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Monday, September 11, 2017

OTP 11 September 2017: Hurricane Irma wreaking havoc on minor league baseball playoffs

There are 18 minor league affiliations that play playoffs every season, and those playoffs all have different formats – some with one wild card, some with split first-half/second-half winners, some with a required 8-10 team playoff grouping. This season, the issues caused by Hurricane Irma will lead to 3 of those 18 championships being cancelled and turned into co-champions.

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:54 AM | 1783 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: minor league baseball, minor leagues, playoffs, politics

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   101. Traderdave Posted: September 11, 2017 at 02:48 PM (#5529789)
These Hillary 2020 posts are so mundane. When can we get to the REAL excitement: negotiating the terms of the cash wagers over whether or not she'll run, followed by three years of chatter about who was too afraid to bet, who might welch on their bet, and regular reminders that the bet is on?


Seems as good a time as any to remind all of my wager with DLF on the S&P 500 the date of the '18 midterms. The wager is a bottle of decent bourbon (definition of "decent" covered at length in prior thread) and I have the under. I spotted him a 10% or so right off the top. I was amazed that only he took such a sucker bet like that.
   102. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 02:48 PM (#5529790)
On September 11, Fox News' Brian Kilmeade makes history come alive for the viewers of today:
Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke:
"Today is really a memorial for the 40 passengers. We're going to talk to the families that are here [at the Flight 93 National Memorial in Pennsylvania]. We were here yesterday dedicating a chime with 40 chimes, the design of it. Shovel groundbreaking for that portion of the monument. We’re really reflecting on how great this country is, the sacrifices we have made, and also talking about the change that 9/11 brought to all Americans."

Brian Kilmeade: "Do you worry 100 years from now someone is going to try to take that memorial down like they are trying to remake our memorials today?"
   103. PreservedFish Posted: September 11, 2017 at 02:59 PM (#5529797)


Seems as good a time as any to remind all of my wager with DLF on the S&P 500 the date of the '18 midterms. The wager is a bottle of decent bourbon (definition of "decent" covered at length in prior thread) and I have the under. I spotted him a 10% or so right off the top. I was amazed that only he took such a sucker bet like that.


What's the over-under line set at?
   104. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:01 PM (#5529801)
Brian Kilmeade: "Do you worry 100 years from now someone is going to try to take that memorial down like they are trying to remake our memorials today?"


I thought of a better one of these:

How long before the left implements straight-to-gay conversion camps?
   105. Greg K Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:05 PM (#5529804)
Speaking of humorous 9/11 references...one of the funner moments of The Big Sick was an example of what a failed joke looks like.

Kumail: You've never talked to people about 9/11?
Terry: No what's your, what's your stance?
Kumail: What's my stance on 9/11? Oh um, anti. It was a tragedy, I mean we lost 19 of our best guys.
Beth: Huh?
   106. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:05 PM (#5529806)
I remember starting Mean Streets once, quite awhile ago actually, and finding it so dull that I didn't bother finishing it. Maybe a re-watch would have a different result.

You really should give it a second try. The one I found dull as dishwater was Scorsese's first feature, Who's That Knocking At My Door?, though ironically John Cassavettes used his fondness for that movie as a springboard for talking Scorsese into making another film based on his own experiences, which turned out to be Mean Streets. Mean Streets is just terrific in so many ways, especially considering it was directed by a 31-year-old.

And speaking of off-the-chart great films, did anyone else watch or record Jim Jarmusch's Night on Earth when TCM ran it early Sunday morning? I've been wanting to grab that for about 25 years, and it was worth the wait, especially on a double bill with Taxi Driver. That New York segment with "Helmut" and Rosie Perez is positively sublime, and the L.A. part with Winona Ryder is pretty damn good, too.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Andy's the guy saying, "I vastly prefer unicorn juice to diet coke! And I'm on record saying so for quite some time! How DARE you imply that I'm a fan of diet coke?!". And when the bartender says, "We don't have unicorn juice. Nobody has unicorn juice. It doesn't exist. So what will you have?", Andy replies, "Diet coke.".


Well, that, plus the fact that he has never actually sought out a bar that doesn't serve Diet Coke, has never asked bars to stop serving Diet Coke, and denigrates anyone else who criticizes Diet Coke.


Recognizing your obsession with Andy, zenbitz's #73 is briefer (how couldn't it be? ZING!) and more accurate.

I know one thing: Of all the people around here, other than possibly Lassus, I'm probably the one who least needs to put Diet anything on my table. That crap is nasty even to look at, let alone swallow.

   107. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:05 PM (#5529807)
How long before the left implements straight-to-gay conversion camps?


aka the Federal Prison System...
   108. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:06 PM (#5529808)
How long before the left implements straight-to-gay conversion camps?


Bah. You want crazy?
Alex Jones Says Trump Is Being Secretly Drugged (Link NOT to Alex Jones. Why? Because I don't hate everything good in the universe)

Ladies and gentlemen, I was told this by high level sources and it was evident and especially after Reagan was shot in his first year in office when he was acting like Trump, and doing the right things, that he never really recovered. They gave him cold blood, and his transfusion that causes brain damage. They slowly gave him small amounts of sedatives. It’s known that most presidents end up getting drugged. Small dosages of sedatives till they build it up, Trump’s such a bull he hasn’t fully understood it yet.

