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Monday, October 16, 2017

OTP 16 October 2017: Sorry, Yankee fans: Trump’s claim that he can ensure victory simply isn’t true

As is sometimes the case with Trump’s tweet’s, his claims don’t hold up. We identified 14 games that Trump has attended since 1988, including two preseason games and the game above. Of those 14 games, the Yankees won eight and lost six — 57 percent of the time during seasons when the Yankees won 60 percent of their games overall.

In other words — Trump might be a jinx.

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 16, 2017 at 07:49 AM | 1967 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: astros, playoffs, politics, yankees

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   1101. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:49 PM (#5557440)
YANKEES WIN!! THUUHHHHHH.....YANKEES!.....WIN!!!!!!

Well, it sure beats thinking about gerrymandering or Donald Trump.
   1102. Dog on the sidewalk Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:52 PM (#5557442)
Jesus; is there anyone on this site other than SBB who isn't a lawyer?

I'm not, though my mother, brother, and uncle all are.
   1103. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:56 PM (#5557445)
I used to watch The People's Court, so I'm pretty much a lawyer.
   1104. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:57 PM (#5557446)
Jesus; is there anyone on this site other than SBB who isn't a lawyer?


I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
   1105. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:11 PM (#5557464)
Turns out it was just an unfortunate coincidence after all

A White House spokesperson, speaking on background, said the check has been "in the pipeline" since the President's conversation with the father.

"The President has personally followed up several times to ensure that the check was being sent. As stated earlier the check has been sent," the spokesperson said.

When asked why it took so long for the funds to be sent, the spokesperson added: "There is a substantial process that can involve multiple agencies anytime the President interacts with the public, especially when transmitting personal funds. In this situation there were other agencies involved."

The spokesperson did not say which agencies were involved or elaborate on the process.


See. The check was going out today anyway. It normally takes 4 months for the President to send a check to someone. Anyone who believe's differently is just suffering from TDS. The spokesman failed to elaborate how long it takes for the president to set up an online funding mechinism. Other sources say the Twelfth of Never.
   1106. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:12 PM (#5557466)
I blame the father for making this all about himself.
   1107. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:29 PM (#5557482)
You make joke about gay predation but it is real and it taught me not to be obnoxious and continue my advances after being rejected.
   1108. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:29 PM (#5557483)


Article from the Financial Times on SBB's favorite VIX argument.
   1109. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:30 PM (#5557485)
YANKEES WIN!! THUUHHHHHH.....YANKEES!.....WIN!!!!!!

Well, it sure beats thinking about gerrymandering or Donald Trump.
For the five millionth ####### time, Andy, stop posting game spoilers on OTP. You have less self-control than Harvey Weinstein.
   1110. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:33 PM (#5557492)
Mark Parenteau, a notorious predator, sexually harassed me when i was an intern at WBCN, back in 1980, when I was 21. It's creepy, so #metoo.
   1111. Lassus Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:42 PM (#5557513)
I'm way way way behind because I'm traveling, but if Obama, Bush, Carter, Clinton, whomever paid out to a family of a dead soldier as part of a condolence call, I would rightfully call that totally fucking gross. (I mean, I would call it that, I would never judge anyone who received said check for not agreeing.)
   1112. Lassus Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:45 PM (#5557522)
Article from the Financial Times on SBB's favorite VIX argument.

Subscription?
   1113. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:48 PM (#5557528)
So if we stipulate (IANAL) that the MD shooter is crazy can we use that as a rationale to pass a law that makes it diicult for crazy people to get guns? Will that destroy the republic?
   1114. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:51 PM (#5557534)
Once a Turkish gentleman touched my penis in a Turkish bathhouse. It was very surprising but I sustained no emotional damage. Also, I was naked in a Turkish bathhouse. Maybe they rub each other's penises all the time there, who am I to judge?
   1115. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:57 PM (#5557542)
Some people just aren't as tough as you are, PF.
   1116. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 10:18 PM (#5557571)
I used to listen to the radio show Loveline frequently. There was an inviolate pattern to the female callers that wanted to talk about abuse they had recently suffered. Dr. Drew would ask if they had been victims in their childhood, and they always, always, answered "yes." I can't recall exactly what he said about this but my impression was that women that had been abused in childhood were dealt a massive and potentially lifelong psychological blow. Such women were (a) very likely to find themselves attracted to abusive men, whether they liked it or not and (b) also gave off a sort of vulnerability vibe that abusive men would pick up on. And that's how they end up in abusive relationships time and time again. Whereas, if an emotionally healthy woman somehow finds herself in an abusive situation, she is far more likely to be able to shrug it off and extricate herself without a lot of drama.

