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Monday, October 16, 2017

OTP 16 October 2017: Sorry, Yankee fans: Trump’s claim that he can ensure victory simply isn’t true

As is sometimes the case with Trump’s tweet’s, his claims don’t hold up. We identified 14 games that Trump has attended since 1988, including two preseason games and the game above. Of those 14 games, the Yankees won eight and lost six — 57 percent of the time during seasons when the Yankees won 60 percent of their games overall.

In other words — Trump might be a jinx.

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 16, 2017 at 07:49 AM | 1967 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: astros, playoffs, politics, yankees

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   701. DJS, the Digital Dandy Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:32 PM (#5556247)
What are your favorite essential oils?

Petroleum; my car won't go anywhere without it!
   702. Morty Causa Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:34 PM (#5556250)
693

That is one of his finest.

I think the following is, too:

A Summer Morning

Her young employers, having got in late
From seeing friends in town
And scraped the right front fender on the gate,
Will not, the cook expects, be coming down.

She makes a quiet breakfast for herself,
The coffee-pot is bright,
The jelly where it should be on the shelf.
She breaks an egg into the morning light,

Then, with the bread-knife lifted, stands and hears,
The sweet efficient sounds
Of thrush and catbird, and the snip of shears
Where, in the terraced backward of the grounds,

A gardener works before the heat of the day.
He straightens for a view
Of the big house ascending stony-gray
Out of his beds mosaic with the dew.

His young employers having got in late,
He and the cook alone
Receive the morning on their old estate,
Possessing what the owners can but own.
   703. strong silence Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:36 PM (#5556252)
Our lives have too much stress right now so bourbon for me and essential oils for my wife will provide some relief.
   704. madvillain Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:39 PM (#5556253)
A bit late for the Popovich circle jerk, Andy.

We already know that Popovich is a hero. He did something that few are courageous enough to do: attack Trump.

For his next bid for a medal in courage, Popovich will come out in support of gay rights.

Start your right hands!


In your twisted world a guy speaking out eloquently against Trump is a point against him. I don't get it.
   705. Lassus Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:41 PM (#5556255)
No, he really doesn't care about Popovich. He cares that liberals like what Popovich said. That's what upsets him.
   706. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:42 PM (#5556256)
It's actually poor citizenship for a former AF Academy grad to call the President a "gutless coward," particularly when he mischaracterizes the remarks.

As Ray says, he isn't taking a bit of risk in saying it -- it's just piling on.

Not exactly sure what we're supposed to be celebrating here. The citizenry, including prominent members, becoming more shrill and unthinking and unyielding and tribal? How is that cause for celebration?

So, yeah, go ahead and celebrate -- left hand, right hand, both hands, whatever. Knock yourselves out, serenade each other with tales of your "courage" and the "resistance." Meanwhile, this remains very, very much what Decline looks like.
   707. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:44 PM (#5556257)
In your twisted world a guy speaking out eloquently against Trump is a point against him.


There was nothing "eloquent" about it. He sounded like a lunatic.

I wonder if Popovich even read the stories saying what Trump said, in full. I'd bet quite a bit of money he did not. He probably read a reductionist tweet or somesuch and then ran off at the mouth.

Again -- please set forth what it is we're supposed to be celebrating here.
   708. strong silence Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:45 PM (#5556258)
We have a new employee. She says "ask" and pronounces it "axe". How do I react?

Edit: I like diversity as much as the next guy but we're running a business and you'll be speaking with clients!
   709. Omineca Greg Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:48 PM (#5556260)
Thanks, Morty. I'd never read that one before. Great stuff.
   710. PepTech Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:48 PM (#5556261)
Carsale update!

Thinking, there is at least some chance the guy is telling the truth, I called the guy and asked straight up what he was after. He said I could go first.

-----------------

After consulting with car dealers and discussing the situation with the local sheriff, I'm not really interested in the mechanical troubles. However, if you can document the towing, I'll consider assisting with that. What towing company did you use?

.... Triple A.

They don't tow, they call a towing service for you. What company actually towed you?

.... I think it was City Towing.

Uh huh. What city? Where were you?

.... On the freeway. I'm not sure.

Tow trucks don't just show up. Who did you call?

.... It was the highway helper guys.

Roadside Assistance?

.... Yes. They said if I didn't move it in two hours it would be a big fine.

Uh huh. Those aren't tow trucks either... Do you have a receipt?

.... Uh, no. I paid cash.

Well, I'd have been happy to help with the towing, but without any documentation...

.... Look, the towing isn't important, OK? I just need some help getting the car running again.

Yeah, well, that was baked into the price of the car. If you can remember who towed you, let me know. Otherwise, have a nice day.

-------------------

I would be willing to wager the car is running fine. He knows I called the cops to report him. I think this one's over; bluff called.
   711. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:55 PM (#5556264)
Anyone tried the Hudson Baby Bourbon? I bought a bottle as a gift for friend who restored my set of hickory clubs, but I've never tasted it.
   712. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:55 PM (#5556265)
“This man in the Oval Office is a soulless coward who thinks that he can only become large by belittling others. This has of course been a common practice of his, but to do it in this manner—and to lie about how previous presidents responded to the deaths of soldiers—is as low as it gets. We have a pathological liar in the White House, unfit intellectually, emotionally, and psychologically to hold this office, and the whole world knows it, especially those around him every day. The people who work with this president should be ashamed, because they know better than anyone just how unfit he is, and yet they choose to do nothing about it. This is their shame most of all.”


These are absurd words, from the mischaracterization of what Trump said, to the silly words like "soulless coward," to the collective defamation of other people serving in the US government as shameful.

