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Monday, December 11, 2017

OTP 11 December, 2017 - GOP strategist: Moore would have ‘date with a baseball bat’ if he tried dating teens where I grew up

“I grew up in Mississippi. Every father I knew, if he saw a guy like Roy Moore in his 30s trying to date his 16-year-old daughter, he would have had a date with a baseball bat,” Stevens, a former aide to Mitt Romney’s campaign, said on CNN’s “Anderson Cooper 360.”

Stevens, who worked on former Alabama Gov. Bob Riley’s (R) primary campaign against Moore in 2006, said Moore has violated the “decency standard” of civil society in his previous alleged pursuit of teenage girls.

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 11, 2017 at 08:53 AM | 2653 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: bats, bats are afraid, politics

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   901. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:34 PM (#5591394)
He's down by 20k now.
   902. This is going to be state of the art wall Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:34 PM (#5591396)
I didn't make a prediction on this one.


You gotta schedule a fight sooner or later.

[888] The Fox News poll was off by 9 points. The Monmouth poll showing a tie was the closest.


ah, interesting though coming from Fox imo. Like to see the methodology. Turnout is by far the hardest thing to gauge and in a special? ha.
   903. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:36 PM (#5591397)
Roy Moore, classy to the end.
   904. SouthSideRyan Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:36 PM (#5591398)
Per http://www.governing.com/gov-data/military-civilian-active-duty-employee-workforce-numbers-by-state.html

There are 8,732 active duty military from Alabama, so every single one of them wouldn't even trigger an 0.5% difference for a recount.
   905. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:37 PM (#5591399)
Alabama SOS is apparently 8 feet tall.
   906. Joe Bivens Recognizes the Kenyan Precedent Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:37 PM (#5591400)
Ray said he wouldn't have voted for Moore. He would have let the good people of AL do that dirty work for him so he wouldn't have to.
   907. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:37 PM (#5591401)
Roy Moore's concession speech is not a concession, but a call to storm the Secretary of State's office... and a recount promise.

FWIW - NYT now showing all precincts in - final margin of 1.6% - roughly 21,000 votes.

EDIT: Cokes...
   908. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:38 PM (#5591402)
You all act surprised that Moore isn't taking "no" for an answer.
   909. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:38 PM (#5591403)
Moore will not concede. His spokesdude calling for a re-count because God is in control.


There are still several uncounted districts in Emmaus and Gethsemane.
   910. This is going to be state of the art wall Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:38 PM (#5591404)
Ha, this one's over. Moore is out on his own.
   911. 6 - 4 - 3 Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:39 PM (#5591405)
"Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?!?" - Roy Moore
   912. Ray (CTL) Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:40 PM (#5591406)
Ray said he wouldn't have voted for Moore. He would have let the good people of AL do that dirty work for him so he wouldn't have to.


Not sure why you're obsessed with me. Is your life this boring? I'm glad he lost.
   913. Joe Bivens Recognizes the Kenyan Precedent Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:41 PM (#5591407)
Good for you Ray. Good for you.
   914. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:41 PM (#5591409)
You all act surprised that Moore isn't taking "no" for an answer.


That's good - but I'd have gone with something like the results are still young and fresh.... perfect time for a' courtin'!
   915. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:43 PM (#5591410)
See? Roy Moore brings people together.
   916. Joe Bivens Recognizes the Kenyan Precedent Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:44 PM (#5591411)
I would have went with "y'all".
   917. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:46 PM (#5591413)
Trump was surprisingly gracious. For him at least, not a normal person.


Congratulations to Doug Jones on a hard fought victory. The write-in votes played a very big factor, but a win is a win. The people of Alabama are great, and the Republicans will have another shot at this seat in a very short period of time. It never ends!


I'd suspect that someone on staff wrote that with his cadence, but I imagine if someone tried to take him off Twitter by force, he'd nuke somewhere.
   918. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:48 PM (#5591414)
Probably that damn lawyer stealing his phone again.
   919. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:48 PM (#5591415)
Trump:
It never ends!


