Rotation - NYTimes.com
(12 - 9:28pm, Jul 22)
Last: shoewizard

NewsblogTony Oliva turns 76; Gardenhire: 'He should be in hall of fame'
(46 - 9:10pm, Jul 22)
Last: DavidFoss

Page rendered in 0.6472 seconds
53 querie(s) executed