They're only not seen that way because of the unique -- and highly unflattering -- features of the current age. There's nothing whatever to celebrate here. Prominent citizens shouldn't be expressing themselves so poorly and so gratuitously and so gracelessly.
   713. Sleepy's not going to blame himself Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:55 PM (#5556266)
It's actually poor citizenship for a former AF Academy grad to call the President a "gutless coward," particularly when he mischaracterizes the remarks.
Why? In what way? He served his time, he was honorably discharged, he's not claiming to speak on behalf of the AF Academy or the AF. And what mischaracterization are you talking about?

Is there some unwritten rule of citizenship that I don't know about?
   714. Sleepy's not going to blame himself Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:58 PM (#5556267)
They're only not seen that way because of the unique -- and highly unflattering -- features of the current age.
And because they are true. I suspect that's a major factor.
   715. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:00 PM (#5556268)
And because they are true.


No, they're false. Not just about Trump's remarks (*), but the absurd claim that other people in government should be "ashamed" for their service. What an asshat thing to say. Sod off, Popovich.

There's nothing to celebrate here. Go ahead and pretend otherwise, but there isn't.

(*) And the stuff about Trump's fitness.
   716. BDC Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:01 PM (#5556269)
We have a new employee. She says "ask" and pronounces it "axe". How do I react? I like diversity as much as the next guy but we're running a business and you'll be speaking with clients!

People have dialects and speak with accents. We think some are charming and we think some are awful, for various historical and ethnological reasons; that's all extrinsic to what the person is saying. If she makes a lot of sense aside from the metathesis, I would appreciate her. If she forms sentences like Donald Trump does, I would worry :)
   717. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:02 PM (#5556270)
Re Krauthammer:

“Before we leave, one quick update,” Baier said. “Hundreds of you, literally hundreds have emailed, tweeted, or posted questions to me about the status of our colleague, Charles Krauthammer.”

“Charles had a pre-planned surgery his doctors said he needed,” he continued. “He expected a speedy recovery but ran into some complications post-surgery.”

“He is still in the hospital,” Baier added, “making slow steady progress and recovery.”

“He desperately wants to come back to the panel as soon as possible,” he continued. “Believe me, I speak to or email with his wife Robby almost every day. And I share your thoughts and prayers.”

“It will likely be a few more weeks,” he said. “And yes, he does get to watch his Washington Nationals first game of the playoffs against the Cubs, tomorrow night, so we’re pulling for him.”

“And thanks for asking about his status,” Baier concluded. “He’ll be back here soon I’m sure.”


"Hundreds, literally hundreds?" Mmmm, Bret, that doesn't sound like a whole hell of a lot.
   718. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:04 PM (#5556272)
As far as I'm concerned, "axe" is effectively standard English at this point. Meaningless.
   719. Sleepy's not going to blame himself Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:04 PM (#5556273)
No, they're false. Not just about Trump's remarks, but the absurd claim that other people in government should be "ashamed" for their service. What an asshat thing to say.
Wow, talk about "mischaracterizing" what someone is saying.
   720. SteveF Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:10 PM (#5556274)
People have dialects and speak with accents. We think some are charming and we think some are awful, for various historical and ethnological reasons; that's all extrinsic to what the person is saying. If she makes a lot of sense aside from the metathesis, I would appreciate her. If she forms sentences like Donald Trump does, I would worry :)

She may make the code switch around clients but not around employees. Is it against the law to ask someone to switch it up? David is in that part of the law as I recall, so maybe he'd know the answer.

At any rate, I'd only raise the issue if I saw someone using non-standard English with clients. I think it's an unnecessary burden to require someone to code switch around other employees.
   721. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:12 PM (#5556275)
717...YOU. ARE. DELIGHTFUL!
   722. Ray (RDP) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:15 PM (#5556277)
Looks like the officers who tried to remove the loony macaw from the United flight have been fired/suspended:

Two Chicago aviation security officers were fired and a third resigned for their roles in dragging a Kentucky doctor off an overbooked United Airlines flight for refusing to give up his seat.

Dr. David Dao of Louisville broke his nose, lost teeth and suffered a concussion in the April 9 fiasco, which was captured in cell phone video and sent United into a public-relations tailspin.

Five-day suspensions also were handed to two other officers who removed the flailing, bleeding doctor for refusing to relinquish his seat to a crew member who needed to get to Louisville, the Chicago Sun-Times reported.

One of the suspensions was reduced to two days after the officer filed a grievance. The other officer also filed a grievance, but then withdrew it and resigned, according to the paper.
   723. madvillain Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:17 PM (#5556279)
So, yeah, go ahead and celebrate -- left hand, right hand, both hands, whatever. Knock yourselves out, serenade each other with tales of your "courage" and the "resistance." Meanwhile, this remains very, very much what Decline looks like.


lol
   724. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:25 PM (#5556281)
You laugh, but this is very much what Declown looks like.
   725. madvillain Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:28 PM (#5556283)
You laugh, but this is very much what Declown looks like.


I love that Greg Popovich, who is the literal embodiment of American excellence and strength through diversity, critiquing Trump, is the sign of decline -- and not Trump himself.
   726. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:32 PM (#5556289)
Somehow, Newt Gingrich screwed up an admiring tweet about how "rermarkably stgroing" "Presideent Trtump" is.

Which isn't important, except that it gave us this Twitter response:
Newt Gingrich
@newtgingrich
Presideent Trtump was rermarkably stgroing in hius joint press event with with Sen McConnell. His grasp of the issues is very deep and growing.

Ramzy Nasrallah
@ramzy
I assume your spellcheck is in the hospital battling cancer so you abandoned it
   727. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:43 PM (#5556304)
Ouch. Nice burn against Moon Base Newt.
   728. Morty Causa Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:47 PM (#5556305)
Thanks, Morty. I'd never read that one before. Great stuff.