Who would have guessed that Trump was such a Sam Kinison fan?
   920. Sleepy's not going to blame himself Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:50 PM (#5591416)
It's rather amusing to see Hannity and Bannon/Breitbart get all pissy about Mitch McConnell.
If only Mitch McConnell had formally announced that he would kick the R candidate out of the Senate, more good folks would have voted for said candidate. Deep State!
   921. SouthSideRyan Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:52 PM (#5591417)
Ray did say he wouldn't vote for Moore because he was a child molester, but he sure seemed to be warming up that football spiking arm on page 1 of this thread.
   922. Joe Bivens Recognizes the Kenyan Precedent Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:55 PM (#5591419)
Ray is a Dancing Monkey. Period.
   923. Ray (CTL) Posted: December 12, 2017 at 11:57 PM (#5591420)
You guys are insane. You can't stop making it about me even though I wanted to see him lose also.
   924. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:00 AM (#5591421)
Ray, page 1:
Keep wondering why you lose elections to people like Trump and Moore. Eventually you might understand something about the subject other than OUTRAEG.


Trump and Moore? Doug Jones just beat Trump and Moore. That analysis might be OBSOLTEE.
   925. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:03 AM (#5591423)
Page 1 has always been over.
   926. Random Transaction Generator Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:04 AM (#5591424)
another shot at this seat in a very short period of time.


There is no way Trump wrote that line.

Why would he say "in a very short period of time" when we all know he'd say "soon" instead? He's a twitter-fanatic, so he's use the easier short form instead.
   927. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:05 AM (#5591426)
In this election, the Lord God did make His divine will known: Judge? Not.
   928. greenback is on a break Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:06 AM (#5591427)
Ray said he wouldn't have voted for Moore. He would have let the good people of AL do that dirty work for him so he wouldn't have to.

In fairness to the Rays of Alabama, write-ins made the difference. That doesn't account for turnout, which seems to have been less than enthusiastic for Moore.
   929. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:11 AM (#5591428)
There is no way Trump wrote that line.

Why would he say "in a very short period of time" when we all know he'd say "soon" instead? He's a twitter-fanatic, so he's use the easier short form instead.


No, that's Trump. He uses that phrase a lot when speaking.
   930. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:11 AM (#5591429)
Why would he say "in a very short period of time" when we all know he'd say "soon" instead? He's a twitter-fanatic, so he's use the easier short form instead.

He had to make sure something was really awkwardly worded.

I hope someone tells him that "in a very short period of time" is when he's up for election, just for the chimpout.
   931. Shredder Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:22 AM (#5591432)
Couple of thoughts:

1) The Republicans probably lost this election way back when Bentley chose Strange to replace Sessions. There were a lot of negative rumblings toward Strange since Strange was investigating Bentley at the time of his appointment. He was a damaged candidate going into the primary, which led to Moore winning the nomination, which led to the Republicans losing the election. Good job, idiots.

2) A lot of Republican legislators will hand wave this publicly and blame the election on Moore having more baggage than O'Hare on Thanksgiving weekend, and they may be right. But has there been one special election where the Dems didn't run WAY ahead of expectations? I mean, sure, they've lost most of them, but most of them have been historically safe Republican seats that turned into actual races, and maybe would have been even closer if the Dems thought they had a real chance at winning. That fact has to be REALLY scary for Republicans in Arizona and Nevada, and hell, maybe even in Tennessee. Meanwhile, Nelson, Tester, Heitkamp, McCaskill, Donnelly, and Manchin are breathing a little easier tonight. Long way to next November though.

3) We now know the baseline in Alabama. Dems can win if they run against lawless pedophile endorsed by one of the most unpopular presidents in history at this point in his first term. Guessing we're not going to see that lightning striking twice.
   932. greenback is on a break Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:24 AM (#5591433)
WaPo's exit polling shows Moore won 68-30 among whites. Crikey.
   933. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:27 AM (#5591434)
Alex Burns' twitter "Choose your own adventure" is probably a pretty good roadmap - I mean, it's literally a case where every Republican picked the "The Dragon eats you!" choice on every decision page.