This even extended to rape victims. That is, I don't recall ever hearing about an adult that was just raped out of the blue. An adult that was raped was probably also raped as a child.

I have no idea if these trends are real, or recognized by professionals. Callers to a radio show are not a perfect sample by any means.
   1117. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 18, 2017 at 10:42 PM (#5557623)
When a party is out of power, sometimes the National Committee is the only thing left to fight about - Longtime Democratic National Committee Officials Ousted:
A shakeup is underway at the Democratic National Committee as several key longtime officials have lost their posts, exposing a still-raw rift in the party and igniting anger among those in its progressive wing who see retaliation for their opposition to DNC Chairman Tom Perez.
. . .
Complaints began immediately after party officials saw a list of Perez' appointments to DNC committees and his roster of 75 "at-large" members, who are chosen by the chair.

The removal and demotion of a handful of veteran operatives stood out, as did what critics charge is the over-representation of Clinton-backed members on the Rules and Bylaws Committee, which helps set the terms for the party's presidential primary, though other Sanders and Ellison backers remain represented. Those who have been pushed out include:

Ray Buckley, the New Hampshire Democratic chairman and longtime DNC official who ran against Perez for chair before backing Rep. Keith Ellison, D-Minn., lost his spots on the Executive Committee and DNC Rules Committee;
James Zogby, the president of the Arab American Institute and prominent Sanders backer, is no longer co-chair of the Resolutions Committee and is off the Executive Committee, a sport he has held since 2001;
Alice Germond, the party’s longtime former secretary and a vocal Ellison backer, who was removed from her at-large appointment to the DNC; and
Barbra Casbar Siperstein, the first transgender member of the DNC who supported Ellison and Buckley, was tossed from the Executive Committee.

I think Donna Brazile is still around, in case they need someone to rig the 2020 debates. More whining at the link.
   1118. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 10:50 PM (#5557637)
I think Donna Brazile is still around, in case they need someone to rig the 2020 debates. More whining at the link.


Your concern is noted.
   1119. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: October 18, 2017 at 10:56 PM (#5557646)
I used to listen to the radio show Loveline frequently.

If I said "Tom Arnold," would you know what I was talking about?
   1120. Shredder Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:06 PM (#5557664)
Jesus; is there anyone on this site other than SBB who isn't a lawyer?
I'm technically not a lawyer. Though I have a law degree and am admitted to the bar, I don't practice.
   1121. Lassus Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:16 PM (#5557680)
I am so old school. I was living in L.A. and listening to Loveline when Riki Rachtman was on.
   1122. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:19 PM (#5557687)
That's not old school. Poor Man would be old school.
   1123. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:20 PM (#5557690)
I remember hearing Tom Arnold as a guest, but I don't remember anything special about it.

This was in the late 90s, I guess.
   1124. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:22 PM (#5557694)
Just to close the book on whether Hillary Clinton was aware of her pal Harvey Weinstein's sexual harassment, Linda Bloodworth-Thomason, the creator of the Designing Women hit TV show, has an op-ed piece today indicating, among other things, that she was aware of Weinstein's misdeeds and warned top-level Democratic political operatives against letting him organize fundraisers. Other than Chelsea, Huma Abedin, and sometimes maybe Bill, there is no one closer to Hillary than Linda Bloodworth-Thomason. It seems inconceivable that she would have withheld such info from Hillary.
   1125. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:24 PM (#5557699)
I remember hearing Tom Arnold as a guest, but I don't remember anything special about it.