You are welcome.

Wilbur's proficiency with meter and rhyme and his seemingly casual elegance in this day and age seem so out of date, even an aberration, that some are tricked into thinking he's superficial and lacks deep feeling. Poems like the one you and I quoted give the lie to that.
   729. Hysterical & Useless Posted: October 17, 2017 at 06:48 PM (#5556306)
708. strong silence Posted: October 17, 2017 at 05:45 PM (#5556258)
We have a new employee. She says "ask" and pronounces it "axe". How do I react?


The pronunciation "ask" is a relative newcomer, I believe dating only to the 14th century. Chaucer used both the new-fangled "ask" and the older "aks," sometimes within the same poem.
   730. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:02 PM (#5556310)
Carsale update! . . . I would be willing to wager the car is running fine. He knows I called the cops to report him. I think this one's over; bluff called.

Sounds like your buyer was some kind of amateur scam artist. His story doesn't even hold up - if he'd used AAA, he wouldn't have paid, that's what the membership fee is for. In retrospect, there's an argument for not even returning his original call. You might never have heard from him again since he seems to have been just making stuff up on the fly. Glad it worked out, eventually.
   731. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:14 PM (#5556314)
Business Insider: Mueller has interviewed the cybersecurity expert who described being 'recruited to collude with the Russians':
A cybersecurity researcher who described being recruited to vet hacked Hillary Clinton emails last year by a GOP operative tied to President Donald Trump's campaign team has been interviewed by the FBI's special counsel, Robert Mueller, Business Insider has learned... The interview was part of a broader effort by Mueller to examine the relationship between the longtime GOP operative, Peter Smith, and the former national security adviser Michael Flynn and whether Flynn played any role in seeking out the stolen emails during the election. Smith killed himself in May after talking to The Wall Street Journal about his experience.

...In a [national security blog] piece titled "The Time I Got Recruited to Collude with the Russians," [Matt] Tait recalled how Smith had approached him to help verify the authenticity of emails he said were given to him by dark-web hackers. "Smith implied that he was a well-connected Republican political operative," Tait wrote... Tait said he went along with Smith's request because he wanted to find out more about these hackers — and whether they were pranksters or part of a larger Russian intelligence operation. He said he never found out. But he wrote that it was "immediately apparent that Smith was both well connected within the top echelons of the campaign and he seemed to know both Lt. Gen. Flynn and his son well."

Tait said Smith also listed the top Trump advisers Kellyanne Conway, Steve Bannon, and Sam Clovis as part of a group he had formed to conduct opposition research on Clinton, the 2016 Democratic presidential nominee. ...At one point Smith sent him a document detailing the company Smith and his colleagues had set up "as a vehicle to conduct" the opposition research.

The company, KLS Research, had been set up as a limited-liability corporation in Delaware "to avoid campaign reporting," Tait wrote, adding... "This document was about establishing a company to conduct opposition research on behalf of the campaign, but operating at a distance so as to avoid campaign reporting. Indeed, the document says as much in black and white. The combination of Smith's deep knowledge of the inner workings of the campaign, this document naming him in the 'Trump campaign' group, and the multiple references to needing to avoid campaign reporting suggested to me that the group was formed with the blessing of the Trump campaign."
   732. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:23 PM (#5556323)
I love that Greg Popovich, who is the literal embodiment of American excellence and strength through diversity, critiquing Trump, is the sign of decline -- and not Trump himself.


Both are. It's a symptom of Decline that Trump was elected; it's a symptom of Decline that prominent citizens like Popovich have no filters preventing them from making public statements like his yesterday. Popovich's comments about others in the government were unhinged.(*) Not a good look.

(*) His comments about Trump were not fully hinged, but that's exogenous to the point.
   733. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:27 PM (#5556327)
Um, wow?

I still wouldn't give Jones more than a one in 10 shot -- and frankly, I wouldn't advise Democratic spending on the race (mostly because the last thing Owens needs is "tool of Chuck Schumer! And Nancy Pelosi!".... I mean, he'll get that anyway - but a big DSCC cash dump ain't gonna move the needle).

By all means - make sure he's got enough to be modestly on the air, absolutely help him with staff... But if that 10-1 comes in and he pulls what would have to stand as the most massive Senate upset since what... I cannot even fathom an analogue.

The closest I can think of would be Murdoch beating Lugar, but that was a primary. Maybe Paul Wellstone? But even that wouldn't cover it.

EDIT: I mean Jones... it would be such an upset I can't remember his last name.
   734. Morty Causa Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:27 PM (#5556328)
Richard Wilbur's perfect baseball story, "A Game of Catch"

EDIT: I think this link works. A PDF, though.
   735. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:35 PM (#5556334)
But if that 10-1 comes in and he pulls what would have to stand as the most massive Senate upset since what... I cannot even fathom an analogue.


Scott Brown?
   736. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:37 PM (#5556335)
But if that 10-1 comes in and he pulls what would have to stand as the most massive Senate upset since what... I cannot even fathom an analogue.


Scott Brown?


OK, you're right - I think that would match. I also suspect Jones' Senate career would last about as long as Brown's, of course.
   737. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:42 PM (#5556338)
Popovich's comments about others in the government were unhinged.(*) Not a good look.


Just curious, but why is it never not a good look for the President to pick a twitter fight with the Mayor of London after his city suffers a terrorist attack? Or pick a fight with the mayor of San Juan (from the comfort of his golf club) who's city was still knee deep in Hurricane floodwater? How come it's never not a good look for the Prez, on countless occasions, to make unfounded allegations later proven to be utterly false? How come the least popular President in history has never had one "not a good look' moment?