But I’ve talked to people, multiple ones, and they believe that they are putting a slow sedative that they’re building up that’s also addictive in his Diet Cokes and in his iced tea and that the president by 6 or 7 at night is basically slurring his words and is drugged. Now first they had to isolate him to do that. But yes, ladies and gentleman, I’ve talked to people that talk to the president now at 9 at night, he is slurring his words. And I’m going to leave it at that. I’ve talked to folks that have talked to him directly…

Now I’m risking my life, by the way, to tell you all this… They drug presidents because the power structure wants a puppet. The president needs his blood tested by an outside physician he trusts.”
   109. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:10 PM (#5529811)
"cold blood?" Who drugged Reagan, Truman Capote?

It’s known that most presidents end up getting drugged.


Then I guess Clinton & Obama are off the hook, then?
   110. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:10 PM (#5529812)
Mocking those who suffer injustice and racial discrimination because some people don't suffer injustice and racial discrimination would be something you'd support.

I more support you not making things up, but that certainly hasn't made a difference.
   111. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:13 PM (#5529817)
"Night on Earth" is indeed great.
   112. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:16 PM (#5529819)
Can someone explain to me #99 by Gonfalon and #100 by Traderdave?


I was wondering that myself...
   113. Covfefe Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:17 PM (#5529821)
Now I’m risking my life, by the way, to tell you all this…


...because it's a medical fact that high levels of stupid can be toxic.
   114. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:17 PM (#5529822)
Another source on Bannon and his waging war against the GOP. Link

The target list includes Tennessee Sen. Bob Corker, Mississippi Sen. Roger Wicker, Alabama Sen. Luther Strange, Nevada Sen. Dean Heller and Arizona Sen. Jeff Flake, the source said.


I wonder if Clapper will explain to them that they have nothing to worry about?
   115. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:18 PM (#5529823)
Can someone explain to me #99 by Gonfalon and #100 by Traderdave?


Quote attempt gone wrong?
   116. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:19 PM (#5529824)
Can someone explain to me #99 by Gonfalon and #100 by Traderdave?
I was wondering that myself...


I think it was a mistakenly formatted quote, then just a correction for the flip. (why I edited by initial inquiry)


Or, Traderdave and Gonfalon are the same person, which would be a HOF sockpuppet performance.
   117. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:22 PM (#5529826)
Or, Traderdave and Gonfalon are the same person, which would be a HOF sockpuppet performance.


Right? It had me going "Wait...but...I thought..."
   118. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:22 PM (#5529827)
"Night on Earth" is indeed great.

Any New Yorker who doesn't relish that New York segment can't possibly be a real New Yorker.
   119. Traderdave Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:23 PM (#5529828)
It was my quote attempt gone wrong. #101 is what is should have been


   120. madvillain Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:27 PM (#5529831)
The president needs his blood tested by an outside physician he trusts.”


take your own advice, nut.
   121. Covfefe Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:32 PM (#5529833)
Another source on Bannon and his waging war against the GOP. Link


The target list includes Tennessee Sen. Bob Corker, Mississippi Sen. Roger Wicker, Alabama Sen. Luther Strange, Nevada Sen. Dean Heller and Arizona Sen. Jeff Flake, the source said.


I wonder if that's what led Corker to suddenly be less than sure he wants to bother running again.

In any case, I cannot help but think that this just goes to show the intellectual rot that has infested the new GOP scions...

I suppose you can make a 'populist' case against Corker -- Democrats have certainly tried to do so (as I said last page, there's no greater ally of the predatory payday loan industry) -- but it ought to be painfully obvious that this all about nothing but cult of personality sentiment regarding a few recent Corker statements (hey - by all means, Breitbart/Bannon - prove me wrong).

Flake? That's nothing BUT cult of personality opposition... Calling him some kind of RINO is ludicrous. I suppose if you want to go after him for being part of the infamous Gang of Eight... but yeesh.

And what's with Wicker on the list? What apostasy is he guilty of? Hell - he's a legendary pork barreler, and while I could see Norquistian or debt-obsessed folks taking issue with that, "populism" is virtually engaged with pork.

Four Senators that have voted - to the best of my knowledge - 100% for whatever the Bannon/Trump contingent have advocated them voting.

But whatever... not my party. I'll just once again ask where I can send all the GoFundMe shivs I'm happy to donate.

   122. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:34 PM (#5529834)
Tough couple days for 80s nerds: Len Wein and Jerry Pournelle gone.
   123. The Good Face Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:43 PM (#5529835)
Flake? That's nothing BUT cult of personality opposition... Calling him some kind of RINO is ludicrous. I suppose if you want to go after him for being part of the infamous Gang of Eight... but yeesh.


/facepalm
   124. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:44 PM (#5529836)
How long before the left implements straight-to-gay conversion camps?

aka the Federal Prison System...


Yes, but the left doesn't support the notion of prisons.

Well, they'd be happy to toss some cake bakers in there, but beyond that, the appetite lacks.
   125. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:45 PM (#5529838)
Can someone explain to me #99 by Gonfalon and #100 by Traderdave?

I was wondering that myself...



I am Kaiser Soze.
   126. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:45 PM (#5529839)
These Hillary 2020 posts are so mundane. When can we get to the REAL excitement: negotiating the terms of the cash wagers over whether or not she'll run, followed by three years of chatter about who was too afraid to bet, who might welch on their bet, and regular reminders that the bet is on?
   127. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:46 PM (#5529840)
Tough couple days for 80s nerds: Len Wein and Jerry Pournelle gone.


Never hea...... Will look them up.
   128. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:49 PM (#5529842)
126

Nicely done, Ray.
   129. BDC Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:52 PM (#5529843)
Can someone explain to me #99 by Gonfalon and #100 by Traderdave?

I just assumed they were both Yun Taragaoshi.
   130. Nose army. Beef diaper? (CoB) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:53 PM (#5529844)
They gave him cold blood,


Clearly, the "they" here are the Lizard people ...
   131. Covfefe Posted: September 11, 2017 at 03:57 PM (#5529845)
Flake? That's nothing BUT cult of personality opposition... Calling him some kind of RINO is ludicrous. I suppose if you want to go after him for being part of the infamous Gang of Eight... but yeesh.