Then you must have stopped listening before the
end of the show.
   1126. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:30 PM (#5557711)
Just to close the book on whether Hillary Clinton was aware of her pal Harvey Weinstein's sexual harassment, Linda Bloodworth-Thomason, the creator of the Designing Women hit TV show, has an op-ed piece today indicating, among other things, that she was aware of Weinstein's misdeeds and warned top-level Democratic political operatives against letting him organize fundraisers. Other than Chelsea, Huma Abedin, and sometimes maybe Bill, there is no one closer to Hillary than Linda Bloodworth-Thomason. It seems inconceivable that she would have withheld such info from Hillary


We're back to this? So Hillary knew Weinstein was a rapist and yet didn't warn Obama? or she did and Obama sent his daughter to work with a rapist anyway? Is that you contention?

   1127. Shredder Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:31 PM (#5557717)
.
   1128. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:33 PM (#5557724)
Well, she was already America's best known pervert-enabler.
   1129. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:39 PM (#5557730)
We're back to this? So Hillary knew Weinstein was a rapist and yet didn't warn Obama? or she did and Obama sent his daughter to work with a rapist anyway? Is that you contention?

Well, that would make Hillary a liar, but my specific contention is that Hillary Clinton's opposition to sexual harassment was quite selective, and was certainly secondary to the political fundraising that Weinstein was heavily involved in. She probably figured it was a low-risk strategy, since the press didn't seem inclined to pursue the story when she and Harv were riding high. Indeed, it's quite likely Hillary would have made him an Ambassador.
   1130. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:41 PM (#5557734)
You know what you're getting into reading clapper.
   1131. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: October 18, 2017 at 11:42 PM (#5557736)
YANKEES WIN!! THUUHHHHHH.....YANKEES!.....WIN!!!!!!

Well, it sure beats thinking about gerrymandering or Donald Trump.


For the five millionth ####### time, Andy, stop posting game spoilers on OTP. You have less self-control than Harvey Weinstein.


Sorry, David, but what in the hell are you doing arguing about politics when there's a game going on?

If it's any consolation, I won't tell you how the other game's going.
   1132. Nose army. Beef diaper? (CoB) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 12:06 AM (#5557825)
Bill Barilko disappeared that summer,
He was on a fishing trip.
The last goal he ever scored
Won the Leafs the cup
They didn't win another until 1962,
The year he was discovered.
I stole this from a hockey card,
I keep tucked up under
My fifty mission cap, I worked it in
To look like that


Fifty Mission Cap

Bah, Trudeau should have gone with he knew what he signed up for ...
   1133. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 01:04 AM (#5557886)
See. The check was going out today anyway. It normally takes 4 months for the President to send a check to someone. Anyone who believe's differently is just suffering from TDS.


Do try to keep the various strawmen in your head out of the discussion. I don't recall that anyone here thought it took 4 months for the president to send a check. I certainly didn't. I said at the outset that Trump probably sent the check today (or yesterday, or whenever it was that the story broke).

My issue has been the people banging on Trump for having the unmitigated call to give $25,000 to a grieving military father. Those folks are indeed suffering from TDS.
   1134. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 01:06 AM (#5557887)
We're back to this? So Hillary knew Weinstein was a rapist and yet didn't warn Obama? or she did and Obama sent his daughter to work with a rapist anyway? Is that you contention?


Hillary cares as much about sexual assault as I do about global warming.

   1135. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 19, 2017 at 01:11 AM (#5557888)
#1114:
Once a Turkish gentleman touched my penis in a Turkish bathhouse.


But did he pull it like taffy?
   1136. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 01:17 AM (#5557889)
My issue has been the people banging on Trump for having the unmitigated call to give $25,000 to a grieving military father.
Oh dear. Citation, please.

The only person criticizing Trump for this gesture is SBB.
   1137. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 05:36 AM (#5557895)
Yeah, I guess Little Lord Fauntleray and The Declown are going to have to finally decide who loves the emperor more.

And....START!
   1138. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 06:09 AM (#5557896)
My issue has been the people banging on Trump for having the unmitigated call to give $25,000 to a grieving military father. Those folks are indeed suffering from TDS.
Once more, the only person who took that position was your fellow traveler, SBB. Everyone else criticized Trump for not doing it, after he said he would.
   1139. Swoboda is freedom Posted: October 19, 2017 at 07:39 AM (#5557902)
My issue has been the people banging on Trump for having the unmitigated call to give $25,000 to a grieving military father. Those folks are indeed suffering from TDS.