   934. Shredder Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:29 AM (#5591435)
Moore will not concede. His spokesdude calling for a re-count because God is in control.
I've never understood this media obsession with conceding an election. It has no legal effect, right? It's not like throwing in the towel in a fight. I mean, if someone concedes, and they count the rest of the votes, and that guy wins, it's not like the other guy can say "No takebacks, dude, you already conceded!" I understand it' a message to supporters and such, but just once I'd like a candidate to say "I'm not going to concede, because that's a meaningless gesture, and I'm just going to let them count the votes. When they're all counted, a winner will be declared, and whether I accept the result really won't matter."
   935. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:38 AM (#5591436)
   936. This is going to be state of the art wall Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:40 AM (#5591437)
I've never understood this media concession with conceding an election. It has no legal effect, right? It's not like throwing in the towel in a fight. I mean, if someone concedes, and they count the rest of the votes, and that guy wins, it's not like the other guy can say "No takebacks, dude, you already conceded!" I understand it' a message to supporters and such, but just once I'd like a candidate to say "I'm not going to concede, because that's a meaningless gesture, and I'm just going to let them count the votes. When they're all counted, a winner will be declared, and whether I accept the result really won't matter."


because it's part of the drapery. conceding when down more than the margin for an auto-recount is basically pro-forma -- it's what you do as a candidate. I mean, especially when your party controls 100% of the voting mechanisms in the state.

At a certain point, it's unseemly and anti-democratic protesting too much when you were defeated fair and square.

The media, at least some of it, recognizes the sometimes rigid formalities that dignify American Democracy. "Accurate and fair vote counting", at least when you control all the patronage (like the GOP does in 'Bama) and losing is more than time to concede. You tried. In fact, you had an inherent advantage, a big one, and still lost. It's over.
   937. Joe Bivens Recognizes the Kenyan Precedent Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:40 AM (#5591438)
Ah yes post 6 of this very thread. A precious lecture from Dancing Monkey #4, Little Lord Fauntleray, who in one sentence said he wouldn't vote for Moore because hecwas a child molester, and then very soon after said that only children base their vote on one issue. Doofus. Get in your jammies and go night nights, child.
   938. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:49 AM (#5591439)
3) We now know the baseline in Alabama. Dems can win if they run against lawless pedophile endorsed by one of the most unpopular presidents in history at this point in his first term. Guessing we're not going to see that lightning striking twice.


Meh - yes and no.

I mean, Jones isn't anything close to the raging liberal that the alleged totes-not-Moore-fans still attempted to paint him as - but I do think it's fair to say that he's actually a bit left of the Manchins/Donnelly/etc. That is to say -- he's basically a mainstream Democrat. Certainly to the right of, say, Obama - but not outlier so.

So sure - he beat an awful candidate by just 1.5 points.... but he actually didn't even run as, say, a Bob Casey on abortion.

In short - he actually ran as a Democrat that could conceivably win a primary in a blue state... not necessarily a progressive favorite by any stretch - but a guy that, at least, wouldn't be giving a left-flank opponent a big enough opening to truly take him down.

THAT'S what leaves me optimistic... He won in basically the reddest of red states as a no-apologies Democrat. I'm fine with the big tent. I'm fine with majorities requiring Manchins and Heitkamps and Donnelly's in plenty of places.

He certainly didn't run ON those core D social issues -- but neither did he disavow or run away from what is essentially vanilla Democrat.

   939. Shredder Posted: December 13, 2017 at 12:53 AM (#5591440)
I was at the Civic Opera House tonight in Chicago to see The National. They're big Democrats. Matt Berninger asked how Roy Moore was doing at a time when Moore was looking good. When they called it for Jones there was some rumbling in the crowd. Word got out, some people started chanting, and when Berninger repeated what he'd heard about the results, there weren't many people in the building who weren't pretty happy. Also, it was a great show, at a really cool venue for a rock concert. Also saw them earlier this Forest Hills stadium. Definitely recommend seeing a show there to New Yorkers. They've done a nice job with the venue, and it's got really good acoustics for an outdoor venue. Also cool being at the stadium where Arthur Ashe won the U.S. Open.
   940. Mark Edward Posted: December 13, 2017 at 01:17 AM (#5591441)
I was at the Civic Opera House tonight in Chicago to see The National. They're big Democrats. Matt Berninger asked how Roy Moore was doing at a time when Moore was looking good. When they called it for Jones there was some rumbling in the crowd. Word got out, some people started chanting, and when Berninger repeated what he'd heard about the results, there weren't many people in the building who weren't pretty happy.


I was at that show too! I was on the 5th floor and when I heard the commotion from the crowd it kinda sounded like protesters and I wondered who would protest a National show. And the band seemed so genuinely excited to hear Jones won.