/facepalm


If y'all are that single-mindedly and beyond everything fixated on sticking it to them brown peoples, then I really got nothing for you... and you do deserve all the deplorable you get.

And I'll reiterate again - just tell me where to send the shiv.

Having a whack job like Chemtrail Kelli in the Senate is a risk of high embarrassment, but she's probably easier for whomever the Dems run to beat than Flake.
   132. dlf Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:15 PM (#5529852)
Seems as good a time as any to remind all of my wager with DLF on the S&P 500 the date of the '18 midterms. The wager is a bottle of decent bourbon (definition of "decent" covered at length in prior thread) and I have the under. I spotted him a 10% or so right off the top. I was amazed that only he took such a sucker bet like that.


What's the over-under line set at?


I'd have to go back, but I believe that it was the closing number on 11/8/16 ... which is how I got the 10% kicker. Being a big fan of the US economy, a bigger fan of decent bourbon, and a believer that there isn't much any President can do to really #### it up, I took the bet thinking we were starting from the day of the wager.

But Dave, didn't we consider changing it to a decent rye instead?

...

Irma update from the Atlanta suburbs: we've had power fluctuating on and off this afternoon, have lost some branches in the back yard, the water found a short in the outdoor wiring for the gazebo, and the house is being pelted by acorns, but nothing significant as of yet. I sent staff home for today, kids are out of school, and my wife just opened a nice cabernet to let it breathe before the cocktail hour ... which will be starting very soon.
   133. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:17 PM (#5529854)
Having a whack job like Chemtrail Kelli in the Senate is a risk of high embarrassment, but she's probably easier for whomever the Dems run to beat than Flake.


If Kelli Ward doesn't work out, Todd Akin is ready, rejuvenated, and willing to relocate.

And the potential bench has only deepened, as the 2016 electorate proved they're primed and prepared in 2020 to elect a witch.
   134. Traderdave Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:18 PM (#5529855)

But Dave, didn't we consider changing it to a decent rye instead?



I'm glad to tender rye in payment, but prefer to receive bourbon.
   135. The Good Face Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:19 PM (#5529856)
I really got nothing for you... and you do deserve all the deplorable you get.


I'm just SMH that somebody who claims to follow politics could be so incredibly ignorant. "Hurrr, why would Bannon want to primary da guy who took a policy position that is diametrically opposed to Bannon's core political beliefs? It make no sense to me, durrrr!"

   136. Covfefe Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:23 PM (#5529858)
Yeesh

So word is that Mitt Romney wants to run in Utah if Hatch decides against another run -- and polling shows Mitt would cruise... but good lord, those numbers on a Hatch reelect? Down 11 points to some no-name dudette?

On a certain level, I understand the anti-career politician stuff... but only on the top, superficial level. I think one can be judicious about which 'career politicians' have actually become career politicians in the vein of personal enrichment and "losing touch".... but I just really struggle to see how that applies to Hatch.

Unlike Indiana, where I really do think that the Senate losing Dick Lugar was a bad thing for the country (thanks for the seat, though) had his whack job primary opponent ended up in the seat -- I suppose Mitt Romney wouldn't be a terrible addition to the Senate. I mean - hey - I'd prefer a center-left technocrat, but as it is Utah - a center-right technocrat might be the best possible outcome....

   137. Covfefe Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:28 PM (#5529859)
I'm just SMH that somebody who claims to follow politics could be so incredibly ignorant. "Hurrr, why would Bannon want to primary da guy who took a policy position that is diametrically opposed to Bannon's core political beliefs? It make no sense to me, durrrr!"


Shouldn't that be belief, singular?

   138. PepTech Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:46 PM (#5529865)
Wow - this just in, nature is powerful.

Irma turns your Green Isles, Brown
   139. Nose army. Beef diaper? (CoB) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:46 PM (#5529866)

The Gettysburg Address. Washington’s Farewell Address. JFK’s Inaugural Address. And now, the pantheon of the greatest American political speeches has another entry: Kid Rock’s first campaign speech.

The Bullgod, who has not filed the appropriate paperwork to run and is therefore already in violation of federal law, illuminated for an audience in Grand Rapids, Michigan what some of his policies will be, should The Pimp of the Nation be elected to office.

There were many “highlights” of the stirring and inspirational speech, which began with Rock blasting social welfare programs: “It seems the government wants to give everyone health insurance, but wants us all to pay. And to be very frank, I really don’t have a problem with that, since God has blessed me and made my pockets fat. But a redistribution of wealth seems more like their plan, and I don’t believe that you should say, ‘Sacrifice, do things by the book, and then have to take care of some deadbeat milking the system, lazy ass ############# man.’”

“Now the issue of struggling single parents is an issue close to my heart,” Rock continued. “But read my lips, we should not support these women who can’t even take care of themselves, but keep having kid after ####### kid! Of course we should help them out. I don’t want to sit here and sound like a jerk. But let’s help them out with child care, job training, and put their ####### asses to work.

Rock next set his sights out deadbeat dads: “All you ghetto glorifiers and gangster wannabes,” the man who wrote the song “Roving Gangster” and grew up in a mansion shouted, “I say lock up all you fuckin’ ######## and throw away the key!”


Link
   140. Traderdave Posted: September 11, 2017 at 04:57 PM (#5529868)
Please, please tell me that is not real.
   141. Hysterical & Useless Posted: September 11, 2017 at 05:40 PM (#5529879)
Now I’m risking my life, by the way, to tell you all this…


Please please god, may this prove true...