Asking for a friend.
   738. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:45 PM (#5556339)
People have dialects and speak with accents. We think some are charming and we think some are awful, for various historical and ethnological reasons; that's all extrinsic to what the person is saying. If she makes a lot of sense aside from the metathesis, I would appreciate her. If she forms sentences like Donald Trump does, I would worry :)

She may make the code switch around clients but not around employees. Is it against the law to ask someone to switch it up? David is in that part of the law as I recall, so maybe he'd know the answer.

At any rate, I'd only raise the issue if I saw someone using non-standard English with clients. I think it's an unnecessary burden to require someone to code switch around other employees.
To the original poster: I don't know where you are so don't know what your state laws might be. From the perspective of federal law (although that, too, depends on what circuit you're in), there is significant risk in doing something about it. (I don't know what you contemplate doing.) Less so now that Trump is president -- the Obama EEOC was extremely activist -- but still plenty of risk. Any action may be deemed a violation of Title VII, especially if you single out AAVE while tolerating other accents. Before you say or do anything, I would certainly advise you to consult an attorney.
   739. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:46 PM (#5556340)
I also suspect Jones' Senate career would last about as long as Brown's, of course.


Like the guy who defeated Rosty ( forget his name, natch)
   740. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:48 PM (#5556341)
Wow, talk about "mischaracterizing" what someone is saying.
Talk about euphemisms. SBB is trolling/lying, as usual.
   741. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:51 PM (#5556342)
Like the guy who defeated Rosty ( forget his name, natch)


Something Patrick Flanagan! (William or Michael or something).

Then subsequently knocked off by Blago!
   742. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:52 PM (#5556344)
Um, wow?
I wouldn't give Jones a high chance; this is a single poll, and there are a significant number of undecideds -- which means that the race isn't necessarily close even if the poll is accurate. But, well, I would give Jones a much higher chance than virtually any other Democrat in a statewide race in Alabama would possibly have.

(FTR, I hope Moore loses. The man is a nutjob on a good day, a bigot, a loon, a kook, and someone with no respect for the law. He almost makes SBB look sane.)
   743. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:53 PM (#5556345)
Tait said Smith also listed the top Trump advisers Kellyanne Conway, Steve Bannon, and Sam Clovis as part of a group he had formed to conduct opposition research on Clinton, the 2016 Democratic presidential nominee.

That's either a very poorly written sentence, or an indication that the story may have some credibility problems. Probably just a coincidence that the "testimony" of this Tait fellow ends up being leaked? And that it seems to be based almost entirely on hearsay from a fellow who's no longer around? I'd also wonder about the chops of a reporter who refers to Robert Mueller as "the FBI's special counsel". Might want to give this one a little thought before rushing to judgment.
   744. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:54 PM (#5556347)
Scott Brown's election was a surprise but in hindsight shouldn't have been. He had a good reputation as a state rep, good on veterans affairs, and ran against a candidate whose glass ceiling was state AG. She was a bad candidate who kind of lost on her own.

Brown showed his true colors in his debate(s) with Warren and the results weren't surprising there either.
   745. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:58 PM (#5556348)
Just curious, but why is it never not a good look for the President to pick a twitter fight with the Mayor of London after his city suffers a terrorist attack? Or pick a fight with the mayor of San Juan (from the comfort of his golf club) who's city was still knee deep in Hurricane floodwater? How come it's never not a good look for the Prez, on countless occasions, to make unfounded allegations later proven to be utterly false? How come the least popular President in history has never had one "not a good look' moment?


Uh, I said the election of Trump was a symptom of Decline. Not sure what "not a good look" to individual moments would add to that. Plus, I said long ago that I don't pay attention to Twitter and press secretary briefings.

Plus, no one around here is holding up Trump's statements as grounds for celebration as you and yours did Popovich's.
   746. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 17, 2017 at 07:59 PM (#5556350)
Talk about euphemisms. SBB is trolling/lying, as usual.


This silly meme has apparently become your own personal foreplay to ready yourself for the circle jerk. Whatever works, one supposes.
   747. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:04 PM (#5556352)
This silly meme has become your own personal foreplay to ready yourself for the circle jerk. Whatever works, one supposes.
Concession accepted.
   748. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:04 PM (#5556354)
Plus, I said long ago that I don't pay attention to Twitter and press secretary briefings.


Lame. I imagine you don't follow everything Greg Popovich says to the media either, but you still took the time to issue your patented "Not a good look" procilmation.
   749. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:06 PM (#5556355)
Plus, no one around here is holding up Trump's statements as grounds for celebration as you and yours did Popovich's.


Even lamer, first that you edited after you posted without annotating it, but more importantly, that you insult Popovich because of how some people on a message board react to his statement?
   750. Greg K Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:16 PM (#5556366)
We have a new employee. She says "ask" and pronounces it "axe". How do I react?

You react by thanking the good Lord you don't have to mark first-year undergraduate papers.
   751. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:18 PM (#5556371)
I wouldn't give Jones a high chance; this is a single poll, and there are a significant number of undecideds -- which means that the race isn't necessarily close even if the poll is accurate. But, well, I would give Jones a much higher chance than virtually any other Democrat in a statewide race in Alabama would possibly have.

(FTR, I hope Moore loses. The man is a nutjob on a good day, a bigot, a loon, a kook, and someone with no respect for the law. He almost makes SBB look sane.)


Sure - like I said, I'd need 10-1 odds before laying any money (not that I bet on politics anyway).... and it goes without saying that it's less because Jones is a good match (I know little about him beyond his wikipedia bio) then because of Moore. Other polling has shown the race to be single digits, though.