If he had actually done that, especially with publicity, my opinion of him would have gone up dramatically. Instead, he said he would, then didn't. And now without the publicity, he wouldn't have done it.

BTW, giving money is not usual or expected, unless you promise to do so.
   1140. Lassus Posted: October 19, 2017 at 07:55 AM (#5557903)
Ray cares about the truth of what he says as much as he cares about global warming.
   1141. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 08:50 AM (#5557911)
It normally takes 4 months for the President to send a check to someone. Anyone who believe's differently is just suffering from TDS.


You misunderstand. Anyone who's obsessing over the minute-by-minute minutia of this event is suffering from TDS.

TDS has both a substantive and a "procedural" component. (And of course the minute-by-minute obsession impacts the substantive perspective. It's all quite daffy.)
   1142. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 08:57 AM (#5557915)
The first principle question with all of this remains:

Why do you people have such a deep psychic need for a head of state with whom you can closely identify as they carry out that function? It's ... odd.
   1143. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:03 AM (#5557917)
Hillary cares as much about sexual assault as I do about global warming.


Her record on it is terrible.
   1144. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:10 AM (#5557919)
Wah! Wah!

People are obsessing because they're talking about the political stories of the day in the baseball site thread set aside for politics rather than talking about the various crimes and culpability o the woman who lost the election a year ago!

Wah! Wah!

   1145. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:15 AM (#5557920)
People are obsessing because they're talking about the political stories of the day in the baseball site thread set aside for politics rather than talking about the various crimes and culpability o the woman who lost the election a year ago!


Weird how people want to discuss the President rather than the person who lost. Remember all that discussion about Romney? McCain? No? Strange.
   1146. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:15 AM (#5557921)
The first principle question with all of this remains:
Namely, why is SBB such a troll? What possible psychological benefit can he gain from sitting around arguing in bad faith about politics on a baseball website all day and night?
   1147. BrianBrianson Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:26 AM (#5557923)
Jesus; is there anyone on this site other than SBB who isn't a lawyer?


I'm not, though I once hired a lawyer to help me sort out a problem with my visa application.
   1148. PreservedFish Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:29 AM (#5557924)
Anyone who's obsessing over the minute-by-minute minutia of this event is suffering from TDS.


What about those of us that are just casually discussing it, like you are?
   1149. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:31 AM (#5557925)
Both of you talked about how it would impact individual districts, suggesting (among other things) it conflicted with VRA and such. So yeah, your belief is wrong.

Uh, you seem very confused. One might -- or might not; see my post at 1090 -- be able to challenge the overall map, but the end result of a successful challenge on that basis is still that individual district lines will have to be redrawn. And, yes, the VRA controls that.
David - You're misreading.

Mouse's "your belief is wrong" is addressing Clapper's #1088 - "I don't believe David or I said anything about individual districts versus all districts in a state" - not your and Clapper's belief that ES conflicted with the VRA.
   1150. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:33 AM (#5557926)
Hillary cares as much about sexual assault as I do about global warming.
Boy, if I were you I wouldn't vote for her the next time she runs.
   1151. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:39 AM (#5557931)
When Hillary dies, I'm pretty sure no one will be surprised over which OTPers will be shedding the most tears.

It wouldn't be a terrible idea to just set aside an OT-HRC thread now...
   1152. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:42 AM (#5557932)
Namely, why is SBB such a troll? What possible psychological benefit can he gain from sitting around arguing in bad faith about politics on a baseball website all day and night?


That's certainly a question, albeit one not particularly relevant to the topic under discussion.
   1153. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:44 AM (#5557933)
Mouse's "your belief is wrong" is addressing Clapper's #1088


Correct, but I admit I am interested in moving on until the SCOTUS rules. Absent a ruling gerrymander talk is kind of boring, with most people having an opinion set in stone in advance, largely based on partisan desires and not any real principle.
   1154. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 09:46 AM (#5557937)
When Hillary dies, I'm pretty sure no one will be surprised over which OTPers will be shedding the most tears.


I won't shed tears - I didn't for my father's funeral, I doubt I will for that - but I will be sad. I think she has truly meant well, wanted to do what is right, more so than the vast majority of politicians and has been savaged not for her beliefs but for sundry other nonsense.
   1155. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:03 AM (#5557948)
Another congressional GOP No Mas --

Pat Tiberi is apparently set to not just retire - but resign soon.