   142. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: September 11, 2017 at 05:45 PM (#5529881)
127...Nope not betting, because I don't care if she runs.


HA! How do YOU like it?
   143. Hysterical & Useless Posted: September 11, 2017 at 05:46 PM (#5529882)
Since it's 9/11, wanted to mention that we went to the NYS museum in Albany a month or two back while we were visiting my sister-in-law. Big part of the museum is stuff about the state of course, including NYC (not a given, many upstaters loathe the city). And a big display re: 9/ll. Artifacts such as crushed cars, broken girders, a cell phone (owner unknown) which someone found and used to call home to let spouse know they were okay, all kinds of trash and photos and newspaper headlines and TV interviews...extremely powerful and moving exhibit.
   144. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 05:55 PM (#5529884)
Since it's 9/11, wanted to mention that we went to the NYS museum in Albany a month or two back while we were visiting my sister-in-law. Big part of the museum is stuff about the state of course, including NYC (not a given, many upstaters loathe the city). And a big display re: 9/ll. Artifacts such as crushed cars, broken girders, a cell phone (owner unknown) which someone found and used to call home to let spouse know they were okay, all kinds of trash and photos and newspaper headlines and TV interviews...extremely powerful and moving exhibit.


I avoid all 9/11 museums, exhibits, and remembrances -- including tv programs.

Some years back I saw an in-depth documentary on it, which showed the people jumping out of the windows of the twin towers, to avoid being burned to death.

The thought of that "lesser" of two evils horror, combined with living through 9/11 in NYC, was enough 9/11 for me.
   145. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 11, 2017 at 06:17 PM (#5529890)
I avoid all 9/11 museums, exhibits, and remembrances -- including tv programs.


Yeah. Me also.
   146. Swoboda is freedom Posted: September 11, 2017 at 06:18 PM (#5529891)
The thought of that "lesser" of two evils horror, combined with living through 9/11 in NYC, was enough 9/11 for me.

I had 2 friends from college die that day, both at the towers, plus some who had narrow escapes. Going to their memorials was a lot for me. I still get teary if I watch those shows.

which showed the people jumping out of the windows of the twin towers, to avoid being burned to death.


The worst part was it was a 9 second drop. I think a some people were accidently pushed out. The heat was tremendous, plus all the smoke. Hell on earth. A friend of mine talked to one of the guys who died. He said they were all standing on the desks, as the floor got so hot.
   147. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 06:24 PM (#5529892)
The worst part was it was a 9 second drop. I think a some people were accidently pushed out. The heat was tremendous, plus all the smoke. Hell on earth. A friend of mine talked to one of the guys who died. He said they were all standing on the desks, as the floor got so hot.


Yeah, plus seeing people around you succumbing to the smoke or fire. Which has to inform your decision to jump.

Probably the most horrifying of the images for me was seeing the falling people trying to right themselves in mid air, their brains convincing themselves that if they could just manage to land on their feet they'd have a chance.

-

To pull it back to politics, these types of thoughts are surely what resonates in the minds of most Trump supporters as they hear him addressing the terrorism problem in ways that the left refuses to.
   148. Morty Causa Posted: September 11, 2017 at 06:25 PM (#5529893)
Same here. I was listening to a segment on NPR about the man with the red bandana on the way to the gym, and I had to spend a little time in the car getting myself together before going on in.
   149. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 06:50 PM (#5529901)
Probably the most horrifying of the images for me was seeing the falling people

Same here. I also try to avoid 9/11 shows/remembrances/etc. Those scenes were horrible enough to see once and I have no desire to wallow in them.
   150. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:09 PM (#5529906)
As well as the people hanging outside of the windows on the doomed floors, as if hoping to be rescued via helicopter.

Then you have the firefighters charging in to condemned buildings to try to rescue people.

Whole thing was a nightmare. With the epilogue of the 9/11 related cancers.
   151. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:15 PM (#5529910)
These Hillary 2020 posts are so mundane. When can we get to the REAL excitement: negotiating the terms of the cash wagers over whether or not she'll run, followed by three years of chatter about who was too afraid to bet, who might welch on their bet, and regular reminders that the bet is on?

She's guaranteed to run again and win! Iron-clad guarantee. So, I'll give you 5:4 odds for Trump and the bet only starts if she decides to run and is the candidate and has a 10% lead in the polls the week before the election.
   152. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:17 PM (#5529911)
And speaking of off-the-chart great films, did anyone else watch or record Jim Jarmusch's Night on Earth when TCM ran it early Sunday morning? I've been wanting to grab that for about 25 years, and it was worth the wait, especially on a double bill with Taxi Driver. That New York segment with "Helmut" and Rosie Perez is positively sublime, and the L.A. part with Winona Ryder is pretty damn good, too.

Guys, it's on Netflix.
   153. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:21 PM (#5529912)
That New York segment with "Helmut" and Rosie Perez is positively sublime


So it's a silent segment?
   154. TDF, FCL Posted: September 11, 2017 at 07:41 PM (#5529920)
My wife's company lost hundreds (EDIT: Actually, it was 295. ) of people in the twin towers. She still watches every show and has read numerous books. Her company has a moment of silence every year at the moment the plane hit their floor.

I want to urge her to let it go (it's been 16 years, and she's an emotional wreck around the anniversary), but don't dare.
   155. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:14 PM (#5529928)
Remarks by Donald Trump:

On Sept. 11, 2017-- "Today our entire nation grieves with you and with every family of those 2,977 innocent souls who were murdered by terrorists 16 years ago. Though we can never erase your pain, or bring back those you lost, we can honor their sacrifice by pledging our resolve to do whatever we must to keep our people safe."