Anyway, the William (looked it up) Patrick Flanagan reference from Misirlou is an interesting one because I think it shows how far we've fallen from the limits of acceptability. I'll spare anyone the defense of Rosty -- I could dig up an old Royko column that I think makes a good case (and Royko was no friend of Rosty) - but even the defense wouldn't rise to the level of him deserving to lose (he was under indictment at the time).

I remember that race fairly well - I had been in Chicago (well, technically Evanston) for a couple years by that point and it WAS earth shattering... it was also in the '94 bloodbath.

That said, it's interesting that Blago was actually worse than Rosty -- truly, he was. No doubt, Rosty was feathering his nest from the congressional PO - but Rosty also remembered the old machine maxim that it's not just the big donors you take care; it's also the constituency.

It would have been interesting if Flanagan hadn't been such a complete misfit for the district... I mean, it's the Chicago liberal lakeshore. Flanagan was anti-choice, anti-gun control, and basically in favor of virtually everything super majorities of the district opposes, and in favor of virtually everything they oppose. Not being a crook only gets you so far.
   752. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:22 PM (#5556377)
Plus, no one around here is holding up Trump's statements as grounds for celebration as you and yours did Popovich's.


I'm just spitballing here, but maybe it's fair to hold the President to a higher standard than an NBA coach.... and that's without even getting into Popovich using bigger words and piecing together coherent thoughts.
   753. Omineca Greg Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:24 PM (#5556382)
I remember hearing some outtakes from a Soul Stirrers recording session from way back in 1951. A pre-pop Sam Cooke was one of the lead singers, and they were doing takes of Touch The Hem Of His Garment...which is usually the earliest Sam Cooke song you get in any of his anthologies...

Oh, there was a woman in the Bible days,
she had been sick, sick so very long
but she heard about Jesus was passing by,
so she joined the gathering throng
and while she was pushing her way through,
someone asked her: 'What are you trying to do?'

She said:
'if I could just touch the hem of His garment
I know I'll be made whole'

She cried:
'Oh Lord, Oh Lord and Oh Lord, Oh Lord'
Said :
'if I could just touch the hem of His garment
I know I'll be made whole'

Oh, She spent her money here and there
until she had no, had no more to spare,
the doctors, they'd done all they could
but their medicine would do no good.
When she touched Him The Saviour didn't see
but still He turned around and cried
'Somebody touched me'

She said:
'It was I who just wanna touch the hem of Your garment,
I know I'll be made whole right now'

She stood there crying:
'Oh Lord, Oh Lord and Oh Lord, Oh Lord'

Said:
'If I could just touch the hem of His garment,
I know I'll made whole right now'

Cooke


When they got to the "ask" part Sam always fouled it up, and said "axe". There's a fair amount of technical precision in this music, his diction is excellent, you can hear it in the clip. I think the churchiness of it dictated that everything be done properly, maybe even a little fussily. So they would stop, and start again. ""Ask", Sam. It's "Ask", said the producer. "I know, I know" said Sam. And they would do it again, and he'd screw it up, and the producer would say, "Ask" and Sam would say, "Sorry..." until finally Sam said, quite tongue in cheek, "You know, you're going against my upbringing here..."

There's no real point, I just thought it was an interesting story about the intersection of more formal speech and a more traditional kind. I've read writers who say that Cooke's technical pronunciation learned in Gospel music helped him crossover to white audiences, as he sounded less...otherly, I guess. I don't know if that's true. I do know that his music puts my wife into a very affectionate mood, so for that, I thank him.

   754. Howie Menckel Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:31 PM (#5556393)
"axe" for ask is pretty standard in NYC blue-collar areas - and as much or more among Italians as any other group. for the legal eagles, not sure if "protected class" would be relevant to any 'guidance' (not applicable to Italians of course).
   755. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:42 PM (#5556404)
. . . for the legal eagles, not sure if "protected class" would be relevant to any 'guidance' (not applicable to Italians of course.).

The EEOC has taken the position that "accent discrimination" can be an indication of national origin discrimination, with mixed success. Won some cases where the plaintiff sounded like Fernando Lamas, lost some where a thick accent made the person difficult to understand, when that was important to the job. And as David mentioned in #738, African American vernacular can raise issues. A lot depends on the job at issue. However, American regional dialects aren't generally protected by federal law, although I suppose the time may be near for some to claim "that's how we talk white in my area".
   756. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: October 17, 2017 at 08:55 PM (#5556414)
Newt Gingrich
@newtgingrich
Presideent Trtump was rermarkably stgroing in hius joint press event with with Sen McConnell. His grasp of the issues is very deep and growing.

Ramzy Nasrallah
@ramzy
I assume your spellcheck is in the hospital battling cancer so you abandoned it

That reply is now stored in the trophy room of the Department of Cryogenics. I only wish Nasrallah had said it to Gingrich's face.
   757. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 09:31 PM (#5556483)
Clapper, #743:
Tait said Smith also listed the top Trump advisers Kellyanne Conway, Steve Bannon, and Sam Clovis as part of a group he had formed to conduct opposition research on Clinton, the 2016 Democratic presidential nominee.

That's either a very poorly written sentence, or an indication that the story may have some credibility problems. Probably just a coincidence that the "testimony" of this Tait fellow ends up being leaked? And that it seems to be based almost entirely on hearsay from a fellow who's no longer around? I'd also wonder about the chops of a reporter who refers to Robert Mueller as "the FBI's special counsel". Might want to give this one a little thought before rushing to judgment.



So... Robert Mueller didn't interview him? Nor the House Intelligence Committee? Okay, then.

Also, rushing to judgment about what?
   758. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 17, 2017 at 09:33 PM (#5556484)
756...It's unhinged! It's a symptom of decline! It's not a good look!
   759. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 17, 2017 at 09:34 PM (#5556487)
That's self-evident. PS I am not a crackpot.
   760. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 09:48 PM (#5556509)
Re: #743 and #757--
I'd also wonder about the chops of a reporter who refers to Robert Mueller as "the FBI's special counsel".