The OH-12 is a traditionally GOP district (it's also John Kasich's old seat), but Obama won it handily in 2008 and at R+7 -- certainly within the realm of pickup opportunities.
   1156. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:17 AM (#5557959)
Pat Tiberi is apparently set to not just retire - but resign soon.


Waves happen, in large part, when the reinforcing cycle of a scary future leads to retirement leads to more enthusiasm, funding, and recruitment on the other side, which leads to a scary future ... and so on.

It is still early, and of course the economy over the next 6 to 8 months matters a huge amount for the prospects for both parties in 2018.
   1157. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:19 AM (#5557961)
For the five millionth ####### time, Andy, stop posting game spoilers on OTP. You have less self-control than Harvey Weinstein.

Sorry, David, but what in the hell are you doing arguing about politics when there's a game going on?

If it's any consolation, I won't tell you how the other game's going.


David shouldn't be wearing that short skirt in OTP, amirite?

It doesn't matter why he doesn't want to see spoilers; it's an etiquette issue.

I don't watch games start to finish anymore. I only watch playoff games now, but I start them late and skip liberally through the bases-empty periods until there's a runner or two on base and then I nest, continuing to 30-second-advance through the dead time between pitches. Then I hang out at the end of a close game. Consequently I'm continually behind in the proceedings. When you post spoilers in OTP it screws my system up.

--

In general I watch sports much less now, but I almost never watch commercials or dead time between plays/pitches. With the NFL I don't watch 4th downs or FGs or XPs or kickoffs or punts. I don't want to spend 3-5 hours watching games anymore. It's not a pace of play issue, either; I don't want to spend more than 30 or 45 minutes watching any sporting event. I certainly refuse to sit through commercials. And I don't need the analysis from the announcers.

Oh. Replays. I don't sit there through a replay, either, as the announcers go over the play 12 times and then go to commercial and go over it 12 more times. I watch the play, come to a conclusion, and then fast forward to the ruling. In the NFL before the game comes down the stretch I don't even re-watch the play under review. There are so many flags and penalties and reviews cumulatively that I just skip to the next play.
   1158. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:22 AM (#5557964)
Everyone else criticized Trump for not doing it, after he said he would.


If you found something negative about Trump giving $25,000 to a grieving military father you're insane.

HTH.
   1159. PreservedFish Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:23 AM (#5557966)
How do you spend all that free time that you've earned back?
   1160. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:25 AM (#5557967)
It doesn't matter why he doesn't want to see spoilers; it's an etiquette issue.


Keeping sport's spoilers out of OTP seems reasonable to me. Especially when bad things like the Yankees winning happen. Ugh, no one wants that on top of the page, just sitting there like a turd.
   1161. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:26 AM (#5557972)
How do you spend all that free time that you've earned back?


See World

OK, that joke doesn't work as well in written form.
   1162. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:35 AM (#5557978)
If you found something negative about Trump giving $25,000 to a grieving military father you're insane.
Your obtuseness has been in fine form this week.
   1163. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:36 AM (#5557983)
So this turns out to be the district next door... maybe I should be paying more attention to local politics. The GOP has a 1-vote advantage in the State House, so if Dhingra can flip the seat, the state turns all blue (Governor and Senate are Dem-controlled).
Campaign donations are pouring in for a Washington state Senate seat contest because the outcome likely will determine whether Democrats or Republicans control the chamber. Oil companies have written $100,000 checks for political action committees running ads against the Democratic candidate, Manka Dhingra, and in support of Republican Jinyoung Lee Englund. A pair of billionaires who want action on climate change, Michael Bloomberg and Tom Steyer, each gave $125,000 to political action committees funding ad campaigns against Englund, and supporting Dhingra. When all is said and done, $8 million dollars likely will have been spent on this state legislative race, political consultants predict. That’s more than triple the amount ever spent on any other Washington state legislative race and more than has ever been spent on any U.S. Congressional race in the state.
Another angle on this one: Expensive Washington state senate race: A Sikh vs. a Christian and no one's covering that
   1164. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:41 AM (#5557989)
If you found something negative about Trump giving $25,000 to a grieving military father you're insane.