On Sept. 11, 2001-- "40 Wall Street [owned by Trump] actually was the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan, and it was actually, before the World Trade Center, was the tallest. And then, when they built the World Trade Center, it became known as the second-tallest. And now it’s the tallest."
   156. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:27 PM (#5529930)
Remarks by Donald Trump:

On Sept. 11, 2017-- "Today our entire nation grieves with you and with every family of those 2,977 innocent souls who were murdered by terrorists 16 years ago. Though we can never erase your pain, or bring back those you lost, we can honor their sacrifice by pledging our resolve to do whatever we must to keep our people safe."

On Sept. 11, 2001-- "40 Wall Street [owned by Trump] actually was the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan, and it was actually, before the World Trade Center, was the tallest. And then, when they built the World Trade Center, it became known as the second-tallest. And now it’s the tallest."


Gonfalon Bubble: a most unhinged liberal, or the most unhinged liberal?
   157. PreservedFish Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:32 PM (#5529935)
And then, when they built the World Trade Center, it became known as the second-tallest


Shouldn't it have been the third-tallest?
   158. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:36 PM (#5529936)
Gonfalon Bubble: a most unhinged liberal, or the most unhinged liberal?


He's lucky Emperor Trump didn't hear him say that or he'd be morally obligated to insult his mother.
   159. PreservedFish Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:47 PM (#5529938)
"But a redistribution of wealth seems more like their plan, and I don’t believe that you should say, ‘Sacrifice, do things by the book, and then have to take care of some deadbeat milking the system, lazy ass ############# man.’”

“Now the issue of struggling single parents is an issue close to my heart,” Rock continued. “But read my lips, we should not support these women who can’t even take care of themselves, but keep having kid after ####### kid! Of course we should help them out. I don’t want to sit here and sound like a jerk. But let’s help them out with child care, job training, and put their ####### asses to work.


I'll gladly defer to Kid Rock on the subject of white trash.
   160. BDC Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:49 PM (#5529940)
There's an armed Border Patrol agent just inside the Ballpark CF gate tonight. He's observing people entering. Maybe one of the Mariners has overstayed his visa, or alternatively not proven he can perform his job as well as a US citizen.

Dude has also bought a bag of Ranger souvenir items.
   161. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:55 PM (#5529942)
alternatively not proven he can perform his job as well as a US citizen.

Yovani Gallardo?
   162. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 08:58 PM (#5529949)
Remembering life in the city in the aftermath of 9/11 is the most surreal of experiences.

The disaster itself seems more like a true horrifying stark reality in the memory, easily acceptable. The aftermath is very much like remembering a dream because it's personally difficult for me to imagine that was actually the life we were living.

The endless flyers, the dust, the talking, Joe McEwing, the normalcy, everything stored in that place in my head is beyond batshit because I feel like it was not something that could have happened the way I remember it.
   163. DavidFoss Posted: September 11, 2017 at 09:18 PM (#5529957)
70 Pine (1932) is 25 feet taller than 40 Wall (1930).

40 Wall predates Empire State and Chrysler by a few months so it was briefly the tallest building in the world.
   164. Morty Causa Posted: September 11, 2017 at 10:02 PM (#5529971)
One Cheer for Betsy DeVos

It's only taken universities about--what?--30-40 years to come around on this. That and some pretty high-profiled obvious miscarriages, and abusive miscarriages, of justice. But, hey, it was only guys who were shafted.
   165. simpleton & childlike gef the talking mongoose Posted: September 11, 2017 at 10:08 PM (#5529973)
My wife's company lost hundreds (EDIT: Actually, it was 295. ) of people in the twin towers. She still watches every show and has read numerous books. Her company has a moment of silence every year at the moment the plane hit their floor.


Makes me wonder what today is like in my first cousin's home outside Little Rock. As I've mentioned before, his wife (they got married around 10 years ago, I guess) lost her first husband when the plane crashed in Pennsylvania. They were one of the couples conversing by cell phone as the passengers were deciding to rush the cockpit.
   166. simpleton & childlike gef the talking mongoose Posted: September 11, 2017 at 10:12 PM (#5529974)
BTW, thanks to being ridiculously busy with hurricane-related submissions the last week-plus, I think I skipped OTP entirely the last 7 or 8 days. Did I miss anything of particular note? I'm suspecting not.
   167. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: September 11, 2017 at 10:23 PM (#5529977)
BTW, thanks to being ridiculously busy with hurricane-related submissions the last week-plus, I think I skipped OTP entirely the last 7 or 8 days. Did I miss anything of particular note? I'm suspecting not.
We figured out how to achieve world peace.
   168. Howie Menckel Posted: September 11, 2017 at 10:30 PM (#5529978)
I avoid all 9/11 museums, exhibits, and remembrances -- including tv programs.

I mostly do as well.

I went to the Wall once, out of respect. There is a Long Island firefighter (no relation) listed as the same first name, middle initial, and last name as my father - who as I have noted before, was 39 years FDNY - and thankfully, was long retired before 9-11. I stared at the name for a bit.