Also the show was excellent. I picked up a ticket on StubHub a few days ago and paid way too much for it but happy I went.
   941. Shredder Posted: December 13, 2017 at 01:31 AM (#5591443)
Also the show was excellent. I picked up a ticket on StubHub a few days ago and paid way too much for it but happy I went.
We were also on the fifth floor, row E, aisle 6. That place almost sounded a little too good. We'll be on the 4th floor tomorrow night (my wife is kind of a National superfan). We got our tickets in the pre-sale though and paid face. Could have used a little more "Trouble Will Find Me", but similar to the set they played Queens.
   942. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 02:12 AM (#5591444)
It both heartens and surprises me that a tiny majority of Alabamians reject the most objectionable candidate I've seen in my 20 years paying attention to this stuff.
Minority. Jones got 49.9%, according to the figures I've seen.

The write-ins were not a huge number -- 1.7% -- but that's bigger than the difference between the main two candidates -- 1.5%. Presumably the write-ins were almost all Republicans who couldn't bring themselves to vote for either the child molester or the pro-abortion guy. I wonder how much Shelby's comments mattered. Shelby had denounced Moore when the child molesting first came to light, but the other day he expressly announced he couldn't support the guy and that he was going to vote write-in.
   943. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 02:26 AM (#5591445)

I've never understood this media concession with conceding an election. It has no legal effect, right? It's not like throwing in the towel in a fight. I mean, if someone concedes, and they count the rest of the votes, and that guy wins, it's not like the other guy can say "No takebacks, dude, you already conceded!"
As we know from 2000, where Gore in fact did take back his concession.
   944. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 02:38 AM (#5591446)

Big rebuke to Trump, who has shown once again that -- contrary to Ray and Dilbert's and TGF's and SBB's portrayal -- he has the political instincts of Mike Dukakis, and is not the leader of a movement. Bigger rebuke to Bannon, who (unlike Trump) was all-in for Moore for no obvious reason except a desire to say #### you to the GOP. Bannon recently threatened to primary every Republican member of the Senate other than Cruz. Somehow I think this becomes a less compelling threat than before. Bannon is now not the brilliant strategist who put Trump in the WH; he's the guy who handed Alabama to the Democrats.

But I wonder what this does to Kay Ivey and most of the rest of the Alabama GOP, who decided to double down on Moore after the child molesting came to light. They could've tried to replace him on the ballot, could've tried to force him out or to organize a write-in campaign, or the like. They did neither. In fact, they came out forcefully and told all the other Republicans in Alabama to fall in line behind Moore or else.
   945. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 03:07 AM (#5591447)

Wow, I had missed this, but Sam Wang apparently once again beclowned himself. (Note that Wang apparently decided to delete the original tweet to hide his idiocy.) Nobody should take his analyses seriously, because he doesn't understand what he's analyzing. Manipulating numbers without knowing what they measure is useless. (Note that I am not criticizing him for the prediction itself, which was not crazy; I am criticizing him for the way he came up with it.)
   946. Srul Itza At Home Posted: December 13, 2017 at 03:25 AM (#5591449)
Bigger rebuke to Bannon, who (unlike Trump) was all-in for Moore for no obvious reason except a desire to say #### you to the GOP. Bannon recently threatened to primary every Republican member of the Senate other than Cruz. Somehow I think this becomes a less compelling threat than before.


The best Democrat move would be to ridicule, bait and troll Bannon unmercifully, as being washed up, powerless and now not even going to dare try to primary anyone. That might be just the kind of thing to get him to double down on backing the most extreme, and thus potentially least electable, Republican candidates. Of course, the Democrats, being Democrats, could still find a way to lose to a guy who campaigned in a white hood with a swastika armband accessory, but it might help in some places.
   947. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: December 13, 2017 at 06:58 AM (#5591456)
You all act surprised that Moore isn't taking "no" for an answer.

Heh primey.
   948. manchestermets Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:15 AM (#5591458)
It both heartens and surprises me that a tiny majority of Alabamians reject the most objectionable candidate I've seen in my 20 years paying attention to this stuff.

Minority. Jones got 49.9%, according to the figures I've seen.

The write-ins were not a huge number -- 1.7% -- but that's bigger than the difference between the main two candidates -- 1.5%. Presumably the write-ins were almost all Republicans who couldn't bring themselves to vote for either the child molester or the pro-abortion guy. I wonder how much Shelby's comments mattered. Shelby had denounced Moore when the child molesting first came to light, but the other day he expressly announced he couldn't support the guy and that he was going to vote write-in.