Following up Yankee Clapper's phraseology critique, "the FBI's special counsel" appears to be Business Insider's house editorial preference.

Writer Natasha Bertrand, Aug. 3: "Robert Mueller, the FBI's special counsel, impaneled a grand jury in recent weeks to help him investigate Russia's election interference."
Writer Bryan Logan, Aug. 31: "Robert Mueller, the FBI's special counsel in charge of the investigation of the Trump campaign's ties to Russia, is now teaming up with..."
Writer Sonam Sheth, Oct. 5: "Reports that the FBI's special counsel's team is researching President Donald Trump's pardon power are the latest indication..."
   761. Random Transaction Generator Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:02 PM (#5556524)
Trump : "I know words. I have the best words."

Eh, maybe not so much.
   762. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:08 PM (#5556532)
Raw Story: Trump finally calls widow of fallen Army soldier — only to tell her ‘he knew what he signed up for’:
Donald Trump on Tuesday finally called the families of four U.S. soldiers who were killed during an ambush in Niger earlier this month, only to tell the widow of U.S. Army Sgt. La David Johnson, “he knew what he signed up for.”

“Yes, he said it,” Rep. Frederica Wilson (D-Miami Gardens) told ABC. “It’s so insensitive. He should have not have said that. He shouldn’t have said it.”

Trump called Tuesday afternoon and spoke to Johnson’s widow, who’s pregnant with her third child to the deceased Army soldier. Johnson is also survived by a 2-year-old son and 6-year-old daughter.

And from Miami-Dade's ABC outlet:
Johnson, who participated in a mentorship program Wilson founded in 1993, died during a mission fighting alongside Green Berets. Islamic militants ambushed them Oct. 4 with rocket propelled grenades and machine guns. The team reportedly didn't have overhead armed air cover and were in unarmored pickup trucks. Reuters reported the lack of planning upset the French.

"I will, at some point, during the period of time, call the parents and the families, because I have done that, traditionally," Trump said during a press conference last week.

[Rep.] Wilson criticized Trump for failing to acknowledge Johnson's death after he was left behind during the evacuation and it took nearly two days to find his body in the Republic of Niger's desert. Johnson's body made it to the U.S. Oct. 7 when Trump was playing golf with Sen. Lindsey Graham.

Amid the controversy, Trump later said President Barack Obama and other presidents didn't make calls to the relatives of all fallen servicemen and women. President George W. Bush's and Obama's aides reacted on Twitter and on The Huffington Post saying the president misspoke. Trump later backpedaled the claim during an interview with NBC's Peter Alexander.

"President Obama I think probably did sometimes, and maybe sometimes he didn’t. I don’t know. That’s what I was told. All I can do—all I can do is ask my generals. Other presidents did not call. They’d write letters. And some presidents didn’t do anything," Trump said. "But I like the combination of—I like, when I can, the combination of a call and also a letter."

The Atlantic's David A. Graham believes Trump used the controversy to distract reporters. Despite the criticism, Trump continued the discussion on Fox News Radio when he raised doubt about whether or not Obama called his chief of staff, John Kelly, when his son died.

Graham said it was Trump's strategy to distract reporters from the important questions about the deadly ambush in Africa. "The broader question, of what the soldiers who were killed were doing and what went wrong, remains unaddressed by the president, and Trump’s jab at other presidents may, unfortunately, help to keep it that way," Graham wrote.
   763. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:24 PM (#5556554)
Following up Yankee Clapper's phraseology critique, "the FBI's special counsel" appears to be Business Insider's house editorial preference.

Multiple writers at that outlet using the same incorrect terminology would not seem to do much to shore up its credibility.
   764. PreservedFish Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:26 PM (#5556556)
Graham said it was Trump's strategy to distract reporters from the important questions about the deadly ambush in Africa.


I've lost count of the dimensions to this chess game.
   765. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:27 PM (#5556559)
Clapper, #763:
Multiple writers at that outlet using the same incorrect terminology would not seem to do much to shore up its credibility.


Neither would using the phrase "rushing to judgment" in response to nothing at all. Maybe they're hiring?
   766. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:45 PM (#5556587)
Donald Trump on Tuesday finally called the families of four U.S. soldiers who were killed during an ambush in Niger earlier this month, only to tell the widow of U.S. Army Sgt. La David Johnson, “he knew what he signed up for.”

“Yes, he said it,” Rep. Frederica Wilson (D-Miami Gardens) told ABC. “It’s so insensitive. He should have not have said that. He shouldn’t have said it.”

Trump called Tuesday afternoon and spoke to Johnson’s widow, who’s pregnant with her third child to the deceased Army soldier. Johnson is also survived by a 2-year-old son and 6-year-old daughter.


Let's see. A Sgt with a wife and 2 kids, another on the way. They can't have much in savings. probably has $100,000 or so in life insurance. Yeah, they will probably be on welfare soon. Just some more takers. Poor life choices and all that.
   767. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:45 PM (#5556588)
Fish, #764:
I've lost count of the dimensions to this chess game.


Perhaps this visual representation will help you to see the truth behind the genius.
   768. The Yankee Clapper Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:48 PM (#5556591)
Multiple writers at that outlet using the same incorrect terminology would not seem to do much to shore up its credibility.

Neither would using the phrase "rushing to judgment" in response to nothing at all. Maybe they're hiring?

I'm not the one that not only linked to the article, but re-posted almost its entire text; but you are correct, it appears to be nothing at all. Which was my point.
   769. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 10:59 PM (#5556608)
I'm not the one that not only linked to the article, but re-posted almost its entire text; but you are correct, it appears to be nothing at all. Which was my point.