Without re-reading, I think people found something negative about him telling the grieving military father he would be giving him $25,000... and the not doing it, a practice that Trump has a long history of perpetrating.

And while I'm not expecting daily updates -- with Trump, the actual "giving" plaudits really ought to await receipt of the check and it clearing.
   1165. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:48 AM (#5557994)
David shouldn't be wearing that short skirt in OTP, amirite?

It doesn't matter why he doesn't want to see spoilers; it's an etiquette issue.


I don't disagree with that, and my only defense is that I forgot that some people here don't watch the games live, a practice I still find kind of weird.

But to each his own, and I'll try not to repeat this kind of spoiler going forward.
   1166. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:50 AM (#5557995)
Without re-reading, I think people found something negative about him telling the grieving military father he would be giving him $25,000... and the not doing it, a practice that Trump has a long history of perpetrating.


He did it though, right? (I'm not paying attention, so my only source is BBTF on the matter.)

If he did it, then it would be incorrect to refer to "the not doing it."
   1167. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:52 AM (#5557997)
Without re-reading, I think people found something negative about him telling the grieving military father he would be giving him $25,000... and the not doing it,


Ah. So apparently the problem here is that people can't perceive reality.

He did it. "The check has been sent." If it turns out that lightning strikes and the WH spokeswoman was lying, we can re-visit.

   1168. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:52 AM (#5557998)
Donald Trump's concept of charity really puts faith and hope through the wringer.
   1169. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:53 AM (#5557999)
Namely, why is SBB such a troll? What possible psychological benefit can he gain from sitting around arguing in bad faith about politics on a baseball website all day and night?

That's certainly a question,
Actually, it's two. HTH.
   1170. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:53 AM (#5558000)
"I am criticizing him because it took him four months to give a grieving military father $25,000 out of his own pocket!!!!"

Signed,
an insane person
   1171. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:54 AM (#5558002)
If you found something negative about Trump giving $25,000 to a grieving military father you're insane.
And... let's go to the videotape!
1011. PepTech Posted: October 18, 2017 at 05:15 PM (#5557254)
No one is attacking Trump for the gesture, which is, in itself, admirable.

1041. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 18, 2017 at 05:31 PM (#5557289)
I don't want presidents cutting checks to private citizens while in office. Particularly the families of soldiers. It's unseemly and has the whiff of anti-democratic vote-buying.
At the risk of sounding self-serving, I fully endorse Ray's sentiment here. :)

   1172. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:54 AM (#5558003)
Everyone else criticized Trump for not doing it, after he said he would.

If you found something negative about Trump giving $25,000 to a grieving military father you're insane.
Reading still very much fundamental. That statement should be directed to SBB, who argued that it was unethical. Not to me, since I found nothing wrong negative about it, other than the fact that Trump hadn't done it after promising to do it.
   1173. Traderdave Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:55 AM (#5558004)
Is Trump going to file a gift tax return for this, or is he going to 1099 the dad?
   1174. BrianBrianson Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:57 AM (#5558008)
He did it though, right? (I'm not paying attention, so my only source is BBTF on the matter.)


None of us have the slightest idea.
   1175. canadian shield Posted: October 19, 2017 at 10:58 AM (#5558010)
Have you guys paid or is Ray arguing in his spare time?
   1176. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:00 AM (#5558012)
Without re-reading, I think people found something negative about him telling the grieving military father he would be giving him $25,000... and the not doing it,

Ah. So apparently the problem here is that people can't perceive reality.
No, the reality is that Trump apparently had no intention on honoring his word until called on it.

Of course, he also lied about having his staff set up an online fundraiser too, so there's that. (The original link to the WaPo story is in #979, in case you don't believe me).
   1177. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:01 AM (#5558013)
Donald Trump's concept of charity really puts faith and hope through the wringer.
"Charity" being said alongside faith and hope is just the result of a poor choice made by the translators of the King James Bible when dealing with the word agape. That really means "love", in the sense of non-erotic love, divine love. No one thinks that divine love has a place in Donald Trump's character. Faith and hope are fine.
   1178. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:03 AM (#5558014)
And do we actually know that Trump, or the Trump Foundation, actually ever sent the check? Because the WH has lied about Trump's words and deeds plenty before.
   1179. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:04 AM (#5558015)
Have you guys paid or is Ray arguing in his spare time?
Primey worthy. Thanks for that...
   1180. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:06 AM (#5558017)
#1175:
Have you guys paid or is Ray arguing in his spare time?