So if the 1.7% rejected Moore as well as the 49.9%, there's your majority. Although the argument then becomes about the definition of tiny.
   949. McCoy Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:27 AM (#5591460)
Nn
   950. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:45 AM (#5591462)
Biggest losers were Moore, Bannon, and Trump, but somewhere on that list is Al Franken; if Moore were elected, Franken would've argued that "If he can be here, so can I," and rescinded his resignation.
   951. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:46 AM (#5591463)
948: yeah. I knee-jerkedly responded to people saying "majority" when the winner only had a plurality, but in this case they were talking about Moore, so yeah: a majority opposed him.
   952. BDC Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:54 AM (#5591464)
Various comments in this thread got me thinking about abortion as a political issue – not much WRT Doug Jones, but more generally. Abortion is, as several here have noted, a white-hot issue in all sorts of communities – drive across flyover country on US highways instead of the interstate, and you are likely to see not only tons of signs and displays against abortion, but you actually have a good chance of coming across demonstrators and people engaged in vigils and what-not.

And yet … there are well over half a million abortions in the US every year. Those women cannot all be Democrats.

Abortion is a fact of American life. It fuels political movements. Republicans are happy to line up against it, to de-fund it, to make access near-impossible for rural and poor women. But it is part of their lives too. It seems to be one of those issues where getting one's way would be politically disastrous. Actually banning abortion, if enacted in red states after a hypothetical overturning of Roe v. Wade, would be a political nightmare for the substantial number of middle-class suburban Republicans who take access to abortion for granted, while opposing it at the polls.

I wonder what a humane world where abortion was banned would look like. It would have to involve extreme openness about sexuality, lavish promotion of contraception, socialized (basically free) pre-natal and obstetric care, profuse expenditure on child-care, ample social services (adoption, foster-care) to provide for unwanted children. How many abortion opponents want such a world? If it involves taking a nickel extra in taxes to support some child of some Other that they don't want to see born or aborted?

It often seems to me that conservative right-to-lifers, at heart, want pregnancy to serve as a punishment for promiscuity. I would respect an anti-choice movement that said "we are coupling anti-abortion policies with maximum efforts to help raise children and to prevent unwanted pregnancies." But that seems a pipe-dream.
   953. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 07:59 AM (#5591465)
Biggest losers were Moore, Bannon, and Trump, but somewhere on that list is Al Franken; if Moore were elected, Franken would've argued that "If he can be here, so can I," and rescinded his resignation.


You can't know that. It is possible, but personally I doubt it. In any event the good people of MN would very likely give him the boot next cycle he was up for election anyway and I doubt he would want that.
   954. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:01 AM (#5591466)
Regarding dlf's comments about Jones and abortion, most notably #767, here was the video clip of Jones on MTP from late September. I was clearly right the first time around. Abortion-on-demand. It was unambiguous. That he attempted to clean up the mess *weeks* later in the referenced article doesn't change that.
   955. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:15 AM (#5591467)
Biggest losers were Moore, Bannon, and Trump, but somewhere on that list is Al Franken; if Moore were elected, Franken would've argued that "If he can be here, so can I," and rescinded his resignation.
Bingo. And although, like most here, I'm a process>results guy, Ted Cruz walks away from this mess a winner: The voters of Alabama decided and we'll respect the results.
   956. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:21 AM (#5591468)
This is probably the wrong thread for this, but it appears Nick Saban received at least one vote for Senate.


if Moore were elected, Franken would've argued that "If he can be here, so can I," and rescinded his resignation.
Bingo.


You can be in favor of Franken resigning and still find the GOP's equalization of his and Moore's infractions pathetic, miserable, and stupid.


I knee-jerkedly responded to people saying "majority" when the winner only had a plurality

I have a difficult time believing this happened.
   957. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:23 AM (#5591470)
You can't know that. It is possible, but personally I doubt it.
Why do you think he resigned at some indefinite point in the future rather than just stepping down?
In any event the good people of MN would very likely give him the boot next cycle he was up for election anyway and I doubt he would want that.
If the polls reflected that in two years, he could save face by declining to run, after having three years to prepare a soft landing for himself.
   958. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:25 AM (#5591471)
This is probably the wrong thread for this, but it appears Nick Saban received at least one vote for Senate. I assume it will end up more than that.
I haven't checked the history but an Alabama politico once told me that Bear Bryant's influence in the state was so extensive that no one dared bring a minor-league baseball team into the state until after he had passed.
   959. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:25 AM (#5591472)
Uh oh!