I sat not 10 feet away in our office for 10 years from the photographer who shot the "Iwo Jima flag photo" that day - an eerie echo of the famed shot from WW II, where I also have often noted my father also flew 35 missions as a bombardier over Germany during the war, nearly getting killed. two Air Medals.

a close friend I just saw again recently lost her cousin that morning, and the desperate message she sent us all that night, still hoping, broke my heart. a work colleague I was so fond of lost his brother in the Pentagon that same day.

my wife would have worked with may be 154's company as landlord/tenant, and she late that previous day tried to talk a high-ranking executive there into taking that beautiful pending Tuesday off and playing his beloved golf (this was a guy who answered to no one). the exec agreed that was a great idea - but he showed up early on that high floor on 9-11 anyway. Mrs Howie never erased that message, and eventually changed employers.

maybe someday I'll tune in to coverage, but not yet.

there was a wonderful story of a 39-year-old local guy who lost his brother that day and never went to the 9-11 site for 15 years. he fell in love this year, his gal got him into counseling, and they were there this morning.

the guy's emotions, long buried, have arisen from the ashes. God bless him
   169. Rickey! the first of his name Posted: September 11, 2017 at 11:03 PM (#5529982)
The yearly interminable 9/11 rememberances are the height of virtue signaling.
   170. Lassus Posted: September 11, 2017 at 11:06 PM (#5529984)
That's pretty much exactly how I feel about college football season.
   171. Rickey! the first of his name Posted: September 11, 2017 at 11:09 PM (#5529985)
At least college football has new material instead of canned b-reel.
   172. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 11:29 PM (#5529987)
Ray replying, #156:
Trump on Sept. 11, 2001-- "40 Wall Street [owned by Trump] actually was the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan, and it was actually, before the World Trade Center, was the tallest. And then, when they built the World Trade Center, it became known as the second-tallest. And now it’s the tallest."

Gonfalon Bubble: a most unhinged liberal, or the most unhinged liberal?



Ray, your use of a running gag from "The Colbert Report" makes me wonder, just a smidge, about the genuineness of your anti-Colbert pose.

I take unhinged responsibility for making Donald Trump actually say those actual words on the actual day of the attacks, with his actual mouth, on actual television, while the dust was still filling the air. So that people watching the tragedy would know about his dick building regaining supremacy. That's the man who makes you proud that you guessed half-right.
   173. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: September 11, 2017 at 11:49 PM (#5529991)
Today’s Hillary obsession update, in the form of a headline on The Drudge Report:
AMAZON, WAL-MART slash book price by 40% -- before release!

Drudge presumably omitted the Ha ha ha ha ha! for space considerations.

The current #1 selling non-fiction book in America right now is Neil deGrasse Tyson’s "Astrophysics for People in a Hurry." Its cover price is $19; Amazon is selling it for $11.

The current #1 fiction book is Louise Penny’s "Glass Houses." Its cover price is $29; Amazon is selling it for $17.
   174. Mans Best Friend Posted: September 12, 2017 at 12:51 AM (#5530002)
Remembering life in the city in the aftermath of 9/11 is the most surreal of experiences.

Shock and awe.

I worked for a spell in lower Manhattan in the early 90s, so I can imagine. An ex has some pics from that day in the Smithsonian.
   175. greenback is not cosmopolitan Posted: September 12, 2017 at 02:12 AM (#5530007)
I am late to the party, since I am currently in Vegas, but...

Brian Kilmeade: "Do you worry 100 years from now someone is going to try to take that memorial down like they are trying to remake our memorials today?"

This is in reference to the Flight 93 Memorial, which I just visited two weeks ago. It is awful. Granted, its original design was in the shape of a crescent moon, so what we got was an update on the ridiculous. The memorial in Pennsylvania is an imitation of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, which I guess started the trend of minimalism for memorials. But when you have a whole damn corn field as a canvas, then you can celebrate/mourn these people with more than 40 slabs of marble, each slab containing only a person's name. The chain link fence they used at the old temporary memorial had more character than this nonsense.
   176. DavidFoss Posted: September 12, 2017 at 06:01 AM (#5530019)
slash book price by 40%

They print the price on the jacket, so full price is for airport shops on the other side of the security checkpoint.

I don't know why books need to do that. They don't pre-print some ridiculous price on the soft drinks or the bags of nuts.
   177. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 06:34 AM (#5530020)
Why should you be on Twitter? Because Ted Cruz is on Twitter.
   178. Mans Best Friend Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:08 AM (#5530029)
A Woman Who Shall Remain Nameless said on NPR this morning that she lost the white woman vote cos fathers, husbands, brothers 'told em not to vote for the girl.'
   179. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:14 AM (#5530030)
The memorial in Pennsylvania is an imitation of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, which I guess started the trend of minimalism for memorials.


The Vietnam memorial is amazing. It is friggin' witchcraft how they designed it to completely immerse you. I hated it when they were talking about building it and scoffed about it right up until I went to it the first time.

However, you can't imitate it and expect to succeed. So I fully believe the monument you are talking about it terrible.

Note: Fun game, discuss mall monuments with DC locals. Everyone has an opinion and everyone is right darn it! My sister loves the FDR monument, but some of that is because that is where her (now) husband asked her to marry him.
   180. Lassus Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:26 AM (#5530032)
and everyone is right

Well, this isn't true.

The combination of the Lincoln Memorial and the Vietnam Memorial at night when there's almost nobody there is incredibly striking.
   181. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:27 AM (#5530033)
slash book price by 40%

They print the price on the jacket, so full price is for airport shops on the other side of the security checkpoint.

I don't know why books need to do that. They don't pre-print some ridiculous price on the soft drinks or the bags of nuts.


The late and unlamented Crown Books began the strategy of radically discounting the NY Times top 20 bestsellers by 40% in the 70's, as a way to undermine independent booksellers who couldn't compete with them on volume.** Amazon has merely continued that practice on a much larger scale, although the irony is that while the megachains like Barnes and Noble are fast fading as a result of the competition, independent booksellers bottomed out several years ago and now now widely flourishing.