The more applicable Monty Python sketch for Ray & Co. is the one where the sycophantic writers keep applauding and praising the psychotic film producer with increasing desperation and frenzy, as the producer's moronic, incoherent abuse flits randomly from target to target.
   1181. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:07 AM (#5558020)
Because the WH has lied about Trump's words and deeds plenty before.


So has the Washington Post.
   1182. BrianBrianson Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:09 AM (#5558022)
And do we actually know that Trump, or the Trump Foundation, actually ever sent the check? Because the WH has lied about Trump's words and deeds plenty before.


No, we have no idea. If it was sent in the last couple of days, it may well be in the mail.
   1183. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:13 AM (#5558025)
Have you guys paid or is Ray arguing in his spare time?

It's as if Cleese had a time machine into the future, and he condensed Ray's entire BTF output into two paid up minutes.
   1184. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:14 AM (#5558026)
And do we actually know that Trump, or the Trump Foundation, actually ever sent the check?
I think this line of inquiry is silly. At this point, I'm certain there's a check in the mail. It takes about 30 seconds to write a check and hand it to a staffer, and I don't buy all that noise about a "multi-agency process". I'd be willing to bet no one in the WH knew anything about this until the story broke yesterday, and the check was "sent" about one minute later.

Ray, your continued insistence that criticism is because Trump sent a check has crossed any reasonable boundary into outright lying. It's perfectly fine to say you don't think he should be criticized "now that he has sent it", but your insistence on doubling down with "because he sent it" is simply bizarre.
   1185. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:19 AM (#5558030)
He did it though, right? (I'm not paying attention, so my only source is BBTF on the matter.)

None of us have the slightest idea.


In the same way that none of us "have the slightest idea" whether Neil Armstrong really landed on the moon, I suppose. We weren't on the moon to witness it, after all.

But here on planet earth, the WH spokesperson said "A check has been sent." That provides us with a slightest idea.
   1186. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:21 AM (#5558034)
But here on planet earth, the WH spokesperson said "A check has been sent." That provides us with a slightest idea.


A White House spokesman also once said that Trump's inaugural crowd was the largest in history, PERIOD!

A WH spokesman once said that Trump fired the FBI director because of how he treated Hillary. Trump himself contradicted that one less than 24 hours later.

Citing a WH spokesman as evidence of anything is a dicey proposition.
   1187. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:22 AM (#5558035)
1129

Well, that would make Hillary a liar, but my specific contention is that Hillary Clinton's opposition to sexual harassment was quite selective, and was certainly secondary to the political fundraising that Weinstein was heavily involved in. She probably figured it was a low-risk strategy, since the press didn't seem inclined to pursue the story when she and Harv were riding high.


Politician lies and goes for the money! Film at 11!
   1188. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:27 AM (#5558038)
In the same way that none of us "have the slightest idea" whether Neil Armstrong really landed on the moon, I suppose. We weren't on the moon to witness it, after all.


No, not in the same way. If I saw on TV Trump writing a check and putting it into an envelope, I would have little doubt that the check was sent. If the only evidence of the moon landing was a statement from the WH, I would have doubts.
   1189. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:27 AM (#5558039)
Without validating the original analogy, President Nixon didn't say Neil Armstrong had landed on the moon, adding that Johnson and Kennedy didn't care about astronauts, then hurriedly send Armstrong to the moon in November when his empty words got found out.
   1190. PepTech Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:27 AM (#5558041)
But here on planet earth, the WH spokesperson said "A check has been sent." That provides us with a slightest idea.
Says the guy who "can't fathom" why a four-month reneging, which likely would have been indefinite, is any kind of issue. Not the slightest idea.

I bet Trump's jaw clenched when he wrote the check. :)
   1191. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:28 AM (#5558042)
Ah. So apparently the problem here is that people can't perceive reality.