He is advising the White House to "reconsider" the nomination of Jeff Mateer, who was selected to become a federal judge in Texas. He said the White House "should not proceed" on the nomination of Brett Talley, whom Trump picked to become a federal judge in Alabama.

"I've advised the White House they ought to reconsider," he said as he left a Judiciary Committee hearing. "I would advise the White House not to proceed."


What radical Democrat is this? Some evil liberal plot by the ABA or other Cathedral affiliated organization? Who would dare speak out against the beloved picks of GOP President (and Clapper)?

Oh, never mind. It is just Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley(R) (Link). Let's here again about how great Trump's judicial picks are, shall we?

As CNN first reported, Mateer said in 2015 that transgender children are part of "Satan's plan." His home state senator, Republican John Cornyn, is taking issue with the fact that Mateer did not disclose the speeches where he made the eyebrow-raising remarks.

"On the Mateer case, he did not disclose the information before the judicial evaluation committee," he said. "That's a serious breach of protocol."

Meanwhile, controversy has built around Talley since he was approved by the Judiciary Committee last month. An online comment he wrote in 2011 surfaced defending the early KKK. He also didn't disclose his wife's top White House job as a potential conflict of interest on his Senate questionnaire.
   960. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:28 AM (#5591474)
If the polls reflected that in two years, he could save face by declining to run, after having three years to prepare a soft landing for himself.

Him skipping the next cycle and running in the one following seems a given.
   961. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:28 AM (#5591475)
Why do you think he resigned at some indefinite point in the future rather than just stepping down?


Because every Democratic vote is critical in the Senate and he doesn't want the tax bill (for example) to slide through in the gap while his chair is empty - I thought that was pretty obvious. He will step down and the place holder candidate will step in. Don't go peddling weird conspiracy theories.
   962. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:31 AM (#5591478)
The New York tabloids are always fun.

I hope Ray doesn't see that.
   963. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:31 AM (#5591479)
[Double post]
   964. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:34 AM (#5591480)
Him skipping the next cycle and running in the one following seems a given.


Possible. Much more likely than him refusing to step down (which could happen, but I really doubt it). Still MN has many many Democratic politicians tanned*, rested, and ready to go - there are no shortage of qualified Democratic candidates.

Note: One of the things that drove Franken to run, is because he (like many) hated the idea of a Republican in Paul Wellstone's seat. He referenced that thought often (way more than he needed to, it seemed like a real thing and not a campaign prop). While obviously the years passed and his mind might have changed, but I still suspect that played a factor in initially deciding to step down rather than fight it out.**

* OK, not really. I mean it is MN after all.
** From a pure campaign political perspective I would have advised him to stick it out and run again. I think it would have been brutal, but typically in these scandals if the politician hunkers down they can ride it out. We have seen that many times on both sides of the aisle. When you resign though, you are basically done.
   965. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:35 AM (#5591481)
The New York tabloids are always fun.
I hope Ray doesn't see that.


1.) What did that poor horse ever do to anyone?
2.) The POST's game is weak by not making Trump the horse.
   966. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:37 AM (#5591483)
Least surprising thing ever - Trump: I said Roy Moore would not be able to win the general election

“The reason I originally endorsed Luther Strange (and his numbers went up mightily), is that I said Roy Moore will not be able to win the General Election,” the president said.

“I was right!” he added. “Roy worked hard but the deck was stacked against him!”


Heh.
   967. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:41 AM (#5591485)
I haven't checked the history but an Alabama politico once told me that Bear Bryant's influence in the state was so extensive that no one dared bring a minor-league baseball team into the state until after he had passed.

Your Alabama politico must have gotten that info from Fox News. Bryant died in 1983, and Birmingham and Montgomery had minor league teams for the greater part of Bryant's coaching tenure. I saw Jim Bouton pitch in Montgomery during the 1978 season when his team was in town, and while Birmingham didn't field a team for a few years in the late 70's, it'd gotten a new one two years before The Bear croaked.
   968. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:44 AM (#5591486)
The New York tabloids are always fun.

I hope Ray doesn't see that.

1.) What did that poor horse ever do to anyone?
2.) The POST's game is weak by not making Trump the horse.