** And like WalMart does with everything, Crown (and B&N) were able to force publishers to sell to them at wholesale prices that weren't available to independents. But since Crown was owned by a complete moron, their stupidity eventually caught up to them and they went belly up many years ago.
   182. Swoboda is freedom Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:41 AM (#5530038)
My sister loves the FDR monument, but some of that is because that is where her (now) husband asked her to marry him.

I have been to the Mall several times and didn't even know that there was an FDR monument. Had to look up where it was.


Fun game, discuss mall monuments with DC locals. Everyone has an opinion and everyone is right darn it!

No, the WWII one is awful. Not the Iwo Jima one, which is great, but the new one is just oversized and overblown.

   183. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:48 AM (#5530040)
Everyone has an opinion and everyone is right darn it!


I meant every thinks they are right. Those that say Lincoln and Vietnam are the best and WWII is a monstrosity are spot on. Korea is a bit boring. Jefferson, MLK, and FDR are all very solid.

EDIT: See everyone has an opinion.
   184. Covfefe Posted: September 12, 2017 at 08:56 AM (#5530041)
To pull it back to politics, these types of thoughts are surely what resonates in the minds of most Trump supporters as they hear him addressing the terrorism problem in ways that the left refuses to.


Is there anything the non-coastal elite, non-urban white working class can't do?

They even mourn, remember, and understand the horrors of 9/11 better than the de Blasio/Hillary/Obama voting multicultural NYC and surrounding environs!
   185. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 09:15 AM (#5530047)
Is there anything the non-coastal elite, non-urban white working class can't do?


I remember when they couldn't tell the difference between Iraq and Saudi Arabia.
   186. Covfefe Posted: September 12, 2017 at 09:28 AM (#5530054)
McConnell:

No, I'm the smart one because I wrote the debt deal so that the debate could happen as late as the height of primary season, not December!
   187. Morty Causa Posted: September 12, 2017 at 10:04 AM (#5530069)
On the subject of book pricing, things can get out of hand with algorithmic pricing:

HOW A BOOK ABOUT FLIES CAME TO BE PRICED $24 MILLION ON AMAZON

The book, which was published in 1992, is out of print but is commonly used as a reference text by fly experts. A post doc student working in Michael Eisen's lab at UC Berkeley first discovered the pricing glitch when looking to buy a copy. As documented on Eisen's blog, it was discovered that Amazon had 17 copies for sale – 15 used from $35.54 and two new from $1,730,045.91 (one from seller profnath at that price and a second from bordeebook at $2,198,177.95).

This was assumed to be a mistake, but when Eisen returned to the page the next day, he noticed the price had gone up, with both copies on offer for around $2.8 million. By the end of the day, profnath had raised its price again to $3,536,674.57. He worked out that once a day, profnath set its price to be 0.9983 times the price of the copy offered by bordeebook (keen to undercut its competitor), meanwhile the prices of bordeebook were rising at 1.270589 times the price offered by profnath.

Amazon vendors use algorithmic pricing to ensure that they can automatically change their product prices based on a competitor, for example.
   188. Morty Causa Posted: September 12, 2017 at 10:12 AM (#5530071)
In case you think the preceding is merely a once in a lifetime aberration, the above only came to my attention because something apparently of the same nature occurred to a Facebook friend who teaches freshmen English in college and had assigned that his students obtained as a text for class "For Argument's Sake" by Katherine Mayberry. Then things got wild. I let him tell you:

I just watched an Amazon vs. Google algorithmic robot pricing war happen in real time with 20 witnesses. I feel like Richard [David}] Attenborough or Diane Fossey watching a lion and and a tiger tangle or gorillas creating a tool.

It wasn't as ridiculous as this: https://www.wired.com/2011/04/amazon-flies-24-million/ But that was *six* years ago and both those companies should have refined their algorithms enough by now to prevent it from happening.

For one (actually two, but I'll get to that) of my classes, the bookstore had some books but not enough. So I told the kids no biggie, we don't need the book this week and if we still don't have them by Wednesday to just check Amazon or Chegg.

Which a couple kids then proceeded to do right then. First one gasps. "TWO HUNDRED SEVENTY FOUR DOLLARS?!?!?!"
No, I said, I love this book, but one of the reasons I love it is because it's not a ripoff. Should be fifty or less.

Second kid chimes in. "It's not $270. It's *$380*."

To which I replied The Eff you say.

So then we sat there and watched the price go up 'til it reached $2,100 in about five minutes before leveling off. So while that was happening I told them what I thought was happening (see the Wired article) and I teased them about Hey, this is your world now, you better get used it.

While were chatting the spiral took off again topping out at $3,600.

So we were falling down laughing by then and I told them not to buy the book at that price and in fact to wait a couple of days to buy it until the market settles.

So I go to the next class. Same book. Kid in the front had bought it used, correct edition, for *nine* dollars last week. So we checked and the prices had fallen back to $75, which is still $30 more than the $45 it listed for when I ordered it. We did find one site that still had it for $2,500, and I just found the listing below a few minutes ago, so some of the robots are better than others!
   189. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 10:30 AM (#5530080)
The efficiency of capitalism offends you, does it comrade?
   190. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: September 12, 2017 at 10:52 AM (#5530097)
The bottom line about book prices is that in real dollars they're mostly cheaper than they've ever been, especially if you can wait a few months after they come out. Nearly every hardback book I've found that's over a year old is cheaper than the kindle version, and I'm not talking about some moldy ex-library discard.
   191. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 10:57 AM (#5530102)
DUH! Nevermind.
   192. BDC Posted: September 12, 2017 at 11:07 AM (#5530110)
Amazon vendors use algorithmic pricing to ensure that they can automatically change their product prices based on a competitor, for example

Perhaps also why you sometimes see Wednesday-night regular-season third-deck tickets behind the right-field foul pole going for $1,799.99 on StubHub.
   193. Traderdave Posted: September 12, 2017 at 11:15 AM (#5530118)
I lost a number of colleagues and counterparties that day and while the memories fade a bit each year it still really gets me. I printed and saved a few emails sent out after the planes hit but before the collapse, people panicked and in a hurry to GTFO but still typed out a quick mass email to everyone in their loops.