You knew what you signed up for.
   770. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:11 PM (#5556633)
At least he didn't tell her to "have a great time!". I mean, as far as we know.
   771. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:12 PM (#5556637)
Multiple writers at that outlet using the same incorrect terminology would not seem to do much to shore up its credibility.
Hey, can you speak up? Can't hear you over all the hand-waving.
   772. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:18 PM (#5556646)
At least he didn't tell her to "have a great time!". I mean, as far as we know.


Did he send his warmest condolences?
   773. PreservedFish Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:19 PM (#5556647)
"I bet Obama didn't call when your husband died."
   774. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:23 PM (#5556657)
There was blame on both sides. Both sides. And Very fine people.
   775. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:25 PM (#5556661)
There was blame on both sides. Both sides. And Very fine people.


Speaking of which, what do you call people from Niger? They can't be Nigerians.

Edit: Apparently, they are. Well that's confusing. Technically, they are Nigeriens, but it's pronounced the same.
   776. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:31 PM (#5556674)
According to Wikipedia, they are Nigeriens. Also the name of the Francophone professional hockey team.
   777. Joe Bivens Will Take a Steaming Dump Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:37 PM (#5556683)
Since YR isnt here....America first, hippies. Everyone else are "those people".

   778. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:39 PM (#5556688)
In Trump's defense, he called the widow right after binge watching a bunch of episodes of Super Chicken. #heknewthejobwasdangerouswhenhetookit
   779. greenback wears sandals on his head Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:41 PM (#5556691)
Finding a hotel in Chicago for tomorrow night is a PITA. I may have no choice but to stay at the Trump monstrosity.
   780. Shredder Posted: October 17, 2017 at 11:46 PM (#5556697)
The weather should be nice. You can just sleep on the street with the gutterpunks in Wicker Park.
   781. tshipman Posted: October 18, 2017 at 12:20 AM (#5556723)
Obviously liberals are to blame for Trump's statement to the widow.

If we hadn't criticized him for not calling her, he never would have made such a fool out of himself.

I, for one, feel bad about it.

/sbb
   782. Zonk Tormundbane Posted: October 18, 2017 at 12:26 AM (#5556730)
Late word from WH is that he's going to send Mike Pence to the funeral and make sure no one kneels and have his poodle do a very stern walkout if anybody disrespects the troops in such a manner.
   783. Howie Menckel Posted: October 18, 2017 at 12:26 AM (#5556732)
Finding a hotel in Chicago for tomorrow night is a PITA.

have spent 9 months of my life there on 75 visits

if you don't know the angles, ask a millennial or hire one to get you to the best onlite site
it is worth it
   784. Spahn Insane, stimulus-funded BurlyMan™ Posted: October 18, 2017 at 12:28 AM (#5556733)
"I bet Obama didn't call when your husband died."

**snort**
   785. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 06:57 AM (#5556779)
Edit: Apparently, they are. Well that's confusing. Technically, they are Nigeriens, but it's pronounced the same.


Wasn't there a famous football player called the Nigerian Nightmare?
   786. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 18, 2017 at 07:19 AM (#5556780)
Obviously liberals are to blame for Trump's statement to the widow.


Clearly this is a big nothingburger. Are you hippies going to sit there and claim with a straight face that this person didn't know what they were signing up for? Is that what you've been reduced to hippies? Criticizing the president for telling the truth?
   787. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:11 AM (#5556786)
A moderately interesting 538 politics chat - Where Is The Trump Presidency Headed?

Our topic: “14 Versions Of Trump’s Presidency, From #MAGA To Impeachment”

Nate wrote this article after Trump’s inauguration; it lays out 14 possible tracks the administration could take. We’ll go through each scenario, and everyone has to rank it on a scale from 1 (has become much less likely since Trump was sworn in) to 10 (has become much more likely since Trump was sworn in).

You have to factor in where things stand now and where they might be headed. Everyone got that?
   788. BDC Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:15 AM (#5556787)
Finding a hotel in Chicago for tomorrow night is a PITA

Even as far north as Evanston? I'd look for something out near the Purple el line, change to the Red train at Howard. Not that this does you much good this morning :(
   789. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:22 AM (#5556789)
#787 - My mileage varies. I find chat transcript "roundtables" to be one of the worst evils of internet journalism.
   790. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:33 AM (#5556791)
My mileage varies.


I am not a fan of the format, but I really liked the framing of the original article and then the update to it - which is why it was only moderately interesting.
   791. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:37 AM (#5556792)
We talk about the Criminal Justice system periodically, and while most people won't change their opinion based on anything as flimsy as evidence, still it is worth reading up on the subject - A massive review of the evidence shows letting people out of prison doesn’t increase crime

“I estimate, that at typical policy margins in the United States today, decarceration has zero net impact on crime,” Roodman wrote in a blog post. “That estimate is uncertain, but at least as much evidence suggests that decarceration reduces crime as increases it. The crux of the matter is that tougher sentences hardly deter crime, and that while imprisoning people temporarily stops them from committing crime outside prison walls, it also tends to increase their criminality after release. As a result, ‘tough-on-crime’ initiatives can reduce crime in the short run but cause offsetting harm in the long run.”

This isn’t the first major analysis to find incarceration has little or no effect on crime; other researchers and studies estimate that since the 1990s, more incarceration contributed to anywhere from 0 to 25 percent of the drop in crime. But Roodman’s analysis is one of the most extensive reviews I have seen.