That was the Daily News, not the Trump-loving Post. The Post probably showed Moore being stabbed in the back by a Trojan horse named Shelby.
   969. manchestermets Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:50 AM (#5591489)
The POST's game is weak by not making Trump the horse.


Baby Jesus, Trump - is there anyone you won't try and make a horse?
   970. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:50 AM (#5591490)
I'm a process>results guy, Ted Cruz walks away from this mess a winner.....

As JE dives through last night's dumpster bin and comes up with a half-eaten Buffalo wing.
   971. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:53 AM (#5591491)
As JE dives through last night's dumpster bin and comes up with a half-eaten Buffalo wing.
Snore. You're so predictable.

And to be sure, last night was also a win for the entire Senate.

EDIT: Now let's see if Franken slithers out the door.
   972. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:53 AM (#5591492)
That was the Daily News

GODDAMMIT.

Well, anyhow, my idea was better.
   973. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: December 13, 2017 at 08:59 AM (#5591494)
That was the Daily News

GODDAMMIT.

Well, anyhow, my idea was better.


But my apologizes to the Post. Here was their cover, with the bonus of calling him "Perv Moore".

   974. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:02 AM (#5591495)
But my apologizes to the Post. Here was their cover, with the bonus of calling him "Perv Moore".
OMG, the look on the horse's face is priceless.
   975. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:04 AM (#5591499)
EDIT: Now let's see if Franken slithers out the door.


Maybe he's supposed to give Jabba the Farenthold a ride out of town....
   976. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:06 AM (#5591501)
Maybe he's supposed to give Jabba the Farenthold a ride out of town....
Isn't this poster one of the yahoos who's always bleating about whataboutism, not that he has a clue how it works?
   977. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:08 AM (#5591504)
I see those nefarious text message exchanges between Strzok and Page have been released....

And it would appear that Bernie Sanders, Eric Holder, John Kasich, and Martin O'Malley also get immunity from investigations. Why, if I didn't know any better - I'd say that they have a decidedly negative view of Trump AND politicians generally.
   978. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:12 AM (#5591507)
I see those nefarious text message exchanges between Strzok and Page have been released....
LOL. Yeah, that's how this works. Damn, you really weren't ready for Canadian winters.
   979. PreservedFish Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:12 AM (#5591508)
OMG, the look on the horse's face is priceless.


Yeah, they ####### nailed it with that photo.
   980. Random Transaction Generator Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:13 AM (#5591509)
Savage post on Reddit today about Moore not conceding and demanding a recount:

"His reaction to losing is so childish I'm surprised he's not trying to #### it."
   981. Stormy JE Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:15 AM (#5591510)
"His reaction to losing is so childish I'm surprised he's not trying to #### it."
Moore should've hired Podesta to work the crowd.
   982. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:16 AM (#5591511)
"His reaction to losing is so childish I'm surprised he's not trying to #### it."


He knows how this bread is buttered... All he needs to do is bang the drum for a day or two, let a day's worth of cable TV sink in on Trump, start bellowing about fraud - and Trump will join him.

By all means, I support this -- win afterglow is a boring Christmas present... I'd much rather that the Trump/Moore GOP spend another couple weeks reminding the country of the Trump/Moore GOP.
   983. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:17 AM (#5591512)
Moore should've hired Podesta to work the crowd.


You don't have to be an elected official in DC to book a pizza party at Comet Pizza and Ping Pong.
   984. BrianBrianson Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:19 AM (#5591514)
Huh. A (D) in Alabama. Who'd've thunk it?

By-elections come with all their own issues, and can't really be extrapolated to the larger context. But if I were a Democrat, I'd be proper chuffed.
   985. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:20 AM (#5591515)

Wow, I had missed this, but Sam Wang apparently once again beclowned himself. (Note that Wang apparently decided to delete the original tweet to hide his idiocy.) Nobody should take his analyses seriously, because he doesn't understand what he's analyzing. Manipulating numbers without knowing what they measure is useless. (Note that I am not criticizing him for the prediction itself, which was not crazy; I am criticizing him for the way he came up with it.)


It's shocking how bad at this Wang is. Nate's not 100% right by any means, but you can see in Nate's analyses that he understands the dynamics of a situation and can identify where he may be wrong. Wang has no such awareness as he's displayed publicly multiple times. It's crazy how a PhD in a mathematical field can't seem to understand propagation of uncertainty or that errors can be correlated.