I know exactly where they are but I've never been able to go back and re-read them.

I had been in a heated argument the day before with a guy a backed away from a trade after confirming it. I had some choice words for him. He was dead less than 24 hours later. That has eaten at me more than once.

I bought some bonds from another guy on 9/10 who died in the collapse. There was some sort of snafu with the trade ticket & it wasn't booked properly (this is a reasonably common occurrence, usually fixed with a quick phone call or email). It took a while to sort that one out with a survivor who was in tears for each phone call. It had to be done, there was no way around it, and tears aside the lady I worked with was supremely professional about it but damn that was a supremely awful feeling. It made me question staying in the business.

I generally stay very quiet on anniversary date, partly because it's sad as hell, partly because the compulsory forced USA!USA! patriotism is extremely off-putting, but mostly because other lost so much more than I did. Silence seems the only decent way for me to go.


   194. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: September 12, 2017 at 11:41 AM (#5530128)

I generally stay very quiet on anniversary date, partly because it's sad as hell, partly because the compulsory forced USA!USA! patriotism is extremely off-putting, but mostly because other lost so much more than I did. Silence seems the only decent way for me to go.


I feel the same way; I didn't lose anything personally on 9/11.
   195. Morty Causa Posted: September 12, 2017 at 11:48 AM (#5530136)
The efficiency of capitalism offends you, does it comrade?


As to books, I'm not too worried. As to medicines, now, that's different. Prices for some drugs, like the state of the art cancer drugs, are ridiculous. There's a book that just came out (will have to try to find out), that claims drugs are way overpriced, the cost of R & D is way over estimated, the need to retain intellectual property rights way too long, and the profits are astronomically more than Big Pharma concedes. Of course (see tobacco), everyone associated with Big Pharma and Big Insurance and Big Medical--in fact, the entire medical industrial complex--is up in arms, trying their best to discredit the book and its findings.
   196. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 11:56 AM (#5530141)
There's a book that just came out (will have to try to find out), that claims drugs are way overpriced


And that book only cost $17,483.72 on Amazon...
   197. Morty Causa Posted: September 12, 2017 at 12:17 PM (#5530146)

The author, Emily Yoffe, some of you may remember, was a mainstay at Slate for a number of years. She wrote that long article at Slate at the height of the UVA student rape (false rape) accusations. She was much too common-sensical for Slate. This is a comment to her article in The Atlantic on that same subject of rape accusations in colleges and universities and those colleges and universities acting as quasi-criminal adjudicatory bodies, ruining the lives of students.

This is a lengthy article with a lot to unpack, but this leapt out at me and made my blood boil:

"She added, “I want to fully own my participation in what happened, but at the same time recognize that I felt violated and that I owe it to myself and others to hold him accountable for something I felt in my bones wasn’t right.”

Before we even begin to discuss the appropriate response to allegations of sexual assault, there is this enormous issue to confront. A woman who engaged in a fully consensual sexual interlude has somehow come to believe that because she was ambivelent about it afterwords, that she was worried about the consequnces to herself or her reputation after the fact, that some one other than her has to be held accountable. She further states (I didn't quote it here) that her conviction that she was sexually assaulted arose from her training as a Resident Assistant.

Isn't that really the starting point for this conversation: figuring out why an otherwise sophisticated adult came to believe such perverse ideas in the first place? Who is teaching women such an infantalizing view of sexuality?


The Uncomfortable Truth About Campus Rape Policy
   198. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 12:23 PM (#5530151)
The bottom line about book prices is that in real dollars they're mostly cheaper than they've ever been, especially if you can wait a few months after they come out. Nearly every hardback book I've found that's over a year old is cheaper than the kindle version, and I'm not talking about some moldy ex-library discard.


Sure. I mean, almost _everything_ is insanely cheap these days. That's why there are so few people in America living in actual poverty.

I had a root canal done this morning. As the left side of my mouth feels like it's in a vice I bought 24 tablets of Advil. $5.49.

(Now, granted, it cost me $1,089.00 for the root canal, because despite me paying for insurance for me and a percentage of another random person I don't know, after all the dust settled from my coverage my insurance only covered $700 of it. It's not that the cost of health insurance is exorbitant; it's that individual health care items should be so much cheaper, but there's no free market for them so they're not.)
   199. Ray (RDP) Posted: September 12, 2017 at 12:28 PM (#5530154)
I generally stay very quiet on anniversary date, partly because it's sad as hell, partly because the compulsory forced USA!USA! patriotism is extremely off-putting, but mostly because other lost so much more than I did. Silence seems the only decent way for me to go.

I feel the same way; I didn't lose anything personally on 9/11.


Everyone lost a little bit of something, even if it was only personal freedoms.
   200. Covfefe Posted: September 12, 2017 at 12:30 PM (#5530156)
(Now, granted, it cost me $1,089.00 for the root canal, because despite me paying for insurance for me and a percentage of another random person I don't know, after all the dust settled from my coverage my insurance only covered $700 of it. It's not that the cost of health insurance is exorbitant; it's that individual health care items should be so much cheaper, but there's no free market for them so they're not.)


Considering that Obamacare has no dental provisions for adults (pediatric dental care is required for family health plans), I believe your costs are wholly your own fault and problem.
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