He did it. "The check has been sent." If it turns out that lightning strikes and the WH spokeswoman was lying, we can re-visit.
When the firm notices that something seems amiss with the books and calls in an auditor, and then when called in to speak with the auditor the bookkeeper quickly sneaks an envelope filled with cash into the safe and says, "I don't know what you're talking about; there's no money missing," will Ray say, "Why are you upset? All the money's there"?

Saying "He did it" is a double lie on your part. First, you have no way to know whether it's true. Second, he hadn't done it at the time people asked him about it.

If the spokesperson is lying, then Trump reneged on his promise. If the spokesperson isn't lying, then Trump reneged on his promise until after he was caught. The common factor in each case is Trump reneging on his promise. Which is part of a specific pattern for Trump.
   1192. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:28 AM (#5558043)
1133

My issue has been the people banging on Trump for having the unmitigated call to give $25,000 to a grieving military father. Those folks are indeed suffering from TDS.


Why is anybody surprised that DJT treated this grieving father no different than one of his sub-contractors or vendors? Once the check arrives, this dad can be removed from that long list.
   1193. PreservedFish Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:29 AM (#5558045)
This argument is hilarious.
   1194. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:31 AM (#5558047)
1142

Why do you people have such a deep psychic need for a head of state with whom you can closely identify as they carry out that function? It's ... odd.


For the journey is just as important as the destination, grasshopper...
   1195. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:33 AM (#5558048)
Once the check arrives, this dad can be removed from that long list.


Once the check CLEARS.
   1196. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:34 AM (#5558049)
This argument is hilarious.


The weird need to defend everything and anything Trump related from all criticism, while also pretending not to be a Trumpkin, causes some posters to twist themselves into some amazing knots.
   1197. BrianBrianson Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:37 AM (#5558050)
In the same way that none of us "have the slightest idea" whether Neil Armstrong really landed on the moon, I suppose. We weren't on the moon to witness it, after all.

But here on planet earth, the WH spokesperson said "A check has been sent." That provides us with a slightest idea.


There's video footage of Neil Armstrong on the Moon. Armstrong showed up in Florida with more rocks from the Moon than had previously been collected as meteorites across the whole Earth in all of recorded history. Someone pull a laser cube reflector on the Moon, which you can verify yourself. So there's a good amount of evidence Armstrong walked on the Moon. Of course, since he was in a spacesuit - I suppose someone else could've gone, and given Armstrong the credit.

On Earth, someone who already lied about this exact question, who regularly lies about this kind of thing, claims a check was sent. That's not meaningful evidence.
   1198. The Fallen Reputation of Billy Jo Robidoux Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:40 AM (#5558053)
Jesus; is there anyone on this site other than SBB who isn't a lawyer?


In my defense, I've been visiting BBTF since my early college days.

(Yes, I realize your post was just another opportunity to zing SBB).
   1199. Nose army. Beef diaper? (CoB) Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:41 AM (#5558054)

Washington (CNN)President Donald Trump sent a $25,000 personal check to the family of a fallen soldier the same day that The Washington Post reported that he had promised the soldier's father a personal donation during a June condolence call but never followed through.

A White House official confirms to CNN that the President sent a personal check Wednesday to the family of Army Cpl. Dillon Baldridge Wednesday. Baldridge, 22, was killed in June by an Afghan police officer.

According to the Post, Trump called Chris Baldridge in June, weeks after his son was killed. During the call, the Post reported, Trump offered him $25,000 and said he would instruct his staff to establish an online fundraising page for the family.

"The check has been sent," Lindsay Walters, White House spokeswoman, told CNN on Wednesday. "It's disgusting that the media is taking something that should be recognized as a generous and sincere gesture, made privately by the President, and using it to advance the media's biased agenda."

White House press secretary Sarah Sanders told CNN that it was a personal check from Trump


CNN

It's rather delicious that it was Trump's own big, fat mouth that triggered the events that led to him having to pay the promised $25k ...
   1200. PreservedFish Posted: October 19, 2017 at 11:43 AM (#5558055)
The weird need to defend everything and anything Trump related from all criticism, while also pretending not to be a Trumpkin, causes some posters to twist themselves into some amazing knots.


With RDP there's the additional tendency to bulldoze through nuance. You and I and most people can recognize that any number of things can happen between "promises money" and "delivers money" that are worthy of comment and can color the act of charity in good or bad ways. Ray cannot.
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