When us sabermetric barbarians stormed the conventional wisdom gates in baseball, at least the existing chucklefucks hadn't given each other PhD's in general managing or anything.
   986. Greg K Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:24 AM (#5591517)
I think you guys misunderstood the purpose Daily News link.

Forget the horse. Four and a half stars for the new Star Wars? That's the real outrage.
   987. PreservedFish Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:27 AM (#5591521)
Four and a half stars for the new Star Wars?


I thought this said "four and a half hours."
   988. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:28 AM (#5591523)
Forget the horse. Four and a half stars for the new Star Wars? That's the real outrage.

What's the problem? Do they insult the Queen or something?


I thought this said "four and a half hours."

I wish.
   989. PreservedFish Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:32 AM (#5591525)
Yeah I was mixed. I mean, 4.5 hours is too ####### long. But the reviews are all raves, so I was thinking, if it's that damn entertaining over 4.5 hours, wow, it must really be something!
   990. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:35 AM (#5591528)
By-elections come with all their own issues, and can't really be extrapolated to the larger context. But if I were a Democrat, I'd be proper chuffed.


Yes and no. Yes in that Democrats can't (and don't) expect to win in such super red areas as Alabama come 2018 or 2020. No, however, because some trends from all the "off" elections can be teased out.

A Suburban Shellacking

New York Times: “Voters in Alabama’s cities and most affluent suburbs overwhelmingly rejected Mr. Moore’s candidacy, an ominous sign for Republicans on the ballot next year in upscale districts. In Jefferson County, which includes Birmingham and some of the state’s wealthiest enclaves, Mr. Jones, the Democratic candidate, captured more than 68% of the vote. And in Madison County, home to Huntsville and a large NASA facility, Mr. Jones won 57 percent of the vote.”


It is ominous, because we have seen in multiple elections since last election (and to a lesser extent in Trump's own election), the suburbs turn sharply against the GOP. If that holds true into 2018 and/or 2020 and that is real bad news for the GOP.

For myself I would rather the GOP keep going as it is. Stay harnessed to Trump and his "popularity", but go ahead and ditch all his potentially populist and popular campaign ideas and instead run on the pure culture war, xenophobic and plutocrat platform. That is sure to be a winner for the GOP in the next few cycles.

Everything passed through reconciliation and by executive order can be undone the same way.
   991. McCoy Posted: December 13, 2017 at 09:56 AM (#5591538)
Oh no, Omarosa is resigning. The braintrust is falling apart!
   992. Greg K Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:08 AM (#5591543)
Forget the horse. Four and a half stars for the new Star Wars? That's the real outrage.

What's the problem? Do they insult the Queen or something?


Nah I just figured I'd try and start a pop culture flame war.

The second season of The Crown is getting into some pretty delicate subject matter though. Although, there was a "Queen giving a blow job" scene in season one, so I guess showing a little bit of royal marital discord is hardly pushing the envelope for the show.
   993. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:11 AM (#5591544)
"I hope Senator-elect Doug Jones will do the right thing and truly represent Alabama by choosing to vote with the Senate Republican Majority."

- National Republican Senatorial Committee chairman Cory Gardner in a post-election statement asking Democratic senator-elect Doug Jones to vote Republican.
   994. PreservedFish Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:13 AM (#5591546)
"I hope Senator-elect Doug Jones will do the right thing and truly represent Alabama by choosing to vote with the Senate Republican Majority."


Ha. I see the argument. It's a cute request.
   995. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:14 AM (#5591547)
So...

I miss anything last night? ;)
   996. simon bedford Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:16 AM (#5591548)
Some guy was told to get lost and the horse he rode in on apparently Charlie.
   997. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:18 AM (#5591550)
It's a cute request.

You're right about me being grumpy, because unlike you, my first thought was that Doug Jones' official response should be something like this, with less warmth.
   998. Der-K: downgraded to lurker Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:20 AM (#5591551)
952: Long ago, I was a pro-life dem and wanted a world that is much like what you described, BDC.

That Gardner line is funny.
   999. Zonk, Genius of the Stables Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:20 AM (#5591552)
So.... thinking back to the shoulda never been close anyway, but damn House losses in MT, KS, and GA... I guess if you're going to break through and snag just one of those Aboministration seats - you'd obviously pick the Senate seat in Alabama.

   1000. Lassus Posted: December 13, 2017 at 10:24 AM (#5591554)
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