It is a long article, with links to the study.
   792. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 08:44 AM (#5556797)
Interesting. Certainly counter-intuitive.
   793. Ishmael Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:09 AM (#5556805)
'if I could just touch the hem of His garment
I know I'll be made whole'

I like the tight, interpersonal drama of the woman with the haemorrhage. It’s a bit inconvenient, like much of Mark, for a high Christology, but I love the image of Jesus casting around for the culprit with the disciples looking at him like he’s a madman.

Matthew tidies up that embarrassing bit about Jesus’ power going out of him (Luke leaves it in), but he adds the detail that the woman touched the “hem” or the “edge” or the “fringe” of Jesus’ clothes.

Now, Luke has the same detail. It’s one of the minor agreements that present a problem for the two source theory. There are a few easy ways out for Q adherents: Mark has a reference to healing by touching the edge of Jesus’ cloak in the next chapter, “They begged him to let them touch even the edge of his cloak, and all who touched it were healed.” Mark 6:56. That might have influenced both Matthew and Luke independently. BH Streeter appeals to a manuscript tradition of Luke omitting the “fringe” wording, in other words presuming that later scribes added it to Luke following Matthew’s text. Both are I think perfectly plausible. It’s also an even more difficult passage from a Luke-used-Matthew or Matthew-used-Luke perspective, incidentally.

There is also a related idea I’ve heard that’s interesting.

Dale Allison, in “Healing in the Wings of His Garment: The Synoptics and Malachi 4:2,” speculates that this healing fringe might refer to a verse from Malachi “the sun of righteousness shall rise, with healing in its wings” Malachi 4:2, with the sun’s wings (or rays in the NIV) being represented symbolically by the fringes of Jesus’ clothing. In fact, we know that was an early Christian belief, as Allison finds the Malachi verse used as a proof text in the fourth century pseudo-Epiphanius.

Allison thinks that these fringes are the Tzitzit that hung from Jesus’ Talit, that at the time were associated with Pharisees (and in fact Matthew refers to them in 23:5, equating long fringes with false piety). So, according to Allison, it’s Malachi that supplies the detail in Mark 6:56 and Matt 9:20, at least when it is read through the correct pesher-type interpretive lens. Not something that we could know for sure was in the minds of the synoptic authors, but it’s consistent with the sort of thing that we know was going on during the New Testament composition period, including elsewhere in the gospels.

For example, all the gospels have Jesus’ triumphal entry riding a donkey. We know this is dependent on Zechariah 9:9, because Matthew explicitly tells us. But Matthew, perhaps looking to expand the meaning of the verse, gets hung up on the synonymous parallelism in the following:

See, your king comes to you,
righteous and victorious,
lowly and riding on a donkey,
on a colt, the foal of a donkey.

Obviously the final line is just a reiteration of the third, the same sort of thing as we find all the time in the Psalms. The donkey is the colt, the foal of a donkey. But Matthew can’t be sure, so he has Jesus ride in on two donkeys.

Just to cover his ass.
   794. Greg K Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:14 AM (#5556807)

Obviously the final line is just a reiteration of the third, the same sort of thing as we find all the time in the Psalms. The donkey is the colt, the foal of a donkey. But Matthew can’t be sure, so he has Jesus ride in on two donkeys.

Just to cover his ass.

And they say scriptural exegesis can't be funny!
   795. BrianBrianson Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:30 AM (#5556811)
Donald Trump on Tuesday finally called the families of four U.S. soldiers who were killed during an ambush in Niger earlier this month, only to tell the widow of U.S. Army Sgt. La David Johnson, “he knew what he signed up for.”


Depending on how you say it, it could certainly be either really insensitive, or maybe really venerating.

I mean - I can't fault people for not giving Trump the benefit of the doubt. Fool me sixteen times, shame on you. Fool me seventeen or more times, shame on me.
   796. BrianBrianson Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:35 AM (#5556813)
Interesting. Certainly counter-intuitive.


Maybe a little. It should be self-evident that tougher sentences don't deter crime because the sentences are all effectively infinitely tough. That longer incarceration increases recidivism is a little surprising - a criminal record makes it really hard to get work, so it certainly motivates a lot of petty crime, but I'm surprised the length matters much.
   797. The Good Face Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:39 AM (#5556814)
Anyone tried the Hudson Baby Bourbon? I bought a bottle as a gift for friend who restored my set of hickory clubs, but I've never tasted it.


It's garbage. But it's expensive garbage that comes in neat looking bottles, which makes it a fine gift for people that don't know bourbon. As a general rule, craft distilleries make shitty whiskey. It takes at least 6 years of aging in standard barrels to make high end bourbon, often more. But craft distilleries generally can't keep their doors open without revenue for that long, so they take shortcuts, like aging in smaller barrels to speed up the aging process (it kinda sorta works, but almost always results in an inferior product) and/or releasing young whiskey that desperately needs more aging time.

Bourbon is the opposite of beer, in that the big, macro distillers produce almost everything worth drinking, and the small, craft distillers largely produce crap. Might change over the next decade if enough of them are able to survive and build up reserves of properly aged juice, but right now the good stuff comes from the big boys.
   798. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:39 AM (#5556815)
It should be self-evident that tougher sentences don't deter crime because the sentences are all effectively infinitely tough.


That may be true, but it's certainly not self-evident.
   799. Blanks for Nothing, Larvell Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:40 AM (#5556816)
Depending on how you say it, it could certainly be either really insensitive, or maybe really venerating.


Yes, exactly. Good that someone else could actually be honest and make that rather obvious point, instead of it always being a very small group of us. Perhaps we're getting somewhere.

In this case, knowing Trump, it was probably closer to insensitive but it very well might not have been.
   800. PreservedFish Posted: October 18, 2017 at 09:51 AM (#5556820)
In this case, knowing Trump, it was probably closer to insensitive but it very well might not have been.


Agreed.
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